Mr Green and Opportunity Knocks— For Aberdeen?

Avatar Bybroganrogantrevinoandhogan

Mr Green and Opportunity Knocks— For Aberdeen?

Good Morning,

In the last week, we have seen a number of strange occurrences in Scottish Football, which if taken together might just point to a very different land than the one we were lead to believe we live in just two short years ago.

First of all there was the report from a firm of well known accountants which pronounced that a significant number of Scottish Football Clubs had, in fact, sold more season tickets for this coming season than they had in the course of the last several years.

Then we had the spectacle of the National team travelling to Wembley and playing very well AND being cheered on by a very large travelling support who appear to have been full of fun and who acquitted themselves well in the big smoke.

This morning I read that today’s match at Pittodrie is a sell out — with the old stadium being packed to the rafters for the visit of Celtic. This is the first time that Aberdeen have been able to sell out the fixture for some 6 years!

Not only that, various Celtic supporting websites have lead with articles saying that the return of a strong Aberdeen and Dundee United are to be welcomed– in fact not only welcomed but positively wished for.

In contrast, stories abound about the in fighting on the Ibrox Board. There are surreptitious share dealings and all sorts of company jockeying being deployed by the rival factions who are trying to gain control of The Rangers. Further, there is the suggestion from some well informed parties that not only will Ibrox and the Albion be sold and leased back to the club to generate much needed immediate cash, but that Murray Park has been sold off completely and will no longer be available to The Rangers for any purpose whatsoever!

Clearly, there are big troubles at the club which will not assist in the stated intention of rising to the very top in Scottish Football.

In between all of this, the debate goes on about Campbell Ogilvie, Press manipulation, the correspondence  between Media House and the SFA, and between The SFA and Ibrox re the relationship between Charlie Green and Craig Whyte and so on.

Standing with my business hat on, I looked at all of this and wondered what it all meant, and pretty quickly reached the conclusion that we are now in a time of supreme opportunity for some of the clubs in Scottish Football—- particularly Aberdeen FC.

There is a view abroad, that in the absence of the “Strong Rangers” that Celtic Football Club will win the SPFL title for almost evermore — or at least until they are toppled from the top spot by the rise of a strong Rangers club somewhere towards the end of this decade or early in the next– because we are assured that they will be back– in one form or another– in a rather Arnold Schwarzenegger  like fashion.

That return or initial rise if you like– its timing and its manner— is dependent on a number of things– not least the exit strategy of Charlie Green and his cohorts.

If it is true that The Rangers are going to part company with Ibrox and the Albion, that they have taken on a loan of funds which attract a rate of interest that amounts to 15% per annum, and that there are set figures for buying the old ( and decaying ) stadium back any time soon, and that they have yet again hawked the season ticket money, then the already flawed Ibrox business plan is burdened even more by interest and rent payments of an additional £3M per annum and rising!

It should also be noted that the accounts for old co from the mid naughties onwards boasted that season ticket sales, merchandising, corporate hospitality and so on had reached unprecedented levels—- but—- the club still did not make an operating profit without strange internals transactions such as the repurchase of media rights which added £15M on to the P&L’s AND the sale of Jean Alain Boomsong!

Accordingly, the current position will not make for good financial reading.

So– let’s presume that in the current climate Celtic are out of sight and will always be champions for ever and a day. What do the rest of the clubs say in the absence of the Ibrox club without whom they have been told they will perish?

Well, If I were in charge of Aberdeen FC I would look out across a city with an inherent population of some 220,000 souls sitting in a county which takes the population up by another 40,000 or so. I would note that the compact city also houses two universities and a number of colleges — all of which attract visitors to the city— and that its position as the oil capital of Europe also draws in a substantial number of itinerant workers.

Further, personal knowledge shows that many who studied at Aberdeen University or Robert Gordon’s in the 80’s left the city as Aberdeen FC fans and no matter where they have ended up in life they still make the journey back to Pittodrie when they can– especially in good times!

Alas, however, Aberdeen has not enjoyed ” Good Times” of late— in fact not really since ……….. the arrival of David Murray at Ibrox!

If you cast your mind back to the pre Murray era, Aberdeen were a force not only in Scotland but Europe as the recent nostalgia re Gothenburg has reminded us.

The city has an economic micro climate which suggests that it can ride economic hardship better than most and so all things considered this current period provides a great opportunity for the Dons.

Unlike Dundee United, Hearts, and Hibs, Aberdeen FC sits in a large one team conurbation and should be on the doorstep of a populace which can fill Pittodrie every single week …… IF that fan base can be motivated.

And there lies the rub– how do you get a notoriously fickle fan base out of the armchair and into the stadium?

The late Bob Crampsey once described Pittodrie by saying ” And there are the masses of Aberdeen fans, masquerading as rows and rows of Empty seats!” yet in their heydey an Aberdeen crowd on a visit to Glasgow were among the noisiest– and to this football fans eyes — the scariest ( in a good sense ) supports to be seen.

Well, at this juncture, Derek McInnes and team need only look at every other football club in the land ( bar Celtic ) and determine that come next May those others will be below them in the league. If Aberdeen maintain a strong league run keeping everyone behind them then there is the possibility of a huge revenue swing in favour of the Dons– such a swing that would put them in an even stronger position for the following year.

Further, Aberdeen are a European name. Perhaps a European name from yesteryear and not the recent past, but the pedigree is there and as such there will be those who remember the heady European Nights both home and away. Reviving those memories and that reputation– at least to an extent– is not beyond the club, and with no disrespect to Motherwell and St Johnstone both of whom are liable to lose key players or even a manager between seasons, Aberdeen may just be of a size to consolidate each year rather than scramble to maintain the momentum of one good season which comes along every now and then.

Financial management and football rewards can go hand in hand when combined properly, and of all the clubs in Scotland who can benefit from a level playing field in terms of proper football governance, Aberdeen FC are uniquely placed in my opinion.

That is not so say that The Arabs, or the Hibees or anyone else cannot benefit– on the contrary— but the Dons are the most obvious candidates in terms of potential structure to really motor forward and regain a by gone status.

Such a situation, and the recognition of that potential, should be borne in mind by all at Celtic Football Club, as last year they struggled for a period in the league while they concentrated on their European exploits. If Celtic want to go further and further in Europe ( and why shouldn’t they ) they will have to be wary of any club which is capable of reigniting its fortunes from a lowly position or a position of having to look back at glory and potential glory rather than looking forward.

Further, with the way things are being organised at Ibrox, there is absolutely no guarantee ( some would say likelihood ) that an eventual challenge to a perceived dominance by Celtic will come from that quarter, and life in the top flight for any returning Rangers could prove very difficult if the likes of Aberdeen get their act together and start to produce the type of home grown team of old.

For now, I sense a degree of optimism about the Dons– not just on the playing front either.  They have a fan base, they have a business model and a good young manager, and any comparative business exercise must conclude that they have every chance of rising above most of their rivals in the league, in terms of revenue, in terms of brand development and business expansion.

If I were an Aberdeen fan I would like to think positive and be ambitious in this climate, whilst at the same time casting an eye back to the days when they were top of the tree.

As one Aberdeen supporting ( but now Edinburgh based ) friend put it to me:

” Ah, those were the days my friend, those were the days……………”

About the author

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broganrogantrevinoandhogan author

Boot wearing football, sport & total nonsense fan-- Gourmet, Bon Viveur and eedgit! - Oh and I write a bit occasionally!

2,310 Comments so far

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JLeeHookerPosted on8:49 am - Sep 3, 2013


fergusslayedtheblues says:
September 3, 2013 at 8:18 am

JLH
Is that really the case ,can’t free agents be registered outwith the window .
Maybe Mr Bryson is just running over the new recruits contracts in case they get into a pickle again .
_____________________________________________________________________

They ‘can’ be registered outwith the window. The question is ‘will’ they be registered?

I am sure RFC* would have put out a press release by now if they have been signed to appease their fans.

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tcup 2012

tcup 2012Posted on9:06 am - Sep 3, 2013


Maybe they are going to make the Honest mistake plea 💡
By saying they were paying them and didn’t know that by doing so made them employees and ineligible to be registered as free agents 👿

But i did say a few weeks ago that i thought they would only actually sign 1 or 2 of the so called trialists 😐

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andygraham.66Posted on9:13 am - Sep 3, 2013


Apologies if I have missed this being discussed, but I’m surprised more hasn’t been said on here about the Scotzine interview with Jack.

http://www.scotzine.com/2013/09/exclusive-qa-jack-irvine-media-house/

It’s the talk of the steamie seemingly in Govan

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bluPosted on9:15 am - Sep 3, 2013


Someone with a sense of history and humour buying RIFC shares this morning?

Date: 03-Sep-13
Time: 08:33:10
Trade Price: 52.75
Volume: 1,888
Buy*
Value: 995.92

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on9:36 am - Sep 3, 2013


andygraham66
I read the JI link to question 2 and that was enough for me I’m afraid .
No need to read any further 🙄 🙄

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neepheidPosted on9:52 am - Sep 3, 2013


From the Jack Irvine interview on Scotzine (AM is Andy Muirhead) –

“AM: A twitter account called Charlotte Fakes has been publishing emails and other correspondence involving you, Whyte, some journalists and Rangers officials – which seem to paint all parties in a bad light. What is your take on what this person is doing?

JI: It is illegal. It is a breach of the Data Protection Act and the perpetrator faces serious consequences when he is caught.”

To state with such certainty that there has been a breach of the DPA, Irvine must know how the stuff posted by CF was obtained (or he’s just a big bag of wind and a bully 🙄 ). A shame the interviewer didn’t ask how the stuff was obtained by CF. Or even ask whether the CF stuff was genuine.

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Esteban

EstebanPosted on9:56 am - Sep 3, 2013


neepheid says:
September 3, 2013 at 9:52 am

A shame the interviewer didn’t ask how the stuff was obtained by CF. Or even ask whether the CF stuff was genuine.

You are entirely correct, but the whole thing just looks like quick email answers to a list of emailed questions with no opportunity to probe or to follow up, so it’s a bit of a set-piece. There is a lot of this kind of thing around. As Jack Irvine knows very well, good journalists used to be taught not just to leave no question unanswered, but also to leave no answer unquestioned.

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Danish PastryPosted on10:10 am - Sep 3, 2013


upthehoops says:
September 3, 2013 at 7:07 am
25 1 Rate This
———-
Last night’s was an absolute shocker. Keevins and Johnstone were appalling, shouting down callers. The only bright spot was the main host who was trying to inject some sanity. The Celtic debt calls were last week. None of the hosts had heard about it and the slightly contrived and misleading calls were debunked and put into context later in the week I believe. SSB has a few decent pundits and Delahunt does try to be open-minded, but you’re up against it on that show with the likes of Daziel and Johnstone. It can only be a matter or time before Chick Young turns up there to join them. His stuttering, on-air incoherence would fit in well there.

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Danish PastryPosted on10:23 am - Sep 3, 2013


andygraham.66 says:
September 3, 2013 at 9:13 am
5 0 Rate This

Apologies if I have missed this being discussed, but I’m surprised more hasn’t been said on here about the Scotzine interview with Jack.

http://www.scotzine.com/2013/09/exclusive-qa-jack-irvine-media-house/
————-

Thanks Andy. A bit of pro-JI propaganda. He needs it. I was sure one of the CF docs discussed the ‘cleaning up’ of Whyte’s Google history. Might be wrong though. Anyone?

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nickmcguinnessPosted on10:26 am - Sep 3, 2013


Andy Muirhead has just chucked the credibility of Scotzine oot the windae with that soft-focus, doe-eyed puff piece for Uncle Jack Irvine.
Has he been promised a job at Media House or is he just an appalling journalist (if that!) who did zero research before his interview? Or both?
What a shame.

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iamacantPosted on10:57 am - Sep 3, 2013


Charlottes looking for answers

Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes 1h

Do we have it on record yet as to how McColl, Murray and others formed the alliance for boardroom changes.

if so, link?

#CorporateCarnage

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Drew PeacockPosted on11:22 am - Sep 3, 2013


nickmcguinness says:
September 3, 2013 at 10:26 am

Andy Muirhead has just chucked the credibility of Scotzine oot the windae with that soft-focus, doe-eyed puff piece for Uncle Jack Irvine.
Has he been promised a job at Media House or is he just an appalling journalist (if that!) who did zero research before his interview? Or both?
What a shame.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

It is a bit tame but it does show JI not being 100% truthful about his part in representing Whytes interest. All his talk about hindsight being a great thing when talking about Whyte is nonsense as we have seen the emails from CF which clearly demonstrate he knew Whytes full background.

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ShannowPosted on11:36 am - Sep 3, 2013


neepheid says:
September 3, 2013 at 9:52 am

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From the Jack Irvine interview on Scotzine (AM is Andy Muirhead) –

“AM: A twitter account called Charlotte Fakes has been publishing emails and other correspondence involving you, Whyte, some journalists and Rangers officials – which seem to paint all parties in a bad light. What is your take on what this person is doing?

JI: It is illegal. It is a breach of the Data Protection Act and the perpetrator faces serious consequences when he is caught.”

To state with such certainty that there has been a breach of the DPA, Irvine must know how the stuff posted by CF was obtained (or he’s just a big bag of wind and a bully 🙄 ). A shame the interviewer didn’t ask how the stuff was obtained by CF. Or even ask whether the CF stuff was genuine.
—————————————————————————————————————————————–
Sorry if this is a daft question from a lurker, but can the leaks be in breach of the DPA if they are fake?

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tomtomPosted on11:53 am - Sep 3, 2013


I’d like to think that the Scotzine piece has been printed to show what a complete and utter nutjob Irvine is. Most of what he says can be pulled apart by anyone with half a brain but at least it’s now out there in the public domain rather than being something we knew but couldn’t prove. Maybe Jack might just regret becoming the story.

On the other hand it could be Andy Murdoch angling for a job 🙄

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jimlarkinPosted on11:59 am - Sep 3, 2013


Excuse my ignorance. . .what’s the issue with ONLY nicky law being ‘registered’ at this moment in time.

. . . Surely Bryson would say that he accepts they are already registered as they have been playing for Sevco for quite a few weeks now. . .

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Flocculent ApoideaPosted on12:25 pm - Sep 3, 2013


“JI: It is illegal. It is a breach of the Data Protection Act and the perpetrator faces serious consequences when he is caught.”

Is this the first confirmation that the documents are genuine? Does this give good journalists an angle?

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martin cPosted on12:34 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Is it just me, but why has the story become more and more about JI?

Good PR, thats why!

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jockybhoyPosted on1:02 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Stuck this on Phil MGB’s site as itr relates to his debunking of the Celtic are in Serious Debt myth, but it’s still in moderation so thought I’d ask here:

What are Cumulative Convertible Preference Shares?

Cumulative Convertible Preference Share are a type of preference shares where the dividend payable on the same accumulates, if not paid. After a specified date, these shares will be converted into equity capital of the company.

So as I understand it, and I am happy to be educated if incorrect, there is not a great deal of value in paying off this debt as at the end of the term, it “converts” into equity, meaning the share float is diluted but it doesn’t actually “cost” the club anything. Is that right?

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torrejohnbhoyPosted on1:03 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes 2m

The return of Paul Baxendale-Walker via Dr Nigel Griffiths ex MP August 2011. http://i.imgur.com/XmHukzd.jpg

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MoreCelticParanoia

MoreCelticParanoiaPosted on1:07 pm - Sep 3, 2013


fergusslayedtheblues says:
September 3, 2013 at 8:43 am

JLH
The others may have found a 6 month deal to get the spivs to the xmas lock in and are reluctant to put pen to paper
just my opinion though

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A 6 month contract is better than no contract – and no doubt on terms more favourable than available from any other clubs outwith the SPL and many in the SPL. Although the players concerned would remain free agents and therefore available to other clubs, I’d imagine most clubs dealing in this particular department of the bargain basement will have already used whatever limited transfer budget they had so hardly seems worth the risk therefore doubt this is the reason

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Danish PastryPosted on1:27 pm - Sep 3, 2013


torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
September 3, 2013 at 1:03 pm
1 0 Rate This

Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes 2m

The return of Paul Baxendale-Walker via Dr Nigel Griffiths ex MP August 2011. http://i.imgur.com/XmHukzd.jpg
————

Don’t see, from that email, the connection between PB-W and the doctor.

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torrejohnbhoyPosted on1:37 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Danish Pastry says:

torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
September 3, 2013 at 1:03 pm
1 0 Rate This

Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes 2m

The return of Paul Baxendale-Walker via Dr Nigel Griffiths ex MP August 2011. http://i.imgur.com/XmHukzd.jpg
————

Don’t see, from that email, the connection between PB-W and the doctor.
=====================================
Neiher did I but here’s the latest:

Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes now

1. http://i.imgur.com/36XxOup.jpg
2. http://i.imgur.com/W6zBrdO.jpg
3. http://i.imgur.com/39cWLDw.jpg
4. 5. http://www.scribd.com/doc/165080474/Another-White-Knighthttp://i.imgur.com/M44ImpT.jpg

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torrejohnbhoyPosted on1:40 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Charlotte Fakeovers ‏@CharlotteFakes 1m

Rather ironically, Whyte chased the ex Labour MP and no meeting took place. Where has Griffiths been for the past few years, the moon?

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TallBoy Poppy

TallBoy PoppyPosted on2:03 pm - Sep 3, 2013


torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
September 3, 2013 at 1:40 pm
—————————————————————-
Dr Griffiths appears to have 2 seperate CVc on Linkedin, Sneaky
Here’s his recent one:
http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/dr-nigel-griffiths/29/561/786

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john clarkePosted on2:17 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Danish Pastry says:
September 3, 2013 at 1:27 pm
‘..The return of Paul Baxendale-Walker via Dr Nigel Griffiths ..’
——
Like calls unto like, as ever…

‘In 2002 the Parliamentary commissioner for standards upheld complaints that Griffiths owned an office for which he was claiming expenses for rent of £10,000 a year…’

Griffiths was the MP for my constituency.
I did not vote for him!

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ecobhoyPosted on2:22 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Whoever the writer who recently appears to be changing Leggo’s rants into something a bit more sensible has today launched an interesting attack on JI.

He is using info contained in two emails allegedly sent by Irvine, presumably to a third party/parties, which seriously trashes the reputations of Sun editor Andy Harries and Daily Record editor Allan Rennie. Obviously in any PR campaign involving Irvine trying to keep Rangers supporters onside with the current Board then he needs support from these two tabloids.

So what action is JI going to take against Leggoland for using the emails which I am confident were not sent to Leggo. And how many more emails does Leggo have that will now be used. And who is the source and does JT play any part?

However the really interesting point here is that Leggo – or his advisors – haven’t printed the actual emails but just used their content to launch his attack on Irvine. This, of course, is what SMSM journos could have done all along with the CF emails.

Whatever anyone thinks of Leggo’s position vis a vis Rangers it should always be remembered he used to be a very good journalist and was head and shoulders above your normal football hack. I think his blog today is more than just a simple attack aimed at damaging JI and have the feeling he is basically challenging JI to take him on legally.

He certainly has shamed all the Scottish journalists who have been hiding when it comes to using any serious CF material to ask probing questions.

Certainly this PR ‘war’ is taking place on many levels and shows no sign of a truce being agreed.

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NawlitePosted on2:25 pm - Sep 3, 2013


I’m confused with what’s happening in regard to CF apparently being closed down, either under duress or by him/herself.

If he/she was deliberately deleting everything that had been posted because (as some posters thought) he/she had now got what he/she was after, then why continue posting new pieces? Especially new pieces that don’t seem very related to the ‘threats’ those previous releases contained.

Alternatively, if someone had forced the shutdown/deletion, would CF be allowed to continue posting, or even feel safe in doing so?

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on2:29 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Charlotte Fakeovers
@CharlotteFakes
Despite the 5 way agreement published earlier, the SPFL are considering transferring the 250k fine from oldco to newco. #AskSPFLNoDenial

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ecobhoyPosted on2:47 pm - Sep 3, 2013


nawlite says:
September 3, 2013 at 2:25 pm

I’m confused with what’s happening in regard to CF apparently being closed down, either under duress or by him/herself. If he/she was deliberately deleting everything that had been posted because (as some posters thought) he/she had now got what he/she was after, then why continue posting new pieces? Especially new pieces that don’t seem very related to the ‘threats’ those previous releases contained.

Alternatively, if someone had forced the shutdown/deletion, would CF be allowed to continue posting, or even feel safe in doing so?
===============================================
Obviously impossible to answer your questions. One thing that has struck me about the presentation of recent CF tweets is the amount of comment where she is now giving info such as the fine transfer from oldco to newco rather than printing the emails. Perhaps she has been advised that just commenting means the post can’t be taken down.

Also if I am correct in that supposition it is interesting to note that is the track that Leggo appears to have gone down today. If I was an enterprising Scots journo I might be phoning the SPFL and asking would it be possiblt to transfer the fine and is there any plan to do so and have their been any discussions regarding this.

And of course nothing is based on material that JI claims is illegal. Has the great spinmeister got himself trapped in a tumble dryer ❓

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on3:32 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 2:29 pm
4 0 Rate This

Charlotte Fakeovers
@CharlotteFakes
Despite the 5 way agreement published earlier, the SPFL are considering transferring the 250k fine from oldco to newco. #AskSPFLNoDenial

==============================

OK, so as no one else is commenting, this is an interesting development for all us bampots.

Wasn’t the fine placed on them by the SFA for not registering the contracts fully? So, why would the SPFL be trying to move this to the “newco”

They wouldn’t receive the money, it’s of no consequence to them.

Now, the SFA might try it, and they might just get away with it….if newco don’t accept the punishment and pay the fine (as a footballing debt to the authority from oldco) then they are in breach of the agreement. they could also claim that they are a new club – but then they don’t want to to do that – and even then, they couldn’t take the SFA to court over it – as they’d be in breach of the 5WA.

hmmmm

then again, the SFA are not going to kick them out either – so I guess this is just more nonsense and fluff.

the 250k fine is NOT getting paid – not by old co, newco or the ethereal “Rangers Football Club”

Unless the SFA are going to threaten to remove their membership or if Sevco are prepared to go to court over this, then we have a stalemate.

So, has something changed that the SFA have grown a set? Doubt it

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on3:35 pm - Sep 3, 2013


DOH, wait, no….the fine was for breaching SPL rules! So, the SPFL will be looking for that money

they aren’t getting it from Old Co, so they are after newco

How so? Is the 250k a footballing debt and newco to assume responsibility under 5wa agreement?

or are they saying the fine was on rangers football Club and it’s “owners/operators” are responsible

However, is there a will from SPFL to kick them out of the league if they don’t pay up? Unlikely i’d say.

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neepheidPosted on3:50 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 3:32 pm
0 0 Rate This

Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 2:29 pm
4 0 Rate This

Charlotte Fakeovers
@CharlotteFakes
Despite the 5 way agreement published earlier, the SPFL are considering transferring the 250k fine from oldco to newco. #AskSPFLNoDenial

==============================

OK, so as no one else is commenting, this is an interesting development for all us bampots.

Wasn’t the fine placed on them by the SFA for not registering the contracts fully? So, why would the SPFL be trying to move this to the “newco”

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Under the 5 way agreement, surely Sevco/TRFC are liable for this sum? I’m looking at 2.1 and 2.2 of the agreement. Since the fine of 250k relates to events predating CW’s involvement, then surely Sevco/TRFC are liable under the terms of the 5 way agreement, not despite it, as CF says? Or am I getting this all wrong?

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nickmcguinnessPosted on4:03 pm - Sep 3, 2013


ecoboy at 2.22 says:
Whatever anyone thinks of Leggo’s position vis a vis Rangers it should always be remembered he used to be a very good journalist and was head and shoulders above your normal football hack.

__________________________________

Are you joking?
Leggatt was never more than a bigoted buffoon with a risible writing style consisting of uber-tabloid hackery. Think William McGonagall without the rhymes.
The semi-literate trash he has posted on his site up till now, full of comical and ineffective repetition, is testament to that.
Today’s piece, however, was clearly written FOR him by someone with access to emails Jack Irvine had previously sent to figures at Ibrox. Possibly even to Whyte.
Could Charlotte Fakes even be involved? Quite possibly.
Leggatt is now firmly in the Paul Murray camp. I presume that’s who is paying for his daily rations of gin.

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Ian58Posted on4:33 pm - Sep 3, 2013


nickmcguinness
Your last sentence brought to mind the wonderful phrase ‘vase of gin’ used by the splendid poster tinsoldier on KDS to describe one of Mr Leggatt’s units of measure. Always makes me smile, that one.

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yakutsuki

yakutsukiPosted on4:43 pm - Sep 3, 2013


andygraham.66 says:
September 3, 2013 at 9:13 am

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Apologies if I have missed this being discussed, but I’m surprised more hasn’t been said on here about the Scotzine interview with Jack.

http://www.scotzine.com/2013/09/exclusive-qa-jack-irvine-media-house/

It’s the talk of the steamie seemingly in Govan

==============================================================================

At the risk of repeating myself… WOW, just feckin WOW!!!

Irvine says ‘Fergus McCann with his bunnet and his squint!’ Sevco, reign him in ffs! Irvine, we feel your pain, bitterness and hatred.

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beanosPosted on4:47 pm - Sep 3, 2013


yakutsuki says:
September 3, 2013 at 4:43 pm
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I noticed that too.

Part of what makes Irvine such an odious character is the way he slips seamlessly between low grade tabloid speak like that and his usual pompous prose.

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Lord WobblyPosted on5:04 pm - Sep 3, 2013


http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/latest/celtic-chief-peter-lawwell-appointed-to-sfa-board-1-3073394

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AuldheidPosted on5:06 pm - Sep 3, 2013


http://www.scottishfa.co.uk/scottish_fa_news.cfm?page=2986&newsID=12443&newsCategoryID=1

Peter Lawwell appointed to Scottish FA Board

Tuesday, 03 September 2013

Following its meeting at Hampden Park, the Professional Game Board has nominated Peter Lawwell, Chief Executive of Celtic Football Club, as their representative on the main Board of the Scottish FA.

Peter joins the four Scottish FA office bearers, Chief Executive Stewart Regan, President Campbell Ogilvie, Vice-President Alan McRae, and Second Vice-President Rod Petrie, on the Board along with Barrie Jackson, the Independent Non-Executive Director.

Peter Lawwell commented: “Clearly I am pleased to accept this nomination. Whilst there are certain challenges facing the game in Scotland, there is also a great deal to be positive about and much to look forward to.

“We must build on these positives and along with other Board members I look forward to playing my part in working to improve and develop various aspects of the game, for the benefit of Scottish football as a whole”.

The Non-Professional Game Board will make their nomination at the next meeting.

The Professional Game Board is comprised of:

Stewart Regan
Campbell Ogilvie
Alan McRae
Rod Petrie
Neil Doncaster
Peter Lawwell
Dr Andrew Waddell
Sandy Stables
Michael Johnston
Bill Darroch
Duncan Fraser

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on5:06 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Good breakdown of document.

http://www.thefootballlife.co.uk/post/60008041287/five

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The Football Life

Five

Today, CharlotteFakes leaked a copy of the Five Way Agreement. While not
signed, given the generally high level of authenticity maintained by
Scotland’s Julian Assange, there is little reason to take it as anything
other than the real thing.

The Five Way Agreement is something that has taken upon somewhat
mythological (or pathological, depending on what team you support)
importance as the document which would clear up exactly what Rangers are
doing in the Scottish League system once and for all. While it is perhaps
impossible for it to clear up everything some may promise it to do so, it
can be condensed to certain important concepts – Who are Rangers and how
did they obtain their place in the league in spite of precedent from, for
example, Gretna, that they should not be allowed to do so.

The full document is available to view at
http://www.scribd.com/doc/164607084/5-Way-Agreement-As-issued-to-all-parties-for-signaturebut,
as with my other documented blogs, rather than go through the whole
thing, there will be a point by point narrative meaning it may be helpful
for those with Windows 7 to do the thing where two windows take up half of
the screen each or just to refer to the document while reading.

Page 2 – For those who love semantics, Rangers and Sevco Scotland are two
separate entities. Take from that what you will but it would appear to lend
handy documented support to those who will call Rangers a New Club and a
stick to beat those who call it the Same Club with. Personally, I don’t
care for that debate, but I know some do love it for it’s banterous
purposes.

Page 2, Recitals B and C – Interesting to note this in terms of timeline,
that the SFL at this point has 30 members and the SPL 12, suggesting that,
at this point, Dundee have not been “promoted” nor Rangers “relegated”.
Considering that this document was actually signed after Rangers were
evicted from the SPL, it seems odd to me that neither organisation have
chosen to reflect it. It would suggest that Rangers membership of the
league never lapsed and that it was never in question and that, as such,
the matter of league membership was not up for discussion as part of the
Five Way Agreement process. Recital D staes that OldCo Rangers still owns a
SPL share despite, in recital G on Page 3, it clearly stating that Rangers
will be entering Division Three. This is particularly odd as the SPL share
generally lapses as soon as the season is over (or, in Rangers case, should
have lapsed when initially voted out of the SPL) which would suggest that
precedence was ignored to allow Rangers a “share” in the league so as not
to leave them without a league to play in. As the SFL works on a membership
basis only and Rangers NewCo were not granted any membership status at this
point (as they had, in effect, no club), without this share, Rangers would
be, by default, out of the league. It would suggest that precedent was
ignored to ensure Rangers still had a grip on a league spot.

Page 4, CW Enduring Acts – This is notable for making accusations not
publicly made previously. Why mention bribery, match fixing, undisclosed
payments to players (rather hilariously noted as an enduring act from Craig
Whyte, rather than David Murray) or undisclosed payments to match
officials? Why mention those things if there wasn’t something going on? By
mentioning that it has to be put into this document that Rangers commit not
to do these things, surely it suggests that they have in the past. While
financial doping rigged the game to an extent, were Rangers rigging games
in a more literal sense and if not, why is it mentioned?

Page 7, Articles 2.1 and 2.2 – More separate entity evidence – Sevco become
liable for Rangers’ misdeeds but, at the same time, don’t. Note the last 5
words – full member of the SFA – Rangers NewCo were an associate member.
The associate membership loophole to get Rangers into the SFL in the first
place would surely apply to this also.

Page 8, Articles 2.3.1 and 2.4.3 – Commits Sevco to paying Scottish and
European Football Creditors. That would appear to diminish the difference
between OldCo and NewCo.

Article 2.3.2 – This, in itself, ins interesting and marks a break from the
Gretna precendent once more. Sevco/Rangers renounce any right to monies
owed to them by the SPL in terms of prize money from 11/12 or any other
season for the SPL to dispose of as it sees fit. Gretna, of course, were
given an advance on their prize money so they could complete the season.
Why the change? Considering Rangers, as the team who came second in the
11/12 season, would have been entitled to a large chunk of cash, is it that
the SPL couldn’t afford to pay it or just didn’t want to. And how was it
disposed of? Until it was disposed of, was it sat accruing interest? If so,
what happened to the interest? Were the SPL actually making a profit from
the demise of Rangers?

Page 9, Article 2.4.4 – This is an interesting one. Based on UEFA rules,
Rangers should be able to qualify for Europe 3 seasons post an insolvency
event. This article appears that, in addition to that, they should also
have to be given permission to do so by the SFA, which would seem an
unnecessary bureaucratic layer to pass through and suggests Rangers can ask
UEFA to bend the rules in that respect. Why?

Article 2.5.4 and 2.5.3 – This is exceptional hypocrisy. Put it in writing
that Rangers not only have to pay the fines meted out by the judicial panel
(fair enough) but also the SFA’s costs in administering these and then in
the NEXT BLOODY PARAGRAPH saying Rangers agree not to chase the SFA for
payment of costs they were awarded in the Court of Session. Staggeringly
arrogant.

Article 2.6 – This begs the question, when did the share transfer and how
does this affect the Brechin game played before the deadline of 3rd August
given here?

Page 10, Article 3.2, also Page 11, Article 5.2 – The debate on whether
players should or shouldn’t have TUPEd over to Newco is complicated here.
It states that any player registered with Rangers as part of the SPL side
would transfer to be part of the SFL side which would appear to reflect
that the SFA were of the opinion that those players who departed the club
for nothing in the Summer should not have been able to do so and that, had
any left after this document was signed, the SFA could refuse the transfer.
Of course, doing so would have led to an entertaining case in the European
courts, but the SFA appear to be trying to weigh in on it anyway.

Article 5.1 – This, to me, is the real nitty gritty. The Gretna precedent
would be to refuse entry of a liquidated club into the SFL unless they were
passed fit to do so by an application panel (hence why we have Annan in the
league). Instead, this commits the SFL to irrevocably take “whatever steps
are necessary” to ensure Rangers take part in the Third Division. Now,
while the SPL also is t take “whatever steps are necessary” to get Dundee
in the SPL, it is odd language to use. Surely this could have been done
without needing to state authorities were to do whatever needed doing to
allow Rangers to play. While it does not suggest misdeed, it certainly
suggests mistrust between Sevco and the SFA/SFL/SPL.

Page 11, Article 8.1 – Yes, the Five Way Agreement needed a Non-Disclosure
arrangement aside from to say that it existed in the first place and a
pre-written statement would be released on it. Stewart Regan must think
he’s Tyler Durden.

Page 12, Article 10 – This would appear to suggest that, had Rangers gone
back to the SPL/SFL/SFA and said they had no intention of paying
footballing debts, there could be an amendment to the Five Way Agreement to
ensure that they didn’t have to, that it would be swept under the carpet
and that the creditors would have no say in that whatsoever. Due to the
non-disclosure agreement, the creditors would also be unable to find out
that this was the case. Certainly, if any football creditor of Rangers is
still waiting for money, this might seem like carte blanche to try and get
it from the SFA/SPL/SFL as they would appear to be complicit in allowing it
to be possible for Rangers to not pay creditors and to withhold information
about not having to pay creditors after initially agreeing to.

Article 12.1 and 12.2, also Page 14, Article 16.2 – That says Rangers/Sevco
have no recourse to take a pop at the SPL, SFA or SFL about their conduct
with regard to Rangers. This would also include that Rangers are not able
to take the SFA, SPL or SFL to the Court of Session to obtain something as
basic as, oh, I don’t know, the costs they were awarded by the Court of
Session itself. Slippery.

Page 18 – The Registration Embargo. Here, times get mixed up. Rangers are
not allowed to register a player between 00:01 on 01/09/12 and 00:00 on
August 31st. The Transfer Window in Scotland ended at 23:00 on August 31st
meaning Rangers’ registration ban ended after the transfer window. Now,
let’s look at the SPFL rules on this (located at
http://spfl.co.uk/docs/067_324__therulesofthespfl_1375800603.pdf – Page 97
is the relevant bit) – it clearly states that players cannot be registered
outwith the transfer windows (article 7) unless (as per Article 9), the
registration is given special dispensation by the SPFL board to do so when
the player was, on the last day of the window, out of contract. That
Rangers have committed to the signature of 8 players must mean that they
were very confident that the SPFL would allow them to do so. Why?

It would appear, on the face of it, to be clear and blatant collusion from
the SPFL to be seen to be giving Rangers carte blanche to be signing
players outwith the transfer window and to guarantee that they will be
given special dispensation to do so in spite of the ultimate decision being
one made by the SPFL board. If that is the case, what is the point of the
transfer window when the SPFL board are simply rubber-stamping everything
that is put in front of them without taking a look at it. While it is hard
to doubt that Rangers should be able to sign players, that they are able to
sign 8 players on pre-cintract deals would suggest that the deals were
assured to be given the OK by the SPFL before they were made, in spite of
the fact that the SPFL’s own rules would suggest that that should be
impossible. The rules on transfer windows and player registration do not
appear to be worth the paper they are written on.

To conclude, in my humble opinion, this document may disappoint a lot of
people. Many will enter it looking specifically for a smoking gun on behalf
of Rangers. Instead, what is found is further evidence that the men running
Scottish football are not fit for purpose – slippery as a fish, they appear
to make up the rules as and when they want to suit them. Do Rangers want to
sign 8 players outside of the transfer window? Let them. Should we pay
Rangers costs they were granted by the courts? No chance. Evasive in the
extreme, more inconsistent than your average Samaras season – it would seem
that, in their own words, they will take whatever steps are deemed
necessary to keep their grip on power.

Every team should be treated equally. The SFA and SPFL seem to think some
are more equal than others. It’s time for the iron curtain that surrounds
the offices at Hampden to be torn down.

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AuldheidPosted on5:14 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Although it relates only to Celtic shareholders, the resolution that can be found on the Celtic Supporter Trusts web site is at its heart about trying to make the SFA accountable by existing means.

http://www.celtictrust.net/index.php?func=d_home_article&id=433

Ok AGMs are only once a year (normally 🙂 ) but shareholders in clubs can make use of their AGMs to make their disatisfaction known at any SFA decisions that drive a horse and cart through sporting fairness.

If you are a Celtic shareholder and are in agreement please sign up.

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Danish PastryPosted on6:01 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 5:06 pm
5 1 Rate This
————

Very interesting analysis, especially the page 4 bit. Back when all the talk was of atomic revelations, I had convinced myself that short of gun-running, narco and prostitution it could only be match fixing. No evidence though, so it remains an unsubstantiated and possibly malicious rumour, for all we know … perhaps.

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on6:13 pm - Sep 3, 2013


andygraham.66 says:
September 3, 2013 at 9:13 am
Apologies if I have missed this being discussed, but I’m surprised more hasn’t been said on here about the Scotzine interview with Jack.

http://www.scotzine.com/2013/09/exclusive-qa-jack-irvine-media-house/
It’s the talk of the steamie seemingly in Govan
====================================
Is that not highly unusual: a PR granting an interview about the work he has done – or more importantly – is currently doing, for clients ?

Not sure if the purpose of his participation is because;
– Irvine is concerned about losing business
– he’s telling the TRFC fans they won’t scare him away ?
– it’s simply deflection / distraction
– something else ?

…and judging by some of his ill-judged responses, maybe someone at Media House should coach him on interview technique… ?

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Danish PastryPosted on6:26 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Great Accies chairmen on Sportsound, obviously joyful at the windfall from the sell on of McCarthy. Healthy club, no debt, paying sensible wages, working to get back to the Premier with a team of Scottish lads. Music to the ears. Bless them.

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Lord WobblyPosted on6:55 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Danish Pastry says:
September 3, 2013 at 6:26 pm
18 0 Rate This
Great Accies chairmen on Sportsound, obviously joyful at the windfall from the sell on of McCarthy. Healthy club, no debt, paying sensible wages, working to get back to the Premier with a team of Scottish lads. Music to the ears. Bless them.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The flip side of that was Chick lamenting the fact that the days of big deals coming into Scotland during the transfer windows is over. Conveniently forgetting that that only happened as a result of Rangers suicidal buying of players that they couldn’t afford. Chick has learned nothing.

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Danish PastryPosted on7:07 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Lord Wobbly says:
September 3, 2013 at 6:55 pm
2 0 Rate This
——————
Aye, well, Chick Young. The others didn’t give him too much airtime, thank goodness. Well past his sell-by date. The world has moved on from the Chick Young school of football punditry, it appears the BBC just don’t have the heart to tell him.

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FIFAPosted on7:12 pm - Sep 3, 2013


As Chick will need to understand the chirpy chirpy days are gone its all on the cheep cheep
I am just in ,but I’ll get ma coat back on

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upthehoopsPosted on7:20 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Lord Wobbly says:
September 3, 2013 at 6:55 pm
===========================
Aye, Chick appeared to be pining for the days Rangers got big deals through with ‘seconds to spare’. It stuck in my craw a bit when he spoke of them doing just that with Steven Naismith, who was of course signed at a time they could afford no-one at all. I’m afraid Chick belongs to a show like Radio Clyde Superscoreboard who have no scruples at all regarding any club from Ibrox. He certainly should not be getting licence fee payers money to promote what Rangers were doing as kind of halcyon period for Scottish football.

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AuldheidPosted on7:22 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Danish Pastry says:

September 3, 2013 at 7:07 pm

2.45 in

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AuldheidPosted on7:36 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:

September 3, 2013 at 5:06 pm

Page 9, Article 2.4.4 – This is an interesting one. Based on UEFA rules,
Rangers should be able to qualify for Europe 3 seasons post an insolvency
event. This article appears that, in addition to that, they should also
have to be given permission to do so by the SFA, which would seem an
unnecessary bureaucratic layer to pass through and suggests Rangers can ask
UEFA to bend the rules in that respect. Why?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
To clarify. The section in question only stated what UEFA Rules cover. The 3 Year exile came under Article 12 (not SFA members for 3 years – there is a hint in there about where SFA ignore UEFA – and how Under Article 15 (from memory) they might qualify before the three years have elapsed via the Scottish Cup..

If that were to happen the SFA would have to make a case to UEFA for UEFA to decide on the sportying merits of the case . The problem will be that the circumstances that led to the three year exile under Article 12 would be part of the considerations and given the skullduggery at play, UEFA would be unlikely to approve without undermining Article 12. There is also the question of financial fair play which might also work against any yes decision given their current imbalaqnce between football income and expenditure.

It is a clause to cover a hypothetical situation to (rightly) see the relevant rules applied in the event entry via the SC were to happen.

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upthehoopsPosted on7:43 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Danish Pastry says:
September 3, 2013 at 6:26 pm
=================================
Terrific news for Hamilton Accies and just reward for a policy of prudence and investment in the right areas.

What next for young James – off to Man Utd, Chelsea or Man City for £30M+?

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Lord WobblyPosted on7:52 pm - Sep 3, 2013


FIFA says:
September 3, 2013 at 7:12 pm
7 0 Rate This
As Chick will need to understand the chirpy chirpy days are gone its all on the cheep cheep I am just in ,but I’ll get ma coat back on
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That song is inextricably linked in my mind with the trampolines at Portobello in the early seventies. It was never off the jukebox as I bounced around. Any similarities with bouncys living or dead are entirely coincidental.

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Danish PastryPosted on8:05 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Auldheid says:
September 3, 2013 at 7:22 pm
3 0 Rate This
————-

That said, I am aware he suffered a huge personal tragedy years ago and may have found solace in his fitba punditry and love of all things Rangers. A mitigating factor perhaps, but surely time now for him to spend more time on his boat.

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paulsatimPosted on8:29 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Grant ‏@GrantColl 27m
Peter Lawell on the board at the SFA..
.
Bloody hell….Rangers will be turning in their Grave

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YellohoosePosted on8:42 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Irvine merely sustains the mantra that can now be easily picked up across the SMSM on any given day. Traynor certainly was a disciple of the “If you don’t agree with me, you are naive and not capable of understanding the bigger picture and the many threads that make it up. Trust me, I KNOW what’s going on” or words to such effect. He comes across as a blinkered, pretendy vicious David Brent type character who’s words have now lost their power and who’s time is now past.

There will be the frantic death rolls and inevitable breakdowns in communication and nervous systems before this plays out. The damage cannot be undone. I for one, for what it’s worth, will not forget.

For all the loud talking, grandiose rhetoric and pathetic threats, jacks mind seems to this reader to resemble a bare flat furnished only with a broken 3 bar fire, a mattress and a vase of out of date, mouldy old lamb flavored gin. 👿

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Danish PastryPosted on9:12 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Hadn’t heard of this new media station. It’s got the U19 commentary v Iceland. Saw the link on another forum. Nice initiative.

http://radio.youthfootballscotland.co.uk/scotland-v-iceland-live-commentary/

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newtzPosted on9:25 pm - Sep 3, 2013


I intended to post this at the time of the C release of the 5-way agreement, so I guess the superb analysis (Five) by The Football Life is another opportunity …. esp as the alleged £250k fee (raised by C earlier today) poses a further query ….

http://www.thefootballlife.co.uk/post/60008041287/five

I notice a potential discrepancy between the 5WA and the IPO document as illustrated below … though I must admit I am not sure if it is consequential or not ….. I will leave that to our learned guys/gals on here to ponder ….
——————————–
The 5 Way Agreement

2.3.1
Sevco shall become liable to the RFC Scottish Football Creditors in the sums due to date or which may hereafter become due (but in respect of such sums to become due only in relation to (i) outstanding instalments of transfer fees and(ii) sell-on clauses in transfer contracts for which Sevco receives the full or any part of the transfer fee and is liable to account to the original club for any sell on entitlement arising) to the RFC Scottish Football Creditors by RFC as if Sevco had always been so liable and Sevco shall from and after Completion pay to each of the RFC Scottish Football Creditors such sums as are or may be come due to the RFC Scottish Football Creditors in accordance with the subsisting contractual terms between RFC and each of the RFC Scottish Football Creditors (or such variation thereof as Sevco may hereafter agree with any of them) as if the relevant contractual terms had always been between Sevco and each of the RFC Scottish Football Creditors; and

2.3.2
RFC, Sevco and Rangers FC irrevocably renounce, waive, release and discharge any right and/or entitlement to any unpaid Fees and any other sums due or to become due howsoever arising, including without prejudice to the fore going generality, in respect of or related to season 2011/12 and earlier seasons and whether under and in terms of the SPL Articles and/or SPL Rules or otherwise, by the SPL to RFC, Sevco and/or Rangers FC and hereby agree that the SPL shall retain all such Fees and other sums due to use and apply as the SPL shall in its sole discretion think fit.

——————————–

The 5WA clearly sets agreement that both Oldco amd Newco irrevocably renounce, waive, release and discharge any right and/or entitlement to any unpaid Fees and any other sums due or to become due howsoever arising,

Further,

… and hereby agree that the SPL shall retain all such Fees and other sums due to use and apply as the SPL shall in its sole discretion think fit.

So it clearly states that Oldco/Newco have no claim over any fees or sums due ….. howsoever arising ….
Covering the question of the £250k fee as raised by C …

Does this not give rise to a potential caveat, since between them they have chosen to agree to exclude the HMRC debts (as falling to RFC defined clearly as THE RANGERS FOOTBALL CLUB PLC IN ADMINISTRATION), as football debts, yet seeming the £250k fine as a football debt …. Should that would be for courts to decide how to discriminate the basis of these fees/sums as it appears based on this agreement to be a definition outside the stated SFA rules and/or UEFA statutes ….. and potentially outiside their jurisdiction, or at least is based on legal opinion supplied, but not tested in court. So they appear to have chosen to cherry picked the £250k fine as a football debt to the exclusion of HMRC debt(s) arising to RFC(IL) ….I don’t know ! …. so offer for debate !

The Point I was originally poised to make though refers to the wording in the IPO …. esp the very last statement of this paragraph ….

—————–
IPO Doc (Page 25)

RFCL was incorporated on 29 May 2012 and acquired the assets of the Club from RFC 2012 plc on
14 June 2012 pursuant to an asset purchase agreement dated 14 June 2012 (the principal terms of which are summarised in paragraph 12.1.1 of Part XII of this document) (the “APA”). Under the APA RFCL bought the assets and business known and operating as “Rangers Football Club” but excluding the liabilities of RFC 2012 plc due to creditors (including any liability for sums owed by RFC 2012 plc to HMRC). However, further to an agreement between the SFA, SPL, SFL, RFC 2012 plc and the Company dated 27 July 2012 (the principal terms of which are summarised in paragraph 12.1.7 of Part XIII of this document (the “5 Way Agreement”), RFCL subsequently agreed to take responsibility for payment of all Scottish and other football creditors of RFC 2012 plc, which had not been settled by the administrators of RFC 2012 plc or by the SPL from monies held by SPL on behalf of RFC 2012 plc, as a condition of being granted SFA membership.

————————
Here, we see that RIFC have claimed to potential investors that ….

RFCL subsequently agreed to take responsibility for payment of all Scottish and other football creditors of RFC 2012 plc, which had not been settled by the administrators of RFC 2012 plc or by the SPL from monies held by SPL on behalf of RFC 2012 plc, as a condition of being granted SFA membership.

Yet the 5WA appears to state explicitly that RFCL take responsibility for such payments, and not to be the responsibility of the SPL …. (or the SFA or SFL as signatories) … ?

That the SPL subsequently did hold fees due to pay some of that football debt (from recollection eg Hearts … ?), again seems to be in contradiction with the agreement as they had no clear responsibility to do so … yet chose to do so ? …. have they muddied the waters and in doing so blown the 5WA … ?
Have they created a circular legal argument here if they did use any withheld fees/sums to help pay some of the football debt … Since RFC(IL) … irrevocably renounced, waived, released and discharged any right and/or entitlement to any unpaid Fees and any other sums due or to become due howsoever arising. … and accepted responsibility for any football creditors (debt) ….

Am I making sense ?

Maybe my recollection is wrong and no such payment of football debt occurred …. but that then raised the question …. why state such in the IPO ?

Though it may be argued that there is a get out clause in the last para of 2.3.2 of the 5WA ( … and apply as the SPL shall in its sole discretion think fit.), but does not seem to fit with the general agreement as laid out …. ?

Feel free to rip this post apart …. because I can’t get my head around it all …. !
And I’m a bit scatter brained at the mo …

Confused newtz

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on9:37 pm - Sep 3, 2013


paulsatim says:
September 3, 2013 at 8:29 pm
38 1 Rate This

Grant ‏@GrantColl 27m
Peter Lawell on the board at the SFA..
.
Bloody hell….Rangers will be turning in their Grave
———————————————————————————————————————-
It is about time that we had an ex rangers director on the board just for a change.

.

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phill450Posted on9:48 pm - Sep 3, 2013


valentinesclown says:

It is about time that we had an ex rangers director on the board just for a change.

____________________________________________________________________

For every five Celtic directors, we should have ten!

.

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essexbeancounterPosted on10:16 pm - Sep 3, 2013


paulsatim says:

September 3, 2013 at 8:29 pm

61

1

Rate This

Grant ‏@GrantColl 27m
Peter Lawell on the board at the SFA..
.
Bloody hell….Rangers will be turning in their Grave
=============================================================================
Paul…this will now “prove” the conspiracy theorists/plotters based round the Govan club/Sevco franchise. I can just hear them whingeing: “What chance will we ever have in future if this man is around…”

I think they need a good PR outfit…any suggestions anyone?

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on10:19 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Essexbeancounter……..the conspiracy theory you mentioned above ….. taken from follow follow…..they actually believe this

Last piece of the jigsaw in their 5 year plan
This Lawwell decision is the final piece of the jigsaw. A 5 year plan initiated by Peter Lawwell and one John Reid the politician who set the ball rolling with his dirty war before getting out as quickly as he got in so not to damage his political career I wonder.

It was Murray who first signalled this when he said ‘There is an unwritten rule among Old Firm chairmen that you don’t criticise Rangers or Celtic, but I do find that this has changed since John Reid arrived,” “He has taken a few shots at us. We have not responded because there has been an unwritten rule between Rangers and Celtic that you show respect, and I will continue to do that. When you are the chairman of Rangers or Celtic, you have to be very careful. There is a strong argument, especially in the west of Scotland, that for a politician to become a chairman of a football club could be verging on being a bit dangerous.”

Reid’s response: ‘In any case, no one should be under any illusion that in defending the welfare of Celtic and our supporters I will continue to comment when appropriate, without fear or favour

It was this year that Lawwell and Reid suddenly postponed an old firm due to an ex players death who’d been bit part to say the least only to allow a game to go ahead months later when their own assistant manager passed away. A year where they falsely claimed they had a Japanese tour in order to force us into playing 4 games in a week all in a calculated effort to win the league

In 2010 Stuart Regan is then appointed to the SFA but who appointed him? There was the rather suspicious link between Kevin Reid (guess who’s son he was) and his best buddy Paul Nolan of Nolan Partners (who helped the SFA to recruit Regan) and we now know of course that Regan and Lawwell worked together during their time as employees at Coors Brewers. We also know that Nolan Partners is still a business supplier to Celtic, and that the SFA committee tasked with finding a new Chief Executive was headed by Eric Riley, a prominent Celtic director.

Still In 2010 Reid addressed his disgruntled AGM members with ”We don’t seek special treatment for Celtic,” he said. “I have never claimed we are better than anyone else. But we won’t be treated as less than anyone else – those days are gone.”

We all know what happened next with appointments such as Vincent Lunny, Paul McBride and Rod McKenzie the low level paper gatherer.

Illegal embargos, Blackmail, fines and then to keep quiet when approached by Traynor re Whyte’s failure to pay the PAYE. But that’s another story of corruption

Todays decision to allow Lawwell on the Rangers hating board is no surprise to me. This is now 5 years since Reid made his comments. Their plan has worked. We will recover on field but what set up will we have off field and who will be there to take on our enemies that have gained their positions of power

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essexbeancounterPosted on10:30 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:

September 3, 2013 at 10:19 pm

Essexbeancounter……..the conspiracy theory you mentioned above ….. taken from follow follow…..they actually believe this
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NTHM….I can assure all concerned, on this glorious blog and elsewhere, that any isolated conclusions I have managed to draw are based on my now limited intellect and have absolutely nothing to do with the deluded poster(s) on FF.

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jean7brodie

jean7brodiePosted on10:36 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 10:19 pm
Can’t believe what I’ve just read in your post. They are all suffering from hatred, detachment from reality, disillusionment or how else can this be explained?!!!!!

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Paulmac2Posted on10:42 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Is it just possible Peter has been placed into the SFA to minimise allegations of corruption?

Or is it a genuine move to start the changes that are needed….

Time will tell!

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on10:46 pm - Sep 3, 2013


NTHM
That post from folly folly
Really does take a few readings to get your head around .
Oh what power Celtic must wield in Scottish football when we can set a 5yr plan in motion just to get PL on the board of the SFA .
I thought the Slur David Murray stuff was brilliant ,keeping a diplomatic silence after all Ragers were known for that 🙄
The fact that the SFA has been infested with Ragers men for years and their influence to this end has been proven fails to register with the poster though .So what is the posters worry about PL being on the SFA board .
1. the fact that anyone with a Celtic background is in the 6th floor
2. the dead clubs monopoly of the 6th floor is being diluted
For me an unhealthy influence of any one club on the 6th floor is unacceptable for our game as a sport
I do not want to see the dismantling of one bias pro one club regime only to see it replaced by another .So rest assured any Sevco fans lurking .I for one am all for a fair and balanced running of our game and I am sure I am not alone in this .

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Paulmac2Posted on10:50 pm - Sep 3, 2013


It was Murray who first signalled this when he said ‘There is an unwritten rule among Old Firm chairmen that you don’t criticise Rangers or Celtic, but I do find that this has changed since John Reid arrived,” “He has taken a few shots at us. We have not responded because there has been an unwritten rule between Rangers and Celtic that you show respect, and I will continue to do that. When you are the chairman of Rangers or Celtic, you have to be very careful. There is a strong argument, especially in the west of Scotland, that for a politician to become a chairman of a football club could be verging on being a bit dangerous.”
………………….
Does Murray do irony?….we don’t criticise each other…then goes on to criticise…comedy genious

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on10:54 pm - Sep 3, 2013


How is this for a theory
PLs place on the SFA board was the result of a plea bargain to allow Sandy Bryson’s fairy tale registration evidence go unchallenged and led to Ragers FC keeping their titles and saved the SFA from UEFA’s wrath

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bohemianPosted on11:02 pm - Sep 3, 2013


I also have it on good authority that Lawwell and Reid were on the grassy knoll, faked the Moon landings, are involved with the Illuminati, really wrote all of Shakespeare’s stuff, ordered Diana’s death because Lawwell is Harry’s real dad and it would come out and together they exercise their control over the Bermuda Triangle. But, do you know what? You can’t face the truth! You’re obsessed with our club (sic).

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on11:04 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Jim Spence
@bbcjimspence
Sandy Easdale, Paul Murray, Frank Blin and John McLelland set to join Ibrox board. McLelland touted to return as chairman…..

Jim Spence
@bbcjimspence
the four will join up at the request of the consortium which has requisitioned the EGM.

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on11:05 pm - Sep 3, 2013


McLelland – Murray – both directors when Rangers went bust – shouldn’t be allowed

wonder if the all powerful Peter lawwell will put a stop to it?

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on11:06 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Rangers board close to peace deal with four new directors
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23953675

By Jim Spence and Chris McLaughlin
BBC Scotland
A peace deal to halt ongoing strife between Rangers’ board and disaffected shareholders is close to completion, according to senior sources.
The League One club are poised to add four new directors to the current five-man board and avoid what promised to be a stormy extraordinary meeting.
“No-one will be leaving the board,” said an Ibrox source.
“The deal is close to being agreed and the four will be joining the board at the request of the requisitioners.”
The four would join the board at the request of the group of shareholders who have demanded an egm in an attempt to remove chief executive Craig Mather, finance director Brian Stockbridge and non-executive director Bryan Smart.
Paul Murray and John McLelland
Murray and McLelland could be returning to the Ibrox board
BBC Scotland understands that the four to be added would be former chairman John McLelland, former director Paul Murray, accountant Frank Blin and bus tycoon Sandy Easdale.
McLelland is being touted for a return as chairman.
Mather, Stockbridge and Smart would remain on the board along with present non-executive directors Ian Hart and Sandy Easdale’s brother, James.
The group of shareholders, headed by Jim McColl, chairman of Clyde Blowers, has been in negotiations with the Ibrox board to achieve a solution that would avoid a gathering that could cost the club £80,000.
Rangers’ board would prefer to have discussions on boardroom changes incorporated into the agenda for the annual meeting, which is to be held in October.
However, it is understood that the deal has been struck following a stalemate in the power struggle going on within Ibrox.
Both factions are understood to speak for around 30% each of the club’s shareholders, with neither side entirely confident of winning any vote at an egm.

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john clarkePosted on11:29 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Paulmac2 says:
September 3, 2013 at 10:42 pm
“.Is it just possible Peter has been placed into the SFA to minimise allegations of corruption?
—–
He will certainly be a steadying hand, who will help the SFA membership as a whole to realise that some very important changes need to be made if any credibility is to be restored to the SFA Board and its officers.
That realisation will result in CO walking away, and possibly one or two others, and the election of some members who are seen not to have any past or present connections with either Celtic or the new club.
That is the minimum that must happen.
Whether any Board, no matter how constituted, can now legally undo the mischief caused by the admission of the new club irregularly into membership by now rescinding that membership, I don’t know.
If Liquidation carries the new club off ( and perhaps some of the business brains among the SFA membership can see that that is about to happen) , that would be an opportunity to tidy things up properly, with apologies to all of Scottish football.
But seizing that opportunity would require rather more guts and iron resolve than has so far been shown.

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Tif FinnPosted on11:36 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 11:05 pm

=============================

Why in the name of all that’s sacred would he.

If that is who the Rangers support and the Rangers owners want running their club then so be it. It’s another no win situation for anyone who interferes, even if it is for the best of intentions.

If the SFA had stopped Craig Whyte buying Rangers then they would have been stopping the club move forward with a new billionaire owner. They would have been in the wrong and anti-Rangers.

The fact that they didn’t stop it and it went wrong meant they were complicit in Rangers going into liquidation. Making them anti-Rangers.

A no win situation.

Peter Lawwell is too clever to get involved in that sort of parochial nonsense.

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Matteo GalyPosted on11:46 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 11:05 pm

There’s nothing stopping Murray or McLelland being directors of Sevco.
According to the SFA Articles of Association, neither can be on the board of a club who have been the subject of an insolvency event within the previous 5 years.
Sevco have never been insolvent, Rangers were!

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on11:50 pm - Sep 3, 2013


Matteo Galy says:
September 3, 2013 at 11:46 pm
1 0 Rate This

Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 3, 2013 at 11:05 pm

There’s nothing stopping Murray or McLelland being directors of Sevco.
According to the SFA Articles of Association, neither can be on the board of a club who have been the subject of an insolvency event within the previous 5 years.
Sevco have never been insolvent, Rangers were!

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doesn’t matter, the rule is if they have been a director of ANY club that has had an insolvency event in previous 5 years.

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on11:52 pm - Sep 3, 2013


NTHM
Spence ‘s piece
WHahhhhhaaaaaahhhaaaahaaaahahha
Noted
Murray and McLelland could be returning to the Ibrokes board (not the ragers board) .
McLelland is being touted for a return as chairman .when was McLelland ever the chairman of Sevco .
If however J Spence is really implying that these two are moving back into board positions of a company that stiffed creditors of millions of pounds that they were partly responsible for ,then that really would be disgusting and probably illegal .
Would it be illegal though if it was an entirely different club and company .Looks like the SFA are painting themselves into a corner on this one .
Also if the only real ragers men willing to step into the breach are ones verging on (phoenix company allegations ) or newly found TYCOON status it makes me think the grand plan may have had to be redrawn .
where have all the billionaires gone

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