John Clark Meets “The SFA”

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John Clark Meets “The SFA”

Regular posters and contributors to the SFM may remember that in October last year I wrote to Mr McRae, President of the SFA.

I posted the text of my letter on 28th October http://www.sfmonitor.org/whose-assets-are-they-anyway/?cid=20786

I had not received a reply or acknowledgement by 12th December, so I sent a reminder. I received a reply to that reminder, dated 16 December 2015, in which Mr McRae apologised for not having responded to my previous letter, and invited me to come and see him. We arranged that I should visit him at Hampden on 19 January 2016 at 2.00 p.m.

Following the meeting, I wrote a summary of the conversation. I emailed that summary to Mr Darryl Broadfoot, Head of Communications, asking him to check whether my recollections were accurate, because I was my intention to post the summary on SFM.

I have not had a reply and I think I have waited a fair enough time, so, here is the summary of an approximately 45 minute conversation.

I should first make it clear that Mr McRae said that he had no recollection of airing any of the views recorded in my letter as attributed to him. I should also say that I made it clear that while I contribute to SFM, I was not there as ‘officially representing’ SFM, although what I would say broadly reflected the view of many.


 

“Note of informal meeting between me, and Alan McRae, President of the SFA, with Darryl Broadfoot, Press Officer, at Hampden park, 2.00 pm Tuesday, 19th January.

Background: I had written to Mr McRae in October 2015, to ask whether Mr McRae had really (as had been reported to me) aired the following opinions:

  1. that Rangers FC were not Liquidated
  2. that Rangers FC were put down to the third Division
  3. that Rangers FC were bought by Charles Green and that the team currently playing out of Ibrox Stadium and calling itself The Rangers Football Club Ltd is one and the same as the club known as Rangers Football Club, which is currently in Liquidation.

Mr McRae, through Mr Broadfoot, went through the points one by one.

On point one, there was no difficulty in agreeing that RFC had been Liquidated. That was accepted as a matter of fact.

On point two, I argued that;

  • Mr Green’s new club had had to apply for league and SFA membership, and were therefore admitted as a new club to Scottish Football and allowed into SFL Third Division.
  • They had as an emergency measure been granted conditional membership, and had had to seek the Administrators’ and Football Authorities’ agreement to the use of certain RFC (IL) players who had decided to sign on with the new club in order to play their first game as a new club.
  • They were ‘put in ‘the Third Division as a new club, not as an existing club being relegated.

Mr McRae, through Mr Broadfoot, argued that ‘put in’ and ‘admitted to’ are pretty much the same thing, and that the legal advice obtained was that Mr Green’s new club was not a new club, and the Authorities were stuck with that.

I referred to the 5-way Agreement, and made the point that two entities other than league or SFA representatives were signatories to that agreement: RFC (IL) and Mr Green’s new club. The two could not be one.

Mr Broadfoot said that was a matter of opinion.

I said that it was rather a matter of fact.

Likewise, on the third point, there was disagreement.

Mr Broadfoot, for Mr McRae, argued that Charles Green bought the club (and Mr McRae personally added ‘and the “goodwill”’).

I pointed out that Mr Green had NOT bought the club out of Administration, as had happened with other clubs, but merely had bought the assets of a former club that was NOT able to bought out of administration and was consequently Liquidated.

Mr Broadfoot said that Celtic and Rangers supporters might continue to disagree but that could only be expected.

I pointed out that this was not at all a Celtic-Rangers supporters’ issue, and that the Scottish Football Monitor, for instance, represented the views of supporters of many clubs. I further made the point that many sports administrative bodies had come under the spotlight in current times and people were naturally concerned that the governance of football should be above suspicion: and that substantial numbers feel that the Football Authorities have been at fault, in permitting a new club to claim to be an old club and pretend to the honours and titles etc etc.

Reference was made in the passing to some allegations that had been made that certain evidence relating to the Discounted Option Scheme had been withheld from the LNS commission, which occasioned Lord Nimmo Smith to be misled; and to the apparent negligent performance of the SFA administration under the previous President, who, both on account of his personal knowledge of the use of the DOS by Sir David Murray, and as a subsequent recipient of an EBT, might reasonably have been expected to ensure a thorough and diligent examination of the information provided by clubs about payments to players.

Mr Broadfoot ruled out discussion of the first of these matters because ‘there was no evidence’, and the second matter was also ruled out because, he asserted, the previous president is a man of the highest integrity.

I replied that work was in hand to provide evidence, and that the question of negligent performance of duties was not a question of ‘personal integrity’.

Mr Broadfoot opined that the future would show whether Scottish Football supporters were really concerned about the old club/new club debate, if huge numbers turned their backs on the game.

I replied that a sport based on a false proposition, on what could be seen as a lie, no matter on what pragmatic reasons, would certainly wither if and when people thought the sport could be rigged.

As the meeting drew to a close, I was asked if, coming from Edinburgh, I was a Hibs or Hearts supporter, or perhaps a Celtic supporter? And whether I was going to tonight’s (Celtic were playing that evening at home) game?

I replied that as my name suggests, I was of Irish extraction and perhaps conclusions could be drawn from that. Also that I would not be going to tonight’s game, and that my interest in the present matter was rather more academic and objective than partisan.

The meeting ended cordially at about 2.45.pm “


 

I think I can say that Mr Broadfoot, opening the meeting, explained that

“for the purposes of this meeting, I am the SFA.”

Mr McRae’s personal contribution to the conversation was therefore very little more than mentioned above, Mr Broadfoot doing most of the talking.

I will say further that I spoke to BP, and consulted one or two other posters before I went to the meeting, in order to make sure that my general understanding both of the principal events of the ‘saga’ and of the thrust of most of SFM’s contributors, who are drawn from supporters of many clubs, was sufficiently sound.

I give it as my opinion that I may have been invited to a personal meeting only because it might have been thought in some quarters that I was in possession of an electronic recording of what I told Mr McRae that he was reported as having said.

And, finally, I declare here that my note of the meeting was written within two hours of the meeting, and reflects the substance of the conversation. It is exactly the note I sent by email to Broadfoot, except that I corrected a typo in the spelling of Darryll (I had ‘Caryll’), have omitted my own surname, and changed references to myself from the third person to the first person.

 

 

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1,392 Comments so far

Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on11:56 am - Feb 9, 2016


Den 9th February 2016 at 11:36 am #said Prior, who owns roughly over one per cent of the club but plans to increase his shareholding.From “roughly over one per cent” to something approximately more than that I assume. The wealthy Rangers fans could have had the lot for £5.5m, Charles Green did.If they go to Court asking for a Commercial contract to be altered they will need a better argument than “it is not Fair” or “a big CEO did and Eh …… we don’t idolise him any more”.Unless there is evidence of unfair practice they will see out the deal, or buy it out.I am not saying that it is not heavily (morally it could be argued, unfairly) weighted against them however there were no better alternatives. 
___________

In all probability, without those loans, there would have been no TRFC today! And without the ‘unfair’deal, there would have been no loans. Of all the ‘badness’ surounding TRFC, from it’s very beginnings in 2012, the SD deal is one of the few carried out with both sides knowing exactly what was happening, and why. It is probably the only one where the ‘investor’ had a reasonable chance of getting out with his own money, and one of the very few where the investor (other than supporters) actually used his/their own money.

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billyj1Posted on12:00 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Watch out for an SPL club entering administration soon. Possibly before the weekend.

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on12:31 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Reference Kieron Prior IQ, is it 234 or 2+3+4 ?  Only asking due to him loaning money to financial basket case of a club.

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yourhavingalaugh

yourhavingalaughPosted on12:35 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Every possible connection to the club from Ibrox fact,fictional ,living ,dead,human or otherwise has always got to have something about it that’s off the radar,step forward this weeks,Keiron,drum roll,loud applause ,Keef ,you made this statement your own,it will follow you everywhere .

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HighlanderPosted on12:43 pm - Feb 9, 2016


billyj1 9th February 2016 at 12:00 pm #Watch out for an SPL club entering administration soon. Possibly before the weekend.

I think you’ll find the SPL died shortly after Rangers did likewise, amid very little mourning for either death.

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DenPosted on12:55 pm - Feb 9, 2016


bfbpuzzled 9th February 2016 at 12:22 pm #

IQ 234. It is so ludicrous that no decent journalist should report it unchallenged, but City AM and the Record do. 

When I read the claim previously I formed the opinion that Mr Prior is a bit of a fantasist.

If he had anything like the money to lose that he implies he would be a Director of RIFC in minutes, and a fleeced mercilessly.

 

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neepheid

neepheidPosted on12:56 pm - Feb 9, 2016


billyj1 9th February 2016 at 12:00 pm #Watch out for an SPL club entering administration soon. Possibly before the weekend.
===================
You maybe mean an SPFL club, but you really need to give us a clue.

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gwaredPosted on1:05 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Neepheid, Billy means Motherwell, rumours awash of a Board meeting this week to discuss admin. I must stress that rumour is the operative word.

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Prohibby

ProhibbyPosted on1:07 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Whatever, bfbpuzzled, he has intelligence ‘of the radar’, obviously!
Allyjambo makes a very valid point – which seems to have slipped off the Govan radar – the Ibrox outfit were heavily cash strapped, without the size of credit facility they needed available anywhere else on the radar. So they had to borrow under extraordinary terms to match the extraordinary risks the lender faced.
The genius would have to admit that a-priori12, the Ibrox outfit did well to get the loan and side benefits from MASH that they did get, given the impoverished state they were in!

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on1:50 pm - Feb 9, 2016


John Clark 9th February 2016 at 2:18 am #Corrupt official 9th February 2016 at 1:00 am‘.. He has as much authority as a supply teacher in an Easterhouse school.’________He has,constitutionally as it were, as much ‘presidential’ authority as our Campbell had.But of course Campbell was in with the bricks, all squared.And what   is his successor to do? Pull the pillars down? Never in life.
    ——————————————————————————————–  
   I agree John, constitutionally he has authority, but why was it given to him when his first reaction was to reach out for help from someone off screen?. (Mr SFA?)…. He did so in a manner completely void of any leadership qualities. Inside he was screaming, “Help !”….The only inspiration on show was his ability to point a finger at someone else, and gaze into a hole in the desk looking for a solution. Almost like he was checking the size of the hole to see if he could fit his head in…..Totally lost without his “comfort” bucket of sand.
    I think I just answered my own question there. 

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on1:58 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Reiver 9th February 2016 at 9:54 am #I see there are a number of recent post suggesting that what is need is to clear all the current administrators and replace them.Well???Posting on blogs ain’t gonna make it happen.Spread the word.SIGN the PETITION!
https://www.change.org/p/scottish-football-association-return-integrity-to-football-administration-in-scotland-94421b40-2d6b-4d4b-9cff-912c9849478f
   ——————————————————————————————————–
   Did so a while back mate, and also forwarded the link to buddies. I don’t want to spoil it by doing so again, but anybody who hasn’t signed, in the words of Billy Bragg, “Wearing badges is not enough, In days like these”
Good Luck Bro !04

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billyj1Posted on2:05 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Apologies. SPFL. Reliable source. They needed a cup run. 

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Kopweb

KopwebPosted on2:11 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Isn’t the Kieran Prior piece just a regurgitation of a story that did the rounds in January 2015? That would explain the lack of quotes and the reference to his investment ‘in the last year’.
Maybe I’m too cynical but I suspect a high-Level squirrel. 13

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neepheid

neepheidPosted on2:34 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Kopweb 9th February 2016 at 2:11 pm #Isn’t the Kieran Prior piece just a regurgitation of a story that did the rounds in January 2015? That would explain the lack of quotes and the reference to his investment ‘in the last year’. Maybe I’m too cynical but I suspect a high-Level squirrel.
==================================================

Not too cynical at all, and thanks for pointing me to this puff piece from January 2015-
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-investor-kieran-prior-backs-4937812#dAXWrFqBb2Cgfkfz.97
From which-

Prior arrived on the scene 18 months ago and promised to look under the bonnet and, if he liked what he saw, he would invest further. Suffice to say, he didn’t see a Rolls-Royce engine.
Manchester-born and London based, the former Goldman Sachs trader has spent much of the past 12 months in California, working on the launch of a multi-million dollar software firm.

Which echoes almost exactly the City AM piece I posted earlier. However this California dream has now been at least 2 years in the making.
I think Mr Prior is a very useful squirrel indeed, for those of a Level5PR persuasion (i.e. the Daily Record). I suppose the question is, why release him again right now?

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John ClarkPosted on2:52 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Kopweb 9th February 2016 at 2:11 pm
‘..Maybe I’m too cynical but I suspect a high-Level squirrel’
___________
About the only high-level thing the DR is capable of in the arena of Scottish Football reporting is gutter-level  Jacksonism.
In my opinion.

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yourhavingalaugh

yourhavingalaughPosted on3:03 pm - Feb 9, 2016


It was like last nights evening times front page headline,a story about A frying pan assault that happened over a week ago ,in fact the last Sunday in January,headlines,FFS,over a week later and what a story.

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on3:37 pm - Feb 9, 2016


For the time-wasters(like me).

https://twitter.com/DirtyFootbaIIer

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zerotolerance1903

zerotolerance1903Posted on3:45 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Re Kieran Prior, I’m not all convinced that the average bear is going to like the cut of his jib.  Maybe that’s why little seems to have happened with him since his 2013 investment   

http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2010/08/05/‘religion-and-the-city-go-hand-in-hand’/

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yourhavingalaugh

yourhavingalaughPosted on4:27 pm - Feb 9, 2016


zerotolerance1903
As We know the DR Kieron piece is a copy and paste from over an year ago,pity that,if it was a recent interview the  Record could have asked him ,as an investor who is going to invest again ,what is his take on the songs that are sung at Ibrox,particularly the ones that include his father and paternal grandfather blood.

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scottc

scottcPosted on4:53 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Highlander 9th February 2016 at 12:43 pm #
billyj1 9th February 2016 at 12:00 pm #Watch out for an SPL club entering administration soon. Possibly before the weekend.
I think you’ll find the SPL died shortly after Rangers did likewise, amid very little mourning for either death.

Actually, the SPL didn’t die. It absorbed the SFL and changed its name to the SPFL. It’s still the same company that it always was.

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jimboPosted on4:58 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Good to see there is to be 9th minute demonstration of support for Leigh Griffiths at Celtic Park on Saturday.  It was heartening too that he received support from fans of all clubs including TRFC & Hearts.

I hope Police Scotland catch these vile rats, Twitter should offer them up.

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Billy BoycePosted on5:34 pm - Feb 9, 2016


zerotolerance1903 9th February 2016 at 3:45 pm
Re Kieran Prior, I’m not all convinced that the average bear is going to like the cut of his jib.  Maybe that’s why little seems to have happened with him since his 2013 investment   
http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2010/08/05/‘religion-and-the-city-go-hand-in-hand’/
______________________________________________
 Today the Daily Record informs its readers that “Prior, a childhood Rangers fan, owns around 2.5 per cent of the club and has invested £1million in the last 12 months.”  This bold statement of young Prior’s footballing affiliation has caused much hilarity on the Celtic message-boards.  They wonder how a young lad from a devout Catholic family in rural west of Ireland forsook all others to follow, follow the Ibrox giants – particularly when there was no access to Scottish television and, dare I say it, no other bluenoses in that neck of the woods.
 
Why do the rags feel the need to portray every chancer arriving in Edmiston Drive as a staunch Rangers fan, man and boy?  We had Union Jackson telling the nation that the MBB’s dreams came true when he bought over his boyhood heroes.  The rags also informed us that Dave King was lifted over the turnstiles by his father from an early age.  Of course, that did not tie in with King’s own earlier account of his policeman father wanting nothing to do with the anti-social behaviour and violence of football fans.

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yourhavingalaugh

yourhavingalaughPosted on6:38 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Billy Boyce
I suppose therein lies the difference between the succulent lamb brigade,Speirs etc and Keef and his like the porky pie mob.

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essexbeancounterPosted on7:34 pm - Feb 9, 2016


neepheid 9th February 2016 at 9:24 am #I understand that the article is based on an interview with Prior by City AM, a business based free paper circulating widely in the London commuter belt. 
http://www.cityam.com/233979/rangers…ct-retail-deal
One of the most intelligent men in the world, Prior bought 785,000 shares in the Glasgow club in 2013 and plans to increase his influence with further purchases once he has completed work on a business opportunity on the West Coast of America.
==============================================
Neepheid…Thank you for the link.
City AM can usually be found decorating the floors of London Tube trains and other public transport.
I can only wonder why a man of such high intelligence quota, would want to wait a minute longer before purchasing any more shares in TRFC. Surely they must be at their lowest possible valuation, notwithstanding that “Career Criminal King” (copyright John James!) forced them to be delisted with his antics over a NOMAD…or is it me? 09

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on8:37 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Watching West Ham v Liverpool and was struck by the amount of time wasted at free kicks  –  over a minute for the one the Hammers hit the post alone . It appears to be the ref who is holding up play so surely the clock should be stopped . There was less time added in total than for that delay .

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wottpiPosted on8:51 pm - Feb 9, 2016


paddy malarkey 9th February 2016 at 8:37 pm
If you Google it it appears as though a few years back to average time for phaffing/ ball out of play etc was around 20-30 mins.

Better than the NFL where it is reckoned that for the hour long game 12 mins is actually action and that takes 3.5 hours to play it out.

However something like a 30 second clock from whistle to taking a free kicks, goal-kicks corners and throw-ins, or 15 secs from the refs whistle when a booking is involved would liven things up a bit 🙂

Same for subs, if your guy doesn’t get his ass on the field in 15 secs then the game starts without him!!

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:40 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Motherwell rumours. Crap. Officially Alan Burrows.

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John ClarkPosted on11:11 pm - Feb 9, 2016


ianagain 9th February 2016 at 10:40 pm
‘Motherwell rumours. Crap. Officially Alan Burrows.’
_____
And I, for one, am heartily glad to hear it.

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justshatered

justshateredPosted on11:30 pm - Feb 9, 2016


Today was the day that the financial figures at ‘The Rangers’ came back under the spotlight.
It looks as if there may be another attempt to raise cash through a share issue to existing shareholders although how much capital it will actually bring in is up for debate.
This organisation is haemorrhaging cash at an alarming rate and there is a clear shortfall.
What no one seems to be suggesting however is how is this gap, between funding and expenditure, going to be bridged.
Could it be the opportunity of European football; a Celtic versus ‘The Rangers’ Scottish Cup final where Celtic as league champions guarantee ‘The Rangers’ access to the European cash. The problem with that scenario is Celtic are clearly now struggling with only one recognised forward. It will be interesting to see whether Aberdeen suffer some ‘strange’ decisions over the next few games.
This actually plays into the SFA’s hands as it allows minds to, yet again link Celtic and ‘The Rangers’, as the two bullies in the playground. It would also drag Celtic into the calamity that is now unfolding leaving Aberdeen the fall guys in the game. The SFA/SPFL know that Stewart Milne will do rock all after his comments late last year. He clearly is happy playing the fall guy.
Of course there is another possibility; the league plays out for good or bad and there is a ‘strange’ decision or two at Hampden.
Anyway the ultimate outcome is achieved and it allows ‘The Rangers’ access to the European market in an attempt to balance the books although it will be interesting to see where they are seeded in the draws and if they will be treated as a new club or the ethereal everlasting entity. Even if they fail to qualify the players valuations will rocket, well according to the tabloids.
Our referees are now so erratic that anything is possible and as we all know even the impossible happens with amazing regularity in Scottish football.

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John ClarkPosted on11:32 pm - Feb 9, 2016


scottc 9th February 2016 at 4:53 pm
‘..Actually, the SPL didn’t die. It absorbed the SFL and changed its name to the SPFL. It’s still the same company that it always was.’
___________
Your post led me to indulge in  an interestingly enjoyable hunt through Companies House stuff.
I had no idea that the original name on incorporation in May 1997  was ‘Dunwilco(597) Ltd’, or that the original Articles of Association don’t mention the word ‘football’ .
In December 1997, Stewart Milne and RC Ogilvie became directors, and in April 1998 the name of the company was changed to ‘The Scottish Premier League Ltd’.
More recently, of course, there was an ‘amalgamation of the SPL and SFL’.
The SPL and SFL signed up to the proposal that the SPL should change  its articles of association and absorb, AS the SPL,  the SFL; and then change its name to the ‘SPFL’.
It seems it was the SFL that ceased to exist.( Mind you, I don’t see it on the Companies House records as a ‘dissolved’ company.It simply doesn’t seem to be recorded, because you’re thrown back to the SPFL, if you simply key in ‘Scottish Football League’.
Perhaps it still exists: ethereally, conceptually, an idea, the passion of football, the ‘what it’s all about’, so brilliantly shouted at his lordship by a metaphysician?02

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John ClarkPosted on11:48 pm - Feb 9, 2016


justshatered 9th February 2016 at 11:30 pm
‘….Anyway the ultimate outcome is achieved and it allows ‘The Rangers’ access to the European market ..’
__________
There will be many who, reading your post, justshatered, will ,like me, be thinking: we would not put it past the SFA to do the dirtiest of deeds, since we know they have already not been above a shabby thing.
And far from apologising for it, and correcting it, they have in effect spat in the face of honour and integrity, denied their wrongdoing and continue to compound it  by the  propagation of the Big Lie.
Like Macbeth( sorry, Eb) they are so far across the river of wrongdoing that going back would be more disastrous for them than trying to slog through to ‘victory’ over justice and truth.
This really has to be sorted.

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buddy_hollyPosted on12:00 am - Feb 10, 2016


I do like a good conspiracy theory but….
Scottish cup runner up is not in europa league qualifying any more. Changed last year europe wide, for english reference notice that arsenal beat aston villa and aston villa played no games in europa eague season 2015-2016, i.e. this season. (Arsenal were in champions league)

For 2016-2017…
SPFL winner in chmpions league qualifying champions round 2 of 4.
Scottish Cup winner in  europa league qualifying round 2 of 4.
SPFL runner-up in europa league qualifying round 1 of 4.
SPFL third place in europa league qualifying round 1 of 4.
In event Scottish cup winner is SPFL winner, then SPFL fourth place gets europa league qualifying slot round 1, SPFL runner-up shuffles up to 2nd qualifyng round.
(All assumes the eligible clubs have accounts and are eligible)… that one for you auldheid.

So, you need a fair bt more conspiracy….
…. though after what we have seen since 2012 and in court nothing is beyond the shame faced SFA.
Scottish football needs accurate conspiracy theories
Scottish football is thankful for accurate court reporting from John Clark and others
Buddy
——————-
John Clark 9th February 2016 at 11:48 pm #justshatered 9th February 2016 at 11:30 pm‘….Anyway the ultimate outcome is achieved and it allows ‘The Rangers’ access to the European market ..’__________There will be many who, reading your post, justshatered, will ,like me, be thinking: we would not put it past the SFA to do the dirtiest of deeds, since we know they have already not been above a shabby thing.And far from apologising for it, and correcting it, they have in effect spat in the face of honour and integrity, denied their wrongdoing and continue to compound it  by the  propagation of the Big Lie.Like Macbeth( sorry, Eb) they are so far across the river of wrongdoing that going back would be more disastrous for them than trying to slog through to ‘victory’ over justice and truth.This really has to be sorted.
====================

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John ClarkPosted on12:21 am - Feb 10, 2016


buddy_holly 10th February 2016 at 12:00 am
‘…..So, you need a fair bt more conspiracy….…. though after what we have seen since 2012 and in court nothing is beyond the shame faced SFA.’
__________
You’re right, of course, in showing how many obstacles there can be to frustrate the would-be wrongdoers. The sad thing is that they have allowed themselves to be seen as being ready to do ‘wrong’-if they possibly can.
And, by not repenting of, or acknowledging, their wrong behaviour, they exhibit a readiness to do wrong again-if they thought they could get away with it.
That’s what they have done to themselves: destroyed their own credibility.
And, like thon banking knight who busted us all, and  the football knight who busted RFC, they will have one helluva job getting anyone to believe that they and Scottish Football are  clean potatoes. Unless, and until, they ‘fess up, and rectify things.
In my opinion.

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buddy_hollyPosted on12:39 am - Feb 10, 2016


John Clark 10th February 2016 at 12:21 am #buddy_holly 10th February 2016 at 12:00 am‘…..So, you need a fair bt more conspiracy….…. though after what we have seen since 2012 and in court nothing is beyond the shame faced SFA.’__________You’re right, of course, in showing how many obstacles there can be to frustrate the would-be wrongdoers. The sad thing is that they have allowed themselves to be seen as being ready to do ‘wrong’-if they possibly can.And, by not repenting of, or acknowledging, their wrong behaviour, they exhibit a readiness to do wrong again-if they thought they could get away with it.That’s what they have done to themselves: destroyed their own credibility.And, like thon banking knight who busted us all, and  the football knight who busted RFC, they will have one helluva job getting anyone to believe that they and Scottish Football are  clean potatoes. Unless, and until, they ‘fess up, and rectify things.In my opinion.
===============================
John,
How the SFA regain the trust of all scottish football fans is a tough one.
However, we live in interesting times, where….
How the FIFA regain the trust of all football fans worldwide is also a tough one.
How the IAAF regain the trust of athletics stakeholders is also a tough one.
However the UCI have started to regain the trust of cycling fans by their admissions and action. Tough things have to get worse generally for the authorities/governers before they get any forgiveness. They also may not get much credit if they are dragged into it by outside forces against their own will.
I do not see the precise trigger for the SFA dominos starting to fall. Though ashley’s court actions is one way to start a breach in the dam. SFA might plug it quickly though. Vigilance, preparation and readiness to act when the dam is weakened is the important thing we have to both facilitate and prepare for.
I would like the sfa to disappear, however the clubs will not allow this, a clean out nd the enshrinement of true transparency might be the best to hope for.
Buddy

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AuldheidPosted on12:45 am - Feb 10, 2016


buddy_holly 10th February 2016 at 12:00 am #

(All assumes the eligible clubs have accounts and are eligible)… that one for you auldheid

I posted on this today on JJs site when he was suggesting SC was a route into Europe for TRFC.
Because they are not in the top tier they  will not have been  assessed against the UEFA licence level that applies to Premiership clubs.
To allow for clubs from lower tiers to qualify on Sporting merit there is special provision in UEFA Rules for an exceptional case to be made by the National Association to allow participation. (Article 15 from memory)
Naturally everyone thinks this will be a given, but UEFA  have the final say and will take a bit of convincing that a club for whom the SFA currently only award an Entry Level licence under National Club licensing are  not at risk of failing during the UEFA tournament.
UEFA should by then have a copy of the SFA’s role in the 2011 UEFA Licence shenanigans and will be well appraised of the trustworthiness of the case the SFA might make.
That assumes of course TRFC are able to supply a set of accounts ratified at an AGM with no going concern notes to make UEFA ask for future financial forecasts to satisfy themselves that TRFC are a financially viable club.
I’m not saying entrance would not be granted but it is anything but a given if the scenario painted ever actually arises…..
  

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John ClarkPosted on12:45 am - Feb 10, 2016


Billy Boyce 9th February 2016 at 5:34 pm
‘… Of course, that did not tie in with King’s own earlier account of his policeman father ..’
______
Which reminds me! there is a pharmacist in Brisbane whose family got the house in Castlemilk that had been previously occupied by the King family.
Can I ask the poster who knows that pharmacist to  pm me, please? I can’t remember where we left the ‘communications contact’ information, whether I could give either party the email address of the other!
I feel all guilty, now.Unlike the brass necks in the SFA.02

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jimboPosted on12:51 am - Feb 10, 2016


Auldheid, I have no trust left in any footballing authority to do the right thing any more.

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Paulmac2Posted on1:16 am - Feb 10, 2016


Auldheid 10th February 2016 at 12:45 am #
……………………………..
If we are to believe this is the same club….then there is a minor matter of an outstanding TAX BILL of £14 million pounds unpaid that excludes them from any UEFA licence…also that small tax bill…has that ever been paid?
After all it is the SFA who are claiming they are the same club…so how can they knowingly submit approval for a licence to compete in a UEFA competition under those circumstances?

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John ClarkPosted on1:26 am - Feb 10, 2016


jimbo 10th February 2016 at 12:51 am
‘..Auldheid, I have no trust left in any footballing authority to do the right thing any more.’
___________
Auldheid will have his own reply to that observation, jimbo.
For my part, I rely, ultimately, on the basic common sense of people like ordinary football supporters.
Which sense tells us that  rule makers and rule enforcers who themselves are prepared to cheat,are on a level well below the gutter level of , say, the knighted majority shareholder of an erstwhile football club, or of bad-assed poltroons whose radar screens are defective.
We now do not know whether any match, any football competition, any disciplinary proceedings, or any fecking thing in Scottish Football, can be trusted. Who can have any faith in the Judicial panel protocol? When it was so signally, in my opinion, capable of being subverted?
And, of course, we know for sure that  the SMSM , and BBC Radio Scotland in particular, are not at all to be trusted
.And that is my , in my submission, well-founded opinion.

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Paulmac2Posted on1:42 am - Feb 10, 2016


neepheid 8th February 2016 at 5:57 pm #
……………………………..

The man with the impossible IQ score….according to various qualified sources 200 is the highest possible adult IQ score attainable.

So I am guessing, Mr. Prior has been awarded an IQ certificate from the Charles Green school of IQ tests.
How else could Charlie convince him to invest?

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scottc

scottcPosted on5:26 am - Feb 10, 2016


John Clark 9th February 2016 at 11:32 pm #

It seems it was the SFL that ceased to exist.( Mind you, I don’t see it on the Companies House records as a ‘dissolved’ company.It simply doesn’t seem to be recorded, …

If memory serves me correctly John, the SFL was NOT an incorporated company. It never really got beyond simply being … well … a club, I guess. 02

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upthehoopsPosted on6:53 am - Feb 10, 2016


John Clark 9th February 2016 at 11:11 pm #ianagain 9th February 2016 at 10:40 pm‘Motherwell rumours. Crap. Officially Alan Burrows.’_____And I, for one, am heartily glad to hear it.
===============================

Oh dear…that means we will be spared a media tsunami informing us it wouldn’t have happened had the mighty Rangers been in the top league.  They have spent four years telling us clubs will go to the wall because the only club to actually go to the wall is missing. 

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ReiverPosted on9:26 am - Feb 10, 2016


Corrupt official
“but anybody who hasn’t signed, in the words of Billy Bragg, “Wearing badges is not enough, In days like these”Good Luck Bro !”
Cheers mate, but I must admit I’m starting to think that, despite all the moaning that goes on on the forums, the support isn’t there.
We have managed 1600 signatures compared to a petition to save a hovercraft with 19000 in less time.
Pathetic!
Ideally a twitter or facebook promotion would help but I don’t have a presence there and to start from scratch would be ineffectual.
There is no access to the Scottish media for obvious reasons and my lack of experience means that I am struggling to think of other platforms to promote this. Any suggestions? I’ve tried the BBC, Channel 4 and a couple of papers based down south but no luck. Even Phil three names didn’t allow my post on his site and John James has stated he no longer wants to give the petition publicity.
Unless something can kick start this then the only thing that will achieve our goal is the slow death of the sport we love. Relying on Ashley’s court cases I believe is looking less and less likely to achieve an outcome.
If only I could translate every post that bitches about the SFA/SPFL into signatures we would be well past the next action trigger of 5000 by now but writing on comments sections seems to be more about looking clever than being effectual for most.
Cheers anyway. I haven’t given up yet.

SIGN the PETITION

https://www.change.org/p/scottish-football-association-return-integrity-to-football-administration-in-scotland-94421b40-2d6b-4d4b-9cff-912c9849478f

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bordersdonPosted on10:26 am - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver 10th February 2016 at 9:26 am #
If only I could translate every post that bitches about the SFA/SPFL into signatures we would be well past the next action trigger of 5000 by now but writing on comments sections seems to be more about looking clever than being effectual for most.
———————————————————————————————————–
I think you will find that most of the posts are the same people posting multiple times. We might have to accept that within the vast majority of the Scottish football supporting public there is not the appetite for involvement in a campaign to right the wrongs within the governing bodies? Evidence also shows that through their inactivity the clubs are not minded to take action. A bit glass half empty I know but realism also? I admire your tenacity and wish you success however.
ps I have signed the petition!

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tayred

tayredPosted on10:49 am - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver 10th February 2016 at 9:26 am #If only I could translate every post that bitches about the SFA/SPFL into signatures we would be well past the next action trigger of 5000 by now but writing on comments sections seems to be more about looking clever than being effectual for most.
———————————————————————————————————–

Following up on Bordersdon, I think the apathy of the majority is pretty clear. But, I don’t believe it is apathy about the state of things, I think many are fully aware and repulsed with the shenanigans that have been and continue to be part of the behaviours of the SFA/SPFL. 

The apathy goes along the lines of “It was always thus, and it will never change”. I also believe that many do not sign petitions as they don’t see them as worthwhile, we have complained about the SFA many times before and it makes not a jot of difference. Sorry Reiver, but that is largely my feeling towards petitions. There are too many these, and they are too easy to ignore.

The only thing that will provoke any form of action from our clubs is something that would directly hit their pockets. Withdrawal of money is the only thing that can cause any hurt to them, up till that point its bunker down and hope the noisy people go away. Look at the furore that Liverpool fans have managed to stir up by leaving on the 77th minute. The clubs aren’t worried about that per se, they still have their money after all, but the train of thought is clear – if they can leave after 77 minutes, maybe they just won’t bother turning up at all! 

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stevoPosted on11:38 am - Feb 10, 2016


<BLOCKQUOTE>justshatered 9th February 2016 at 11:30 pmAnyway the ultimate outcome is achieved and it allows ‘The Rangers’ access to the European market in an attempt to balance the books although it will be interesting to see where they are seeded in the draws and if they will be treated as a new club or the ethereal everlasting entity.</BLOCKQUOTE>
As buddy_holly says, the Scottish Cup winner will enter the second Europa League qualifying round. Based on the team coefficients at the same stage of this season’s competition, only Celtic and Hearts (of the teams left in the Cup) would be seeded, regardless of whether Rangers were treated as a new club or not. A team can however become seeded in QR3 by beating seeded opponents in QR2, as Aberdeen did this season.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on12:32 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver 10th February 2016 at 9:26 am #Corrupt official“but anybody who hasn’t signed, in the words of Billy Bragg, “Wearing badges is not enough, In days like these”Good Luck Bro !”
   ————————————————————————————————————-
     Don’t get disheartened Bro. You will be aware of the stamina and tenacity that Auldheid and the Celtic shareholders have had to draw on and are still persevering. It’s a game of small bites with plenty of chewing in between.  Forget the SMSM ! Getting anything like the truth printed in them will set you back the price of a full page advert and a team of lawyers. Even at that it will be attacked on everything but merit. Evil 5 will see to it.
    Social media is all we have, because even writing direct to them, or our clubs solicits little feed-back and responses are always of a can-kicking nature. 
   There will be successes for every disappointment though. At the end of the day it is our game, and as my auld granny used to say. “Ye cannae beat a man who wullnae gie in” 
   Keep chipping away mate. If your petition converts just one fan into realising that change is needed, it will have been worthwhile. 
   As Tayred points out above, I do think it will take a mass wallet hitting exercise on a scale of 2012 to really get them to take notice. 
   Kill it to cure it so to speak…….Mr self-appointed SFA has already thrown out that challenge. Don’t be deterred by his bold front. With his limited qualifications he knows he is facing a minimum wage zero contract when he is out ! 
    We will get the game, we let them give us!

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jimboPosted on12:43 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver,  I posted a link to the petition on here a few days before you started posting it.  One of our posters replied that he was wary because the petition requires you to supply your name and address.  This could be a reason, people are reluctant to give private details on the internet.  Good luck anyway. 04

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jimboPosted on1:03 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Just read The Clumpany is no more.  If that is true I am very sad.  I read it every day and found it hilarious (maybe not if you were a fan of TRFC.)  His twitter a/c is down too.  So there is no way to say thanks and good luck.  I hope he reads this site. 0520

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HaywirePosted on1:26 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver 10th February 2016 at 9:26 am #Corrupt official “but anybody who hasn’t signed, in the words of Billy Bragg, “Wearing badges is not enough, In days like these”Good Luck Bro !” Cheers mate, but I must admit I’m starting to think that, despite all the moaning that goes on on the forums, the support isn’t there. We have managed 1600 signatures compared to a petition to save a hovercraft with 19000 in less time. Pathetic! Ideally a twitter or facebook promotion would help but I don’t have a presence there and to start from scratch would be ineffectual……………………………………………………. If only I could translate every post that bitches about the SFA/SPFL into signatures we would be well past the next action trigger of 5000 by now but writing on comments sections seems to be more about looking clever than being effectual for most. Cheers anyway. I haven’t given up yet.
SIGN the PETITION
……………………………………………………………………………………….
Hello Reiver,
I am completely in sympathy with your project regarding the Petition.  However, and this has been referred to by other posters, I am reluctant to commit my personal details to an online petition when I know virtually nothing about the organiser.
I don’t want to sound too risk averse, and I hope that you do not take this personally, but I don’t know who you are and have no idea of your background.  About the only thing I can make of you, based on your pen name, is that you were probably born or lived in the Borders.
I should add that I have signed other online petitions, but not involving Scottish fitba’.  Some time ago, I did wonder if there was any possibility of getting ’38 Degrees’ interested.  I have committed to many of their petitions, but they are principally involved in political issues and based in England as far as I can determine.
I am now somewhat long in the tooth and have witnessed many examples of WATP ‘animated conversations’ with non-believers. 
I do not wish to sound too downbeat, so Good Luck with your Project!

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tykebhoy

tykebhoyPosted on1:31 pm - Feb 10, 2016


jimbo 10th February 2016 at 1:03 pm #
Just read The Clumpany is no more.

Out of interest and for provenance, where did you read that?  The blog site is available but with no new content since Monday.  However that isn’t unusual from Clumps.  The twitter account may just have been temporarily removed especially if abuse levels are up.  Its certainly disappeared in the past and returned.  Is it also coincidence that SFM was down for a while this morning?  As in cyber attacks.
 
I’m pretty sure Clumps has posted on here and PGMB’s blogs.

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weeandyoPosted on1:31 pm - Feb 10, 2016


jimbo 10th February 2016 at 1:03 pm #
I also see the Twitter account of blogger James Forest (LaytonBhoy) is down too. What’s going on?  These are 2 of my staples and I will miss their insight if they do not return. Hopefully just a glitch and nothing sinister.

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nawlitePosted on1:49 pm - Feb 10, 2016


It seems odd to me that we are all happy to decry those members of the SMSM who refuse to tell the truth about all things TRFC*, whether that’s going along with the big lie, falling in line behind their latest charlatan leader or refusing to denounce the (wider) issue of sectarianism in football.
We are all very quick to compare them with proper journalists who report on truly life/career-threatening issues, whether those be in theatres of war or simply exposing political wrongdoing. In comparing them, we are happy to belittle the SMSM for being afraid of a few antagonistic people in the TRFC* fanbase.
Yet here we are perhaps with an opportunity to make our voices heard a little more widely through Reivers’ petition and we continue to hide behind our computer screens just in case he is harvesting our details to add to ‘the list’.
Surely we need to stand up for what we believe in here.

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Methilhill Stroller

Methilhill StrollerPosted on1:57 pm - Feb 10, 2016


At little late but again appreciating John Clark, James Doleman, etc for their contributions in court and also still laughing at the Cup draw fiasco. Organization, what organization?
Slightly off topic but I see that friendlies have been organized with Czech Republic (away) and Denmark (home) in March and then Italy (in Malta where we play the first WC qualifier) and France (in Metz) before the Euros. The only way we were going to get to France I suppose but at least we can now say we are going this summer.
WGS seems to be talking this up as a good plan, especially Malta to see the sights before the WC starts, and the quality of France and Italy, but I worry about that because the opposition will be tough he might well revert to type and keep the old has-beens (Fletcher – looking at both of you) instead of throwing in some new blood in an effort to qualify (no laughing at the back but we can at least hope before a ball has been kicked).
Let’s hope that for the Denmark game we have a pitch worthy of a national team to play on and for the away games the flights are on time and burgers are off the menu this time around.
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath and East Fife (getting better but still room for improvement and some consistency).

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abigboydiditandranawayPosted on2:00 pm - Feb 10, 2016


OT I know..
I have tried to pm John Clark with no success..
John,
I am the poster who knew the Castlemilk pharmacist who has now been in Brisbane for nigh on 30 years…
We are now friends on Facebook and are in regular contact thanks to you and SFM!…
SFM and John Clark…”spreading the love worldwide”..

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on2:28 pm - Feb 10, 2016


nawlite 10th February 2016 at 1:49 pm 

   “Yet here we are perhaps with an opportunity to make our voices heard a little more widely through Reivers’ petition and we continue to hide behind our computer screens just in case he is harvesting our details to add to ‘the list’.Surely we need to stand up for what we believe in here”
    ————————————————————————————————————
  Well said Nawlite ! ……….Alba an Aigh ?????   

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on3:17 pm - Feb 10, 2016


In the (unlikely) event that TRFC win the Scottish Cup, what or who would UEFA be looking at wrt financial compliance for European competitions – RIFC ? TRFC ? Somebody else ?Does SPFL or SFA submit the application , or is it the club ?

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on3:51 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Also, while I’m awake, if MA/SD take full ownership of RR, what are the effects does the giving of notice on the 7 year deal have ? Thanks in advance .

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on3:56 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Gough hoping to become voice of RangersPosted at 15:25 Former Ibrox captain Richard Gough has put himself forward for election for the board of the Rangers First supporters’ group. 
Gough, who acts as a “global ambassador” of Rangers, is among 23 candidates for a seat on the five-strong board of the shareholding group, which owns a 3.5% stake in the club and has more than 14,000 contributors. 
He has backed proposals to merge Rangers First with several other fans’ groups to form a unified Rangers Support organisation that will work closely with the club.

BBC Sport

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AuldheidPosted on4:32 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Whoever from Ibrox applies for permission to play in Europe next season, assuming the SC provides a means of entry, it will not be the same legal entity that last applied in 2011 and was granted a licence. You can take that to the bank because if it was they would have no ratified accounts to supply and would have millions in tax overdue to HMRC, so would not be entertained.
The last time a legal entity applied it would have to have called itself MIH in order for a new application by TRFC or TRIFC  to be entertained, this time as being the holding company who took over the liquidated RFC.
So who applied last time? MIH or RFC? What do you think?
I think anyone reading Article 12 of UEFA FFP would find in it a determination to protect the sporting integrity of UEFA competitions, a determination our SFA do not share for the domestic game, apparently on the Broadfoot gamble that supporters don’t care enough about sporting integrity to stop watching a sporting game that depends on it.

A much longer version taken from CQN covers the matter.

Article 12 – Definition of licence applicant

1 A licence applicant may only be a football club, i.e. a legal entity fully responsible

for a football team participating in national and international competitions which

either:

a) is a registered member of a UEFA member association and/or its affiliated

league (hereinafter: registered member); or

b) has a contractual relationship with a registered member (hereinafter: football

company).

2 The membership and the contractual relationship (if any) must have lasted – at

the start of the licence season – for at least three consecutive years. Any

alteration to the club’s legal form or company structure (including, for example,

changing its headquarters, name or club colours, or transferring stakeholdings

between different clubs) during this period in order to facilitate its qualification on

sporting merit and/or its receipt of a licence to the detriment of the integrity of a

competition is deemed as an interruption of membership or contractual relationship (if any) within the meaning of this provision.

It would seem pretty clear from the foregoing that as the current legal entity playing as The Rangers Football Club cannot play in UEFA competition for three years. (See announcement at  http://www.itv.com/news/update/2012-06-12/rangers-forced-into-liquidation/ by Duff and Phelps)  that UEFA must have judged that the alteration in legal form reported to them by the SFA , would be to the detriment of the integrity of UEFA’s competitions and so that alteration was deemed to be an interruption of membership of the entity undergoing liquidation.

The question that arises in terms of what type of legal entity is undergoing liquidation is

Were RFC considered a legal entity under a) or b) of Article 12 above?

Now whilst Sir David Murray owned Rangers and MIH all supporters would argue that there was never in the public consciousness the notion that MIH owned and operated Rangers under a contractual relationship between both.

Supporters of all clubs, including their own, believed that before liquidation Rangers were a standalone club under a) of Article 12.

If there are documents that support b) why have they not surfaced? That is not to say they are not now a different kind of legal entity under b) following the purchase of their assets and the clear division that has been set between Rangers International Football Club and The Rangers Football club, but did this club/company arrangement exist as defined at b) before 2012?

The SFA could provide the answer by revealing what they told UEFA in either June 2012 when a CVA was rejected or October 2012 when Administration was formerly ended.

The SFA are governed by ANNEX I: Exceptions policy.Para 1(d) refers

A. Principle

1. The UEFA administration may, in accordance with Article 4, grant exceptions on

the following matters:

a) Non-applicability of a minimum requirement concerning the decision-making

bodies or process defined in Article 7 due to national law or any other

reason;

b) Non-applicability of a minimum requirement concerning the core process

defined in Article 9 due to national law or any other reason;

c) Non-applicability of a minimum assessment procedure defined in Article 10

due to national law or any other reason;

d) Non-applicability of the three-year rule defined in Article 12(2) in case of

change of legal form or company structure of the licence applicant on a case by-

case basis;

e) Non-applicability of a certain criterion defined in part II, chapter 3 due to

national law or any other reason;

f) Extension of the introduction period for the implementation of a criterion or a

category of criterion defined in part II, chapter 3.

2. Exceptions related to items a), b), c), e) and f) are granted to a UEFA member

association and apply to all clubs which are registered with the UEFA member

association and which submit a licensing application to enter the UEFA club

competitions. Exceptions related to item d) are granted to the individual club that

applies for a licence.

3. An exception is granted for a period of one season. Under specific

circumstances this period may be extended and the UEFA member association

may be placed on an improvement plan.

4. A renewal of the exception is possible upon a new request.

Under 1(d) above The SFA could have applied for exemption from Article 12 but as a 3 year exile was deemed necessary the SFA either did not make a case or had a case rejected. It is unlikely even the SFA would have made a case, especially if they had to do so in October 2012 when Administration ended and TRFC were playing in the bottom tier of Scottish football!

B. The process (paras 4 and 5 refer).

1. The UEFA administration acts as the first instance decision-making body on

exception requests.

2. An exception request must be in writing, clear and well founded.

3. Exceptions related to items defined under A(1)(a, b, c, e and f) must be

submitted by the UEFA member association to the UEFA administration by the

deadline communicated by the latter.

4. Exceptions related to the item defined under A(1)(d) can be submitted at any

time. A licensor notified of the reorganisation or restructuring of an affiliated club

(e.g. change of legal form, merger of clubs, split of club, liquidation or

bankruptcy) is responsible for notifying the UEFA administration accordingly as

soon as it becomes aware of it.

5. The UEFA administration uses the necessary discretion to grant any exception

within the limits of these regulations.

6. The status and situation of football within the territory of the UEFA member

association will be taken into account when granting an exception. This

encompasses, for example:

a) size of the territory, population, geography, economic background;

b) size of the UEFA member association (number of clubs, number of registered

players and teams, size and quality of the administration of the association,

etc.);

c) the level of football (professional, semi-professional or amateur clubs);

d) status of football as a sport within the territory and its market potential

(average attendance, TV market, sponsorship, revenue potential, etc.);

e) UEFA coefficient (association and its clubs) and FIFA ranking;

f) stadium ownership situation (club, city/community, etc.) within the

association;

g) support (financial and other) from the national, regional and local authorities,

including the national sports ministry.

7. The decision will be communicated to the UEFA member association. The

decision must be in writing and state the reasoning. The UEFA member

association must then communicate it to all licence applicants concerned.

8. Appeals can be lodged against decisions made by the UEFA administration or, if

applicable, the UEFA Executive Committee in writing before the Court of

Arbitration for Sport (CAS) in accordance with the relevant provisions laid down

in the UEFA Statutes.

It would be informative to actually know what the SFA reported to UEFA.  Did the SFA seek to make an exception or was the liquidation seen by UEFA as nothing more than an attempt by a club to shed its debt and carry on as before to the detriment to the integrity of UEFA’s competitions? 

How much did the SFA and SPL’s failed attempt to parachute the new legal entity that was “The Rangers FC” into the top tier of the SPL, an attempt thwarted by supporters of all other clubs in Scotland, influence what the SFA told UEFA about Rangers liquidation?

Why are the SFA not treating the issue as UEFA have done to protect the integrity of domestic competition?

Why no equivalent of Article 12 of UEFA FPP in SFA Articles to deter the type of skulduggery that has not only damaged healthy recovery at Ibrox but has also created the perception of – at worst – corrupt governance or – at best – not fit for purpose governance.

Finally, and going back to the two types of legal entity that UEFA recognise as legitimate applicants for a UEFA licence:

When Rangers applied for a UEFA licence from say 2009 to 2011, did they do so as an applicant under Article 12 legal entity a) or legal entity b)?

– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/asa-the-different-entity-uefa-rules/#sthash.lZYiPx2b.dpuf

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easyJamboPosted on4:48 pm - Feb 10, 2016


@ John Clark – I have confirmed with Grant Russell that Ashley v SFA at the Court of Session re Kings FPP status is not scheduled for tomorrow as he had advised previously, but has been put back to 28 April.  It might save you a wasted journey.

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neepheid

neepheidPosted on4:57 pm - Feb 10, 2016


paddy malarkey 10th February 2016 at 3:51 pm #Also, while I’m awake, if MA/SD take full ownership of RR, what are the effects does the giving of notice on the 7 year deal have ? Thanks in advance
================
The full terms of the agreements between TRFC and Sports Direct are not in the public domain. We only know about the 7 year notice period because someone leaked that juicy titbit to the press. There is some detail provided in the AIM admission document, but  clearly not the full details. 
I would guess (but it’s only a guess) that the 7 year notice period on the Retail deal would survive if SD took over RR entirely. However I have no idea what happens to the worldwide IP licence held by RR once the Retail 7 year notice period expires. That licence appears to be subject to a separate agreement. I have no way of knowing whether there is a separate (or any) notice period for the IP agreement, or whether it simply ends with the Retail deal.. 

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ReiverPosted on4:58 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Let me respond to a few of the posts,
Who am I? Well , an Edinburgh born and bred incomer to the Scottish Borders, my spiritual home. Retired IT professional in his late sixties. almost old enough to have seen his team,Hibs, win the Scottish Cup.
And that, at this stage, is about as much as I wish to divulge. Why? Because of the same reason that some are reticent to sign the petition, it makes you a target. Signing the petition though can be totally anonymous as the site accepts nom de plumes. You will only be allowed to sign once though unless you monkey around with your cookies(that isn’t innuendo).
My trust has to be as much in the signatories as theirs in me because, if the petition were to start taking off, then someone has to front the actions and I guess that would be me. The first communications with UEFA, SFA, SPFL and the clubs was only informing them that a petition was under way so no name was given. At the 5000 mark that has to change. Any volunteers? 02
The other point the comes up regularly is that a petition is not the way, that a protest or boycott is what is needed. I have seen this suggested numerous times through the last few years but it is always a case of wishing that someone else organises it. There again I understand why. It is as before, someone has to put themselves out on the firing line and that can be pretty dodgy as we have seen. This cause is seen by the Ibrox faithful as a cover for anti-Rangers haters to take it out on them. This despite the fact that, had this been done five years ago, most of what they have been through would not have happened.
I am not the step forward kind of a guy so when I eventually decided to do something then the petition was the most likely to provide anonymity until it could be seen that there were enough getting involved to warrant taking a risk. Things like boycotts can easily be pinned on to the actions of the petition if enough support is forthcoming. Call a boycott and, if the response is the same as has been for the petition, then you have undermined your goal. There would be no point in calling another one any time closely following the first. In the same way, there will be no point in starting another petition in the foreseeable future.
All I can say is look on the petition as a rallying point where the reticent, like myself, can make there voices heard. If we get enough signatures it can be used as a lever with UEFA, the non-Scots media and the politicians.
At the very worst it is better than nothing and that, despite the internet gripes, is all that was on offer.
Support the petition.
https://www.change.org/p/scottish-football-association-return-integrity-to-football-administration-in-scotland-94421b40-2d6b-4d4b-9cff-912c9849478f

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AuldheidPosted on5:29 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Reiver
Don’t get disheartened. The only thing keeping a lid on matters is the full extent of what has happened and continues to happen is not realised by the wider public because msm refused to touch what is now evidence in the indictments.
That provides temporary shelter until the trials are over as does waiting for a decision on whether leave to appeal the latest decision on BTC ebts is granted. If it is then it’s more wait and see. If it isn’t hold on to your seat belt. You are by no means alone in seeking reform of the SFA. 
Just keep focus on the issue and try and open up as many communication channels as you can. Call a meeting of Hibees  to form a pressure group in readiness for ST renewal time. By then we  can make ST purchase conditional on SFA reconstruction with supporters having an input and with some credible oversight in place. 

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on5:32 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Thanks, Auldheid and neepheid for those responses .

Furralaff
https://www.commonspace.scot/articles/3448/police-scotland-call-for-beyonc-extradition-for-offensive-behaviour-at-football

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TheGamesABogeyPosted on6:28 pm - Feb 10, 2016


OK so that’s the petition signed. Curious as to why they are asking for street address and postcode. The last one of these I signed, only asked for the postcode and that was just a fortnight ago.

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ReiverPosted on6:34 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Good man bogey, Ta.
The address business is strange but I suppose they are trying to count out bogus signatures. A vain attempt if you ask me.

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John ClarkPosted on7:17 pm - Feb 10, 2016


easyJambo 10th February 2016 at 4:48 pm
‘..@ John Clark – I have confirmed with Grant Russell that Ashley v SFA at the Court of Session re Kings FPP status is not scheduled for tomorrow as he had advised previously, but has been put back to 28 April. It might save you a wasted journey.’
_________
Thanks, eJ. 
I was looking forward to it as well, curious to hear just what SA enquiries were made that enabled the SFA to arrive at what I think most of us would consider a really perverse decision!

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Jingso.JimsiePosted on7:49 pm - Feb 10, 2016


A wee reminder from 06.02.15:

http://www.lse.co.uk/share-regulatory-news.asp?shareprice=RFC&ArticleCode=81ca0qto&ArticleHeadline=Requisitioned_General_Meeting

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smartie1947Posted on8:43 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Liverpool fans have won their dispute with the Club’s owners tonight. After the walkout on Saturday over the introduction of the £77 ticket” for next season, the Club have withdrawn that ticket, frozen all prices for the next two seasons and introduced a £9 ticket for seats at certain matches.
Are there lessons we can draw on here in our fight against the SFA?

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wottpiPosted on8:51 pm - Feb 10, 2016


Never mind Liverpool, I see that big bad Mr Ashley’s club announced a ticket price frreeze and significant reductions in kids prices yesterday.
Given the aversion to all things MA/SD I guess we won’t see DCK following suit down Govan Way.
Maybe his supporters will be asking to out do the SD supremo by calling for their club to reduce ticket prices for all punters next season?

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ThomTheThim

ThomTheThimPosted on9:02 pm - Feb 10, 2016


smartie1947,
The obvious lesson is the power of the pound.
It was effective in 2012 and would  be again.
Good place to start would be the SFA cup ties and take it forward to ST renewal time.
However Je Suis SFA thinks the fans haven’t the stomach for the fight.

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on9:20 pm - Feb 10, 2016


My TRFC-supporting daughter just showed me their fixtures for the start of March .
Mon 7th v Hibs  19.45 Away
Fri 11th v Morton  19.45 Home
Fri 18th v Falkirk 19.45 Away
She can’t make any of them .

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ZilchPosted on11:24 pm - Feb 10, 2016


A blog from Mark Frankland on how English football is being priced out of the reach of ordinary football fans and how Liverpool fans are reacting to dodgy owners hiking the prices sky high. 

http://marksimonfrankland.blogspot.co.uk/2016/02/enough-is-enough-you-greedy-bastards.html

Fair play to the LFC fans and to Mark for the excellent article.

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John ClarkPosted on12:51 am - Feb 11, 2016


abigboydiditandranaway 10th February 2016 at 2:00 pm
‘….I am the poster who knew the Castlemilk pharmacist ….’
__________
abbdiara. I’m  delighted at that news! When you next communicate with him, please pass on my regards.

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