Reflections on Goalposts

ByDanish Pastry

Reflections on Goalposts

A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.

One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.

My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.

We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.

These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.

The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.

At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.

The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.

This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.

How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.

You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.

Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.

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4,642 Comments so far

bluPosted on11:27 am - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 10:00 am
davythelotion says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:04 am
Billy Boyce says:
January 22, 2014 at 9:46 pm

Let’s chase this squirrel. ‘Slicker’ states:
=============================================
Slicker is regarded as probably the first and certainly the most feared financial investigative journo in the City of London who didn’t regurgitate PR releases as a favour to get the odd titbit of ‘exclusive’ info and I have seen a lot of his work.

He has been at the Eye for a number of years still doing his thing.

But I have to say that the current article makes me wonder if he is still alive or whether others are now writing under his byline because it is so poor. When Slicker strikes there is blood and snaughters all over the gold paved streets and not this wishy washy offering. He just doesn’t do inuendo – he reveals the facts and the truth.

Seems all very strange to me – it would be easy to say strings are being pulled but the Slicker I speak of eats people like JI for breakfast.

ecobhoy, the Eye has worked this way for a long time – Rotten Boroughs and In the Back have plenty user-generated content. The Co-op/GCC/CFC one is clearly one of those. Paul Foot’s successors clearly focus on the bigger issues, like spending their week obsessing over Rebekah Brooks.

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ecobhoyPosted on11:42 am - Jan 23, 2014


Rangers supporters have claimed that Celtic has received illegal State Aid through illegal favours shown in various land deals and, in particular, at Lennoxtown and Westthorn.

This has resulted in complaints to the European Commission who apparently are duty-bound to take notice of complaints even from deluded crackpots deciding to mount a mass email campaign for reasons we know so well. Indeed a previous email campaign attempted to subvert Parliamentary Democracy in the case of the HMRC Petition but this came to the attention of the relevant House of Commons department which I have previously posted on.

Back to the land deals: I have demonstrated that the grandly labelled ‘forensic investigation’ wrt Lennoxtown is totally flawed and untrue but I have dealt with this previously.

On Westthorn I have shown conclusively that the Bear Land ‘Experts’ are all at sea with their claim that the only thing ‘impaired’ at the site was the price paid by Celtic. It is fact that Celtic received a deduction from the land price from Glasgow Council because of abnormal ground conditions and that this process was carried out in line with established procedures and minuted. The Bear ‘Experts’ claim there is nothing wrong with the land and therefore the deduction is a fiddle.

However, I have posted that publicly available records show heavy industrial useage at Westthorn from the 1700s up until the 1930s and, in particular, that the land had coal mines with deep shafts and extensive mining operations and indeed fatalities are recorded.

This morning HP pointed me to the coal records held by The Coal Authority. They show at least four shafts at Westthorn and the whole area of ground is defined as a ‘Development High Risk Area’ further defined as: ‘Part of the coal mining reporting area which contains one or more recorded coal mining related features which have the potential for instability or a degree of risk to the surface from the legacy of coal mining operations.

‘New development in this defined area needs to demonstrate that the development will be safe and stable taking full account of former coal mining activities.’

Will the Bears look at their claims and amend them to show the actual facts – of course not ❗ It just isn’t their way being always in the right as Scottish Football has learnt to its cost.

EDIT – ADD

I should have pointed out that It wasn’t until 1872 that the Coal Mines Regulation Act introduced the requirement for the deposit of accurate mines abandonment plans with the Secretary of State.

Regrettably, many thousands of workings had been abandoned by 1872 and the knowledge and understanding of those unrecorded workings was, in many cases, lost forever.

I am fairly sure deep coal mining at Westthorn commenced some time after the 1750s and had ended by 1872 so the extent of the underground workings remain largely unknown.

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John ClarkPosted on11:46 am - Jan 23, 2014


Just as Traynor became reckless in his support for the dead club once he knew he was ok for a job with the new club, so Tom English begins to grow a pair shortly before he is about to depart the Scottish football journalist scene.
Integrity? Principle?
Neither man would really appear to know the meaning of the words.

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Famous songPosted on11:46 am - Jan 23, 2014


Kicker Conspiracy at 11:07, thanks for the diligence in research, I did make it clear that I was working entirely from memory. A pedant might point out that the word “ice” did not appear in front of the word “hockey”.

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John ClarkPosted on11:51 am - Jan 23, 2014


But are things looking up at the Herald, with the appointment of David Leask as Chief Reporter?’
“””….david.leask@eveningtimes.co.uk
0141 302 6637
I am one of the lucky few journalists who never has to read press releases churned out by PR companies. Instead, I get to look into almost anything from the state of banking to the scale of organised crime – and all the goings-on in between.”
————–
What’s the Evening Times track record on recycling RIFC PR material?

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ecobhoyPosted on11:52 am - Jan 23, 2014


blu says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:27 am

ecobhoy, the Eye has worked this way for a long time – Rotten Boroughs and In the Back have plenty user-generated content. The Co-op/GCC/CFC one is clearly one of those. Paul Foot’s successors clearly focus on the bigger issues, like spending their week obsessing over Rebekah Brooks.
=========================================================================
Yea that’s true – but it was the use of ‘Slicker’ that has thrown me because his byline gives the story a cachet that it doesn’t merit in its own right. Maybe Slicker has gone the way of Francis Gay at the Sunday Post 😆

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bluPosted on12:09 pm - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:52 am
===============================
ecobhoy, Have you sent your deconstruction of the land deals allegations to Private Eye?

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ecobhoyPosted on12:22 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Re David Leask:

Worth looking at: http://journalisted.com/david-leask to get a flavour of his stories and his bio is there as well. Tbh I can’t think of anything earth-shattering he’s done off the top of my head in investigations but I could be totally wrong there.

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AllyjamboPosted on12:41 pm - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy,
May I echo blu’s question, and encourage such action. No doubt whoever is playing the part of ‘Slicker’ received his ‘evidence’ from a source he had reason to trust, a PR firm perhaps!! Factual counter evidence of this quality, should it arrive on the right desk, might persuade someone to look into the source of the original ‘report’ and decide that the providers, themselves, deserve investigation; especially if you can point to the connection with Private Eye’s previous articles re the goings on at Ibrox under Murray and Whyte, and of the continued efforts of their PR, and a compliant MSM, to continue to provide the smoke for the spivs to operate under. They just might not like being used as part of this smoke!

It would be a long shot, I know, but at least it would be a shot!

May I congratulate you on your excellent research (what an example for the MSM) and the quality of your writing of what could be, but wasn’t, a tedious subject to many not normally interested in such matters.

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ecobhoyPosted on12:48 pm - Jan 23, 2014


blu says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:09 pm
ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:52 am
===============================
ecobhoy, Have you sent your deconstruction of the land deals allegations to Private Eye?
===============================
Tbh probably too complex for them. Then there is the racist and religious issues actually driving this which they won’t want to touch and hey it’s Scotland – who cares?

The only way the Slicker piece got in was because the Co-op Bank is topical and not because of Celtic. But that’s why you pay PRs to see the little crevices that can be used to insert a story.

I have asked the EC if I can present my ‘deconstruction’ as evidence to counter the inane drivel which has been supplied to them and am awaiting their response on that. Tbh I think that might be a more fruitful seam 😆

The SMSM obviously won’t touch it. An example of how far the journalistic rot has spread can be seen in this week’s Kirkintilloch Herald re Lennox Castle. I came across the story when researching the Celtic land purchase at Lennoxtown.

It didn’t really affect Celtic as such but was another huge nail in the coffin of the Bear Tax ‘Experts’ case in that it was another torpedo in their contrived housing land value. But I digress because the purchasers of the actual castle in the grounds plus some external ground reportedly paid £160K and wanted to convert it into 47 flats.

Over the last 10 years neglect, weather, fires and collapses have reduced the listed building to a sorry state with no conversion done and the ownership changed to a Northern Ireland company a number of years ago.

They appear to have gone bust and an Irish bank has popped-up because they have a charge on the property and are in the process of submitting a planning application which I believe is for 34 new build properties on the land outwith the actual castle. The tale is that proceeds from this will allow the castle renovation to take place.

Call me a cynic but I have a terribly strong premonition that the proceeds will clear-off what’s owed to the bank and the mouldering pile of sandstone which the castle is turning into will continue to deriorate until a kid living in the new houses or the McTaggart & Mickle development is killed by falling masonry. Then the listed building will be demolished and new-builds will rise to replace the castle. Demolition costs I would expect to be paid by the council such is the nature of these things.

It’s happened so many many times before. But what do the Kirkie Herald do? They run a puff piece about how wonderful it all is and how it will breathe new life into the castle. Are they really that stupid or is it just they don’t care and just want to fill a space as quickly and cheaply as possible. Although I refer to the paper the remark could equally apply to the castle 👿

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on12:49 pm - Jan 23, 2014


blu says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:09 pm
9 1 Rate This

ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:52 am
===============================
ecobhoy, Have you sent your deconstruction of the land deals allegations to Private Eye?

=====================

i suggest you do……there is a thread on Followfollow now suggesting the Lennoxtown land should have been approx £1M an acre instead of the £12k or so Celtic paid…..they are claiming that the land was sold with residential planning permission, not only that, that Celtic also got 900k from the council so long as it was for public access to the facility (which is isn’t!)

these things are easily shot down, as it will be a matter of public record if there is/was planning permission for houses granted on the site.

however, part of me says……let them pursue this State Aid nonsense, let them throw their energy into hurling mud elsewhere whilst their club bleeds to death. It’s pretty much what they would deserve. if that is their mentality.

Celtic fans may spend an inordinate amount of time ripping the pee out of rangers fans/sevconians, But, if our club was in bother, we wouldn’t give a feck about how much the steel for their new club deck cost or who benefited in that deal, we’d be organising and raising funds to save the club – so hell mend them.

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Carl31Posted on12:50 pm - Jan 23, 2014


On the ongoing squirrel diversion…

Much is made of Celtic benefitting from low rates for loan/overdraft from a commercial bank, namely the Co-op.

I recall I had a variable rate mortgage at the time of the credit drunch and the interest rates drop. My rate went down by a few percent what seemed like overnight, and my mortgage payments dropped considerably too. This was due to a combination of the BoE base rate dropping and my rate with my lender taking the for of ‘base rate plus a small percentage’.

It seems that Celtic gained substantially from this BoE base rate drop too, which was brought on by the credit crunch and economic downturn. These economic woes in turn seem to have been due to the global financial crisis that engulfed the developed economies and beyond.

The only sensible and reasonable deduction to make is that a Celtic Plc conspiracy somehow manufactured the chaos in the world economy so that they could obtain an advantageous rate from the Co-op bank a couple of financial years later.

I’d just like to express my gratitude to Celtic Plc for their efforts on this.

Well played.

The few hundred quid a month that I saved on my mortgage for a period were welcome.

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manandboyPosted on12:56 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Re; David Leask

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/taxi-driver-in-irish-rant-probe-147474n.23005857

So you thought getting a cab (taxi) was a simple affair –

well, not when the name Hampden sits on top.

That reminds me of something

but I can’t recall what it is just now . . . .

perhaps the two are connected in some way . . .

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Galling fiverPosted on1:10 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Thanks for the info Eco etc, In the interests of fairness will the bank and HMRC fill the black holes under the east end with free money for the next 20yrs.

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theoldcoursePosted on1:20 pm - Jan 23, 2014


As well as football, basketball and ice hockey I believe that MIH also had a small sponsorship interest in a brass band in Whitburn. Thankfully the band survives to this day and is still relatively successful. Perhaps thats his sporting legacy 🙂

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ecobhoyPosted on1:26 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:49 pm
============================================
These are the facts on Lennoxtown which I originally posted on 8 January I think:
————————————————–

I see that the Bears have been presented with a massive New Year squirrel by the claim that Celtic has been illegally granted massive’State Aid’ allegedly in contravention of Euro Legislation.

I would have thought that any Rangers supporter in this financially dangerous time might be more interested in what is tearing their own club apart and finding out who actually owns it rather than worry about non-existant State Aid to Celtic given that Rangers has had a helluva lot of ‘State Aid’ through failure to pay taxes at local and national level.

However I am always hopeful when any blogger claims to have conducted a forensic analysis and exposed wrongdoing so I was interested by the statement from footballtaxhavens.wordpress.com that: ”The Scottish Government in 2006, allowed the transfer of a £30+ Million 19.53 hectare property near Glasgow, at Lennoxtown, for the heavily discounted (1/60th of the valuation) price of £497,000 to be transferred to Celtic FC for their training facility via the signature of one person, the CEO of Greater Glasgow Health Board.”

Sounds a shocker but there isn’t a shred of evidence and that the total fabrication can be demolished through publicly available sources.

I have no intention of even addressing the tawdry allegations made against the CEO who has been pilloried apparently because he shares the same surname as former celtic players and officials – Personally I have a simple line with allegations of criminality – You report it to the police. If not talk’s cheap and dangerous if done through a sectarian motive. So let’s look at this piece of muck-raking.

Lennox Castle Hospital was finally closed in 2002, after a long process whereby mental health care was transferred to ‘The Community’ from decaying large-scale institutions – such as Lennox Castle – which had ended-up as a unit of Greater Glasgow Primary Care NHS Trust – itself a division of Greater Glasgow NHS Board.

Footballtaxhavens claim that instead of paying £493k for their almost 20 hectares training Ground and Football Academy in the grounds of the former Lennox Castle Hospital that they should have paid £32.5 million based on the averaged cost, according to annually published Government figures, of the value of housebuilding land in Scotland in 2006.

With apologies to my friends in Lennoxtown who know me well let me observe that the lovely village with even lovelier people is no Bearsden or Mingavie in terms of residential property prices/values. However more importantly the annual Government valuation figures per hectare of residential housebuilding land is predicated on the land in question having: ‘A planning permission typical for the location, is ripe for development and has services to the edge of the site’.

The situation with the Celtic ground at Lennoxtown is quite simple. There is not, never has been and is never likely to be any residential housing development on it because of Greenbelt restrictions and planning constraints. Therefore the site cannot be valued on the basis that it is for housebuilding because if it was Celtic wouldn’t have been able to afford or want it for training facilities. Perhaps Rangers had different intentions when they bought Murray Park and we may learn more on this shortly but it is not The Celtic Way to needlessly throw money away.

But let’s go back a bit and deal with the spurious allegation that this land sale was basically engineered by one person who is accused of possibly being a Celtic supporter; possibly being a Parkhead ST holder; and possibly being a Celtic shareholder but who definitely has a ‘suspicious’ name.

In 1998 the Secretary of State for Scotland approved the closure of Lennox Castle and because of the economic impact on Lennoxtown a taskforce was created by East Dunbartonshire Council, Scottish Enterprise (Dunbartonshire) and Greater Glasgow Primary Care NHS Trust.

Because the Lennoxtown regeneration was seen as a long-term process the taskforce and local community members set-up the Lennoxtown Initiative whose running costs and objectives were to be met through receipts from land sales on Governmernt-owned land. Tbf this is State Aid to an economically disadvantaged area in operation and allowed under Euro Rules and legislation.

However because of planning constraints and subsequent lack of interest in the land involved things didn’t look hopeful until a joint planning initiative between housebuilder McTaggart & Mickel and Lennoxtown Initiative which saw the builder relinquish planning rights on its nearby land at Hole Farm. This gave East Dunbartonshire Council the wiggle-room to allow planning permission for houses on the Lennox Castle lower site in-line with the Draft Local Plan.

However before it could agree to anything Greater Glasgow Primary Care NHS Trust had to seek permission from Greater Glasgow NHS Board which was given on 22 October 2002 – the minutes of the meeting and the draft document outlining the issue in great detail is a matter of public record lon.g before Celtic became involved

The 2002 GG NHS Board meeting also noted wrt to Lennox Castle upper site – now the home of Celtic’s training facilities and Football Academy: ‘The Trust has worked with East Dunbartonshire Council and Lennoxtown Initiative to reach agreement on the disposal of the upper part of the site on the basis that this will be developed for Greenbelt Compatible Leisure use. This disposal is embraced by the Tripartite Agreement.’

The Board Meeting also noted: ‘Forecast receipts from the disposal of the upper site are minimal on the basis of the Greenbelt Compatible Leisure planning use designation for this part of the site. Any receipts generated from this use will accrue to Lennoxtown Initiative. In the unlikely event that the upper site is developed for a use other than Greenbelt Compatible Leisure use, then the receipts will be shared on the basis of a formula contained within the Agreement.

‘The Agreement provides for East Dunbartonshire Council to have a 17 year option on the upper site which it can only exercise on behalf of Lennoxtown Initiative.’

As well as the agreement of GG NHS Trust Board the Scottish Government Ministers also had to agree to the money raised from the land sales going to the Lennoxtown regeneration under the control of Lennoxtown Initiative. The guy with the ‘dodgy’ Celtic-associated name was the GG NHS Board CEO who was the authorised signatory for his employer and didn’t even have a vote in the decision to see the land sold. Still with a name like that he must be guilty of something – maybe it was doing his job impartially and professionally.

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No1 BobPosted on1:30 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Lots of talk about Rangers forays into basketball and ice hockey this morning but who has forgotten motor racing?

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/rangers-sign-up-to-football-team-972018

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rangers_F.C._(Superleague_Formula_team)

David Murray a wannabe Bernie Ecclestone?

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Kicker ConspiracyPosted on1:37 pm - Jan 23, 2014


So SDM did win the European trophy after all.
Take that Celtic fans!

http://thescotsmanpublications.newsprints.co.uk/view/22562506/li960918_the%20murray%20interna_jpg

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ecobhoyPosted on1:37 pm - Jan 23, 2014


theoldcourse says:
January 23, 2014 at 1:20 pm

As well as football, basketball and ice hockey I believe that MIH also had a small sponsorship interest in a brass band in Whitburn. Thankfully the band survives to this day and is still relatively successful. Perhaps thats his sporting legacy 🙂
======================================
Perhaps they are on a retainer to ‘Blow his Trumpet’ when required for ego purposes – much cheaper than employing a PR and personally more satisfying 😎

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m.c.f.c.Posted on1:41 pm - Jan 23, 2014


If today’s Dave King quotes are true, it indicates several things:
1) King would like us to think McCoist is a competent manager.
2) King would like us to think McCoist’s can spend further investment wisely.
3) King would like us to think McCoist can gain promotion to the Premiership.
4) King would like us to think he does not anticipate a fiscal event that may interrupt McCoist’s progress
5) King would like us to think he is a future investor – and you should follow his lead – but you deserve the opportunity to go first.

These assertions confirm Dave’s Rangersness beyond all doubt. But, to me it sounds like his early positioning to buy a club in admin for buttons and then call on the punters to fund their dream and their (his) favourite manager ad infinitum. Well, the fun is far from over.

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beatipacificiscotiaPosted on1:43 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Carl31 says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:50 pm

Couldn’t agree with you more. A good friend of mine had a 5yrs introductory mortgage deal at 1% BELOW base rate, so for a time was paying no interest at all (until the deal ran its course). It is simply good business to take advantage the good deals that are out there. If you are like my good friend, or like Celtic Football Club, and have an excellent credit rating then that’s your good fortune. Celtic simply benefited in the same way that all variable mortgage holders benefited (myself include so I share your joy, Carl).

I can’t believe this is even a topic for discussion. If you keep your nose clean and get a good deal, how can that be wrong? Just plain jealousy, that’s the only conclusion.

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ecobhoyPosted on1:50 pm - Jan 23, 2014


I notice that the dates for the UT Appeal on the HMRC v Rangers FTTT Hearing have been announced and this would have been known to the parties before they became public knowledge.

Given the hearing is open to the public in Edinburgh I can’t help but wonder whether this explains the number of squirrels roused from their hibernation slumbers to distract the Bears from the revelations about how Real Rangers Men ran and financed their club and dragged it to its death.

But will the SMSM media attend and report proceedings ❓

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m.c.f.c.Posted on1:58 pm - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 1:50 pm

But will the SMSM media attend and report proceedings ❓
=========================================================================
Eco – MSM will probably wait for the press release from Ibrox – or maybe they already have it:

“Victory – UTT and HMRC fail to prove sporting advantage from EBTs”

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redetinPosted on2:03 pm - Jan 23, 2014


easyJambo says:
January 23, 2014 at 9:59 am

ecobhoy says: January 23, 2014 at 9:06 am

HirsutePursuit says: January 23, 2014 at 12:58 am
================================
The Scottish Mining website is another good resource for the history of mining across Scotland.
http://www.scottishmining.co.uk/index.html
=================================================

Here’s an entry with a tangential Scottish football interest:

“30 August 1895
Fatal Colliery Accident at Uddingston – On Friday, while a boy named James Semple, aged 14, son of James Semple, ostler, residing at Kirkwood, near Uddingston, was engaged guiding bogies in Nackerty Colliery No 3, belonging to the Glasgow Iron and Steel Company, one of the bogies left the rails, knocking away a post, when a large stone fell from the roof, crushing the boy so seriously about the back and chest that he succumbed to his injuries early on Saturday morning. [Scotsman 2 September 1895]”

Young James Semple was the brother of William (Billy) Semple of Baillieston Thistle, Celtic, Millwall, Southport. Professional football was a way out of the tough mining environment for many men, including Jock Stein.

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on2:07 pm - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 1:37 pm
theoldcourse says:
January 23, 2014 at 1:20 pm

As well as football, basketball and ice hockey I believe that MIH also had a small sponsorship interest in a brass band in Whitburn. Thankfully the band survives to this day and is still relatively successful. Perhaps thats his sporting legacy 🙂
======================================
Perhaps they are on a retainer to ‘Blow his Trumpet’ when required for ego purposes – much cheaper than employing a PR and personally more satisfying 😎
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Not for nothing did SDM’s pals nickname him Bugle.

Re all this digging around in the disused tunnels of East End coal mines I trust you are adding the value of the mineral deposits to the land value.

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neepheidPosted on2:11 pm - Jan 23, 2014


GeronimosCadillac says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:07 pm

Re all this digging around in the disused tunnels of East End coal mines I trust you are adding the value of the mineral deposits to the land value
=============================
I thought that all mineral deposits belong to the Crown?

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ecobhoyPosted on2:11 pm - Jan 23, 2014


GeronimosCadillac says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:07 pm

Re all this digging around in the disused tunnels of East End coal mines I trust you are adding the value of the mineral deposits to the land value.
===========================================
That’s a fracking good idea 😆

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BroadswordcallingdannybhoyPosted on2:14 pm - Jan 23, 2014


..and the nominations for Journalist of the Year are:

1. ecobhoy for his excellent work exposing the state aid squirrel.

2. …err that’s it

Bunnet well and truly chapeau’d

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ecobhoyPosted on2:18 pm - Jan 23, 2014


redetin says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:03 pm

Professional football was a way out of the tough mining environment for many men, including Jock Stein
———————————————————————————————————
It’s quite sobering to read the death and injury reports in the Scottish mines and many were, of course, children. And then when it was the breadwinner you read of the wife and I have seen up to 9 kids being left with only the parish workhouse between them and starvation. Often the death reports don’t even grace the deceased with a name so cheaply was their life regarded by their Maisters.

Indeed slavery was widespread in the Scottish coalfields and I think even existed into the 1800s.

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on2:20 pm - Jan 23, 2014


neepheid says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:11 pm

GeronimosCadillac says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:07 pm

Re all this digging around in the disused tunnels of East End coal mines I trust you are adding the value of the mineral deposits to the land value
=============================
I thought that all mineral deposits belong to the Crown?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I thought it was just Swans and Squirrels she had the rights to. If you are correct do not, whatever you do, tell any Rangers fans as they will think they have come up trumps by having a King and a Queen as potential saviours of the club they love and who are also loved all around the world.

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scapaflowPosted on2:26 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Eco

Your industry may be having results, a wee change in emphasis from McMurdo minor

“The issue is not entirely about the legalities. Like the EBT issue at Ibrox, questions must not just focus on what was legal but on what is considered to be proper and equitable. “

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redlichtiePosted on3:10 pm - Jan 23, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:26 pm
Eco
Your industry may be having results, a wee change in emphasis from McMurdo minor
“The issue is not entirely about the legalities. Like the EBT issue at Ibrox, questions must not just focus on what was legal but on what is considered to be proper and equitable. “
=========================================================

These guys are in their own little world….

Scottish Football needs a Bluenosed Copernicus to put them right. 🙄

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coineanachantaighePosted on3:34 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Angus1983 says:
January 22, 2014 at 9:59 pm
Meanwhile, remind me why we’re getting quite so worked up about some coal mines in Glasgow? Is this to do with the “Celtic-buy-land-Bears-think-it’s-a-con” story in the MSM which appeared briefly recently, and then sank without trace?
=======================================================

Was that because of the subsidence in the evidence??

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ecobhoyPosted on3:53 pm - Jan 23, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:26 pm

Eco

Your industry may be having results, a wee change in emphasis from McMurdo minor

“The issue is not entirely about the legalities. Like the EBT issue at Ibrox, questions must not just focus on what was legal but on what is considered to be proper and equitable. “
=======================================================
Mmmmmmmmmmmm – considering that McMurdo’s Blog has been a hot-spot in promoting the false land deal stories he should hang his head in shame and apologise. Not to Celtic supporters who instinctively knew the claims were rubbish – No the apology should be to all the Bears who wasted time in sending emails to organisations throughout Britain and even Europe in an attempt to do down Celtic both financially and by removing titles..

They would have been better employed railing against the conspiracy from within Ibrox which is destroying their own club – but one can only wonder at McMurdo’s motivation given his staunch support of the current Rangers Boards.

Has he made any pronouncement on what is ‘just and equitable’ wrt the rangers EBTs or is he waiting with fingers-crossed and blinkered eyes on the result of the UT Appeal?

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ecobhoyPosted on4:08 pm - Jan 23, 2014


McMurdo states: ‘ . . The only acceptable way for this to be dealt with i.e. that Celtic’s dealings with the GCC, the NHS and the Co-op Bank all be micro-examined to the satisfaction of Joe Public. People want answers and they should get them.’

Well all McMurdo needs do is provide links on his site to my land deal posts on TSFM and they will get the answers based on facts unlike the sectarian motivation at work on the footballtaxhavens site which McMurdo points to as a shining example in oncovering the land scam.

Wrt the Co-op Bank allegations I have not posted on that and have no intention of doing so because of the childish basis of the wild allegations which reveals a complete lack of understanding of even basic financial matters – that has always been The Rangers Way I’m afraid and it would appear neither the fans nor those in charge have learnt much from the last few years.

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erniePosted on4:58 pm - Jan 23, 2014


beatipacificiscotia says:
January 23, 2014 at 1:43 pm
26 1 Rate This

Carl31 says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:50 pm

Couldn’t agree with you more. A good friend of mine had a 5yrs introductory mortgage deal at 1% BELOW base rate, so for a time was paying no interest at all (until the deal ran its course). It is simply good business to take advantage the good deals that are out there. If you are like my good friend, or like Celtic Football Club, and have an excellent credit rating then that’s your good fortune. Celtic simply benefited in the same way that all variable mortgage holders benefited (myself include so I share your joy, Carl).

I can’t believe this is even a topic for discussion. If you keep your nose clean and get a good deal, how can that be wrong? Just plain jealousy, that’s the only conclusion.
=======================================
Spot on , in fact even if your nose is nae entirely clean there is no real problem. If your friend or the old Rangers had secured a wee land deal or otherwise pulled a fast one to their financial advantage I doubt anyone would be bothered and I can’t see the rationale of the 1000’s of words in TSFM showing how pristine the dealings of CFC are. Why bother, it’s nothing compared to the shafting of Scottish Fitba by Rangers and Sevco? If Stewarty Milne is exposed for some dodgy deals I can’t see a single Dons fan bothering to defend him. (Anyone familiar with the tiny world of Aberdeen land zoning and associated planning permission, no laughing please) What would be the point? Dodgy deal, guilty, move on. Dodgy deal, innocent, move on.
The level of protest is disproportionate to the alleged offence.

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JimBhoyPosted on5:17 pm - Jan 23, 2014


McCulloch: “It’s a very thin line between the teams in the division we are currently in and the Premiership and I don’t mean that disrespectfully to anyone.”

– I am sure no-one currently plying their trade in Scotland’s top league would be offended that they are little better than partime players who often play after a hard shift and journeymen, older pro’s who I actually thought dropped down the leagues as their effectiveness naturally diminished with age, but still loving the game… Maybe if/when a rangers team get to the top league they will win a few games on the trot and then proclaim they will have a perfect season, after all, it isn’t much different to the league they are in..
— Now if he said that every game versus rangers is a cup final for the smaller teams and therefore more difficult as the smaller team raise their game, then I would have accepted that.. I am sure that’s what he meant maybe..

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on5:19 pm - Jan 23, 2014


I have had a look at Article 36 of the SPFL Articles of Association. It deals with transfers of shares in the SPFL (specifically transfers where the existing shareholder is insolvent).

As I read this Article, it allows the Board to sanction a Newco type transaction and to determine, in its discretion, in which Division the Club operated by Newco should then play.

It occurs to me that if such an a thing should come to pass in the middle of a season, it might be easier to attempt to justify letting Newco’s Club stay in the Division in which it started the season, rather than to try to tip the Club down a Division or two because otherwise there would be much fixture chaos for the remainder of the season.

Dundee and Livingston have both had two insolvencies under their belts to date. For the second insolvency –

Livingston (happened in the close season)- down two divisions
Dundee (happened mid season) – 25 point penalty.

So, if you were needing to go the newco route, I’d suggest you do it mid season.

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sickofitallPosted on5:45 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Stenhousemuirs john gemmell issued notice of complaint for comments about ally mc coist ssn anybody on here know what he said

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nowoldandgrumpyPosted on5:46 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 23, 2014 at 5:19 pm
2 0 Rate This
++++++++++++++

Are there any SFA rules. Every rule seems to have a ” at our discretion” attached to it.
This would make them all guidelines rather than rules would it not?

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Carfins FinestPosted on5:48 pm - Jan 23, 2014


sickofitall says:
January 23, 2014 at 5:45 pm
0
0
Rate This
Stenhousemuirs john gemmell issued notice of complaint for comments about ally mc coist ssn anybody on here know what he said
=============
He called Alistair a P**ck on Twitter.

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sickofitallPosted on5:55 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Look!

Notice of Squirrel: John Gemmell (Stenhousemuir)
Thursday, 23 January 2014

The Compliance Officer has issued the following Squirrel:

Alleged Squirrel in Breach: John Gemmell (Stenhousemuir)
Date: On or around 4th January 2014
Disciplinary Rule(s) allegedly squirreled:

Disciplinary Rule 82: By flicking his big bushy tail in relation to Rangers FC and Alistair McCoist, manager, Rangers FC.

Squirrel hearing date: Thursday, 13th February 2014

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Exiled CeltPosted on5:57 pm - Jan 23, 2014


For the avoidance of doubt, McMurdo has used the Land Deals to throw the biggest bushy tailed rat out amongst the Peepil in order to give his friends in RIFC more time to get their positioning in order to strip the carcass of TRFC as soon as possible………….

McMurdo and Graham have all been on message to raise this. McMurdo is an avid supporter of the current board and is seeking deflection from any examination of the financial piracy that is going on down Govan way. Chris has been shown to be a complete imbecile by backing Whyte, then Green then the Rebels – rather than explain Plan B to his followers, better to leap onto this vehicle.

Many of the Peepil have been busy writing to MP’s, Private Eye, EC and anyone else they can find an email for to ensure the land deals are investigated. Too busy to notice anything untoward on their own affairs…………

By the way – I received an offer in the mail yesterday – they said if I transfer my current credit card debt to this new one, I will get 0% interest charged on the transfered balance for 6 months………

After reading the outrage over the CFC-Coop I may decline – I don’t want to be labelled as fiscally responsible…….hell no!

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on6:03 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Nowoldandgrumpy

Fair point well made. As a pedant, I would point out that I was looking at the Articles – not the SPFL Rules. There are an eye-popping 192 pages of Rules. One and a half pages of which relate to insolvency – about the same as is devoted to rules (guidelines 😉 ) about giant screens at grounds.

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AllyjamboPosted on6:03 pm - Jan 23, 2014


nowoldandgrumpy says:

January 23, 2014 at 5:46 pm

Another way to look at it might be ‘A Cheats Charter’, as we have already seen on a number of occasions when those charged with upholding the rules have used their discretion, or unprecedented interpretations, rather than sticking to the words of the rules, to assist a club get almost clean away with what was possibly the biggest breach of the rules, ever, in the sport!

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nickmcguinnessPosted on6:35 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Jack Irvine has a vested interest in setting loose the Celtic “state aid” squirrels for Bill McMurdo and other Rangers fans to chase in the hope that it will divert the attention of the fans and the Scottish Mainstream Mass Media from more important matters.
Such as: Who are the “angry Arabs” (as described by Malcolm Murray) who are behind the controlling stakes in RIFC plc held by Blue Pitch Holdings, Margarita Trust, Norne Ansalt, Pierre Haddad, Elias Kaisar and Mazen Houssami?
Especially at a time when the focus of Rangers fans should surely be on how £22million of IPO cash has disappeared from their club.
A few weeks ago I explained how the holdings of Blue Pitch, Margarita et al appeared to all link back to a gentleman called Albert Martin John Abela, who had agreed a plea bargain in an Italian court to a charge of fraudulent bankruptcy over the collapse of the catering firm Gama SpA and escaped with a huge fine and a suspended sentence.
Further research has cast light on why Mr Abela is so keen to keep this conviction and, indeed, his connection to Rangers secret.
He is the son of Barbel C Abela (whose foundation was listed by Charlotte Fakes as owner of many of the Sevco 5088 shares).
His brother is Marlon Abela, a rather famous restaurateur.
Albert Abela Jnr is better known in London circles as Albertino Abela. As such, he is a major patron of the toffs’ eco charity World Land Trust. A former Chairman, in fact.
And he even had a short-lived spell as a Hollywood bigwig, being named as Executive Producer of Camera Obscura, a turkey made in 2000 that starred Ariadne Gil and grossed a pitiful £11k at the box office.
Quite a colourful character.
But this is one story our gallant Scottish hack-a-poodles don’t want to tell.
I think we all know why that is.

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CliffHangerPosted on7:03 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Now that Barry Ferguson has been named as manager at Blackpool can Ally expect some over inflated bids to help reduce his squad?

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slimshady61Posted on7:21 pm - Jan 23, 2014


CliffHanger says:
January 23, 2014 at 7:03 pm
—————————————
The hot tip is that Ally is going to Blackpool as Bazza’s assistant manager. Still keen to learn the trade, after 6 years at Walter’s side and looking for a step up to a bigger club.

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Tif FinnPosted on7:34 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Sorry but I just can’t see McCoist going to be assistant to a temporary manager, that’s ludicrous.

He would walk away from a mental salary and a ridiculous pay-off if he were to be sacked.

He’s a bully and a coward but I don’t think he is actually an idiot.

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justshateredPosted on7:53 pm - Jan 23, 2014


nickmcguinness says:
January 23, 2014 at 6:35 pm

The thing that confuses me about Jack Irvine is that he is supposed to be a ‘Real Rangers man’ is he not?
If you were why would you assist in helping people that are destroying the thing that you are supposed to love.
Why would you continue to spread stories of joy when it is clear to everyone that all is falling apart. It is like attempting to put a cherry on a turd. Still you are getting paid but will it be a good thing to have on your CV that you were the media genius heading up good news stories for two clubs going bust out of the same premises in 3 years.
Or is your lasting legacy going to be the fact that you managed to convince gullible people that liquidation of a club in administration is not really liquidation!!

Is that a good thing to have on your CV?

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upthehoopsPosted on8:32 pm - Jan 23, 2014


ecobhoy says:
===============
Eco did I see an earlier post from you hinting Celtic have warned off the MSM on this one via their legal team?

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beatipacificiscotiaPosted on8:36 pm - Jan 23, 2014


chancer67 says:
January 23, 2014 at 7:59 pm

“The false and damaging information …”

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

The information may be false, but I don’t believe it is damaging at all. Time will show Celtic are led by shrewd yet honest men who have done well for the club. The only damage will be to the reputations of people who must surely know the accusations are spurious. It is petty, small-minded stuff.

Celtic go from strength to strength. I believe we are entering a time where Celtic will not be caught by another club for many, many years. 10 in a row, I have no doubt. If 10, why not 15 or 20? Celtic fans have nothing to worry about.

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FisianiPosted on8:41 pm - Jan 23, 2014


The ridiculous claims of Celtic malfeasance is simply obfuscation.
obfuscation
Use Obfuscation in a sentence
ob·fus·cate
[ob-fuh-skeyt, ob-fuhs-keyt] Show IPA
verb (used with object), ob·fus·cat·ed, ob·fus·cat·ing.
1.
to confuse, bewilder, or stupefy.
2.
to make obscure or unclear: to obfuscate a problem with extraneous information.
3.
to darken.

It is a classical ploy to divert attention from some other issue. It portends really bad news at Ibrox which needs to avoid scrutiny at this stage.If you are attacking or defending Celtic then you are not putting the spotlight of transparency on Rangers.
We are entering a difficult phase. The Rangers will indeed run out of money in a few weeks but then what? Do you really think they will meekly walk away and surrender. They claim that they will never walk away and never surrender. SFA rules are merely guidelines and the normal does not and will not apply to any version of a Rangers for there are venal forces at Hampden who serve their dark Masters. Watch for attempts to have minimal point deduction, being so far ahead that point deduction is immaterial in terms of promotion, A new Newco being given preferential treatment again.Will Scottish football be subjected to another 5 way secret agreement stitch-up?
Keep the spotlight where it belongs. They will try to pull a fast one when you are not looking. The spivs seldom lose. Watch out.

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SouthernExilePosted on9:01 pm - Jan 23, 2014


The celtophiles on here doth protest too much.

The allegations are patently nonsense, let it be.

It’s all a bit undignified, the febrile atmosphere is going to folk’s heads.

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andyPosted on9:16 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:49 pm
60 0 Rate This

blu says:
January 23, 2014 at 12:09 pm
9 1 Rate This

ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:52 am
===============================
ecobhoy, Have you sent your deconstruction of the land deals allegations to Private Eye?

=====================

i suggest you do……there is a thread on Followfollow now suggesting the Lennoxtown land should have been approx £1M an acre instead of the £12k or so Celtic paid…..they are claiming that the land was sold with residential planning permission, not only that, that Celtic also got 900k from the council so long as it was for public access to the facility (which is isn’t!)

these things are easily shot down, as it will be a matter of public record if there is/was planning permission for houses granted on the site.

however, part of me says……let them pursue this State Aid nonsense, let them throw their energy into hurling mud elsewhere whilst their club bleeds to death. It’s pretty much what they would deserve. if that is their mentality.

Celtic fans may spend an inordinate amount of time ripping the pee out of rangers fans/sevconians, But, if our club was in bother, we wouldn’t give a feck about how much the steel for their new club deck cost or who benefited in that deal, we’d be organising and raising funds to save the club – so hell mend them.
____________
yet none of those eejits have thought about why celtic did not just build houses worth millions on the land with planning permission instead of a training complex

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AllyjamboPosted on9:20 pm - Jan 23, 2014


While agreeing totally with posters who are treating the ridiculous claims about Celtic’s banking arrangements and land deals as of no consequence, I think Celtic would do well to keep a weather eye on things, particularly if they have plans to raise money, or enter into contracts with companies who like to keep a whiter than white image, and to deal with companies of similar standing. If they leave these outlandish claims unchallenged within the media, potential investors or partners might do a search, turn up these media reports, and pull out, or, at the very least, leave Celtic with the need to explain what was going on. Muck sticks, especially if no effort is made to wipe it clean! A sensible approach might be to contact Private Eye (no point in wasting time with the rags up here) and say, ‘here’s our side of the story, with documented evidence. Oh, and by the way…’ While it’s nice to be able to right a wrong, it’s even nicer when you can right the wrongdoer 🙂

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Tif FinnPosted on9:26 pm - Jan 23, 2014


I am comfortable that the people running Celtic know what they are doing and trust them to keep doing it.

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AllyjamboPosted on9:40 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Tif,
I agree and don’t expect them to listen to me, in fact I wasn’t giving advice, merely adding my thoughts on what’s been going on. Seems to have been an awful lot of words written on here, and I’m not suggesting there shouldn’t have been, for something that requires so little concern, if that is indeed the case.

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Angus1983Posted on9:43 pm - Jan 23, 2014


beatipacificiscotia says:
January 23, 2014 at 8:36 pm

Celtic go from strength to strength. I believe we are entering a time where Celtic will not be caught by another club for many, many years. 10 in a row, I have no doubt. If 10, why not 15 or 20?
——
My goodness, what a boring 20 years this is going to be … the rest of us may as well give up now. 🙄

As for land deals which are patently not shady at all, may I echo the words of Southern above … “The allegations are patently nonsense, let it be.” There is no need for a collective PhD thesis in minute detail to be written about it (though some of the history is interesting) – such an exercise only lends some form of credence to the Bear suspicions, in that a section of CFC fans feel a need to justify their club’s actions.

Hopefully some fresh TRFC nonsense will be along soon, because I’m getting fed up hearing what a shining beacon of saintliness and wonderful fiscal responsibility CFC are. 🙂

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JackBauerPosted on9:47 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Just when you think you’ve heard it all

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25870855

Uefa confirm France will compete in Euro 2016 qualifying but no points will be at stake in games!! being reported on both BBC website and Skysports news. Completely pointless. What team in their right minds would risk playing anything other than a team of 3rd stringers in these matches. Who is going to risk a booking, injury etc in a meaningless game. Its obvious the SFA dont have a monopoly in stupidity.

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ianagainPosted on10:23 pm - Jan 23, 2014


From DUD to FUD
Its a fake

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 9 mins Resolving to stand firm against anyone who would drag Rangers down in their selfish desire to promote themselves is paramount.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 11 mins Now, as Rangers has been climbing on to more solid ground and as the fans are heartened by what they’ve seen Whyte emerges from the shadows.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 13 mins What I want to make clear is this: Backing Ally and the playing staff in their quest to restore Rangers’ fortunes is vital.

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2:09 pm – 23 Jan 2014 · Details

Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 15 mins Rangers fans are aware that there have been various people trying to grab pieces of their club for years now. That’s why I have returned.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 15 mins It is disappointing that once again Rangers are distracted by non-football matters that do nothing but destabilise this club.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 19 mins I will meet the upcoming challenge from Craig Whyte in the coming weeks head- on. I promise you.

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2:03 pm – 23 Jan 2014 · Details

Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 20 mins This great club is bigger and more important than anyone, or any thing.

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@CraigiMather stop the cut’s and keep our player’s then the fuckin board take home hundred’s of

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david RFC ‏@realdavidcraig · 17 mins
@CraigiMather well stop the cut’s and keep the player’s the fuckin board take home hundred’s of thousand of pound’s home each month

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david RFC ‏@realdavidcraig · 16 mins
@CraigiMather the board can take the cut’s not the players and don’t force player’s out the door wee need them WATP

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 20 mins I urge all of our fans not to listen to rhetoric or empty promises.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 22 mins That’s why I am planning on returning to finish some unfinished business.

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@CraigiMather Real? surely not.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 22 mins This club needs commitment and unity. It does not require the type of people who stood back and did nothing when Rangers were in trouble.

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Fearghas MagLaithimh ‏@Fearghas73 · 14 mins
@CraigiMather which includes every single supporter of the now dead club

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Craig Peggie ‏@peggieboy73 · 6 mins
@Fearghas73 check FIFA and uefa # facts # still the only show in town #9,000 at parkhead

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 23 mins During my time as a main investor and as Chief Executive I learned about the club’s rich history and proud traditions.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 24 mins I was determined to conduct business with honour, dignity and integrity.

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1:58 pm – 23 Jan 2014 · Details

Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 24 mins Rangers Football Club is a 141-year-old institution built for success. I was lucky to be a part of it.

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Craig Mather ‏@CraigiMather · 25 mins It’s time for me to come out and break my silence.

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ecobhoyPosted on11:30 pm - Jan 23, 2014


upthehoops says:
January 23, 2014 at 8:32 pm

ecobhoy says:
===============
Eco did I see an earlier post from you hinting Celtic have warned off the MSM on this one via their legal team?
——————————————————-
Nope – just observing the very quick withdrawal of those who put their toes into the geothermal springs bubbling up from Westthorn.

I have no information at all on what action, if any, Celtic has taken on the matter.

View Comment

CastofthousandsPosted on11:44 pm - Jan 23, 2014


justshatered says:
January 23, 2014 at 7:53 pm

“If you were why would you assist in helping people that are destroying the thing that you are supposed to love.”
————————–
Money.

View Comment

ecobhoyPosted on11:49 pm - Jan 23, 2014


Angus1983 says:
January 23, 2014 at 9:43 pm

There is no need for a collective PhD thesis in minute detail to be written about it (though some of the history is interesting) – such an exercise only lends some form of credence to the Bear suspicions, in that a section of CFC fans feel a need to justify their club’s actions.
————————————————————————————————
My investigations and posts weren’t aimed at justifying Celtic’s actions it started quite simply to determine what the truth of the matter was as I hadn’t actually seen an informed post on the subject dealing with the allegations.

It soon became clear to me this isn’t about a few bampots mouthing off. This is much more structured and sophisticated and has to be discredited and dismantled in an attempt to expose the aims of those driving the issue.

They are even talking about banners at the Commonwealth Games opening ceremony attacking Celtic for fraudulent land and bank deals. Do you honestly think any sane Scot – no matter what football team they support – would agree we should sit back and not bury this nonsense by showing it to be claptrap. Imagine that image being shown to hundreds of millions throughout the world.

So I’ll continue if that’s all right with you. The way to prevent any credence being given to Bear-faced lies and PR plots is to expose them for what they are and the reasons which lie behind them.

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CastofthousandsPosted on11:52 pm - Jan 23, 2014


SouthernExile says:
January 23, 2014 at 9:01 pm

“The celtophiles on here doth protest too much.”
————————
Agree.

It is a good exercise to examine the claims concerning alleged illicit dealings. This effort may prove worthwhile if these claims are ever promoted seriously in a public or legal forum. However, Celtic are big enough to look after themselves. If it transpires that spurious claims are being made against a Scottish Football Club in an attempt to sully their reputation then I think we have a case to make fair comment. As in the classic line from old films however, ‘don’t shoot until you see the whites of their eyes’. It would be a pity to expend what has proven to be rather fearsome ammunition on a foe that is still too distant to discriminate.

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coineanachantaighePosted on11:55 pm - Jan 23, 2014


redlichtie says:
January 23, 2014 at 3:10 pm

27

2

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scapaflow says:
January 23, 2014 at 2:26 pm
These guys are in their own little world….
Scottish Football needs a Bluenosed Copernicus to put them right. 🙄
=========================
Surely it was Tycho Brahe that had the funny nose?

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Exiled CeltPosted on12:26 am - Jan 24, 2014


If I can summarise…….

if Celtic respond to these land grabbing allegations (which they did) – posters on here and on other blogs, start up with the “ah, so if its nonsense, why are they denying it”

If they don’t respond, the opinion is that its because they are hoping it all goes away so there must be something to it…..

If Celtic fans don’t investigate, its proclaimed that they know they are guilty and are hoping it goes away….

If Celtic fans do look into it, the allegation then comes that they are boring everyone, but must be worried that they are true just because they are looking into it, so there must be something in it.

Quite frankly its appalling people can continue to throw dirt and hope it sticks and by smearing others without any recourse, by the repeating of fiction it becomes the truth.

I note that Bill McMurdo continues to allow posters to make allegations against Jock Stein in the comments section without edit or warning.

Yet another example of smearing people without any justification.

Yet the people who did real damage to our game – Murray – gets knighted and still retains the knighthood – as well as King – who was found guilty of tax fraud – are both held in high esteem by these same people denigrating Jock Stein. The crimes of Murray and King are not enough for anyone on TRFC websites or SMSM to speak about them with anything but respect.

RFC-NIL blatantly cheated for decades and put many clubs in Scotland including Celtic into financial difficulty with loans to players courtesy of BOS lending MIH money. Maybe I missed the apology from SDM and his cohorts………….

This site should be about peeling back the PR layers to get to the truth and holding those repeating nonsense accountable. I would hope we continue in that vein……….

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davythelotionPosted on12:31 am - Jan 24, 2014


justshatered says:
January 23, 2014 at 7:53 pm
28 0 Rate This

nickmcguinness says:
January 23, 2014 at 6:35 pm

The thing that confuses me about Jack Irvine is that he is supposed to be a ‘Real Rangers man’ is he not?
%%%%%%%
Jack’s loyalty is to SDM, first & last. Sevco figure a very poor second, hence JT’s divided love.

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davythelotionPosted on12:49 am - Jan 24, 2014


Exiled Celt says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:26 am
%%%%%
Similarly, Ally had to go four star to Forfar. If he didn’t then the conclusion would be drawn that Sevco are skint. As the ‘players’ mate’, Ally has to be seen to be acting on their behalf. The board are the baddies, please give generously to the season ticket appeal! Dave King is backing Everyman, unfortunately Ally’s image has been undermined by the revelations of largesse pre liquidation and the million penny shares currently burning a hole in his tracky pocket.

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on12:55 am - Jan 24, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:49 pm

Angus1983 says:
January 23, 2014 at 9:43 pm

There is no need for a collective PhD thesis in minute detail to be written about it (though some of the history is interesting) – such an exercise only lends some form of credence to the Bear suspicions, in that a section of CFC fans feel a need to justify their club’s actions.
————————————————————————————————
My investigations and posts weren’t aimed at justifying Celtic’s actions it started quite simply to determine what the truth of the matter was as I hadn’t actually seen an informed post on the subject dealing with the allegations.

It soon became clear to me this isn’t about a few bampots mouthing off. This is much more structured and sophisticated and has to be discredited and dismantled in an attempt to expose the aims of those driving the issue.

They are even talking about banners at the Commonwealth Games opening ceremony attacking Celtic for fraudulent land and bank deals. Do you honestly think any sane Scot – no matter what football team they support – would agree we should sit back and not bury this nonsense by showing it to be claptrap. Imagine that image being shown to hundreds of millions throughout the world.

So I’ll continue if that’s all right with you. The way to prevent any credence being given to Bear-faced lies and PR plots is to expose them for what they are and the reasons which lie behind them.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I too agree that you should continue to debunk the PR propaganda and myths but probably not on here. You should post on Rangers Forums. They are the ones in need of an education on this matter on here we have already decided it’s all nonesense.

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Exiled CeltPosted on12:55 am - Jan 24, 2014


Davylotion – plus Lee McCulloch suddenly came out in the press about there being no gap between SPFL and Div 1 (and I assume the Championship) in between.

Is he trying to say that this is why there is no reason for a paycut or pruning of the squad and is in full agreement with Dave King?

Or is it inadvertently setting the scene for the view that if he is correct, then why can these players not go all the way to SPFL top tier without any more signings given that they have an unbeaten run in an allegedly SPFL top tier standard league?

Jack’s messages tend to be not well thought through!

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on12:59 am - Jan 24, 2014


Exiled Celt says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:55 am

Davylotion – plus Lee McCulloch suddenly came out in the press about there being no gap between SPFL and Div 1 (and I assume the Championship) in between.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Reading between the lines I think what he is saying that he is quite happy to apply a sharp elbow or full on forearm smash (or as we now know it “a Goodwin”) to players in any division.

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John ClarkPosted on1:26 am - Jan 24, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:49 pm
——–
‘……..It soon became clear to me this isn’t about a few bampots mouthing off. This is much more structured and sophisticated …’
—————-
I agree.

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Bryce CurdyPosted on3:59 am - Jan 24, 2014


My mortgage is a lifetime tracker at base rate + 0.19% ie presently 0.69%. Clearly the majority of the senior staff of the Co-op must be supporters of the Ibrox club as they come nowhere near matching my deal with The Woolwich (part of Barclays).

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Bryce CurdyPosted on4:01 am - Jan 24, 2014


ecobhoy – don’t always see eye to eye but you utterly deserve your plaudits and more for the magnificent quality of your recent research about Celtic’s land deals.

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