As most of you will be aware, the Guardian recently agreed to and accepted payment from CQN for an advertisement which was intended to raise awareness of the Resolution 12 issue, an issue pursued determinedly by Celtic shareholders for the last three years. Subsequently, and citing the thinnest of excuses, they decided not to run the ad. This developed hard on the heels of the Herald actually soliciting the business from the advertisers for their own paper, and then without even seeing the copy, refusing to move forward. (See CQN story here)
A troubling aspect of GuardianGate is that CQN were lied to. They were initially advised that the ad was to be removed after editorial scrutiny. Subsequently they were advised that the decision came from an intervention by senior officials.
We are now focused on a media conspiracy to impose censorship in favour of a multi-million pound industry – to the detriment of its small investors and paying customers.
So which was true – and which was the lie?
Here’s a thing about the truth; it is seldom complicated, which is why the failure by the Guardian and the Herald to deliver a straightforward answer implies that there may be more to this nonsense than any of us first imagined.
At this point, it is worth noting that the Guardian is currently running an ad campaign by Toyota, a company who have admitted lying to environmental regulatory bodies for years about emissions from their cars (the Guardian professes to be a major campaigner on environmental issues), but won’t accept a paying ad that asks some polite and important questions about the conduct of a multi-million pound industry.
The denial of the Res 12 guys’ right to ask questions (no accusations – just bloody questions) via the once assumed to be pluralist and free press, should be ringing alarm bells all over the country, and the substantive issue has become largely irrelevant as a consequence. We are now focused on a media conspiracy to impose censorship in favour of a multi-million pound industry – to the detriment of its small investors and paying customers.
Two so-called quality newspapers, have mysteriously, after touting for advertising business, refused that very same business, and have given no good reason for doing so. If the Guardian refuse to accept an ad, I don’t believe that is censorship in itself, but when the dwindling number of newspaper proprietors in this country conspire to arrange an effective blackout of ideas, that is quite clearly censorship.
And for something so relatively inconsequential as football, I can only assume that we have all stumbled on to something far more serious.
Given the recent media rhetoric about Russia Today and their forthright coverage of Chilcot and Tory Election Fraud, it seems that like so many of the players in this saga, the irony circuit in the collective press brain is now as devolved as a human tail.
There are dark forces at work in our country, and they are running riot with basic freedoms. However it is important to put the football issue into the proper perspective; if the media can go to these corrupt lengths for a game of football, what will they do to protect the capital interests of arms manufacturers, food producers and media dictatorships?
They may have lost the war, but through fix after fix at the SFA and the SPL, in the press and in the media, the authorities are winning the peace – basically by denying that any peace is possible until we all accept the notion that black is white, right is left, and wrong is right
Migrant fruit-pickers
© Scotsman
Back in soccer La-La-Land’s Mount Florida Fruit Factory, the football authorities most definitely lost the recent war. RFC went out of business and failed the fundamental task of any football club – to sustain itself. In allowing that to happen on their watch, the authorities failed in their most fundamental role – to keep RFC alive.
However through fix after fix, at the SFA and the SPL, in the press and in the media, they are winning the peace – basically by denying that any peace is possible until we all accept the notion that black is white, right is left, and wrong is right.
And still, even in this atmosphere, the major shareholders at all of our clubs sit and do nothing. Are they part of the problem, an integral part of the conspiracy? Or are they scared witless of the forces that may line up against them if they dare to grow a pair, like the Resolution 12 guys?
Sporting integrity has taken a back seat recently. Season ticket sales are up all over the place; Celtic provided a marquee manager; the red tops are ablaze about the ‘return’ of the Rangers; Hearts and Aberdeen are newly emerged from financial difficulty, and now enjoy the realistic prospect of new eras of success; and another competitive and exciting year beckons in the Championship.
In normal circumstances this would be fantastic news. But all of it is based on a Lie – the Lie that the game is run according to the rules, and for the benefit of all clubs. When the euphoria at Parkhead dies down; when TRFC are reinstalled (actually it will need to be with a shoehorn, but it will be done) as part of the old duopoly that sees the vital contribution made by the likes of Hearts and Aberdeen and others as insignificant; when the next major ‘bending’ of the regulations becomes necessary; all we will be left with is that Big Lie.
The clubs will eventually have to deal with that – and the complicit roles they played in ramming it down each and every one of our throats.
I hope we make them pay.
Another thing about the truth though is this;
Everyone with skin in this game, with the exception of the mentally deficient, know exactly what the truth is;
- RFC cheated;
- RFC evaded, avoided, and deliberately withheld payment of tax;
- RFC failed to register players properly over (at least) a decade;
- RFC lied to the SFA, the SPL and LNS;
- Whilst all the above was happening, RFC won over a dozen on-field prizes;
- The SFA rewrote the terms of LNS to better tailor their preferred outcome;
- RFC were punished by way of a £250k fine. No other penalties were suffered by RFC;
- RFC entered liquidation and a new club, which co-existed with RFC, began playing in competition BEFORE RFC’s SFA/SPL membership lapsed;
- That club (TRFC for differentiation purposes) just achieved promotion to the Premiership;
As long as we keep reminding everyone of those truths, as long as we continue to give them a voice, they won’t go away.
And what if, next time, it is Hearts or Aberdeen or Celtic, who make a desperate attempt to get an edge over their rivals (an emergent TRFC perhaps)?
The irony (and I exclude the TRFC fans who frequent this site) is that TRFC, despite having the weight of the football and press establishments behind them, are being done no favours at all.
The increasing pariah status of their club is a sad but inevitable consequence of the wrong-doing by the old club, because the fans (understandably to be fair) seek to side with their own partisan interests in the face of outside hostility.
But think of this. If the initial-ism ‘RFC’ above was replaced by the name of any other club in the country, wouldn’t TRFC fans be complaining as loudly as the rest of us?
And what if, next time, it is Hearts or Aberdeen or Celtic, who make a desperate attempt to get an edge over their rivals (an emergent TRFC perhaps)?
What if they run roughshod over the same rules that were broken before but remain unfixed? What if, as a consequence, a compliant TRFC are denied an opportunity to play in Europe, or compete in a final, or win a league?
Will we then still be ‘Rangers haters’ if we protest about that or merely Hearts or Dons or Celtic haters?
This is not about revenge – it never has been – and no amount of wishful thinking will make it so. For most of us on SFM, there is no RFC to have our revenge on anyway, so the accusation makes no sense.
What we are about, what we are all about, is weeding out the clucken wort in Scotland’s football garden on level six at Hampden.
And it appears that some extraordinarily powerful individual or group, with enough muscle to bend the fourth estate to their will, wants to keep us all away from that garden..
Being the close season and having difficulty finding any footie people at their desks I decided to widen my knowledge on one of our country’s best loved knights of the realm. Very quickly I came upon this quote from the Herald –
Remove the word “overdrafts”(cos they can’t get one) and change the name and you are left with a quote that seems extremely current(no pun intended).
Looks like I might be doing a few of these today. It seems like a rich seam as Murray would say with his G M Mining hat on.
OH PLEEEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! “an unsolicited approach”? That zip up the back must be hidden by my thick luscious locks cos I’ve never seen it.
It must have been metaphysical!
I warned you.
A WHAT!!!
REIVERJUNE 17, 2016 at 12:01
I warned you.
A spokesman for Lloyds said the Murray Estates deal included an “anti-embarrassment clause” A WHAT!!!
———————————————————————————————————-
One of these Reiver
http://uk.practicallaw.com/5-380-9360?service=crossborder
Off (my) topic is this the Herald just catching up or is this genuinely news? I haven’t seen it anywhere else.
Corrupt officialJune 17, 2016 at 12:25
‘… One of these Reiver
http://uk.practicallaw.com/5-380-9360?service=crossborder‘
_____
What a weird and wonderful world is inhabited by ‘money men’, to be sure.I always rather naively thought if a guy buys shares, it’s usually to do with wanting to make money. And if he buys them cheap and sells them dear, he laughs all the way to the bank.
What manner of speculator buys shares, and agrees to give the seller some more dosh later on, if he makes a killing, in case the seller gets embarrassed at having hadto sell in a panic? Does it work the other way? If I buy your shares at x pence, but they drop to x-y pence, can I get some of my dosh back?
The more I learn of anything to do with ‘master-cheat’, the more contempt I have.
JOHN CLARKJUNE 17, 2016 at 13:39
Corrupt officialJune 17, 2016 at 12:25‘… One of these Reiverhttp://uk.practicallaw.com/5-380-9360?service=crossborder‘_____What a weird and wonderful world is inhabited by ‘money men’, to be sure
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To be fair John, it seems to function in a similar way, when a club receives a slice of the action, when his new club moves him on.
However in the Minty example, it does seem to be an ass-covering clause, that does indeed save them from a big riddy, (just by dint of its existence,) at selling so cheaply in the first place. In effect, Minty’s company, sold the assets to the Minty family. (Why would he want to sell on the good bits?) I wonder if he haggled over the asking price?.
It’s a soo’side thing……Keeping the good bits and leaving the sh*te with someone else.
Just a couple of random extracts from my reading material for you. I make no comment or judgement. The screenshot at the top should be at the bottom but I don’t know how to do that. It is a screenshot because the Daily Mail has removed from their archive. I wonder why?
This is about the Gillespie family who were fellow directors of SDM in his company GM Mining
REIVER
JUNE 17, 2016 at 11:37
…
from the Herald –
“One ex-bank insider said Lloyds simply wanted out of football clubs: “Rangers was just soaking up cash. You can’t build a football business on overdrafts and borrowing, but that is what Murray seemed to be doing.”
===================
Erm, to state the bleedin’ obvious, and mibbees contributes to why he is now an “ex-banker” ?
Murray ran up significant debts over a prolonged period: one Bampot, [sorry can’t remember who], reproduced the annual losses racked up over several years at RFC – i.e. it should have seemed obvious to a blind man that the RFC plc business model was “simply the worst” – and unsustainable.
But fair play to Murray in that particular wheeze: he was just being an opportunistic, unscrupulous businessman and succeeded to screw over a bank, big time. Which businessman wouldn’t turn down the cash flow HBOS was providing to keep their club / company alive ?
…although the tax payers did have to pick up the tab, ultimately.
[For the avoidance of doubt: this is not in any way admiration for Murray, but rather criticism of the banking sector.]
A name from the past. Mr Justice Peter Smith has been a very naughty boy
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jun/17/mr-justice-peter-smith-leave-bench-now
^^ Ernie and TayRed
http://ptfc.co.uk/news/2016-2017/june_2016/club_statement_about_fixture_list
The Board of Partick Thistle FC has expressed anger and frustration at the fixture list for season 2016/17 announced by the SPFL earlier today, which will put the Club and two other Premiership sides at a sporting and financial disadvantage in the forthcoming season.
In previous seasons where both Rangers and Celtic were in the Premiership, pre-split fixtures have been organised to ensure that every club plays three home games against the Old Firm. Without any notification from the SPFL to the contrary, we had expected that this practice would continue this season and that is the basis on which we and other clubs have budgeted.
However, this season we, Motherwell and Hamilton have been handed only two Old Firm games at home whilst Dundee, Inverness Caledonian Thistle and Hearts have four home games. That means an expected loss in revenues for the Club of £120,000 before a ball is even kicked, whilst other clubs will get an unexpected bonus of a similar figure.
Financial implications aside, we believe there is a significant sporting disadvantage created by the fixture list as it stands. Pre-split, we will make four trips away to the two biggest clubs in the country while some clubs will only make two. In the past, each club has made three trips.
It is also worth noting that, for the second time in three seasons, SPFL fixturing means that we will have no competitive match on the second weekend of the campaign.
Having had no communication from the SPFL explaining these changes prior to this morning’s announcement, Partick Thistle intends to seek compensation from the SPFL for all clubs concerned or that they reconsider the fixture list to ensure a level playing field for all.
** I know the idea that the “Old Firm” are needed is a controverial idea – all other things considered – but if their fans’ money is to be available it should be spread evenly and there is also a potential sporting disadvantage as well.
Partick Thistle very unhappy with the new fixture list. Seems to be a lack of transparency and consultation on the part of the SPFL.
Full statement here:
http://ptfc.co.uk/news/2016-2017/june_2016/club_statement_about_fixture_list
COINEANACHANTAIGHEJUNE 17, 2016 at 17:11
“…
Having had no communication from the SPFL explaining these changes prior to this morning’s announcement, Partick Thistle intends to seek compensation from the SPFL for all clubs concerned or that they reconsider the fixture list to ensure a level playing field for all.”
======================
Jeezo.
Weeks before a ball is kicked, the SPFL has already managed to p!ss of its member clubs and paying fans !
IIRC, the fixture list is produced by a computer algorithm [?] through an external/3rd party, which has to reflect several, restrictive variables in the scheduling – and presumably provided by the SPFL.
Sounds like the SPFL has cocked up yet again.
The possible blazers’ response to Partick Thistle ?
“The computer says no!”
I understand the unhappiness of Patrick, and yet at the same time I don’t. Part of the problem with Scottish football is the different treatment of the er.. ex-Old Firm. If we have to corrupt the fixture list just to ensure X or Y with respect to games against them then there is a problem. Short of certain policing issues I don’t believe they should be treated any differently.
The lack of information flowing from the SPFL to the teams on the other hand is more of a problem….
Have to say that with footballing geniuses like Warburton and McParland having the whole planet’s footballing talent out there to look at, you would have thought they could have come up with someone a bit more exciting than a soon to be 38 year old with an ever declining number of appearances over the last couple of seasons (20 & 15).
However I am left wondering if Clint Hill has had to be signed as a senior player/minder to keep Joey Barton in check on both the training ground and on match days? They certainly have the QPR connection.
Other than Kenny Miller I can’t see anyone else being up to such a job and certainly not current Captain Lee Wallace. Far too nice a bloke for that job.
IMHO everything that has occurred with regard to the Ibrox signing policy and targets since the Magic Hat went on holiday seems to go against his philosophy in developing talent, adding value and bringing in people who fit in with the ‘close knit, hard working, unselfish team mentality’ he has been talking about.
Fully expect Warbs to be back on duty as per his contract but have the feeling he won’t be a happy chappy this coming season.
If the ‘love in’ starts to tarnish we will have interesting times ahead.
tayredJune 17, 2016 at 17:31
‘…The lack of information flowing from the SPFL to the teams on the other hand is more of a problem….’
__________
Is it marginally better not to bullied or simply not to be told?
I suspect Thistle are peeing against the wind of the selfish unconcern of the majority of SPFL clubs, who have already shown that fundamental, structural, organised jiggery-pokery by their Board in allowing TRFC to continue to trade as if they were entitled to be regarded as RFC(IL) , and meekly accepted that their ‘Board’ could bully and harass them.
There must surely be intelligent men in these clubs who can see the damage that has been done to any notion that Football Administration has Sporting Integrity at its core. The open sore has to be treated, both as a matter of principle, and as a matter of restoring any kind of belief that the game is worth the candle.
WOTTPIJUNE 17, 2016 at 17:33 …
you would have thought they could have come up with someone a bit more exciting than a soon to be 38 year old with an ever declining number of appearances over the last couple of seasons (20 & 15)…
==================
Well he won’t exactly set the heather on fire ?
But, if he is on a strict, “pay as you play” only deal, then it could be a bit of useful/cheap experience to add to the squad ?
…of course sharing home gate receipts would pretty much render the whole argument moot. Might help level the playing field, give us a tighter league, more competition, every game needs two sides, etc, etc….?
lights the blue touch paper and retires a safe distance
Apart from the fact that we (Motherwell) are playing 4 away games against Celtic and The Rangers, we also have 2 games against Inverness on Wednesday nights (one home, one away), and another midweek game against Ross County (away) . Also Christmas Eve game is against Aberdeen (home). The fans? Who are they?
And whist I would like to think that the SPFL are going to start to treat all clubs the same, I think there is as much chance of that as of Motherwell winning the Champions League!
The root cause of Thistle’s complaint lies with the imbalance of fixtures created by the split.
If, as Thistle claim, all clubs previously had three home fixtures against the (ex) OF before the split, I expect that all clubs were comfortable with that arrangement.
In financial terms, it does make sense that the two largest revenue generating fixtures in terms of away fans and hospitality sales, for the smaller clubs, are distributed evenly.
It is not a huge issue for most clubs, but for those at the lower end of the league with a tight budget it could make a difference. For Partick, £120,000 represents around 4% of their annual turnover, and maybe a couple of half-decent players on £1,000 a week.
EASYJAMBOJUNE 17, 2016 at 18:15
Agree with you, but then the problem lies with the split. It might suggest that the split will become a vicious circle, miss out then you lose not just the end of season award for finishing further up the table, but also on the extra “blue-green” gate bonus that those in the top half get (massive assumption there is that TRFC will make the top half.
Plus if the concern was pure finance then the split should be done away with the ensure all clubs get 4 home fixtures. Imagine TRFC fail to get into the top half, would we then have to balance the books by making Celtic (and TRFC) play some clubs 3 times at home? That would be the logical end of ensuring we all get the equal share of the supposed riches.
TAYREDJUNE 17, 2016 at 09:04 21 9 Rate This
CLUSTER ONEJUNE 16, 2016 at 19:56
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Thanks for your reply.
————
I’ll await the press conference when the club announce they no longer support the idea of the Old Firm. I’ll not be holding my breath though.
The nearest they came was “We have a stand-alone strategy, a stand-alone financial plan and a robustness” Peter Lawwell
Not as good a statement to distance themeselves from the old firm tag as the celtic fans who In a £3000 advertisement in the Scottish Sunday Herald, Celtic fans have dismissed the ‘Old Firm’ moniker in a fittingly lengthy message on Burns night.
It looks like BBC, or Sky, or BT or the smsm,need another reminder that not only celtic fans but those of the other 40 clubs! don’t recognise the term old firm now and never will no matter how many times they say it. The Old Firm Derby is in fact a thing of the past… The Old Firm Derby is false advertisment
Re the league fixtures. We are now witnessing first hand, if it was ever in doubt that the SPFL along with the SFA have only 1 fixture that they care about. No other teams matter. Fans?, they now seem to be a necessary evil. I am afraid the diddy teams have only themselves to blame. They alone have allowed this state of affairs to come to pass. Passive silence was never going to work. Where now for the game in Scotland?
Am I alone in thinking that it’s not entirely outwith the bounds of possibility that some of the teams in the bottom half of the league, post-split, might have an additional home game against The Rangers? Unless, of course, their finances improve dramatically, their signing policy takes a turn for the better, or their other cheek, the SFA, up their game on their behalf.
Tayred @1801
“of course sharing home gate receipts”
I would go one step further and pool all the receipts and split evenly between all the clubs in the division.
There, that takes the heat off you.
Seriously though, it would need to be something as extreme as that if we were to have any chance of leveling the playing field.
To Partick Thistle,Motherwell and any other club crying foul at the moment. How come you found your voice now. Years of blatant cheating and corruption….silence…couple of fixtures not going your way……outrage. Sorry but what did you think was going to happen upon the return of the establishment team.
However, this season we, Motherwell and Hamilton have been handed only two Old Firm games at home whilst Dundee, Inverness Caledonian Thistle and Hearts have four home games. That means an expected loss in revenues for the Club of £120,000 before a ball is even kicked, whilst other clubs will get an unexpected bonus of a similar figure.
———————
What seems to have been forgotten is that the trfc fans have stated they will boycott all away grounds for punishment for (no laughing at the back) the clubs that voted to demote them to the bottom of scottish football.
Think of the money the clubs will save on stewards and police
Perhaps it’s just academic re: the fixture list and playing TRFC x number of times a season.
That is a good point above from CF that only now has a senior club found its voice – whilst keeping a low profile for the last 4+ years wrt RFC/TRFC.
But the newly promoted club will have a threadbare squad, will be needing further cash injections during next season just to keep the lights on…and their highly rated/highly talked up manager might not even be at Ibrox next season.
And we all know what will happen if TRFC starts the season in an unconvincing manner. The bears are not noted for their patience and understanding – and a bottom half league position is not wholly unrealistic for next season, IMO.
Motherwell have released this strongly worded statement –
Motherwell, along with Partick Thistle and Hamilton Academical, have two home ‘Old Firm’ games pre-split, whereas some of our closest rivals have four, something that has never happened in the history of the SPL / SPFL, as far as we know.
This has a serious financial impact on our club, and we cannot and will not accept it.
It creates a significant financial advantage for some clubs over others and in our view, just as important, compromises the integrity of the competition, both in terms of the potential/need for adjusting respective player budgets up or down and the amount of games teams have to play at what has historically been the most challenging venues.
In previous seasons since the split, there has always been parity where clubs had the same amount of home games against both Old Firm sides (almost always three) and were expected to travel to both Celtic Park and Ibrox the same amount as every other team in the division prior to the split.
There was no hint of this fundamental change until we received the fixtures at 8.02am today and, therefore, like the other clubs in our position, now find ourselves significantly worse off than we were on Thursday night and with insufficient time to make appropriate adjustments.
We expect this unacceptable position to be reversed immediately.
In addition, whilst having sympathy around the difficulty of selecting games for certain times of the year, Motherwell FC believes having two midweek matches away at both Inverness CT and Ross County (the Inverness trip being three days after Christmas) sends out the wrong message.
Where possible, consideration should be given, particularly around the festive period, to the needs of all supporters given we now have two fixtures that will be largely inaccessible for a significant portion of our fan base.
——————————–
I think they are trying the TRFC tactic here of not accepting the situation and expecting (not demanding to be fair) that the position is reversed. Of course that only works for one team, so good luck with that! I am glad they have also mentioned the midweek away games, thereby not restricting their complaint to purely a financial one.
wee_alphaJune 17, 2016 at 21:28
‘….Motherwell have released this strongly worded statement – ‘
___________
Genuinely? Can this be the beginnings of a wee fight-back,
Acceptance and acquiescence by the SPFL Board of deceitful behaviour by a new club masquerading as an old club leaves them without a shred of moral authority . What could they possibly do to any club which simply refused to be treqted in any way less preferably than both the old RFC and the new TRFC?
If Thistle and Motherwell mean what they say, the SPFL Board is in difficulties. Back down, change the fixtures or offer some compensatory measures, OR stand firm? Backing down would indicate to other clubs that the Board has lost belief in itself as exercising legitimate authority while standing firm would make them just look like the utterly unprincipled swine they were/are in accepting and promoting the Big Lie to favour one club.
JOHN CLARKJUNE 17, 2016 at 22:04
Genuinely? Can this be the beginnings of a wee fight-back,
——————————————————
JC – You beat me to it!
It’s never too late to hold your hands up and admit you were wrong so maybe we are about to see the worms turning and hopefully en masse to remove these charlatans from their lofty positions.
What are the odds of a disrepute charge for speaking out when only a short time ago the new club were allowed to spout what turned out to be a fabrication when things didn’t go their way?
Certainly is genuine, I can understand your initial skepticism
http://www.motherwellfc.co.uk/2016/06/17/club-statement-premiership-fixtures/
gerrybhoy67June 17, 2016 at 22:15
‘…What are the odds of a disrepute charge for speaking out ..’
____________
And that’s a case in point, gerrybhoy! Even the most zealous independent Compliance Officer would have to be reined in, because the inconsistencies would be so gross.
The system is broken.
We must encourage our clubs ( they have been misled, bullied, threatened, or misguided, or maybe a tad self-seeking and forgetful of Integrity, and probably a bit ashamed) to bend every decent and truthful effort to mend it.
They must look seriously at the Res 12 issue.
And they must, they really must, put an end once and for all to ‘project fantasy’, aka the Big Lie, alias the myth that TRFC are the same club as the one that is being currently represented in law by Court -appointed Liquidators.
The absurdity is there, as well as the deceit.
And both are a stain on the escutcheon of Scottish Football- and a bloody insult to our intelligence and sense of sportsmanship and the rightness of things.
Cluster OneJune 17, 2016 at 19:43
‘…What seems to have been forgotten is that the trfc fans have stated they will boycott all away grounds for punishment for (no laughing at the back) the clubs that voted to demote them to the bottom of scottish football.’
____________
One suspects that that is one threat that, like a DK promise to come up with zillions, will not be translated into action!
As a complete aside, does anyone know enough about advertising agencies and how they go about deciding what style and content of advertisement they might pitch to their clients?
Gardening Ally is now ( might have been for ages, for all I know, but I just saw him on screen the other night) fronting for Bet something or other.
Question: to what extent do the advertising agency calculate whether , in Scotland, they are reaching positively into Ally’s image, or, on the contrary, possibly alienating a section of their possible market? Or are they heedless of the ‘Scottish’ dimension, and relying solely on the exposure said Ally had on that phony sports quiz hosted by what was her name?
I think we should be told, in case Bet 365 is aiming a wee fly kick at some people!
but , fair dos, Ally performs better in the ad than he did as ‘manager’ of TRFC.
I appreciate where the clubs are coming from financially and indeed the fixture list might be a mess but this stinks to high heaven of relying on the blue pound.
Something we all hoped would have faded in the four year absence of the Ibrox club.
Go begging for that cash now and you will regret it in the future. IMHO.
Better to try gaining a few more hundred season ticket holders than go on bended knee to those who will screw you over as soon as your back is turned.
wottpiJune 18, 2016 at 00:16
‘…Better to try gaining a few more hundred season ticket holders than go on bended knee to those who will screw you over as soon as your back is turned.’
________
Correct.
The message to our clubs is :Look to your own supporter base, demonstrate that you believe in true,honest, competitive sport rather than Russian-style rigged set-ups , rigged not only by rotten clubs but by the very people charged with making sure that there is true and fair and honest competition. And with the support of your supporter base act to get rid of those whose actions have left Scottish Football in the distrustful, suspicious mood that it finds itself in.
Who ,at the end of the day,is going to be arsed spending money to watch a phony competition? Or trust anything( who said Lord C?) that a proven deceitful sports body has to say?
The truth has to be told. The unconscionable evil that has been inflicted on us all by the cheating of SDM ( and very bad cess to him) and the complicity in that cheating by those whose duty it was to detect and deal with that cheating, have to be publicly acknowledged. And corrected.
otherwise, there is no point in the existence of football clubs, whose very raison d’etre is sporting competition.
I am not sure how the Thistle and Motherwell complaints have come to be. If I have this correct, then the trouble has been brought about due to home and away inconsistencies brought about by the split. Is there some form of seeding for the split?
If so, are they arguing that Sevco are seeded, causing the problem, or arguing that Sevco are not seeded, causing the problem?
IMO As a new entrant to the league, Sevco have not earned a seeding.
Re the FIXture drama ,is it now a case where all the chairmen of the SPFL clubs are now letting us all know that there is no computer generated FIXture list .
Have they all seen (behind the scenes ) first hand that the peepil in charge of our game can manipulate any or all aspects of the game to cater for ANY individual club they want and now they are telling them publicly it’s their turn to have rules changed in THEIR favour .
I am afraid they may be onto plums as it looks like the SPFL have their new pet in their league and they will find out soon enough that they come first and the rest will just have to suck it up .
IMO it matters not a jot if the fixures have anything to do with a newly promoted club or not ,we the supporters have seen the lengths the cabal will go to corrupt our game that anything that is done in our game now is viewed with suspicion.
That I’m afraid is the legacy of lying ,bending ,breaking and making up of rules as they go along .
CORRUPT OFFICIALJUNE 18, 2016 at 06:27
I am not sure how the Thistle and Motherwell complaints have come to be. If I have this correct, then the trouble has been brought about due to home and away inconsistencies brought about by the split. Is there some form of seeding for the split? ]
If so, are they arguing that Sevco are seeded, causing the problem, or arguing that Sevco are not seeded, causing the problem? IMO As a new entrant to the league, Sevco have not earned a seeding.
========================
Don’t know if it’s true but I read on another forum that Doncaster has enthused about Rangers being able to unfurl their flag on the first day. I hope it’s not true.
FAN OF FOOTBALLJUNE 18, 2016 at 07:53
Re the FIXture drama ,is it now a case where all the chairmen of the SPFL clubs are now letting us all know that there is no computer generated FIXture list.
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Sorry to disappoint FoF, But I have found the patent for the computer generated FIX-ture device.
http://www.google.com/patents/US8001620
CORRUPT OFFICIAL
UTH
I heard the same also ,mate txtd me to say Doncaster had said it on sky news yesterday .
UTH, I have no idea either if Neil Doncaster made any comment about unfurling the championship flag or how enthused he was about this prospect. I’d need to actually see him say this in order to form my own opinion on it.
I think in previous seasons both Hearts and Dundee have raised their Championship flag on the opening game of the season. Seems like it’s a nice moment for the promoted team and their fans to celebrate last seasons achievements.
UTH & FoF
Ditto, but if you really want to spew your cornflakes, have a read of the SPFL site……I won’t post a link.
Apparently Scottish fitba has now become a “Global” phenomenon. (Complete with caption of on-field rammy) So phenomenal that the ink ran out in his pen, and he has been unable to sign any more TV contracts…..That’s sheer bad luck eh.
I must say that I agree with those that say that Partick and Motherwell have no right to complain as any fixture list should be devoid of any setting up to help ANY club. That is what the gist of this site’s purpose is, to have Scottish football run with fairness and integrity at a sport level no matter how it affects ANY club’s finances.
There is one situation where they would have the right to complain. If they were promised the fixture adjustments in return for something — say, not rocking the boat with regards to legitimising a phoenix club and the misdeeds of it’s past.
INCREDIBLEADAMSPARK
JUNE 18, 2016 at 09:05
I think in previous seasons both Hearts and Dundee have raised their Championship flag on the opening game of the season. Seems like it’s a nice moment for the promoted team and their fans to celebrate last seasons achievements.
=========================================
I totally agree, a club has gained promotion, probably the greatest thing any club can achieve whilst competing in the lower divisions. Though some may argue winning the countries top cup competition and gaining a place in European competition is the greater achievement. In any case, well worth celebrating.
Even more so if it’s the club’s first appearance in the top division of the league they compete in. Let the club and support enjoy their day and celebrate the achievement of winning the second tier of Scottish football, having narrowly missed out the previous season gaining a respectable third place. They spent enough doing it and deserve their day in the sun.
I have no idea where our board’s bravery came from , but would it not have been simpler for SPFL to produce a draft set of fixtures for the perusal of member clubs only, ask for their observations and suggestions , then publish an amended set which accommodates the club’s wishes as best they can ? I’m with Reiver in that I think there must have been threats/inducements used to keep the wee clubs tugging the forelock .
How unfortunate the that this is not the case the top 3 finishers in the spfl last year and sevco’s first few fixtures bear in mind that the top 3 are all trying to get in to europe.
Celtic, first last year play 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 9th.
Aberdeen, 2nd last year play 1st, 3rd, 4th and 9th.
Hearts, 3rd last year play 1st, 2nd, 7th and 9th.
sevco, promoted, play 5th, 8th, 10th and 11th.
Anyone else suspect the authorities have rigged it again, to give sevco the best possible chance of a good start?
Can I point out that part of the Thistle board’s complaint is that back in the day (some years ago) when there was previously both a Rangers and Celtic in the top league fixtures against them were divided so that there was an equal number of home fixtures against them for the smaller teams (pre-split) – either 2 v Rangers and 1 v Celtic or vice versa. To quote PTFC:
“Without any notification from the SPFL to the contrary, we had expected that this practice would continue this season and that is the basis on which we and other clubs have budgeted.”
In other words they budgeted and signed contracts in expectation of this. Perhaps you might argue they should have contacted the SPFL in advance but why should they expect things to change? The SPFL seemed to be able to manage a “fair” distribution of fixtures in the past, why not now? (I can’t remember, was Doncaster not in charge last time there was a Rangers in the top league?)
BTW some comments above about this smack of the same attitude that our football administrators have about wee teams.
SHUG
JUNE 18, 2016 at 10:28
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And with that good start more paying customers and a higher feelgood factor.
How could you possibly suggest such a thing.
That could of course backfire spectacularly, depending on just how good a team Mark Warburton can put together.
Exactly, HOMUNCULUS. Let the promoted team raise the championship flag, enjoy the moment, then get on with the football. Nothing to get too worked up about.
INCREDIBLEADAMSPARK
JUNE 18, 2016 at 10:43
===================================
Precisely, it’s a sad state of affairs if a football club can’t celebrate the greatest achievement in it’s history.
Morning all.
Don’t know if true but folk on Twitter claiming that TRFC have appointed a commercial manager and that man is none other than John “showusradeeds” Brown.Seems a strange appointment.I don’t know what experience,if any Mr Brown has and wonder,if this is indeed the case,how he’ll fare in the upcoming battle with Ashleys hand picked guys for control of Rangers Retail.
HOMUNCULUS, looks like we’re in total agreement on this. When a club wins a title, whatever division that may be, it’s nice to see fans celebrate this and cheer on the person chosen by that club to raise the flag. It can be quite an honour.
I know on occasion this has not always been the case and some have decided to enthusiastically boo this person. I don’t know why they would do that. Football fans can be a fickle bunch at times.
Shug,
I am bound to say that I did notice the apparent heavy imbalance in the opening fixtures for Celtic, Hearts and Aberdeen when compared to those TRFC. However there is nothing mathematically so very unusual or unexpected in that outcome – unless of course you start with the premise that it came about by design rather than chance.
My instinct is that the chips falling as they did would nudge some eyebrows at Parkhead, Gorgie and Pittodrie northward in inquiry. On closer scrutiny they have probably concluded that nothing suspicious has taken place. If not, I would expect further challenge.
Like Thistle and Motherwell, those clubs will not defer to the interests of TRFC if they are directly in conflict with their own.
The scandal of the past few years is based on the genuine (but mistaken) belief by clubs that their interests are in fact convergent with those of TRFC.
INCREDIBLEADAMSPARKJUNE 18, 2016 at 09:05
UTH, I have no idea either if Neil Doncaster made any comment about unfurling the championship flag or how enthused he was about this prospect. I’d need to actually see him say this in order to form my own opinion on it.
I think in previous seasons both Hearts and Dundee have raised their Championship flag on the opening game of the season. Seems like it’s a nice moment for the promoted team and their fans to celebrate last seasons achievements.
=====================
No issue at all with Rangers unfurling their divisional flag, but it simply should not be the flagship occasion for day one that the SPL have chosen to make it.
On a wider note we are entitled to know if the fixtures row has been brought about because the SPL have not ‘seeded’ Rangers as they have seeded every other promoted team in the past. My understanding is the way the seeding works is if the promoted team finishes in the top six they may have to go an away ground three times. Has gerrymandering taken place to ensure there is no chance of Rangers having to go to Celtic Park, Pittodrie or Tynecastle three times? That is of course assuming they do get a top six finish. We are entitled to know and let’s hope Motherwell and Partick don’t let it go.
COINEANACHANTAIGHEJUNE 18, 2016 at 10:40
“In other words they budgeted and signed contracts in expectation of this. Perhaps you might argue they should have contacted the SPFL in advance but why should they expect things to change? ”
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Because things have changed ! Rangers are deid, and Sevco have zero track record of a top 6 finish. It is about football, not how many bums are on seats. Have Partick Thistle considered the other side of the coin whereby Sevco don’t make it to the top six, and if PT also don’t reach it, they will meet again? What if they then went on to an additional game, to meet with Sevco in the play-offs?
Obviously the solution for PT and Motherwell is to aim for a top six slot…. No? Thereby getting more games v the other, and bigger gates at the top end.
I don’t consider that an unrealistic goal, and neither should the teams involved. There is not much in it, as shown by last season’s league finishes tween 6 & 10
I can’t see that it smacks of how bigger teams view the smaller clubs, but rather its how they see themselves.
6 Ross County 38 14 6 18 55 61 −6 48
7 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 38 14 10 14 54 48 +6 52
8 Dundee 38 11 15 12 53 57 −4 48
9 Partick Thistle 38 12 10 16 41 50 −9 46
10Hamilton Academical 38 11 10 17 42 63 −21 43
INCREDIBLEADAMSPARK
JUNE 18, 2016 at 11:25
==============================
Fickle is a very good way to describe football fans.
Though to be honest I would rather supporters of football teams were questioning the owners of the club and the board of directors and making their feelings known. Much better that than obsequiously doffing one’s cap and assuming one’s “betters” know what they are doing. That’s a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
I think owners and boards left to their own devices are more dangerous than fickle football fans expressing their honestly felt opinions. Even if I happen to disagree with those opinions.
Wonder how much the Croatians had to pay for this?
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jun/18/why-croatia-fans-disrupt-euro-2016-match-czech-republic
From the Panama Papers
Damn! I always thought Dumfries was such a quiet place too.
Business as usual down Sevco way:
From STV.
Accrington Stanley have refused permission for new Rangers signings Matt Crooks and Josh Windass to train until the Ibrox club agrees compensation for the pair.
Rangers signed pre-contract agreements with Windass and Crooks in January with both players committing to move to Ibrox in the summer.
Accrington’s owner has told STV: “Until the compensation package has been agreed they are our players” but Rangers say the English club has “failed to provide” necessary detail to allow agreement to be reached.
Clubs must pay training compensation for players under the age 23 who move cross-border, providing the players have been offered new deals on the same or better terms than their current contracts.
English fourth-tier club Stanley are unhappy that no compensation has been agreed six months after the players announced their intent and have now taken action.
“We’ve written to Rangers informing them of our position and have copied in the FA and the Scottish FA,” Holt told STV.
“Until the compensation package has been agreed they are our players, so they shouldn’t be allowed to train with Rangers.
“We have them contracted until June 30.”
A Rangers spokesperson told STV: “Rangers has always been willing to pay a compensation fee as determined by FIFA regulations.
“However, in order to confirm a figure Rangers needs Accrington Stanley to co-operate fully by providing some necessary detail.
“So far they have failed to provide this.”
Holt added that there had been contact from Rangers but that he remained unimpressed.
“They’ve got two great players for nothing so the least they can do is pay up properly and stop playing games,” Holt said.
“I believe they are up there in Glasgow. I have an email from Rangers requesting they train but I’m refusing permission until compensation is agreed.”
In January, Holt was vocal in his displeasure over losing two key players for only a small compensation figure, while manager John Coleman criticised the players’ moves, saying that they had “disrespected” fans when tweeting about their Rangers agreements.
BP of course there is nothing mathematically so very unusual or unexpected in that outcome I wasn’t saying there was just like I’m not saying it is impossible to get 5/5 home ties in one cup run improbable highly unlikely but not impossible.
Not much deference to the blue pound down Accrington way. According to their chairman:
HOMUNCULUS, we’re in agreement again and I doff my bunnet to you.
Corrupt officialJune 18, 2016 at 11:55
I have a lot of sympathy for the Croatian supporters, who had to turn vigilante and confront the interlopers in their midst, as the stewards showed no appetite for the task . It was co-ordinated football terrorism . The perpetrators must surely be in custody -they were easy to identify .
* meant clubs’ in previous post
I caught bbcsportsound at 2 today and the transfer concerning Mr Clint Hill was discussed. The panel was Mr Spiers, Mr Wilson and Mr Dodds they all were very positive about the signing of a 37 year old defender. Words and terms like inspirational, experienced, motivator and valuable addition to the defence were mentioned.
Now imagine any other manager in the SPL signed him and in particular if Brenden Rogers signed him would the above discussion be the same or would there be another angle to it that may not be so positive. No balance at all (I know all punters had an allegiance to oldco) but absolute no balance. Joey Barton also praised as expected. Also funny enough Accrington Stanley players not mentioned.
Motherwell (and others) dont rely on the blue pound – they rely on the green and white pound, the blue pound, the maroon pound, the red pound – basically any team that brings more than three or four hundred supporters. After season tickets are sold that’s where money is made throughout the season for most smaller clubs.
This season Motherwell have budgeted to finish 10th and have no cup runs. They would also have included in that budget for a total of 3 home games against Celtic and TRFC. What they and Thistle are saying is that if they had been told that there was a possibility that they would only have had 2 home games, they would have budgeted accordingly, and if it turned out they had an extra game then that would be a bonus. They would have accepted the outcome either way. Although they may have complained about it being harder to play at Celtic Park and Ibrox twice each, that’s something that the team can resolve on the day (hopefully).
For some teams, £120,000 is no doubt a drop in the ocean, but for many its the equivalent of 2 good players (or 3 average ones).
I did hear that TRFC were given Dundee Utd’s place in the fixture computer, and that’s why the fixtures came out as they did. If that’s true, then fine, but let the clubs know what may happen in that case. I suspect that the SPFL have no idea the constraints that many clubs run under, and so didn’t feel it necessary to inform anyone. Or of course it may have just been a fix.
Phils latest.
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/accrington-stanley-and-whatever-it-takes/#more-7652
A wee thought.
All this talk about the fixtures and only 2 home games against…
Does that mean Scottish football has been, for a number of years, fixed? Surely not!
Another wee thought.
There have been times when some clubs have found, at the split, that they have ended up with three away (or home) fixtures against one club. Has it ever worked out that one member of the Old Flim Flam (remember them?) ened up with lopsided fixtures, or even the possibility/fear that it might happen?
Interesting discussion on Twitter tonight wrt TRFC & the reason why there has been no general sale of Season Tickets.Seems that TRFC are having problems wrt guaranteeing they have the funding to see out next season & until they can do so they can’t sell their tickets.
I don’t know the legalities of why this is so but I’m sure some on here will advise.
FWIW this ties in with Phils info contained in his last post.His information is that there are serious financial problems at Ibrox.I obviously can’t confirm any of this as accurate.I’d like to know why tickets are not on sale & I assume if & when TRFC guarantee funding is in position then the folk on the “waiting list” currently being assembled by TRFC will get their ticket.Discussion also mentioned potential problems with selling tickets with credit card processing & with their credit broker(Zebra).
Like I say though,just a twitter natter.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958)June 18, 2016 at 22:49
)
‘……Seems that TRFC are having problems wrt guaranteeing they have the funding to see out next season ….’
____________
Who would be looking for the ‘guarantee’? The SFA?Or the SPFL? Or both?……..If the Twitter chatter is based on fact.Have any of the SMSM picked up on the chatter? ( can you hear my hollow laugh?
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958)June 18, 2016 at 22:49
‘……..their credit broker(Zebra)..’
_______________________
So I look up ‘Zebra’. And so add to my knowledge of the kind of Dickensian Del-boy world of money, money, money!
I look at at what Companies House has about ‘R. Raphael and Sons plc.’….Geez,in their Articles of Association there is no area of anything to do with making money that isn’t mentioned!
Go in and educate yourself a little, in how a 229-year-old private company becomes a plc and ends up making money by lending money to guys like TRFC supporters so that they can buy season tickets!
here is what wiki has to say:
“R. Raphael & Sons plc, trading as Raphaels Bank, is a small UK-based independent bank that provides prepaid and credit card services, personal savings products, consumer credit, and a multi-currency ATM network.[1][2] It was established in 1787 by Dutchman Raphael Raphael who moved to London at the start of the Napoleonic wars. The bank was owned by the Raphaels family until 1983 and has been owned by the Lenlyn Holdings plc since 2004.[3] In early 2016 plans became public, that PayPal will use Raphael Bank to offer Mobile Payment Services in Germany, by integrating into the Vodafone Wallet.”
I haven’t looked up Lenlyn Holdings plc yet.
The really terrible thing is that when I read that kind of stuff I think of cheats like SDM, and the minnows like CW and the horse lovers like CG, and the vultures and hyenas that circled around the dying flesh of said SDM’s cheating club, and their various dodgy successors.
Doesn’t make me a bad person, does it?
Just wondering how it works wrt Renewals & general sales differences.As a layman I’d have thought that both forms of ST sale would be governed by the same rules but apparently not.By the way,the guys having this discussion last night FWIW are in the group of posters that I’d define as “credible”.Not your usual twitter crazies.
Yeears ago,my wife worked with a company which supplied credit to Oldco fans for their Season Tickets.This was usually done on a 20 month repayment plan.If someone took the whole 20 months to pay the interest was horrendous.Couple that with the fact that a ticket is renewed every 12 months with the cost added to your existing bill from the season before then unsurprisingly,a lot of fans found themselves with large bills and unfortunately for some,a degree of financial difficulty.I know this to be true as my wife was responsible for processing these payments & dealing with any queries from the public.On a few occassions she was called to reception to be be greeted by an angry fan because for,whatever reason,his credit application had been denied.She actually got threatened a couple of times.When things got a bit tight financially down Ibrox way,SDM requested my wifes company to agree to finance every ticket application & he would underwite any defaults.He also took a 5% commission as the broker for the deal,Something I think CFC & other clubs also do.
I see TRFC still operate a Continuous Credit Card Scheme.This is something that most financial institutions agree that you should never sign up for.You basically give away control of your account to the other party,who can access your account & take payments whenever they like & as most are set up online,there’s no paperwork to fall back on.
JOHN CLARKJUNE 18, 2016 at 23:48
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958)June 18, 2016 at 22:49‘……Seems that TRFC are having problems wrt guaranteeing they have the funding to see out next season ….’____________Who would be looking for the ‘guarantee’? The SFA?Or the SPFL? Or both?……..If the Twitter chatter is based on fact.Have any of the SMSM picked up on the chatter? ( can you hear my hollow laugh? )
++++++++++++++++++++++
I doubt if this is anything to do with the SFA or SPFL (although it probably should be).
Perhaps some of the Directors are wary of taking payments in advance for a product that they know they may not be able to deliver? That could have consequences for them personally, if a liquidator felt there had been wrongful trading.
Or maybe Zebra want assurances. If you pay by credit or debit card these days, and the “goods” aren’t delivered, the cardholder is entitled to their money back. I’m guessing that 90% of Season tickets are paid for by credit or debit card these days, so whoever makes the repayments in the event of TRFC going bust and not delivering the full number of games could take a big hit.
The distinction between renewals and new business puzzles me.
I thought that Ibrox Season Tickets were sold by default on an automatic renewal basis- I guess that’s the Continuous Credit Card Scheme referred to by TORREJOHNBHOY(@JOHNBHOY1958) above. Maybe consumers haven’t the same protections under these schemes? So renewals have less protection than new business? That’s just my guesswork, though.
The cup final is starting to look like some sort of watershed for TRFC. Where’s the warchest? Where’s Warburton? The Level5 minions are sort of pretending he’s there, but if he is around, he must be invisible. Not paying Accrington Stanley some pitiful amount of compensation for a pair of Galacticos? A signing policy that is the exact opposite of Warburton’s stated policy? What’s going on?
Just a by the by..
Noticed that Brad Friedel and Phil Neville are tweeting about passing their UEFA Pro Licence.
Which reminded me that Mark Warburton was in the same group alongside Jimmy Floyd Hasselbaink – which kinda explains where Clint Hill came from.
…as you were.