Reflections on Goalposts

ByDanish Pastry

Reflections on Goalposts

A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.

One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.

My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.

We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.

These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.

The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.

At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.

The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.

This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.

How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.

You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.

Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.

About the author

Danish Pastry author

4,642 Comments so far

indy14Posted on10:19 pm - Dec 31, 2013


C67, thanks was fairly sure alright.
Bigger Question, it seems people are overlooking the possibility that right now and after DK’s last visit he has been purchasing shares as , quite frankly he has no option if he wants control. So, is he behind the share purchase, and hopes by being secret about his involvement he can recoup his spends through fans buying tickets so that in actual fact he is merely paying up front and taking spiv ownership but pretending it is still in their hands allowing him to recoup every crooked cent he put in buying the shares? out there I know but….

View Comment

bigbhoyPosted on10:51 pm - Dec 31, 2013


Celtic 67, Indy 14

Yes, it’s. true that there may be drainage difficulties and other infrastructure costs. There is likely to be other difficulties such as access roads. But, these are unlikely to be a showstopper for prime housing land.

There will also be objections to Planning from various “Green” parties, but all things considered it would be extremely valuable with a change of use.

Without seeing Development Appraisals we are unsure about costs and at present Housing market is still stagnant.

I bet you that Laxley have several appraisals

View Comment

neepheidPosted on10:53 pm - Dec 31, 2013


indy14 says: (7)
December 31, 2013 at 10:19 pm
0 0 Rate This

C67, thanks was fairly sure alright.
Bigger Question, it seems people are overlooking the possibility that right now and after DK’s last visit he has been purchasing shares as , quite frankly he has no option if he wants control. So, is he behind the share purchase, and hopes by being secret about his involvement he can recoup his spends through fans buying tickets so that in actual fact he is merely paying up front and taking spiv ownership but pretending it is still in their hands allowing him to recoup every crooked cent he put in buying the shares?

======================
Why would he keep it a secret? It is every bear’s dream- the return of the King. They would sell a lot more tickets with King in control, because they see him as the only Rangers man who might actually put his own money in. Whatever money he might puts in, he isn’t getting back, because unlike the spivs, he won’t be getting shares for a penny. He will have to pay at least £10m for a controlling interest, and then a lot more on top of that to keep the business going. Remember that buying shares just puts money into the spivs’ pockets, none of that money helps the company- which is desperate for cash. There is no profit in this for King or anyone else at the current share price in my opinion.

A good New Year to all, by the way.

View Comment

davythelotionPosted on11:12 pm - Dec 31, 2013


Laxley don’t care about flood plains, more worryingly for sevco, they don’t care about history. The Rons have been duped by CG, this turkey won’t fly. Like all great cons it relies on the need for people to believe in the best possible outcome. Unfortunately the spivs believe jack: tell a lie and keep telling it and it will become the truth. The fans don’t believe it, they just don’t know who to trust.
The MSM do what they’ve always done, take the money, take the copy and relax.

View Comment

Partizani TiranaPosted on11:18 pm - Dec 31, 2013


I’m just wondering, how well do people think Greene did his thing? There’s lots of questions about fronting other people, and that may all be true. But he went from hate figure to saviour very quickly with the hoardes, and when looking at The Rangers sites he is still not figured out. In RM arguments rage about spending vs austerity. They dont realise that they have already been raped, and they gleefully financed it.
As my granny would say, ‘Hell mend them.’

View Comment

causaludendiPosted on11:23 pm - Dec 31, 2013


neepheid says: (964)
December 31, 2013 at 10:53 pm
____________________________________

I may have picked things up wrong, but does dodgy Dave being on the board not take them down a very dangerous path towards, very real pheonix-ism charges (I know…) as would Murray of the Paul variety??

As a side note, from the word go the message to the bampots was to follow the money…

With all these sleights of hand we need to forget squirrels and think octopus’ (or should that be Octopii?)

Aw the very best to all for 2014, may awbdy’s lum reek lang ❗

View Comment

indy14Posted on12:17 am - Jan 1, 2014


Why would he keep it a secret? It is every bear’s dream- the return of the King. They would sell a lot more tickets with King in control, because they see him as the only Rangers man who might actually put his own money in. Whatever money he might puts in, he isn’t getting back, because unlike the spivs, he won’t be getting shares for a penny. He will have to pay at least £10m for a controlling interest, and then a lot more on top of that to keep the business going. Remember that buying shares just puts money into the spivs’ pockets, none of that money helps the company- which is desperate for cash. There is no profit in this for King or anyone else at the current share price in my opinion.

Surely because if the hoardes think the spivs are in charge they’ll keep paying to keep them afloat, but if King is in charge they’ll expect 50 million spent in the morning…

View Comment

Celtic67Posted on1:09 am - Jan 1, 2014


I think some are underestimating the water table (not plains) problem. I mentioned house insurance, would anyone on this blog consider purchasing a house at £3/5/7,000,000 in an area that you cannot get building insurance for? There are already pressure groups in place for the existing housing opposite Auchenhowie who fear for the future of their properties.

View Comment

enough is enoughPosted on1:42 am - Jan 1, 2014


GoosyGoosy says: (495)
December 31, 2013 at 8:30 pm
16 2 Rate This

Does anyone know when the next payment of VAT and NI is due at Ibrox. ?
HMRC may be sorely tempted to apply for a winding up order if it is not paid on the due date

__________________________________________________________________________________________

VAT is due on 7th Jan.. PAYE was due on 22nd of Dec.

View Comment

Celtic67Posted on2:27 am - Jan 1, 2014


enough is enough,

I believe you should rethink that comment.

View Comment

AquinasPosted on3:07 am - Jan 1, 2014


Phil Mac,
Delighted you had a comment on my MP valuation, I would buy MP without out planning as a med to long term investment, as a hedge fund would. But I wouldn’t offer much more than…..
Take all kids camping!

View Comment

ziggystardustPosted on4:18 am - Jan 1, 2014


Used to be a huge fan of Only An Excuse when it was available on tape, cd and other formats, with various contributors. When it reduced to Jonathan Watson and others it became less, despite the occasional brilliance. However, this year, I thought was especially good, if not in patches brilliant. At last, in prime time Scottish TV, the fallacy of continued club, company and continuity of licence was laid bare for public consumption. Of course they had to have the caveat of balance i.e Celtic violence in Amsterdam, Neil Lennon slur. Hugely impressed by the balls of a New Year show to lay bare the ills of Scottish Football, the hypocrisy of same club, same tradition etc. Wonderful rejection in seconds with humour the whole philosophy of club, company and constitution of the Rangers. Brilliant!

View Comment

bhoyantPosted on4:27 am - Jan 1, 2014


Enough is enough,
Is PAYE not due on the 19th of each month?

As this is the beginning of a new year we all look forward to what it will bring. My predictions on the coming year are:

The Tribunal (UTT) will find that EBT’s were in fact a scam to pay remuneration and therefore PAYE & NI deductions should have been made and are due. Crucially this will have no impact on The Rangers as it is a new company (and club!). The SMSM will no doubt through a combination of killing the story and perpetuating the holding company myth ensure that the story is quickly swept under the rug as has so many revelations in this saga.

The Rangers will downsize dramatically starting in January and the quality of football and the results will be affected negatively. I’m still undecided whether an administration event will take place as it depends on how drastically the costs are reduced. If an administration event does take place I do not believe that liquidation is likely to be an outcome this time. I base this on the debt which would be relatively low and the spivs will already have ensured that through the magic of creative accounting they would remain in charge of any CVA vote.

My guess is that the spivs initially took the chance that the SFA and the SPL would have agreed to let The Rangers directly in to the top flight and that would have saw the business plan of selling shares much more appealing to fans and investors. The Bampot Spring disrupted that plan and has set The Rangers back for many years to come.

I predict that The Rangers will scrape promotion this season despite downsizing, but this is where the plan I suspect will be scuppered. Without the cash to buy top league players they will not be able to steam roller the Championship. I think McCoist, if he is still there, will be found out as a poor coach and manager. promotion could easily be missed given that Hearts will most likely be in that league as well as a couple of strong teams already there.

In short I predict that The Rangers will more than likely survive but that for the first time in their short existence they will have to live within their means. the fans will start to drift away due to a combination of poor quality football and opposition to the controlling interests of the club (company) and this will in turn affect the ability to reach the top league and effectively compete against Celtic for many years to come.

View Comment

TartanwulverPosted on6:51 am - Jan 1, 2014


All the best for 2014 to you all, thanks to the ‘big hitters’ and occasional posters for the breadth of information and range of insights. And to TSFM too for ensuring that the rage that many of us feel about the current administration of the Scottish game makes it into the forum in a context of good humour and helpfulness to each others’ understanding. Some other forums could learn from such dignity.

But the point of my post is an extract from yesterday’s Daily Record article, referred to (about a page back iamacant says: December 31, 2013 at 1:25 pm) above. It said ““But at the same time there is an argument of false economics and a genuine worry that further reducing the quality of the manager’s squad will bring about a sizeable drop in season-ticket sales.”

You will note that the it does not say that the danger to ‘Rangers’ is “false economies”, but rather “false economics”! Spot on. Is that the type of economics that the likes of Neil Patey refer to in their analyses? It would explain a lot!

View Comment

andygraham.66Posted on8:35 am - Jan 1, 2014


Well that’s Jonathan Watson on the list

View Comment

neepheidPosted on9:03 am - Jan 1, 2014


bhoyant says: (10)
January 1, 2014 at 4:27 am
8 0 Rate This

Enough is enough,
Is PAYE not due on the 19th of each month?
====================
For electronic payments, the deadline for PAYE is the 22nd of the month.

View Comment

essexbeancounterPosted on9:29 am - Jan 1, 2014


Aquinas says: (7)

Take all kids camping!
=======================================================================
…just like Auchengillan…just along the road…!

…ah’ll get ma sporran…!

Happy, prosperous and healthy 2014 to all readers of this glorious blog!

View Comment

SquigglePosted on10:00 am - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops on January 1, 2014 at 9:42 am

I’m back for a quick happy new year to everyone, 2014 is hopefully an opportunity for us to recognise and take the road forward.

Whilst I’m here though UTH, it can only be this way and i suspect that the BBC always have been the keystone in the establishment’s information management approach.

I have posted a lot on how the recovery of ‘it’ is being managed by the vested. The jobs not done yet but they will get there. Whilst the spivs have set them back they have also shown them what else is possible.

I’m away to my darkened room again.

View Comment

TaysiderPosted on10:03 am - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops says: (765)
January 1, 2014 at 9:42 am

BBC Sportsound starts at 2pm Saturday and regularly it seems to be after 2.30pm before they move on from discussing the Celtic game and carrying as the first manager interview the latest from Neil Lennon. How often is the one game which has commentary on 810mw the Celtic match while other games have to make do with open all mics? Invariably Murdo is the pundit for the Celtic team so woe betide those who support their opponents getting any analysis from their perspective.

Yes there are too many biased towards Ibrox but I’m sure a lot of diddy club fans will, like me, read your complaints with a wry smile!

Anyway a happy new year to all TSFM posters and lurkers. I hope that the start of 2014 sees both teams providing an entertaining match at a sold out Tannadice today as another chapter in the Armageddon saga unfolds. 😉

View Comment

bobferrisPosted on10:38 am - Jan 1, 2014


Usually watch Only An Excuse behind my fingers but I agree that they showed some balls last night with the Mastermind sketch. Q: “Who said “I wish the new Rangers football club every success” A: “Walter Smith” then next question mentioned Jim Spence’s similar remark recently that provoked all the outrage with the fan in the chair going apoplectic. I could imagine everyone on here punching the air at that moment!

He nailed Johann Lamont too!

View Comment

bobferrisPosted on10:49 am - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops – you definitely have a point re the Blue Heaven programme. Even back then, as a non-OF person I thought it was odd that they focused on the poorer youth set up of the two. But as regards BBC Sportsound, I remember a list before on here of the pundits and their former or main clubs but I’ll attempt a few – John Robertson(Hearts), Willie Miller(Aberdeen), Murdo McLeod(Celtic), Allan Preston(Hearts), Billy Dodds, (arguable what is main club was but main teams were Dundee, Dundee Utd, Aberdeen, St Johnstone and Rangers), Derek Ferguson(Rangers and Hearts), the latter really only being a match reporter (who has to enunciate everything r-e-a-l-l-y s-l-o-w-l-y.) He’s doing his best as language is not his first language but he makes me laugh!

View Comment

TaysiderPosted on11:08 am - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops says: (766)
January 1, 2014 at 10:46 am

“….If I can call them smaller clubs I believe they receive very fair coverage from BBC and are not subject to any real critical analysis. The point you make about lengthy discussions of the Celtic game, how often are they positive?”
——————————–
It’s all about perspectives upthehoops. My point was to emphasise that for those who don’t support the two Glasgow clubs, the time spent discussing Celtic compared with other teams really is laughable some times. It is particularly noticeable from 2pm Saturday afternoon and honestly, I believe loads of supporters listening will be thinking, like me, any chance of discussing the non Celtic game now please!

Trying to be as objective as any supporter can be, the discussion at those times of the upcoming Celtic game strike me as relatively impartial in terms of how Celtic is playing, who is underperforming, what Neil Lennon might be planning etc.

There’s a lot that we would agree on I’m sure re the Rangers bias of too many in the BBC. A discussion featuring say Graham Spiers, Billy Dodds and Chic Young (most irritating of all for me) would be one that had me quickly reaching for the off button! But there is a Glasgow centric element at times, just as infuriating for those from the provinces listening to our “national” broadcaster.

View Comment

SmugasPosted on11:42 am - Jan 1, 2014


Tayside,

My personal favourite for us one channel wonders is being forced it listen to the second half of Celtic versus whoever desperately hoping for a snippet of comment on my own diddys, then final whistle, switch to Richard Gordon who really should know better who says “so let’s go round the grounds for a round up starting with Liam Macleod at Celtic park”

View Comment

ptd1978Posted on12:38 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Happy new year everyone. Let’s hope that 2014 sees at least a few other media outlets catch up with the ethos of integrity and clear thinking that is a hallmark of this site.
Predictions for 2014:
Celtic win the league, but T’Rangers are crowned “champions” again as the SMSM pretend their achievement is on a par with winning the top division.
There will be a new outbreak of inter boardroom warfare at Ibrox. Stockbridge will try to press ahead with a further share issue, but might find finance a bit harder to come by after Wallace used the AGM to point out what a pathetic finance director he actually is. Cue more inter boardroom warfare at Ibrox.
Gym Trainer will be rehired by the Beeb, creating a massive stink. Nothing creates an unremovable stink like an overused Jim Traynor. The only good thing about this is that someone will get to ask him how long he’s supported Airdieonions.
The UTT will reverse the FTT’s decision. Various “neutral” reporters will read their long prepared (thanks Jack) opinions that it makes no difference as the responsible “company” no longer exists. HMRC will make noises about collecting from recipients and the same reporters will then claim they aren’t finance reporters so the matter should be dropped. Mr C Ogivie (I’m told the c stands for conflicted) will again go into hiding.
Lee Wallace will be hyped up over the next few weeks to the point where Sevco fans believe he’s worth 7 figures for playing 18 months in Scotland’s lowest national divisions and occasionally wearing a yellow bib for Scotland. I wonder if there are any more EBT recipients in management who will consider this the same club enough to do a Souness/Smith and screw their current club to help the spivs.

View Comment

FIFAPosted on12:55 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Happy New Year to All
Had a great evening at the Merchant Square last night where everyone enjoyed a fantastic evening ,got home about 01.30 and poured a large Balvennie to watch a recording of Only an Excuse ,wife had went to bed but was not there long when she came down to see what the racket was,it was me on the floor ,I was lying back sipping at the whisky when I nearly choked , some of the brilliant stuff Watson came out with,I was like others not prepared for this ,well done son,lessons can be taken by our other media punters that we have no respect left for,do any of you want to grow a set,well do you. only need a few more to come out and the walls of Gersico [spelling intended] will come tumbling down ,a positve to start the year on ,hope there are more to come.

View Comment

casper999Posted on1:21 pm - Jan 1, 2014


And jonathon watsons a die hard gers fan aswell. so. lots of them know the truth , just darent speak it………a poor state of affairs……

.Happy New Year to each and everyone of you………

View Comment

Greenock JackPosted on1:22 pm - Jan 1, 2014


The debate on Sportsound and their coverage of Scottish football is interesting.
If it were to have the same amount (est.80%) and the general slant of coverage on Rangers as does this ‘Scottish football’ forum then what would posters say ?

Let’s take a look some of the employees.

Kenny McIntryre:
You could argue he looks for controversy but I don’t think he is bothered what colour it is. His remit is to make the programmes he presents as spicey as possible whilst not hitting the tabloid level. Has featured ‘Rangermen’ (eg. Paul Murray) on his programmes but spivs don’t take up offers.
His programmes were generally a useful positive for requisitioners but only because Spivs wouldn’t talk and hid behind Irvines comms strategy.

Chris McLaughlin:
More a roving reporter that brings his brand of exclusive and has played a prominent part in the breaking of news on the Rangers saga. Is on speed dial with Jack Irvine and Ramsay Smith of Mediahouse and knowingly spreads misleading spin on their behalfs. Has been a toool of the spivs.

Al Lamont:
Comes accross as a responsible neutral reporter but the part he played in the lead up to the AGM left some unanswered questions, both on his part (questioned if it really worthwhile for supporters to attend and vote at AGM on air on the word of source / whilst two possible sources denied leaking) and the conduct of the Rangers board and agents working on their behalf.

The coverage on Sportsound depends a lot on the clubs themselves and individuals within both club and radio.

Dundee Utd get more coverage at the moment because of a brilliant crop of youngsters and their success. Add Jim Spence.
Kilmarnock got a lot of coverage because Kenny Shiels pushed it.
Hibs will now get more coverage because of Terry Butcher. Previously got relatively little for size of club.
Motherwell don’t get much because they keep their heads down (but do tremondously well).
Rangers, Hearts and Dunfermline have had more than usual due to financial issues but it’s not positive.
The Rangers saga could have a radio station of it’s own and it’s arguable that it doesn’t receive enough coverage. Time spent on football matters is limited and in part is due to dispute between club and BBC.
Celtic get plenty of coverage for European matches but their SPFL exploits are of limited media worth given they knew where they’d finish back in August and already know the same for 2014/15.
The Aberdeen angle, whether it be positive or negative is well covered with R.Gordon and W.Miller.
St.Johnstone have Stuart Cosgrove to fly their flag.

Then you have Jackson, English and Spiers.

View Comment

davythelotionPosted on1:45 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Happy New Year!!!!!
Aside from ridiculous diversionary discussions, orchestrated by Jack in the MSM, I’m convinced that the next two months will be crucial for Sevco, CW and some Scottish hacks.
As the threads of the cloak of deceit, which was thrown over the corpse of the dead club, begin to unravel, the motives and identities of the necromancers will be revealed…and it ain’t gonna be pretty!
I have a question, which I have asked before but may have missed the reply, so apologies in advance.
Does anyone know if, having negotiated contractual payments via an EBT, an agent received payment either via his client or as part of the overall slice of the originally negotiated sums?
Or
Was an agent a beneficiary of an EBT from either deidco or an associated company?

View Comment

Danish PastryPosted on1:58 pm - Jan 1, 2014


bobferris on January 1, 2014 at 10:49 am
19 1 Rate This
———

Bob,
Mourinho’s latest, a bit tongue in cheek, is to rhyme off all the non-Chelsea pundits on the BBC and Sky. Not a few from Liverpool. Looks worse than anything in Scotland (PS Greenock Jack, the The Rangers story does have its own station — Clyde 1).
Where BBC Scotland falls short compared to England, in spite of a fairly varied collection of pundits and reporters, is in the lack of serious criticism of Ibrox. Whether it’s fear, not wanting the personal hassle, or pressure from the big wigs, the situation leaves the impression that Ibrox exercises a kind of censorship on what can and can not be said. So even non-Ibrox men can appear to be servants of that club, even though they are anything but.

View Comment

upthehoopsPosted on2:04 pm - Jan 1, 2014


bobferris says: (163)
January 1, 2014 at 10:49 am
===============================
My opinion, for what it’s worth, is that BBC focused on the Rangers youth academy for one reason, that reason being there was, and in my opinion still is, an inherent bias towards Ibrox within the organisation. Other people on this forum rightly point out Celtic do get a lot of coverage on the BBC, and my point is it is more often negative than positive. I really do think they have to ask themselves what they want, and also what the listener expects. I think the listener expects a reasonable level of impartiality whereas in my view we currently have an unreasonable level of bias.

Now, this is where it becomes tin hat time for me, but I’m going to state it anyway. I believe the media still have an underlying view that a Rangers person is of far higher integrity than others, especially Celtic people. The very fact the BBC have such a slant towards Rangers in their pundits, both now and in the past, would back up the view they believe a Rangers man can be trusted implicitly to be honest and fair. Their positivity recently towards ‘traditional’ Rangers man Paul Murray also indicates that is the case. The Government sometimes provide us with data when certain ethnic minority groups officially achieve equal status. I wonder when the media, especially the BBC, will ever regard a non-Rangers man as the equal of a ‘traditional’ Rangers man? I suspect not in my lifetime.

View Comment

Greenock JackPosted on2:28 pm - Jan 1, 2014


UTH
I think the listener expects a reasonable level of impartiality whereas in my view we currently have an unreasonable level of bias.
————————————————

Perhaps the BBC can’t always expect a reasonable level of objectivity or subsequent rationality from listeners.

Accusations of ‘inherent bias’ when coming from such a slanted perspective are of little practical worth or can they be taken too seriously in the places that matter.

I believe that there are issues at BBC Scotland but don’t share your reading of them.

View Comment

davythelotionPosted on2:32 pm - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops says: (767)
January 1, 2014 at 2:04 pm
&&&&&&&&&&
Worth a read.
http://www.wsc.co.uk/reviews/63-General/5079-a-game-of-two-halves

View Comment

upthehoopsPosted on2:43 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Greenock Jack says: (257)
January 1, 2014 at 2:28 pm

Accusations of ‘inherent bias’ when coming from such a slanted perspective are of little practical worth or can they be taken too seriously in the places that matter.
============================================
Make of my view what you will, but surely an observer like Archie McPherson should be listened to? Interestingly, during Archie’s time at the BBC Celtic fans were labelled as paranoid when they made accusations of bias. As I said earlier, exactly when did the bias stop if it no longer exists, and as a licence fee payer I am interested in why ex Rangers players and Rangers supporting pundits are somehow considered by the BBC to be more fit for purpose than others. To put it bluntly WATP still seems to be the mantra, even among people who should be intelligent enough to think outside the box.

View Comment

jean7brodiePosted on2:51 pm - Jan 1, 2014


TSFM says: (582)
January 2, 2014 at 6:59 pm

I thought I had a drink problem there when I looked at the date on your post 😕

Edit: Oops understand now!!

View Comment

FIFAPosted on3:31 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Unfortunately there are very few pundits that I would sit through a [Scottish] TV sports programme and listen to ,their intelectual level is shown up for what it is when the ones that think they are quoted rubbish the net bampots,the comments from posters on TSFM and other sites have totaly been informative in ways that have exposed the sm as a sham of an organisation that you really have to question is this all we have got and the BBC and others really have no choice but to continualy present these incompetents ,if there are any decent pundits out there ,are they refusing to be paired with these foible excuse for reporters or pundits,I cannot think of any other excuse for the continuing parading of these people ,surely the BBC management must realise that if they continue in this way someone someday will question their position ,surely they are not that stupid,well given some things that we have been asked to believe I will hold on that one ,some of these guys kids must be taking it in the neck from their mates as to the level of discussion that is continuly spouted out on tv ,unfortunately I think we are stuck with them for a while yet.
Rant over

View Comment

ianagainPosted on3:41 pm - Jan 1, 2014


TSFM says: (582)

January 2, 2014 at 6:59 pm

Quantcast

A very happy and prosperous New Year to everyone on TSFM from the mods.

In 2013 we recorded over 4,000,000 unique visits to the site, and over 8,000,000 page views. Like the newest club in the SPFL, we have no year on year figures to compare that with, but the numbers certainly suggest that our message of accountability, fair play and sporting integrity has some
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Thanks to TSFM and all the mods. Happy new Year to you all.
Actually we are much more popular than you may think. We are now officially on themoderated list of over 250 companies employing 2500 people or more. (Source my IT GURU) Hence my very poor posting record of late. Up the Bampots!
Posting from phones isn’t easy if you want to quote. Maybes a wee tutorial for Android and Iphone on the pages may help.
============
PS Lord W.
Hows the Bekka valleys finest maturing these days?

View Comment

bobferrisPosted on3:54 pm - Jan 1, 2014


upthehoops – It wasn’t too long ago that Jim Craig presented football on the BBC and Billy McNeill was a regular co-commentator for Scotland games and cup finals.

View Comment

PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on5:14 pm - Jan 1, 2014


TSFM says: (582)
January 2, 2014 at 6:59 pm

Great numbers.
Chapeau

View Comment

FIFAPosted on5:24 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Just listened to SSB ,I know I know ,Keech & co where on about the small crowd at Celtic park and stated ,are you ready, Thats why the game needs a Rangers in the top league,a small issue guys that is vital to any football game,PUBLIC TRANSPORT,there was distinct lack of this today in case you didnt know.

View Comment

BarcabhoyPosted on5:25 pm - Jan 1, 2014


ecobhoy says: (2137)
December 31, 2013 at 5:39 pm
24 0 Rate This

Barcabhoy says: (316)
December 31, 2013 at 4:40 pm

@Barca

The thing about a Rights Issue or increase in shareholding that I can’t get my head round is why would those in control do it?

They have absolute control

================================

The reason to do it, is because they don’t have absolute control. They have control , but not enough to guarantee the 75% needed to pass special resolutions, as was shown by the failure of Resolution 10.

The business needs funds, a rights issue is the obvious way to do this. A loan from Laxey might be an option, but i suspect that would only be Plan A if they were thinking Administration, as this would allow Laxey to control the process.

A rights issue would force the institutions to invest or be diluted to the point the board have absolute control, and can pass any special resolutions that suit their purposes.

I have posted many times on here that my view is the key original investors have been recompensed for their investment by way of fees, commissions, salary, bonus , 1p shares and service contracts. They are therefore in control , having effectively invested zero. Investing cash now to get your side to over 75% and provide the business with operating capital, makes sense on a number of levels.

1 It allows media house to create a story that takes dead aim at Murray , McCall & co. Should they fail to take up the rights issue, they are an easy target for ridicule. They will be seen to have failed to walk the walk yet again. In effect you permanently kill them off as a credible alternative. Should the unlikely happen and the requisitioners take up their rights, then you have their money with them having no say or influence on how its spent

2 the business needs cash. If you dont invest, then some sort of insolvency event is a certainty. That brings risk, as was seen with Duff and Phelps

3 investing cash makes it more likely you will get support for the cut in expenses which are desperately needed. Again media house can spin this to good effect , at the same time as maybe now pointing out the reality of how McCoist has literally profited at Rangers expense. He should be #1 in the list of expenses to be cut, he is not as necessary now as he was 18 months ago. He should be worried.

View Comment

Bill1903Posted on5:47 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Re biased reporting on BBC Sportsound

Today I listened to Liam McLeod commentate on the Aberdeen v United game.
He was joined by Willie Miller with Richard Gordon and the heralds Michael Grant also at the game.
All the above are massive Aberdeen fans but tried to be professional throughout the game.

I’ve no idea why Celtic or The Rangers fans aren’t allowed to ‘come out’ but have to pretend to support one of the diddy teams.

Anyway I’m not bothered as ‘The sheep are on fire’ and I’m going to have a New Years dram to celebrate 😀

View Comment

davythelotionPosted on6:26 pm - Jan 1, 2014


FIFA says: (470)
January 1, 2014 at 5:24 pm

Shug et al are well aware of the prevailing circumstances today. They choose to follow Jack’s line about the league having no edge because Rangers no longer exist. On their current performance sevco will struggle for at least five years in the top division (assuming they achieve promotion). They will really struggle if there isn’t a massive injection of non returnable cash from a sugar daddy in the very near future.

Motherwell, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd will relish the Euro cash.

View Comment

PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on6:51 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Barcabhoy says: (317)
January 1, 2014 at 5:25 pm
Excellent post.
Your point about Ally McCoist and the burden he is on the wage bill misses one point though.
The pay off clause in his contract is significant.
Quite simply it is currently too expensive to sack Ally.
Only in a (controlled) Insolvency Event would it be possible for Ally to be sacked more or less cost free.

View Comment

ecobhoyPosted on7:14 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Barcabhoy says: (317)
January 1, 2014 at 5:25 pm
ecobhoy says: (2137)
December 31, 2013 at 5:39 pm
Barcabhoy says: (316)
December 31, 2013 at 4:40 pm

@Barca

The thing about a Rights Issue or increase in shareholding that I can’t get my head round is why would those in control do it? They have absolute control
================================
The reason to do it, is because they don’t have absolute control. They have control , but not enough to guarantee the 75% needed to pass special resolutions, as was shown by the failure of Resolution 10.
=================================================
Silly me – forgot about the failure of Res 10 and its significance 🙄

View Comment

Tif FinnPosted on7:41 pm - Jan 1, 2014


I was listening to SSB on the road back from the game and listening to the ongoing propaganda trying to reinforce the effort to get Rangers into the SPFL premiership as quickly as possible.

Apparently the league is not competitive enough and that is what is effecting the gates, especially Celtic’s.

Simple question for anyone who takes that view. Would the Rangers side make the top league more competitive. Having watched them a few times I just don’t think so.

View Comment

upthehoopsPosted on8:00 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Tif Finn says: (1141)
January 1, 2014 at 7:41 pm4
==========================
If they believe it is okay to advance them to the top league outwith on field sporting achievement, do they also believe once they are there it is okay to ensure they win it outwith on field sporting achievement?

They seem to forget the lack of competition for years as Rangers financially doped and cheated their way to success. I guess they’d be delighted if those days returned.

View Comment

Tif FinnPosted on8:12 pm - Jan 1, 2014


I really don’t know what they think.

It has been proven conclusively that the previous team only won anything through spending money they didn’t have, including money they stole from others allied to fielding ineligible players. It is brutally apparent that the new team has no sustainable business plan and is again spending money they don’t have.

How the likes of Keevins thinks they are going to improve the top division and make it more competitive is a mystery to me. The team they have would not be competitive in the league, and any talk is of cutting back. Which only makes sense if the business is to survive.

Whilst I am on anyway, Keevins is very comfortable telling everyone how much the Celtic fans are missing Rangers. Even fans who phone in and say that is not the case. He then insultingly laughs that off and says of course they are, people who say they aren’t are just deluded.. No-one I know is missing the old team, or wants anything to do with the new one. That is a very small sample but it is the case.

View Comment

Danish PastryPosted on8:23 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Bill1903 says: (40)
January 1, 2014 at 5:47 pm
20 0 Rate This

… Today I listened to Liam McLeod commentate on the Aberdeen v United game.
He was joined by Willie Miller with Richard Gordon and the heralds Michael Grant also at the game.
All the above are massive Aberdeen fans but tried to be professional throughout the game.
———-

Heard that too Bill. Sounded like a good game and big crowd. Good commentary team all round from what I heard.

Earlier Stuart Cosgrove and Pat Nevin were only slightly petty and not at all ill-informed.

There were some good thoughts about a winter break falling immediately after the Christmas and Nerdy fixtures. Sensible stuff about moving the calendar to include more of the summer months.

View Comment

ianjsPosted on8:37 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Just a thought for today, the figures below ARE sobering!
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/apr/18/premier-league-finances-club-by-club
Financial figures for 2011-12, for the 20 clubs that were in the Premier League during 2010-11
Just 9 of the 20, and much more detail in the article, !!warning!! Long Article

ARSENAL
Net debt: £98m
ASTON VILLA
Net debt: £122m
BOLTON WANDERERS
Net debt: £137m
CHELSEA
Net debt: £878m
LIVERPOOL
Net debt: £87m
MANCHESTER CITY
Net debt: £58m
MANCHESTER UNITED
Net debt: £366m
NEWCASTLE UNITED
Net debt: £129m
QUEENS PARK RANGERS
Net debt: £89m

Happy New Year

View Comment

John ClarkPosted on8:44 pm - Jan 1, 2014


davythelotion says: (309)
January 1, 2014 at 1:45 pm
‘…Does anyone know if, having negotiated contractual payments via an EBT, an agent received payment either via his client or as part of the overall slice of the originally negotiated sums?
Or
Was an agent a beneficiary of an EBT from either deidco or an associated company?’
——-
The answer is probably ‘no’.

Dr Poon’s dissenting opinion Paras 89 and 90 is worth a read for what they say was the way an agent, his player, and Rangers decided the basis on which the agent’s commission would be paid, and the club’s payment contract with the agent
The agent was to receive 5% of the total remuneration of the player ( i.e declared salary + ebt ‘loan’ capacity).
But payment to the agent was by separate contract between the agent and the club, and payment was to be made in 3 equal instalments by the club directly.
Or so it reads to me.
The agent clearly knew that EBTs were included in working out his 5%, and was therefore party to whatever little deception of the tax man there may have been, and the actual deception of the football authorities if the agent knew that all payments were not being disclosed to the SPL/SFA.

refer to page 90 of this link
http://www.financeandtaxtribunals.gov.uk/judgmentfiles/j6851/TC02372.pdf.

View Comment

ecobhoyPosted on8:45 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Tif Finn says: (1142)
January 1, 2014 at 8:12 pm
No-one I know is missing the old team, or wants anything to do with the new one.
================================
Except Keevins 😆

View Comment

BarcabhoyPosted on8:45 pm - Jan 1, 2014


PhilMacGiollaBhain says: (216)
January 1, 2014 at 6:51 pm
12 0 Rate This

Barcabhoy says: (317)
January 1, 2014 at 5:25 pm
Excellent post.
Your point about Ally McCoist and the burden he is on the wage bill misses one point though.
The pay off clause in his contract is significant.
Quite simply it is currently too expensive to sack Ally.
Only in a (controlled) Insolvency Event would it be possible for Ally to be sacked more or less cost free.

===============

Unless MH get to work and point out what most of TRFC supporters are ignoring. Which is that whilst the club has been downsized hugely ( although not hugely enough) McCoist is effectively making more than when RFC were an SPL club. His salary is the same, his bonus provisions unchanged, however he has shares worth £700,000 at IPO, that cost him £7,000.

The stark reality is McCoist has exploited Rangers and their fans for his own ends. Green went along with it, Wallace has no need to. MH could seriously embarrass McCoist , if they wanted him out . Remember Jack Irvines threats to Blin and McCall that they had no idea what they were letting themselves in for. They disappeared from prominence , or entirely in Blins case, pretty quickly after that.

View Comment

John ClarkPosted on8:58 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Danish Pastry says: (1855)
January 1, 2014 at 8:23 pm
Bill1903 says: (40)
January 1, 2014 at 5:47 pm
——–
I’ve never been at a game and listened simultaneously to Liam McLeod commentating on it, so I can’t tell how ‘accurate’ his commentary is relative to what I am seeing with my own eyes.

But, by jings, he makes any game sound really exciting, and earns his corn from that point of view alone, as an ‘entertainer’.

Rob Mclean, by contrast, while he is as reasonably knowledgeable and well-prepared as a professional should be, suffers from the same fault ( self-admitted) as Andy Murray- his voice and delivery are kind of over-restrained ( and perhaps a tad boring) : my heart sinks a little when he’s doing live commentary!

View Comment

indy14Posted on9:29 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Motherwell, Aberdeen, Dundee Utd will relish the Euro cash.

As this is the case and will be for several more years, the gap from Sevco in the PL (assumption made not guaranteed, thankfully) to the likes of Dundee Utd and Aberdeen could be un-scalable let alone to the twenty to thirty point lead to Celtic beyond that.
I always felt the league was better when Aberdeen and Dundee Utd were at their best and challenging with Celtic for leagues and cups, and that I see for the considerable future.
Who loves a wee dram of Armageddon? I DO!

View Comment

PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on9:37 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Barcabhoy says: (318)
January 1, 2014 at 8:45 pm
Fair point and Ally would be an easy target for the toxic stuff from MH.
However he is the only living link as it were between old RFC and TRFC remaining at the top table at Ibrox.
I still think he has the utility function apropos Season Ticket Sales.

View Comment

Danish PastryPosted on9:59 pm - Jan 1, 2014


ianjs says: (63)
January 1, 2014 at 8:37 pm
6 0 Rate This
———–

Can you imagine if Sky or BT Sport did a Setanta and the income stream stopped, or was drastically reduced?

Crivvens.

@Phil
There was an interesting duo in the Sky studio the other night doing their pundit thing from Dunfermline: Jimmy Calderwood & Kenny Miller. I did wonder at the time if the wheels were already in motion.

View Comment

JoethebookiePosted on10:02 pm - Jan 1, 2014


For the first time in ages I’m looking forward to Sportscene.
It’s not even for my own team’s highlights, Dundee United v Aberdeen sounded like a cracker.
For all the msm’s claims I don’t think the current third tier leaders could live with either of the above or Motherwell on even a decent day.
They would bring nothing but fear and hatred to the top flight right now.

View Comment

upthehoopsPosted on10:08 pm - Jan 1, 2014


indy14 says: (9)
January 1, 2014 at 9:29 pm

I always felt the league was better when Aberdeen and Dundee Utd were at their best and challenging with Celtic for leagues and cups, and that I see for the considerable future.
=====================================================
I vividly remember the early 1980’s when what you describe was taking place. Rangers, aside from the odd cup win, were a spent force, but the one crucial aspect to it all was that they lived within their means, so the playing field was reasonably level. Celtic and Rangers were still the biggest clubs, but the managerial talents of Ferguson & McLean had gone some way to outweighing that. When Jim Bett, formerly of Rangers, who was an excellent player and an established Internationalist was looking to return to Scotland, the media cast Ibrox as his only realistic destination. Step forward Aberdeen who could not only pay the £300K fee (large at the time), and meet his wage demands, but also convince him Pittodrie was the place for him. That shows you just how level the playing field was then.

View Comment

FIFAPosted on10:38 pm - Jan 1, 2014


As we all have known for some time ,Keevins ,a man with a forged journo past,imagines himself with a following of sorts out there.well Hugh unfortunately most folk now just accept you as an old man with a grudge against society and Celtic FC in particular ,when you started rambling on about internet bampots just proved your ignorance of where we are in the 21st century ,I tuned into SSB today by mistake and decided to listen in ,big mistake which I wont make again,you went on about the small crowd which according to BBC Sport figures was given as 57000,if this is the case and we know both figures from Celtic and the New Rangers always include season tickets ,well that must mean that Celtic have had their biggest non season ticket attendance [outside of Champion Legue games] not bad going for a day with no public transport.

View Comment

ianagainPosted on10:51 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Indy

Anyone who thinks Motherwell “relish” Euro cash is well wide of the mark.

Its a net debt to the club of well over – Last year certainly minus 40k.

European Championship. Only a money maker for the money makers.

Might be interesting if whoevers second this year gets a 2 daytrip to the Caucasus AT 3 DAYS NOTICE with all the passport crap it involves says Thanks Eufa but No thanks.

Well guess who would volunteer to take their place?

SFA step forward.

I can just see it happening.

View Comment

Tif FinnPosted on10:53 pm - Jan 1, 2014


I can assure you I do not know Hugh Keevins and neither would I want to.

View Comment

BarcabhoyPosted on10:58 pm - Jan 1, 2014


PhilMacGiollaBhain says: (217)
January 1, 2014 at 9:37 pm
5 0 Rate This

Barcabhoy says: (318)
January 1, 2014 at 8:45 pm
Fair point and Ally would be an easy target for the toxic stuff from MH.
However he is the only living link as it were between old RFC and TRFC remaining at the top table at Ibrox.
I still think he has the utility function apropos Season Ticket Sales.

================

Wouldnt be difficult to sell Stuart McColl or Derek McInnes as a better option and therefore fill the role of head cheerleader for Season Ticket Sales.

Cost would be 25% of what McCoist gets now. Whether they would be interested isn’t a given though. There are however many ex Rangers who would jump at the opportunity

View Comment

ianagainPosted on11:05 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Barcabhoy says: (319)

January 1, 2014 at 10:58 pm

0

0

Rate This

Quantcast

PhilMacGiollaBhain says: (217)
January 1, 2014 at 9:37 pm
5 0 Rate This

Barcabhoy says: (318)
January 1, 2014 at 8:45 pm
Fair point and Ally would be an easy target for the toxic stuff from MH.
However he is the only living link as it were between old RFC and TRFC remaining at the top table at Ibrox.
I still think he has the utility function apropos Season Ticket Sales.

================

Wouldnt be difficult to sell Stuart McColl or Derek McInnes as a better option and therefore fill the role of head cheerleader for Season Ticket Sales.

II================================

Its McCall and he wouldn’t even contemplate it. Was wise enough to dodge Sheffield.

View Comment

ianagainPosted on11:14 pm - Jan 1, 2014


As you all may have missed this:

McCall celebrates 3 years at ‘Well

Stuart McCall celebrated his third anniversary as ‘Well boss by lavishing praise on his players and staff.

The 49-year old sat in the manager’s chair at Fir Park for the first time back in December 2010, and his three years have been littered with success, broken records and happy memories.

Indeed, in terms of league wins ratio, the former Scotland midfield is the most successful top-league manager in the clubs’ history, with only Davie Hay producing better in the run-away First Division winning season back in 1981/82.

Showing typical modesty that defines his character, McCall deflected all praise towards his small, hardworking and talented staff and the many players who have played a part in his 140 game run.

Speaking to the gathered press at Motherwell’s news conference, the ‘Well boss, who knocked back a move to English side Sheffield United in the summer, said: “It has been an honour for me to be at this club for the time I have.

“I’ve got to be honest, when I was first offered the job I wasn’t sure I’d last three weeks, let alone three years!

“I remember back to my first game, a pretty dull 0-0 draw at Hamilton, then we faced a tricky Cup-tie at Dundee live on TV. I think everyone going there expected an upset, as Dundee were flying high in the First Division, but we managed a convincing 4-0 win.

“I’m not sure I was an overly popular choice to take over from Craig [Brown] and Archie [Knox], and it was quite difficult at the beginning, particularly losing Mark Renyolds and Nick Blackman so quickly and coming into a dressing room which had just lost three games, to replace a duo who were popular amongst the players.

“But I have got to say, I couldn’t be prouder of the three years, the staff, the players and everyone surrounding the club. Of course, there have been ups and downs, but certainly far more ups. Cup Finals, finishing third then second, playing in the Champions League and Europa League, breaking points and goal records and winning awards at the end of last season; it’s all been a great run.

“But there is still a load more to do here. I said before the season we wanted to make an impact in Cup competitions and we haven’t, and can’t apologise enough for that. Our focus now falls back to the league and we’ll just need to give that an even harder push next season when it comes along again.”

View Comment

ianagainPosted on11:17 pm - Jan 1, 2014


And the consequence:
Hutchie will be sold as we cant afford him.
Anier Ainsworth will go back where they came from

That’s football with reality.

View Comment

PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on11:36 pm - Jan 1, 2014


Barcabhoy says: (319)
January 1, 2014 at 10:58 pm
Agreed.
A competent coach would do much better with those resources-or even a smaller football budget.
However if Ally wants to hunker down he will be expensive to shift.

View Comment

Tif FinnPosted on11:42 pm - Jan 1, 2014


It really is worth bearing in mind McCoist’s fantastic achievements, things like getting knocked out of Europe (all competitions) against Maribor and Malmo. Which if I remember correctly were not going to cause the mighty Rangers many problems according to our press.

I wouldn’t suggest that he had played a central part in the liquidation, but he certainly helped hurry it along.

View Comment

selfassessorPosted on12:03 am - Jan 2, 2014


Happy New Year all and don’t forget to submit your tax returns by end Jan – I know we’re all honest tax payers on here but a reminder is sometimes necessary!

This year I’m looking forward to the correct decision from the UTT and witnessing the financial pruning at the tribute act.

Is Stunney still looking on? I’m still missing the daily paper review.

Cheers all.

View Comment

Matty RothPosted on12:04 am - Jan 2, 2014


As ianagain says there’s not likely to be much money made in Europe for our 2nd and 3rd place qualifiers. The odds are just too heavily stacked in favour of the bigger sides and the cash not distributed far enough.

Aberdeen managed to get into the Europe league a number of seasons ago and made something like £2 million (from memory).

I can’t think of many other diddy teams achieving this and suspect most will make only very modest additional income or indeed a loss.

All the more reason for fans to think carefully about just how important a competitive league is to them and how that might be achieved.

View Comment

davythelotionPosted on1:29 am - Jan 2, 2014


john clarke says: (1482)
January 1, 2014 at 8:44 pm
££££££
Thanks for the reply and the link. As to agents agreeing that salary is made up in part of a non-repayable loan, I would imagine that they would have sought, along with a written statement explicitly stating the loan was non repayable, a further written statement to imdemnify both the agent and the player from any future tax liability arising out of these payments.
If a club, hypothetically speaking, was to employ an agent on a retained basis and they accessed their EBT via an associate company, would this be above board?

View Comment

John ClarkPosted on1:33 am - Jan 2, 2014


ianagain says: (71)
January 1, 2014 at 11:14 pm
‘…McCall celebrates 3 years at ‘Well ..’
——–
And I wish him ” ‘Well!”

Getting on for my dotage ( our recent young American guests ventured to praise me for being ‘spry’ for my age!) I sense a real quickening of the pulse in Scottish Football.

The fundamental distortion created by cheating has been , or at least is beginning to be, properly factored in in any analysis of the Scottish game.

A corrupt club, under the orders of a knight of the realm ( wonder what our Fred thinks about the immunity of SDM?) was (and this is the point) with the certain knowledge of the Football authorities,able to pervert the whole idea of sporting competition.

Now that that club is dead, and its mewling, ‘new club’ surrogate, illegitimate, and wholly spurious pretendy continuation is itself realising its utter irrelevance and early demise, the rest of of Scottish Football can actually begin to get a grip on itself.

It does not in fact ‘need’ cheats.

The Motherwells, the Dundees ( United or otherwise!), the ICTs and Ross Counties, the Aberdeens, and the rest of Scottish Football do not need to sell their souls to cheatery.

They’re doing fine as they are.
And miserable old hacks (oy, less o’ the ‘old’-he’s feckin younger than I am,ffs!) like Keevins are, really and truly, yesterday’s succulent lamb-shit eaters.
We are on the threshold of a new era.
One final push will rid us of the ( now, when you think of it!) the one-club- centred SFA administration, the beautifully oiled connecting door between the marble staircase in Govan and the corridors of Hampden, and those whose sense of entitlement allowed them to prostitute our Scottish Football to charlatans like CG and new company.
The vibrancy of the present game gives those charlatans and their running dog lackeys in the MSM ( I LIKE that expression) a very stiff V sign.
In my humble opinion.

View Comment

Bryce CurdyPosted on7:30 am - Jan 2, 2014


In the event of HMRC winning the UTT I think it most unlikely that either the SFA or the SPFL would impose any meaningful sanction against Rangers (IL). Indeed I would not be surprised if they ignored the verdict entirely.

Would there be any enthusiasm amongst posters on TSFM who are also CFC shareholders to table a resolution at this year’s AGM highlighting the issue? I would certainly be very tempted. It would be almost equally tempting to raise ‘the wee tax case’ and ‘the Bryson interpretation’ but I would keep the message simple for the reason I will highlight below.

I was hugely impressed by the work of the group who tabled resolution 12 at the 2013 AGM. They have been shown various documents and the resolution has been adjourned. While this is frustrating for those of us not in the know I have huge confidence in the requisitioners. In my view, however, they did make one error. To me there was very much a wood and within that wood there was one very large tree (the granting of a European football license to Rangers for season 11-12). While I completely understand the desire to get all our grievances off our chests, I do think questioning the general and the very specific within the same resolution resulted in the message being slightly lost, hence my reason for suggesting that any further similarly themed resolutions should be kept as succinct and pertinent as possible. Hope I’ve not trodden on too many toes as I genuinely believe resolution 12 was a great piece of work and am filled with admiration for the requisitioners.

View Comment

upthehoopsPosted on8:56 am - Jan 2, 2014


I understand there was much rabble rousing on Radio Clyde yesterday about getting Rangers into the top league as quickly as possible. This is in addition to many written media articles over the past few weeks about Rangers ability to compete financially with Celtic, which was put in the public domain by the media darling Ally McCoist. How do they actually propose to make it all happen though? Rangers can get into the top league the season after next by winning their league this year and next year. Once there it is up to them how to win the league and get access to the Champions League cash. What alternatives to these fairly straightforward scenarios do the rabble rousers in the media propose? I’d be really interested to know, because anything else would surely only be achieved by rule breaking and outright cheating, which at the end of the day seems to be what they are most comfortable with!

View Comment

FinlochPosted on9:45 am - Jan 2, 2014


Happy New Year to all our organisers, collaborators, and lurkers.
Our 4 million unique visits in 2013 is testimony to the quality of some of the insight, analysis and live news found here.
For me our collective challenge is moving from being a well respected talking shop into something with teeth.

The sad reality is we still have RCO at the SFA and his signatories of the 5 way agreement remain essentially in place and untarnished.
We also still have deafening silence across all the divides in Holyrood, and our clubs don’t seem to want to get involved.
Complicity almost certainly still abounds and this is probably complicated by fear.
I think we need to think and act bigger.

View Comment

EstebanPosted on10:18 am - Jan 2, 2014


Good posts this morning from John Clarke and Bryce Curdy. Chapeaux.

John makes this very good point: “The fundamental distortion created by cheating has been , or at least is beginning to be, properly factored in in any analysis of the Scottish game.”

I think it’s an important thing to say, but, with apologies to supporters of other clubs, my view is that the distortion created by cheating is not being factored into analysis of Celtic’s current situation, or at least not nearly enough.

Disappoint results in Europe? “Bring back (sic) Rangers.”
Lack of competitiveness domestically? “Bring back Rangers.”
Empty seats? “Bring back Rangers.”

Lots of people have this agenda, it seems.

All three challenges are real but, at least in part, they are definitely linked to the distortion created by cheating (to use John’s excellent turn of phrase once again). I will use a much less elegant turn of phrase and say that lots of Celtic fans are scunnered by Scottish football at the moment. There is every chance that European performances, crowds and domestic excitement would all improve if the top league in Scotland were, as in days gone by, dog-eat-dog, square-go football. Our period of adjustment is ongoing.

If the effects of cheating were a substantive part of people’s analysis of where Celtic and Scottish football are, any reasonable person would have to conclude that, whatever the solutions, cheating to cheat the cheats’ way back to cheating everyone should not form any part of them.

If “Bring back Rangers” is the answer, people are asking the wrong questions, and I hope more factoring in of the situation John highlights will help make that clear in the weeks ahead.

Separately, I agree with Bryce about the need for clarity and succinctness in future formal attempts to get at the truth. Ask what needs to be asked, with no dancing round handbags. I hope Auldheid has time to answer Bryce’s point. Auldheid is always worth reading, and on this matter especially he is one of the men in the know. That’s not to say Auldheid should reveal things he feels he cannot, and I don’t think Bryce is asking for that. I suppose it boils down to wanting reassurance that the cheats will get their just desserts in the end. I desperately want that.

View Comment

Comments are closed.