Charles Green has declared war on the Scottish football authorities. His statement and that of Duff and Phelps today deserve detailed analysis, which is ongoing at McConville Towers as we speak, and will be concluded as soon as Stewart Regan, Neil Doncaster and Peter Lawwell tell me what to write.
For now, I wanted to speculate if Mr Green had managed to forget the terms of the SFA Rules, under which Rangers FC was censured for his comments some time ago. Mr Green could well have forgotten, as the censure took place as long as eleven days ago.
The relevant rules are as follows:
Rule 1: All member clubs shall:
(a) observe the principles of loyalty, integrity and sportsmanship in accordance with the rules of fair play;
(b) be subject to and comply with the Articles and any statutes, regulations, directives, codes, decisions and International Match Calendar promulgated by the Board, the Professional Game Board, the Non-Professional Game Board, the Judicial Panel Protocol, a Committee or sub-committee, FIFA, UEFA or the Court of Arbitration for Sport;
(c) recognise and submit to the jurisdiction of the Court of Arbitration for Sport as specified in the relevant provisions of the FIFA Statutes and the UEFA Statutes;
(d) respect of the Laws of the Game;
(e) refrain from engaging in any activity, practice or conduct which would constitute an offence under sections 1, 2 or 6 of the Bribery Act 2010; and
(f) behave towards the Scottish FA and other members with the utmost good faith.
Rule 2: Each member shall procure that its officials, its Team Officials and its players act in accordance with Rule 1.
Rule 66: No recognised football body, club, official, Team Official or other member of Team Staff, player, referee, or other person under the jurisdiction of the Scottish FA shall bring the game into disrepute.
Rule 71: A recognised football body, club, official, Team Official, other member of Team Staff, player or other person under the jurisdiction of the Scottish FA shall, at all times, act in the best interests of Association Football and shall not act in any manner which is improper.
Now let’s see where Mr Green might, through inadvertence, have sinned against those rules, accidentally of course. The following are extracted from his statement on the official Rangers FC website.
“Our lawyers have made that point repeatedly to the SPL in correspondence and yet our requests for an explanation from the SPL have been completely ignored. The SPL’s silence on these issues is deafening. The outcome of the SPL’s process will have no legal effect.
…
“Although the SPL goes to great lengths to emphasise the independence of its Commission, the Commission is not independent of the SPL. It has been appointed by the SPL. It follows SPL rules and its process is managed by SPL staff. I don’t question the impartiality of the individual panel members but whatever decision they reach is a decision of the SPL.
…
“Did the SPL launch an investigation? Did they appoint a Commission? Did they ask to see EBT correspondence? Did they ask any questions at all? No. They did absolutely nothing.
“What compounds the breathtaking hypocrisy of the SPL in this whole saga, is that the SFA, the SPL and us – as the new owners – took part in numerous discussions regarding the new company’s league status during which it was made clear that a deal was there to be done where ‘the EBT issue’ would be dealt with as part of a package of sanctions which would be implemented in return for membership of the SFA and a place in either the SPL or Division One.
“We do not accept that people who are willing to come to an agreement on such matters then have a right to instigate a full blown inquisition when matters do not unfold as they thought they would.
“In our view, it beggars belief that an authority which can be heavily involved in these discussions to the point that the Chief Executive Neil Doncaster repeatedly stated he was not interested in stripping titles from Rangers can lurch from that position to setting up its own Commission under the chairmanship of Lord Nimmo Smith.
“I must make it clear that we are not questioning for a moment the integrity of Lord Nimmo Smith and his colleagues but we believe the SPL have been hypocritical in their approach to this matter.
…
“Why is the SPL rushing to judgement now when it has been sitting on the matter for two years? Their haste is particularly difficult to understand when the tax tribunal judgement is imminent.
“The factual issues in both cases are identical. We have to ask why is the SPL so anxious to issue a judgement in this matter before the tax tribunal’s findings are made public.
…
“Nothing has changed as the judgement still has not been made public. Why is the SPL rushing ahead when in April the SFA felt it unwise to do so?
“Rangers was not the only club in Scotland to use EBTs yet nothing was done and little has been heard about it. Also, Rangers stands accused of achieving sporting advantage unfairly – yet there is little debate over the fact in all the years EBTs were in existence at Ibrox, the Club often failed to win either the league title, or the main cup competitions.
…
“The decision we have taken has not been taken lightly. There are powerful representatives from Clubs within the SPL – not all of them by any means – who appear hell bent on inflicting as much damage on Rangers as possible.
“It is lamentable that the Board and executive of the organisation have not been able to deal with this appropriately. We do not hold every SPL club in the same regard. Several clubs were placed in an invidious position and we believe their interests were not best served by those in more powerful positions.
“Furthermore, as a Club we are not satisfied that the issue of conflict of interest relating to advisers to the SPL has been satisfactorily dealt with.
“Once again I would thank our supporters for their patience and tolerance. They have been asked to take it on the chin time and again and we stand united in saying: No more.”
——————————————————
Have a read through these edited highlights once again…
The SPL’s silence on these issues is deafening … the Commission is not independent of the SPL … They (the SPL) did absolutely nothing … the breathtaking hypocrisy of the SPL in this whole saga … a full blown inquisition … it beggars belief that an authority which can be heavily involved in these discussions to the point that the Chief Executive Neil Doncaster repeatedly stated he was not interested in stripping titles from Rangers can lurch from that position … we believe the SPL have been hypocritical … There are powerful representatives from Clubs within the SPL – not all of them by any means – who appear hell bent on inflicting as much damage on Rangers as possible … It is lamentable that the Board and executive of the organisation have not been able to deal with this appropriately. We do not hold every SPL club in the same regard. Several clubs were placed in an invidious position and we believe their interests were not best served by those in more powerful positions … Once again I would thank our supporters for their patience and tolerance. They have been asked to take it on the chin time and again and we stand united in saying: No more.
——————————————————
Mr Green has issued a lengthy statement, as can be seen from the fact that what is shown above is only an extract from it. It is on the official Rangers website, and is stated to be by “Rangers Football Club”.
If this is not a declaration of war on the SPL and by extension the footballing authorities in Scotland, I don’t know what is.
I spoke to a friend who compared some of Mr Green’s recent statements to what has become known as “dog whistle politics”. There is little of the dog-whistle about this – instead it is a clear rallying cry to the loyal support of Rangers, which will, I am sure ensure that the turnstiles keep clicking at Ibrox for some time yet.
As of a few minutes ago the respective posts regarding the statement on two of the main Rangers FC fan sites showed a total of 867 posts and over 26,000 views. Not bad for a statement issued two hours ago!
I also suspect that the reaction there will be 100% positive.
Deciding that they are refusing to play and denouncing the process before the first hearing takes place is an interesting tactic. Now, if the Commission proceeds, in the absence of both oldco Rangers and newco Rangers and delivers a damning judgement, it will be ignored, it appears, by Mr Green and his company. And, if action is taken, then they propose to invoke the aid of the courts to stop disciplinary action happening.
What strikes me is that, once again, Mr Green is playing a masterful hand. He is a king of diversion. When the transfer of the SFA membership took place Mr Green said:-
“There remains, however, an outstanding issue with the SPL regarding EBTs. As we have proved in the last couple of months we will stand up to any challenges that face Rangers and will continue to fight for the Club’s best interests.”
What he has managed to do is to build the impression that the one penalty, above all others, which newco will not accept, being the most horrendous possible, is the stripping of titles. Not being barred for all time from, membership of the SPL; not being suspended for a longer period than the next three years; not the imposition of further financial penalties…
No, the one penalty to be fought against, above all others, is one which will cost newco not a penny, and will in fact generate more support from the fans.
As I said, it is brilliant!
He has challenged the football authorities to take action, as indeed he promised he would. So much gratitude for the three ruling bodies pledging to “facilitate” Rangers entry to SFL3!
And as far as his attack on some, but not all, SPL teams, one wonders why he felt constrained from telling us who they were. After all, Ibrox is the home of clarity, transparency and free speech!
However the extracts above indicate numerous ways in which the rules quoted at the top of this piece are broken. Will the SFA have the courage of its convictions to take action? Will the SFL take any steps itself?
Or has Mr Green stared them down, and, as long as the share flotation comes along in the near future, enraptured the fans into subscribing in their thousands?
As has been the case ever since RTC started, this piece could end with the line:- we have no idea what will happen next; we will have to wait and see!
Posted by Paul McConville
WOTTPI says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:16
CW says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:01
The ECA meeting was on 10 & 11 Sept. Green gave a BBC radio interview and mentioned he was there.
I for one do not know why. Of the 207 members only 135 turned up, so why he needed to be there when T’Rangers aren’t going to be anywhere Europe for years is anyones guess.
——————————————————————
WOTTPI,
Sorry, I was getting confused over the so called trip CG made to Switzerland a few months ago when everyone thought he was going to a FIFA/ UEFA meeting, but was in fact meeting up with someone else (Was it with Whyte ?) !
I didn’t even know about the meeting on 10/ 11 Sep, it seems to have slipped under the radar !
Are there any Official Minutes from it, or was CG only there to try and make some “Friendly” Contacts ?
You’re right, it all sounds a bit mysterious !
I would like to comment on the display of Stevie OOReilly tonight, the QotS 2nd goal was a mile offside, Kyle should never have been sent off, there should not have been that amount of injury time,…. but I can’t, your not allowed to discuss that on here.
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:26
Loyalbuddy, are you Chick Young??
.Essex beancounter says:
September 18, 2012 at 21
‘……how would they have accepted the story had it been reported by John Rafferty/Ian Archer/Cyril Horne, assuming the ediorial line would have allowed it?…or is that latter aspect the real underlying qustion?..’
—-
Eb, in the words of the philosopher, ‘quaerendo, respondis’.
Even those three, I think, would have seen their reports ‘spiked’ first by sub-editors , and then when they objected, by the Sports editor, and on further objection, by the nervous, weak, or entirely partisan, editor.
Each of them would then have resigned on the spot.(I knew John Rafferty personally, and I’m sure he would have done. Ian Archer was no ‘compromiser’ either. And Cyril Horne will now be looking down in scorn and contempt at the Jabbas and the Britneys and the Forsyths and the Keevins and the … .( I was about to say Tom Englishes ? Not sure yet about his journalistic integrity: since he writes for an Edinburgh paper, I might have thought he could have got right into the saga! )
And thank you for observing that I might have been misunderstood in my post re Alex Salmond.
smartie1947
You appear to b elogged in to WordPress so you’re ok. However you should retrieve your password at WordPress.com for future use.
blindsummit
First posts (you had a new id) always go into moderation. New regime doesn’t start until next week (Sun)
Danish Pastry says:
September 18, 2012 at 20:48
He also mentioned wanting to make a break with the past. I wonder if he was talking about what I thought he was talking about?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Charlie wants everyone to join him in a massive, collective memory loss and stop going on about those d@mn EBTs.
@smallteaser
Aye the ref looked out of his depth
Looked like an elbow from Kyle though
bill1903 says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:42
Apologies bil, my tongue is inserted well into my cheek.
Just for the record, QOS is a full time team, the only one in the 2nd division.
Moan the south!
smallteaser says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:34
Says who?
Goal looked offside but no multiple camera angles to review. T’Rangers fans may well feel hard done by.
Same with the Kyle sending off, seemed at bit tame from what I could see but would need another angle.
Anyway whats the problem, aren’t the diddy teams just told that these things all iron themsleves out by the end of the season?
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:26
Sorry commentators and posters this site is rapidly losing credibility with every partisan gloating post. It was never the purpose of this site to bait any team so please focus on the task at hand and not the result of one cup quarter final.
I’m sure you can find another club forum if you want to continue this mindless bleating.
———————————————————————————-
Point taken, loyalbuddy.
One question for you though. In your words/ opinion, just what is “the task at hand” ? I’d be really enlightened to know ?
One observation as well, Buddy is spelt Buddie in Paisley !
The TD’s just serve to prove my point and maybe a tear was understandably shed at a credible venture being usurped by partisan posts better suited to other forums.
Ask yourself if this post is for the betterment of scottish football or the beating of one club – if you fall into the second camp then please find another corner of the internet to hang around in as some of us are more interested in the bigger picture rather than the shock of a 3rd division club taking a 1st division club to penalties.
Green has a problem. On RM they are complaining about Ally and his abilities as a manager. Some want him to go.
There is no way Green would sack Ally before the share issue, too many Sevco fans would turn against him. However every poor result will lessen the Sevco fans enthusiasm to buy shares and affect attendances.
Catch 22 perhaps?
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:52
The TD’s just serve to prove my point and maybe a tear was understandably shed at a credible venture being usurped by partisan posts better suited to other forums.
Ask yourself if this post is for the betterment of scottish football or the beating of one club – if you fall into the second camp then please find another corner of the internet to hang around in as some of us are more interested in the bigger picture rather than the shock of a 3rd division club taking a 1st division club to penalties.
———————————————————————————————–
OK, I’ll try again.
In your words/ opinion, just what is “the task at hand” ? I’d be really enlightened to know ?
It’s your chance now to contribute and take the Blog forward into serious discussion towards the issues you clearly have concerns about !
Do you have anything concrete to say ?
We’re all ears ?
If results on the field continue like this the fundraising will need a ringfenced warchest before Sevco fans will stump up
the rangers are in the fourth tier and queen of the south the third tier just to avoid any confusion about each teams merits and standing in scottish football. By the way Charles Green club have never won anything, all their trophies were bought…..a bit like Sir David Murray’s!
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:52
Of course the third option is that some people may believe that this post is the best place to discuss if the betterment of Scottish Football will only be achieved if one club is not only beaten but done away with.
PS QoS are SFL 2nd Division.
The result this evening should not be an excuse for gloating.
A simple celebration that Scottish football has, so far, avoided the Armageddon should suffice.
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:52
The TD’s just serve to prove my point and maybe a tear was understandably shed at a credible venture being usurped by partisan posts better suited to other forums.
Ask yourself if this post is for the betterment of scottish football or the beating of one club – if you fall into the second camp then please find another corner of the internet to hang around in as some of us are more interested in the bigger picture rather than the shock of a 3rd division club taking a 1st division club to penalties.
———-
I agree with you. Gloating is not helpful. I had the P&B thread open and put a few football-related comments there. The most interesting thing for this blog seems to have been Green’s half-time interview. He comes out with some jaw-dropping stuff, even for a native of Yorkshire. Apart from that I was trying to figure out who was sitting in the Sevco Scotland director’s box. Green looked particularly anxious tonight.
Danish Pastry says:
September 19, 2012 at 00:23
Would be interested to hear what Green was saying as I only picked up at start of 2nd half.
Does anyone know if it is online?
A wee bit of light gloating is what football is all about? It would have been done if T’Rangers were in the SPL and this was the league cup, so why off limits tonight?
Away from any gloating Green’s bletherings and the team’s performance on the park are clearly cause for concern.
john clarke says:
September 18, 2012 at 00:54
midcalderan says:
September 18, 2012 at 00:01
‘..How could Salmon’s advisers’ allow him make such a gaff when HMRC’s Taxpayers Charter says:..’
——-
I suspect that Alex never even thought of asking for ‘advice’ on the question!
I don’t think for a minute that he is any kind of pro-Rangers secret conspirator, in league with Ogilvie, Green, CW, or the apron-wearing fraternity. ……………….
————————————-
Just catching up. I have always enjoyed and respected your posts and will continue to do so. I was not suggesting any form of collusion with any of the parties you have named.
My concern is that here was a company (or was it a club) systematically avoiding or evading tax over a ten year period and then, in its final death throes, set about failing in its day to day obligations to remit the taxes it had collected during the last 12 months of its life. How could such a company ever be considered by anyone, let alone the elected leader of our nation be said to be part of the fabric of the nation.
For a company and its directors to enjoy the benefits of operating and living in this nation, they must contribute towards the cost of running the nation. Only then may they be considered to be part of its fabric.
You may well be correct in saying his background led him to say what he said but all I can is; how do you know?
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:52
some of us are more interested in the bigger picture rather than the shock of a 3rd division club taking a 1st division club to penalties.
———————————————————————
Just twigged ! You are Chico, or some other form of MSM, aren’t you ?
If you are, read your comments again below :
“Ask yourself if this post is for the betterment of scottish football or the beating of one club – if you fall into the second camp then please find another corner of the internet to hang around in as some of us are more interested in the bigger picture rather than the shock of a 3rd division club taking a 1st division club to penalties.”
——————————————————————-
tell me, loyalbuddy, just what is “the bigger picture” ?
You definately have something worthwhile to contribute ! Don’t keep it to yourself !
loyalbuddy September 18, 2012 at 23:26
___________
You are right. This blog has become more like CelticQuickNews, with a constant stream of irrelevant Celtic-related waffle.
Insights into the current Rangers situation and the effect on the rest of Scottish football are few and far between.
Let me be clear here: I am a Celtic fanatic.
But if I want to talk about Celtic or even Sevco games, I go to Kerrydalestreet, CelticQuickNews, the Huddleboard or CelticMinded.
Leave the Sellik chat and inane anti-Rangers jabbering for those sites. Please.
Peter Lawell speaks at last.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/peter-lawwell-catches-whiff-of-paranoia-as-he-rejects-rangers-ebt-complaints-1-2534512
loyalbuddy says:
September 18, 2012 at 23:26
‘..Sorry commentators and posters this site is rapidly losing credibility with every partisan gloating post…’
—-
loyalbuddy, just stop and think for a moment.
People are on the blog because they are football supporters, in two senses of the words. They are supporters of particular teams, certainly.
But they are supporters also of the very idea of the beautiful game, with its wonderful requirement that there be individuals of talent and skills of high order , who are somehow ( mysteriously) blended into an efficient and effective team, which matches itself fairly under the rules against similarly composed teams.
Unfortunately, one particular football club seems not to have subscribed to that ideal of fair competition.
That in itself would have been a serious problem.
But much, much more serious, is the problem caused by the belief that that club was encouraged, aided and abetted by the Footballing Authorities to such an extent that, even though it DIED, it was regarded as still alive!
And thus the very idea of ‘fair play UNDER THE RULES was cynically dismissed.
There is no ‘partisan gloating’ on this blog.
There is, instead, a surge of quite legitimate satisfaction that the beneficiaries of the utterly contemptuous and truly despicable corruption of the SFA in according any kind of legitimacy to ‘The Rangers FC Ltd’ are not, in the event, capable of enjoying much footballing success, and have been humbled tonight, deprived of one source of revenue, and have presented serious problems to the charlatans whose only interest lies in making money out of the loyalty of genuine fans.
Well done, PL, for deconstructing the EBT issue and setting the facts out in simple terms for even the bewildered to comprehend.
Celtic’s 1 EBT:
SPL – Happy. No dual contract.
HMRC – Happy. Tax paid.
Rangers 70+ EBTs:
SPL – No happy. Dual contracts. Judicial enquiry.
HMRC – No happy. Tax not paid. FTTT decision awaited.
Johnboy says:
September 19, 2012 at 00:37
loyalbuddy September 18, 2012 at 23:26
___________
You are right. This blog has become more like CelticQuickNews, with a constant stream of irrelevant Celtic-related waffle.
Insights into the current Rangers situation and the effect on the rest of Scottish football are few and far between.
Let me be clear here: I am a Celtic fanatic.
But if I want to talk about Celtic or even Sevco games, I go to Kerrydalestreet, CelticQuickNews, the Huddleboard or CelticMinded.
Leave the Sellik chat and inane anti-Rangers jabbering for those sites. Please.
———————————————————————————————
Johnboy
I’m neither a Celtic nor (whatever the other team is called today!) supporter.
Tonight was really good for a neutral fan to witness, as much as it sticks in your throat !
I haven’t seen too much “Celtic-related waffle” tonight, quite the opposite in fact. Celtic fans in the whole have been very dignified tonight. I’ve probably been the most excited about QOS winning, and I’m neutral !
A lot of good questions have been asked re- CG’s half time interview for example.
So, Goodnight Johnboy, loyalbuddy is calling you.
(Boy, the smell of Trolls tonight is really affecting my Sinus’s !)
Will Sevco self-implode?
=====================
CG can’t get rid of McCoist:
– he has a share issue to sell (allegedly)
– he has to maintain the ‘siege mentality’ for unity
– he wouldn’t want to waste cash on a payoff for McCoist
But…
The bears become divided: those who blindly support McCoist against those who believe he should go.
Karma would be for the nastier elements of Sevco support to direct their invective at each other for a change.
Could get very interesting – even before the FTT result!
john clarke says:
September 19, 2012 at 00:42
——————
John
Magnificat rant!
Charles has come on air to explain the position after the Ramsden cup draw with QOS ,it was agreed that if the game ends in a draw even after the additional 30min ,penalties will be taken and the winner of said penalties will decide where the replay will be played ,due to some confusion QOS did not receive this memo in time before the kick off and the required signature either agreeing or disagreeing with this was not obtained ,under rule 124 part 6a of the Ramsden Cup which again was posted at 22.20 on the 18/9/12 QOS have been disqualified from the tournament ,Charles said they have his full sympathy but rules are rules ,one must always remember rules are continualy being updated and you should always ask your opponents has there been any rule changes since the last rule change ,they clearly failed to do this ,when it comes to knowing what the rules are we are ahead of the game .
loyalbuddy,
I was half expecting you to explain “The bigger picture” tonight, but can’t wait up now, as I have to get some sleep.
I was really looking forward to your words of wisdom as well !
Ah Well ! Tomorrows another day.
Goodnight all !
RM Poll as at current time ;
“Should Ally stay?”
Yes – 59%
No – 41%
Danish Pastry says:
September 18, 2012 at 20:18
It seems to have been lost.
+++++++++++++++
Last chance til the next one.
Did CG just ask for the draft of the 5 way agreement to be published?
While they are at it how would he feel about the final 5 way agreement he signed up to being published also?
I am sure not only the fans of T’Rangers but the wider audience of Scottish Football supporters would like a good look at that!
Not holding my breath!
Odds on the draft being ‘leaked’?
Attn Peter Lawwell.
Dear sir.
Firstly, i would like to offer my praise to yourself and your team who have guided Celtic through a difficult financial landscape and i thank you for your continued efforts to keep Celtic competitive at home and abroad, while maintaining a viable business plan.
My main point however is to seek to allay my fears that the outrageous rule breaking and rule invention by the football administrators will not impact on Celtics ability to grow as a club.
I have been an avid reader of RTC and now The Scottish Football Monitor since their inception and while i am a layperson, the outstanding contributors to both sites have led me on the path of truth and enlightenment. As such, i am fully aware of the situation regarding the tax cases, maladministration of the club, and the countless delays by the courts, police, soca, and football authorities to deal with the situation at RFC.
I understand Celtics wishes to remain silent on another clubs problems, especially given the social structure in Scotland and the bigotry that our club and fans face on a daily basis, culminating in Mr Neil Lennon’s life threatening intimidation.
I do feel that Celtic should comment when Ally McCoist dog whistles his angry hordes into a palpable frenzy by linking Celtic to a cover up in the SPL regarding Juninho and his valid registration. If McCoist is wrong, Celtic should have immediately stamped his obfuscation into the ground.
This is unprecedented times in Scotland , and it seems as though government interference is trying to save the very fabric of a bygone age of social exclusion. This must make Celtics ability to seek fairness and integrity in our game very difficult, but i do feel that the only winners will be Sevco fc and the handwringers who will do anything to have this brand new entity recognised as RFC, which they most certainly are not. Scottish football will suffer irrepairable damage if the punishment does not fit the seriousness of the crimes. The fans will disappear never to return, leaving Sevco to step into a dead mans shoes and dominate a nuclear landscape.
Please allay my fears that Celtic are not going to just let the authorities trample our Club, our game and our lives into the ground due to the establishment of this country, and their need for any team other than Celtic to be dominant, and the basis on which such a position grew from, to be allowed to continued in the supposedly enlightened times we now live.
Will Mr Salmond give up his fight for independance to appease the unionist vote. He has certainly lost my vote, as the Scottish Government has its grubby hands on these investigations.
I will post this email and any reply on TSFM unless you request that i keep your confidence.
Thank you and good luck.
Rab. Faithful through and through.
==========================================
I sent this email yesterday lunchtime, no reply yet. Peter has now spoken and i am content that he has spoken well and is playing a blinder in my opinion. I shall email tomorrow to say thanks, i suspect enough supporters contacted him recently to seek some reassurance, and he felt it was time to address some issues.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/sfl-division-two/ramsdens-cup-queen-of-the-south-heap-humiliation-on-rangers-with-shootout-win-1-2534569
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/charles-green-stands-by-comments-after-the-sfa-issue-charges-1-2534514
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/sfl-division-two/rangers-2-2-queen-of-the-south-qos-win-4-3-on-pens-1-2533271
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/spl/peter-lawwell-catches-whiff-of-paranoia-as-he-rejects-rangers-ebt-complaints-1-2534512
And, lest we forget, one from the recent past…
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/top-football-stories/ramsdens-cup-queen-of-the-south-clash-massive-for-rangers-says-ally-mccoist-1-2532302
http://www.heraldscotland.com/u/u/rangers-2-queen-of-the-south-2-queens-win-4-3-on-penalties.1348004416
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/mccoist-first-defeat-of-the-season-was-a-sore-one.1348007847
Hmmm….
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/opinion/spiers-on-sport-can-ally-mccoist-prevail-as-rangers-manager.1348005079
Quite…
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/football/happy-to-be-home-after-another-difficult-journey.18909481
Maybe another world record can be set next week against Motherwell – only team in the world to be dumped out of 6 cup tournaments in 14 months before the semi final stages…….
Anyone know the record? Must be surely on for a Guiness Book entry………
CL
Europa League
League Cup
Scottish Cup
Ramsdens Cup
No one else surely has a chance to beat that record……well done Swally!
Here’s another world record that is now owned bt T’Rangers that they are too shy to embrace – the number of shareholders in a company confirmed by the CEO of a company that were then denied that the party owned any shares
To date 2 – McColl and McCoist – another world record
Any chance McCoist or CG will be asked if he will keep his “4.5%” shareholding thsat he denies he has should CG replace him?
Astonishing – and for SEVCONIANS – terrifying comments re: paying down debt from CG. What debt? Last time he told us they were debt-free.
Is the floating charge thus still floating and is the ST money,and now share issue money, being raised to service it? Such questions will obviously never be asked by any journalist in Scotland!
Luckily the SFA persecuting that loyal Mr G means the SEVCONIANS won’t read the comment, nor pay it any heed – and will shell out their remaining shekels regardless.
SEVCO are doomed – the sad thing is that the SFA have colluded with conmen to fleece their fans. While I am no fan,and in truth have no real sympathy for the SEVCONIANS as I had for some of the original Rangers fans, I think the mask of credibility given to the club by the authorities has been a despicable betrayal of their obligations as governors of the game. Moreover, this collusion will give the SEVCONIANS a focus of blame when they do go bust as Charlie vanishes in a wave of recrimination and blame of the evil footballing authorities who drove him out.
I predict utter chaos – SEVCO will not see out the season and the SEVCONIANS will cause utter mayhem – the TV companies , because of the insane renegotiation of contracts to include SEVCO specifically as part of the deal will demand money back – clubs will fold.
A blinder by Donkey and Raygun.
Charlie and his dark forces will run off with whatever pennies the gullible have given. Scottish football will be on the brink of total collapse.
Part of me, if I am honest, would like to see it disintegrate entirely and be replaced by an entirely new authority – though I suspect without Celtic who will use the shambles, rightly, as a legitimate pretext to move to pastures new.
As regards the defeat of SEVCO by QoS – does it really matter?- the whole SEVCO exercise is a charade and a fraud- gloating or dissecting the on-field performances is in truth an utter irrelevance.
I think this is working – could not see how to get avatar though and my name has had to change
In truth the result last night has the biggest impact to CG and his plans to rid the Bears of some more dosh.
Marching through the leagues, beating everyone by double digit scores, winning trophies and becoming the team to fear once they got back to SPL with their newfound wealth and trophy haul is turning a bit into being trumpeted as the all seeing all conquering new force – only to become unstuck by lesser mortals – much like Mussolini’s invasion of Abyssinia (Ethiopia to you new pups).
We were, we are and always will be Rangers was the cry to arms.
Granted the old team had some hiccups in their day – away to Berwick – but these were blips on a successful march to become the “most successful team in the world”.
This team that pretends to be the same does not seem to have the same aura. Bit like me retelling a Billy Connolly joke – it just not the same me retelling it without his style.
So now the Bears sitting watching last night began to grumble. Some of them were grumbling at the goalkeeper Alexander at Annan which induced an angry exchange between the keeper and the fans.
No doubt the fact that we all noted that they went to T’Rangers purely for monetary aims is now beign used by the same fans against them.
The fact that Lee McCulloch – assuming his SPL contract was TUPE’d over and not renogiated to be lower – earns more in a week than whole SFL3 squads earn in a month, is also becoming an issue for the Bears.
In these circumstances, all the squabbles with SFA/SPL will never help CG get the fire stoked under the share issue delivery.
The Bears as noted here are very reluctant historically to invest in RFC when the team were at their peak – they assumed SDM would bail them out as the beoard did as well – AJ alluded to this.
So ever the most fanatical fan – having shelled out on for themselves and the family perhaps a ST, replica jersey and donations to RFF – will be asked to “invest” in a team that they can see is going nowhere fast unless the SFA/SFL/SPL step in to help them. They can also see that CG is as was stated yesterday not someone you would buy a motor from – they may love the GIRUY from CG but I doubt they will put him first before their families in an austere economy right before Xmas.
CG had a hard enough selling campaign ahead of him – the result last night just made it even more difficult if that is possible.
Can he ask Lord Cardigan to come and help be a mentor again? Can he fire the man he wanted to give a 25 year contract to? As well as 4.5% of the company?
CG today for once has some serious worries of his own………..and this is before BDO give him some more 🙂
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19640322
CG nealry had me in agreement
“I would ask the SFA and the SPL to release the first draft of the five-way agreement put together by their lawyers to reveal all of the sanctions. Stripping of titles was definitely within that document”
Why the first draft? I want the end draft released…………
Iam a bit concerned about Lawwell’s comment’s reported today about how Celtic gambled on a £7M loss in order to win the SPL title with the importance of Champions League and lucrative player sales to balance the books. Now this season the gamble has paid off as Celts were successful in Europe and Ki was sold but what if Helsinborgs had won or Ki got injured? Surely it’s this kind of financial speculate to accumulate policies that was typical of the Murray era at Ibrox where Scottish football went heavily into the red to try to compete? What if the gambles don’t pay off? This is deliberately creating instability, isn’t a good example of sustainability as it creates dependecies or necessitates certain outcomes? Auldheid often opines that such massive financial dependencies created/corrupted Rangers behaviour and also that of the football establishment. The origins of the Rangers Tax Case also stems from the spending arms race speculate to accumulate can easily spiral into.
We need proper financial rules, clubs shouldn’t be able to post huge losses or project big unfunded liabilities that require certain european or player trades to make the numbers work as these things cannot be guaranteed. It’s not only a risk for the clubs involved it also distorts the competitive environment. I also accept over the last decade my club Hearts in attempting to get closer to the Glasgow clubs have posted awful losses and overspends that have made the clubs balancesheet a basketcase and totally reliant on Romanov’s funding and debt forgiveness.
Celtic made a calculated gamble that paid off this time but regardless these policies are harmful, the winner takes all nature of the competition doesn’t help either though as it encourages or makes the thought of a successful gamble attractive, not all gambles are or will be succesful though so we have to collectively agree to restrict such potentially harmful practice imo.
Charles Green’s interview on the “stupidity of Scotland.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEh8jMLQMsk
Anyone know if Celtic/Dundee Utd/Hearts/Rapid Vienna/East Fife and Falkirk all have been paid yet by T’Rangers – and moreover was it by a cashiers cheque given that no oen is sure they have any banking facilities yet………….
I mentioned yesterday that the MSM would ensure the Cetlic PLC results were the only story in town.
I am delighted to be wrong and see a pattern happening here. Poor results on the pitch accelerating monumental events off the pitch.
From twitter
@ShaunGibson1888: The Rangers in deep trouble again http://t.co/GuR3EiEr via @ShaunGibson1888 – The word from contractors who work for Charles Green.
Word from inside Ibrox today is that they are £600,000 in Debt. This is Charles Greens new-company. Rules for brand new clubs are, you MUST stick to strict financial paths, and any debt incurred in 1st season as a brand new side can see you throw out. I wonder if the SFA will come in and help, as there is no way the SFL will help “The Rangers Football Club” get through its maiden season as a club.
I know several people who do contract work for TRFC and the word is 4 or 5 companies are due out £600,000 and lawyers letters have been sent out and court cases almost arranged. If true, and if “big if” the SPL hammer TRFC with EBT penalties, could see The Rangers thrown out of football in its 1st season of existence.
On the BBC website Clive lindsay describes The Rangers as being former SPL Champions 2 years ago! Hello !!!! This team are only 2 months old
So according to Chucky logic, a court can only prove it’s independence if it reaches a decision that you agree with? 😯
Does he actually believe any of this guff he comes away with, and could Swally’s ineptitude be endangering the Great Swindle, sorry Share Issue?
WOTTPI says:
September 19, 2012 at 00:31
… be interested to hear what Green was saying as I only picked up at start of 2nd half.
Does anyone know if it is online?
A wee bit of light gloating is what football is all about? It would have been done if T’Rangers were in the SPL and this was the league cup, so why off limit.
———–
WOTTI,
I just found the link but Doon the Slope has been good enough to post it above already. Bravo.
I don’t think gloating is off limits here, judging by the undisguised glee :). I have no time for Green’s version of the masquerade ball either. Old Rangers are deid, or very nearly so. As a football fan I was actually thrilled to see honest-to-goodness blood and guts commitment and no small show of skill from QOS. It was like watching good old-fashioned Scottish football for real men. And an improvement on some of the SPL matches I’ve struggled through. Strange as it may seem I was with the QOS. My interest in the Sevco Scotland aberration is purely academic now. I cannot see it as anything other than a huge scam, and if defeats such as the one last night help reveal those behind the bal masqué, then all the better.
Only problem I see with the gloating is that it could put off new posters or readers who may, at first glance, see the blog as nothing more than slightly blinkered and anti-anything-blue. It’s far better than that. Anyway, Sevco are not Rangers, so be careful not to legitimize the claims that they are by gloat 🙂 That said, I think one electronic banner last night did flash the words: “Rangers Then, Rangers Now”. Add to that, “I bought those trophies” and you’d almost have to give Charles 5 stars for effort, well, not those 5 stars, of course …
Charlie Brown says:
September 19, 2012 at 07:06
Iam a bit concerned about Lawwell’s comment’s reported today about how Celtic gambled on a £7M loss
————-
there is nothing wrong with a calculated gamble.
If Celtic had failed to make the champions league this season would they have gone bankrupt? No.
If the gamble had the effect of bankrupting the team it would have been a bad one to take, but in this case all that they stood to lose was a bit of money with the prospect of making a lot more. That is called good business sense.
The difference re: Rangers and their 10 years avoiding taxes is the liability and risk being created was enough to bankrupt the company. That is called bad business sense.
I remember years and years ago, Saints chairman Geoff Brown broke his own rules and went and borrowed 500,000 (a fortune for a club like Saints and still our largest ever transfer fee paid) to sign a young Dundee striker called Billy Dodds in a bid to try and avoid relegation. We failed by 1 single goal to avoid it. Dodds was promptly sold for more than we’d paid for him in the first place. Now, what if Dodds had got injured and we couldn’t have moved him on? Is that financial doping? No. Saints would have survived, just with a 500k hole in their finances which would probably have meant George O’Boyle, John O’Neil and Alan Main would never have been signed to help us back to the SPL…
…and Billy would never have gone on to become a Scottish international with Aberdeen and Dundee Utd before getting his EBT from Rangers.
Guys, I hate to be a party pooper, but I agree with Loyalbuddy & Johnbhoy’s views on the gloating. I also take John Clarke’s point, and I understand the effect of Karma and all that, but it really isn’t what we are about. There are a multitude of places where people can indulge if they are moved to do so, but let’s try to keep that to a minimum here.
Thanks
This panning out like the plot from Mel Brookes classic comedy The Producers with Green & McCoist in the staring roles. Chuckie however has forgot to sell the shares first before the show becomes a flop and he heads of Brazil wi the dosh
So the last 7 days have brought ‘Downfall’ high in sales,in third run of print,hidden behind the counter in Waterstones,and yet failing to be reviewed by any Scottish newspaper? How can this be?
Yet we have an article on EBTs by a Scottish journalist which is ,in my view, virtually unreadable.
We have a football team which has almost crippled our game by cheating, accommodated to the point of ridicule by our football administrators and who continue to implode on the field as well as off.
And we have a raft of enquiries and outcomes to keep us interested through the winter months.What intrigue.
One thing that is warm, exciting, tangible and all that is good today.
A Scottish football team in the European Cup!
Danish Pastry says:
September 19, 2012 at 08:27
Hear what you say with regard to the standard of the blog but I believe it will get back on track pretty quickly.
Last night’s result does however leave Mr Charles with a dilema. He has previously spoken in glowing terms of Mr McCoist, 25 year contract and all that. Mr McCoist on the other hand say’s he ‘Doesn’t do walking away’. However after a good number of years learning from the becardiganed master he is showing that, as I suspect of a number of Old Firm managers over the years including the sainted Walter, without the cash and large squad of half decent players at his disposal he is a failry ordinary manager/coach. As was pointed out he had six guys with international caps on the field last night. Sandaza was 3rd top scorer in the SPL last season on 14.
As has been said the drerssing room looks like it may have been lost. Big money players not putting in the effort, young guys trying but not getting the support and finding themselves in tough tackling battles with guys in the lower divisions out to prove a point.
Therefore what does Mr Green do?
Over the summer McCoist was the voice of the club and he was generally doing pretty well until the ‘name them’ issue. While that didn’t go down well with others it certainly got the T’Rangers fans behind him and added to his legendary status.
Sack the legend just as you commence a share issue or stick with it in the hope he can turn the ship around.?
For a club that still expects to win everything a few more away draws will be more than enough to see scarfs being tossed on the pitch etc and those share certificates will remain on the shelf.
Interesting times ahead and one which will affect the whole of Scottish Football if, as some have predicted, T’ Rangers are headng towards the toilet pan once again.
PS As I have raised it many times before did the 5-way agreement include a bond to cover the possibility of the new club not seeing the season out. Livingston had to pay £750k when they were in administration and demoted but I have heard nothing reported that T’ Rangers have been required to follow that precident.
Interesting wee item on the BBC news site today
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-19639956
Doon the slope says:
September 19, 2012 at 07:15
Thanks for the Green interview.
I keep banging on about it but at the time of the meeting last week the ECA had 201 members. membership was given to another six bringing that total to 207 mafde up of 103 ordinary and 104 associated members. However only 135 attended the meeting in Geneva.
http://www.ecaeurope.com/news/eca-calls-on-member-clubs-to-adhere-to-financial-fair-play-rules/
Given his public statement about 200 clubs Simple questions?
Was Green actually there?
If so was he paying attention?
How many of the 200 / 135 club reps did he talk to telling them of T’Rangers plight?
How many said who are you and what are you doing here?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01mw51z/Live_Football_Rangers_v_Queen_of_the_South/
Highlights of the game last night. CG part is around 57/ 58 mins.
Nowoldandgrumpy says:
September 19, 2012 at 07:35
5 2 Rate This
From twitter
@ShaunGibson1888: The Rangers in deep trouble again http://t.co/GuR3EiEr via @ShaunGibson1888 – The word from contractors who work for Charles Green.
————
Unsubstantiated but intriguing.
Although it could result in last night’s Ramsdens Cup experience being the Green deja vu of Whyte’s CL exit. Nah, can’t be, surely we’ve seen that before?
I don’t get the ‘had their chips’ reference to the cup defeat. Do Ramsdens also do fish suppers? Or is it a mixed metaphor? By combining pawnbrokers and fish&chip shops you could end up with a banana skin.
I’ll get my anorak.
🙂
I think Charlie Green deserves a bit of credit for what he said at the end of the interview about cleaning up Rangers reputation and driving out the undesirable element. I just hope he knows that would have halved last nights attendance – is that in his business plan cash flow forecasts?
Is the final of the Ramsden cup still at Hampden ?
Not wishing to gloat excessively over last nights result but one couldn’t resist this genius one liner shamelessly nicked from an Aberdeen site;
‘Rangers will be turning in their grave at that result’
After 18 months I feel compelled to make my first criticism of RTC
He indicated that he was bringing out a book on the RTC saga
But he didnt say a word about bringing out a book on the Sevco saga
Is that for Xmas 2013 ?
Just caught the comments from Mr Green on Alba on previous post and I must say I did lfind it refreshing his comments towards the end where he said that he would with the help of the fans like eradicate all this issue of the past and improve the image of the brand, recognising that there are issues with it. Tough one Chuck when you have websites dedicated to keeping the traditions of the Old Club in place, best of luck mate.
One other point, Chuck says ” I bought the Titles” . You and your predessessor SDM at the Old club have one major thing in common then ! Well said Chuck and making it clear what we outside of Ibrokes know!!!
bogsdollox says:
September 19, 2012 at 09:54
I think Charlie Green deserves a bit of credit for what he said at the end of the interview about cleaning up Rangers reputation and driving out the undesirable element.
———
I thought that too, initially. Then someone pointed out that he perhaps wants to ‘eradicate’ Rangers bad financial reputation. I’m still not sure what he meant there. But I tied it together with recent reports that the club had denied a request from one of the more vocal supporters groups for more space in the main stand. If he does, against all expectations, want to market the brand globally the inane singing and large choob element has to be sent packing. Maybe he heard Joe Jordan the other day call for life bans for offensive chanters? Bravo Joe say I.
Danish Pastry says:
September 19, 2012 at 09:52
I don’t get the ‘had their chips’ reference to the cup defeat. Do Ramsdens also do fish suppers? Or is it a mixed metaphor? By combining pawnbrokers and fish&chip shops you could end up with a banana skin.
==========================
Harry Ramsdens was Yorkshire’s finest fish and chip shop when I worked in Leeds 20 years ago. It became a national chain, branches in Blackpool etc, but I don’t know if they strayed across the border. So quite a good reference.
stevensanph says:
September 19, 2012 at 08:28
=========================================================
Steven,
UEFA Financial Fair Play rules require teams to break-even over a 3 year period and are non specific about the mechanics of how clubs achieve this just as long as they do – with the threatened sanction they will be ineligible for UEFA Competitions if they don’t.
Now clearly with the level of finances involved this is a good incentiviser for clubs to run themselves in a financial sound manner however it is only a deterrant and can by it’s nature only be applied after the fact. ie once the financial decisions and spending have occurred. It in no way prevents nor can it ever prevent clubs from making losing gambles ie speculations that don’t pay off – the UEFA remedy for this is then to impose a bar from competition ie a financial penalty which then probably makes a bad situation worse as it removes one of the possibilities for the overspending club to make good financially that overspend or unfunded liability.
Now of course teams should not be rewarded if they overspend and break the Financial Fair Play rules but with winner takes all nature of the Champions League money distribution there is little or nothing to prevent clubs from speculating/gambling on getting that reward and incurring losses and debts in the process – losses or debts which might or probably have distorted the domestic competition in the process.
As I said before you cannot look only at the risk to the individual club and it’s shareholders, employees and supporters – you should also consider the secondary effects of overspending ie what effect did it have on the other clubs?
Last season Celtic overspent by £7M which represents an overspend that is 90% of Hearts entire turnover – Rangers overspent (and stole from Taxpayers & Creditors) approx £15M to achieve 2nd place in the SPL by an amount which is greater than the combined turnover of Motherwell & Dundee Utd the clubs who finished 3rd & 4th. So between them Rangers & Celtic overspent by £22M an amount that was approx equal to the combined turnover of the 3rd, 4th & 5th clubs. The SPL prize money for 1st & 2nd place is only about £5.5M combined so essentially they were gambling to ensure they got a shot at the Champions League money, Rangers subsequent financial implosion meant that Motherwell got awarded the 2nd Champions League place however had Rangers been able to finance their massive overspend by debt instead of not paying taxes & creditors that would have been okay? There is nothing in the rules to prevent it.
In your example at the other end of the table St Johnstone gambled financially and sought to gain a footballing advantage by hopefully avoiding relegation and having some other club being relegated instead of them. Now one of the biggest complaints many of the SPL clubs have is the fear and finacial decimation being relegated causes with the gulf between SPL & SFL estimated at a minimum of approx £1.5M per season revenues. relegated clubs face lost income and job cuts as players and staff are forced to be let go to meet much reduced income levels. The St Johnstone example is as much an example of financial doping as Clubs using it to try to buy success only reversed to try to avoid pain at the the expense of others.
As far as I can see there is no justification for Rangers, Celtic, Hearts or any other SPL club to overspend or use debt to meet their annual financial obligations – debt for infrastructure project yes but simply to pay the bills or gain competitive advantage then no that cannot be right or sustainable?
The problem as I see it is the rules and the football authorities trust the clubs to decide how to run their financial affairs and to run them prudently which if the history of the last 25 years is any indicator is a naive assumption given the massive debt and financial failures that have been accumulated over the period. Calculated gambles or not – it’s not good business if it pays off or bad business if it doesn’t. That is wrong thinking but the rules don’t prevent it.
There are of course solutions but puts limitations on clubs ability to act as they please and makes them face tough choice many seem unwilling to embrace or talk about so i don’t see how we can move forward?