A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.
One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.
My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.
We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.
These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.
The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.
At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.
The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.
This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.
How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.
You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.
Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.
fergusslayedtheblues says:
January 21, 2014 at 9:37 pm
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Campbellsmoney
Thanks for the reply and apologies for not remembering your moniker ,I hope you were not offended by any posts I made as no offence was intended .
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I was asked if I was an employee of or partner in BDO. I was not asked who I worked for.
In that case Ecobhoy was quite correct as that question is very specific and not called for and (as I am not familiar with your moniker I assume you are a new poster ) even more so .
I apologize for my crass comment and I hope it does not give you the wrong impression of this blog which welcomes all opinions and viewpoints as I am sure you will find out in due course ,that’s one of reasons I read it regularly.
I believe self policing works best regards fans stepping out of line at games and I think this backs that belief .
😳
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Yeah it was a really crass question and I’m sorry I asked it now if it meant poor Fergus got the blame. Therefore my apologies to both of you. You still haven’t told us which team you support
GeronimosCadillac says:
January 22, 2014 at 1:02 pm
No we haven’t, but its looking likely that he is not a member of the Gruesome Twosome, but may be a member of one of their other evil undead kin
Sorry Campbell, just paid the accountancy bil!
As a neutral observer I would guess that CFC could easily be a middling EPL team and would be very happy with the associated cash … however there is a risk there IMO as I remain altruistically confident that that particular bubble can and probably will burst eventually. Also, being mid table in the EPL would inherently mean the odd flirtation with relegation and I’m not sure their fans would appreciate the struggle and the style of football required. Anyway, I wish they’d get on with it!
Continuing off topic as we wait for the next exciting instalment, I can’t help wondering if the latest, tame Ibroxfinancialguru wheeled out by the MSM is related to the original fitba great and Barcelona’s most effective goal scorer, George Patullo? I have used a comparison between Patullo and Messi in presentations in the past asking who is great and why? Is it the multi balon d’or winner and mega millionaire Argentinian or the strictly amateur Scotsman who was decorated in WW1?
Fitba needs a sense of perspective!!
MCFC – I’m not saying that it’s not of interest but I’d suggest that this discussion is more for KDS or CQN as it’s focused entirely on Celtic. A theoretical discussion on the pros and cons for Scottish football sans Celtic and/or Rangers might be worthy of a blog piece but personally I don’t see there being enough content (or prospect of it happening) at this time to justify it. Unless that Bond-Baddie type CEO at Celtic Park knows something we don’t?
slimshady61 says:
January 22, 2014 at 12:55 pm
All fair points mcfc, but you ignore the upside of the EPL – the bottom club gets £40M from TV money alone each year, rising to £46M in mid-table and so on. And those are just last year’s figures.
Celtic, with that sort of cash injection annually, a huge rise in season tickets (& inevitably season ticket prices) would be financially much better off and so able to afford better players.
You need to take all factors into the equation, not just some. And you have also ignored the fact that Celtic Park is a fortress in both domestic and European football, and I see no reason for that not to continue were they playing in the English leagues.
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slimshady61 – fair points – can’t really disagree. To be honest I’d much rather see City playing Celtic than Leicester – any Leicester fans in the house ?
The biggest challenge would be the massive and rapid business changes needed over the first 3-5 years in a much more volatile environment.. I’m not saying Celtic are incapable – I am saying that many solid clubs have missed the mark for a variety of reasons. For example, in year one alone you’d need to
1) deepen quality across the squad,
2) get four strikers with minimum fifteen EPL goals each
3) retain manager if he’s seen as good – replace him if not.
4) retain mercenaries if things go well (in demand) or if things go badly (want to bail at Xmas)
That’s a lot to do – and £40m would need to be spent very wisely and quickly – and would not seem like a vast amount – mostly on the hoof while scrapping with experienced EPL clubs. I’d go the Championship route if I was you – much less glamorous – but much more likely to be successful.
EDIT Anyway – I guess it is largely academic – but worth passing the time on while we wait for CW’s revelation – but it would open up a place in the Scottish Premiership for another club – in an extraordinary and rule challenging manner – I wonder what possibilities might arise? 🙂
ernie says:
January 22, 2014 at 1:25 pm
Continuing off topic as we wait for the next exciting instalment, I can’t help wondering if the latest, tame Ibroxfinancialguru wheeled out by the MSM is related to the original fitba great and Barcelona’s most effective goal scorer, George Patullo? I have used a comparison between Patullo and Messi in presentations in the past asking who is great and why? Is it the multi balon d’or winner and mega millionaire Argentinian or the strictly amateur Scotsman who was decorated in WW1?
==============================
When I think of some of the “death by powerpoint” presentations I had to sit through in my working life, yours sounds brilliant. I might have actually stayed awake!
English clubs are not averse to rising to the top of their game through the largesse of foreign billionaires lending them huge sums of money. With those people providing loans which could not be repaid, and swapping that debt for equity at a later date.
For example
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f0b08520-fab5-11de-a532-00144feab49a.html#axzz2r8SlGBkr
Man City owner in £305m debt-for-equity swap
Manchester City became the latest English Premier League club to clear its long-term debts in anticipation of tougher financial rules being drawn up Uefa, European football’s governing body, after it announced on Wednesday that its Abu Dhabi owner had converted his £305m ($488m) loans into equity.
Sheikh Mansour bin Zayed Al-Nahyan, who bought the club in September 2008, has invested up to £400m to help fund a player spending spree that mirrors Chelsea’s transfer bonanza under Roman Abramovich.
or
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2009/dec/30/roman-abramovich-chelsea-debts-accounts
Roman Abramovich turns £340m of debt into equity as Chelsea loss falls
Chelsea have in effect drawn a line under an era of lavish benevolence from their owner, Roman Abramovich, after the Russian oligarch converted his outstanding £340m of interest-free loans into equity and technically rendered the company debt-free.
scapaflow says:
January 22, 2014 at 1:05 pm
“but may be a member of one of their other evil undead kin”
😯
Jings you really don’t like accountants do you! Someone has to help the zombie companies out there. It may as well be one of their undead kin.
Campbellsmoney says:
January 22, 2014 at 2:18 pm
Ain’t nothing but a family thing
Edit
Given that the profession was largely an invention of the Borgias, what’s not to like 😉
Tif Finn says:
January 22, 2014 at 2:01 pm
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English clubs are not averse to rising to the top of their game through the largesse of foreign billionaires lending them huge sums of money. With those people providing loans which could not be repaid, and swapping that debt for equity at a later date.
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That’s just the bears’ dream, isn’t it? Dave King arrives from another continent, and lets them have loads of money to spend on “the journey”. In my opinion, Celtic (although as someone who has done walking away, over the Ogilvie coronation fiasco, it’s strictly none of my concern) need to steer clear of that kind of business model, and definitely steer clear of the EPL, which has no other business model (apart from maybe Swansea?). If the EPL bubble ever bursts (and I really hope it does) then there will be a very big mess.
I am a great fan of the Scottish footbal model around the late 70’s, early 80’s. Somebody, please, tell me what was wrong with that? Great teams, great players, respected (in fact feared) in Europe, good crowds, just a normal healthy environment.
Then along comes David Murray and blows it all apart. How could that be allowed to happen? From probably the healthiest of the smaller European footballing nations, to a pathetic hanger-on in 10 years. Thank you David. You must be truly proud.
Sorry folks, what was meant to be a short post has turned into a rant. TD’s expected and welcome.
Celtic67 says:
January 22, 2014 at 12:18 pm
“….Historic Scotland will definitlely take an interest in any planning application. I believe the area is protected due to the connections with the Antonine wall.,,,”
——————-I
This link tells me about something that I didn’t know was happening, about looking after the Antonine Wall.
http://www.eastdunbarton.gov.uk/pdf/DE%20Planning/DE-P_Antonine_Wall_Management_Plan_2014-19_SEA_Statement.pdf
m.c.f.c. says: January 22, 2014 at 11:59 am
“Neil Lennon has asserted that if his squad were inducted into the cash-rich honeypot that is the EPL, they would be mid-table at worst….This logic rests largely on assessment of the team and individual plays over a handful of CL games a season where they experience top class opponents . There are three crucial factors it ignores, and which blow it out of the water completely:
1) Attrition – There are 38 league games plus two cup competitions.
2) Depth of Squad – many clubs slip to the bottom under the weight of injuries and frequent matches
3) World Class Strikers – not enough world class goal scorers eg Samaras was barely good enough when at City nearly a decade ago when they were habitually middle/low table
Surely then all three issues you raise MCFC are related to squad size and depth. As has been noted any Scottish club would benefit from the TV money the EPL attracts – just add £50m per year TV money plus additonal revenues based on the higher profile league, to (for example) Celtic’s playing budget and consider where they would sit in the “financial strength” stakes. Certainly Celtic (as an example) would sit upper end of mid-tier (7–14) based on turnover. Why is it then unlikely that’s where they would be on a points basis?
One of the problems all Scottish teams’ have has been the low-profile league they are in, which doesn’t attract the top talent: Celtic playing at home, with a packed stadium, in the world’s richest league would certainly enable the club to attract better players – would Celtic be losing players to the likes of Norwich and Southampton in the field wasn’t skewed?
We should of course take your prognosis seriously though, you know of whence you speak, after all Mancheser City were a yo-yo club for a few seasons in the EPL then having a number of seasons of “mid-table mediocrity” interspersed with flirtiations with relegation.
It was only (as I posted previously when discussing Wallace’s performance as Chief Exec) after the AbuDhabians spent some £500m on top of the money used to buy the club and “pay off” previous debts (alledgedly to help launder its image according to Human Rights Watch) that Manchester City escaped that “mid-table tag and fast-trcked their way to the top table. My colleague, a City fan and member of the Mid-Sussex Blues, was there and he waxes lyrical of the day, hence my passing interest in City as a conversation topic.
[edited for typos]
Craig Whyte – The Man of Mystery.
We seek him here. We seek him there. But he can’t be found – anywhere.
And yet another rumour appears taunting us with the veiled promise of a decisive move.
Perhaps it is time the collective forensic mind we know as TSFM, applied itself
as to the strategic status of Mr Whyte.
After all, with an ‘end game’ possibly in sight,
now might well be the time for him to play his hand at the Ibrox poker table.
Unless of course he has neither cards nor chips to play with ?
Interesting that there is talk on twitter that Craig Whyte is to return in a couple of weeks.
That would take us into February, the same month a certain ‘Rangers Insider’ last week was claiming something big was going to happen regarding Sevco.
We’ll see.
john clarke says:
January 22, 2014 at 2:45 pm
Aye, John, in relation to Auchenhowie, The Bears may well end up asking not “What have the Romans ever done for us?”, but, “What did we ever do to the Romans” ?
Still some work to do though
Note to those excited by the latest rumours of a cheery Craigie Whyte:
The man is a delusional sociopath with a well-earned reputation for wishful thinking and near-constant lying.
I’ll be disappointed in Phil if his latest esoteric witterings are based on no more than the nudges and winks of a shameless chancer.
nickmcguinness says:
January 22, 2014 at 3:13 pm
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“Note to those excited by the latest rumours of a cheery Craigie Whyte:
The man is a delusional sociopath with a well-earned reputation for wishful thinking and near-constant lying.”
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scapaflow – do you think he is an accountant?
I’m with you Neepheid. I’m also astounded at the lack of public outrage and resentment, with the honourable exception of Turnbull Hutton, from the rest of Scottish football (and indeed Rangers fans) for the damage done. I know that Armageddon has been avoided so far but the wooden-headed notion that Scottish football’s very existence was dependent on a Rangers existing in the top league came from the people running Scottish football. I don’t mean Campbell Ogilvie or any of the officials employed at either SFA or SPFL. Look at the board membership of both these organisations, plenty of obvious enemies for paranoid bears to find. The SPFL board: Neil Doncaster (CEO), Ralph Topping (Chairman), Eric Riley (Celtic), Stephen Thompson (Dundee United), Duncan Fraser (Aberdeen), Les Gray (Hamilton Academical), Mike Mulraney (Alloa Athletic) and Bill Darroch (Stenhousemuir).
The SFA board: Stewart M Regan Chief Executive, Campbell Ogilvie President, Alan McRae First vice-president, Rod Petrie Second vice-president, Barrie Jackson Independent Non-Executive Director, Ralph Topping SPL chairman, Tom Johnston Junior FA President.
These are the people who are responsible for the 5-way agreement and the recommendations that went to the SPFL and the SFA membership that allowed Rangers to continue competing in Scottish football. Some bears may wish to continue arguing about EBTs and the UTT but this is irrefutable – Rangers chose to use monies due to the tax man to meet the running costs of the club for a season. Why would the people charged with running Scottish football want a club that behaved in that way as a member?
The fig leaf of, “It was all Craig Whyte’s doing,” doesn’t stack up.
If the Whyte knight is indeed returning , is it possible that he will have in his possession…
A – a small voice recording apparatus and
B- the deeds ? 😉
czm@czm32h
@alextomo Alex, are you hearing anything about Craig Whyte’s return – which will shock Scottish football, circa 2 weeks?
alex thomson@alextomo43m
@czm3 only that Craig Whyte has saiid to expect something – not sure I can face phoning!
Alex Tomo’s feedback on whether he has heard of the return of the TGEF.
Bluster on the part of Mr Whyte – only time will tell.
Campbellsmoney says:
January 22, 2014 at 3:15 pm
Campbell, even the Gruesome Twosome and all their evil undead kin, have some standards.
If you hang around here long enough, you’ll end up certified. or is is already too late? 😉
Now just sit down, and try to resist the temptation to bill me for something
Made increasingly aware of the duplicity and general aversion to the truth of many in the finance and football world, I read this line of the ‘leaked’ mail with a degree of suspicion:
“after lengthy discussion with the Executive and its advisers, the UKLA accepted that no disclosure needed to be made about the level of Ally’s ongoing salary.”
So I have just emailed the UK Listing Authority (part of the FCA) to ask,politely, on what basis permission was given to exclude details of the remuneration of a senior employee from the IPO prospectus, and whether any would-be floater on AIM be accorded the same exemption.
Being the son of parents who took the view that the teacher wouldn’t belt you unless you deserved it, one thing this whole saga has taught me is a readiness NOT to believe straight off what ‘respectable’ organisations, like banks, insurance companies, police, MPs, MSPs,or schools, have to say.
It would appear that the recent stories about Mr McCoist are having an effect, now that Mr Stockbridge has returned his bonus, fans are actually talking about Mr McCoist returning not just his bonus, but also half his salary.
Evidence that a PR type has not, in fact, lost his touch?
where has CW said “expect something”
Thomo has heard it from Phil – or phil from thommo, so wouldn’t take that as 2 separate sources.
Let me see something confirming CW has spoken – who to, and in what context
another kite i think…
Not that I am developing any sympathy for McCoist or anything…
But assuming that he wants to reside in the West of Scotland, post-TRFC, you would think that he would be trying to engineer his departure now – on ‘amicable’ grounds if possible – to appease the fans ?
There has been a definite sea change wrt how McCoist is now being reported on in the MSM.
You would think that ‘someone’ was deliberately trying to make him into a scapegoat, or to just use him to deflect from other TRFC issues ?
Shirley, McCoist has a sensible friend who could have a wee word and advise him to walk away, ‘for the good of TRFC’, with maybe a well-publicised reduced and/or even deferred pay-off ?
He has ruthlessly sucked out plenty of money over the last couple of years from his financially distressed club(s), and he could / should be considering what happens after leaving Ibrox.
He might want to try and keep the bears ‘sweet’ for obvious, depressingly predictable reasons – but he will still always be remembered by many non-TRFC fans for his irresponsible dog-whistling.
If over the forthcoming weeks it became clear that the admin path or worse was a sure thing for the rangers and out-popped Whyte, ably backed by some awesome doctors of spin. Whyte’s plan to stave off Liquidation backed with some genuine money to get the bears back to where they purport to belong in a couple of seasons. He would need a WATP type mantra, ‘Ibrox to stay the property of the fans’ maybe… Might need a couple of ex rangers players, rangers men etc but I would not be surprised for most of the fans to welcome the man back.. A last resort perhaps… Anything is possible in this saga.
StevieBC says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:14 pm
In all seriousness it’s beginning to look like a matter of when, not if, he goes.
If it goes on much longer, they will find it very difficult to step back from parting with him.
Edit
JimBhoy
I can be a bit harsh about the Rangers fans sometimes, but I wouldn’t wish that on them, or us come to think on it. The Dance Macabre has to end at some point surely?
blu says:
January 22, 2014 at 3:18 pm
Look at the board membership of both these organisations, plenty of obvious enemies for paranoid bears to find. The SPFL board: Neil Doncaster (CEO), Ralph Topping (Chairman), Eric Riley (Celtic), Stephen Thompson (Dundee United), Duncan Fraser (Aberdeen), Les Gray (Hamilton Academical), Mike Mulraney (Alloa Athletic) and Bill Darroch (Stenhousemuir).
The SFA board: Stewart M Regan Chief Executive, Campbell Ogilvie President, Alan McRae First vice-president, Rod Petrie Second vice-president, Barrie Jackson Independent Non-Executive Director, Ralph Topping SPL chairman, Tom Johnston Junior FA President.
These are the people who are responsible for the 5-way agreement and the recommendations that went to the SPFL and the SFA membership that allowed Rangers to continue competing in Scottish football.
===================
Great post, Blu, and spot on. Never mind the functionaries and the office holders, these are the real guilty parties, who are now, of course, totally committed to the continued existence of a “Rangers” playing at Ibrox.
If TRFC go pop, what can these people do? Either admit they got it badly wrong, or keep bending the rules to let the dance continue. Because once the music stops, there won’t be any chairs left to sit on. Which explains the Ogilvie coronation, of course. He knows exactly where all the bodies are buried, so vote against him at your peril. (lovely man my the way, such a gentleman, blah, blah, blah, yes, we’ve heard it all before)
The first rule of life at that level is this- never, ever, but never admit you were wrong. True in business, true in politics, true in Scottish football. That is what passes for morality today, in many walks of life.
The first rule of life I was given by my parents was to be honest, but if you made a mistake or did wrong, admit it. What a strange, far off world I was brought up in. So far off, that it might as well be a different planet, from the brogue bedecked “dignity” of Ibrox and Hampden, Where truth is a moveable feast, and honesty is a foreign country.
I am simply unable to put into words my utter and complete contempt for the world of of “Sir” David Murray, his acolytes and apologists, who inhabit the 19th hole of the very best golf courses, the dining rooms of the very best hotels, and infect (that is the only word I can come up with) a whole society with their poison. I wish I could put it into words. That might have some effect. But I’m no Burns or Macdiarmid. If they were alive today, we would be hearing from them, loud and clear, of that I am sure
Scottish society has been brought low by venal, selfish scoundrels, who revel in division, who care nothing for integrity, who just scratch each others backs and to hell with the rest, What is Scotland, or Scottish football to people like that? And the more that we, the real people of Scottish football, show our commitment the hard way, by spending money we can, in many cases, ill afford , the louder they laugh as they take the money from our pockets.
I suddenly realise that for the second time in one day, I have abused the hospitality of this forum by going off on a rant. Sorry, folks, I’ll give you all a rest from my moralising for a day or two now.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:05 pm
It is a reasonable tip worth checking out.
No kite flying here…
neepheid says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:23 pm
Can I respectfully suggest a slight edit to your last post?
“I suddenly realise that for the second time in one day, I have (abused the hospitality) enhanced the credibility of this forum (by going off on a rant.)”
redlichtie says:
January 22, 2014 at 12:48 pm
I share the general scepticism of any claims made by CW.
However he broke cover this week to make his bold claim to someone in Glasgow he has a past association with (for source protection I cannot be more specific).
Let’s see…..
jockybhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 2:46 pm
I suppose the issue is that establishing mid-table obscurity is no mean fire-juggling act, on a unicycle, on a high wire.. It’s not just a matter of having budget and being able to afford players – it’s about being able to do that and many other things better than 17 other EPL clubs every year. My argument is that Celtic would do well to have a couple of years practice in the Championship – rather than betting the farm on the EPL.
A lot of clubs come up to the EPL with sound finances and good infrastructure and then slip down again after 1-3 years to Championship mid-table life (or worse). City’s per-billionaire experience shows it takes a lot of football and business skill – not to mention luck – not to mention faith and nerve from the board. Like CFC, one big advantage we had was consistently big crowds. Other fans sing “where were you when you were crap”. Apart from challenging their sentence structure, I’d reply – “we were here mate” – look at the stats.
btw – personally I was far from comfortable with Shinawatra’s ownership. Sheikh Mansour could walk tomorrow – but his stated ambition is to accelerate MCFC (no me) as a global brand to equal Barca, Real, Bayern and United (8th!) to build earnings and approach self-sufficiency.. Wouldn’t you love to have a hobby like that !!!!
curious about Whyte’s motivation and timing.
Is it a case of do something now before the money runs out?
If the company does go into admin then he wouldn’t be able to bring his legal action.
beanos says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:43 pm
I have no idea apropos his timing.
However I think we can all be clear about his motivation and that is revenge on Charlie and the boys.
He feels that he was done over in the Sevco 5088 wheeze.
PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:42 pm
redlichtie says:
January 22, 2014 at 12:48 pm
I share the general scepticism of any claims made by CW.
However he broke cover this week to make his bold claim to someone in Glasgow he has a past association with (for source protection I cannot be more specific).
Let’s see…..
=============================================================
OK Phil, we await events. Oh that just this once CW actually delivers more than minor entertainments….
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:50 pm
Phil, no trouble believing that Mr Whyte want’s revenge, or that he can probably cause serious embarrassment to a few people who need to be seriously embarrassed. But, I have great difficulty in believing he has the wherewithal to do much more than that!
PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
January 22, 2014 at 4:50 pm
3 0 Rate This
I have no idea apropos his timing.
However I think we can all be clear about his motivation and that is revenge on Charlie and the boys.
He feels that he was done over in the Sevco 5088 wheeze.
————
Could just have been bravado after a cheeky wee £600 bottle of wine. Mind you, revenge on ‘Charlie and the boys’ sounds very plausible — and also fits in with, at least part of, the CF montage.
Hi Phil
OK, so CW’s claims are to someone associated to the whole Sevco/Rangers/5088 saga of days past
Did this source pass info onto you and thommo separately, or did one of you pass it to the other?
Is there just the one source or have others backed this up – i.e. are we being played by CW or is it maybe your source flying a kite?
Did you get any detail on what the event may involve or just that it was “something” that would “rock Scottish football”
is their any caveat around the 2 weeks – i.e. is there something that might prevent it happening, or do we really expect CW to make some kind of move.
Has your source delivered before or are we in uncharted waters here?
and, yeah, given that ultimately it’s come from CW, i guess we should all take it with a large pinch of saxa.
Regarding Murray Park:
I may be wrong but I have always looked upon that land as liable for flooding. There would appear to be some flood defences built where Murray Park is located. If you look at the following map from SEPA regarding land at future risk the area in and around MP doesn’t look to great. I for one wouldn’t buy a house there if it ever came to pass.
http://map.sepa.org.uk/floodmap/map.htm
m.c.f.c. says:
January 22, 2014 at 1:00 pm
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EKBhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 12:39 pm
m.c.f.c. says:
January 22, 2014 at 11:59 am
Interesting points well made, a bit of a stretch to assume relegation from the EPL is a certainty ….. other factors to consider:
– Celtic could get a “bounce” in the initial weeks against unsuspecting opponents
– the games will be very open, as the cocky English push forward against the Scots
– Celtic actually play football on the deck and will get far more space going forward
– Celtic generally play below par in the SPFL as they know the result is more often in the bag , so using today’s performances as a guide may be mis-leading
Still it will not happen until European football goes kerplunk and I must admit I am ambivalent about any move.
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EKBhoy – I don’t mean to disrespect Celtic in any way – but the EPL is tough. You make some good points and they could be decisive – but if it was my team I’d prefer a slow burn approach to the shooting start gamble.
There is a strong trend of good Championship teams coming up and doing pretty well before Christmas then fading badly in the second half of the year. They often do worse in the second year [ref: Reading, Blackpool – where are they now ?]. There are also those that get promotion and are never on the pace. eg Derby, Wolves. I’d say analyzing these clubs and trends would not support the idea that a few CL games is a good guide to EPL success – or maybe Neil is thinking more about his next career step.
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Certainly , an interesting chin wag on the topic of the Celts down south.
I suspect that the teams from the Championship that came had a settled pattern of play and they tended to have reasonable good defences , goalkeeper and centre halves; the likes of QPR you could drive the preferable London Double -decker through their back-line.
I suspect Celtic would do OK but would need time to settle and re-enforce , a bit like Rangers, if they ever get back to the Premier League, as for Neil eyeing up his next job, given the average tenure of an EPL manager , he would need to be a lunatic to take a gig on down there …….
Good to chat
Well;, CW could open with “Me and Charles were best mates when we cooked up this whole scam – before he shafted me and double crossed the 5-Way Agreement guys. Pinsent Mason? Don’t make me laugh – listen to this”.
Now whether he can do more than embarrass is another matter.
briggsbhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:08 pm
Yes, the more I look at this themore problematic it becomes
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:03 pm
The source isn’t involved in aviation.
So let’s see….
A known liar advertises his arrival….a known liar suggests through other sources that he has a score to settle sort of thing….a mystery tweeter arrives and suggests February is looking horrendous for Govan…
Forgive me if I sound sceptical…but we have seen all this bunkem from Whyte before….throwing around a few close to the edge details in the hope those listening would sit up and take notice in his fight for ownership and cash…
My feeling is he is using the usual suspects to get the message out…otherwise what is to be gained from him pre warning everyone of his arrival…there has to be a benefit to him in having the message of his arrival made known….
Just turn up and do your thing…no need for the veiled threats…through a third party…
Neepheid – great rant.
That a Rangers must be in the top echelon of Scottish football is indeed what the actors in Blu’s post believe. I would like to think that enough of them would realise now that they have been taken for complete fools by Green, CEOs x 3 and sundry Chairmen.
If they have any shred of pride and respectability, which,granted, for some of them is a long shot, any 3rd Coming of The Light Blue for a licence would be conditional on a sustainable annual business plan for at least 5 years.
Of course, I may be a hopeless dreamer, not versed in the ways of the Brotherhood (some guy did give me the funny handshake once to which I replied “Erm, what was that all about?” – he left quickly) but some of these guys will not want to be taken for such mugs again, surely.
I am not putting any cash on that though.
Paulmac2 says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:21 pm
Just turn up and do your thing…no need for the veiled threats…through a third party…
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If Mr McCoist had won a few games, CW might be viewed as an audacious entrepreneur who saved RFC – if only in the short-term until HMRC caught up with them asking about SDM’s EBTs.
I would give him a little more credit – especially as he is now a wounded and cornered creature with precious little to lose. Not holding my breath – but not entirely dismissive either.
neepheid,
Rant away anytime, you are just putting what the vast majority on here feel. Nowt like a good rant from honest people. It’s something I value about this site, the opportunity for us all to get it off our chest from time to time. It’s when the dishonest rant that we get wearisome.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:03 pm
…………………………………….
The 2 week comment appears to be a pre warning of time scale..to whoever he is trying to get the message to ….someone he maybe is not allowed to be seen to talk to….after all who needs a mobile phone when you can get the twitter sphere exploding to every man and his dog.
Sounds a bit James Bond…but it reminds me of the old messages in the times newspaper…’Mildred has dresses arriving on Tuesday at 10am’ …sort of thing.
EKBhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:10 pm
==============================================
Good to chat !
edit: btw – just looked back at my original post and got an exact 50/50 TU/TD score – good game 🙂
briggsbhoy,
I posted about the flooding issues around that area a few weeks ago (without the map). The natural water has been rising for years and will continue to rise for the forseeable future. I most definitely would not buy a house there, or across the road where there is already housing. I believe that is where the flood defences are.
Maybe Whyte will be in Glasgow interviewing and looking for venues for his forthcoming film…
JimBhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:55 pm
Maybe Whyte will be in Glasgow interviewing and looking for venues for his forthcoming film…
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You mean this one?
pic.twitter.com/n9W575wskd
JimBhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:55 pm
Maybe Whyte will be in Glasgow interviewing and looking for venues for his forthcoming film…
….entitled ? – anybody?
Personaly I dont think there is anything to read into Craigs visit other than he wants to deliver the biggest valentines card on his old beloved clubs anniversary ,he is a senti[mental] guy after all.
JimBhoy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:55 pm
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Maybe Whyte will be in Glasgow interviewing and looking for venues for his forthcoming film…
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Nah…he’ll be looking for another accountant…for Scapa to deride and insult…and take the heat off the poor accountants on the board of the Govan club…!
manandboy says:
January 22, 2014 at 6:18 pm
….entitled ? – anybody?
=============================================================
Final Destination 3
essexbeancounter says:
January 22, 2014 at 6:20 pm
Essex, Come now Mr Whyte has provided a fair bit of employment to the accountancy profession!
Anyway, I failed, Big Brother says no reduction in the bill will be forth coming, I just have to suck it up like everybody else
Sorry folks, what was meant to be a short post has turned into a rant. TD’s expected and welcome
Neep, I said it back in RTC days, all anyone had to do was look at Murrays track record in Scottish sport, from a lowly hundredthousandaire to the half billionaire he was momentarily, he started where he could afford to influence, (and to be fair I can’t remember which came first but) he started for arguments sake with Basketball (Murray somethings) then walked away and invested in Ice Hockey (Fife Flyers?) and in both took the both to the top and dominated, then when they had served their usefulness discarded them, withdrew funding left the leagues of both in tatters. As clearly as his profile grew he figured football would support his profile, and so it was, he used Scottish SPORT not just football, to grow, become more recognizable, and partly to hide behind, and pretend he was larger than he was…benefits were making friends in the right places and leveraging his friendly bank against nonsensical valuations….and guess what – it worked out very nicely, he has never, ever cared for RFC as was in my opinion, he was concerned about his pension.
Murray above all by some miles, in fact all the way to no atmosphere is the criminal here, he’s the Lion if you like, he made the kill he stalked it, snapped its neck drank it’s blood……the rest are the Hyenas chattering around the remains wanting to suck oot the marrow bone.
Sugar Daddy says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:29 pm
Neepheid – great rant.Of course, I may be a hopeless dreamer,
—-
You’re not the only one ….I’ll get ma coat 😀
I would just like to pay homage to the return of TGEF which as I am terrible at remembering acronyms always make me giggle when I remember what it stands for….ah good times…..
Paulmac2 says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:31 pm
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Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:03 pm
…………………………………….
The 2 week comment appears to be a pre warning of time scale..to whoever he is trying to get the message to ….someone he maybe is not allowed to be seen to talk to….after all who needs a mobile phone when you can get the twitter sphere exploding to every man and his dog.
Sounds a bit James Bond…but it reminds me of the old messages in the times newspaper…’Mildred has dresses arriving on Tuesday at 10am’ …sort of thing.
===============================================================
Oh come on Paulmac2 – I’m just managing to keep tabs on Charlotte without throwing Mildred into the mix !
Revenge is a dish best served cold.
The following is a hypothesis. What if Mr Whyte threw a spanner into the works that would force HMRC/BDO to consider TRIFC et al a phoenix company?
IPO declared null and void perhaps, investors loose their money, assets tied up, no way of raising new income (easily)?
I like that LTL I really do, but surely that’s cutting off nose to spite face unless if course he has truly been cut adrift in this saga…to me looking at his past the peope currently and previously involved (StockBridge Mather etc etc) all still have strong links to TGEF, to me he’s up to his well manicured nipple hair in this well orchestrated clusterf*ck
indy14 says:
January 22, 2014 at 6:36 pm
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Sorry folks, what was meant to be a short post has turned into a rant. TD’s expected and welcome
Neep, I said it back in RTC days, all anyone had to do was look at Murrays track record in Scottish sport, from a lowly hundredthousandaire to the half billionaire he was momentarily, he started where he could afford to influence, (and to be fair I can’t remember which came first but) he started for arguments sake with Basketball (Murray somethings) then walked away and invested in Ice Hockey (Fife Flyers?) and in both took the both to the top and dominated, then when they had served their usefulness discarded them, withdrew funding left the leagues of both in tatters. As clearly as his profile grew he figured football would support his profile, and so it was, he used Scottish SPORT not just football, to grow, become more recognizable, and partly to hide behind, and pretend he was larger than he was…benefits were making friends in the right places and leveraging his friendly bank against nonsensical valuations….and guess what – it worked out very nicely, he has never, ever cared for RFC as was in my opinion, he was concerned about his pension.
Murray above all by some miles, in fact all the way to no atmosphere is the criminal here, he’s the Lion if you like, he made the kill he stalked it, snapped its neck drank it’s blood……the rest are the Hyenas chattering around the remains wanting to suck oot the marrow bone.
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Very well put 😉
indy14 says:
January 22, 2014 at 7:05 pm
I’m hoping that TGEF starts his own TV series – phoenix nights?
He wouldn’t be relevant to the UTT which is sitting between Jan-March, would he?
Would they call him if they suspected a cunning plan by DM that involved CW?
Any word on the CB case
I found the case strange from the off and was it not due back up about now .
could it have any relevance to the something going to happen tweets .
Having followed the story for some time, and I mean way before RTC started blogging, and having considered the material, including that which CF provided I genuinely believe that Whyte was royally shafted by Green. He was in the process of shafting everyone else at the time but that is a different issue.
Green has admitted that, in fact he has gone as far as boasting about it to the Rangers support as part of the process of getting them onside. He conned the conman in order to get his hands on the club.
I took Whyte’s letter before claim (if that is what it was called) as a way of trying to get a pay-out and that appears to have failed. So I would not be at all surprised if he was back once again, either trying to get his payout again, or to get some sort of revenge, possibly both.
I have nothing to add to the previous reports and rumours and take them for what they are. I simply wouldn’t be surprised if there was something in the story of his potential return.
Long Time Lurker says:
January 22, 2014 at 7:14 pm
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indy14 says:
January 22, 2014 at 7:05 pm
I’m hoping that TGEF starts his own TV series – phoenix nights?
—-
ok so who’d play Peter Kays part ? 😯
Danish Pastry says:
January 22, 2014 at 7:16 pm
UTTT 24 Feb – 21 March (Edinburgh) http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/tribunals/tax-and-chancery-upper-tribunal-/hearings-register.pdf
Neepheid
Seriously good rant.
essex
Accountants aren’t the problem, and if the profession is part of the problem, it’s only because it’s part of the larger whole. Like, I imagine a lot of people, it was dinned into me growing up, at home, school, church, youth clubs, that it didn’t matter what you did, as long as you left the place a bit better than you found it. Somewhere along the way the business world has lost sight of that, what we’re seeing in Scottish Football is just a microcosm of the bigger problem.
Anyway, hide your cognac, because the next time the accountant visits, I’m hiding my bloody whisky.
PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:19 pm
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Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 22, 2014 at 5:03 pm
The source isn’t involved in aviation.
So let’s see….
============================================
🙁
Phil, if i was interviewing you and that was the response you gave to my questions…..i’d be very disappointed and you’d be left absolutely no credibility IMO.
You’ve avoided most of the questions, but more worryingly for someone in your profession, you have now nailed your reputation to the mast on this.
You are allowing speculation to build and failing to put the brakes on what could be a total non story.
In 2 weeks time, if nothing happens, then i’m afraid you’ll simply be no better or worse than the average internet bampot with a hunch or a taxi driving pal.
Fair play to you if you are happy with that perception of yourself.
Debts, pies and audio tape.
Hope its true, I miss TGEF. I have never seen anyone traipse in and out of the court quite like he does.
scapaflow says:
January 22, 2014 at 6:29 pm
Essex, Come now Mr Whyte has provided a fair bit of employment to the accountancy profession!
Anyway, I failed, Big Brother says no reduction in the bill will be forth coming, I just have to suck it up like everybody else
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Scapa….Mr Whyte has probably paid for a few accountants’ exotic lifestyles…apart from mine and my fellow (mini) professionals and their (mini) firms…!
PS I presume you exclude the dreaded D&P, aka “financial restructuring” outfits?
PPS I recommend you change firms…or brothers…LOL!
scapaflow says:
January 22, 2014 at 7:42 pm
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Neepheid
Seriously good rant.
essex
Accountants aren’t the problem, and if the profession is part of the problem, it’s only because it’s part of the larger whole. Like, I imagine a lot of people, it was dinned into me growing up, at home, school, church, youth clubs, that it didn’t matter what you did, as long as you left the place a bit better than you found it. Somewhere along the way the business world has lost sight of that, what we’re seeing in Scottish Football is just a microcosm of the bigger problem.
Anyway, hide your cognac, because the next time the accountant visits, I’m hiding my bloody whisky. ===========================================================================
Scapa…shooperb summary and I agree entirely…I have ranted long and hard on here and on RTC about the so called “accounting professionals” making a killing in this scenario…and they certainly have not left it a better place, as was dinned into you.