The “Lawwell Letter” is trending everywhere this week. To elucidate, it is email sent to (among others) Peter Lawwell and Eric Riley of Celtic on 26 July 2012 by SPL CEO Neil Doncaster.
The email came with an attached copy of the Five Way Agreement (hereafter “5WA”, the deal between Sevco, Rangers, the SFA, the SPL and the SFL). Now that it has been made public, it seems safe to speak openly about what it all means for us as folk who believe in sporting integrity.
I would preface my comments with a caveat though. On the face of it, the Celtic Chief Executive appears to have misled the gathering at the recent Celtic AGM. He was asked by a shareholder if Celtic were involved in the Five Way Agreement. Lawwell replied, “No”, and gave same “No” response to the follow up question, “have you seen it?”
Given that a copy of that email was in the possession of a few folk before that AGM, I have to admit to being surprised by that answer – although even more surprised at the apparent lack of due diligence implied by the lack of knowledge of its content.
We have attempted to contact Mr Lawwell to ask him if he would like to comment on the apparent discrepancy between the evidence and his answer (and I am sure we are not the only ones to have done so). To date, we have received no response. Given the complete lack of acknowledgement of the existence of this anomaly in the MSM, we should perhaps assume that none will be forthcoming.
Perhaps there is an explanation (yes I know), but Celtic should know, like Rangers old and new have come to realise, that silence on these matters breeds deep suspicion and distrust.
Assuming for the minute that Occam’s Razor applies here, there may be an uncomfortable truth emerging for Celtic fans – that Rangers (old and new) do not have a monopoly on dishonesty. There is also an uncomfortable truth that should emerge for Rangers fans too – that as we have said all along, this has never been about just Rangers, but about the governance of the game.
If the Celtic CEO did lie to the AGM a few weeks ago what are the consequences? He broke no laws as far as I can see. One insider I spoke to said simply this,
“So he lied. So what? What happens now? It’s irrelevant”
That is of course absolutely true. As long as controlling shareholders are happy that Resolution 12 is buried, and that no deep inquiry into governance is held into the workings of the game in Scotland, the lie is nonpunishable, though it would be a mistake to believe that accountability is confined only to the corporate rules governing Boards and shareholders; the corporate veil of “I was only following company policy” can be readily challenged in the court of public opinion, which has no statute of limitations.
What all this demonstrates of course is that Celtic have been saying one thing to their fans and shareholders, nodding agreement in private meetings about how appalling Rangers behaviour was, tut-tutting over how amateurish the authorities were, and wringing their hands in frustration at what a sham the LNS inquiry turned out to be.
At the same time, they have done nothing, allowed small shareholders to spend not inconsiderable suns progressing the matter, and quietly hoped that the “appetite” for justice would diminish so they could get back to whatever it is they and the rest do when subject to little or no scrutiny.
Whilst ten in a row is on the table of course, they can get away with it. To Celtic fans right now, understandably, nothing else matters. But what if TIAR is derailed? Not a stretch to imagine that the Parkhead kitchen could get uncontrollably hot in that circumstance. And when the TIAR squirrel finally ends its scurry, in either success or failure, where will the fans attention be diverted?
Perhaps the arrogance that permits making (allegedly) false statements to a general meeting, and (allegedly) misleading shareholders over Res 12 is borne of the knowledge that the parachutes are ready to be deployed when either of the above scenarios come to pass? If TIAR is achieved or goes south, are they already prepared for an emergency exit?
Celtic have two major shareholders whose combined holding is over 50% of the club’s shares. Dermot Desmond and Nick Train. Desmond is now in his eighth decade and Train is reportedly having some business difficulties. Both may well be moved to get out anyway, but fan unrest would make their decision a whole lot easier.
And Lawwell himself is – if you believe the MSM – on the wanted list of nearly as many top clubs as Alfredo Morelos.
The foregoing of course is extremely “Old Firm” centric, and as the two biggest clubs in the country they certainly have the biggest impact on the game, culturally, socially and financially. However there is no get-out clause here for others.
We KNOW there is evidence of fraud surrounding the licencing issue in 2012. We KNOW there is evidence of a cover up over that, and the EBT-related registration issues for Old Rangers. We KNOW that the Five Way Agreement was signed by football authorities in the knowledge that it would rob their own rules of judicial authority with regard to compliance by RFC prior to 2012.
We also know that NOT ONE club has taken a meaningful stand against any of it.
Clubs are saying one thing to supporters and doing their best to derail those supporters’ efforts on the other. We can also infer (not unreasonably) that the folk who run the clubs think that we as fans have no right to interfere in how they run their operations.
As I said earlier, Celtic can do what they like whilst TIAR is live, but afterwards, however it ends, the fans and shareholders involved in Res 12 will still be asking questions. Celtic in particular know how fatal it can be to alienate their own fan base – a fan base that has flexed its muscles with devastating effect for the boardroom in the past. And it is the wrath of the fans of all clubs that will eventually see the charlatans get their just desserts.
Our job as fans is to continue to hold those who care little for the honour and beauty of football to account, to continue to press them on their refusal to deal with arguably the biggest sporting scandal in Scottish history.
The bottom line (which is of course what the folk in boardrooms care about) is this. They need us far more than we need them. As fans of different clubs, the sensibility of those of us at SFM recognises that the real battle, the real war, is not between rival fans or rival clubs, but between the arrogant, self-entitled clique who run our game; who lie for fun, who cheat and belittle the sport; and the good folk who make it possible for the game to prosper.
Resolution 12 is not just about Rangers – nor is it just about Celtic. It deserves to be embraced by every true football fan in the country. The Res 12 franchise needs to widened
Sooner or later the fans will demonstrate their unhappiness with the money men. They did it in 2012, and they will inevitably do so again.
Alex Rae has got some serious competition for talking p!sh;
Name this talking head;
"…He said:
“There is no doubt this (Corona Virus pandemic) is bigger than than the Rangers situation in 2012 because some people felt they brought the problems they encountered on themselves but you can’t say that here because it’s nobody’s fault…"
[Clue: he used to be the SFA CEO!]
I note that the SFA is releasing in advance about £1.5 M to clubs, each club receiving an amount based on its 2019 Licensing level- Bronze, Silver, Gold or Platinum.
Anyone able to make a rough calculation of the amount that ,say, TRFC might expect to get?
John Clark 19th March 2020 at 11:45
=============
IIRC correctly they had silver level last year?
https://www.scottishfa.co.uk/media/6062/club-licensing-current-update-february-2020.pdf
Aberdeen Silver
Celtic Platinum
Hamilton Academical Silver
Heart of Midlothian Silver
Hibernian Gold
Kilmarnock Silver
Livingston Bronze
Motherwell Silver
Rangers Silver
Ross County Silver
St Johnstone Gold
St Mirren Gold
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
upthehoops 19th March 2020 at 12:11
'…they had silver level last year?'
……………………………..
yes: "It appears that Rangers were awarded a silver though for the annual financial statements section"
The thing is that there are a lot of clubs subject to the National system:
Scottish Professional Football League (Premiership) Clubs
Scottish Professional Football League (Championship, League 1 and League 2) Clubs
Scottish Highland Football League Clubs
Scottish Lowland Football League Clubs
All other Member Clubs
If they've all to get something, £ that1.5 M isn't going to go very far,assuming the grading system doesn't give a disproportionate amount to the platinum and gold level clubs.
EJ/AJ
So, Anne Budge says Hearts will have to take a £1m hit.
£500,000 for the outstanding league games and £500,000 for the semi final.
Surely Hearts wouldn't have budgeted for the £500,000 semi final money!!!
HS
1.5m divided amongst clubs may help very small clubs but to those with the largest running costs it's a drop in the ocean . Even if TRFC were able to get 10% of that (and I doubt they would be entitled to such a large %age) it wouldn't pay Defoes wage for a month. They should face reality (like Hearts) and ask staff to take a pay cut or at least defer some wages to a latter date . Operating costs at Ibrox are 4.7m a month , they have a known shortfall twice that , the question is do they pay March wages, then April and possibly May with zero coming in?If yes then who writes the cheque ? There is a massive queue forming for financial assistance and I'm afraid that the circus that is football is not a high priority .
IIRC, the original Rangers also asked players / staff to defer a percentage of salaries?
Suppose that could keep most folks happy, and help avert an immediate cash flow meltdown?
And if clubs do have the relevant insurance – and they do actually receive a pay out – it would probably still take a while to see some cash?
A percentage of something is better than nothing…
Higgy's Shoes 19th March 2020 at 12:48
EJ/AJ
So, Anne Budge says Hearts will have to take a £1m hit.
£500,000 for the outstanding league games and £500,000 for the semi final.
Surely Hearts wouldn't have budgeted for the £500,000 semi final money!!!
HS
======================================
At December's AGM, it was stated that the club had budgeted for a break even performance over the financial year, but was forecast to have a £400k shortfall because of poorer performance on the pitch leading to lower than anticipated match day, hospitality, advertising and sponsorship income, and costs associated with the changes in the management team.
You are correct to say that the Scottish Cup run was an un-budgeted windfall that now won't be received in this financial year, so can be discounted.
However the forecast £400k shortfall, plus the loss of another £500k in matchday and other income to the scheduled end of season, still leaves at least a £900k gap to be filled. I would have expected Ann Budge to cover the £400k either personally, or through her "benefactor" friends, but the latest £500k hit necessitated further cost cutting measures, as announced yesterday.
Higgy's Shoes 19th March 2020 at 12:48 EJ/AJ So, Anne Budge says Hearts will have to take a £1m hit. £500,000 for the outstanding league games and £500,000 for the semi final. Surely Hearts wouldn't have budgeted for the £500,000 semi final money!!! HS
______________–
I'm only a Hearts supporter with no more insight to Hearts financial situation than anyone else, but unless Ann Budge stated that the hit is from the budgeted figure then I don't see anything in what you've posted to suggest she is referring to anything other than money that was reasonably anticipated a week or so ago but is now lost over the next couple of months due to the shut down. Not only that, she may have drawn up a budget post quarter-final win that did include the additional half-million, and is now having to shelve some off-field plans, or she is concerned that that additional money, that may have helped to fund a possible season (or more) in the Championship, is now lost (or, if my club managed to avoid relegation, funded a rebuilding of the squad during the window).
I'd be very surprised if any business stuck rigidly to a start of the year budget and didn't re-budget as increased/decreased revenue occurred, and I think we can be pretty sure that every club, including Celtic, is, right now, re-budgeting, and re-budgeting again as this disastrous end(?) to the season unfolds.
Once again the site gets a bashing from the man in the know
” Many of same have a chip on their shoulder apropos this site and do their utmost to disparage my narrative. With only one article in every six weeks as a focal point, many of them hang on my every word and then queue up to kiss Phil Macgiollabhain’s arse for the exclusives that he ‘borrowed’ from our site. They can wait until the official release of my exclusive news. These bitter OAP’s deserve to be in the dark. ”
Reminded me of a tune that sums him up, considering what he produces is rehashed news that has been aired by most bloggers before him.
”
Come in here, dear boy, have a cigar,
You’re gonna go far,
You’re gonna fly high,
You’re never gonna die,
You’re gonna make it if you try,
They’re gonna love you.
I’ve always had a deep respect and I mean that most sincere;
The band is just fantastic, that is really what I think,
Oh, by the way, which one’s Pink?
And did we tell you the name of the game, boy?
We call it “Riding The Gravy Train”.
We’re just knocked out.
We heard about the sell out.
You’re gonna get an album out,
You owe it to the people.
We’re so happy we can hardly count.
Everybody else is just green,
Have you seen the chart?
It’s a hell of a start,
It could be made into a monster,
If we all pull together as a team.
And did we tell you the name of the game, boy?
We call it “Riding The Gravy Train”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMr3KtYUCcI
Next week's court hearing (if anyone is allowed in)
LORD CLARK – L Cranston, Clerk
Tuesday 24th March between 9.30am and 10.00am
Preliminary Hearing
CA12/20 The Rangers Football Club Ltd v LBJ Sports Apparel Ltd – Anderson Strathern LLP – Burness Paull LLP
“It will take a lot of leadership to come through this and within the SFA, knowing the new set-up, we’ve got strong characters and experienced characters. That experience is in a number of different areas, not just football. I’m sure they will lead us through this and it will be difficult, and there is so much speculation."
We're in good hands according to the former SFA president in today's Aberdeen Evening Express!
Gaslamp
I'm sobbing into my pillow, we're f**ked
Bigboab1916@15.55
I had to look. “Bitter little men with too much time on their hands” Nice bit of trolling that.
Interesting factoid. Roy Harper sang lead on Have A Cigar, much to the chagrin of Roger Waters.
That Gordon "I knew nothing about anything" Smith is certainly on a roll today in the SMSM.
Fortunately, Smith was the SFA CEO a long time ago, and the SFA has since progressed and developed into a World Class organisation with a 'Respected and Trusted to Lead' top management team in, erm, Ian Maxwell and Rod Petrie.
Nurse!!!
“Bitter little men with too much time on their hands”
Anyone ever come across the term psychological projection?
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
redlichtie 19th March 2020 at 18:56
===========================================
No but I know how to use a possessive apostrophe.
"These bitter OAP’s deserve to be in the dark."
I also have a working knowledge of what TUPE is intended for, who it is there to protect and when it kicks in.
"If there is not, then clubs will have to put themselves in receivership and TUPE over a skeleton squad of eighteen."
This doesn't sound much like Greenock to me, "worst time" or not.
"As I look from my shoe box’s window I can see a 200 unit block of condominiums priced at upwards of £300,000 with no occupants. The Chinese were expected to buy these units. There was a major pitch by CBRE at The Peninsula Hotel in Hong Kong. Not one taker. The adjacent hotel lies empty. Even the mixed-use mall/office/upmarket condo new builds are struggling for tenants. The Marriott Hotel chain have just announced 20,000 redundancies. I cannot think of a worst time to go cap in hand to"
Oh and he does write some amount of nonsense. Then adds comments saying how well written and "forensic" his work is.
StevieBC 19th March 2020 at 13:00
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IIRC, the original Rangers also asked players / staff to defer a percentage of salaries?
Suppose that could keep most folks happy, and help avert an immediate cash flow meltdown?
………………….
But that would be too much of a wake up call for the ibrox fan base who expect SG to get a warchest to stop the ten
A lot of uncertainty surrounds this virus, and the ability of many clubs to weather the storm will be dependent on so many variables, so it may be some time before a clearer picture emerges.
Although Sevco's financial figures are mainly composed of educated guessing and gauging the depth of director's pockets, I couldn't help but chuckle at the thought, that the very real possibility exists that Sevco might be liquidated before Rangers themselves finally make it onto the butchers block.
I'm not even sure what is funny about it……It just is.
.
What about the un bitter ones like me ? Can we still be haters ? Is he still overseas and railing against his ex partner and the mob that threatened to kill his parents ? Or has the narrative moved on ? This lack of football is actually quite pleasant fopr Thistle fans , or at least this one .
bigboab1916 19th March 2020 at 15:55
……………
And a lot of folk believe it was an original member of the band that sang that song on the record. Just like a lot of folk believe it is all JJ original work.
A little knowledge should shine a light.
Just a thought.
Should football open the transfer window and leave it open for now.
For clubs needing money right away they could sell players registrations getting that money in. There will be some clubs who are willing to spend even now.
We would have to accept it would be very much a buyer's market. Though if a club is near to the edge they may not care.
It would cost nothing and would allow the clubs a bit of flexibility.
I don't know if this has been mentioned before, however Raith Rovers have asked for crowdfunding support of £25,000
They have received almost £21,000 in practically no time.
Well played to their support.
https://www.justgiving.com/crowdfunding/raithroversfc
Anyone got any reading suggestions?
Nothing too demanding. No need for grammar, syntax, spelling or punctuation.
Must be humble, though.
Bonus if it's not by a writer or author; a correspondent is preferable.
Nothing too expensive.
Price negotiable.
LUGOSI 20th March 2020 at 00:21
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Anyone got any reading suggestions?
—————————————————————————————————-
'Sapiens' by Yuval Noah Harari
I see the new Rangers PR Chief is getting it tight in today’s Daily Record for a previous Facebook post referring to Celtic Park as ‘the piggery’. It makes me wonder if Traynor really is leaving the building of his own accord.
2-3 years back Rangers demanded the removal of a SFA director for a comment made several years ago referring to the Rangers support as ‘the great unwashed’. They made a huge song and dance about it and they got their wish. Was that any worse than what their new PR Chief has been reported as saying? With the type of background the guy has it is inevitable that more negative stuff will emerge. It’s only a guess but I wonder if the only reason the guy is there is to drum up financial support from Northern Ireland.
King was originally charged with threatening witnesses ,Traynor was employed as an enforcer on the media and now they have employed someone who has links to an outlawed terrorist organisation . Now if you read point one again ………..far fetched? over exaggeration? Let's remember this man has no experience for the job he has just been employed to do . It may well be that they see him as a link to DUP funds after all they employed Pedro for his links to Qatari Princes and Warburton for his contacts in the City . If they do secure new funding the first investment should be in long spoons. Dave King is a sociopath in my opinion and a dangerous character , this really is worth a read even if it's just for point 1
https://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html
Lugosi@00.21
”Laidlaw” by William McIvanney. Just reread it after a gap of about 40 years. Page 52 contains the immortal line “There’s been a murder” which I’m sure I’ve heard somewhere before.
Yep.
It's just a matter of time before this latest Ibrox 'PR expert';
– has a particular past indiscretion dug up, from which there is no return, and it simply has to be 'Game Over'
and/or
– his inexperience drops TRFC – deep – into the smelly stuff, and he has to take responsibility, and do walking away.
It's a no-brainer.
It 'could' be that he's potentially bringing a positive and negative to Ibrox.
Positive: perhaps access to 'other' funds?
Negative: a 'perceived' big stick to keep the SMSM in check, and especially in the absence of any local media contacts or relevant experience.
The race to the gutter at Ibrox has just accelerated, IMO.
Never mind 'interims'!
Companies House is allowing a two month extension to the company accounts deadline,and then another month after that if companies can demonstrate extreme circumstances [due to the coronavirus]
(The Scotsman print edition today, p.36)
JC, good spot.
I wonder if companies – of all sizes / industries – will consider changing their year end date – to extend their current financial year by X months, and past the peak of the crisis, (hopefully).
For example, if your year end is June 30th, like most (?) football clubs, then even just logistically the external auditors are unlikely to be able to conduct a full audit remotely, typically.
And also in the 'Scotsman' today we have Halliday's report on Doncaster's 'Price of Football' podcast recorded shortly before the 'pandemic' broke out.
" So [says Doncaster]cross-border leagues are, I think, coming down the track.Ultimately,any party you need an invitation to.It may be some sort of economic or political shock,or technology shock,which unsettles the environment and makes cross-border leagues more likely.But I do think that at some point in the future we will see cross-border leagues and who knows where that might take us."
We are truly in the realm of Cash is King.
Not the time to be a loss-making enterprise without access to credit facilities from a bank.
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
The virus is sweeping through all pro sport
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51968800
If you think Scottish football is bonkers go check out the financial wastelands of English pro rugby. From memory only one club broke even. All the others needed benefactor support.
On this appointment of a rookie PR man, whose only previous experience in football is as a bigoted 'Rangers' supporter, could one possibly ask for greater evidence that any semblance of integrity, if it ever existed, has now escaped the Blue Room at Ibrox? They're not even trying to pretend anymore.
Desperation doesn't even begin to describe this appointment, but we can be assured that whatever criticism comes their way from the SMSM, it will be watered down with much that could be published of a more serious nature going unreported.
I can only assume that things are so bad in the Blue Room that no one is able to make rational decisions or even ask if, whatever the proposal made, is a good idea! It's as though they are so overwhelmed with their financial problems that they've gone blind to such an obvious hypocrisy of a company running an anti-bigotry/racism campaign appointing someone – anyone, everyone – to any position in their club/company with such blatant bigotry as his trademark.
Homunculus
Great idea about transfer window which I Tweeted about earlier (with full credit of course). David Low has already Tweeted in support of the idea – based on his overarching message of "Survival" in the recent podcast.
If anyone has missed it, it really is worth a listen
http://podcast.sfm.scot/
I hope this link works, it's a tweet from Clevid Dikamona about his own reaction to the request from Hearts for players, and staff, to accept a 50% drop in wages during the crisis. He's probably not a household name amongst anyone other than Hearts supporters, but what a great attitude from someone who has, until recently, not been able to command a regular place in the team. It would be nice to think that most footballers and sportspeople, the world over, will show a similar attitude, and grasp of reality, as this young man has.
I've also read on Jambos Kickback that both Daniel Stendel, Hearts manager, and Stephen Naismith (unconfirmed) have approached Ann Budge and offered to go without wages so others can have a decent wage.
Lump in the throat time for me.
https://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/uploads/monthly_2020_03/Screenshot_20200320-112641.png.ee409639d5bcc174b7c538652ce4f117.png
Link to article re Stendel
https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/daniel-stendel-tells-hearts-use-his-wages-pay-other-staff-german-free-leave-if-club-relegated-2502930
When Cash is King but King has no Cash the Monarchy is in danger
The incoming PR appointee has already instructed Ibrox to update their diversity campaign slogan;
"Everyone but Anyone who's not one of us."
At least he's honest.
A perfect storm….
SPFL sponsor finishes at end of 19/20 as does Scottish Cup. Can’t see when Betfred ends in league cup.
what’s the likelihood of getting new sponsors in on improved terms given current circumstances?
Big Pink 20th March 2020 at 12:25
It's a bit of a no-brainer for me.
How does a company get cash.
Normal sales
Disposal of assets
Share issues
Loans
If three of those are impossible, or extremely difficult, and the other one is currently banned. Lift the ban, at least until things get back to approaching normality.
Allowing clubs the chance to survive surely outweighs the reasons for the transfer windows in the first place. Particularly as no-one is going to be playing football for the foreseeable future anyway.
Its a simple way for the game to support it's own clubs.
‘Allyjambo 20th March 2020 at 12:22
On this appointment of a rookie PR man, whose only previous experience in football is as a bigoted ‘Rangers’ supporter, could one possibly ask for greater evidence that any semblance of integrity, if it ever existed, has now escaped the Blue Room at Ibrox? They’re not even trying to pretend anymore…’
#########################
I can’t have been alone in wondering why a former TRFC director (and DCK ally), known for being a true-blue RRM & liking a ‘certain’ type of sing-song was being paraded in the SMSM last week…
…then David Graham is appointed & it all becomes clear. They’ve been caught ‘red-handed’: going forward, Ibrox is going to be (even-more) ‘Ulsterised’!
(I wonder if anyone with a BT postcode joining Club1872 will receive a discount of £1.82 on the regular subscription?)
I see Alex Salmonds lawyer has introduced a new version of legal process. In Eck's defence he has proclaimed "I cant prove something's going on here but I'm sure I can smell it"
Oh if only that worked! (in legal terms at least)
Dom 16
…and I also think the transfer market will absolutely plummet.
https://za.investing.com/equities/micromega-holdings-ltd-chart
Exactly 1 month ago today the price was R250 today it is R125. King has lost 50% of his wealth in just 4 weeks and the price had been falling since 2015 when it was a heady R1550. Since he ascended the marble staircase he is down 90% , his Gerrard gamble has slipped at the final furlong and he is staring at an impecunious future. His shares in RIFC are worthless and unsellable and his £5m loan has no chance of being repaid. If he attempted to call it in it tips RIFC over the edge as they have no funds to settle and very few assets to sell . Any assets they do have are hawked to Close Leasing. I do wonder if he has a claim on the stadium that John "Whurz ra Deeds" Brown played at .I think JC questioned whether the Japan based investor who was involved in commercial property was more than a coincidence.
I agree that opening the transfer market may help but most clubs are in the same position in that there will be many wanting to sell to cut costs but only a handful that will be cash rich enough to buy. They know that there is more chance of players being freed and available for nothing in the weeks and months ahead and are more likely to wait. The velocity of currency has hit a brick wall , nobody is spending , people and business' are nervous of the future and hoarding cash rather than spending it will be the order of the day.
Timtim 20th March 2020 at 17:03
https://za.investing.com/equities/micromega-holdings-ltd-chart
=================================
Thanks for keeping track on this. The fall in the share price in "Sebata Holdings" (formerly Micromega) has devastated King's "wealth" retained within South Africa. The value of his stake at today's exchange rate (20.39 ZAR to the £1) is now only £4.46m.
I suspect that if he has provided a £5m loan facility to RIFC, then he will be wanting (perhaps needing) to call in the loan soon, if he hasn't asked for it already.
@EJ , I read that the loan is not due to be repaid til 2021 so it may be the case that he can't even ask for it yet. I cannot see them continuing beyond the end of this month (unless everyone takes a 100% pay cut) . King is a busted flush , it's all over bar the shouting .
If TRFC run out of money then how can an administration be paid for? Will it not simply pass into receivership with Close Bros holding valid security over certain assets. It must be a choice this month of pay salaries or enter admin unless further donations can be squeezed out of interested parties.
gunnerb 20th March 2020 at 18:51
If TRFC run out of money then how can an administration be paid for? Will it not simply pass into receivership with Close Bros holding valid security over certain assets. It must be a choice this month of pay salaries or enter admin unless further donations can be squeezed out of interested parties.
=======================================
It is within the power of the SFA and SPFL to set aside their insolvency rules and player registration restrictions (transfer window) for at least a temporary period.
For some clubs it may be prudent to go down the insolvency route in order to be able to stop trading and release high earners until such time as normal trading can be resumed.
There would also be risks with that approach as any insolvency practitioner appointed could, in theory, sell all the assets for a fraction of their value, rather than keep the company in a dormant status for a period. There could be issues about how a club could emerge from administration after the crisis. Could it restart its operations without going through a CVA? Could it re-engage players on different contracts? I don’t know
Billionaire Buddies from Japan and Hong Kong Phooey fantasies aside…
to get through the Corona crisis – and beyond – the necessary funds will have to be self-generated at Ibrox.
The Directors and/or the fans will simply have to stump up the cash.
It's been suggested that the Directors are all tapped out – which could very well be the case, and understandably so.
Which leaves the bears…
Will we see the launch of a major, emotional blackmail campaign to demand that the fans save TRFC and help with 'going for 55'.
Such a fund raiser would be much more effective if it was co-ordinated with a circling-of-the-wagons and loud pointing of fingers at all the 'Rangers haters' for inflicting perceived, (dreamt up), injustices or some such BS.
I think we've seen this Ibrox movie before… and a few sequels too!
How much money does Club 1872 have just now.
I'm sure just giving that to the club could be branded "a project".
Homunculus 20th March 2020 at 20:38
How much money does Club 1872 have just now.
I'm sure just giving that to the club could be branded "a project".
——————————————————————————
I would be very interested to see a formal justification for such a project or 'investment' as these folks all seem to call it.
A risk assessment would probably be too hot to touch!
They would be better advised to hoard their funds for the creation of Sevco #2.
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
I think club 1872 had their pockets picked not so long ago and the amount they have built up since then will not make a great deal of difference (rough liberal est 500k) . The problem with raising capital from Directors and fans is the Directors are "tapped out" , they know it's a bottomless pit and they have their own business concerns at the moment , fans likewise. The season is effectively over with zero income on the horizon for at least 4 months , any ST money they can bring in for next season is held in escrow and released on game by game basis. They owe £9.6m in transfer fees due in June plus the Close loan , there is a further 12m in transfer fees to be paid at a later date and of course Kings 5m then there's all the court cases. There comes a time when you must realise that you cannot square the circle , that there is no point spending 4m in March just to get to April then another 4m just to get to May then another 4m to get to June when you have to pay 10m . If they do manage to wiggle out of this then it will be an act Houdini would be proud of
Homunculus 20th March 2020 at 20:38
How much money does Club 1872 have just now.
I'm sure just giving that to the club could be branded "a project".
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Their last "investment" was £500k in November 2019. Prior to that it was £1m in September 2018.
If they only took in £500k between those two dates then they won't have much more than enough for a couple of good nights in Glasgow (sic. Chick Young – and that's with pubs and clubs shut).
Timtim 20th March 2020 at 21:12
"…… any ST money they can bring in for next season is held in escrow and released on game by game basis."
——————————————————————————————–
That's an interesting thought. Have the season ticket holders any right of refund if fixtures are not played?
Are Rangers* better off having a quick ending of the season so that they can access this cash rather than waiting to whenever the games actually get played?
How much is actually effectively sitting in escrow?
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
easyJambo 20th March 2020 at 21:13
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LOL indeed.
I believe a decent night out runs to about £95,000 or thereabouts.
Well it did back in the day.
I imagine fans would be entitled to a refund for any games not played or any games played behind closed doors, normally fans may waive their right to a refund when things are tight for their club but things are going to be equally difficult for them as well. As for the amount I could only hazard a guess at approx 1m per home game that's left (that's £30 minus vat x 45k ) knowing the way admin works it will end up in the administrators pocket rather than any creditor.
IIRC, £95K was "not just for any good night out in Glasgow"…
but for "a Campbell Ogilvie good night out in Glasgow".
Does anyone know what that dodgy, slippery character is up to these days?
(Hopefully retired and nowhere near football in any capacity?)
Smugas 20th March 2020 at 15:57
I see Alex Salmonds lawyer has introduced a new version of legal process. In Eck’s defence he has proclaimed “I cant prove something’s going on here but I’m sure I can smell it”
Oh if only that worked! (in legal terms at least)
Something stinks. Reading the MSM against Doleman and Craig Murray (banned from the court on a “possible contempt”) its like a different world and that reporting is meant to be restricted.
The front page of todays DR is contempt. In my view.
John Clark 20th March 2020 at 10:34
And also in the 'Scotsman' today we have Halliday's report on Doncaster's 'Price of Football' podcast recorded shortly before the 'pandemic' broke out.
" So [says Doncaster]cross-border leagues are, I think, coming down the track.Ultimately,any party you need an invitation to.It may be some sort of economic or political shock,or technology shock,which unsettles the environment and makes cross-border leagues more likely.But I do think that at some point in the future we will see cross-border leagues and who knows where that might take us."
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
So if i've got this right the SPFL (no doubt in close collusion with the SFA) let loose the Covid-19 just to get cross border football for the Old Firm. I'm paranoid enough to believe that.
Timtim 20th March 2020 at 21:12
I think club 1872 had their pockets picked not so long ago and the amount they have built up since then will not make a great deal of difference (rough liberal est 500k) . The problem with raising capital from Directors and fans is the Directors are "tapped out" , they know it's a bottomless pit and they have their own business concerns at the moment , fans likewise. The season is effectively over with zero income on the horizon for at least 4 months , any ST money they can bring in for next season is held in escrow and released on game by game basis. They owe £9.6m in transfer fees due in June plus the Close loan , there is a further 12m in transfer fees to be paid at a later date and of course Kings 5m then there's all the court cases. There comes a time when you must realise that you cannot square the circle , that there is no point spending 4m in March just to get to April then another 4m just to get to May then another 4m to get to June when you have to pay 10m . If they do manage to wiggle out of this then it will be an act Houdini would be proud of
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It's not a matter of squaring the cirlcle for some of the Directors when trading when insolvent.
There are some Directors with other interests to protect and the consequences of being found guilty of that are not worth thinking about.
Timtim 20th March 2020 at 21:12
They owe £9.6m in transfer fees due in June plus the Close loan , there is a further 12m in transfer fees to be paid at a later date and of course Kings 5m then there’s all the court cases.
………………
Off the top of my head i can’t remember when the Close Brothers loan is due to be paid back. Any information?
@C1 I thought it was the end of this month but not 100% sure
redlichtie 20th March 2020 at 21:00
'…I would be very interested to see a formal justification for such a project or 'investment' as these folks all seem to call it.'
…………
My own feeling is that there is a very loose interpretation of what the word 'community' means as used in Section 35(5) of The Company's(Audit) Investigation and Community Enterprise )Act 2004!
Can the supporters and shareholders of a football club really be considered a community in the way that , say, the population Castlemilk or Aviemore or Leith or Dumfries is a civic 'community', with common interests?
I myself do not think so.
Anyway, this is from the Articles of Association of Club 1872 Shares Community Interest Company, company number 476150
“Article 5.1 The objects of the Company are to carry on activities which benefit the community and in particular (without limitation) to acquire a shareholding in the controlling entity of The Rangers Football Club('the Club') and to utilise this shareholding to repair,improve and enhance the engagement between the owners and the followers and supporters of the club and otherwise to support and enhance the aspirations of Rangers supporters and followers for the well-being of the club and its footballing success. …
…..
6.1. The Company may do all such lawful things as may further the Company's objects and, in particular, but without limitation, may borrow or raise and secure the payment of money for any purpose including for the purposes of investment or of raising funds . [ note: but isn't allowed to grant security over its assets unless this approved by Special Resolution] "
I think that supports my view that to describe the supporters of a football club as constituting a 'community' ( for tax relief purposes and such) is stretching things a bit, in the circumstances where any particular football club (or clubs!) appear to foster ill-will and the very opposite of civic 'community' and civic unity.
ClusterOne@22.17
“Off the top of my head i can’t remember when the Close Brothers loan is due to be paid back.”
Too soon.
Homunculus 20th March 2020 at 21:37
'..I believe a decent night out runs to about £95,000 or thereabouts.
Well it did back in the day.'
………………………….
That made me smile when I saw it earlier.
I would nearly say 'poor Chick!' except that he contributed to the minimising of the possible involvement of CO in the whole dirty saga of untruth and cheating.
He allowed his partisanship to direct his 'journalism'.
As so many of the SMSM have done-to their eternal discredit!
All very depressing stuff at the moment , no footie no pubs no jigging no pasta no eggs and no toilet roll !! Club allegiancies aside for a moment and the scary scenario football wise is , what is the football landscape gonna look like once we get through the other side of this ?
Clubs are gonna go bust , not just here in Scotland but everywhere . What ever is left of Scottish football once we get by this , it should be a time for ALL the clubs to come together and choose to put in place proffesional people with a genuine love of our game . Clubs need to realise that for the good of the game the SFA must be cleansed once and for all. I would even take the SFA out of Glasgow . Aberdeen , Dundee or Perth for me . Sort the feking rule book out once and for all and the people in charge earn their corn by deciding any controversial issues of the day themselves instead of involving lawyers and the crazy finanacial fees that go with it . FFP should be the first thing that should be brought in . That we dont already have it ( and we all know why ) is reason enough to kick the corrupt imcompetents out of office . Rangers in whatever form must be stood up to by every club if Scottish football is ever to thrive . When you think over the years the amount of time and effort the SFA must have taken up ducking and diving to appease Rangers it is absoloutely crazy. We need an SFA fit for purpose who will treat every club equally and not be afraid to make decisions . I would go further and say that a decent percentage of any Champs league money should be distributed to the clubs in the league but ONLY if the above was in place . I know some fellow Celtic fans may not agree with that but we need a proper competitive league . Oh and all teams in the top division must have a grass park ! I know Im way ahead of myself but woke up a bit depressed with all things football just now and trying to stay positive . Whilst things are black at the moment , if we get through this it could be a genuine opportunity to fix a broken system here in Scotland . Anyhoo Im gonna get up and have breakfast…………anyone got any spare eggs ?
My question of the other day is partly answered! Iain McMenemy, chairman of Stenhousemuir tells us that his club's share of the £1.5 million is £,8000!
Come to think of it, re: completing the current season's fixtures, or not…
Whilst the social distancing continues, all players will be losing their match fitness – regardless of how much training they can do themselves.
It looks like there could be many more weeks, (months ?), to go before public events are allowed again.
If fixtures are initiated ASAP, there could be a higher risk that players could sustain injuries due to their – relatively -impaired physical state.
I.e. the longer the break, the greater the need for a 'pre-season' training period?
Ergo, it could be another reason not to complete this season's league games – with possibly a question mark over the remaining SC games rolling over to the beginning of next season… whenever that will be.
One thing that really annoys me in all this is the fact that UEFA are dictating that June the 30th is the cut off date to finish all our current domestic leagues . Why ? So that the big fat gravy train can roll again and make more money thats why. Imo UEFA should do one , domestic leagues are more important at the moment than their crazy money pot competition . The Champs League, Europa cup etc should be scrapped until normality is up and running in all domestic competitions . As StevieBC says above players need to get back up to speed . It looks at the moment as we aint gonna see football anytime soon , players will be out of contract, many clubs might not be here any more etc but all they give a shit about is their competition. Without the domestic leagues properly up and running again how can you have a proper Champs league or Europa cup competition. Its all self interest on their part , the football world might never be the same again , its time they realised that and start thinking about what role they should be playing in helping domestic football back on its feet
Here’s my tuppence worth.
I think it’s safe to say that this season is done and everybody involved in the game should plan to start again in August.
What is currently missing is leadership from someone with authority in the game to say it out loud. Motherwell fans have already responded and if season tickets for next season are sold then that will help to partially offset the current cash crisis.
In other news I heard anecdotally that subscribers were deserting SkySports and this is now being accelerated by pubs being shut.
Stay safe.
I read this elsewhere, so hope it's correct:
Sky is offering the facility to temporarily suspend sports packages.
If you go to the 'My Sky' app, there's (apparently) a button which allows you to 'pause' Sky Sports (and the charges incurred) during the current public health emergency. You'll be automatically reconnected when sport recommences. I'm told that the channels may still be watched when you do this.
BT Sport appears to be allowing immediate cancellation: that is, you do not need to give one month's notice.
Jingso.Jimsie 21st March 2020 at 14:39
Have just been onto Sky and used the pause facility, pretty easy though you may have to wait to be connected due to volume of users also pausing. In saying that I've had nothing yet to confirm that my Sky Sports package has been paused.
Pretty good thinking on their part as it'll keep hold of customers who might otherwise cancel altogether and not re-subscribe later or immediately the crisis is over.
Allyjambo 21st March 2020 at 15:16
Jingso.Jimsie 21st March 2020 at 14:39
Have just been onto Sky and used the pause facility, pretty easy though you may have to wait to be connected due to volume of users also pausing. In saying that I've had nothing yet to confirm that my Sky Sports package has been paused.
Pretty good thinking on their part as it'll keep hold of customers who might otherwise cancel altogether and not re-subscribe later or immediately the crisis is over.
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I have a prepaid subscription to NowTV for their Sky Sports "season ticket" package which has the best part of three months to run.
At the moment they are not offering a "pause" facility while there is little in the way of live sports. Their best offer is a "one month" Sky Sports pass which can be started at some point in the next year. No refunds are on offer.
Apart from being a crap offer, NowTV is part of Sky, so it's treating customers differently based on which service(s) they use. I will keep at them though in the hope that they will eventually see sense. I know from forums that that I'm certainly not the only one who has made a similar complaint.