A Guest Blog by Auldheid for TSFM
Honesty requires both transparency and accountability. In pursuit of honest, transparent and accountable governance of Scottish football, and only that objective, the following letter, with attachments, has been sent to SPFL lawyers, CEO and SPFL Board Members.
An honest game free from deception is what football supporters of all clubs want. It is the action the letter and attachments prompt that will tell us if there is any intention of providing it.
It is a response on behalf of readers here on TSFM, but the sentiment which underpins it is almost universally held amongst fans of all clubs. Importantly it is a response directly to all clubs, especially those with a SPFL Board member, that will make the clubs and the football authorities aware just how seriously supporters take the restoration of trust in an honest game, honestly governed.
The annexes to the letter contain information which may be published at a later date. We thought it appropriate to first await any response from any of the recipients.
Please also draw this to the attention of friends who are not internet using supporters and love their football and their club.
Auldheid
__________________________________________________________________
Harper MacLeod
The Ca’d’oro
45 Gordon Street
Glasgow
G1 3PE
19 Feb 2014
Copy sent to SPFL CEO and Board Members *
Dear Mr McKenzie
We the contributors to The Scottish Football Monitoring web site write to you in your capacity as the legal adviser employed by Harper MacLeod to assist the Scottish Premier League (now the Scottish Professional Football League) to gather evidence and investigate the matter of incorrect player registrations involving concealed side letters and employee benefit trusts as defined in the eventual Lord Nimmo Smith Commission.
We note from the then SPL announcement that set up an enquiry that the initial date range to be covered was from the inception of the SPL in July 1998, but that was changed to 23 November 2000 because, according to our understanding, that is the date of the first side letter supplied by Rangers Administrators Duff and Phelps. It is also our understanding that the SPL asked for all documentation relating to side letters as well as the letters themselves.
It is a matter of public record that Rangers Administrators failed to supply the SPL all relevant documentation. Indeed the seriousness of not complying with SPL requests was the subject of an admonition of Rangers/Duff and Phelps from Lord Nimmo Smith under Issue 4 of his Commission.
Quite how serious that failure to comply or concealment was in terms of misleading the Commission and so Lord Nimmo Smith can now be assessed from the information contained at Annexes 1 to 10 attached.
We think that as legal advisers to the SPL (now the SPFL) you have a responsibility to make them aware that their Commission was misled by the concealment of documents starting on 3 September 1999, and signed by current SFA President Campbell Ogilvie, whose silence on the ebt matters referred to in the attached annexes* is questionable at the very least.
This letter but not attachments is being posted on The Scottish Football Monitor web site as this is matter for all of Scottish football and support for the issue being pursued to establish the truth can be gauged by responses from supporters from all Scottish clubs once the letter has been published there.
A copy of this letter with Annexes has also been sent to the SPFL CEO and members of the SPFL Board.
Acknowledgement of receipt and reply can be sent by e mail to:
(Address supplied)
Yours in sport
On behalf of The Scottish Football Monitor contributors and readers. http://www.tsfm.org.uk/
Addressees copied in
Neil Doncaster CEO
The Scottish Professional Football League
Hampden Park
Glasgow G42 9DE
Eric Riley (Celtic),
The Celtic Football Club
Celtic Park
Glasgow G40 3RE
Stephen Thompson (Dundee United),
Tannadice Park,
Tannadice Street,
Dundee, DD3 7JW
Duncan Fraser (Aberdeen);
Aberdeen Football Club plc
Pittodrie Stadium
Pittodrie Street
Aberdeen AB24 5QH
Les Gray (Hamilton),
Hamilton Academical FC
New Douglas Park
Hamilton
ML3 0FT
Mike Mulraney (Alloa)
Alloa Athletic FC
Clackmannan Road
Recreation Park
Alloa FK10 1RY
Bill Darroch (Stenhousemuir).
Stenhousemuir F.C.
Ochilview Park
Gladstone Road
Stenhousemuir
Falkirk
FK5 4QL
Campbellsmoney says:
Ooh those funny Jags guys
But of course they know fine well what insolvency is all about.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Indeed they do Campbellsmoney, and the whole insolvency episode not only saved the Jags but arguably, went on to provide an early example of how corrupt the football business can be.
Shares were given to the Jags Trust along with a seat on the board. At the same time, shares were given to a number of the people who had made significant contributions in terms of work under the premise that they would be the “guardians” of the Club (some were also given for the amount of cash given also).
One of the “guardians” went on to become the head of the SFL, however, he was then ousted from the Thistle Board and, as the head of the SFL had (certainly at the time) to be on a member club’s board, he went off to another SFL Club taking his shares with him.
Now, as it is illegal for an individual to have a controlling interest in two SFL clubs, he was told he had to get rid of them. So what did this individual do with those shares he was given as a “guardian” of the club?
Did he return them to the Club? Give them to the Jags Trust or some other fans organisation? Nope, he transferred them to other members of his family.
I won’t bore you with the other shennanigans that went on at Firhill around this time but suffice to say, the cracks seen between Board and fans at Ibrox, and indeed, between fans, were very evident there and for some are still running sores to this day.
The problem with that Rangers Standard piece like 99.9% of all pieces written by Rangers supporters is that they make a pile of sensible comments but completely airbrush over Liquidation
Sounds like there is a titanic groundswell of the angry bears questioning Mr McCoist acumen as a football manager, motivator and strategist after the ref helped them to an “unembarassing” draw with lowly Albion Rovers.. What kept them..!! I thought they disallowed barging the goalie into the net in the 70s.. 🙄
As we know Ally doesn’t do walking away, it will cost the cash strapped gers over a million to move him and his inept cronies out of their high profile positions. Why would he walk unless he got what was due to him. I think there will be a ‘leaving by mutual consent” event happening at the end of this season. They could wheel in one of their old boys to boost the SB sales, Goughie, Sounessy, McCally, the DeBoery twins (heard that one recently) 🙂
Well done to the Wee Rovers, have some old college pals who supported them (as well as the esteemed Paul McConville god rest his soul) and the pals used to go tidy up the ground and do minor repair works at the ground…
On a game on telly that is as important why can each team have a call at questioning one decision (similar to tennis) where Albion could say to the ref we want you and your linesmen to review the footage of that goal decision. IMO the ref took the easy call simply because of the hostility he and his officials and the rangers team would have been subject to at the end of the game. Just my opinion.
JimBhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 10:05 am
As we know Ally doesn’t do walking away, it will cost the cash strapped gers over a million to move him and his inept cronies out of their high profile positions. Why would he walk unless he got what was due to him.
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And thats the problem T’Rangers have at the moment. Everyone is on a contract and on the make. McCoist doesn’t do walking away, the players have shown they have no interest in a wage cut, Charlie was worth twice his contract (or was that twice his original contract that was on par with Ally) and Imran still wants what he believes is due to him. Laxeys want interest and security for their loan while the Easdales want fees and security for their input.
I have said before, when times got rough a few years back the company I worked for at the time initiated cost saving measures to weather the economic storm. Everyone’s salaries were reviewed and those at the top to middle were encouraged to take pay cuts, sometimes based around reduced hours, pension contributions were reduced, benefits reviewed and all expenses were scrutinised to ensure costs were brought down. As far as I am aware everyone signed up to the survival plan with individual circumstances taken into account. Contracts were altered PDQ as the situation required.
The company survived and while I left after a short time later for other reasons, everyone who stuck by the company is still in a job and from what I hear all got wage rises and bonuses at the end of last year.
The only obvious cost saving at Ibrox in two years appears to be two months of All’s salary which to date is around £68k for end of Jan and Feb.
The cash flow is still a major problem and the bears are slowly realising that despite all the talk of a ‘treble’ the product on the park is dire with an apparent reliance on high balls into the box and there is a good chance they would get ripped apart by any half decent team on their game.
Still hard to see what the future holds down Govan way.
Charlotte2Weeks @Charlotte2Weeks 11h
Good Luck Charles Green at Cheltenham this week.
Well you didn’t all think he was in the UK just for a Sky interview, do you’s?
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Just in case above tweet is true, I’ve picked a nag for Charlie in the 1st race at Cheltenham.
1.30 No 10 – The Liquidator
Bawsman,
Why shouldn’t you seek to be paid via an EBT, if the UTTT decision goes the same way as every others decision in this saga.
In fact, the TUC, if they still exist, should already be indicating that they will pursue this course of action for all their members should the case arise.
If nothing else, it may focus the mind of Lord Docherty during his deliberations
NB.
Tongue not totally implanted in cheek.
BBC Sport website is running a series of great World Cup memories (95 to go) in the run up to some event in Brazil in the summer. Today is the “Battle of Santiago” in 1962 – Chile v Italy. What an eye-opener that is. A few dodgy challenges and decisions to review there.
@WOTTPI
I wonder if Super Salary has, by his acceptance of a reduced salary, arranged to have a super pay-off clause inserted in his contract in the event of an early parting from TRFC. Job security is often worth more to dead-legs than an overpayment now. Won’t be worth much in the event of admin or worse, but at least he’s a real bear because he took the cut.
iamacant says:
March 11, 2014 at 10:44 am
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Charlotte2Weeks @Charlotte2Weeks 11h
Good Luck Charles Green at Cheltenham this week.
Well you didn’t all think he was in the UK just for a Sky interview, do you’s?
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Just in case above tweet is true, I’ve picked a nag for Charlie in the 1st race at Cheltenham.
1.30 No 10 – The Liquidator
……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
Apologies for the risk of turning today into a horse racing blog, here’s a Cheltenham Yankee for our friends from Govan;
Fantasy King (Glib one)
The New One (Messiah)
Wrong Turn (Again)
Shutthefrontdoor (The only sensible outcome)
Allyjambo says:
March 11, 2014 at 11:41 am
I wonder if Super Salary has, by his acceptance of a reduced salary, arranged to have a super pay-off clause inserted in his contract in the event of an early parting from TRFC. Job security is often worth more to dead-legs than an overpayment now. Won’t be worth much in the event of admin or worse, but at least he’s a real bear because he took the cut.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Who knows -you forget that despite being an expert in all manner of things he has never had the inkling to look at the small print of his employment contracts.
If a big pay off is in there somewhere then being a ‘Teflon Dan’ he can blame it all on his agent.
jockybhoy says:
March 10, 2014 at 10:45 pm
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Campbell’s money: sorry, I misunderstood – when you said “I am reminded of Christopher Brookmyre’s comment …What CB said (and I paraphrase) was that Celtic were the second least likely to be offended against team in Scottish football. Pretty clear what he meant by that” I assumed Christopher Brookmyre commented or indeed said something, rather than being “the imaginary thoughts of a fictional character”.
Based on that misapprehension I had a quick butcher’s online and found the following article (from 2005) where he DID differentiate between running out for The Buddies and “this kissing the badge nonsense that you keep seeing from some football players, though… For example, one player who signed for Celtic turned round and said that he was from the Celtic-supporting corner of Wales. Where is that? O’Taffyville?”
Seems to me Mr Brookmyre has some preconceived and slightly peculiar views where Celtic are concerned… Not sure I’d take his views at face value.
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JockyBhoy – at least partly my fault here – I did describe the “second least likely…..” comment as a “Christopher Brookmyre” comment initially rather than attributing it to one of his characters.
As for him having “some preconceived and slightly peculiar views where Celtic are concerned” I would suggest you try and find something that he has written about Rangers – his books have loads of laughs at the expense of Rangers and Celtic – and a fair few jibes at Morton too for good measure. His books are often set in the central belt of the west of Scotland. He is a humorous writer – not a historian. If Billy Connolly, Frankie Boyle or Kevin Bridges make a joke about Celtic or Rangers is that a problem?
Anyway CB is more than capable of defending himself – I bet he reads this blog btw.
john clarke says:
March 10, 2014 at 8:58 pm
______________________
Many thanks once more John.
My sense is that Thornhill for the defence had the better of it at the start, but Thornton made a strong comeback at the end.
Of course I wouldn’t know one end of a law book from the other…
blu says:
March 10, 2014 at 9:52 am
Agree with you wottpi (although on first viewing my thoughts were that a foul would be given and keepers get too much protection) – too many on here ready to jump in with the ‘one they prepared earlier’ conspiracy theory…
____________________________
There is no need to come up with a conspiracy theory.
We have seen many such incidents before, and I submit that in the vast majority of cases a foul has been awarded, hence the reason for the claim…”goalies get too much protection”.
That phrase wouldn’t be so familiar if a goal was awarded in the majority of similar incidents.
In other words if a goal was awarded most of the time in such circumstances, there would not have been such an outcry.
I do agree though that it could just have been another honest mistake…
Campbellsmoney says:
March 11, 2014 at 12:13 pm
jockybhoy says:
====================================================
Very patient and polite Campbell. It’s difficult in this medium whan people don’t know each other or always have the same cultural reference points though. Following normanbatesmumfc @ 11:42 am theme, a number of Brookmyres novels might apply in the RFC/SEVCO 5088/RIFC/TRFC case – I’l offer A Big Boy did it and Ran Away.
Now that JC’s week of court reporting is over, I should echo the thoughts of other posters and say a big thank you for keeping us informed. Commitment above and beyond, well done.
I am a tax layman, but from your reports, it seems to me that Lord D is unlikely to overturn the decision himself, though I think HMRC has done enough for him not to support the original decision. That would mean he refers it to a panel for reinvestigation/reinterpretation. The big question would then be will he refer it back to the numpties (honourable exception for Ms Poon) or to a completely new panel?
I can’t see how he could be confident of a fair review by those whom he had judged to have ‘got it wrong’ in the first place, so would imagine it would be a new panel. Anyone agree? The issue with that, as Thornhill said (subtly pointing Lord D away from this option) is the cost of a completely new and therefore lengthy assessment of the evidence. Would Lord D take that into account over the requirement to reach a fair assessment of the evidence/ Surely the FTT members must be tainted if he thinks the evidence needs reassessed?
The BBC were banned by Rangers on May 5th 2013. They were banned because they said Charles Green had a plan to fire McCoist. You can understand why that would be embarrasing to the Green board. A reaction was needed to show the fans the story was untrue ( even if it was true, it couldn’t be allowed to gain credence)
They are still banned today.
Yet not a single member of the board from May 5th 2013 remains in place. The story , true or untrue, could not possibly reflect badly on any of the current board.
So why haven’t they lifted the ban ? Is it because those angered by the story haven’t gone anywhere. They still make the decisions, not the board.
In any business when those making decisions cannot be held legally accountable , then you have the potential for disaster
wottpi says:
March 11, 2014 at 10:38 am
I think AllyJambo beat me to it.. I am not even sure Mr McCoist and remuneration manager ever met…If they did Ally will not lose out when they decide he is more an obstacle to get the SB money than the catalyst when Chico was in charge. Did the last CFO five back his bonus? Doubt it…. Of course if the accounts were out we would not have to speculate..
Mr McCoist’d downfall is in quantity of squad.. A big lazy overpaid squad as opposed to a few additions of quality to the young team last season.. Sometimes you can have too many options.
Alan Price says:
March 11, 2014 at 12:38 pm
==============================
Alan, there was such an outcry because the big team got a decision that was debatable and lots of us wanted the guys with cramp to get a result, for our different reasons. Some on here leapt to the conspiracy conclusion, I don’t buy that – as I noted in my earlier post on this subject there was plenty of evidence of incompetency at the other cup tie on Sunday too.
@Barca
The BBC were banned by Rangers on May 5th 2013. They were banned because they said Charles Green had a plan to fire McCoist. You can understand why that would be embarrasing to the Green board. A reaction was needed to show the fans the story was untrue ( even if it was true, it couldn’t be allowed to gain credence)
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Howdy mate, just one thought on the Beeb ban, maybe it’s not a ban, maybe the beeb are bhoycotting Ibrox.. 😀
Re the UTT many thanks to JC for the excellent posts.
It is a sad commentary on the current state of our country’s legislation that a bunch of over-paid footballers can be rewarded through a discretionary loan and that a court thinks it is OK when a contract, sorry side letter exists for the aforementioned loans.
I’m sure the money-grabbing players down south whose clubs went along a similar path will be watching with interest.
Taking a punt, there appears to be legal minutiae / arguments on both sides and I would say 70 / 30 on the case being returned to a new FTT, which I understand would be unusual but then again …….
@Blu
Good point… All the fans want from referees is consistency. So at the weekend I guess we got that, consistent levels of incompetency… All is well.. 😀
bad capt madman says:
March 10, 2014 at 10:55 pm
Will the SFA give a reason for scheduling the game two days after a mainly part time Albion Rovers play a league game?
Are there any precedents for such short time spans?
___________________________________________
There sure is.
Its a few years back now, but Celtic came back from a European tie on a Thursday, and were required to play a league game on a Saturday.
Not a cup game I know, but the same principal.
Smugas says:
March 10, 2014 at 11:21 pm
I’ll take a step back. The game on the Monday seems to disadvantage both Albion 48 hours after Saturday AND Sevco 4th game in 8 days.
________________________________________________
I take your point, but in my view its advantage ‘The’ Rangers.
Rangers are training full time and will be playing against part time players who were out on their feet at Ibrox with 20mins to go.
Cramp everywhere.
Now they have to face the same problems a week later.
‘The’ Rangers, with superior fitness, should find it easier to cope.
nawlite says:
March 11, 2014 at 12:54 pm
Now that JC’s week of court reporting is over, I should echo the thoughts of other posters and say a big thank you for keeping us informed. Commitment above and beyond, well done.
I am a tax layman
_______________
I have never heard the term ‘tax layman’ before.
I am genuinely interested in what that means.
“So why haven’t they lifted the ban ? ”
because no one had noticed that there was one ??
Alan Price says:
March 11, 2014 at 1:06 pm
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If I’m not mistaken it was at Ibrox too.
I’m pretty certain the rule is 48 hours.between competitive games and whether that’s between final whistle and kick-off or simply between scheduled kickoffs is irrelevant. I have to wonder how much influence each of Hamilton, TRFC and TV had on the decision. I do know that in Englandshire cup replays can’t be played at such short notice (10 day minimum)
Alan Price says:
March 11, 2014 at 1:17 pm
From Wikipedia…..”A layperson (or layman) generally refers to a non-ordained member of a church. Depending on context, it is often used to mean a person who is not qualified in a given profession or does not have specific knowledge of a subject.[1]”
So in terms of tax, I am a layman. I thought that was quite a well known term?
Campbellsmoney says: March 11, 2014 at 12:13 pm
I gave your post a thumbs up Campbellsmoney – your misquote sent me on a mission of discovery and as I’m not familiar with the writer, I may buy one of his books and see how I go on. Everyday you learn something new is a good day 🙂
I would suggest that Bridges, Connolly & Boyle are all guys who wear Celtic on their sleeve – I don’t think anyone would put them forward as neutral observers of Scottish football!
I am not in a position to be confident of the outcome of the UTT . I was amazed at the FTT result, all the more so when I read Dr Poons opinion. So who knows which way this will pan out, although its clear to the layman that this was a clear case of tax evasion.
I’m grateful to those who reported for us, terrific effort all round.
It seems to me HMRC are saying we do not trust the original FTT panel, Dr Poon aside. If Lord Doherty sends it back to a new FTT panel, then he will be saying I don’t trust them either, or at least he doesn’t trust their competence .
Regardless of the football element, thats a very poor reflection on the Scottish legal system
parttimearab says:
March 10, 2014 at 8:59 pm
“The idea that they should give their season ticket money to Dave King just seems a bit naive, even for me.”
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Its worse than that
The idea that a Spiv stops being a Spiv when he is (or pretends to be ) an avid TRFC fan is baffling
In the real world the average Bear would not trust a thief just because he knows he has a ST
No wonder they are getting ripped off by all and sundry
jockybhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 1:57 pm
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Campbellsmoney says: March 11, 2014 at 12:13 pm
I gave your post a thumbs up Campbellsmoney – your misquote sent me on a mission of discovery…………….
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Cheers – it wasn’t a misquote – it was a wrongly attributed paraphrase . 🙂
Hope you enjoy Christopher Brookmyre’s books. Its a constant mystery to me why none of them have ever been made into movies/TV programmes.
As for which of his titles would qualify as apposite here?
“Country of the Blind” and “Where the Bodies are Buried” are both contenders.
jockybhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 1:57 pm
I would suggest that Bridges, Connolly & Boyle are all guys who wear Celtic on their sleeve – I don’t think anyone would put them forward as neutral observers of Scottish football!
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I could only think of Andy Cameron as an alternative 🙄
GoosyGoosy says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:16 pm
Its worse than that
The idea that a Spiv stops being a Spiv when he is (or pretends to be ) an avid TRFC fan is baffling
In the real world the average Bear would not trust a thief just because he knows he has a ST
No wonder they are getting ripped off by all and sundry
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Goosy, i’ve had this argument with an RFC* supporting friend since King’s call to hand HIM their money. He thinks it’s right to follow DK. I used the analogy of a hypothetical guy in my friend’s work who he knows to be a con man/spiv (he has seen him fiddle expenses, not declare his 2nd job etc etc) offering to run the works Xmas savings club (a la Farepak) where everyone gives him £20 a month and get it back to buy pressies at Xmas. Would he do it? “Not a chance! I’d be worried he’d run off with it.” When I remind him that DK is a convicted tax evader and, according to a respectable judge, a shameless liar whose word cannot be taken without corroboration, would he still give his money to DK? “Yes, as he’s a Ranjurs man and we need to get rid of this board.” Bizarre isn’t the word!
Improving the customer experience.
==========================
Without wishing to get into a debate on ref’s, there is one aspect which could be improved for the fans / customers’ benefit.
We have probably covered this before, but I do like the way in which the referees in American football games switch on their microphone and explain the decision / foul / punishment for the benefit of the fans.
Even if the whole Scottish refeering system was revamped, we would still have some poor decisions on the field of play. So in the top league games, [across Europe ?], why can’t this service be provided ?
You might not agree with the ref’s decision but at least you would know why he took a decision.
[And I’m not talking about TV replays – just explanations given to the crowd during the game.]
And shirley that could only improve the overall game experience for the paying punters ?
bad capt madman says:
March 10, 2014 at 10:55 pm
Are there any precedents for such short time spans?
——
I remember when Aberdeen played in the Final of a diddy cup back in 1983, the opponents being Real Madrid. Three days later, on the 14 May, we were required to play Hibs at Pittodrie and won 5-0, leaving us finally 3rd in the League – a point behind the winning Arabs and 2 goals behind Celtic on the same points as us.
At least we got a week’s break before lifting the Scottish Cup after that. 🙂
Barcabhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:13 pm
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I am not in a position to be confident of the outcome of the UTT . I was amazed at the FTT result, all the more so when I read Dr Poons opinion. So who knows which way this will pan out, although its clear to the layman that this was a clear case of tax evasion.
I’m grateful to those who reported for us, terrific effort all round.
It seems to me HMRC are saying we do not trust the original FTT panel, Dr Poon aside. If Lord Doherty sends it back to a new FTT panel, then he will be saying I don’t trust them either, or at least he doesn’t trust their competence .
Regardless of the football element, thats a very poor reflection on the Scottish legal system
==================
If they give DK their season ticket money and he wants to pay it out in dribs and drabs, how are they going to get a season ticket in the first place?
It appears to me to be a call my bluff situation and that this ploy can only last until the deadline day for season tickets. Does not make sense otherwise.
John Clarke
Did I read it right that Thornhill tried to make light of the concealment of the side letters, the same Thornhill who advised Rangers to cough for the wee tax bill because they had concealed the evidence of DOS side letters when asked about them by HMRC?
What is the difference? Is it just that HMRC discovered the BTC ebt side letters by fortune and had not asked about them previously.
Is the only difference that in the DOS side letters Rangers have been shown to have lied, but in the BTC ebts, failure to disclose is no more than negligence?
Aye right.
Campbellsmoney says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:22 pm
Hope you enjoy Christopher Brookmyre’s books. Its a constant mystery to me why none of them have ever been made into movies/TV programmes.
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Er – did Jimmy Nesbitt not star in “Quite Ugly One Morning”? Also, Wikipedia alleges that “Bampot Central” ❗ was adapted for Radio 3 in 2004.
STV have just reported that The Rangers Football Club and Media House have parted company with effect from today.
No further details to hand.
TSFM
The edit function is a bit clunky. I’m finding that after I save an edit I need to select the TSFM link again and scroll down. Previously an edit episode would have brought you back to the foot of the current discussion.
Jack Irvine knows where all the skeletons are buried and they are letting him go ?
They must be short of money.
McCaig`s Tower says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:26 pm
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Campbellsmoney says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:22 pm
Hope you enjoy Christopher Brookmyre’s books. Its a constant mystery to me why none of them have ever been made into movies/TV programmes.
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Er – did Jimmy Nesbitt not star in “Quite Ugly One Morning”? Also, Wikipedia alleges that “Bampot Central” was adapted for Radio 3 in 2004.
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😯
smartie1947 says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:33 pm
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Jack Irvine knows where all the skeletons are buried and they are letting him go ?
They must be short of money.
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Maybe he is about to become an Employee…….Slipping into JTs Shiny Brogues 😆
ecobhoy says:
March 10, 2014 at 10:16 pm
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Hi Eco
Again, interesting stuff. Some further thoughts from me if you will. Been a bit interrupted by work stuff – might be a bit disjointed as a result. 🙄
I think most people on here believe we should get better from the SMSM, and I think many would agree there is particular onus on the Beeb. You mention the fear of having to report evidence that might upset the apple cart. I tend to agree. However this raises the question of why should there be this fear? The fact that it appears to be widespread across the entire SMSM could be seen as pointing towards some sort of conspiracy of silence, a form of omerta? Whilst this is possible, I think many people have noticed the reluctance of many ordinary fans of the Ibrox club simply no longer discussing the game in the same manner they used to. I think there is a strong sense of embarrassment and a reluctance to acknowledge that a previously assumed position of pre-eminence was built on sand. Could it be that the establishment media are simply reflecting a prevailing cultural view on how to deal with such a situation?
Again, though, the Beeb in particular have a duty to rise above this. And whilst this is, for me at least, definitely associated with attacking the previous role of SDM and CO (et al) in gravely wounding the fabric of our sport, it is not necessarily an attack on the community of fans that support the club – though I accept this would be a hard sell. In fact, the failure to report properly on the mismanagement at Ibrox, now under a sequence of owners, has largely benefited those who have exploited the Rangers fans, run their club into the ground and made off with piles of cash and ultimately look likely to remove any remaining assets.
Who gains from the silence? I suggest it is not the Rangers fans. It has possibly spared some blushes in the short term, but the long term damage to their club has been greatly facilitated by supine reporting.
You are clearly correct that the reality of the situation means that the blogosphere has become an important, in this case essential, source of information. I wonder if, once the UTT decision is announced, any media organisation would be willing to point interested readers to the material JC has placed on TSFM? One line in an online article. Maybe Alex Thomson could do it? If the matter is referred back to a FTT, I hope that this will be held in public and maybe we will see better from the media. If we do come to that, I sincerely hope we have JC and the other TSFMers there to provide us with more of the same.
WRT to engaging with Rangers supporters – I understand and agree with the idea of trying to build as broad a consensus as possible on the way forward for Scottish Football.
Scottish Football does not need Rangers (or Celtic for that matter), but it would be foolish to rashly lose the large followings that these clubs bring.
I say rashly. If Rangers self-combust (again) – I would not welcome a repeat of the rule-twisting gymnastics that kept their tribute act in the professional league structure. I think there has to be a clear understanding that sporting integrity and financial fair play are not optional. Armageddon did not happen last time and threat of it next time should hold no fear.
The point is that we must have a clear idea of what constitutes an acceptable way forward and this cannot be held to ransom by either of these clubs or their fans. Rangers and Celtic both need Scottish Football – there is little chance of either team being welcomed down south in the foreseeable future and dreams of European league structures remain dreams. Personally, I would be strongly against any move out of Scotland should such an opportunity arise, and I think it is pretty disrespectful to our fellow Scottish teams when such a hypothetical move is suggested by these clubs.
For us to move towards a healthy future for the Scottish game there needs to be a recognition of what has gone wrong previously. Unfortunately too many of the characters that were intimately involved in previous wrong doing are still in positions of authority in the game. It is for the other clubs, encouraged by their respective fan bases, to force change at the SFA. The media have a role to play in highlighting the continuing conflict of interest for characters such as CO. They also have a role to play in pointing out the inadequacies of previous judgements such as the FTT and LNS.
Ultimately I think there may well be some form of club, based in Ibrox, playing in blue and attracting the support of large numbers of fans that will see it as a continuation of a Rangers tradition. That does not overly concern me. It is not acceptable that Scottish Football should continue to bend over backwards to ensure that this club not only exists (I would argue it has not survived) but does so in a manner that is at the expense of all others.
For my own club, I would far rather that we throw in our lot with all of the rest of the clubs in Scotland to create a fairer and ultimately more competitive environment, than go back to the old duopoly. Perhaps TSFM has made me realise more clearly than before that no club stands in isolation.
not sure what happened, my query was meant to be in response to these posts. So trying again 😳
GoosyGoosy says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:16 pm
7 0 Rate This
parttimearab says:
March 10, 2014 at 8:59 pm
“The idea that they should give their season ticket money to Dave King just seems a bit naive, even for me.”
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Its worse than that
The idea that a Spiv stops being a Spiv when he is (or pretends to be ) an avid TRFC fan is baffling
In the real world the average Bear would not trust a thief just because he knows he has a ST
No wonder they are getting ripped off by all and sundry
======================
If they give DK their season ticket money and he wants to pay it out in dribs and drabs, how are they going to get a season ticket in the first place?
It appears to me to be a call my bluff situation and that this ploy can only last until the deadline day for season tickets. Does not make sense otherwise.
Correct on both counts. I think Bampot Central was actually written for the radio in the first place.
And James Nesbitt spoiled Parlabane for me. He was flavour of the month at the time though
nowoldandgrumpy says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:55 pm
That’s a very good point, Mr Grumpy, and typical of what we’ve come to expect from these spiv types.
King is trying to force the board to bend to his will, and at the same time expects them to pay for the printing/production of season tickets and to just hand them over to him/his representatives to do with as he pleases. At the same time the bears are expected to hand him/his representatives tens of thousands/millions of pounds to hold in good faith/stupidity in the off chance that, if TRFC lasts until the start of next season with no income, they will honour King’s chittys. In the meantime all King risks is a sore throat through all the hot air he’s expending. Talk about a snake-oil salesman!
Palacio67 says:
smartie1947 says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:33 pm
Jack Irvine knows where all the skeletons are buried and they are letting him go ?
==================================================
And the reason he know’s where they’re buried is because he did the burying and no doubt issued the obit as a press release 🙄
http://www.rangers.co.uk/news/headlines/item/6494-club-statement
RANGERS Football Club and Media House International Ltd announce that by mutual consent their current business relationship will end on March 11th 2014.
=================================================
But will JI still be representing the Easdales??
Will Jim Traynor make a return??
Pity Tom English already took up the BBC’s offer 🙂
Allyjambo says:
March 11, 2014 at 4:18 pm
4 0 Rate This
nowoldandgrumpy says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:55 pm
====
And of course all the interest money gained by holding it in an account, will likely go to DK.
StevieBC says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:30 pm
11 1 Rate This
Improving the customer experience.
==========================
Without wishing to get into a debate on ref’s, there is one aspect which could be improved for the fans / customers’ benefit.
We have probably covered this before, but I do like the way in which the referees in American football games switch on their microphone and explain the decision / foul / punishment for the benefit of the fans.
Even if the whole Scottish refeering system was revamped, we would still have some poor decisions on the field of play. So in the top league games, [across Europe ?], why can’t this service be provided ?
You might not agree with the ref’s decision but at least you would know why he took a decision.
[And I’m not talking about TV replays – just explanations given to the crowd during the game.]
And shirley that could only improve the overall game experience for the paying punters ?
————–
StevieBC
I don’t know if you recall in England where 2 games over the last 40 years, the refs were miked-up. An Arsenal game where Tony Adams spent most of the game swearing and calling the ref (David Ellaray) a cheat , and an FA Cup semi-final between ManU and Derby where Jack Taylor was the ref. I recall that this was a particularly feisty affair …..
In my view, the last thing football needs is the refs miked up, to me football is a bit like war without the guns / bullets , although the game has been calmed down in terms of over rough play in the last 30 years.
Our refs are pretty poor and to mike them up would only add to their stress levels, so I would be against it …… there is literally nothing to be done about the refs I’m afraid , just laugh and enjoy your teams games when you can.
Alan Price,
From earlier.
Celtic returned from a European match on the Friday night. Trained at 11pm at Celtic Park.
They had to play Hearts at Tynecastle on the Saturday and lost 3-2.
nowoldandgrumpy says:
March 11, 2014 at 4:44 pm
Joking apart, the fact King has not addressed, publicly at least, this part of his ‘scheme’ has been sadly, but not surprisingly, overlooked by the succulent lambers, and even those ‘journalists’ who consider themselves above the rest, including Tom English. I wonder how long it’ll be before someone thinks to ask King that, although he is famous for finding ways to part an unsuspecting public from money they are likely to never see, in full at least, again, and there’s no doubt he’ll find bears willing to part with their cash for their ‘saviour’, just how does he expect to provide them with season tickets? A small part of his plan, I’m sure, but pretty vital when selling something.
smartie1947 says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:29 pm
STV have just reported that The Rangers Football Club and Media House have parted company with effect from today.
———————————
Maybe that’s what they needed the £1.5m for…… 😈 ……..
Should bear in mind that the last time this happened Jack bounced back into place in no time at all……like a jack-in-a-box…….. 😀
EKBhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:02 pm
StevieBC says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:30 pm
Improving the customer experience.
==========================
…
We have probably covered this before, but I do like the way in which the referees in American football games switch on their microphone and explain the decision / foul / punishment for the benefit of the fans.
…
————–
StevieBC
I don’t know if you recall in England where 2 games over the last 40 years, the refs were miked-up…
=================
Thanks for that EK – and no I didn’t know about these 2 games: interesting though.
Agreed, the bad language can be viewed on the TV shots, but from what I see on American football the ref deliberately steps away from the players when he switches his mike on – temporarily – to explain to the crowd what is going on.
In this day and age of the demand for instant communication and immediate access to data from virtually anywhere in the world – we still have a situation where paying fans might not know or understand what is actually happening on the pitch in front of them. A little bit of communication from the ref would be helpful.
…but perhaps too radical and/or customer friendly for the SFA, [& UEFA] ?
Allyjambo says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:16 pm
nowoldandgrumpy says:
March 11, 2014 at 4:44 pm
Totally agree. While I get the jist of King’s argument it seems highly unlikely that the RIFC are just going to hand over the season tickets to an outsider.
The fans are addicts and the RIFC control the supply. There is not going to be any Barksdale /East Side New Day Co-op.
One wonders how the game of bluff will pan out.
As far as I can see the RIFC hold all the aces with the idea of a property company sitting there as Plan B.
Shareholders are getting hee haw from the loss making subsidiary so if things are going to get even tougher then why not dump the football operation and sit on the properites. Afterall the shareholders ain’t going to see any return soon so whats to loose?
Like Charles Green said to the Blue Knights, I’m guessing Laxey will be giving Dave King a few home truths about what he will need to cough up to gain control of the club and if he ain’t up for it he will be on the next plane home.
wottpi says:
One wonders how the game of bluff will pan out.
————————————————-
I guess DK has two routes (not mutually exclusive) here – one, the season ticket “boycott” which while potentially effective might be difficult to pull off given the fractious supporter base (herding cats springs to mind) – the other being splitting off shareholders (an equally fractious bunch I suspect) with some scope here as the largest tranche of shares in one set of hands is only 12.74% (Laxey)
A combination of both might work but very difficult imo.
What’s been intriguing me is why would he attempt this before the current board implement cost cutting? – does he suspect that the property assets will go as part of this process?
Re Jack Irvine leaving the big hoose. Perhaps Wallace & Co have realised what a waste of money he has been. After all, they could get the Scottish media to print any puff piece nonsense they want without having to pay a middle man.
PARTTIMEARAB says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:44 pm
10 0 Rate This
smartie1947 says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:29 pm
STV have just reported that The Rangers Football Club
and Media House have parted company with effect from
today.
———————————
Maybe that’s what they needed the £1.5m for…… ……..
Should bear in mind that the last time this happened
Jack bounced back into place in no time at all……like a
jack-in-a-box……..
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Assuming that Jack was the smart one in that relationship, is it unreasonable to speculate that his latest bill has been paid before the tax year end *… and he’s decided that enough is enough?
* I realise that I am wildly speculating that the tax year had actually begun at Ibrox!
bogsdollox says:
March 10, 2014 at 1:49 am
Auldheid says:
March 10, 2014 at 1:26 am
Has a judge not ruled material from the same source admissible precisely because everybody is aware of it?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
It’s not really a judge led thing. It’s more of a whistleblower concept which the Press are usually happy to report if it’s a major institution under scrutiny. the Scottish Press has failed spectacularly on this one.
Is there a public interest angle in keeping quiet a story of a national football association aiding and abetting one of its clubs to evade tax? Quite the reverse would seem to be the case.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
How did they help the tax evasion? That is nuclear. Please explain.
========================
The wee tax bill of £2.8M first entered public consciousness on 1st April 2011.
Agreement to accept the liability was reached between Rangers and HMRC in March 2011 in the week before the Interim accounts were published, which actually makes Alistair Johnstone’s Chairman’s statement in those accounts about making provision for a “potential” liability (when it had been accepted the week before) the start of the process of blowing smoke in the public’s eyes in respect of the wee tax bill.
The trail of obfuscation began there in April 2011 and was indicative of a failed attempt to prevent questions being asked about the UEFA licence process and justify the granting of a licence in March 2011. It may even have succeeded had it not became clear the tax payer had not been paid by August 2011, which in turn led to questions being asked that are now being pursued through Resolution 12 to the Celtic AGM of last November.
Although liability was accepted in March 2011 HMRC did not pursue recovery and waited until the Rangers take over on 6th May before a demand to pay dated 20th May was issued. This delay, whilst understandable in the takeover circumstances, allowed the SFA to accurately say that at the 31st March under Art 50 of UEFA FFP that there was no overdue payables to tax authorities and grant a UEFA licence.
However .the SFA had and have ongoing monitoring responsibilities (which they appear to be unaware of going by a statement on a lunch time BBC radio programme in November 2013 before the Celtic AGM ) These required them to see that Rangers complied with the second stage of UEFA rule compliance which was to fully demonstrate at 30th June under Article 66 that Rangers had no overdue payables to HMRC. In essence to check that the wee tax bill had been paid.
Well by 30th June the 30 day time to pay instruction in the letter of 20th May had already elapsed, so the bill was overdue and none of the criteria for excusing it as an being an overdue payable applied.
However the SFA emphasis at that time was to help Rangers to stay in business, which meant giving them access to Europe AND not having UEFA asking for an examination of their accounts. (see note)*
Had it not been so and had the SFA appreciated that the aim of Article 50 and the new Article 66 was to make sure the taxpayer got paid what he was due and not footballers , then instead of giving the Ranger’s submission to UEFA no more than a nod, the SFA should have been seeking the proof that what it was told was true, was in fact true and then said that the only way they could support the licence being retained (and UEFA had the power under their rules to expel clubs who had had a licence granted) was to tell Craig Whyte and Rangers to cough up in July 2011 and either pay or reach a written agreement to pay in instalments with a confirmed down payment or for a deferral.
Taking that line would have either exposed CW earlier for the charlatan he was or got £2.8M into the taxpayer’s pocket. The last thing on the SFA’s mind was the impact on the clubs denied a UEFA place by the possibility of a Rangers expulsion or giving the tax payer what he was legitimately owed.
It is perhaps ironic that football karma entered the scene in August of 2011, first in the shape of Malmo and Maribor, that stopped Rangers receiving any UEFA geld, which probably hastened their descent into administration and then it appeared in its other guise as Sherriff Officers in the same month alerting the world to the fact that the wee tax bill had to be overdue.
Karma tends to turn up when least expected.
(* Note:
It might be of interest to note that asking for accounts is what UEFA Club Financial Control Panel did in similar circumstances in the case of Malaga FC, except that whatever Malaga submitted about their tax position at 30th June alerted UEFA CFCP to ask for an audit at Malaga and look at the case for exemption that Article 66 requires. However this did not happen in Rangers case which all adds to the necessity of Resolution 12 being pursued in respect of an examination of the process in 2011 to establish if it was properly carried out, as the SFA appear to be claiming.
Malaga btw were subsequently sanctioned by the CFCP (to apply from the following season) and a condition of those sanctions being reduced was PAY YER TAXES which is as clear an indication of UEFA’s intent to protect the tax payer as it is of the SFA’s failure to do so.)
ecobhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 4:27 pm
Palacio67 says:
smartie1947 says:
March 11, 2014 at 3:33 pm
Jack Irvine knows where all the skeletons are buried and they are letting him go ?
,,,,,,,,,
Nope
We are dealing with Spivs so theres a money angle driving this
Most likely RIFC owe a bundle to Media House and would have to square them up before announcing Admin
So the Spiv solution is to dump MH before
announcing Admin and they become creditors
Having said that
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
The smart solution would be to give Ally the PR job at 10% of his current salary and hire a cheapie football mgr to do what Ally can`t
Perceived views – surreptitiously MSM plugged – Relay – in end effect – 100% ST cash will get to Ibrox one way or another next season.
.
We’ll see if that’s true.
Views round these parts heard – I wouldn’t call 100% a banker bet.
.
They’ve dug deep, and shelled out for two years often going out of their way to support every game and they feel [insert various expletives] badly treated – even taken for granted. Remember – thousands have lost a couple of hundred and more in share value.
They’ll say they don’t care of course – that’d be natural – but many are family guys and there’s not a bottomless pit when hard choices need to be made. Wonga interest of 150 grand and security of assets difficult to balance against any household budget spending. No point ponying up just for valueless pay-offs to all and sundry worthless spivs on the make.
.
But they are waking up to the mountains of nonsense thrown at them to part with cash.
.
My mrstp has long held the view that the culprits in this endless plunder should be long resting their heels for extended bird time in the Bar-L and the rest shouldn`t be there at all – [go somewhere else flogging timeshares – hedges/ get-rich quick larks – & so on & so forth]
.
& She`s always right 😉 .
(& we`re both E`s)
Blimey!
.
[wot no jack? – that`s kinda like machiavellian sevco5088 director changes] 👿
I recall, relevant to discussion on here re matches played within short time scales, that in terms of European football, the first time a Scottish club was affected by Thursday ECWC matches was in season 94-95. Dundee United had a home tie against Tatran Presov, finishing at around 9.30pm on the Thursday, and played Hearts away at 3pm Saturday.
The second leg in Slovakia finished around 11.30pm Scottish time, and another away match took place on the Saturday at Ibrox, at 3pm, around 39 hours later.
As I recall, Dundee United requested a change of both league fixtures, which was refused. And, of course, they were relegated at the end of that season.
Re: Jack Irvine
I don’t think it should ever be overlooked that despite being a pretty good PR Spinner and moderately successful businessman that Jack actually is a Rangers Man through and through.
He may well be clearing the decks for the next stage and that might well be to support DK – the only thing I can’t quite figure out is his PR representation for the Easdales. I don’t know how much that’s worth and whether it extends to McGills.
Financially Jack was slightly burnt in the last admin – can’t remember how much off the top of my head – but I doubt if he would be going unless he was fully paid up-to-date.
I really believe this is bad news for the current Board as they need the likes of Irvine and I have no doubt that he has links to the mystery shareholders. If my guess is right I think enough info might be making its way to certain journos that will see Wallace skewered and hung out to dry.
Allyjambo says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:16 pm
13 0 Rate This
wottpi says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:59 pm
11 1 Rate This
I think DK was trying to find a plan that had the most impact without actually thinking about how it would work in practice. It seems a simple idea, but it is only simple because no one has has asked any questions about it. No doubt when DK comes over the SMSM will be all over it. 🙄
Don’t forget to vote in the TSFM Geriatr .. er, demographic poll 🙂
http://www.tsfm.net/survey/
StevieBC says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:54 pm
7 0 Rate This
EKBhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 5:02 pm
StevieBC says:
March 11, 2014 at 2:30 pm
Improving the customer experience.
==========================
…
We have probably covered this before, but I do like the way in which the referees in American football games switch on their microphone and explain the decision / foul / punishment for the benefit of the fans.
…
————–
StevieBC
I don’t know if you recall in England where 2 games over the last 40 years, the refs were miked-up…
=================
Thanks for that EK – and no I didn’t know about these 2 games: interesting though.
Agreed, the bad language can be viewed on the TV shots, but from what I see on American football the ref deliberately steps away from the players when he switches his mike on – temporarily – to explain to the crowd what is going on.
In this day and age of the demand for instant communication and immediate access to data from virtually anywhere in the world – we still have a situation where paying fans might not know or understand what is actually happening on the pitch in front of them. A little bit of communication from the ref would be helpful.
…but perhaps too radical and/or customer friendly for the SFA, [& UEFA] ?
———-
StevieBC
I rather enjoy the chaos of an incompetent ref and the general outrage amongst fellow fans when the ref has gone off on one. The sight of Bobby Madden and Ian Brines ( admittedly he has got better the more weight he has put on) can very often liven up a dull affair , and I always have a snigger at the wee baldy linesman keeping up with play …….
…… Best in my view to keep the minutiae of all the on-field stuff away from the miked-up refs and keep the hi-tech stuff to a minimum … Still not everyone’s cup of tea.
ecobhoy says:
March 11, 2014 at 8:08 pm
Re: Jack Irvine
…
Financially Jack was slightly burnt in the last admin – can’t remember how much off the top of my head – but I doubt if he would be going unless he was fully paid up-to-date…
I really believe this is bad news for the current Board as they need the likes of Irvine…
===============================================================
eb, I agree that JI leaving TRFC is not a good thing for the Board – or for TRFC. Time will tell.
TRFC would need PR support more than ever now, you would think ?
As for financials: I have mentioned previously that Media House International Ltd. has been posting declining financials over the last 5 years plus, IIRC, [public info on Duedil].
On the face of it, the numbers would suggest that Irvine is not really in a position to do ‘walking away’ from any client, [unless he had serious doubts about being paid perhaps ?]
TSFM says:
March 11, 2014 at 8:28 pm
3 0 Rate This
Don’t forget to vote in the TSFM Geriatr .. er,
demographic poll
http://www.tsfm.net/survey/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I’m willing to bet that this is a demographic that recognises the phrase ‘Progressive Rock’!
Of course, how many actually understand Progressive Rock is a different matter!
A progressive rock analogy to help you along…
‘Wandering through the chaos the battle has left,
We climb up a mountain of SFA regret,
To a plateau of green grass, and football teams full of life.’
Jack does walking away in the week their title can be secured,strange that,is the March wage bill an issue,what is King bringing to the table,is Wallace had enough,so many questions and at a time when Ally has found some more faces to wear.
BANGORDUB says:
March 11, 2014 at 9:10 pm
0 0 Rate This
Alex Thompson on Twitter now:
alex thomson @alextomo Mar 2
Why is Jack Irvine contacting journos quite unsolicited
tonight to deny possible imminent Admin to people who
hadn’t asked about it?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sorry, but is he repeating what he said on Mar 2?
Just the one trade today in RIFC shares, and that for only 2,000. Perhaps someone more market savvy than I would like to comment? Is it just quiet? Or suspiciously quiet?
Lord Wobbly says:
March 11, 2014 at 9:14 pm
Yes Lord Wobbly!
It was retweeted and I misread. Realised the error and deleted comment within 30 seconds, you were quick off the mark 😳
easyJambo says:
March 10, 2014 at 10:43 pm
——
Coming late to your post, easyJambo, but I think any fresh hearing would have to be in public (with the ‘court’ cleared when the ‘exceptions’ were giving evidence). Otherwise,Judge Bishopp’s ruling would have to be set aside by a more senior Judge.
But I hope Lord Doherty bites the bullet, seizes the opportunity to make a cracking name for himself by reaching a decision on the paper evidence. That evidence includes the ‘confession’ that the trust mechanism was used so that they could afford players they otherwise would not have been able to afford, and evidence that they guiltily concealed their use of the Trust from the Football Authorities for fear of being rumbled. Judge D [puts me in mind of a great wee book about a Chinese mandarin called Judge Dee!] would not have to read an awful lot of the huge mass of evidence in order to make the necessary findings in fact. In my opinion. ( I incidentally discovered a wee while ago,as a matter of biographical interest to no one but myself and much to my amusement, that my granny’s uncle is said to have become a Commissioner of the Inland Revenue, and was knighted in 1912. There might be something in the genes, then, that makes me side with HMRC!)
BANGORDUB says:
March 11, 2014 at 9:18 pm
0 0 Rate This
Lord Wobbly says:
March 11, 2014 at 9:14 pm
Yes Lord Wobbly!
It was retweeted and I misread. Realised the error and
deleted comment within 30 seconds, you were quick off
the mark
~~~~~~~~~~
We’ve all done it (well I have!)