Launch of SFSA Fans’ Survey

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Launch of SFSA Fans’ Survey

LAUNCH OF THE FIRST INDEPENDENT EVALUATION OF SCOTTISH FOOTBALL GOVERNANCE BY THE SCOTTISH FOOTBALL SUPPORTERS ASSOCIATION (SFSA)

 

Representatives from various fan groups, including the Scottish Football Monitor took up the invitation to the above event which is largely self-explanatory. The scene was set with the following agenda

 

 

 

 

Media Briefing.

SURVEY TO SET BENCHMARK FOR FUTURE EVALUATION OF NATIONAL GAME

 WHEN:                             Thursday, 20TH July 2017 at 11AM

WHERE:                           Scottish Parliament – Committee Room 4

WHO                                Simon Barrow (Chair of the SFSA), Henry McLeish (Board member of the SFSA), Richard Leonard MSP (member of Scottish Parliament for Central Scotland and host of event) and Dr Joachim Lammert (The Department of Sports Economics and Sports Management at the University of Leipzig)

 

The first independent evaluation of Scottish football governance will be launched by The Scottish Football Supporters Association (SFSA).

 

The SFSA’s nationwide survey will assess, for the first time, supporters’ views on the current position of the game, including the performance of the game’s governing bodies in Scotland.  The research will become an annual benchmarking & reporting exercise looking at all aspects of the game.

 

The SFSA’s online survey has been created in partnership with Prof. Dr. Axel Faix and Dr. Joachim Lammert, two experienced German academics who have undertaken similar evaluations on a national level in Germany and on a European level on topics including 50+1 (German football’s rules that a parent club must own at least 50% plus one share of the football company) and Financial Fair Play.  Their research has been backed by Football Supporters Europe and by German fans organisation, Unsere Kurve.

 

Fans will also be able to provide comment on their own club’s performance.

 

The SFSA, whose board includes former First Minister Henry McLeish; former MP and MSP Cathy Jamieson and Maureen McGonigle, Founder of Scottish Women in Sport and first female Scottish FA Council Member, has over 67,000 members supporting clubs across Scotland.

 

The SFSA is Scotland’s fans’ representative in The Football Supporters Europe network (FSE), an independent, representative and democratically organised grass-roots network of football fans’ in Europe with members in currently 48 countries across the continent.

 

The SFSA might be best thought of as movement appearing at a time when Scottish Football supporters are desperately seeking an alternative to the attitudes and events that have seen our game at best stand still and at worst decline, as changes in the way football has grown as a global industry  have left us marooned on our own small patch of God’s earth.

 

If the two maxims that

  • a problem cannot be solved by the mind that created it and
  • if you cannot manage (and therefore improve) what you cannot measure

are true, then the SFSA professional idea to making change happen offers a different approach to the past by introducing new thinking and using tested scientific metrics on a survey model used successfully in Germany, where the game is light years ahead of Scotland’s by any measure.

The arrival of this movement is crucial, and in the words of SFSA Board member Henry McLeish, ex footballer and former First Minister of Scotland; “Scottish Football is at a Watershed”.

Few if any who love our game would argue with that. We love football because it is in our blood, it plays a key part in the social interplay of Scottish society and it is too important not to now say  “Enough!”

It is clear that the medicine of the past, an approach to the game which excludes it’s life blood, (no wonder it is ill) is no longer efficacious – if indeed it ever was.

To continue with that same prescription would fall foul of that other maxim; “Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result”.

Thus the SFSA, who are independent of current Scottish football authorities (SFA/SFL), offer an opportunity to break that insane cycle by offering a new approach, which sees it’s first duty as asking the fans what they think, and they are seeking to do exactly that by enacting a comprehensive nationwide survey of fans’ views and attitudes. The survey, created by a team of research academics at Leipzig University will present, in a cohesive way, the views and thoughts of Scottish football fans concerning the health of the game in Scotland through their own own clubs, the SPFL, and the SFA .

The higher the number who complete the survey and articulating their views, the more weight and authority the survey’s outcomes will carry when the SFSA presents them to current authority and government.

 

SFM hopes that as many people as possible will take part in an exercise that offers real hope of change by clicking below

https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/sfsa-benchmark-2017

and visit the SFSA page at

http://scottishfsa.org/have-your-say-now/

where the survey is explained and you can join the SFSA individually.

 

This may be our last chance as lovers of Scottish football to restore its integrity and trust in our football authorities who have lost sight of those values in pursuit of commercial concerns.

 

To the cynics whose past experience of calling for change discourages them (and who can blame them for it’s taken lifetimes) one last maxim.

 

If you don’t buy a ticket, you don’t win the lottery.

 

Roll Up, Roll Up https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/sfsa-benchmark-2017

Big Pink Comment:

Like Auldheid, I am encouraged by the birth of the SFSA and its determination to procure the views of supporters. There are enough people involved in the initiative with clear views about the harm that inherent self-interest on the part of the clubs has brought to our game.

I was less encouraged by the conciliatory tone of Henry McLeish, in public at least, towards those in power at Hampden. For example he said that Scottish football folk viewed outside bodies with suspicion, and that was often understandable.

My take is that they only view anyone wishing to become proactive with that suspicion (and fear). They have never viewed my cash with anything other than hungry eyes, far less suspicion.

The feeling in the room, when less formal discussion was taking place, was that the authorities and the clubs have refused to take fans’ views into account for too long.

Governance (particularly the lack of and the ‘making it up as we go’ varieties), FFP and Strict Liability were all subjects of those discussions. These are all nettles that MUST be grasped in public, and the sooner the better, if fans’ views are to be properly reflected.

I am hopeful that the weight of dissatisfaction I expect to see as a result of this ambitious survey will compel a change in tone by McLeish and his colleagues.

One final note of concern is that a group like SFSA, which after all hopes to represent fans at the top table, appears to have a board overly comprised of folk from the political, business and academic spheres. Some grass roots participation is vital moving forward. Hopefully that is also on the agenda.

About the author

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Auldheid author

Celtic fan from Glasgow living mostly in Spain. A contributor to several websites, discussion groups and blogs, and a member of the Resolution 12 Celtic shareholders' group. Committed to sporting integrity, good governance, and the idea that football is interdependent. We all need each other in the game.

629 Comments so far

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easyJamboPosted on2:49 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Homunculus July 24, 2017 at 14:27 
EASYJAMBO JULY 24, 2017 at 11:54 ================================
Are you sure it’s the EBT which caused that debt, rather than the film scheme he “invested” in. 
As I understood the situation they would be given the opportunity to repay the money they got via the EBT, or pay the tax on it. Clearly paying the tax would be the cheaper option.
========================
I’m sure that the action taken by Ferguson will have been the direct result of an assessment re the Film Scheme.  However, I would guess that he have taken financial and legal advice, with the likelihood of an EBT assessment also coming along soon, so he has taken the logical (and pre-emptive) step of going down the bankruptcy route in order to insulate him from further claims over the next two or three years.

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jimboPosted on2:55 pm - Jul 24, 2017


It’s difficult to know what their intentions are with a review.  It could be an initial discussion of the SPFL board to decide how to go forward with this.  Hopefully it will mean a full blown independent review of LNS without any of the previous panel involved.  Call them as witnesses fine but no more than that.

It’s ironic that this comes about as Peter Lawwell leaves and The Rangers are back on board. 

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jimboPosted on3:03 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Barry Ferguson only has £3k of assets?  Yet he lives in a gated mansion near Larkhall!  (Clyde Valley?)  He used to own a large share in the Popinjay Hotel in the Clyde Valley too, don’t know if he still does.

A bit of speculation as you would expect about transferring property and interests over to e.g. his wife.  Who knows?  But if he has and it is relatively recent that won’t stop HMRC going after their dues.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on3:15 pm - Jul 24, 2017


JIMBOJULY 24, 2017 at 15:03
Barry Ferguson only has £3k of assets?  Yet he lives in a gated mansion near Larkhall!  (Clyde Valley?)  He used to own a large share in the Popinjay Hotel in the Clyde Valley too, don’t know if he still does.
A bit of speculation as you would expect about transferring property and interests over to e.g. his wife.  Who knows?  But if he has and it is relatively recent that won’t stop HMRC going after their dues.
     —————————————————————————————————
   There might be more than a few WAGS filing for divorce soon Jimbo.   19

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jimboPosted on3:38 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Done a bit of digging about there (a la EJ)  According to the Herald Barry bought into the Popinjay Hotel in 2009 with a 20% share.  Clyde Valley Developments were the owners.  However the said company went into liquidation in 2015.  Had a look at Companies House and from what I can see Bazza was never a director.  So a good chance he doesn’t have that asset anymore.  Lucky Barry! King Midas in reverse.

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easyJamboPosted on4:16 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Chris McLaughlin‏Verified account @BBCchrismclaug 3m3 minutes ago   Hearts owner and SPFL board member Ann Budge says a statement on Wednesday re Rangers and EBTs.
My understanding is very unlikely SPFL will push for further action re #Rangers and EBTs. Legal advice sought. Statement on Wednesday.

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SmugasPosted on4:37 pm - Jul 24, 2017


My guess would be “legally constrained, would if we could etcetc’

Id like to think a vote of no confidence in Regan and especially Doncaster might be thrown to the Bampots as a token gesture.

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jimboPosted on4:39 pm - Jul 24, 2017


So they are going to make an announcement 2 days later?  Sounds to me like they have already made up their mind.

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easyJamboPosted on5:10 pm - Jul 24, 2017


jimbo July 24, 2017 at 15:38 
Done a bit of digging about there (a la EJ)  According to the Herald Barry bought into the Popinjay Hotel in 2009 with a 20% share.  Clyde Valley Developments were the owners.  However the said company went into liquidation in 2015.  Had a look at Companies House and from what I can see Bazza was never a director.  So a good chance he doesn’t have that asset anymore.  Lucky Barry! King Midas in reverse.
=====================
Ferguson’s Directorships from Companies House records

WRP DRYVAC LLP (OC308171) – Dissolved – LLP Member
TAXI TECHNOLOGY LIMITED LIABILITY PARTNERSHIP (OC304216) – Liquidation – LLP Member
ECLIPSE FILM PARTNERS NO. 9 LLP (OC316490) – Active – LLP Member Resigned Apr 2014
GLENSILLOCH LIMITED (SC259901) – Active – Resigned Apr 2014
CLYDE VALLEY INVESTMENTS LIMITED (SC350813) – Active – Resigned July 2013
CLYDEVALLEY KINDERGARTEN LIMITED (SC219513) – Active – Resigned May 2013
A.D.O.K. PROPERTIES LIMITED (SC200682) – Dissolved – Resigned Aug 2008

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HaywirePosted on5:23 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Fellow Bampots,
I posted the message below a couple of days ago.  However, unless I have missed it in a the haze of a red wine mist, I have yet to receive a response.  Now that it would appear that something has stirred (I shall put it no more strongly than that!) at the SPFL, I really, really would like to contact my club and my doubting pals with a detailed list of the various nefarious activities inflicted on Scottish Fitba’ by a combination of the Ibrox shapechangers/SFA/SPL/SPFL/ over recent years – surely somebody has kept a comprehensive list?!

I have signed the various petitions regarding the Rangers/SFA/SPL/SPFL cheating so far, and I shall shortly be filling in the SFSA Survey.  Due to a rather busy diary in the last week or two, I have yet to contact my club, Killie, over the Rank Bajins, but that will also follow. However, I am having some difficulty remembering ALL the various calumnies inflicted on Scottish fitba’ by those permanent embarassments and occasional disgraces at Ibrox and Hampden over twenty years or so. I am aware that some of our bloggers have assembled the opposite of a brownie points list (blue points?) with regard to the miscreants of our game, but am having trouble finding one which is reasonably up to date. Could some kind person point me at a relevant and recent list, please? Regards to all!

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on5:25 pm - Jul 24, 2017


causaludendiJuly 24, 2017 at 10:58  
AllyJambo, the SPFL came into being 2013 with a ‘merger’ between the SPL and the SFL. This resulted in the dissolution of SFL and all member clubs coming under the banner of the newly renamed SPFL – it is the same company number as the SPL. Therefore all member clubs (should that be big C?!) were now subject to the rules of the SPFL whether they were in the Premiership, Championship, league 1 or League 2. Was this another sleight of hand? In my opinion, which is worth next to hee-haw, of course it was. As well as being a power grab by the commercial-istas who were no doubt alarmed by the Turnbull Hutton effect and the fan revolt. Power was centralised for a reason – we are all aware of the fact that should 2012 happen again, to any member club, the right to re-admit lies at committee level as opposed to going to a free vote.Apologies, got sidetracked and went on something of a tangent there.
______________________–

Thanks, Causa, for pointing out my faux pas regarding the continuation of the SFL, my excuse can only be that I was rushing before heading off to work14

Regardless, though, they did enter the SFL, so for their first year were in a league that did not have rules that could be twisted to suggest TRFC should be treated as ‘Rangers’, and once not ‘Rangers’, they could never, ever be ‘Rangers’. I’ve always thought that was such a fatal flaw in their plan, and perhaps part of what made entry into the SPL so important to them. 

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goosygoosyPosted on5:32 pm - Jul 24, 2017


JIMBO
JULY 24, 2017 at 14:55
It’s difficult to know what their intentions are with a review.  It could be an initial discussion of the SPFL board to decide how to go forward with this.  Hopefully it will mean a full blown independent review of LNS without any of the previous panel involved.  Call them as witnesses fine but no more than that.
It’s ironic that this comes about as Peter Lawell leaves and The Rangers are back on board. 
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Peter Lawell is the only person to come out of this entire saga with his integrity intact
He has none

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on5:39 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Did she really say that would be the end of it?…….That was a quick stripping.

https://twitter.com/NeilCameron5/status/889504106414563333

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ZilchPosted on5:49 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Tick…

Tock…

Tick…

The hands of the clock turn wearisome slow for those that wait for justice.

But turn they do, and time presses inexorably forward. A blind, crushing force that sweeps all before it.

My old da knew a thing or two about business and bad’uns.

He would have been like a pig in muck following this story. I would have loved to share this rollercoaster ride with him.

Today’s announcement of an SPFL review of the (ab)use of EBTs by Rangers IL raises many questions, but also offers tantalising possibilities.

What we can say at this point is watch this space – the details of the review will be crucial.

What we can also say, unequivocally, is that this is another point in the saga where the need for people of real stature to come out fighting for sporting integrity is crucial.

We will certainly learn more about where our own clubs and our representatives stand on the issue of sporting integrity.

Our only demand must be to have the rules of the game enforced fairly and without fear or favour.

In the meantime we inch ever closer to a final scene, where we find out if the villains get away with it, or if the good guys finally triumph.

Perhaps this review will not be that final scene – maybe the soap opera goes on and on with ever more bizzare twists? This is Scottish football after all – got to be a reasonable bet!

But in all of this, I am reminded of something my old da used to say frequently: he who laughs last laughs longest.

Thing is, if the bad guys win here I won’t be hanging around to hear their laughter.

The ONLY future for Scottish Football is one where they (and we) get their governance in order and deal with the failings of the past.

If the good guys win, and I hope they do, our victory will be knowing that our sport has been saved and we can pass it on to our children and grandchildren with a clear conscience.

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SmugasPosted on5:55 pm - Jul 24, 2017


If they want to say “enough” then fine.  Just explain why in a coherent manner, and not with a response that is proven beyond all reasonable doubt to be complete sh!te on here within minutes of saying it.

if she wants to call our bluff with “move on just cos” with no litigants whatsoever then hell mend them all!

(I actually typed mitigants but I prefer spellchecks version!)

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on5:56 pm - Jul 24, 2017


jimbo July 24, 2017 at 14:55 

It’s difficult to know what their intentions are with a review.  It could be an initial discussion of the SPFL board to decide how to go forward with this.  Hopefully it will mean a full blown independent review of LNS without any of the previous panel involved.  Call them as witnesses fine but no more than that. It’s ironic that this comes about as Peter Lawwell leaves and The Rangers are back on board. 
___________________

I know it’s most likely a mere slip of your keyboard, Jimbo, but I am certain that TRFC have never had anybody ‘on board’14 to be back

Should this review be any more than the regulation Scottish football eyewash, then Robertson’s position might be difficult, for he must, surely, either excuse himself (as an, ahem, interested party), or remain to influence the review as an non-conflicted board member.

If nothing else, by announcing this review, the SPL have tacitly acknowledged that the Supreme Court decision has impacted on the LNS decision. It will be interesting to see if they even attempt to justify not revisiting the decision if they show that they remain the craven cowards that have always adorned Scottish football’s governance boardroom, in the event that they announce no further action!

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wottpiPosted on6:04 pm - Jul 24, 2017


A though came across me after Stewart Milne’s chat with the press and while awaiting what Anne Budge and the SPFL have to say.
Scottish Football and mainly the fans cannot move on until a line is drawn in the sand. 
The LNS farce is clearly inadequate but the Stewart Milnestance is equally so.
Perhaps the answer is a Mandela style truth and reconciliation approach.
To Rangers and DCK – Do you stand by your statements of previous years where you said the club needed to say sorry if found guilty of not paying taxes by the courts? Yes or No?
To all SPFL chairmen/women. Do you agree that in relation to running the DOS and EBT schemes and not revealing player payments to the footballing authorities, the actions and behaviours of Rangers were  way below those expected of one of our oldest and established clubs and this has tarnished the games reputation. Yes or No?
Simples:-)

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on6:05 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Looks like Ann Budge has been sent out to be the first mouthpiece of the whitewash! I won’t be surprised if there now follows a PR piece tomorrow to continue the preparation for the screwing of Non-establishment football club supporters…again!

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bigboab1916Posted on6:18 pm - Jul 24, 2017


My humble understanding is there is only one thing to consider for the SPFL and it is did the old club Rangers use a scheme to enable players to have a tax free scheme in place and did this due to the hidden side letters create a promise to pay players which in effct creates a contract.
Was this contract a dual contract now that the SC has considered its evidence and has gave the decision that the payments were indeed just that, side payments and taxable. What is there to decide on we know what constitutes breaking rules, we know now that the system was known and ignored and that the LNS enquiry is now flawed therefor we are not revisiting we are applying the rules to the ols club as they should have been.Hearts fans you gave money to rescue your club for nothing you would have ben given preferential treatment and saved a few quid, clubs cannot die is the logic applied in Scotland, you do not need to uncorporate you will be given a new number and contiuation seal of approval, hahahahaha, this is the biggest joke in the history of football, what a bunch of arseholes trying it on give them nothing in return if they bend the rules and shit themselves. 
To all fans are you prepared to let this band of football people with a vested interest in their own pockets decide that it is alright to bend rules to suit their bank balances. Is there no shame and integrity in breaking the moral compass of sport which is all sports will compete on a level playing field as regards the laws of the game in place and that a nominated panel and association of rules will be in place to uphold the integrity of the sport for all.
If this is not enforced i am out of the game i will not contribute to husslers or be hussled and i will attempt to enforce my views on other members of my family and friends.All clubs who vote to allow chaeting are one in the same and all fans are sheep who allow themselves to be fleeced.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on6:21 pm - Jul 24, 2017


https://stv.tv/sport/football/1394219-spfl-will-not-re-open-inquiry-into-rangers-use-of-ebt-scheme/?utm_content=buffer90e55&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

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upthehoopsPosted on6:39 pm - Jul 24, 2017


So the SPFL appoint a  new board today, and they announce a review. Yet within hours both BBC and STV know they will do nothing.  That’s not a review even in the murky world they operate in. Speaking only as a Celtic fan I was brought up being told I was simply paranoid when I thought the authorities made decisions which disadvantaged my club. I know this affects more than Celtic, but clearly we were never paranoid enough. 

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SmugasPosted on6:41 pm - Jul 24, 2017


BigBoab @18.18

A slightly different question for me for the new board.  

How did we get from there to here, what was the motivation and (bearing in mind the game is as divided and polarised as its ever been) how successful were we?

Crucial to that question will be how much of the genuine answer will they be willing to share with us.

Similarly important is what is their response to the answer regardless of whether they share it with the bampot fraternity.  

Get packed Neil. 

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on6:42 pm - Jul 24, 2017


JIMBOJULY 24, 2017 at 15:03       11 Votes 
Barry Ferguson only has £3k of assets?  Yet he lives in a gated mansion near Larkhall!  (Clyde Valley?)  He used to own a large share in the Popinjay Hotel in the Clyde Valley too, don’t know if he still does.
————
Did he not also have an apartment that he rents out in Dubai?
don’t know if he still does.just remember it in the papers.

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on7:20 pm - Jul 24, 2017


EASYJAMBO
JULY 24, 2017 at 14:49
=================================

Thanks EJ that makes sense. 

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upthehoopsPosted on7:55 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Anyone else getting the view that SPFL statement on Wednesday will be along the lines of:

– There are lessons to be learned for us all from this (even though only one club cheated).
– Legally there is nothing we can do (there will be no detailed explanation as to why).
– We all need to pull together for the good of the game 
– The statement will avoid saying what happened was wrong. 

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causaludendiPosted on7:57 pm - Jul 24, 2017


AJ @ 17:25; unfortunately it is the pedant within me that feels a need to correct. Perhaps, nay, indeed one of the primary reasons I continue to be preoccupied with SFM is the desire to right a wrong. 

Goosy hit hit the nail squarely on the head with an earlier post about morals and fairness. That, for me, is the nub of the matter, for Rangers (RFC2012) to remain uncensured for the cheating years is unjust, and downright, bloody-well wrong. That is what sticks in my craw. Until this wrong is righted I shall remain ‘obsessed’.

Scottish football needs a strong East Fife. (And Arbroath)(and every other Scottish club, including Ryan’s TRFC, for without them we would have nothing to rail against!! (Obviously the very last comment was firmly in cheek Ryan!))

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SmugasPosted on8:02 pm - Jul 24, 2017


UTH @19.55

excuse my not so subtle edit.

– There are lessons to be learned for us all from this (even though only one club cheated)

.– Legally there is nothing we can do (there will be no detailed explanation as to why)

.– We all need to pull together for the good of the game

– The statement will avoid saying what happened happened.

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on8:03 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Mibbes why some have trouble accepting the death of a club.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-40705687

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jimboPosted on8:24 pm - Jul 24, 2017


AJ, you are of course correct that they have never been on the board of the SPFL, I thought I did well in remembering to put THE in front of Rangers and then let that slip through.  Hope one of my brothers doesn’t read that I will get skelped!  He only let’s me say Sevco!

But this ‘review’ is a kid on.  Hours later the BBC, STV & the Record can all tell us it’s a no no.  Why didn’t they just announce it today instead of building our hopes up for a couple of hours.  And leak it all to the media.  Cowards.

This is not going to go down well.  They have made matters even worse than the SFA by taking their time as if they were considering things.  Then there is mention of a review.  When all along they knew they were going to side in with the SFA. A total sham.

I blame the clubs!  Regan & Doncaster bad as they are, can only get away with this with the clubs’ approval.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on8:37 pm - Jul 24, 2017


I mentioned the other day that no one from the SPFL or the SFA has said that Rangers didn’t cheat. It will be interesting to note, assuming the anticipated Wednesday whitewash, if anyone has the brass neck to tell us that, as far as they are concerned, the use of EBTs and deliberate mis-registrations (they’d no doubt refer to it as ‘improper registrations’) does not constitute cheating.

The obvious and correct thing for any reasonable hack, reporter or journalist to do would be to ask the SPFL spokesperson, straight out, ‘did Rangers cheat?’ Then follow up with an equally obvious question or two to whatever answer is given. The SPFL spokesperson can rest assured, though, that the SMSM doesn’t have the capacity to ask questions they have not be cleared to ask!

Should someone have the guts to ask an awkward question or two, though, I do hope they remember to mention that an SFA tribunal described Rangers’ tax cheating under Whyte (which was not exacerbated by mis-registration) as ‘just short of match-fixing’, which is as close to cheating as you can get.

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jimboPosted on8:41 pm - Jul 24, 2017


At least Nimmo Smith can sleep well tonight his decision making will not be held up to ridicule.  His reputation on this matter remains intact, ha ha.  Not that he will be worried, he has already taken his 30 pieces of silver.  His name will go down in history along with quite a few other in this era of Scottish football.

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on9:16 pm - Jul 24, 2017


SFA and now the SPFL have sought legal advice from the bestest legal minds in the land.
But, as another Bampot (?) simply explained: what is higher / better than a SC judgment ?!

And we now have briefing of the obedient SMSM, a few sound bites from Chairmen and ex-players…all to soften up the paying punters before the SPFL announcement – and nobody will be surprised, IMO.

This appears to be the last opportunity for the administrators to put a cork in the EBT, UEFA licence, improper registrations, cheating etc.

Kill it stone dead and reap the wrath of the majority…or offer a sop to create confusion, but avoid a final, final decision…and play for extra time?

And you would think that the SPFL announcement should also include a carefully worded ‘regrettable’ statement from TRFC?
(I know.)

The SFA and SPFL have discussed the past, apparently, and sought external, legal advice, apparently.

They have been consistent: fans’ feedback is not required – or wanted.
The blazers STILL haven’t learned the most basic lesson from all the nonsense in recent years from Ibrox: 

LISTEN TO YOUR PAYING CUSTOMERS!

Or one day they just might ‘move on’ right enough…to another – but honest – leisure choice.
11

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ChristyboyPosted on9:26 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Well if STV’s understanding is correct does this answer Peter Lawell’s move to the SFA ? It won’t make my mind up about withdrawing support, money etc as I withdrew that long ago but I just can’t understand why not having a mechanism to review would stop you wanting to have one. The powers that be remember pulled an ” associate membership ” out of the bag. They really are, I was going to say a self serving bunch of hypocrites but there’s no doubt now that they are serving the blue pound. It’s so embarrassing. We’re a laughing stock. They would be unfit to govern the Scottish egg and spoon race championships and should be nowhere near a football ground. You have failed utterly and I hope all the fans of all football clubs tell you your time is up in the only way you’ve left us. ALL OUT !!!

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upthehoopsPosted on10:05 pm - Jul 24, 2017


Just reading there that Anne Budge said outside Hampden today ‘I doubt if we will ever please all of the fans all of the time”. 

How’ will she reconcile that statement with only one group of fans likely to be pleased? 

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on10:16 pm - Jul 24, 2017


The statement on Wednesday my go something like this.
After the SC case which found EBT’s and the way they were used to be illegal.At the time the ibrox club used them they thought they were legal,so they made a wee mistake,everyone makes mistakes.look at the GB. Oh! buy the way the old firm playing in england is back on20

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jimboPosted on10:30 pm - Jul 24, 2017


There’s something badly wrong with the governance of our game.  We have two governing bodies.  A bit of tension between the two might not be a bad thing.  But instead we have two cheeks of the same a.se.  Indeed we have interchangeable members of the boards, like Peter Lawwell ex SFA then SPFL, now back to the SFA.  There have been others.
Regan & Doncaster should not be allowed near each others organisation.  It’s all too cosy.
I haven’t thought this through as usual but I’ll tell you one change I would introduce.  For every member attending meetings where a vote will be called for, each club chairman/CEO/Director – whatever status – must be accompanied by a fan representative of the same club.  With every attendee entitled to one vote each.   Keep this clique to account, keep them in check.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on10:33 pm - Jul 24, 2017


If the statement that is put out on wednesday is a whitewash? which clown will they put in front of the camera to say it with a straight face?
Or who will draw the short straw,or will it just be a statement released to the press.

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jimboPosted on10:43 pm - Jul 24, 2017


For Regan & Doncaster read The CEO of SFA and CEO of SPFL.  It’s ridiculous that they should be allowed on each other’s boards.

Cluster One, it’s been done already it would seem!

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jimboPosted on10:53 pm - Jul 24, 2017


I’d love to see Auldheid going along with Peter Lawwell and Peter telling him how to vote!  1202  I thinks a lot of fan reps would be quite independent and could be voted on by fan organisations every couple of years, therefore held to account by the fans of their club.

Supporter Power !!!

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goosygoosyPosted on11:07 pm - Jul 24, 2017


UPTHEHOOPS JULY 24, 2017 at 18:39 So the SPFL appoint a  new board today, and they announce a review. Yet within hours both BBC and STV know they will do nothing.  That’s not a review even in the murky world they operate in. Speaking only as a Celtic fan I was brought up being told I was simply paranoid when I thought the authorities made decisions which disadvantaged my club. I know this affects more than Celtic, but clearly we were never paranoid enough.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 
Spot On
You weren`t paranoid enough
The response from the BBC and STV was deliberate positioning at the behest of whoever controls corrupt press relations at Hampden
The corrupt SPFL with its new and 100% corrupt Board and the corrupt SFA with its 100% corrupt Board have known for 5 corrupt yrs. that there is 100% corrupt support from all 42 corrupt clubs for this issue to be dealt with corruptly when the time comes
That time has come. Their corrupt game plan for disclosure of their corruption will be unfolded this week
And it will have been rehearsed and rehearsed with their corrupt stooges in the media, with their fellow Directors and with their corrupt members. No doubt there will be a hymn sheet of prepared Q&A issued to all clubs in advance with recommendations (i.e.instructions) on how and when it can be used
The announcement will be done  BLATANTLY without a blush
There will not  be the slightest effort to condemn Ranger(IL) for cheating the taxpayer and fans of other clubs for 11yrs.
There will be no reference whatsoever to removing trophies or asterisking trophies. They won’t even mention  morality or integrity or anything of the sort
These corrupt people will behave like our corrupt politicians. They paint all issues in terms of PR and cover up. Even their announcement on Wednesday or Thursday will be  timed to coincide with an important CL match at Parkhead .
Make no mistake
Irrespective of the result, this particular CL match will get additional wall to wall coverage on Thursday from the SMSM with the active cooperation of Celtic.The announcement will be buried.
Look out for all the cup final type post-match analysis with player rating and all the other garbage they feed us with to sell their corrupt rags
 Why are the SPFL and SFA doing this to their Customers?
It’s obvious 
They DONT CARE if you think they are corrupt or  call them corrupt. They DESPISE the fans who put bread in their mouth
They have a corrupt media in their pocket , a corrupt police force bending to their will, a corrupt Judiciary making outrageous decisions and a corrupt SG pandering to them as if THEY were a member of the establishment never mind the deceased cheats. And that’s why they bend disciplinary rules on and off the field when it suits them
Let’s face it
We are living in a wee bigoted , corrupt country where the people in power don`t know the difference between  good and evil. The corrupt SFA can stand proudly alongside our corrupt SG and corrupt Local Authorities in lining their pockets at our expense
As far as I`m concerned
These so called governing authorities can unveil themselves as true soldiers of  the Peepul if that`s what they think they are
But they won`t get another penny or vote from me 
The only  step that will get my support is crowdfunding an Independent Judicial Review  against  corruption in the  SFA. One that will expose the corruption in the 5WA , document the evidence of collusion with Celtic fc  to smother the Level 5 issue and collusion with TRFC to get them into the Europa League this year. And i dont want the labour party political  SAFS anywhere near this Review
Their hands aren`t clean enough to deserve my trust 
I wish I was wrong
But I` don`t think I am
When the stench of corruption poured down the Hampden terracing today,
I could smell it miles away

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on11:23 pm - Jul 24, 2017


        If the SPFL come out, (in line with AJ’s comment)  and say no action will be taken because Rangers(I.L.) never cheated, I will accept that if the explanation as to why it wasn’t cheating is satisfactory
       I they come out and say Rangers(I.L.) did cheat, but “legally” we are impotent to act, then I will demand to know what legal agreements were entered into that usurp their own rulebook….
     However I suspect we will see something more Brysonesque, along the lines of, “As we didn’t know at the time EBT’s were being used illegally…..Blah blah fecking blah….
  The moment of no choice “Industrial” action will soon be upon us………….Yeez ready?
   

 

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iceman63Posted on12:21 am - Jul 25, 2017


Perhaps the most effective and immediate course of action is for all fans of Scottish football to cancel all subscriptions with SKY and BT Sports. If even say five or ten thousand cancellations with reason given that their companies are supporters of fraud rather than football were received that may create some difficult discussions for SPFL board.
I would boycott games, but my boycott of all Scottish football has been ongoing since 2012. I think my choice has been vindicated by the inevitable subsequent squalor that Scottish Football has descended into.
My main regret is that the vast majority of my fellow supporters including every other member of my family, did not follow suit. Had the boycott been sustained in 2012 by the fans, then this disgrace would never have come to pass.

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AuldheidPosted on1:43 am - Jul 25, 2017


Cluster OneJuly 24, 2017 at 22:16 (Edit)  
The statement on Wednesday my go something like this. After the SC case which found EBT’s and the way they were used to be illegal.At the time the ibrox club used them they thought they were legal,so they made a wee mistake,everyone makes mistakes.look at the GB. Oh! buy the way the old firm playing in england is back on
=========================
If they thought they were legal did they think in 2005 the DOS EBTS were illegal so they deliberately did not reveal the DOS side letters when asked
or
there were DOS side letters but they were obscured by the BTC side letters in the files in 2005.
Just an oversight. 🙂

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HelpumootPosted on2:08 am - Jul 25, 2017


A positive boycott of ‘corporate’ football in Scotland. On a designated Saturday, fans all over Scotland go and support a local junior team. Give their hard-earned where it will actually be appreciated. 

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on4:06 am - Jul 25, 2017


What would you say if – along with an unsatisfactory SPFL statement – it was reported that Doncaster and / or Regan had resigned with immediate effect, to help ‘draw a line’ under the RFC saga?

Don’t think many Internet Bampots will see that as fundamental change, and becoming more customer focused.
But, it might buy the blazers a bit of breathing space?

Or, will the Hampden numpties just try to brass neck it – and ‘instruct’ the fans that the SPFL has decided in its great wisdom that we all just have to move on?

I think they might be seriously underestimating public outrage.

And if they cock up this decision as well, then Scottish football will suffer – and long after the Hampden buffoons have shuffled off into retirement.

“Respected and Trusted to Lead, My @rse !”

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on7:16 am - Jul 25, 2017


AULDHEIDJULY 25, 2017 at 01:43
Just an oversight.
—–
We can’t punish them for an oversight. What! we can…oh Dear, look over there buy the way the old firm playing in england is back on20

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upthehoopsPosted on7:18 am - Jul 25, 2017


According to the back page of today’s Metro Wednesday’s announcement will be in two parts. Firstly they will announce that due to legal advice received there will be no reopening of LNS and therefore no title stripping. Secondly an ‘independent’ review will be announced into how they handled the case. 

In my opinion the SPFL will not have sought independent legal advice on this matter. They will simply have asked the law firm they use for routine business. What chance that law firm told them a Judicial Review is coming down the line fast so a delaying tactic of a so called independent review might time bar it from happening. LNS was also supposed to be independent, and I mean no disrespect to LNS himself. He simply worked with the tools the SPL gave him. This will be no different. Rangers have kept their titles, and that is the only thing that matters to them, whether their reasons are bias, fear or financial.  Let’s be honest, the chances of Wednesday’s statement daring to go anywhere near the fact that withholding tax was wrong are very, very slim.  It is all about appeasing Rangers and their fans, and ergo, an easier life for the SPFL board. 

It is well known by now that influential fans are seriously progressing talks as to whether a Judicial Review is possible. I am sure they will be ready for the pathetic nonsense we are going to be fed on Wednesday. Getting these charlatans in front of a Judge under oath is our only hope. 

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SmugasPosted on7:56 am - Jul 25, 2017


Whilst I have the same sense of foreboding as most I will at least do them the courtesy of seeing their response first.

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HighlanderPosted on8:07 am - Jul 25, 2017


I’ve said for a long time that the football authorities will do sweet FA about Rangers cheating because they’ll have inserted a legally binding clause in the five-way agreement stipulating no action can be taken over EBTs, and that’s exactly how things are panning out.
 
Let’s just pause and consider that for a moment. Five years ago, our football authorities, including but not restricted to Campbell Ogilvie, SFA President, EBT recipient and former Director on the Board of Rangers Football Club, had the sheer audacity to subvert future natural justice by removing the ability to achieve restitution or apply an appropriate sanction if and when the Ibrox club was found guilty of breaches of their rules at a later date, regardless of the magnitude of that rule-breaking.
 
That is utterly corrupt! For that alone, those involved ought to be banished from football governance for life. Indeed, they ought to be in the dock facing charges themselves!
 
Somebody rightly mentioned earlier that the football authorities can somehow manage to circumvent their own rules and regulations when it suits their agenda (eg the issuing of a temporary license to play).

Well how about instead of their highly paid legal advisor telling them what they can’t do, he earns his corn by telling them what they can do. If they can’t revisit LNS, what about a brand new commission for example? Where there’s a will, there’s a way.  

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The_SteedPosted on8:39 am - Jul 25, 2017


Highlander – there’s the problem…  There is no will

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FinlochPosted on8:46 am - Jul 25, 2017


We’re in another premeditated programme of fan misinformation, corralling, kettling, and blind-sighting.

Where necessary we’ll see delaying tactics to protect the football business in Scotland from the feared outfall that might erupt if there was indeed an honest review of what happened at SDM’s club and on the decisions made by the SFA and SPL in 2011-2012 in their blind panic to move on.

They all know the fans want an honest review.

They also all know we don’t believe that can or will happen by anything undertaken the self protecting SFA and SPFL.

So we are currently being nagumbied that the SPL has been taking legal advice, that an announcement will be made tomorrow, and according to Ms Budge that it has been “Thoroughly looked at” and that not all fans will be happy.
In PR Made Simple text book fashion they have also already leaked most or all of what they are going to say tomorrow to soften us up until they tell us they can’t do anything.

As I write this Phil on BBC Shortbread is bombarding me with his take on the “facts” that they have taken very high level advice now and before with Nimmo Smith so they must have the weight of the law in justifying doing nothing, much.

Its just another confirmation of how our club chairmen and their two trade associations see and indeed treat their stakeholders, us the fans.

So here is an open message to them all.

Ms Budge, et al (in both the SFA and ESPL) 

This will not go away until it is revisited properly and honestly.

By an independent review.

A real independent review – not a Regan and Doncaster charade.

  

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on9:45 am - Jul 25, 2017


Monday’s fiasco from SPFL came as no shock.  Okay they say all will be made clearer on Wed so let us wait and see what happens (really). Already the BBC and STV news have stated that any further action against any idea of title stripping is very unlikely. They just stated it as a matter of fact without questioning the basis of why and how new evidence is irrelevant.  Since SC verdict I have not heard any smsm state that RFC (IL) cheated, as this is exactly what they have done. They cannot say it just like the problem of them saying liquidation, it sticks in their craw. We just want a sport to stay a sport, so they cheated and if the SFA and SPFL both agreed with the fact RFC played players illegally and removed all winning trophies over this period then we would have our sport back. So why can they not follow the rules, surely the past has told them that football in Scotland can survive by playing the game fairly.  Are they scared of the blue pounds fans?  Really what can the fans of the new Ibrox club do if titles are stripped/removed from the record books? What is the main reason for not sticking to the rules as now all the facts are there, from Mr Murray in the high court to the panel of the SC. There must be a reason for not wanting to apply the rules fair and square.  This is why an outside independent review has to take place, to look at the whole corrupt governing body from 2012 to the present day..

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on9:46 am - Jul 25, 2017


HIGHLANDERJULY 25, 2017 at 08:07

Well how about instead of their highly paid legal advisor telling them what they can’t do, he earns his corn by telling them what they can do. If they can’t revisit LNS, what about a brand new commission for example? Where there’s a will, there’s a way.  
__________

There is, I’d suggest, a more serious charge awaiting, if that will were to miraculously exist, that is made possible by the fact that the players’ registrations were deemed valid by LNS. Just turn the whole matter on it’s head and accept the players were registered, but the rules were broken by Rangers paying the players outwith their registered contracts.

Imagine for a moment that the EBTs didn’t exist, but Rangers still paid their players large sums of money hidden from the football authorities, and HMRC, then the player’s registration would not have been an issue, it would merely have been a question of, did Rangers break the rules of Scottish football by making payments to players outwith their registered contracts? There can be no doubt that they did, for it has already been established in various courts that these payments were made, and payments outside a player’s contract is a definite no no, it says so in the rules.

Every one of us was blindsided by the EBT element of Rangers’ cheating, for they quite simply made large payments to players outwith their contracts, and that is a very straightforward and serious case of rule breaking, exacerbated, of course, by the use of a method of payment that has, itself, been shown to be illegal!

I also wonder how close making an offer of a large amount of money to a player to ‘sign for us’ comes to being a bribe, and therefor criminal! It must come pretty close.

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John ClarkPosted on10:12 am - Jul 25, 2017


goosygoosyJuly 24, 2017 at 23:07
‘…..They DONT CARE if you think they are corrupt or call them corrupt..’
_________________
We need to keep in mind that the ‘they’ are (mostly) those who sit on the boards of our 41 small-to -medium sized  Scottish businesses (called football clubs).
I find it almost unbelievable that so many busines-men / -women in our various communities should be prepared
first,  to accept meekly and without fuss  having been  hugely cheated by a fellow businessman in the same line of business over many years,
secondly,to consent readily to authorising  their ‘trade association’ Boards to continue to defend and propagate a  monstrous lie which is destructive of the very nature of their businesses, namely ‘competitive Sport’
The lesson we have to draw from this is that the capacity for  deceit and corruption is not restricted only to vile, professional ‘asset-strippers’ and some of the types of truly repulsive people we have come across during the ‘saga’. 
No, indeed. Our local worthies in our local professional football clubs are every bit as vile and corrupt.
And , as you say,goosygoosy,shameless with it.
May the curse of Cromwell be on their heads, may their books (whether true or false) never again balance, and may their terrracings and stands end up as stark and bare as their bleak dishonourable hearts and the ruins of Cathkin Park as the consequences of their deceit inevitably catch up with them.

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Charlie_KellyPosted on10:28 am - Jul 25, 2017


I’d love for someone from our MSM to simply ask the SFA/SPFL the following question.
Do they regard the “Improper registration of players” over a sustained period of around 10 years, as cheating?
Depending on their answer I’d also like to know if this answer applies equally to all clubs past/present/future and if not why not?

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Higgy’s ShoesPosted on10:53 am - Jul 25, 2017


In light of my own chairpersons pre statement statement.

As of 10 mins ago, I have withdrawn my £30 a month contribution to the Foundation of Hearts.
I have emailed Tynecastle to let them know and also to intimate to them that there will be not one penny spent on “extras” at Tynie this season ie food, programme, half time draw ticket etc.

I have also let it be known that had this statement been made earlier I would not have renewed this seasons ticket.

I have also attended my last Scotland game.

There is nothing else we can do other that stop funding the corruption.

HS

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woodstein

woodsteinPosted on11:28 am - Jul 25, 2017


Apologies,  off topic but for those interested.
 
Mr Barry Ferguson MBE
“He also invested in a film production partnership called Eclipse which has been targeted by HMRC after being ruled to be a tax avoidance scheme”
 
Background
https://www.ft.com/content/bd818dfa-c059-11e5-9fdb-87b8d15baec2

“ Film schemes structured to offer big tax savings grew out of incentives introduced by Gordon Brown in 1997 and attracted thousands of wealthy and often famous subscribers.
However, after new legislation was introduced in 2014,  the investors were told they had to make immediate payment of disputed tax even before the courts had ruled on whether their schemes actually worked. A scheme can be said to have worked if the courts agree it successfully and correctly used legislation to achieve a tax saving, even if the law was not meant to be used that way.”
 
“The Revenue has argued that Eclipse 35 never carried on a trade — a pre-requisite for investors to qualify for tax reliefs — and “merely organised a sophisticated financial model involving licensing and distribution rights” in relation to the films.”
08

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bad capt madmanPosted on11:31 am - Jul 25, 2017


Higgy’s Shoes-
I fear you’re right. What a crap time for a Dons fan to hurt the club’s finances / attendances as well eh?
The alternative would be for planned walk outs during the second half etc and perhaps taking a leaf out of the apparently succesful The Rangers fans strategy – boycotts of the SPFL & SFA sponsors (and our clubs’ sponsors where possible, – although I’m not sure how I could boycott e.g. Wonga or international investment / energy companies etc).
Money talks, & money has been talking all along instead of the integrity as the authorities have actually admitted. 
It’s time for our money to start talking, and there’s no point making an ultimatum or threat and not carrying it out.
How do we organise & publicise the boycotts?

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JimmyBeeJayPosted on11:33 am - Jul 25, 2017


Hi folks,
I am disappointed that no action will be taken against Sevco/Rangers but not surprised.  The Establishment decided long ago that if they could have got away with it, there would have been no punishment at all!
The fans took them on and won, with a little help from those men called out the cheating, and who still had some morals.
It is once again up to the fans, but is the appetite still there for a fight?  I am a Celtic supporter, and I am disappointed that they have sat on their hands throughout this debacle!
If the SPL statement tomorrow does not say, what is the point in chasing for titles to be taken off a club, liquidated, and no longer in existence, then all is lost!
We cannot even say, “meet the boss, same as the old boss” as all the culprits remain in their luxury laughing at us.  
Scottish Football as a fair competition is over!  It is like The Banks and the Multi-Nationals, no one to blame.  Taxes they are for the little man!

Jaybee

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erniePosted on11:54 am - Jul 25, 2017


I despair. If it all goes as predicted on here the ST is going back, they can keep the money: if they are so desperate for cash that they’ll whore themselves to this corruption they need it more than I.
On the big picture.  We are being subjected to a joint SFA/SPFL cover up.  In the past there have been calls for a single body to cover the game in Scotland but, to me, the problem is that the two bodies need to be separate and are not operating in the correct manner.  In particular I think the SFA need to take the flack when this scandal unfolds, as it will.
As discussed on here, the SPFL is a trade organisation.  As such we could expect, but not accept, that they will act exclusively in a way to maximise profit for the members.  We can argue that they are shooting themselves in the foot but nevertheless they are entitled to shaft their customers, that is their commercial decision.  Hell mend them.
The SFA is responsible for the laws of the game and governance.  They are the second oldest FA in the world, founder members of UEFA and members of the international body that sets the laws of the game.  The world is full of Leagues and their connected trade organisations and they often chance their luck in franchising, player registering, fixture manipulation, loan scams etc etc.  The various FA’s are duty bound to keep them from phucking up our sport.  The associations are what make football a global sport not the the bunch of owners who currently own the clubs.  Shame on our SFA for shafting Scottish football, it’s in their care.
I will await the SFA stance on this scandal, I already know the SPFL “cost of everything value of nothing” driven agenda.
 

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LUGOSI

LUGOSIPosted on12:24 pm - Jul 25, 2017


Whatever tomorrow’s SPFL Statement says, given their reliance on binding authorities, it is safe to expect that the Statement will not conclude:
RIP
It may well be that the Statement will mainly be about the establishment of The Independent Investigation Into Headlines Which Would Be Likely To Induce Rage If Permarage Didn’t Exist Inquiry which will be chaired by a foreign neutral, Arlene Foster.
The Inquiry will focus on how five years have passed without the biggest scandal in sporting history being properly addressed:
Daily Record Wednesday, 13th June 2012
R.I.P. RFC
Who are these people?
Who was there at the time?
Keith Jackson?
I remember him. Guy was never off Twitter until just before the Supreme Court decision. Not a cheep since.
James Traynor?
I remember him. Got a job with Charles Green punting Snake Oil and then opened a Turd Polishing shop based in ” plush state-of-the-art offices in Blythswood Square”. You could tell it was “plush” because the official contact point was, um, a Mobile Telephone number.
We need to find out how this Romanesque, Non-Biblical headline ever saw the light of day.
More than that we need a Statement. From The Grand Orange Lodge Of Scotland. Or from Club 1872. Or from both. Separate Statements. Or maybe just the same one. Or…
Other Squirrels Today:
Former millionaire now only has three grand.
Former millionaire who formerly didn’t want to pay bills, like tax, continues to not want to pay bills, like tax.

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iceman63Posted on12:42 pm - Jul 25, 2017


I think the next step is now down to Lawwell and Celtic. They should instigate a judicial review and hand over the whole shebang of cheating evidence to UEFA. If they fail to do this, then may I suggest too the Celtic supporters who did not act as me to give Celtic an empty stadium with thousands protesting outside as the flag of shame is unfurled. The fans should then either walk away or enter once the flag ceremony is complete.

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on12:50 pm - Jul 25, 2017


If the fans have got to confront this level of cheating my concern is how many fans are aware of the who level of cheating (many fans may not be social media savvy, which is a worry). If fans have to depend on the smsm for all their information (I am aware paper sales are plummeting) then they may not have the same gut feeling as we do, or access to information the smsm do not want to print or say.  The clubs have our ST monies (although you may cancel) which they did not have back in 2012 and they had to listen to us. Fans I think would be very divided on boycotts as back to supporting my team would be the cry from many fans. Crowd funding would get my support to have an independent review. We cannot let the SFA and SPFL deal with this anymore as they are corrupt or at least conflicted in the whole issue from the start. I wonder why, someone did mention our bigoted little country in an earlier post and I believe this plays a significant part of the do not punish, same club,  relegated, going for 55, they have suffered enough, all this s*** to protect a tradition an institution a watp mentality. This would not happen to any other club apart from the Ibrox club. All fans have to realise this and again be as one and hopefully we can get rid of this corrupt attitude of letting cheats win and the people in power in our sport because the fans of the Ibrox club will be back on their high  horse and they will let you know your place in the game in Scotland and their WATP attitude will get stronger and louder and they will sure as hell let you know each time you play them that they are the number 1 club (no matter what version) in Scotland.  It is that simple. Unless someone can convince me otherwise.

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John ClarkPosted on1:22 pm - Jul 25, 2017


ernieJuly 25, 2017 at 11:54
‘…The SFA is responsible for the laws of the game and governance. They are the second oldest FA in the world, founder members of UEFA and members of the international body that sets the laws of the game. ‘
________________
The SFA [is a member ]of the international body that sets the laws of the game.

The four home Associations have 50% of the voting power, FIFA are represented but also only have 50%.

And so, our petty little SFA , with absolutely no notion of Sporting Integrity , still continues to exercise disproportionate power in the  world of football  in establishing, maintaining, monitoring and safeguarding the very ‘Laws of the Game’ ,as if they were in any way to be considered as honest brokers when ,in their own backyard ,they have so contemptuously  crapped  on the Sport by their administrative and sporting cheating.

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John ClarkPosted on1:47 pm - Jul 25, 2017


 iceman63July 25, 2017 at 12:42
‘..I think the next step is now down to Lawwell and Celtic. They should instigate a judicial review and hand over the whole shebang of cheating evidence to UEFA.’
______________
There is a step before that, I think, iceman63, and that is to bring the ‘dispute’ before the Court of Arbitration for  Sport .( Or at least check whether that body has ‘jurisdiction’ in these kind of corruption matters.Not every club escapes censure for resorting to the civil courts!)

If that is not possible, then an application for full Court of Session judicial review would be needed, to challenge the power of the Football authorities to abuse or misapply their own rules.

This might at least get the dirty five-way agreement into the open ( I’ve little doubt that the dirty deals done lie (!) at the heart of any legal advice on which the Authorities have based their refusal to deal properly with the ‘ineligibilty’ consequences.Their almost conspiratorial ‘sacred oath, sword-point’ swearing to everlasting secrecy is, I’m convinced, what makes it impossible for them to think of even letting us know the content of that ‘legal advice’ and from they received it.

They are desperately afraid of challenge.

I haven’t the money to fund such actions. I suggest that if Celtic felt rich enough to let another club bilk them out of several millions they might have the resources (as well as, NOW, if not before,  the duty, in my view) to hunt the lying authorities and drag them into the daylight , secret oaths or not!

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scottc

scottcPosted on2:39 pm - Jul 25, 2017


JIMBO
JULY 24, 2017 at 16:39 
So they are going to make an announcement 2 days later?  Sounds to me like they have already made up their mind.

It crossed my mind that they might be putting that out there to gauge reaction for a couple of days before they commit to which statement to make

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bigboab1916Posted on2:55 pm - Jul 25, 2017


https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/archives/news/77708/i-couldnt-let-us-go-bust-it-wouldve-been-a-humiliation/
“Other liabilities — even a big tax claim regarding Paul Elliott — had to be met.
“It would’ve cost less, and left the previous owners with nothing, to go into liquidation.
“But it would also be humiliating for Celtic. So we paid all the bills.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/hearts/10770603/Hearts-avoid-liquidation-after-creditors-agree-share-sale.html
“Hearts avoid liquidation after creditors agree share sale
The deal came only two weeks before Hearts would have run out of cash and been forced into liquidation. The club can now begin the process of applying for a Company Voluntary Arrangement in order to exit administration.”
 
Oh dear we have a decision coming that will virtually state that the rangers are the same club and that they will be a club going for 55 titles. Two statements above what liquidation and what a CVA achieved by one club meant.
Hearts fans have been well and truly shafted as is their creditors, as it is obvious, if you believe it is possible to survive without a CVA or survive without paying bills as the same club.  Fergus you should have kept your hand in your pocket we would have won those Mickey Mouse divisions history intact the team in the lower divisions and the only one to have won the big cup, now debt free and better still we could have repeated this scamming and got others like all the big teams and created a new league of cheats all in the same league,

Hold on is this not what we are getting on Wednesday.

Hearts fans you agree to give up your share of the creditors pot to save your club and then you discover you really did not need to as football takes care of its own in this, liquidation is for companies,  not for clubs,tut tut course silly us, you would have got your money from the assets and then could have used your share to buy a new shiny season ticket for the same gig in a different league but still with same club and debt free with all the other cheats LNS said could copy whoa what’s not to like, imagine all been in the same league forever……….

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on3:13 pm - Jul 25, 2017


HIGHLANDER
JULY 25, 2017 at 08:07
I’ve said for a long time that the football authorities will do sweet FA about Rangers cheating because they’ll have inserted a legally binding clause in the five-way agreement stipulating no action can be taken over EBTs, and that’s exactly how things are panning out…
==============================================

Such a clause may indeed be inserted in the secret 5WA, H, but if it is it could be reasonably challenged IMO.

Which organisation would have a multitude of members’ rules, yet specific organisation admin. individuals are allowed to secretly agree that a preferred member simply does not to have to comply with those rules?

The SFA & SPFL reps were acting beyond their authority, IMO.

The validity of a ‘non-title stripping’ indemnity clause could be a reasonable query – you would think – to be clarified by a JR, based on a premise that fans, [ & their member clubs?], believe they have been cheated / defrauded ?

[Admittedly, I do not know specifically how a JR works re: allowed plaintiffs, allowed scope etc.] 

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on3:45 pm - Jul 25, 2017


JIMMYBEEJAYJULY 25, 2017 at 11:33
      “How do we organise & publicise the boycotts?
  ———————————————————————————-
   By replacing apathy with inspiration, provoke, pester and anger everybody you know. Publicise all you know in a reasonable and coherent fashion. Let the corporations know why you are not availing yourself of their products and services. Let your club know. Encourage others to. Withdraw your political vote, and say why.
   I have had no reply from Ladbrokes or McDonalds…..But I know they now know.
   I have had no reply from the SFA or SPFL, and I know they have been binned unread.
   I will go out on a limb, and say I don’t think my club are finished on this. 
   Do not be palmed off by cowards, who announce a review, and then give you the finger as soon as they are on the motorway slip road….Gutless craven crooks that they are. 
    The bus will be driven, Just get aboard. We are all Jock Tamson’s bairns on this one. Lets kick some ass ! And then another, just for the hell of it. 
    Put every penny you have saved in fatburgers and bets into a central fund. It’s happening !
    
https://twitter.com/rangerstaxcase/status/889826880433422337

https://twitter.com/rangerstaxcase/status/889828362079789056

https://twitter.com/rangerstaxcase/status/889828814569656320

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easyJamboPosted on3:53 pm - Jul 25, 2017


The TRFCG/Wavetower accounts for the last five years and the Restoration to Register document requested by H&J on behalf of Law Financial can now be viewed on the Companies House Website.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/07380537/filing-history

The attached snippet from the 2016 accounts shows how the debtors/creditors now line up.

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on4:22 pm - Jul 25, 2017


Looks like Bazza had taken further tax advice – as I’m sure most of the UK-based EBT recipients will have done likewise, as they had plenty of time to transfer assets into wife’s name, or offshore.

Absolutely expected, and absolutely despicable – and from an ex-Rangers and Scotland captain as well.

Extracted from The Sun today.
BARRY’S TRANSFER 
Rangers hero Barry Ferguson transferred luxury mansion into wife’s name six years before bankruptcy
The ex-Scotland captain, who has gone bust with debts of more than 1.4 million, gifted his joint share in the house to wife MargaretBy Stuart MacDonald25th July 2017, 1:12 pmFORMER Rangers star Barry Ferguson transferred his luxury mansion into his wife’s name six years before his bankruptcy, it has emerged.
The ex-Scotland captain, who has gone bust with debts of more than 1.4 million, gifted his joint share in the house to wife Margaret.
Barry Ferguson transferred his luxury mansion into his wife’s name six years before his bankruptcyTheir home is a gated property near Larkhall, Lanarkshire, which the couple bought for £1.2 million in 2003.
Property records show Mrs Ferguson, 39, became the sole owner in November, 2011, when the footballer handed over his interest in the home for ‘love, favour and affection’.
The move means the house is likely to be out of reach to creditors who Ferguson, 39, owes money to.
Under bankruptcy laws, an asset which has been transferred more than five years before the date a person is made bankrupt cannot be used to pay off their debts.
Ferguson applied for his own bankruptcy after running up debts of £1,425,633 and it was approved by the Accountant In Bankruptcy, Scotland’s insolvency service, earlier this month.
He declared that he has only £3,000 worth of assets available to help pay off his creditors.
 Ferguson also gave up all his company directorships in firms which he ran with his wife before his money woes became public.
He resigned as a director from an investment company, a nursery business and a media firm during 2013 and 2014 but Mrs Ferguson remains involved in them all.
Ferguson is one of a number of former Ibrox stars who faced paying back money they had received in Employee Benefit Trusts (EBTs) after Rangers lost a battle with HMRC at the Supreme Court earlier this month.
The former midfielder, who recently stepped down as manager of Clyde, received £2.5 million in EBT payments
He also invested in a film production partnership called Eclipse which has targeted by HMRC after being ruled to be a tax avoidance scheme.

Ferguson was previously listed as a director with Eclipse Film Partners No.9, a scheme which allowed investors the opportunity to claim tax relief through investing in the production of movies
In April last year, the Supreme Court upheld a judgement that one of the biggest partnerships, Eclipse 35, was a tax-avoidance scheme.
HMRC has used that judgement to issue demands to investors, who include several footballers and managers, in the other 38 similar partnerships.
The so-called Rangers ‘big tax case’ centred on the use of EBTs. More than £47million was paid to players, managers and directors between 2001 and 2010 in tax-free loans.
Earlier this month judges found that ‘loans’ paid to players and staff were in fact taxable earnings, in a decision that brought to a close legal proceedings that have dragged on for years.
HMRC said the ruling proved the EBT scheme was ‘contrived’ in that it presented payments as ‘loans’ rather than earnings, amounting to ‘tax avoidance’.
A bankruptcy trustee, Maureen Leslie of Glasgow-based insolvency specialists MLM Solutions, has been appointed to take control of Ferguson’s assets and try to recover money owed to creditors.
She said she did not comment on individual cases.
A spokesman for HMRC said: “We do not comment on identifiable taxpayers.”
Ferguson was unavailable for comment.”
===============================

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John ClarkPosted on4:24 pm - Jul 25, 2017


scottcJuly 25, 2017 at 14:39
‘…to gauge reaction for a couple of days before they commit to which statement to make.’
_________________
Interesting also,that they used Ms Budge as a ‘gauge’

This is at once testimony to the fact that she is  not just by many Hearts’ supporters but by,I suspect, a fair majority of the general run of surporters, to be rather less untainted than anyone else , and to the suits’ awareness of the distrust that they have brought upon themselves.

I wonder did Ms Budge ‘volunteer’ to say her little piece, or was she leaned upon by those whose normal job it woud be to say anything about a closed meeting?

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on4:42 pm - Jul 25, 2017


STEVIEBCJULY 25, 2017 at 16:22
   November 2011?…….He knew before anybody then !… Now he’s claiming that the medals he received a £2.5m EBT for, are worth a fraction of 3 grand….
   Take them off him anyway. !……Maybe he could increase their value by having “Kicked me when I was doon” and a wee two fingered salute, engraved on the back of them. 

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on4:50 pm - Jul 25, 2017


ffs

http://c.newsnow.co.uk/A/895238832?-11344:801:0

No remorse, as they stick to we done nothin wrong approach.

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goosygoosyPosted on4:50 pm - Jul 25, 2017


You know
While I sincerely believe Peter Lawell has acted corruptly throughout  this saga I find it difficult to believe he did so with the unanimous support of every member of the Celtic Board
So even now, at the 11th hour, before Celtic`s  endorsement of the corrupt  SFA and corrupt SPFL is finally made public
I keep asking myself
Isn`t there one,
Just one member of the Celtic Board prepared to stand up and be counted?
Have Celtic forgotten where they came from?
Don`t they care any more?
What`s happened to the integrity that created the club?
The high ideals that drove them to feed the poor of the East End ?
Is this fine club founded on goodness about to poison their roots for money ?
Would Bro Walfrid have played politics while dinner tables lay empty?
Surely there  will be one resignation at least?
Surely

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