About the The Scottish Football Monitor

ByTrisidium

About the The Scottish Football Monitor

The purpose of The Scottish Football Monitor is to pay homage to, and carry on the work of the groundbreaking RangersTaxCase blog (RTC). The aim of the Scottish Football Monitor is to cast a questioning and watchful eye on Scottish Football officialdom and the compliant mainstream media (MSM).

Scottish football, in the immediate wake of the Rangers FC liquidation, faces great challenges. The MSM have provided no sensible checks or balances on the actions of the authorities. The Scottish Football Monitor aims to provide those checks and balance.

The cosy relationship that has existed between the media and people at the top of Scottish Football has dissuaded those who may otherwise be moved to blow the whistle on wrongdoing. The Scottish Football Monitor aims, through time, and by winning the trust of ordinary fans, to fill a gap in the football media in Scotland that has been up to now filled only by RTC.

The Rangers FC saga, its consequences, and consequences of the accompanying stream of untruths and misdirection fed to us by the MSM is far from over. RTC was successful in getting the previously buried truth of the Rangers tax case into the mainstream despite a hostile MSM reaction. The Scottish Football Monitor hopes to use the skills and expertise of those in our community to a cast light on matters that those in authority would have concealed, or at least present alternative arguments to those being presented as having none.

Scottish Football Monitor asks contributors to remember only a few things;

1. The site is not the domain of any one club and is open to fans of all clubs.

2. Absolutely no discussion with regard to religion should take place.

3. Posters should refrain from using foul or abusive language.

Welcome to The Scottish Football Monitor

About the author

Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

2,167 Comments so far

redlichtiePosted on2:55 pm - Aug 3, 2012


loamfeet says:
August 3, 2012 at 11:56
I was astounded to hear Sportsound “talking up” Scottish football after taking a cue from their interview with Stephen Thompson of Dundee United. Thompson said that the Sky deal on the table would amount to a loss of less than 10% compared to the previous deal that was on the table. “Remarkable,” Richard Gordon said, “that there was so much talk of armageddon only a few weeks ago” singularly failing to note that much of that talk came from pundits on his own show. “Who could have predicted that the top flight could be in this position going into the new season,” he asked. Pretty much every soul on the RTC blog, for a start.

And spare a thought for poor, confused Terry Butcher:

11th May: “From our point of view, it would be a disaster if Rangers were not in the SPL. We need the Old Firm in the SPL for us to survive, like all the other clubs.”

2nd August: ““Rangers going makes it a much more open league than before. [ .. ] Every club is thinking they don’t have to play the Old Firm teams as often. Those games can blight a good run and if you suffer a heavy defeat it has repercussions on a club. [ .. ] We don’t have that now, it is much more open and there is the chance of one or two teams putting good, long runs together against the other sides.”

Talk about cognitive dissonance.
————————————————————————————————

Clear evidence that the MSM and footballers have the attention span of a gnat.

Thank goodness RTC and the internet bampots have somewhat longer memories and active critical faculties.

Unfortunately the majority of readers of the MSM must themselves be in some sub-gnat-like state to keep believing the MSM output. Obviously an interdependent relationship.

Apologies to all gnats for bringing them into this comparison.

/ Red Lichtie

PS No gnats were harmed in the preparation of this posting.

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RayCharlezPosted on2:58 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Auldheid says:
August 3, 2012 at 14:23

One of the best parts of RTC was the humour and Rab’s post was very witty.

The reaction to me reposting it has, in my opinion, been a bit po-faced.

Perhaps some people are taking themselves so seriously.

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smallteaserPosted on3:01 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Domaine Jessiaume says:
August 3, 2012 at 12:20

English FA paying £500,000 to SFA in relation to the Steve Davis transfer. SFA will deduct £196,000 in respect of fines and pass the balance to Charles Green.
=======================================================
Where is this from, cannot find it anywhere else?

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thedevilsfinalbattlePosted on3:04 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Test

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smallteaserPosted on3:16 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Stirling Albion announcement on tickets for Rangers game:-

“Following on from discussions with Central Scotland Police and our stewarding company with regards to our October 6 home fixture against Rangers, the SAFC executive board have agreed on the following pricing structure: adults £13, senior citizens £10, children £7. There will be no student tickets available for this match.

Stirling Albion announcement on ticket price for Annan game :-

Saturday August 11
Annan Athletic (H) Division Three, 3pm
Adults £10, Seniors/students £7, children U17 £5

Nothing to beat a bit of capitalism none and again, the SFL3 clubs will now be richer than the SFL2 & SFL1 clubs.
I thought there was a set published rate for games before the season starts.
Pensioners almost 50% increase for a game against Rangers, shame on you.

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Charlie BrownPosted on3:17 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Auldheid you might want to look at your gravatar if you want to retain your anonimity?

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Livia BurlandoPosted on3:18 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Testing my posting ability and avatar thing. My RTC posts mostly vanished.

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stevensanphPosted on3:20 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:16

adults £13, senior citizens £10, children £7
Adults £10, Seniors/students £7, children U17 £5

So its cheaper for a kid to watch football at McDiarmid Park this season, than it is to go to a SFL3 game!!

For anyone who missed it, Saints, and I believe Aberdeen (could be wrong here!) are letting U12’s in for free all season. Saints include away fans in this.

You can’t blame Stirling though… this may be the only game they get against Sevco should their fans not buy season tickets…

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smallteaserPosted on3:21 pm - Aug 3, 2012


http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/aug/03/espn-spl-rangers-contract

Rangers must be getting a good share of the TV revenue, 10 games from ESPM + 5 from Sky each season for 5 years, any monetary figures released?
In fact does anyone know any of the details of the TV contract, not how many games, the relevant stuff,like distribution to all 42 clubs etc.

Nothing changes, Scottish football couldn’t survive without Rangers and Scottish football will ensure Rangers survive.

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coineanachantaighePosted on3:24 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Blindsummit says:

I think we need to have a list of “issues” that require to be monitored and as we the fans and paying customers are satisfied with the explanation given we can remove them one by one from the list.
________________________________________________
I think this is a splendid idea. Not knowing much about WordPress, I’m wondering if the mods are able to add a tab alongside the “About” tab on the top menu bar, for an issues and questions log. There are just so many unanswered questions that it’s tough to keep track of them, and some could easily slip away.
——————————————————————————-

Perhaps an FAQ for questions that are asked a lot (and are a bit historical) and have been answered?? Then the “Issues” tab for stuff that’s current and there’s no complete answer to yet?

Of course don’t want too many tabs or site would become unfocussed.

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smallteaserPosted on3:28 pm - Aug 3, 2012


stevensanph says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:20

You can’t blame Stirling though… this may be the only game they get against Sevco should their fans not buy season tickets…
=========================================================================
Certainly cannot blame them for making money, however if they start budgeting for this then they will go bust, the same as the SPL clubs could not cope when Rangers were withdrawn from the SPL.
The myth that Scottish football can survive without either of them has well and truly been kicked into touch.

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Once A Bhoy….Posted on3:30 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Good luck with carrying on the traditions of the original blog guys.

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smartie1947Posted on3:33 pm - Aug 3, 2012


I’ve missed a few days events this week.
Can someone please enlighten me if any reputable source can confirm if Mr C Green actually paid over his £5.5m, to D & P this week, as per his CVA proposals.
Many thanks.

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Fritz AgrandoldteamPosted on3:35 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:21

This is why I won’t be subcribing to ESPN this year

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john clarkePosted on3:36 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Charlie Brown says:
August 3, 2012 at 14:45

‘Perhaps we can compile a large list of all our unresolved issues or queries, break them down into their relevant SFA / SPL / SFL issues and then compose and send a letter to all of Regan, Doncaster & Longmuir asking for their answers or responses to these unresolved or inconsistency issues. ….’


A number of serious posters have variously over the last few months tried to list all of the various issues that have arisen out of the disgraced club’s disgraceful actions:

in the field of civil law ( tax evasion, the stiffing of creditors, possible unprofessional conduct by administrators..etc )

in the field of criminal law ( fraudulent, perhaps, sale and purchase of a football club, incitement to violence, etc)

in the field of football administration ( wholesale breaking of the Rules by the disgraced club; possible corruption of senior administrators in possibly hiding that rule-breaking; definitely dodgy rule-breaking by the Football Authorities to avoid having to let the offending club suffer all the consequences of its bad behaviour; highly suspicious granting of conditional membership of the SFA and very questionable admittance to the 3rd Div of the SPL; and peculiar player-registration procedures with a non-existent club)

in the field of Politics ( inappropriate interventions by MSPs and First Minister. and sundry other ‘time-to-move-on quasi-political hoorah henrys..)

in the media field ( unbalanced, partisan and inaccurate and selective reporting by BBC Radio Scotland, …)

The list is long, and very long.

If these posters could now re-post their lists round about the same day, perhaps the rest of us can produce our own individual comprehensive list, ensuring that no facet is left unmentioned.

Otherwise, CB, you’ll require quite a few hours of trawling back through all that has been posted to copy and paste everything. But at least, we now know that the archive is safely preserved, and the info is there.

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parttimearabPosted on3:37 pm - Aug 3, 2012


I notice that sky and espn will be showing a combined total of 60 live Spl games plus 15 “rangers” games per season.
That should help put bums back on seats in our grounds don’t you think?

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coineanachantaighePosted on3:43 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:01

English FA paying £500,000 to SFA in relation to the Steve Davis transfer. SFA will deduct £196,000 in respect of fines and pass the balance to Charles Green.
=======================================================
Where is this from, cannot find it anywhere else?
——————————————————————–

It’s been reported (e.g., Herald) that the FA have told Southampton to pay the money they decided off their own bat to pay to SFA and not Sevoc (TheRangers).

I presume because the right of Green’s mob to any money is dubious.

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ChrisPosted on3:45 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:21

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/aug/03/espn-spl-rangers-contract

Rangers must be getting a good share of the TV revenue, 10 games from ESPM + 5 from Sky each season for 5 years, any monetary figures released?
In fact does anyone know any of the details of the TV contract, not how many games, the relevant stuff,like distribution to all 42 clubs etc.

Nothing changes, Scottish football couldn’t survive without Rangers and Scottish football will ensure Rangers survive.

Courtesy of lubolubo on KDS:

The SFL has a very weird distribution system

Basically there is a capped amount, around £1.3 million, of the first profit the league makes

75% of this is split equally between all clubs (sevco get 1/30th)
25% of this is split on a incentive based ladder system

Any money over this £1.3 million is split between the clubs, at the discretion of the board, by the following rules

1st division clubs get 55% of the excess split amongst them
2nd division clubs get 33% of the excess split amongst them
3rd division clubs get 12% of the excess split amongst them

Sevco would get 1/10th of that 12%.

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coineanachantaighePosted on3:45 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Forgot to say (in previous post) – that was only mention I could find, no mention as far as I can see about passing any money on to Green.

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coineanachantaighePosted on3:49 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Testing

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the Don DionisioPosted on3:50 pm - Aug 3, 2012


RTC,PL/TSFM,CE,RayCharles,rab…..(especially RTC)….. a very belated “mille grazie per tutto”, I am not worthy.

I promise to TUPE over, but will only post when I have something to say, not because I have to say something !

At that point I will be happy to hook up again with all the good fellas and wiseguys on here. I have been busy with pressing family matters……Stracci, Cuneo,Philip Tattaglia, Barzini, the Rosatto Brothers, Frank Pantangeli…you know the sort of thing.

As for the “Team”, I am flattered to be included—especially given my meagre contributions–mainly about the ramifications, ins-and -outs, etc of the beast known as the Floating Charge….(yawn,yawn) right at the beginning of RTC’s blog.

Remember ,however, none of the players asked or sought to be nominated so there is no clique/elite, and it is grossly unfair to accuse Ray Charles, a stalwart from the beginning, of elitism.

Having said that, I demand a place for slimshady !

Also patently incorrect to suggest–(did the trolls TUPE over as well?)—that the Team is 100% CFC, when it includes Paulie Walnuts, Easy Jambo and Onand (x3) for starters, and there may be others.

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RobinBhoyPosted on3:53 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Glad to see that the inquisition will continue to ensure that the MSM need to do their jobs better.

Good luck with the new site

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jonnyodPosted on4:00 pm - Aug 3, 2012


testing testing testing

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row zPosted on4:03 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Why did the SFA not conduct the dual contracts investigation¿ Easy one. Because they WANTED to be the appeal body. Why¿ Because if they conducted the investigation the appeal body would be the CAS thereby loosing control of the outcome. simples.

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Lord WobblyPosted on4:04 pm - Aug 3, 2012


The Ranger’s deliberate 10year EBT scheme vs Celtic’s one-off Juninho EBT.

Any fair minded person knows that the two scenarios are not comparable.

Rangers followed one path with the sole intention of gaining a financial advantage which consequently gave them a footballing advantage. No tax paid to date and possibly not registered with the football authorities. If not registered correctly then matches must be amended to a 3-0 win for the opposition and any titles/trophies must be stripped.

Celtic paid one player on his way out of the club. No footballing advantage. Probably all tax paid but possibly not registered with the football authorities. Does that make the player incorrectly registered? If so then the same consequences must apply.

It does raise an interesting point though. What if payments were made to a player AFTER he left a club? By that I mean that a player might be registered as being on a wage which he is paid throughout his time at the club. But then later, perhaps much later, he is paid lump sum directly or indirectly (eg pension scheme) which wasn’t registered while playing. Obviously this would raise the same trust issues which led to the side letters but it is not inconceivable that a player might be attracted to a club in this way.

Could full public disclosure of players contracts be the answer?

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Dark BluePosted on4:06 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Dundee confirmed as premier league members in a unaminous vote of spl clubs today

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AuldheidPosted on4:08 pm - Aug 3, 2012


RayCharles says:

August 3, 2012 at 14:58

7

2

Rate This

Auldheid says:
August 3, 2012 at 14:23

One of the best parts of RTC was the humour and Rab’s post was very witty.

The reaction to me reposting it has, in my opinion, been a bit po-faced.

Perhaps some people are taking themselves so seriously.
=========================
I took myself too seriously once and it was’nt funny.

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mickdPosted on4:09 pm - Aug 3, 2012


The Rangers FC propaganda machine? This smacks of in house positive spin:

http://ibroxnoise.blogspot.no/2012/08/do-rangers-fans-trust-charles-green.html

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Dark BluePosted on4:10 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Unanimous

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rantinrobinPosted on4:11 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Don ,what is on and (x3) team?

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smallteaserPosted on4:15 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Chris says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:45

Chris, do we know if this is how it has been done previously or if there has been a new agreement put in place?
I cannot see Rangers giving TV rights to almost all games this season for that amount.
Included in this deal is 3 games at Ibrox.

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Dark BluePosted on4:15 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Bbc saying Dundee spl membership ratified. Does this mean transfered from Rangers(IA)?

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jonnyodPosted on4:24 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Well it looks like all Scottish Football fans (except one club) will have another battle on our hands at the end of this season .
IMO regan /doncaster and longmuir will be putting plans in place to fast track 2012 fc through the leagues ,bypassing all sporting integrity on the way .

It looks to me as if they are hell bent on gambling with the very game in this country to force their will on us all no matter what our views are ,well that’s up to them and I hope it’s worth it as if their gamble does not come off ,there will be no going back .
If the fans who go through the turnstiles lose faith in the game as a contest then it could be fatal for the game and no amount of positive publicity will convince them that there is any level playing field in the game .

The first rule in our game has to be that every member club will be treated the same no matter what .There are thousands of fans who pay their hard earned money week in week out to see their teams and maybe once in a while they will reach a cup final and maybe even win it ,why should these fans clubs be treated any different from the bigger clubs ,there is NO excuse for it .

If a TV company’s contract dictates that ANY teams can’t drop out the league then that contract should not be signed .

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the Don DionisioPosted on4:27 pm - Aug 3, 2012


rantinrobin,

Onand(x3) was a RFC man, don’t know if he TUPED over to Sevco…..but a good fella and wiseguy, intelligent as well.

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AuldheidPosted on4:29 pm - Aug 3, 2012


john clarke says:

August 3, 2012 at 14:04

We can ask but the SFA are under no obligation to reply and certainly not to reveal what they do not want to in a reply.

You commented on the correspondence between the CST and the SFA where a reply was forthcoming within a few days. That is is because the enquiry came from a fully constituted representative supporters group who could not be ignored.

I posted on the interim blog that it was essential that we have folk on here who are members of groups, particulary supporters trusts as the SFA HAVE to engage with them via Supporters Direct and ask them to raise the issue that are discussed on here.

There is a perfect opportunity coming up to tell the SFA that supporters have lost trust in their ability to govern football fairly and demanding that the SFA tell us what they are going to do to restore that confidence, not platitudes but an action plan.

The opportunity comes in the form of a conference on 19th August at Falkirk Stadium

see

http://www.supporters-direct.coop/events/item.asp?e=6632

Now if the issue of the loss of trust were to be raised there it could not be ignored by the msm or the SFA. That could be done during the workshops which should produce issues that the SFA need to address to meet the aims of the Supporters Direct project and surely restoring trust is key to achieving the aim of greater supporter involvement?.

Registration is required by 15th August if anyone is up for attending.

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BayviewGoldPosted on4:31 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Some comments about how we make this effective, (no I don’t have the answers so you can stop reading now) but ultimately for this blog to be effective it has to have focus and drive change, how is that done – I would argue it is not the comments but rather the actions that the comments encourage us to do, so all the comments are wasted unless we take these and perform some actions in the real world, as many have said that means letters, emails, call etc. The alternative is what I saw happened with RFC – for all the thousands of fans they all stood back and waited on someone saving them, in reality they could have organised and either bought the club or at least put the right type of pressure on prospective and past buyers. We need to do the same – the SPL & SFL campaigns were won not by RTC itself (no don’t TD yet) but what RTC enabled us to do – organise, be informed and then go back our respective clubs and put pressure on them, This is the model we need – the blog is the inform, document and organise part – but as it stands it will not be the action, that needs to come from us.

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rantinrobinPosted on4:32 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Thanks Don.Thought he was,he thinks I am a piper in real life,and makes reference to my musical ability.He has the wrong person.

That’s the virtual world in which we live! I am Batman’s sidekick.

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Domaine JessiaumePosted on4:33 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:01
5 0 Rate This
Domaine Jessiaume says:
August 3, 2012 at 12:20

English FA paying £500,000 to SFA in relation to the Steve Davis transfer. SFA will deduct £196,000 in respect of fines and pass the balance to Charles Green.
=======================================================
Where is this from, cannot find it anywhere else?
======================================

Same source as before on RTC.

(So far as I know it has not been reported anywhere, but I am not an avid reader of Scottish football journalism, to be honest.)

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iamacantPosted on4:35 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:21

Nothing changes, Scottish football couldn’t survive without Rangers and Scottish football will ensure Rangers survive.
——————————————————————————————————–

RFC(IA) cannot survive without Scottish football 😉

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BayviewGoldPosted on4:36 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Auldheid says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:29

Rate This

john clarke says:

August 3, 2012 at 14:04

Better post than mine and essentially covering the same ground, one thing that this reminded me of and has been niggling for some time, even though we have these supporters groups, they are essentially separate from the SFL/SPL/SFL organisations, maybe one thing they can start to push is for direct representation on the committees of these quangos/clubs. So at least we have customer oversight on the workings.

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ChrisPosted on4:40 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Lord Wobbly says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:04

The Ranger’s deliberate 10year EBT scheme vs Celtic’s one-off Juninho EBT.

Any fair minded person knows that the two scenarios are not comparable.

We believe so, yes, but it has to be proven to be incomparable. The FTTT will nail the coffin lid on this one once they detail the astonishing lengths Rangers’ executives went to hide the fact they were cheating, and the fact they were informed in no unneccessary terms that they were cheating, and their subsequent continuation of the same policy afterwards.

Rangers followed one path with the sole intention of gaining a financial advantage which consequently gave them a footballing advantage. No tax paid to date and possibly not registered with the football authorities. If not registered correctly then matches must be amended to a 3-0 win for the opposition and any titles/trophies must be stripped.

Without a doubt. The contravention is the thing which means there should be a sanction, the nature of the contravention (my oft-repeated phrase: breaking the rules on registration to hide tax evasion) is what should nail down the severity of the sanction. Correcting the historical record and retrospectively awarding competitions to other clubs is not a sanction, it’s natural justice being applied and the true winners recognised – a massive fine or even an expulsion from the game completely would be appropriate punishment.

Celtic paid one player on his way out of the club. No footballing advantage. Probably all tax paid but possibly not registered with the football authorities. Does that make the player incorrectly registered? If so then the same consequences must apply.

Unfortunately, if he actually played whilst in receipt of monies then yes the same consequence (correcting the historical record) should arise, but the sanction, the punishment should be minimal or nonexistent given the clubs’ subsequent payment of taxes due by their own violition.

It does raise an interesting point though. What if payments were made to a player AFTER he left a club? By that I mean that a player might be registered as being on a wage which he is paid throughout his time at the club. But then later, perhaps much later, he is paid lump sum directly or indirectly (eg pension scheme) which wasn’t registered while playing. Obviously this would raise the same trust issues which led to the side letters but it is not inconceivable that a player might be attracted to a club in this way.

Wouldn’t this then fall foul of thirdparty payments cos he’d be registered with another club?

Could full public disclosure of players contracts be the answer?

The disclosure is meant to be a requirement already Wobblers old bean, albeit not public disclosure. I don’t see what business it is of the public’s to view players’ remuneration details, what should be public is a sign-off by way of the footballing authorities (i.e. did club X comply with all relevant criteria? Again though this is a nightmare to service and fund)

Or the SPL and SFA could simply tighten their rules to state that all benefits of any kind whether repayable of not must be disclosed for every player upon registration and no provision for any other benefits or payments can be made without the express consent of the SPL/SFA following disclosure of the changes.

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TSFMPosted on4:42 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Blindsummit says:

August 3, 2012 at 14:09(Edit)

spanishcelt says:

August 3, 2012 at 12:12
I think we need to have a list of “issues” that require to be monitored and as we the fans and paying customers are satisfied with the explanation given we can remove them one by one from the list.
________________________________________________
I think this is a splendid idea. Not knowing much about WordPress, I’m wondering if the mods are able to add a tab alongside the “About” tab on the top menu bar, for an issues and questions log. There are just so many unanswered questions that it’s tough to keep track of them, and some could easily slip away.

_____________________________________________________________

It’s on my To Do list. Hopefully I’ll get something started over the weekend – along with a glossary 🙂

Examples: Whatever happened to the Nimmo report which was withheld from public gaze whilst the Independent Disciplinary Trubunal sat – although it turned out that THEY were never given sight of it. That is an absolutely stunning piece of sophistry which has gone unquestioned in the MSM.

There are other huge questions like that unanswered.

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jonnyodPosted on4:43 pm - Aug 3, 2012


It was heartening to hear the way Motherwell and D,Utd played against good opposition ,they sounded like very good games and the atmosphere at the Motherwell tie sounded very good on the radio .
It bodes well for the SPL season ahead as the boys that played in these games will have been given great confidence in their ability to compete in big games .

The size of their squads will be telling later in the season but if they can stay clear of major injuries ,there is no reason why they can’t have a really good season .If the team is playing well and vying for honours the fans will turn out (hibs div 1 )

May I wish all clubs all the best for the season ahead and I hope we all see some really good football games .

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johndoePosted on4:45 pm - Aug 3, 2012


test

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ChrisPosted on4:47 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:15

Chris says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:45

Chris, do we know if this is how it has been done previously or if there has been a new agreement put in place?
I cannot see Rangers giving TV rights to almost all games this season for that amount.
Included in this deal is 3 games at Ibrox.

This is how it is, there’s no new agreement that I’m aware of. I don’t think Rangers have much choice TBH, they’re associate members of the League and have to abide by the rules of the League as they are when they joined. Ultimately they’re not really Rangers’ rights to give – the rights are the property of the League I believe.

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BayviewGoldPosted on4:48 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Can any of the more legal minded or better memoried of the posters here clarify my understanding of the EBT/FTT etc.

As far as I understand the situation is (or should be )

EBTs The HMRC have already made the decision on the tax legality of these and declared them invalid and essentially delivered the verdict and punishment.

FTT : this is not the decision on the EBTs (which has already been made) but rather RFC appeal against that decision. So they may reverse the decision or uphold it, but the EBT has been made, we are simply waiting for the results of the appeal?

SPL investigation : This has little to do with EBTs/Tax directly, what the SPL are investigating is whether the players had dual and unreported contracts, the tax scenarios or legality behind these contracts is irrelevant so therefore the FTT decision has no bearing on the SPL investigation.

Is this the case?

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timmyPosted on4:48 pm - Aug 3, 2012


any chance of a forum?

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ChrisPosted on4:49 pm - Aug 3, 2012


FFS. Another blockquote fail. I might just go back to posting normally.

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smallteaserPosted on4:49 pm - Aug 3, 2012


jonny says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:43

jonny, you cannot do that on here. The same rules apply to all, if Celtic’s performances cannot be mentioned then neither can anyone else. The ground rules were set earlier today.

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jonnyodPosted on4:55 pm - Aug 3, 2012


bayviewgold says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:48
That is indeed the case

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Lord WobblyPosted on4:55 pm - Aug 3, 2012


testing the test test

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ChrisPosted on4:58 pm - Aug 3, 2012


bayviewgold says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:48

FTTT: You got it spot on. HMRC have said “you owe us this amount of tax in respect of the payments you made under that there EBT scheme” and the tribunal is Rangers’ chance to appeal the amount due and prove (note: the onus is on Rangers to prove they’re not liable as far as I’m aware)

SPL: are investigating whether the players playing for Rangers from 2001-2011 and in receipt of EBT’s have breached the rules on player registrations by not supplying the SFA and SPL with details of the schemes for each and every player on a player by player basis. I’m not sure whether there’s an investigation strand therein which considers the sporting advantage gained by diverting tax from HMRC to their players’ pockets, I think that would fall under the remit of “how severe should the sanction be when considering the player registration rule breach?”

There are two trains of thought with respect to the FTTT ruling having an influence on the SPL investiation:

1. It should have no effect.
2. It should be the governing factor.

I go for 2 because the SPL and SFA rules concern payments for any other reason other than expenses incurred. We’d need to consider what a payment is – in my mind it’s something that’s not intended to be paid back, i.e. it becomes the property of the receiver.

If the FTTT comes back and says “ok those EBT’s you dished out were discretionary and were indeed loans so you don’t owe us any tax for them” it’s difficult to see how the SPL could make a determination that they constituted payments and not loans.

Let’s face it, we’ve seen a lot of the evidence (ok a bit of it, not a lot) and the chances of the Ragners EBT scheme, replete with side letters and emails promising taax free monies and threatening not to pay amounts unless through the EBT scheme means they’re pretty much shafted.

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jonnyodPosted on4:58 pm - Aug 3, 2012


smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:49
My apoligies .
Are we ok to comment on the health of the game (domestic /europe ) in general but just not mention specific clubs .

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www.sportelive.comPosted on5:02 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Good

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nil sine laborePosted on5:05 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Just did the old TUPE thing and found that I was already registered.
Seems to me that the trolls (Juninho?) are out and the MSM are getting bolder at the thought that RTC has hung his boots up.
Listened to HK and GS on SSB the other night and even Mrs NLS shouted at the laptop that these guys just don’t get it, adding that they are acting as if nothing has changed.
SSB no more for me then plus having read the recent Jabba diatribe online, I won’t be clicking on that site either.
Keep watching them and, hey, just like in Hill St Blues, let’s be careful out there.

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ClashCityRockersPosted on5:12 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Merely a test post, sincere apologies. Moniker change from “ClashCityRockers” to “27sclash” due to setting up a gravatar account.

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TSFMPosted on5:14 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Have added a new page called The List (access from top level menu). Comments are allowed where people can add their own unresolved or forgotten issues. I will add them to the permanent body of the page as and when.

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slimshady61Posted on5:16 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Domaine Jessiaume says:
August 3, 2012 at 12:20

The Rangers Football Club Limited to float on the AIM market in October. Zeus getting advisers in now.
———————————–
That story is definitely made up.

No one is floating on anything in the present economic weather – it’s a force 12 gale out there and people are holding on to their money. Even Facebook bombed when it went on the Nasdaq not so long ago, so what chance Sevco? I am aware of two excellent unquoted companies who were looking to do so in the last 12 weeks and both were told unequivocally to leave off for about 18 months.

Zeus may be getting advisers in now but all they will do is rack up, along with Zeus, a quarter of a million in fees and then say “Actually Charles, there’s not much appetite for any flotations just now, never mind the AIM market, never mind a 3 month old football club with an uncertain future and virtually no income. Why don’t you come back to us in four years’ time when you’re back in the SPL and about to qualify for the CL group stages?”

A fool and his money are easily parted.

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NeutralAxisPosted on5:16 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Post fail test. 🙂

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DennyPosted on5:27 pm - Aug 3, 2012


I can’t stand it any more! says:
August 3, 2012 at 17:16

Hi, I believe this is Phil Mac Giolla Bhain’s latest blog post, reporduced on CQN.

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DennyPosted on5:28 pm - Aug 3, 2012


or “reproduced” even…

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ExiledCeltPosted on5:28 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Domaine Jessiaume says:

August 3, 2012 at 16:33

smallteaser says:
August 3, 2012 at 15:01
5 0 Rate This
Domaine Jessiaume says:
August 3, 2012 at 12:20

English FA paying £500,000 to SFA in relation to the Steve Davis transfer. SFA will deduct £196,000 in respect of fines and pass the balance to Charles Green.
=======================================================
Where is this from, cannot find it anywhere else?
======================================

Same source as before on RTC.

(So far as I know it has not been reported anywhere, but I am not an avid reader of Scottish football journalism, to be honest.)

*********************************

The Southampton money again!!!!

Let’s remember my prior posts.

Rangers claimed they got 850K.
Southampton said no – nominal amount
Rangers next day said 750K
Southampton again denied they paid anything more than a nominal amount

Now its 500K….

Josef Goebbels mantra – if you tell a lie often enough, it will become the truth – is alive here as much as it was on RTC. SOme things never change.

Gents – try to question things – if it does not make sense its because it is a piece of nonsense.

Southampton paid a nominal amount – FACT
It was paid so they could get Davis to concentrate on Southamptons first games as they need to get off to a flyer.

A nominal amount in football nowadays is not 850K, nor 750K and not 500K!

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ExiledCeltPosted on5:30 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Oh – and the source of the Southampton money was a “Record Sports Understands” exclusive…………

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jonnyodPosted on5:37 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Now that a certain club no longer exists in the SPL ,is there any chance that the remaining clubs can get together and agree a RULEBOOK before their spawn returns to break every one of them .
No more grey areas ,black and white please .

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Lord WobblyPosted on5:38 pm - Aug 3, 2012


test

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MikecPosted on5:38 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Official announcement that the licence has been transferred to The Rangers Football Club Ltd

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TSFMPosted on5:44 pm - Aug 3, 2012


BBC Sportsound‏@bbcsportsound
Also on Sportsound: Billy Dodds explains what happened when Rangers gave him a payment using an EBT
_____________________________________________________________________

He’s had enough time to think of something. 1810 this evening.

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61patrickPosted on5:46 pm - Aug 3, 2012


ExiledCelt says:
As ye old Judge Judy says “IF IT DOES NOT MAKE SENSE IT IS PROBABLY NOT TRUE”

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eddie ricePosted on5:47 pm - Aug 3, 2012


test

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Charlie BrownPosted on5:49 pm - Aug 3, 2012


It will be interesting if anybody is able to compare and contrast the 3 comments Billy Dodds has made or written about his Ibrox EBT payments after he says whatever he’s going to say tonite?

Funny that i wrote the other day that one of the unresolved issues or examples was Billy Dodds lying on BBC Sportsound – I wonder if he’s been prompted by anyone to give out a further explanation?

maybe Billy would be better just saying Minty said I could get my £XX grand payment tax free and that is was all kosher and above board – they were the experts & millionaire businessmen so i assumed that they knew – I was duped! 🙂

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Lord WobblyPosted on5:50 pm - Aug 3, 2012


TSFM says:
August 3, 2012 at 17:12
1 0 Rate This
lordwobbly says:
August 3, 2012 at 16:55(Edit)
testing the test test
______________________________________________
Very Greek? The Gravatar I mean
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
It’s not Greek. It’s prog…..from Reading/Manchester! It’s one of my favourite albums. Definitely not mainstream. 😀

I seem to have had a bit of a wordpress moment…confusing set of messages and password requests…with the result that I have been demoted to a lower case and spaceless ‘lordwobbly’ rather than Lord Wobbly. Still, at least I didn’t change my name from Sevco Scotland Ltd, eh readers? Because that would make me a completely separate lordwobbly 😀

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TMWTLPosted on5:53 pm - Aug 3, 2012


SFA confirm they are a corrupt organisation by giving SevCo a licence

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Michael BPosted on6:00 pm - Aug 3, 2012


slimshady61 says:
August 3, 2012 at 17:16
3 0 Rate This
Domaine Jessiaume says:
August 3, 2012 at 12:20

The Rangers Football Club Limited to float on the AIM market in October. Zeus getting advisers in now.
———————————–
That story is definitely made up.

No one is floating on anything in the present economic weather – it’s a force 12 gale out there and people are holding on to their money. Even Facebook bombed when it went on the Nasdaq not so long ago, so what chance Sevco? I am aware of two excellent unquoted companies who were looking to do so in the last 12 weeks and both were told unequivocally to leave off for about 18 months.

Zeus may be getting advisers in now but all they will do is rack up, along with Zeus, a quarter of a million in fees and then say “Actually Charles, there’s not much appetite for any flotations just now, never mind the AIM market, never mind a 3 month old football club with an uncertain future and virtually no income. Why don’t you come back to us in four years’ time when you’re back in the SPL and about to qualify for the CL group stages?”

A fool and his money are easily parted.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Apologies Slim, i wholly respect your input from a business point of view and your position is correct.

But What if…

After a few wins and looking to storm ahead, Charles Green goes to the supporters along the lines of,’ Look, I have stabilised things, put YOUR money into the club and help me, just like the Celtic support did. After all, no difficulty pulling the wool over their eyes

The difference will be that the investment will go first to satisfy the consortium’s investment, not to provide new funds to the club, I guess that only after the ‘Loans’ have been satisfied and adequate return given will any monies flow to the club.

The fans will Lap it up, but be fleeced.

Contrast this with Fergus.

1. Fergus invested his £5 Million to clear the bank debt,
2. Fergus paid the old board circa £750K for their shares
3. Fergus sold his first tranche of the shares in the club with the full understanding that this money would be channelled directly to the club, not to Fergus. He was gifting the proceeds from these shares to the club.
4. That offer was over-subscribed, so Fergus released some of his retained shares to dilute his shareholding, that money rightly went to Fergus as he had not previously stated that it would go to the club.
5. After 5 years, Fergus walked away after divesting himself of the majority holding, just like he said he would. ( he delivered everything that Firstgreen Ltd had stated he would long before he wrested control of the club)

OR maybe I am wrong, maybe Charlie and co will follow this model, I won’t hold my breath!!

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Lord WobblyPosted on6:02 pm - Aug 3, 2012


Re Rab’s RTC team, that was then and this is now.

We have a new squad of players. Some old some new *. You all have a chance to show what you can do, so go on and express yourselves. If we create chances, then the goals will shirley come. But above all, enjoy it! 😀

* New players – don’t be surprised if the old guys give you a boot up the backside from time to time
Old players – don’t be surprised if the new players run rings around you.

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nowoldandgrumpyPosted on6:03 pm - Aug 3, 2012


SPL Press Release ~ Share transfer approved
At eight minutes past ten this morning, the member clubs unanimously approved the transfer of Rangers’ SPL share to Dundee Football Club.

Dundee FC is now a member of the SPL.
——————-

If the decision was at 10 this morning, why did it take so long to release this news?

Perhaps Green was still negotiating.

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