On the Old Club vs New Club (OCNC) debate, the SFA’s silence has been arguably the most damaging factor with respect to the future of the game. Of course people get frustrated when there is a deliberate policy of silence on the part of the SFA which results in the endless cycle of arguments being trotted out again and again with no resolution or closure possible.
The irony (it’s only irony if you assume that the SFA have gone to great lengths to create the conditions for the unbroken history status of the new club) is that the mealy-mouthed attitude they have adopted has actually polarised opinion in a far more serious and irreconcilable way than had they just made a clear statement when Sevco were handed SFA membership. A bit of leadership, with a decision either way at that time would have spiked a lot of OCNC guns very early on, but as history shows, they were afraid of a backlash from wherever it came.
I am now convinced that Scottish Football has passed the Event Horizon and is broken beyond the possibility of any repair that might have taken it back to its pre-2010 condition. Rangers fans will never – no matter what any eventual pronouncement from Hampden may be – accept that their next trophy will be their first. The trouble is that no-one else – again despite anything from Hampden – will cast them as anything else other than a new club who were given a free passage into the higher echelons of the game. Furthermore, they will forever force that down the throats of Rangers fans whenever and wherever they play. A recipe for discord, threats of violence, actual violence, and a general ramping up of the sectarian gas that we had all hoped, only a year or so ago, was to be set to an all-time low peep.
There is a saying in politics that we get the government we deserve. It works both ways though, and the SFA will get the audience it deserves. In actual fact it is the one it has actively sought over the last couple of years, for they have tacitly (and even perhaps explicitly) admitted that Scottish Football is a dish best served garnished with sectarianism. They have effectively told us that without it, the game cannot flourish, and they stick to that fallacy even although the empirical evidence of the past year indicates otherwise.
That belief is an intellectual black-hole they have now thrust the game into. They have effectively said that only two clubs actually matter in Scottish football. The crazy thing is that to put their plans into action they have successfully persuaded enough of the other clubs to jump into the chasm and hence vote themselves into irrelevance and permanent semi-obscurity.
That belief is also shared by the majority in the MSM, who despite their lofty, self-righteous and ostensibly anti-sectarian stance, have done everything they can to stir the hornet’s nest in the interests of greater sales.
Act as an unpaid wing of a PR company, check nothing, ask nothing, help to create unrest, and then tut-tut away indignantly like Monty Python Pepperpots when people take them to task.
Consequently the victims of all the wrongdoing (creditors and clubs) walk away without any redress or compensation for the loss of income and opportunity (and history) – stripped of any pride and dignity since they do so in the full knowledge of what has happened. But even as they wipe away the sand kicked in their faces, those clubs still insist on the loyalty of their own fanbases, the same fans whose trust they have betrayed with their meek acceptance of the new, old order.
The kinder interpretation of the impotence of the clubs is that they want to avoid the hassle and move on, the more cynical view that they are interested only in money, not people. In either case, sporting integrity, in the words of Lord Traynor of Winhall (Airdrie, not Vermont), is “crap”.
The question is; which constituency of 21st century Scotland subscribes to that 17th century paradigm?
Sadly, this massive hoax, this gigantic insult to our collective intelligence, is working. Many will leave the game – many already have in view of the spineless absence of intervention from their own clubs – but many, many more will stay and support the charade.
If you doubt my prediction, ask yourself how many tickets will be unsold the first time the New Rangers play Celtic at Parkhead? That my friends will be final imprimatur of authenticity on just exactly who New Rangers are, no matter the proclamations of both sides of the OCNC argument.
God rest you Paul…Devastated..
I didn’t know Paul that well but I always enjoyed his blogs, the one thing that jumped out to me was his willingness to allow all fans a voice. He often agreed with some of the important points being raised to back up arguments from the Rangers camp and annoying as it was (to me as a non-Rangers supporter), he seemed correct from a legal standpoint and was not afraid to put his point of view.
And for his troubles he was branded a “Rangers hater”. Ironic as he seemed like the complete opposite, his input, like many others, could have helped them if they had listened.
It’s sad to see another educator leaving the group.
700,000 RIFC shares traded this morning. Looks like the position consolidation continues.
No matter what has irked you in life something unfortunate comes along that we have to stop and think about life and how we value it,Paul McBride ,Corsica and Paul McConville where 3 leaders in exampling integrity to us all and always carried this out in such a way we all could understand, where they where comming from and where they where going ,unselfish to a man in what ugly retributes would be delivered by evil and uneducated alike because of their stance ,not all would have had the pleasure of learning from these 3 guys but more than most will admit they will have read their comments and knew deep down these where men of their time on this earth ,not a claim but a bestowment from others that will have encountered them in whatever way ,it would be nice if some of the pundits where to acknowledge that they had the chance to read some of the material that was blogged by if not the 3 men but Paul McConville at the very least ,a chance for them to show if they have an ounce of intergrity in any of them ,baited breath.
From the Scotsman
“RANGERS chairman David Somers has used the notice of the forthcoming annual general meeting to ask shareholders to vote against proposals for a new board.
In his notice to shareholders, Somers calls for shareholders to back the board’s ten resolutions for the meeting, describing the resolutions as “most likely to promote the success of the Company for the benefit of its shareholders as a whole.”
Somers then urges shareholders to vote against the resolutions calling for Paul Murray, Malcolm Murray, Scott Murdoch and Alex Wilson to be appointed as board members.
‘Not in the best interests of the Company’
Somers states that the current board “does not believe these Resolutions are in the best interests of the Company”, and raises concerns that any new appointments could lead to yet more instability at the club.
Somers writes: “As none of the required AIM or SFA regulatory consents have been obtained for these proposed appointments to the Board there can be no guarantee that each of these individuals will be found to be suitable to act as a director of the Company or that the Board would be able to function properly having made these appointments.
“As such, in the event that the required regulatory consents can not be obtained this may result in certain of these individuals not being able to act as directors of the Company, resulting in further changes to the composition of the Board to ensure a fully competent and functioning Board.”
‘No notices’
Somers also suggests that the prospective board members are yet to provide their credentials, or notices stating their consent to be appointed. He writes: “The Company has not received a notice with the requisite particulars for each of the proposed directors’ appointments.
“The Company has not received notices from each of the proposed directors indicating their consent to act as directors of the Company. As such, the proposed appointments would be in breach of the Company’s Articles of Association.
Background
The Resolutions calling for the four new appointees to the Rangers board are on the agenda by court order, after Paul Murray succeeded in a Court of Session bid to postpone the AGM from its original date in October.
A source close to Murray told the Daily Mail that Somers’ statement was seen as “disgraceful” by the requisitioners and their key ally, Clyde Blowers chief Jim McColl.
Rangers’ AGM will be held on 21 December at Ibrox Stadium.”
In the last para, the Scotsman with its usual attention to the facts, has moved the AGM to the 21st, then again, perhaps they know something no-one else does?
Scapa
Somers speaks with spiv slanted tongue rather than sounding independent.
Barca
Will get back to you but will leave ‘heated debate’ for a day or so.
“Somers speaks with spiv slanted tongue rather than sounding independent.”
You don’t sound in the least surprised….
Scapa
I’m only surprised that he has made it so obvious and opened the door to reasonable doubt regarding his ‘independence’.
An OG.
Greenock Jack says: (202)
November 27, 2013 at 12:27 pm
Its not very smart, but, they have won, and can afford be to triumphalist. The AGM show will be the best entertainment in Glasgow that day, for under a pound!
I have just read Big Pink’s excellent post and indeed we are beyond the event. I am of the view that the survival of Rangers in any shape or form is immaterial.It is a new club ,as the previous incarnation self-combusted and vapourised in 2012.
I am ,however,far more concerned that the governance of football in Scotland allowed the new incarnation to play in the Scottish Leagues given the level of proven transgression .In addition the fact that ‘the Rangers’ have an unbeaten run is not worthy of comment given their renewed commitment to financially outgunning their league opponents.Had they played in the wilderness and eventually won re-entry with a youth team then I would have readily acknowledged their success.
This is where we are, beyond the event, and I would hope that from now on all transgressions past and present come to light .
I am sure Paul McConville would have wanted that. His blogs were always worth reading and without malice. I am very sorry to hear of his death at too young an age.
I see the Dueling Banjos, Messers leggat & McMurdo are still at it. Playing for their favoured side for all they are worth.
Mr McMurdo is trailing an interesting development, given that all the fan groups, with the exception of the Vanguard Bears are to one degree or another anti-board, the club/company/philosophical construct are apparently investigating setting up their own “Official” fan group. I thought the whole point of fan groups was to be as un-offical as possible, but there you go.
What surprises me is that Smudger is the name in the frame to lead this new group. I would have thought that Mr Smith would have more sense than get involved again, until what he’s getting involved with is a lot clearer than it is at the moment.
Scapa
Complacency or Campaigning ?
I think it is the latter, unless they are hoovering up more shares.
Still trying to get my head around the shocking and untimely death of Paul McConnville. Rest In Peace Paul. My thoughts are with your family.
I didn’t know you, but I would like to have.
Smugas says: (560)
November 26, 2013 at 1:50 pm
12 0 Rate This
I am genuinely sorry for continuing this debate!
I’m sorry, but all the contrition in the world cannot change the technical arguement. The emotional one, yes absolutely. I would be very interested if Barca went back and inserted the word emotional into his response at 12.59 as an afterthought? I was also a “to the first division” supporter at the outset, back when doing such a thing seemed utterly unthinkable. Their hardened stance since has simply hardened mine.
===========================
The emotional aspect was in the original post. I have always accepted that emotionally this is the same club. Until recently I haven’t bothered about the technical aspect. Unless the creditors are going to get paid by proving a technical argument, I can’t see much benefit one way or the other. My view technically it’s a new club, but i don’t get worked up about it
However, as long as the arrogance continues, along with the denial , the refusal to apologize or accept responsibility, and the lack of action against David Murray. Then I agree, attitudes will only harden.
The SFA have handled this in an amateurish , utterly incompetent manner . They are absolutely shot as an organization with the current leadership in place. They can sit in their bunker and delude themselves that Solomon couldn’t have solved this, however courage , leadership and complete neutrality would have seen this issue on the back burner long before now
Like the vast majority of those on here I only knew Paul McConville via his writing on his Scots Law Blog which was informative, funny and thought provoking all at the same time.
I don’t know how long his blog will remain on the web but if possible, and with the consent of Paul’s family, could a section be created within TSFM to contain an archive of his work?
Barca
I don’t think that Courage, Leadership, Neutrality are words that can be found in the SFA lexicon.
Though “Courage, Leadership, Neutrality”, does sound like a good motto for the organisation, once my Robespierre figure, (assuming I ever find one), has done his/her work
A man who made every day a school day. Paul McConville – a talent lost. RIP
On SFA governance.
One of the problems is personnel and the revolving door between SFA exec positions and clubs.
Maybe its time to put some distance between the SFA and the clubs. The rules should be changed putting a two year gap between holding an exec/director level position at a club, and holding the CEO, President or 1st/2nd Vice President positions at the SFA. Similarly, there should be a two year gap between leaving the CEO, President, 1st/2nd Vice President postitions, and joining any club at Executive/Director level.
Article 14 deals with transfer of membership and clearly states ” the SFA Board has “complete discretion to refuse or grant such application on such terms and CONDITIONS as the Board shall think fit.”.
I do not see what all the fuss is about.
Rangers membership was transferred to Sevco( Scotland) Ltd with CONDITIONS, objecting to a ” conditional membership” is only valid if you are interested in playing semantic games.
scapaflow @ 1:58pm
Perhaps a better rule change would be to remove the role of President altogether and use the money saved for something more constructive.
(I actually struggle to think of anything more destructive to the game in this country than the actions of the current incumbent.)
I have never really seen the point in the position. It smacks of an outdated world of unearned privilege and power.
In all honesty, having raised this subject, l don’t feel much like discussing it today.
The news of the untimely death of Paul McConville who I will now never have the pleasure of meeting has left me completely flattened.
I think No1 Bob’s idea of an archive of Paul’s articles here is a splendid one.
I hope it can be achieved.
Requisitioners announcement
The full statement:
In July we embarked upon a campaign to remove certain directors from the Board of Rangers Football Club and to prevent Charles Green from returning to the Club which he was attempting to do at that time.
We were supported by other like minded individuals including major institutional shareholders and the fans who were all concerned about the apparent lack of corporate governance and financial transparency.
In particular we were all concerned about the significant outflows of cash since the IPO and the obvious dysfunctionality of the Board. Since the IPO ,11 months ago, the Club has had 3 Chairman, 3 Chief Executives and 3 Nomads. This is highly unusual for a public company and may even be unprecedented.
We have been relentless in our pursuit of change as have the fans with whom we are totally aligned.
Together we have already achieved a lot.
In the last 4 months we have seen Green banished from the Club followed by 3 of his fellow directors. Of the 6 directors who were on the Board when we started, only 2 remain.
In the past 3 weeks there have been 3 new appointments to the Board. On paper these look like credible individuals who appear to be independent of the Green or Whyte regimes. They will have the opportunity over the coming weeks to prove this and to gain the trust of the fans which they will have to earn.
We believe that the position of Brian Stockbridge is completely untenable and he should resign or be voted off the Board at the AGM. He has presided over significant outflows of cash from the Club since the IPO. In addition his personal conduct has fallen a long way short of the standards expected at Rangers Football Club.
We have been provided with a statement from an ex-employee of the Club questioning various payments made to certain shareholders around the time of the IPO. The ex-employee has reported the matter to the Serious Fraud Office.
On October 14 we won our case at the Court of Session to have four individuals, Paul Murray, Malcolm Murray, Scott Murdoch and Alex Wilson, nominated for election to the Board at the AGM.
As well as being supporters of the Club all 4 men have had highly successful business careers. To help the Club all 4 men are prepared to waive any director fees until the Club is back in the SPL if they are elected at the AGM.
All existing directors will be up for re-election on December 19 at the AGM and the shareholders will therefore have a one-off opportunity to select the best Board to take the Club forward.
We will continue our campaign to the AGM and we would encourage all fans and shareholders to support the changes we have been fighting for over the past 4 months.
After December 19 we must move forward with stability, integrity and transparency as we rebuild the Club back to the highest levels of Scottish and European football.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says: (1036)
November 27, 2013 at 2:38 pm
The world’s first No Surrender, Surrender?
REALLY? How exactly did YOU do this?
Steerpike says: (122) November 27, 2013 at 2:20 pm
Article 14 deals with transfer of membership and clearly states ” the SFA Board has “complete discretion to refuse or grant such application on such terms and CONDITIONS as the Board shall think fit.”.
==================================
Steerpike – What is the header of the section in the SFA Articles which contains the part you have quoted?
It is not headed “Transfer of Membership” is it?
I’ll save you looking it up. It is headed “Prohibition on Transfer of Membership”, so it is you who is playing semantic games.
The article starts: “It is not permissible for a member to transfer directly or indirectly its membership of the Association to another member or to any other entity and any such transfer or attempt to effect such a transfer is prohibited save as otherwise provided in this Article 16.”
As you say, the board has discretion to override its own stated rules, and yet there is a seeming reluctance to admit that “Rangers” were given exceptional assistance by the footballing authorities in 2011 through to 2013. Because that is what exercising discretion actually means for “Rangers”.
If exercising discretion becomes the norm (as it has for “Rangers”) then the SFA would be as well dispensing with all their existing articles in favour of a single new one, i.e. “The SFA Board will exercise complete discretion in all matters”
I have just learnt the terrible news about Paul McConville of Scotslawthoughts and can’t really find the words to express my sorrow to Val and the girls. Paul really was a giant of a man both intellectually and in his ability to see some good in everyone.
He will be sadly and sorely missed for a host of reasons by many people who never met him but he will live long in their memory and affection because they were privileged to read his work.
To think that he was celebrating his 20th wedding anniversary in September. Anyone who wants a glimpse into the personal side of Paul should read his post on that day which clearly meant so much to him.
http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2013/09/18/the-most-important-blog-i-have-written-what-happened-20-years-ago-today/
Not The Huddle Malcontent says: (1037)
November 27, 2013 at 2:38 pm
Requisitioners announcement
In particular we were all concerned about the significant outflows of cash since the IPO and the obvious dysfunctionality of the Board. Since the IPO ,11 months ago, the Club has had 3 Chairman, 3 Chief Executives and 3 Nomads. This is highly unusual for a public company and may even be unprecedented.
________________________________________________________________________________
They just can’t stop chalking up those world records 🙂
Steerpike says: (122)
The shocking, sad and untimely demise of Paul yesterday heralds the return of Steerpike today to TSFM.
Wish I got paid for posting too.
Apologies for my ignorance ,but who exactly does the monicor WE belong to in the requisitors statement,the only common denominator from IPO I can see as a WE is Ally
Another 2 lots of 100k shares traded this afternoon in additon to the 700k earlier.
Things shaping up nicely for the AGM.
FIFA says: (424)
November 27, 2013 at 3:15 pm
Apologies for my ignorance ,but who exactly does the monicor WE belong to in the requisitors statement …
——
Well …wait for it … the People, obviously. 😉
@Jambo,
“As you say, the board has discretion to override its own stated rules, and yet there is a seeming reluctance to admit that “Rangers” were given exceptional assistance by the footballing authorities in 2011 through to 2013. Because that is what exercising discretion actually means for “Rangers”. ”
=================================================================================
The SFA did not override any stated rules, the membership was granted with conditions, this is within the stated rules,, the heading does not alter the meaning of the statement, it is unambiguous.
Latching on other claims of ” exceptional assistance ” to invalidate membership is called a non sequitur, the reluctance of the SFA to admit anything is logical, conditional membership is within the rules.
Finloch says: (224)
November 27, 2013 at 3:13 pm
I just read through the piece on Paul’s wedding anniversary that Ecobhoy kindly supplied the link for, never met the guy and I found it very touching. If it’s not read out at his funeral I would be surprised. What did disappoint me of course was some of the comments on the link posted by our “friend” Steerpike, words fail me Finloch
Finloch,
Your comment is in very poor taste.
Go on then. I’ll have a stab at analysis.
from the req statement (see what I did there 😉 )
We … the peepil, the obviously ….. have been relentless in our pursuit of change as have the fans with whom we are totally aligned …. right up to the bit where money is discussed, whereupon we have left them to sink, or sink further, whilst all the time ironically claiming we should be in charge on their behalf.
Together we have already achieved a lot …. well apart from losing the money bit obviously
In the last 4 months we have seen Green retire …. with a mega pay off …. from the Club followed by 3 of his fellow directors …. for whom the chateaux bell tolled.
Of the 6 directors who were on the Board when we started, only 2 remain …. and we’re fairly sure approx 1.63m increasing to 2.5m if they have the nerve to drawdown Ashley’s money should see them off too. But then, its hovver pitches all round.
In the past 3 weeks there have been 3 new appointments to the Board. On paper these look like credible …. but one of them hadn’t polished his brogues and the other two had Craigy on speed dial …. individuals who appear to be independent of the Green or Whyte regimes …. see above. They will have the opportunity over the coming weeks to prove this …. by buying Messi and Iniesta …. and to gain the trust of the fans which they will have to earn …. by buying Puyol too.
We believe that the position of Brian Stockbridge is completely untenable and he should resign or be voted off the Board at the AGM. He has presided over significant outflows of cash from the Club since the IPO …. however in desperate need of a reason to pay him off, since clearly losing money hand over fist isn’t going to cut it, why single him out? …. in addition his personal conduct has fallen a long way short of the standards expected at Rangers Football Club …. blazer creased?
We have been provided with a statement …. and a cardigan …. from an ex-employee of the Club questioning …. well when we say questioning we mean passing on Martin Bain’s questions …. various payments made to certain shareholders around the time of the IPO. The ex-employee …. being the only one allegedly never to have received an EBT and therefore confident enough to cross the doorstep …. has reported the matter to the Serious Fraud Office.
Sorry, sombre mood seems to have led an outbreak of cynicism.
Finloch says: (224)
November 27, 2013 at 3:13 pm
Now there is a troll who should, most definitely not be fed
On a daily basis he posted on Paul’s blog and not a single word of condolence for him.
Now he is straight back on here to deflect and distract.
Scottish Football needs strong and clear thinking guys like Paul McConville.
R.I.P.
briggsbhoy,
I suggest you do a bit more research before you try and assassinate my character, my relationship with Paul began in March 2012 and I resent your implication.
” On a daily basis he posted on Paul’s blog and not a single word of condolence for him. ”
===============================================================================
Incorrect and unnecessary.
Steerpike says: (126)
Incorrect and unnecessary and bad taste etc etc
…………………………………………………………………………….
But highly remunerative.
Kilgore Trout says: (95)
November 27, 2013 at 2:37 pm
Kilgour, I take your point.
The job titles are more than a bit reminiscent of a seedy golf club, replete with stale beer and faded copies of the Daily Mail on the bar.
However, and I say this with absolutely no respect for Mr Petrie, it is simply not on for a serving Club Chairman to be Vice-anything at the SFA. The SFA is supposed to be the regulator for this industry, as in other sectors, we are seeing the disastrous consequences of having the regulator and the industry as one and the same thing.
I had the pleasure of meeting Paul McConville around a year ago. He was pointed out to me and I introduced myself as a follower of his blog. I expressed my admiration for his stance of ‘putting his head above the parapet’ and stated (with drink taken) that I was considering something similar, we should stand up and be counted, all that malarkey. Paul was horrified and proceeded to lecture me on the attendant risks that would accompany such madness. I reluctantly agreed with him and we had a very pleasant 5 minutes.
The next day it occurred to me that I had not asked Paul if the ‘attendant risks’ did not also apply to him and his family and resolved to one day ask him.
That I will be denied that opportunity is, for me, very sad, a regret I will remember a long time.
Truly a gentleman and an inspiration.
Ranger’s statement in response to the requistioners
“”THE board notes the comments made by a group of businessmen and minor investors led by Mr Jim McColl.
“We would make the following points:-
“Rangers have not been contacted by the SFO and are completely unaware of any investigation.
“There has been no lack of financial transparency, quite the opposite. We have been through a full blown IPO with financial due diligence. Interim and full year accounts have been produced earlier than AIM deadlines and in accordance with the rules and we have an unqualified audit report
“Corporate governance under a previous chairman was nowhere near the high quality of corporate governance that is now in place. The club now has a new, professional board who will deliver the highest standards of corporate governance.
“The outflows of cash include a large amount of exceptional running and salary costs that were inherited from the previous board , costs that were initiated by Malcolm Murray when he was Chairman.
“Despite this, the Financial Director Brian Stockbridge has addressed planned expenditure from facilities, made substantial savings on security by bringing it in-house and making it a revenue generating centre and saved substantial amounts from the catering contract this season.
“We can only assume that confidential information that an ex employee leaked to the requisitioners was in relation to the payments to certain shareholders that was looked at by two sets of lawyers and the nomad at the time and then subject to an additional specific review.
“It will have escaped nobody’s attention that Mr McColl and his colleagues are appearing at a fans forum in Glasgow tomorrow evening and today’s statement appears to be a rather crude attempt to garner support for their cause.””
……….today’s statement appears to be a rather crude attempt to garner support for their cause.”
aye, that would be outrageous behaviour right enough.
pau1mart1n says: (251)
November 27, 2013 at 6:32 pm
So sad the untimely death of PMcConville, I wish his family my condolences, he leaves behind a great body of work on the Sevco fiasco and I will use it as a reference point when the need arises.
RIP big man,
Where is Bryce today, is he away annoying some unsuspecting bloggers elsewhere,with his wit and knowledge of the articles of the SFA..I. Hear we was given short shrift on a Hearts blog site about his Neanderthal outlook on life in the west of Scotland. Some people just can’t help themselves.
Or maybe he’s still on his lunch hour.
scapaflow says: (1203)
November 27, 2013 at 4:45 pm
Kilgore Trout says: (95)
November 27, 2013 at 2:37 pm
Kilgour, I take your point.
The job titles are more than a bit reminiscent of a seedy golf club, replete with stale beer and faded copies of the Daily Mail on the bar.
However, and I say this with absolutely no respect for Mr Petrie, it is simply not on for a serving Club Chairman to be Vice-anything at the SFA. The SFA is supposed to be the regulator for this industry, as in other sectors, we are seeing the disastrous consequences of having the regulator and the industry as one and the same thing.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The current construction is the recipe for the disaster it has produced. Not only do the SFA have to look at their internal constitution, they also have to look at the relationship with the SPFL.
I remember reading the following with incredulity.
The SFA insist they are football’s umbrella body in the game but have no jurisdiction over the running of the SPL or any league for that matter:
“The Scottish FA has no jurisdiction over the competition rules of league bodies. Through the Professional Game Board, we can provide a forum for debate on matters such as league reconstruction.” –
Is it not time the purpose of the SFA is defined to reflect the needs of the present time and proper checks and balances put in place?
Scottish football governance is the equivalent of two clowns, high on candy floss, trying to ride the same unicycle at the same time in opposite directions.
chancer67 says: (106)
November 27, 2013 at 7:11 pm
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Where is Bryce today, is he away annoying some unsuspecting bloggers elsewhere,with his wit and knowledge of the articles of the SFA..I. Hear we was given short shrift on a Hearts blog site about his Neanderthal outlook on life in the west of Scotland. Some people just can’t help themselves.
Or maybe he’s still on his lunch hour.
======================
Think it’s his day off today. Steerpike is on shift.
Auldheid says: (1055)
November 27, 2013 at 7:12 pm
“Scottish football governance is the equivalent of two clowns, high on candy floss, trying to ride the same unicycle at the same time in opposite directions.”
That is a calumny on Coco the Clown and his compatriots. The Scottish Football authorities are a Hampden farce, with Mr Ogilvy in the Brian Rix role!
I was lucky enough to meet Paul at a Q&A session last year and have nothing but respect for him. So young but now gone, God bless him and his family. Will miss his thoughts and analysis.
When a Rangers supporting friend & colleague pointed out the RTC blog to me several years ago, I barely had time to thank him for it. A world of excellent analysis of dodgy business dealing, detailing a litany of misdemeanours as long as a very long thing, perpetrated by Rangers under SDM in the name of sporting competition. This, then continued by the MBB himself with remarkable bluster and chicanery aided and abetted by a Scottish media craving the next generation of success at Ibrox laid bare by thorough investigative work by many excellent contributors. Among these was Paul McConville who provided additional legal takes on various threads which only added to an amazing tapestry of a football club in its death throes. The countless hours days and weeks I spent on RTC, Paul’s blog and TSFM, as I got- and still get- my fix of information, endless witticisms, anecdotes and investigative bampottery ( God knows it was in short supply elsewhere!) were many hours of pleasure and education. If people and most pertinently Rangers fans wanted some truth about their club, and for mostly all, unpalatable truths they would’ve done a lot worse than to read Paul’s blog.
Here’s to Mr McConville, every day was a school day with your excellent contributions.
For your family and friends my utmost sympathies, and condolences in the most difficult of times.
To the rest of you if only for purely selfish reasons please continue to contribute to blogs like this – a band of internet bampot brothers and sisters, I believe it also serves as a fitting tribute to Paul’s memory and his work.
,
Did anyone read Graham Spiers comments on Celtic in the Herald today? While there is no doubt there is much about Celtic this season that is up for debate, I was surprised to see Spiers use the Jelavic transfer to Rangers in 2010 as a stick to beat Celtic with. Spiers opined that Rangers put all their eggs in one basket and got a top quality striker. Jelavic is a really good player, but I guess Spiers missed the fact that Rangers achieved the square root of nothing in Europe with him in their side, including dismal failure in the qualifying rounds of two competitions in 2011. At the end of the day that is not what bothers me though, it is the fact Rangers owed the wee tax case at the time, had the big case hanging over them, and still spent £4m on a player, much of which had still not been paid when the club was liquidated. One wonders if Spiers was actually happier when ‘Walter” was allowed to spend as much of other people’s money as he liked. No matter his views on Celtic’s forays into the transfer market this season, and he is gratuitously savaging on that score, the money spent was honestly earned and was not owed to anyone else.
Spiers IMO, is an utter disgrace the way he clings to the starry eyed view of Rangers under ‘Walter’, even when they shafted every man, woman and child in the U.K.
Like most right-minded people I am shocked and very saddened by news of Paul’s untimely death.My deepest condolences to his family. May he Rest in Peace.
And if the Blog might forgive me, that Steerpike, away an get tae f…………….
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/paul-mcconville/#more-4224
The last 24 hours have seemed rather unreal.
I was joking and laughing with the big fella on Friday night.
Planet Fitba has lost one of the good guys.
My thoughts are with Val and the girls.
🙁
scapaflow says: (1204)
November 27, 2013 at 6:23 pm
Ranger’s statement in response to the requistioners …
“The club now has a new, professional board who will deliver the highest standards of corporate governance.”
——
Eh? The club – that ethereal entity which is definitely not a company – has a board, does it?
Mr Bryce – your thoughts on this, please … and I still await your reasoning as to why Rangers did not play in Europe having “qualified” via their SPL placing.
I agree Phil
Let’s have a moratorium on navel gazing and pi5h on the site with respect to Paul McConville. I loved his writing style – so clear and precise but an absolute gentleman (in the true sense of the word). I didn’t know Paul but wish I had met him – his personality came through his writing and it was a pleasure to read his blog.
Ffs life is too short and woefully unappreciated
And another thing – Paul blogged without a nom de plume – wouldn’t it be a sign of respect if we followed suit? I’m up for this if you can edit user names
A Dog Called Cooperette And The Difference Between A Pedigree And A History
I hope this analogy is original.
Last Saturday my wife and I were lucky enough to become owners of a lovely Irish setter puppy we’ve named Cooper. There were 4 bitches in the litter and we could have just as easily acquired Cooperette and for the purposes of my analogy I will pretend we did.
We were able to meet Cooperette’s mum, and Cooperette’s mum’s mum. Unfortunately we were unable to meet Cooperette’s mum’s mum’s mum as she died several years ago but there were several photographs to see. I was immediately struck by how similar the 4 dogs looked (same strip). They all, of course had the same people looking after (or supporting) them and all had or still did live in the same Big House (no explanation required). It probably is possible to clone Dolly The Setter but all of these dogs had been conceived and born through natural means and quite clearly are 4 different dogs. I was able to view the pedigree of Cooperette and was very impressed at the very impressive list of trophies and honours Cooperette’s predecessors had won. Indeed, when I bought Cooperette I acquired all of Cooperette’s assets including not only the pedigree, but 2 bags of dried food, a cheap collar, a rubbishy toy and some worming tablets in addition. Although these were actually worth £1.78, I acquired them for 7p, stiffing the owner of the worming tablets in the act. I also completed a transfer of Cooperette’s Kennel Club membership from the breeders to me and my wife. There were however rumours that when Cooperette’s predecessors had been sold, the breeders had not declared this income to HMRC and had paid no income tax, and furthermore had deliberately withheld information on their Kennel Club registration form for all their dogs over several generations. Furthermore, for even longer, Cooperette’s breeders have forbidden their bitches to breed with Catholic breeders’s dogs and will not sell puppies to Catholic owners.
No doubt the Kennel Club have all sorts of rules and regulations which I have absolutely no doubt they rigidly enforce, but let’s pretend that Rover Ogilvie, Patch Regan and Lassie Bryson were president, CEO and Registration Officer respectively, and ignored some rules and made up new ones in order to pretend that somehow all 4 dogs were somehow one and the same dog, confident in the knowledge that Rufus Keevins et al who write for Scottish Pedigree Dog Monthly would tell blatant lies about the old dog new dog question.
In due course we decide to show Cooperette for the 1st time at the Ramsden’s Dog Challenge. His main rival is a different breed called Brechin. But there’s only one small problem. The Kennel Club membership transfer between Cooperette’s mum and Cooperette has not been completed, and both are members at the same time; Cooperette was competing against Brechin while Cooperette’s mum was clearly and visibly still alive, but due to be put down the following week.
Last Saturday I saw 3 clearly different but closely related dogs.
Sevco, a club with an impressive pedigree but a pathetic history.
Never posted a RIP type message on a blog before although probably should have on several occasions. Tommy Burns is possibly the best example, but the inevitability of his death ever so slightly lessened its impact. It just isn’t my style. Paul McConville’s tragic and premature death, however, has prompted me to ‘break my duck’. Stunning intellect, clarity of thought and humour. As others have said, no affinity whatsoever with my club Celtic, just an afifinity with ‘sporting integrity’ in the only country on the planet where such an idea is mocked and derided by so many.
ollielogie – a fine plan, if you’re prepared to put up with the type of flak that Mr McConville had to bear.
Personally, since 1994 I’ve never used my full name on an internet forum – and much less chance recently, given how much I can find out about myself by Googling my own name! – but I generally use my real first name. Easier than thinking of a suitably humourous or earnest pseudonym, that’s all. 1983, you’ll recall, was the last time a Scottish fitba team won a European trophy or two. 🙂
PhilMacGiollaBhain
Do you not think a phone call you allegedly made yesterday was utterly insensitive, crass and self serving? I know I’ll get the TD as I’m new on this site (although have posted a few times before under variations of Bryce Curdy as well as on RTC and indeed your own blog).
redlichtie says: (286)
November 27, 2013 at 4:24 pm
——————————————
RL, That’s a fine, eloquent way to pay tribute to Paul McConville.
He made an outstanding contribution on the demise of Rangers Football Club, a contribution that will live long after Rangers is finally extinguished.
54 (fine random thoughts re Scots law) to remember Paul by.
RIP
Angus1983,
The key question, regarding Gers’ UEFA ban in relation to the OCNC, is this:
Is the fact of Rangers’ exclusion from european competition compatible with the football authorities, including UEFA, viewing Rangers as a continuing football club albeit a new corporate entity?
In my opinion the answer is yes.
1. The wording of Article 12 (the relevant uefa rule) specifys that any “alteration to a club’s legal form or company structure” is viewed “within the meaning of this provision” (as in it might not be the case in general terms but it applies for the purposes of the rule) as an interruption to the membership which must have lasted for 4 years in order to get a UEFA licence.
So, there is a scenario provided for in uefa rules where a football club can be seen as having continued but, due to legal/corporate changes, be in effect punished with the effect of being banned from europe for 4 years. This actuality was realised in the case of FC Timiosara, not identical to Gers, but similar. http://www.uefa.org/aboutuefa/news/newsid=1652377.html
2. The case of Derry City, whose oldco was liquidated, and a newco carried on the name/brand/badge of “Derry City FC” (at the least) at Brandywell (it matters not to me whether it’s the same club or not, this is about how UEFA treat them).
I actually wrote an article about this scenario, how it appeared UEFA were recognising continuity between oldco/newcos in Derry’s situation. There has been conflicting information since then, but, today, a look at the Derry City FC page on the UEFA site is unambiguously suggestive of one continuing football club (with numerous references to the club’s history pre-2009, oldco co-efficient points added to newco-won points in rankings table) http://www.uefa.com/teamsandplayers/teams/club=50086/profile/index.html
….Anyway, bottom line is UEFA haven’t yet come out and clarified either way. Apparently UEFA responded to the ASA’s recent investigation and clarified they recognised “sporting continuity” despite a club changing “corporate structure”, but I’ll wait for the official ruling on that. When push comes to shove, it’s the national associations that govern their football clubs and their status, but to OCNC obsessives like myself, it’s an interesting one to key an eye on.
As I posted somewhere else recently, the Scottish Cup competition might provide a bit of meat to chew on regarding the ‘debate’….
— UEFA don’t update Gers league fixtures because they don’t update the league fixtures of ANY club outside their nation’s top tier. However, second tier sides that have their own UEFA page (only the few that have ventured into europe over the last 5 years) have had cup games added to the results column. Interesting to see whether Gers do. Last season they didn’t.
— In addition to this, there is a tab on each club’s domestic page that gives squad details for the Cup. This – in contrast to the results column – WAS updated last November, prior to a Newco tie with Elgin, on the original “oldco” UEFA page, which was an indication of continuity in the eyes of someone editing that page, at least! Whether the same happens this year, who knows.
Watch this space for both… http://www.uefa.com/teamsandplayers/teams/club=50121/domestic/
bryce9a says: (39)
November 28, 2013 at 12:17 am
Angus1983,
The key question, regarding Gers’ UEFA ban in relation to the OCNC, is this:
Is the fact of Rangers’ exclusion from european competition compatible with the football authorities, including UEFA, viewing Rangers as a continuing football club albeit a new corporate entity?
In my opinion the answer is yes.
1. The wording of Article 12 (the relevant uefa rule) specifys that any “alteration to a club’s legal form or company structure” is viewed “within the meaning of this provision” (as in it might not be the case in general terms but it applies for the purposes of the rule) as an interruption to the membership which must have lasted for 4 years in order to get a UEFA licence.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Can you explain to me why that did not apply when Craig Whyte bought RFC 1872 from David Murray.
I also believe it did not effect MCFC when the Arab Chaps bough Man City, or when the Russian Chap bought Chelsea,
is it only Yorkshire men that are not allowed to have their new purchases play in Europe,
it seem like such a waste to have an existing club transfer it’s membership to itself if that the case
Angus1983 says: (1260)
November 27, 2013 at 10:40 pm
===============================
Re posting under your real name on Internet forums. In the early days, around the turn of the millenium, one of the few forums available was from the BBC. In many ways it was like this one, in that there could be reasoned, generally non abusive discussion. I posted under my own name as did many others. Then the forum started to turn a wee bit nasty, and a couple of comments were made to me that made it clear the person, posting under a non de plume, knew who I was. The comments were not in themselves threatening but some of the material the person posted in general was enough to unnerve me.
It is great to say in principle we should all post under our own name, but sadly it is a high risk strategy. Posting responsibly under our non de plume’s is perfectly acceptable to me.
Thursday 28 November, 2013
Rangers Int F.C. PLC
Holding(s) in Company
RNS Number : 1228U
Rangers Int. Football Club PLC
28 November 2013
Rangers International Football Club plc
(“Rangers” or the “Company”)
Holdings in Company
The Company announces that it was notified yesterday that Alexander Easdale purchased 100,000 ordinary shares of 1 penny each in the Company (“Ordinary Shares”) at a price of 44p per share on 27 November 2013. As a result, Mr Easdale now holds 2,942,957 Ordinary Shares in the Company, equal to 4.52% of the issued share capital of the Company. As previously announced, Mr Easdale also holds voting rights over, but does not own, a further 12,352,666 Ordinary Shares, representing 18.98% of the Company, meaning that in total he holds voting rights over 15,295,623 Ordinary Shares, representing 23.50% of the issued share capital of the Company.
Bryce, Angus
Genuine question!
Why were Celtic not prevented from European competition in 1994 ?
I think it is quite clear from UEFA. If Rangers Football CLUB (that’s club remember) were at least 3 years old they would have played in Europe last season. They didn’t and can’t until they are 3 years old. Only a club can apply for a license, not a holding company for example. I think UEFA might be trying to tell us something.
Anyway. Who owns said club this week? Is it Sevco 5088 or Sevco Scotland?
I see that Aberdeen have 15M of debt which has to be paid back over the next five years.
Without the full picture a number can sometimes be misleading but what caught my eye was the Chairman’s reasoning behind his statement, that the club was in a sound position.
One was the improved performance of the team.
The other the improving general economic outlook.
I would argue that neither has solid foundation and therefore Milne understates the risks.
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/aberdeen-chairman-stewart-milne-insists-2855593
FYI: An article from the financial website ‘Thisismoney.co.uk’
Co-op Bank slammed for dishing out £33m in cheap loans and overdrafts to Celtic Football Club
http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-2514682/Co-op-Bank-slammed-cheap-loans-Celtic-Football-Club.html#ixzz2ltUvvAa2
Thank you Bryce – a reasoned argument.
Coatbrigbhoy – The CW situation was different – he bought the existing company/club rather than starting a new one. So the “company structure” didn’t change.
Round Baw – because the OF always get preferential treatment 🙂 No, actually, I’m no expert on Celtic’s company structure – but I believe that all they did was change the type of company they were from Ltd to PLC in 1994. They still have the same company number – SC003487 – and so are the same legal entity as they’ve ever been. TRFC, on the other hand, have a shiny new company number (despite what some of their official emails say), and are therefore an entirely different company.
bryce9a says: (39)
November 28, 2013 at 12:17 am
It seems UEFA have problems with their website regarding updating rankings, according to this wee conversation on bert kassies forum. You might recognise one of the names on there Bryce!
http://kassiesa.net/uefa/forum/view.php?topic=20130909172306.xml
Derry City were treated as a new club in the actual draw so it seems.
Just as in the corporate world the distinction exists between buying a business through the purchase of shares, or through the purchase of assets/TUPE-ing of staff (it is presumed the business is being bought either way)…
…the same applies to football clubs.
However, just like in business rules exist to police the latter scenario because of the risk of owners walking away from debts and carrying on regardless, the same rules exist in football – most obviously UEFA’s FFP Article 12 – to deter club’s from doing the same.
It seems if football authorities wanted to outlaw the whole thing, and keep clubs tied to one legal entity without exception, they’d ban transfers of membership altogether (except where a club incorporates).
In re-writing their rules to fit the wording, in parts of SPL rules, the SFA have if anything gone the other way, with the club/company (owner and operator) distinction now enshrined in the rulebook. That will of course enrage many on here, but like it or not, they are our democratically elected governing body.
The question you then have to ask is why the need to re-write their rules at all? They were perfectly fine as they were, all they had to do was stick to them!
Yes, things like that will enrage folk. The governing bodies are not there purely for the benefit of one particular club (or company! ).
Their behaviour over the past year and a half will never be forgotten nor forgiven.
bryce9a says: (40)
November 28, 2013 at 9:22 am
… That will of course enrage many on here, but like it or not, they are ‘our’ democratically elected governing body.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If that was the case then they would be open and transparent with ‘us’ if they had nothing to hide or be fearful of.
The trouble is that ALL parties to the 5 Way agreement have bascially twisted things for the benefit of one ‘club’ and the people who pay hard cash to watch the game are still waiting (and probably will for a long time) for an explaination. Doesn’t seem like much of a democracy to me.
I notice that the combined total of Sandy Easdales shares and voting rights combined with Laxey’s holding comes to 35.14% and that the board seem to be behind Stockbridge while slating MM’s tenure as Chairman.
The Requisitioners are going to have to go some to get a sniff at the marble staircase.
If I were a betting man I’d say we will see them walkng down Edmiston Drive with their erses well skelped.
http://news.stv.tv/west-central/250617-shareholders-serious-fraud-office-called-over-rangers-payments/
I wonder . . . The alleged fraud – would it be anything to do with the alleged stealing from the rangers charity foundation – did the money not get put into the PLC or rather the business arm of the rangers / rangers / sevco 5088/ sevco scotland or whatever their name is / was / will be