Reflections on Goalposts

ByDanish Pastry

Reflections on Goalposts

A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.

One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.

My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.

We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.

These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.

The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.

At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.

The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.

This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.

How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.

You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.

Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.

About the author

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4,642 Comments so far

wottpiPosted on10:12 am - Jan 29, 2014


Meanwhile over on a Forest forum no-one is getting up tight.
Some reckon if they are wanting L Wallace they will just wait on the crash to happen and then bung the Administrators £450k or so 🙂

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Gym TrainerPosted on10:18 am - Jan 29, 2014


Surely this Lee Wallace thing is just another squirrel… Predicated on the story that Celtic are huffing and puffing about paying around £800k for Griffiths – now A Rangers are apparently willing and able to turn down £900k for Wallace.

I grant you that it’s a sly dig, but not too sleekit for the Andrex-substitute that passes for journalism nowadays.

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SmugasPosted on10:21 am - Jan 29, 2014


I’d disagree that Wallace’s international career has stalled in the 3rd div. Without checking actual call ups I would argue that we have seen more 3rd division caps recently than for quite some time!

Their has been a distinct lack of high level International fixtures, particularly where results meant, for instance, qualification for something important. Remind me? Who’s in charge of that department of our game?

There’s a stat for you. With all that’s happened in the last 30 months or so of Scottish Football and the only guy I can immediately think of out of a job is Levein?

Smith – choice
Longmuir – put it this way, didn’t look disappointed!

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ptd1978Posted on10:24 am - Jan 29, 2014


A post from Rangersmedia:

“Reverse Robin Hood here, stealing off the poor to give to the rich, where’s the Sheriff of Nottingham when you need him.”

Some T’Rangers fans have realised that their club is poor!!!!

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paulsatimPosted on10:24 am - Jan 29, 2014


Graham Spiers ‏@GrahamSpiers 19m
Absolutely, Lee Wallace is worth far more than 900k. It is insulting. But Rangers’ case is undermined by their own desperation for cash.
Reply Retweet Favorite More Expand
finbarfin ‏@finbarfin 15m
@GrahamSpiers Guy drowning .!!!
” want to buy a life jacket “?
” much ” ?
” £900,000 ! ”
” Naw!” .
” OK ” !
Mulgrewsleftpeg ‏@cjlehan67 13m
@GrahamSpiers
http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/lee-wallace/mwverlaufgraph/spieler_36657.html

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JimBhoyPosted on10:24 am - Jan 29, 2014


Not sure anyone can really believe Forest put in a bid of £900k not even with a manger with known rangersitis… Maybe he is gonna be the next rangers manager or to put it another way the manager of the next rangers 🙂

January transfer market for the ordinary clubs, ie, not the ManYoos of the world often start with a real low bid to get the ball rolling so to speak.. The £900k will never have to be validated and like some suggest it may be more of a media exercise by the rangers to attract a bidding war showing their lowest valuation of the player, maybe more in hope…

I would not be surprised if forests true initial bid was just over half of that with add ons up to £8-900k…

Big gamble for the rangers should they not accept a bid for their player and find themselves in soapy bubble in a few weeks. However I think Lee Wallace will be offski probably with a few hours to go of the window. If they get £900k for him in readies upfront they will bite the hand off the buyer.

WRT to Craig Whyte showing up again, the only thing i can think of is that he has seen that the rangers are short of readies and would not be fit to fight a big legal case, timing being everything.. I wonder if bomber Broon is gonna have his ‘I told you so’ moment.

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paulsatimPosted on10:28 am - Jan 29, 2014


TheCoplandRoad.org ‏@CoplandRoadorg 3h
Keep in mind our current playing staff budget level was OK’d by both Brian Stockbridge and real finance people.

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Long Time LurkerPosted on10:32 am - Jan 29, 2014


upthehoops says:
January 29, 2014 at 7:21 am

I agree that information from Twitter should be treated with caution – unless (in my opinion) the source is rock solid e.g. @Barcabhoy @RangersTaxCase.

In this instance, re the rumours of TGEF coming back for the assets – I would be interested to know if there is any other soundings of activity on that front e.g. is there a Court date etc.

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JimBhoyPosted on10:41 am - Jan 29, 2014


@Paulsatim any player is only worth what clubs are willing to pay for him… A player who drops from the top league to the lower leagues for three seasons (especially as he still develops as a footballer) is bound to have some negative effect on them.
The top players operate in the top leagues playing with and agin quality players. Teenage players often get shipped out to lower leagues and juniors to toughen them up and to show them the harsher aspects of the game… IMO Wallace would struggle if he was put straight into any team in the championship.

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ptd1978Posted on10:42 am - Jan 29, 2014


The DR story does the usual ego massage for Sevco fans, but it prepares the fans a bit for any firesale value that they can get for Wallace as well. If they eventually get 150k, it’ll be a bit less of a shock. 😛

They reckon Wallace is a £3-5 million pound player and are being told that the club would sell him for 1.4 million. They seem to think that being a Rangers player makes him immune to the effects of 18 months of playing at third fourth tier level while being coached and managed VERY badly. They also have no concept of the finance problems making their players cheaper. Why would they after their previous club were wound up and it didn’t affect the playing squad?

If Forest do buy him for over 1m, I imagine Ibrox will be getting raided again for suspicious transfer activity.

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JimBhoyPosted on10:51 am - Jan 29, 2014


A slight shift of direction, having watched the career (and antics) of the new temp manager at Blackpool and having met and chatted to him on a couple of occasions on a football front, even offered him a coaching job… I personally do not think he will be in that position at the start of season 2014… Too many rookies start with big teams (often having recent successes) and are set up to fail. I do not think the man’s personality, charm, communication skills are up to the job for now… Maybe he has a good chance at the next rangers job, rangers man, club legend etc etc…

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scottcPosted on10:51 am - Jan 29, 2014


StevieBC says:
January 28, 2014 at 8:42 pm

And the other possible dilemma for the dodgy administrators: what would happen if TRFC found itself in a relegation spot in the SPL…?

If that were to happen, Stevie, the SPFL would come to a sudden realisation that the fans were right all along and that a sixteen team top league would be a much more entertaining spectacle

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wottpiPosted on10:51 am - Jan 29, 2014


ptd1978 says:
January 29, 2014 at 10:24 am

A post from Rangersmedia:

“Reverse Robin Hood here, stealing off the poor to give to the rich, where’s the Sheriff of Nottingham when you need him.”

Some T’Rangers fans have realised that their club is poor!!!!
_____________________________________________________________________________________

IIRC some fan was also on SSB recently saying ‘rich’ Everton could have given them a hand by paying up some cash for Naismith.

Do these guys support the same previously ‘rich club’ run by Green that were happy to stiff a poor and needy Hearts for a few £100k they owed for L Wallace. And for deals like that they hounded Stockbridge out of the building!!

They really don’t do irony down Govan way.

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paulsatimPosted on10:52 am - Jan 29, 2014


Edgar Blamm ‏@EdgarBlamm 36m
Dear Nottingham Forest… https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BfI8dz2CQAARVzv.jpg
😆

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Angus1983Posted on11:00 am - Jan 29, 2014


From July 2011 (transfermarkt): “Rangers have had a £1.5m bid for Hearts left-back Lee Wallace accepted by the Edinburgh club. Two previous offers for Wallace of about £300,000 and then £1m for the 23-year-old Scotland international had been rejected by the Jam Tarts.”
——

So, according to the DR, Rangers think a couple of years in the bottom tiers of Scottish fitba has decreased Mr Wallace’s value only by £100K (after initially valuing him themselves, while he was playing for an SPL team, at £300K).

One struggles to believe that an offer of £900K did not involve someone from Forest losing his hand in a desperate snapping-off incident.

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jimlarkinPosted on11:14 am - Jan 29, 2014


RIFC share price down again – circa 24p

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on11:19 am - Jan 29, 2014


Gym Trainer says:
January 29, 2014 at 10:18 am
22 0 Rate This

Surely this Lee Wallace thing is just another squirrel… Predicated on the story that Celtic are huffing and puffing about paying around £800k for Griffiths – now A Rangers are apparently willing and able to turn down £900k for Wallace.

================================

one is a well run club not wanting to pay over the odds for a target and maintain a cost structure

one is a shambles and will go down in a blaze of glory

they are fooling no one with this advert placed on teh back page of todays DR

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neepheidPosted on11:25 am - Jan 29, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:19 am

one is a well run club not wanting to pay over the odds for a target and maintain a cost structure

one is a shambles and will go down in a blaze of glory
==================================================
They will crash and burn, but a blaze of glory? More like a fire in the midge bins.

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ianjsPosted on11:26 am - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:

January 29, 2014 at 8:16 am

😎

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ecobhoyPosted on11:26 am - Jan 29, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:19 am
—————————————————-
Blaze of Glory ❓

More like Blazing Saddlebags stuffed with hot money riding away from Ibrox at the gallop- watched by dissidents from the local Pawnees 😆

Wonder who’ll figure out the ‘Pawnee’ reference – it isn’t the obvious one btw 😯

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CastofthousandsPosted on11:32 am - Jan 29, 2014


Smugas says:
January 29, 2014 at 9:51 am

“does he have a claim or not, black and white, yes or no.”
—————————
Only a court could adjudicate on that question I suspect.

When the funds were being pulled together to buy Rangers assets from the administrators, the funds appear to have been accepted via a company called Simply Stockbroking, which Imran Ahmad had a role in. At this stage Sevco 5088 appear to have been in the driving seat.

After the car had passed through a tunnel and emerged on the other side it was regaled in Sevco Scotland livery.

So you are basically asking ‘what happened in the tunnel’?

The letter before claim lodged by Whyte is a necessary precursor to any legal action. I think the process exists to prevent court time being wasted by claimants that have not timeously notified respondents of the nature of their grievance. An LBC might force a settlement without the costly need to go to court.

As has been suggested above, if TRFCL are cash constrained then now might be a good time to bring forward your legal action.

I am reminded of the claim that Ticketus successfully lodged against Whyte. This was dependent upon Ticketus being able to argue successfully that they did not know that CW intended to buy RFC with the money he was being forwarded. A man blinfolded in a dark room could have seen that this was likely nonsense but legal argument can be a fickle thing (witness LNS).

I think many of these decisions may be part of a bigger game of chess and whether a move is successful or not is not down to the piece in articulation but more dependent on a bigger strategy. As we can’t be sure what this strategy is then it is hard to discern the next successful move.

So does Whyte have a claim? Yes, from the documentary evidence he seems to have the material to lodge such a claim and has made the formative actions in pursuing this. Will he be successful is a bit like asking ‘are the judiciary immune to external interference’?

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Jack JarvisPosted on11:34 am - Jan 29, 2014


Regarding the urgent need for funds to see them through to Season Ticket time, let’s not forget that in February they have a home cup tie which will probably rake in at least £800,000 (40,000 x £20) although only half of what’s left (after expenses) will be retained with the other half going to Dunfermline (in the fullness of time!!!). If they successfully negotiate that tie (who knows, they might even need a replay) they could be lucky enough (??) to be drawn at home again against the surviving non-Premiership team (??) in the next round in March which could nett them 50% of £1,000,000 (40,000 x £25). Then in April they will be due a payment from the SFA for the hire of Ibrox for the two semi-finals, and I suspect that the SFA will settle this bill without delay.

Cashflow crisis? What cashflow crisis?

Every little helps.

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CastofthousandsPosted on11:42 am - Jan 29, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:19 am

“they are fooling no one with this advert placed on teh back page of todays DR”
——————————
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and you can fool me a thousand times.

Those following this blog are in a position to arrive at your conclusion NTHM but the reason advertising works is that many of us are not in possession of all the information to make an informed decision. The world is riddled with advertising and it has a slow ingraining effect. Even the preposterous can be made believable if enough effort is spent in creating the backdrop (poor banks, we need to help them back to their rightful place at the top).

There is a nice piece of graffiti stenciled on a parapet of Kelvinbridge (not condoning defacement of this fine edifice).

‘In an age of information, ignorance is no longer an excuse.’

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JimBhoyPosted on11:45 am - Jan 29, 2014


I wonder if the Jambos are in line for a wee windfall if Wallace is sold.. Sell on fee anyone?

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scottcPosted on11:45 am - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:26 am

Wonder who’ll figure out the ‘Pawnee’ reference – it isn’t the obvious one btw 😯

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Are we back to Bud Neill? (or is that the obvious one?)

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m.c.f.c.Posted on11:48 am - Jan 29, 2014


Jack Jarvis says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:34 am

nett them 50% of £1,000,000 (40,000 x £25).
===========================================================================
A bit of Ranger-nomics there Jack. “Net” is after 20% VAT and match day costs 🙂 So half of £1,000,000 is probably around £350,000. Also – are kids and concessions charged full price for cup matches ?

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chancer67Posted on11:57 am - Jan 29, 2014


This bear on RM made me laugh,is there any medical students on the blog who can put a name to the condition he is obviously suffering from.

“You have to remember we are playing in the third tier of a shite league 1.4 million for Wallace would undoubtedly be a Scottish record and would be up there with the best of transfers across Europe for a third division.

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Araminta Moonbeam QCPosted on12:07 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Alex Thompson might be blogging later on the subject of a Mr Craig Whyte. Which should keep us all amused.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on12:13 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Four for a pound ?

Where’s me change ?

11:39:48 29-Jan-2014 24.04 2,994 719.76 Ordinary trade
11:34:27 29-Jan-2014 25.75 103 26.52 Ordinary trade
10:40:33 29-Jan-2014 24.02 4,212 1,011.72 Ordinary trade

http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/prices-and-markets/stocks/exchange-insight/trade-data.html?page=0&fourWayKey=GB00B90T9Z75GBGBXASQ1&formName=frmRow&upToRow=-1

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ecobhoyPosted on12:23 pm - Jan 29, 2014


scottc says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:45 am
ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:26 am

Wonder who’ll figure out the ‘Pawnee’ reference – it isn’t the obvious one btw 😯
~~~~~~~~~~~~
Are we back to Bud Neill? (or is that the obvious one?)
=========================================
Cheeky 🙂
Yip: The Immortal Bud Neill

My name is Lobey Dosser,
I’m the Sheriff o’ Calton Creek.
My steed is El Fideldo
an’ it only has two feet.
My enemy is Rank Bajin
an’ I’ll get him before I die,
an’ then I will become a ghost rider in the sky.

I was thinking many might think of Pawnees as those who hocked their silverware in the pawn shop rather than the Arizona tribe who originated in Govan – but you got me bang to rights Sheriff 😆

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wottpiPosted on12:41 pm - Jan 29, 2014


I thought we had missed it this year but here it is.

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ShooperbPosted on12:41 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Mmmm…..interesting…..Beeb are reporting that the bids that Forrest made were below the widely quoted £900,000…..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25942572

Makes you wonder if he’ll eventually end up going as an ‘undisclosed’, allowing various wild figures to be quoted in the press….. although presumably he would have to pitch up in the accounts at some point?

Incidentally, the Craig Whyte stuff…… I’ll believe it when I see it. He’s apparently been just about to for the last however many years. The truth is that I think he’s just about to attempt to call someone’s bluff yet again, without actually going to court. If he had a solid case, he’d have been in court well before now.

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CarntynePosted on12:47 pm - Jan 29, 2014


So, ‘The Rangers’ have turned down a near £1mil bid for Lee Wallace.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-transfer-news/transfer-talk-january-29-moves-3088322?

Really?

I didn’t think Rangers would receive any substantial bids for any of their players during this transfer window, or any other window for that matter, and I still don’t.

This story sounds like a Jack Irvine fairytale.

Rangers turning down a £900,000 bid for Lee Wallace makes them sound tough, and also shows there is a market for their players, a real good news story for the fans.

Let’s face reality.

If statements from Graham Wallace about the financial plight of Rangers, widely published in our national press, are accurate, then the club would have bitten off the hand of any club offering near a £1mill bid for Wallace or any of their other players.

Wallace has repeatedly said they need a cash injection immediately.

It would help them to make it to the end of the season.

So this story does not add up.

My suspicion is there have been no bids for any Rangers player, and the Wallace transfer fiction a Jack Irvine attempted face-saver.

Of course I could be wrong… 😯

P.S. Isn’t it amazing it’s an ex-Rangers player, Billy Davies, whose club made the bid?

Truth really is stranger than fiction!

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Jack JarvisPosted on12:51 pm - Jan 29, 2014


m.c.f.c. says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:48 am

I didn’t have you down as a pedant, m.c.f.c.

Given that I had acknowledged the subtraction of expenses from the gross amount earlier in the post, if I’d used “net them” instead of “nett them” would I have escaped the “Ranger-nomics” jibe? My figures might be wrong (I take your point about kids and concessions, which I hadn’t factored in to the fag packet calculation – the 20% VAT is another story!) but I believe my main point is still valid. There is a substantial amount of additional income available between now and ST renewal time, over and above any player sales, if a particular set of circumstances prevail. Forfar and Raith Rovers will need to overcome Premiership opposition to progress to the next round but both The Rangers v Alloa/Dumbarton and The Rangers v Albion Rovers/Stenhousemuir have a certain quarter final ring to them. As for Dunfermline in their upcoming tie, I wish them the very best of luck, but I strongly suspect that they’ll need more than that to progress in the competition.

Paranoid? Moi?

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m.c.f.c.Posted on12:53 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Shooperb says:
January 29, 2014 at 12:41 pm

Incidentally, the Craig Whyte stuff……
===================================================================================
If I was Craig Whyte – no money and not wanting to face the rigours of questioning in a court of law, I think my next move might be to try gain a warrant of arrest to ring fence some serious cash at RIFC / RFCL – just as Martin Bain did to him. http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/martin-bain-gets-480000-of-rangers-1081725

That might get then negotiating or just push them over the edge in the spirit of “If I can’t have her, then nobody will have her!!”

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ShooperbPosted on12:59 pm - Jan 29, 2014


BTW before I forget – there was a post last night/this morning (I forget which!) that mentioned reaching out to various figures in the MSM, and getting them to engage with us, reaching out beyond the core readership here.

Taking that to it’s logical conclusion, why don’t we invite Traynor, or even McMurdo to write an article for us? I’d be interested in reading their views on things, especially Traynor. I think the difference would be that, rather than write uncontested drivel, as they do (or did, in Traynor’s case) in their day jobs, they’d have to actually hone their pieces, because they’d know that what they had to say would be picked apart, rather than swallowed wholesale without thought. Having to justify their stance without the simple ‘WATP’ justification would be thought provoking, I think. If nothing else, it would be interesting to see how McMurdo would cope with a blog where he couldn’t ban people who think they aren’t the same club!

The only downside I see would be the baser elements of McMurdos following deciding to show up and ‘teach timmy a lesson’, which would be a) ignoring that there are a good mix of different clubs fans on here (including some who don’t use their diddy club as some sort of ‘beard’ to hide their real support of Celtic 🙄 ) and b) an intense time for the moderators, given the number of users that would require banning!

I just think it would be good to see some articles that didn’t preach to the converted, as it were.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on1:01 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Jack Jarvis says:
January 29, 2014 at 12:51 pm

January 29, 2014 at 11:48 am

I didn’t have you down as a pedant, m.c.f.c.
=================================================================================
Ranger-nomics defn The willful exaggeration of the financial upside and the negligence of any possible downside when assessing a business model in the hope of convincing oneself and others that it is viable when it most clearly isn’t. Common factors include confusing net and gross income whilst disregarding taxes due. These can also be combined with double counting,indefensible extrapolation and wishful timing of events..

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ecobhoyPosted on1:03 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Shooperb says:
January 29, 2014 at 12:41 pm

The Craig Whyte stuff…… I’ll believe it when I see it. He’s apparently been just about to for the last however many years. The truth is that I think he’s just about to attempt to call someone’s bluff yet again, without actually going to court. If he had a solid case, he’d have been in court well before now.
========================================================
I’m noit sure it’s as simple as that. I think CW might well have the evidence but his problem in going to court and winning the action means everything is in the public domain and I have no doubt plenty would be ready to swoop and releive him of the dosh.

The only game he can play is one of ‘threatening to expose’ and creating serious damage to the shareprice with the really juicy leaks which I don’t think we’ve actually seen or heard yet. And if he gets his dosh we might never learn what actually went down.

Strangely I have always reckoned that under the new Board he has a better chance of succeeding than at any previous time. But who knows? Anyone that can see into Wee Craigie’s mind and understand what makes it tick – other than money – would be a rare bird indeed 😆

Of course if this Board is heading for oblivion then they won’t pay-up unless the mystery owners instruct them to. At that stage the PR machine would wheel into action and blame Craigie for destroying the club a second time which has the added advantage of helping distance DM a wee bit further from any culpability in the mind of the Bears.

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bluPosted on1:08 pm - Jan 29, 2014


A bit of Glasgow land-use conspiracy fun – does Giovanni Di Stefano = John Stevens @pzj1?

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on1:09 pm - Jan 29, 2014


JimBhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 10:24 am

WRT to Craig Whyte showing up again, the only thing i can think of is that he has seen that the rangers are short of readies and would not be fit to fight a big legal case, timing being everything.. I wonder if bomber Broon is gonna have his ‘I told you so’ moment.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
One could be talked into believing that the emptying of the coffers since Dec 2012 was part of the lead in work for Craigs return. He won’t get much cash but I suppose he will make do with a bag full of assets instead. There may also be AIM/SFO implications if CW proves his title.

Ecobhoy @ 11.26am – Geronimo knows of the troublesome Pawnee. I believe they would have lain down their arms if they too were gifted a Cadillac.

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ShooperbPosted on1:12 pm - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:03 pm

I think it’s more just fatigue from myself – I’ve heard so many times that Craigh Whyte is about to re-enter the fray and all the rest of it, and it never quite happens. I’m sure at some point it will be true, but you just get fed up reading the same thing over and over again.

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ecobhoyPosted on1:12 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Shooperb says:
January 29, 2014 at 12:59 pm

BTW before I forget – there was a post last night/this morning (I forget which!) that mentioned reaching out to various figures in the MSM, and getting them to engage with us, reaching out beyond the core readership here.

Taking that to it’s logical conclusion, why don’t we invite Traynor, or even McMurdo to write an article for us? I’d be interested in reading their views.
=========================================
Anyone who actually wished their brain cells destroyed by the million can go to McMurdo’s blog and indulge themselves any time as far as I am concerned. We should be offering a platform to people who have something to offer and enhance the repuation of this blog and not simply their own rather strange ego and twisted message.

I don’t like Traynor on a personal level but I think he would be good value doing a piece and might actually be of interest to the Blog and even people who normally don’t visit the site. McMurdo on the other hand IMO has nothing to offer either this blog or Scottish Football and at the moment is simply an apologist for the current Rangers Board.

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ecobhoyPosted on1:18 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Shooperb says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:12 pm
ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:03 pm

I think it’s more just fatigue from myself – I’ve heard so many times that Craigh Whyte is about to re-enter the fray and all the rest of it, and it never quite happens. I’m sure at some point it will be true, but you just get fed up reading the same thing over and over again.
==============================================
I avoid twitter like the plague and have no interest in the frenzied hot-house of ill-informed rumour and comment it generally spawns.

If something is going to happen it will and my tweeting or not tweeting won’t make a blind bit of difference and neither will the tweets of most others no matter what they think. Once it happens then informed comments can be made and if it doesn’t well it doesn’t 😉

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ShooperbPosted on1:20 pm - Jan 29, 2014


45. ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:12 pm

To be honest, I mentioned McMurdo because, in my mind at least, he’s the polar opposite of this blog.

Traynor would be interesting, but I can’t see him stating where the bodies are buried, plus he’d have to overcome his own personal animosity!

I think it would do us good to have a varied selection of writers from the other side of the divide. The last few blogs, whilst being good reads, are beginning to recycle the same themes.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on1:28 pm - Jan 29, 2014


wottpi says:
January 29, 2014 at 12:41 pm

I thought we had missed it this year but here it is.
=================================================================================
wottpi – who are all those blazeers supping from the trough cup at the end – and how much do they cost each year ? Have they been asked to take a pay cut ?

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ecobhoyPosted on1:28 pm - Jan 29, 2014


lu says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:08 pm

A bit of Glasgow land-use conspiracy fun – does Giovanni Di Stefano = John Stevens @pzj1?
=======================================
Certainly seems as nutty as Giovanni but pzj says him mum is Ulster/Scots and I don’t know what Gio’s parentage is. Gio might have been nutty about the way he went about things and what he said but I usually saw the rationale in his arguments.

Even if he was misguided I didn’t tend to think he was lying – that’s the difference with the Bear Land ‘Experts’ – they are actually lying and deceiving Bears – why?

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on1:29 pm - Jan 29, 2014


see for cup games where the gate is split, is the gate split BEFORE VAT deductions?

Iassume it must, or there would be a risk of double charging for VAT

i.e.

40,000 x 25 = £1M = 800k + 200k VAT

if the gate was split 50/50 based on VAT having being paid, then both clubs get 400k

however, the visiting club on receipt of the 400k would then have to pay 100k vat – this would mean HMRC got £300k when they were only due £200k and the visiting club only got 300k to keep when the home club would have got 400k (their VAT portion already being paid)

if it was split PRE VAT, then home club gets 500k, visiting club gets 500k, both pay 20% = 100k to HMRC, HMRC gets £200k, both clubs get same

(i have ignored the fact home club gets to keep some expenses from totals)

I am just wondering form an accountancy perspective how this works as the visiting club cannot simply get that income without VAT being payable

not accusing any club of any kind of scam!

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on1:32 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Shooperb says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:20 pm
45. ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:12 pm

To be honest, I mentioned McMurdo because, in my mind at least, he’s the polar opposite of this blog.

Traynor would be interesting, but I can’t see him stating where the bodies are buried, plus he’d have to overcome his own personal animosity!

I think it would do us good to have a varied selection of writers from the other side of the divide. The last few blogs, whilst being good reads, are beginning to recycle the same themes.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It would be good to have a sane blogger writing from a different perspective and expanding the themes.

What about Spiers? I know he’s not everyones first choice but he is a freelancer and probably has a bit more editorial freedom to write for TSFM. He’s best mates with Cosgrove these days – maybe Stuart could talk him into it.

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AllyjamboPosted on1:35 pm - Jan 29, 2014


I doubt it will be of much interest here but AT tweeting that he hopes to have a blog up later today about CW, just waiting for lawyers to clear it. Probably nothing 😉

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slimshady61Posted on1:36 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Jack Jarvis says:
January 29, 2014 at 11:34 am
—————————————-
That’s a bit optimistic. Last time a team called Rangers played a Scottish cup tie at Ibrox, in 2012, they pulled in 17,822 for the Dundee Utd game – in fact their second last game before Administration. I suspect it will be the same for the Dunfermline game which is also being televised, and on a Friday night too.

If they get 25,000 for the Dunfermline match, I would be surprised, still probably a world record for a 3rd tier club in the Scottish Cup?

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on1:45 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Thommo blog: CW is the fiscal probity equivalent of Millwall fans in the 80’s?

unless Ticketus have CW bang to rights for their money and the only way to get ANYTHING back from him is to pick up the sevco5088 being fleeced by greens “robbery” Letter Before Claim action….then there is nothing to see here.

CW is hot air just now….take it to court…or wait until he is completely busted by ticketus and let them do it….otherwise there is nothing to see.

even if he admits to being the money behind Sevco Scotland/TRFC and have a major interest in RIFC – it won’t make the SFA do anything…so nothing will change on that front.

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bluPosted on2:03 pm - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:28 pm
==============================
ecobhoy, I’m sure you’re right about pzj but I think you’re being very kind to Giovanni the convicted fraudster with the lively imagination. If he was any good at it he’d have joined the gang in Govan.

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Jack JarvisPosted on2:13 pm - Jan 29, 2014


m.c.f.c. says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:01 pm

Ignoring my “indefensible extrapolation and wishful timing of events” – which I assume refers to my hypothesis/suspicions regarding the outcome of this round and the potential opponents and venue of the next – and consider only the upcoming home tie with Dunfermline in February and the rental of Ibrox twice in April do you think that the amount of additional income scheduled to be ingathered between now and ST renewal time would be enough to assist them over the line without any need for reductions in staff costs, or is it an insignificant amount in the greater scheme of things?

Does anyone know how much the SFA are paying to rent Ibrox and Celtic Park for the semi-finals and the final?

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Jack JarvisPosted on2:20 pm - Jan 29, 2014


slimshady61 says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:36 pm

I didn’t know their tie with Dunfermline was on a Friday and on the telly. This will certainly impact on the crowd to a certain degree, but I suspect that the “Buy a ticket – Save the Team” propaganda will push it beyond 30.000. Do you think that their share of the gate money combined with the rental fees for the semi-finals will be enough to enable them to reach ST renewal time, or is it a drop in the Dead Sea?

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Carl31Posted on2:25 pm - Jan 29, 2014


OT for the day,

Italian side Nocerina are thrown out of the country’s third division after players faked injury during November’s derby against Salernitana.

The Italian Football Federation (FIGC) took the action after Nocerina players were reluctant to play following death threats from their own “Ultras” fans.

Nocerina made three substitutions and five players went off injured as the game was called off after 21 minutes.

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causaludendiPosted on2:28 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Due to various commitments (and becoming slightly scunnered with going round in circles truth be told!) I’ve missed a fair bit this last two weeks, just cocking an eye in this general direction to see if there’s been a nuclear detonation 😉
By some strange quirk of fate though I was looking through some notes last night and came across stuff re. CW and the floating charge – whatever happened to that? Come on here this afternoon and the talk is of an upcoming blog on… CW?!

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AuldheidPosted on2:29 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Allyjambo says:

January 29, 2014 at 1:35 pm

I doubt it will be of much interest here but AT tweeting that he hopes to have a blog up later today about CW, just waiting for lawyers to clear it. Probably nothing 😉
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This from CQN and my response might be getting 5 from 2+2 but talk about unforeseen consequences….

!!Bada Bing!!

13:33 on

29 January, 2014

Read it all now
@Bryce9A: So Craig Whyte is claiming the SFA membership was transferred to him, not Newco, and that legally HE is the football club. WTF??!! #anguish

Was retweeted by @RetroScot
=======================
Funnily enough Whyte might have a point.

What the SFA did under their agreement with CG was transfer the membership of the SFA that Rangers (and so CW held) to Newco.

They did so using the powers of Article 14.1 with the paradoxical heading that says Prohibition of Transfer of Membership but has a clause allowing the SFA discretion which they exercised.

However Newco could always have obtained SFA Membership as Associate Members at that time had they applied within 14 days of joining the SFL as Newco. (The Associate Membership of the SFA status has since been removed after the SFL and SPFL became SPFL and Newco are now full members).

If rumour is true it becomes a legal issue in terms of who actually owns the SFA Membership, the SFA or the club? I think it is the SFA and it is theirs to do as they please so CW is on to plums, but is it good enough that something of such commercial value as SFA Membership should be at the mercy of powers of discretion with absolutely no defined criteria to protect other football clubs from rogue (as opposed to brogue) traders?

The SFA lawyers must be earning good money. Wonder how they are getting on rewriting the rules that Bryson trashed with his absurd interpretation of what constitutes eligibility?

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Long Time LurkerPosted on2:34 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Tweet exchange with Alex Tomo

czm‏@czm32h
@alextomo Do the lawyers need to clear?

12:48 PM – 29 Jan 2014 · Details

alex thomson‏@alextomo1h
@czm3 of course

Sounds as if the blog is in the lap of the lawyers at the moment. Hopefully publication soon.

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AuldheidPosted on2:36 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:

January 29, 2014 at 1:45 pm

A similar point elicited this response on CQN. The respondent – OGR – does have an inside track on AT’s stuff. It is another “We’ll see”. 🙂

O.G.Rafferty

14:17 on

I think we can expect to see some real developments on the legal front in the next few weeks. If is only bluster, we will find out soon enough.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on2:52 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Jack Jarvis says:
January 29, 2014 at 2:13 pm

Ignoring my “indefensible extrapolation and wishful timing of events” – which I assume refers to my hypothesis/suspicions regarding the outcome of this round and the potential opponents and venue of the next – and consider only the upcoming home tie with Dunfermline in February and the rental of Ibrox twice in April do you think that the amount of additional income scheduled to be ingathered between now and ST renewal time would be enough to assist them over the line without any need for reductions in staff costs, or is it an insignificant amount in the greater scheme of things?
Does anyone know how much the SFA are paying to rent Ibrox and Celtic Park for the semi-finals and the final?
===============================
I could have added the following to my definition of Ranger-nomics – but I thought you’d get the point:
• Naive optimism about the progress of Rangers team/manager is cup competitions ;
• Persistent assumption that Ranger-nomics has not already been performed by insiders on all publicly available data;
• Blythe disregard for recent developments e.g. £200K contractual pay-off to Stockbridge which wipes out the benefit of one cup match.

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ianjsPosted on2:52 pm - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:03 pm

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-could-fighting-rid-craig-1925351
Rangers could be fighting to get rid of Craig Whyte for another 10 years, warns former Ibrox chief Charles Green.
By Colin Duncan, David McCarthy 1 Jun 2013 07:20
Mr Charles (big ands)* Green may have thought so too. :mrgreen:
*(why is it I always have a mental picture of Kenny Everett saying “lets bomb Russia”?

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AllyjamboPosted on2:59 pm - Jan 29, 2014


If Whyte’s claims, whatever they are, aren’t as devastating for TRFC as we might imagine (hope) let’s hope they do damage to the SFA/SPL administrators over their handling of the fiasco of keeping ‘Rangers’ alive. Even if he manages to throw some light onto the secrets of the 5 way agreement, and any other deals with Sevco/Green, a few more pieces of the jigsaw puzzle might just fall into place. But if Tommo’s piece doesn’t get past the legals…we might never know!

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FinlochPosted on3:02 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Just before Christmas one of my pals lost a son on the quite bizarre Sunday when Edinburgh experienced the death of two young footballers.
David Paul, 18 was a cracking lad and a real football talent who was just about to come on to our radars as he broke into the Hibs team this year and who knows where else into the future.
We’ll never know just how good he’d have become.

David’s service last week was very sad but also amazingly uplifting with tears and laughter.
I’ll never forget his dad Gordon’s eulogy which was brave and special or indeed the football oratory contribution by James McDonough of Hibs.
This posting is to lay some serious praise on to Hibs and the Hibs family and to praise one man in particular.

Rod Petrie.

He is much maligned even by some of his own fans but I know he has been a rock for the Paul family in a whole bunch of unsung and unseen but thoroughly decent ways.
I have become a huge fan and admirer of what he has achieved and is achieving at Easter Road.
Hibs maybe haven’t won much but they have a sustainable business model, a fantastic stadium, training park and youth set-up and deep roots into their community.
They haven’t cheated their way to any silverware like some other Scottish clubs but they haven’t left creditors unpaid or even underpaid either and they don’t plan to. They are a thoroughly decent club and cheating is not in Rod’s or Hibs’ DNA.

Rod Petrie proves there are good guys in football.

This takes me to a disconnect.
A disconnect I can’t resolve but Rod can.

The same Rod Petrie, of whom I’ve become a massive fan has lived through the rise and fall of SDM’s team.
And Rod is also involved at the centre and I’d assume influential within the SFA.

The self same SFA who broke their own rules over the 5 Way Agreement (and other machinations pre and post the demise of Rangers FC).
The self same SFA where RCO and SR are still working away on their own agendas and poisoning our community.

I really don’t get it Rod.

What is stopping not just you but also Roy McGregor, Kenny Cameron, Stewart Milne, Stephen Thompson and all the other decent and good guys running most other clubs in the SPFL from uniting and cleaning up our game?

That would be a wonderful and fitting legacy for two Edinburgh youngsters lost to the game.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on3:05 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:29 pm

however, the visiting club on receipt of the 400k would then have to pay 100k vat – this would mean HMRC got £300k when they were only due £200k and the visiting club only got 300k to keep when the home club would have got 400k (their VAT portion already being paid)

======================================================================
NTHM – that made me smile – the idea that al match at Ibrox could lead to double payment of tax – it’s the way you tell em !!!!

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StevieBCPosted on3:12 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Looks like TRFC could attract another ‘Sugar Daddy’ after all…
Interesting parallels with the Govan club.

“…Santander have been in administration recently…Their demise followed a disastrous takeover in January 2011 by an Indian “entrepreneur”, who turned out to be a fraudster on the run from Interpol.
Ali Syed was welcomed with open arms at the time of the takeover, seducing the fans with talk of investing 90 million euros and building a club capable of challenging Barcelona and Real Madrid…”

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/david-mccarthy-rangers-players-stance-3087873

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SmugasPosted on3:22 pm - Jan 29, 2014


ecobhoy says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:03 pm

Rangers could be fighting to get rid of Craig Whyte for another 10 years, warns former Ibrox chief Charles Green.

If I could just rework the sub headline

“Rangers could be fighting to get rid of Craig Whyte for another 10 years, warns one of the two Ibrox men who screwed him out of Rangers and into 25m hellhole”

Could someone talk me through the rest of it?

View Comment

Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on3:40 pm - Jan 29, 2014


m.c.f.c. says:
January 29, 2014 at 3:05 pm
2 0 Rate This

Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:29 pm

however, the visiting club on receipt of the 400k would then have to pay 100k vat – this would mean HMRC got £300k when they were only due £200k and the visiting club only got 300k to keep when the home club would have got 400k (their VAT portion already being paid)

======================================================================
NTHM – that made me smile – the idea that al match at Ibrox could lead to double payment of tax – it’s the way you tell em !!!!

===============================

oh god, I said PAID or I meant to say DUE TO PAY!!

sorry, my bad….

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m.c.f.c.Posted on3:53 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Are We Becoming Blasé ?

Justin Rose announces he’s leaving Sainsbury’s in July after 10 successful years – the share price dips 2.35%

Lee Wallace is not leaving The Rangers after one and a half mediocre seasons – the share price dips 4.76%

Are we becoming insensitive to the erosion of this fine institution’s value – and what about The Rangers 🙂

View Comment

scottcPosted on3:54 pm - Jan 29, 2014


m.c.f.c. says:
January 29, 2014 at 1:28 pm

wottpi – who are all those blazeers supping from the trough cup at the end – and how much do they cost each year ? Have they been asked to take a pay cut ?

The guys supping at the end are the East Fife directors

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Long Time LurkerPosted on3:57 pm - Jan 29, 2014


The OG Rafferty posts on CQN are really interesting:
http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/?p=14598&cpage=2#comments

From what I can gather, TGEF may be making a move on his claim over the assets before the club/company goes bust – as its game over for Whyte if an admin or lquidation event puts the assets outwith the reach of his claim.

Perhaps the Spivs were in a race to bust the club/company as a defence against TGEF progressing the claim?

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scottcPosted on3:59 pm - Jan 29, 2014


m.c.f.c. says:

Justin Rose? The golfer? or Justin KIng the CEO?

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AuldheidPosted on4:00 pm - Jan 29, 2014


http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/red-whyte-blue-rangers-saga-continues/7119

The Saga continues

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on4:02 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Thommo blog

Red, Whyte and blue: the Rangers saga continues

Just when you thought it was all over…

It may no longer be panto season, but the curtain never seems to drop on the Rangers Show – no doubt that is just how the lawyers and accountants want it.

This morning comes a call from the Craig Whyte camp. For some time now the word in Glasgow is that the disgraced former Rangers owner has been having some colourful discussions with people there concerning his ongoing claim that he still owns the club.

29 craig whyte r Red, Whyte and blue: the Rangers saga continues

I simply relate to you what was said to me today and you can make your own judgement about it.

My source insists, vigorously, that Craig Whyte’s claim to own the Rangers assets is alive and well and we should all “expect significant movement in the legal case in the next few weeks”.

The source insists the previous transfer of assets under the then boss Charles Green has no legal basis and will be contested openly in the near future.

Many had rather assumed Mr Whyte’s claim over Rangers, already set out in a lengthy legal document, was dead in the water or lacked the necessary funding. Not so, according to the source who says the claim that Mr Whyte’s ownership of the club “absolutely extends to Ibrox site, the training ground, the players, the entire entity as it stands”.

“There is no question about that, ” he continued. “The ownership of Rangers by the Sevco company of which Craig Whyte is a director is beyond question.”

No doubt many around Ibrox will just laugh this off, and they may or may not be right in so doing. But with the club asking players to take pay cuts, times remain financially critical at the club. So the timing of Mr Whyte is as unwelcome there as it is deliberate.

So, somewhat taken aback by all this, I asked how Mr Whyte would see all this actually working out in the real world.

The scenario unfolded to me would be a legal merger of the disputed camps laying claim to Ibrox under the banner of Craig Whyte’s Sevco and no doubt a new share offer.

Since he has been banned from Scottish football for life and is as near as one can get outside North Korea to being a Non-Person in Scottish football terms, a degree of caution might be advisable in all this.

I understand, for instance, that Mr Whyte believes the ban would not hold up in court for a second, were it to be so tested. Many may choose to differ with that sentiment.

As ever, it totally depends upon where you stand and like I say, I put this out and it’s for others to judge. Though one thing appears certain, the Craig Whyte Claim has not gone away.

We’ll know if this is all just more bluster and hot air in the coming weeks, it appears.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on4:02 pm - Jan 29, 2014


scottc says:
January 29, 2014 at 3:59 pm

Justin Rose? The golfer? or Justin KIng the CEO?
=======================================================
doh!

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Long Time LurkerPosted on4:03 pm - Jan 29, 2014


Tomo blog now up:
http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/

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Comments are closed.