Harper Macleod and LNS

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Redlichtie says: November 15, 2014 at 12:27 am Cripes, what the heck …

Comment on Harper Macleod and LNS by ecobhoy.

redlichtie says:
November 15, 2014 at 12:27 am

Cripes, what the heck are we going to talk about when this all goes sub judice? 😆
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Ah but when is it sub-judice? Some would argue it’s from the time they are charged which apparently they were last night after arrest.

I tend to go with the line that it only becomes sub-judice after a first court appearance when those in custody are formally charged in public and asked how they plead.

Accused might not appear in open court but in private under petition and usually there is ‘no plea or declaration’ at the first hearing under solemn procedure where IIRC they become the ‘panel’. Reminds me of a doc’s sickie and some I have seen empanelled cerainly look like they need urgent medical assistance.

The information publicly released at that point by the procurator fiscal is very very limited if, indeed, any is actually given.

So it comes down to the accused’s lawyer as to whether he says anything or not. In a high-profile case involving accused who are of media interest a lawyer can get a nice wee advert on the back of his clients.

However where the clients have money and influence either the lawyer zips-it or the start of the PR campaign begins with some tailored info being released.

None of my comments should be taken to apply to any specific case but are merely a generalisation, probably out of date, of court procedures and those who pass through the Halls of Justice – blindfolds are always available just inside the door btw 😎

ecobhoy Also Commented

Harper Macleod and LNS
South0fThe Border says:
November 15, 2014 at 1:36 pm
ecobhoy says: November 15, 2014 at 11:02 am:

In the old days when newspapers used to have actual journalists and plenty of them it was common to use a reporter – who had not previously been involved in reporting on the alleged crimes – to report on the actual court proceedings.
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As long as they don’t use journalists from the sports department unfamiliar with court protocol. In Harry Redknapp’s tax evasion trial, a reporter not only named a potential juror undergoing the selection process (he had a name identical to a well-known footballer) but also reported on evidence given by a witness when the jury had been sent out!
http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/node/48623
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Back in the day football journos – except for a very few exceptions – were failed news reporters and would never be allowed anywhere near a court.

They also tended to have no shorthand and as they made-up stories out of thin air they tended to be something of a liability covering a court-room 😆

But at least they knew their limitations and kept well away. Now they are experts in law, finance, feudal tenure, geology, economics, insolvency, AIM regulation, complex business issues, overseas tax shelters, bus company operations, EC State Aid regulations and international extradition procedures. They still know nothing about football right enuff

Some things never change 😆


Harper Macleod and LNS
Bryce Curdy says:
November 15, 2014 at 1:43 pm

ecobhoy 1:17 pm

A question I have had in my head for some time, namely how can such a complex chain of events be unravelled?
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I have no idea whether what has recently unfolded forms part of a complex chain of events or something easily exposed and understood once the necessary evidence is assembled.

Hopefully we will have the answer to your question once the unravelling is completed.

I have learnt in life not to jump to final conclusions too hurriedly before most of the jigsaw is in place as that’s a sure recipe for making mistakes and often BIG surprises.


Harper Macleod and LNS
With the repeated ‘shocks’ being inflicted on McCoist the electrical wiring insulation at Ibrox must be deteriorating at warp speed.

Or perhaps the rusting steelwork isn’t providing a strong enough earthing bond to keep the manager ‘grounded’.


Recent Comments by ecobhoy

Did Stewart Regan Ken Then Wit We Ken Noo?
jimmci says:
April 24, 2015 at 1:50 pm

And why did we not get the panel’s reasoning together with the decision last night?
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Simples ❗ The Decision was the easy bit 😆 The explanation to sell it was the hard bit and despite a nightshift they appear to have fluffed their lines AGAIN 🙄


Did Stewart Regan Ken Then Wit We Ken Noo?
Allyjambo says:
April 24, 2015 at 2:18 pm

Might I suggest that SD’s main interest in this meeting was to put the RIFC board straight on some matters regarding the security over the IP and just how watertight it is, rather than to discuss funding or any ‘amicable’ discussion how best to move the club forward!
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You might be right but would SD want the club suffering another Insolvency Event? Perhaps they were asking for the second loan tranche of £5 million which the new board apparently rejected on taking control.

I have undernoted a reply I made to parttimearab last night which may have been missed but may also be relevant.

3. Insolvency events

(i) The inability of the Company to pay its debts as they fall due within the meaning of section 123 of the Insolvency Act 1986 (the “Act”);
(ii) The issue of an application for an administration order or a notice of intention to appoint an administrator in relation to the Company;
(iii) The passing of a resolution or order for the Company’s winding-up, dissolution, administration or reorganisation;
(iv) The declaration of a moratorium in relation to any of the Company’s indebtedness;
(v) The making of any arrangement or any proposal for any arrangement with any of the Company’s creditors; and
(vi) The appointment of a liquidator, receiver, administrator, supervisor or other similar officer in respect of any of the Company’s assets.

Now I haven’t a clue whether that has anything to do with the SPFL Rule Change. But it’s clear that there could be various stages in an Insolvency Event and perhaps the rule change is to cover all eventualities which might not have been previously defined in the Rule Book.

In particular I look at:

(vi) The appointment of a liquidator, receiver, administrator, supervisor or other similar officer in respect of any of the Company’s assets.

And I think of the various charges which have been placed on Rangers assets wrt the £5 million loan. I have previously posted that the contracts wrt a Default Event could see the assets pass to SportsDirect without any court hearing and SD also already has the power to appoint a Receiver to deal with any of the assets that pass to it via a loan default event.

Now that might not ultimately lead to a full-blown Insolvency depending on what SD actually decide to do with Rangers. But looking at the above I wonder whether with the SPFL rule change that just taking control of the assets is enough to be classed as an Insolvency Event under SPFL Rules?

Perhaps the SPFL are thinking ahead ?

But does the rule take effect immediately or from the new season?

It seems that if it is immediate and Rangers suffers an Insolvency Event then that would be an automatic 25 points this season and 15 next season. Assuming it is able to survive death a second time.


Did Stewart Regan Ken Then Wit We Ken Noo?
Resin_lab_dog says:
April 24, 2015 at 12:10 pm
ecobhoy says:
April 24, 2015 at 12:00 pm
blu says:
April 24, 2015 at 11:40 am
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From what I saw, all criticisms emanating from ICTFC was directed towards the SFA machinery and not towards CFC. Similarly, I have seen no evidence of any criticism of ICTFC being put forward by CFC. I see that fact as quite telling.

Celtic were quite entitled to make all the statements they made and had the boot been on the other foot, in the circumstances I am sure KC at ICTFC would have done likewise.

Similarly, had the situtaions been reversed w.r.t. the foul, I would have expected CFC to back their player robsutly in the same way that ICTFC did.

This is about governance of the sport, not internecine disagreements between member clubs – for which I am yet to see any cause advanced from either party.
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Couldn’t agree more!


Did Stewart Regan Ken Then Wit We Ken Noo?
blu says:
April 24, 2015 at 11:40 am

My view is that Celtic played this one wrong (only in the public nature of it)and it was easy for media outlets to infer cause and effect in the Celtic/Compliance Officer actions.
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There is some merit in your view IMO. However there’s a balancing act to be achieved which requires an answer to what the officials saw, didn’t see, or decided or didn’t decide on Sunday.

All I heard in the ground, leaving the ground, on the train, in the pub, was real anger and disbelief at the decision which worsened with the TV replays.

I do think Celtic fans were due an explanation and tbf to Celtic I doubt if they could have forseen what an absolute hash the SFA would make of it. Obviously the SMSM has ridden to the rescue of the SFA so what’s new about that?

But we’re still awaiting the answers requested. Will we get them? Not without keeping the pressure on the SFA on all fronts where Hampden’s dark secrets exist.


Did Stewart Regan Ken Then Wit We Ken Noo?
Gabby says:
April 24, 2015 at 10:18 am

If Celtic really, really felt they needed to send a letter, then this is the type of thing they should have sent…
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I disagree as the letter you suggest goes way beyond the immediate point which is simply: ‘Please explain how the decision was arrived at’. I say decision because when Celic sent the letter it seemed there had been no decision reached but that the incident had been ‘missed’ by all officials.

Once the SFA provide that info then Celtic can make a decision as to if and how it should proceed with the matter.

My credo in a situation like this is not to give any leeway to a slippery character or room for manoeuvre. Ask the straight simple question and take it from there once the basic position is established.

Never jump fences too soon and never ever jump fences you don’t need to especially if you don’t know what lies in wait on the other side.


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