Scottish Football: An Honest Game, Honestly Governed?

ByTrisidium

Scottish Football: An Honest Game, Honestly Governed?

A Guest Blog by Auldheid for TSFM

Honesty requires both transparency and accountability. In pursuit of honest, transparent and accountable governance of Scottish football, and only that objective, the following letter, with attachments, has been sent to SPFL lawyers, CEO and SPFL Board Members.

An honest game free from deception is what football supporters of all clubs want. It is the action the letter and attachments prompt that will tell us if there is any intention of providing it.

It is a response on behalf of readers here on TSFM, but the sentiment which underpins it is almost universally held amongst fans of all clubs.  Importantly it is a response directly to all clubs, especially those with a SPFL Board member, that will make the clubs and the football authorities aware just how seriously supporters take the restoration of trust in an honest game, honestly governed.

The annexes to the letter contain information which may be published at a later date. We thought it appropriate to first await any response from any of the recipients.

Please also draw this to the attention of friends who are not internet using supporters and love their football and their club.

Auldheid

__________________________________________________________________

Harper MacLeod
The Ca’d’oro
45 Gordon Street
Glasgow
G1 3PE
19 Feb 2014
Copy sent to SPFL CEO and Board Members *
Dear Mr McKenzie
We the contributors to The Scottish Football Monitoring web site write to you in your capacity as the legal adviser employed by Harper MacLeod to assist the Scottish Premier League (now the Scottish Professional Football League) to gather evidence and investigate the matter of incorrect player registrations involving concealed side letters and employee benefit trusts as defined in the eventual Lord Nimmo Smith Commission.
We note from the then SPL announcement that set up an enquiry that the initial date range to be covered was from the inception of the SPL in July 1998, but that was changed to 23 November 2000 because, according to our understanding, that is the date of the first side letter supplied by Rangers Administrators Duff and Phelps. It is also our understanding that the SPL asked for all documentation relating to side letters as well as the letters themselves.
It is a matter of public record that Rangers Administrators failed to supply the SPL all relevant documentation. Indeed the seriousness of not complying with SPL requests was the subject of an admonition of Rangers/Duff and Phelps from Lord Nimmo Smith under Issue 4 of his Commission.
Quite how serious that failure to comply or concealment was in terms of misleading the Commission and so Lord Nimmo Smith can now be assessed from the information contained at Annexes 1 to 10 attached.
We think that as legal advisers to the SPL (now the SPFL) you have a responsibility to make them aware that their Commission was misled by the concealment of documents starting on 3 September 1999, and signed by current SFA President Campbell Ogilvie, whose silence on the ebt matters referred to in the attached annexes* is questionable at the very least.
This letter but not attachments is being posted on The Scottish Football Monitor web site as this is matter for all of Scottish football and support for the issue being pursued to establish the truth can be gauged by responses from supporters from all Scottish clubs once the letter has been published there.
A copy of this letter with Annexes has also been sent to the SPFL CEO and members of the SPFL Board.
Acknowledgement of receipt and reply can be sent by e mail to:
(Address supplied)
Yours in sport

On behalf of The Scottish Football Monitor contributors and readers. http://www.tsfm.org.uk/

Addressees copied in
Neil Doncaster CEO
The Scottish Professional Football League
Hampden Park
Glasgow G42 9DE

Eric Riley (Celtic),
The Celtic Football Club
Celtic Park
Glasgow G40 3RE

Stephen Thompson (Dundee United),
Tannadice Park,
Tannadice Street,
Dundee, DD3 7JW

Duncan Fraser (Aberdeen);
Aberdeen Football Club plc
Pittodrie Stadium
Pittodrie Street
Aberdeen AB24 5QH

Les Gray (Hamilton),
Hamilton Academical FC
New Douglas Park
Hamilton
ML3 0FT

Mike Mulraney (Alloa)
Alloa Athletic FC
Clackmannan Road
Recreation Park
Alloa FK10 1RY

Bill Darroch (Stenhousemuir).
Stenhousemuir F.C.
Ochilview Park
Gladstone Road
Stenhousemuir
Falkirk
FK5 4QL

About the author

Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

3,234 Comments so far

blu(e)Posted on11:38 am - Mar 14, 2014


Castofthousands says:
March 14, 2014 at 11:31 am
ecobhoys cautionary note concerning defamation appears to have gone unheeded.
I trust the ‘truth’ defence will be sufficient a buttress.
=================================================================
CoT, lost track a bit here – are you suggesting defamation on TSFM or elsewhere? Surely not in NO1 BOB’s post at 11:22?

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wildwoodPosted on11:48 am - Mar 14, 2014


I think it’s getting close to ‘next step’ time. The non-acknowledgement of Auldheid’s letter really is unacceptable.

I wonder if Stuart Cosgrove would be willing to have Auldheid or Big Pink on the OTB show, even just to discuss in broad / non specific terms the situation regarding the careful compilation of the letter, the lack of response as well as those pesky attachments.

?????

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blu(e)Posted on12:01 pm - Mar 14, 2014


wildwood says:
March 14, 2014 at 11:48 am
I think it’s getting close to ‘next step’ time. The non-acknowledgement of Auldheid’s letter really is unacceptable.

I wonder if Stuart Cosgrove would be willing to have Auldheid or Big Pink on the OTB show, even just to discuss in broad / non specific terms the situation regarding the careful compilation of the letter, the lack of response as well as those pesky attachments.

?????
========================================
Wildwood, Off the Ball is what is – banter, so probably not the right avenue. The non-governance/maladministration issue that Auldheid is pursuing is, or ought to be, a news item. More appropriate for the kind of journalist who fronted The Men Who Sold the Jerseys? Whether Mark Daly is up for it is another question.

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on12:32 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Ecobhoy – you’ve got mail 🙂

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sannoffymesssoitizzhizzemdyfonedrapolisPosted on1:02 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Uli Hoeness is to resign as Bayern Munich president and chairman and will not appeal his conviction for tax evasion. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26574681

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JimBhoyPosted on1:02 pm - Mar 14, 2014


–Institutional Investors (II), So Mr King what can we do for you today sir…
— DK, Well I was hoping for fresh investment into the rangers..
— II, What is in it for us Mr king..
— DK, Well the rangers will stop Celtic doing 10 in a row..
— II, What is in it for us Mr king..
–DK, Money into the club will allow the rangers to put all the stadium faults right and stop Celtic doing 10 in a row..
— II, What is in it for us Mr king..
— DK, Well, stutter splurt, ahem well it will unite the rangers fans..
— II, Mr King just how much have you actually invested in the rangers..
— DK, Well it’s like this, I put in £20m before and..
— II, Let me just stop you there Mr King, that was not this business that business died, you should know you were a board member and were therefore complicit in it’s demise..
— DK, Aye but we are the people…
— II, Goodbye Mr King

— MSM, Dave King, the castlemilk jillionaire jetted into London today and held successful meetings with the Institutional Investors and is convinced they are behind him in his plans to take rangers forward.. Ally McCoist was quoted as saying, I only discuss footballing matters these days but I can say in all honesty, without a shadow of a doubt that if I was a glass half full man, it could be said that it’s great to see Dave King come to the rescue of rangers, not that I am saying that by any manner or means, that’s not for me to speculate but If i was to speculate I would maybe, potentially say it was a positive move. It would be Roy of the Rovers stuff.. But I am only talking about the football stuff these days as you know..

I plan to jet over to Ireland to hold talks with Mr Desmond, I have £1500 shares in Celtic and have plans to take the club forward. If Mr Desmond does not invest £10m into Celtic I plan on holding back SB monies for me and my 3 kids until such a time as he puts that money into my holding account. I then plan to hold meetings with Neil Lennon, the queen, the pope and wee colonel sanders with his wee beady eyes, through the weekend.. 😆

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EddiegoldtopPosted on1:04 pm - Mar 14, 2014


So… I’m new to TSFM and have been encouraged to join through seeing various links to posts on my usual twitter feed. Ecoboy and Auldheid appear to be striking on a chord that lies close to my heart. I am a long term sponsor of various SFA member clubs over the years and am now at a stage where I need answers to serious questions with regards to openness , honesty and transparency. I Intend to share my correspondence with you in the coming weeks and hopefully for the benefit of all Scottish football clubs we will get answers to my questions. These answers will go a long way to determining my ongoing sponsorship commitments.

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rougvielovesthejunglePosted on1:08 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Para Handy says:
March 14, 2014 at 8:37 am

What is it with these Northerners? Are they all so confused with Club names?

===============

Us “Northeners” have a notoriously dry sense of humour.
Having read your earlier comments Para, I thought I’d use “Partick” once again just to see if you would bite 😆

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rougvielovesthejunglePosted on1:17 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Ive just read the statement from Uli Hoeness regarding his tax evasion on the BBC website.

For the avoidance of doubt, he admits guilt, expresses remorse and displays, for want of a better word, dignity.
There’s a few lads down Govan way could learn from this (and possibly a certain conflicted individual on the 6th floor) ;

In a statement on the Bayern Munich website he said: “After discussing the matter with my family I have decided to accept the judgment. This corresponds to my understanding of integrity, decorum and personal responsibility.

“Evading tax was the biggest mistake of my life. I accept the consequences of this mistake.

“Furthermore I hereby resign the offices of president and chairman with immediate effect. By doing so I wish to avert further damage to my club.

“I will continue to be associated with this magnificent club and its people in other ways for as long as I live. I wish to thank from the heart my personal friends and all followers of Bayern Munich for your support.”

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Danish PastryPosted on1:37 pm - Mar 14, 2014


rougvielovesthejungle says:
March 14, 2014 at 1:17 pm
1 0 Rate This
_________

Wow, glad I still remember my tables from Ally Parade, they help me log-in via the various mathematical hurdles 🙂

Yes, the Hoeness story could not be in greater contrast to that of our own league and association bosses. Can you imagine if some of them had just come out, held their hands up, and said ‘sorry’? We’d probably have been happy with admission of guilt without the porridge.

OT
I saw Tony Benn mentioned. I came very late in life to discover what a fine man he was. He leaves us a fascinating written record. His recorded diaries are worth every penny, and are now available as online audio books. Oddly enough, I feel that he was painted as a bogey man and as the “loony left”, via the sort of character assassination modern PR gurus revel in. This probably made him unelectable, and robbed us of a unique PM. Spin did not arrive with Blair and his acolytes, it was there long before. RIP Tony Benn, a hugely decent human being and politician. As someone said, ‘He’s the finest Prime Minister we never had.’

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Danish PastryPosted on2:05 pm - Mar 14, 2014


wildwood says:
March 14, 2014 at 11:48 am
29 0 Rate This

I think it’s getting close to ‘next step’ time. The non-acknowledgement of Auldheid’s letter really is unacceptable.

I wonder if Stuart Cosgrove would be willing to have Auldheid or Big Pink on the OTB show, even just to discuss in broad / non specific terms …
————–

Good call. OtB has the Pie & Bovril chap on a regular basis. But Stuart might not want the grief that would surely follow (nor Auldheid and BP). On the other hand, the alternative is accepting a game run by the incompetent and the corrupt.

Now if BBC Scotland had a weekly sports media-review programme this stuff could be addressed. Can’t a few of them get together and do a weekly or bi-weekly, independent, syndicated show and post it on iTunes? I’d pay for that.

The issue is now so much bigger than those currently enveloping Ibrox. Scottish football will become a toxic brand for sponsors if it continues on its current course with the present tin-pot dictators. Otherwise, fans will need to set up an alternative, corruption-free national association … oh, some pigs just flew past my window :slamb:

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wottpiPosted on2:14 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Just a wee thought on the non-production of TRFC accounts and the potential link to being granted a license.
Surely in years gone by the accounts and the financial situations at Livi, Dundee, Dunfermline and Hearts were all in a mess.
All these teams were allowed to take to the pitch week after week.

Therefore what do TRFC have to fear in terms of lodging and publishing the accounts?
Are they close to a Grenta / Rangers (IL) situation?

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bluPosted on2:25 pm - Mar 14, 2014


The links show a good journalist at work. The first deals with a liar who passed the English Premier League’s “Fit and Proper Person” test despite them being informed of his criminal conviction. The second covers Rangers fall in 2012. Shame that David Conn’s never really more than nibbled at this story but even then he provides a clear and simple picture of the facts. If I happened to be the greatest football administrator in the world I’d be protecting the organisation I was head of and the team I support from liars like that, especially glib and shameless ones.

Conn on Carson Yeung 14/3/14 http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/mar/13/carson-yeung-birmingham-city-riddle-mystery
Conn on Rangers 12/7/12 http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2012/jul/12/rangers-scottish-football-leaguetells

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essexbeancounterPosted on2:43 pm - Mar 14, 2014


sannoffymesssoitizzhizzemdyfonedrapolis says:

March 14, 2014 at 1:02 pm

Uli Hoeness is to resign as Bayern Munich president and chairman and will not appeal his conviction for tax evasion. http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26574681
===========================================================================
Amidst the personal and corporate tragedies behind this salutary episode, at least the man, who, it must be remembered, made a full voluntary disclosure, has decided NOT to appeal and accept his sentence/punishment with as much grace as one could imagine under the circumstances.
One is left wondering how any of our home grown evaders, when convicted, would behave in such a fashion.
Campbell, are you listening/watching?

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redlichtiePosted on3:20 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Brenda says:
March 14, 2014 at 10:00 am
I know I’m hanging onto this but what about the audited accounts ???? Why have a rule saying they have to be posted by a certain date then ignore the fact that this date has passed. And this clumpany are as they they have done with many, giving yet another rule ‘the finger’ so to speak.
————————————————————————————————————
Brenda,

I followed up with Companies Chocolate House earlier this week and as expected they had nothing new to add. They claimed confidentiality in response to my question as to whether any reason had been given for the failure to lodge accounts on time. I have pointed out the fact that the accounts must have been prepared some time ago as they were incorporated into those published by the parent company. I also pointed out that there were strong rumours of a possible insolvency event and people depended on Companies Chocolate House to keep themselves appraised of any trading risk. Water off a duck’s back I’m afraid….

Scottish Football needs authorities to stand up and be counted when two fingers are held up by clumpanies like this. How can TRFC trumpet their success as Champions of Division Three and at the same time flout Companies legislation that is put in place for a good reason i.e. to protect other companies and the public from clumpanies like them? They are taking the p*ss out of the SFA, SPFL and the general public. It’s not Dignity they need it’s Dignitas…

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on3:21 pm - Mar 14, 2014


wottpi says:
March 14, 2014 at 2:14 pm
0 0 i
Rate This

Just a wee thought on the non-production of TRFC accounts and the potential link to being granted a license.
Surely in years gone by the accounts and the financial situations at Livi, Dundee, Dunfermline and Hearts were all in a mess.
All these teams were allowed to take to the pitch week after week.

Therefore what do TRFC have to fear in terms of lodging and publishing the accounts?
Are they close to a Grenta / Rangers (IL) situation?

————————————————————————————————————————————————————————
Problem is – a company’s accounts can show a loss or a balance sheet deficiency but that does not mean that the company can’t fulfill its fixtures next season. All it takes is a sugar daddy to fill the gap. That seems to have been the prevailing view. When the sugar daddy (as at Rangers (IL), Hearts, Gretna, Livingston, Dundee etc etc) is not able or willing to do it any more then there is a problem. So it might be better to analyse the finances of the daddies rather than the children.

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James DolemanPosted on3:28 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Dave King want’s Ibrox as “collateral” before he hands over other people’s money

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26579100

You have to hand it to him, that’s the best one yet.

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on3:33 pm - Mar 14, 2014


redlichtie says:
March 14, 2014 at 3:20 pm
How can TRFC trumpet their success as Champions of Division Three and at the same time flout Companies legislation
——————————————————————————————————————————————————————
Rookie mistake there – the club won the division; the company (or holding company depending upon which nonsense they spout at any given time) hasn’t filed accounts.

They either have nothing to do with each other or are one and the same thing (depending upon which nonsense they spout at any given time) (oh and of course there is also another company which may or may not be the holding company’s holding company (or just a holding company) (depending upon whether or not you think the first company is just the holding company) (which it clearly is not).

Is that clear now?

😈

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TSFMPosted on3:39 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Eddiegoldtop says:
March 14, 2014 at 1:04 pm
_____________________________

Should be interesting to see what transpires then 🙂
We look forward to seeing what transparency looks like to people like yourself who actually invest significant sums in the game.

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on3:41 pm - Mar 14, 2014


“Rangers: Dave King seeks Ibrox collateral for season tickets”

och this is just getting stupid now. If he asked for the moon to be signed over to him on behalf of fans would they print that as well? Do they even care whether it is possible (never mind about if it is likely).

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evinguuPosted on3:45 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Right i cant get something straight.

Sevco fans want to withold season ticket money on the basis of gaining a security over the stadium. However their reasoning for doing this is because they dont want the company to use the stadium as security for future finance, this seems awfully contradictory to me.

In addition they are not investing in the company as such in order to be granted a security, they are buying a service from the company when they buy a season ticket which they also expect when they drip feed this money into the company. This seems all very odd to me, is it akin to going into tesco and buying a tin of beans on the basis that you get security over all the beans tesco have to ensure your continued custom? If they were offering this money as a loan to keep the company going fair enough, but they want to pay for a product/service and gain the security! how in the hell is that ever going to work legally?

Anyone who knows more about this sort of stuff able to provide an answer as I’ve probably got this all wrong! 😀

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essexbeancounterPosted on3:49 pm - Mar 14, 2014


redlichtie says:

March 14, 2014 at 3:20 pm
It’s not Dignity they need it’s Dignitas…
========================================================================
Redlichtie…superb line…Dignitas…not Caritas…?
Me bad?

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CastofthousandsPosted on3:51 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
March 14, 2014 at 3:41 pm

“If he asked for the moon to be signed over to him on behalf of fans would they print that as well?”
——————————–
At £16.75 per acre I think the moon may be beyond the financial reach of even a jillionaire.

http://www.moonestates.com/?gclid=CJzn1oewkr0CFa3LtAodZ1oAfw

However it would make a nice eye catching headline.

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James DolemanPosted on4:02 pm - Mar 14, 2014


The full statement demands a security over Ibrox and Murray park to be given to supporters before King hands over the season ticket money.

Doesn’t say which supporters…..

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CastofthousandsPosted on4:07 pm - Mar 14, 2014


blu(e) says:
March 14, 2014 at 11:38 am

“…are you suggesting defamation on TSFM or elsewhere? Surely not in NO1 BOB’s post at 11:22?”
————————————–
It was No.1 Bob’s post I was referring to though it was not intended as a reprimand, merely to echo the note of caution. I recognise Bob’s quote as being lifted from a judgement passed down to Dave King by a South African court and that therefore it can be shown to have credibility. Similarly I don’t think that TSFM is routinely defamatory in any way, though we may sail close to the wind at times.

From your retort I illicit that you feel Bob had every right to reproduce the statement and I suppose those who have acted unlawfully should rightfully suffer the indignation that their actions have brought upon themselves. For me personally I would be a little reticent in reproducing such statements as my meagre knowledge of the law doesn’t stretch to knowing whether a South Africa Judges comments can be repeated in UK jurisdiction without challenge. Perhaps I am being too cautious but I am as concerned for TSFM as much for myself.

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twopandaPosted on4:11 pm - Mar 14, 2014


What is this Friday Nonsense?
Spivs will hand over securities?
Hedge Funds?
As if
Next

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AuldheidPosted on4:11 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Danish Pastry

Ah sponsors. Now there is a thing.

Sponsors of Scottish football cannot be happy with their product being associated with a sport some or many of their customers have mounting doubts over its honesty.

I have just posted a letter to William Hill whose retiring CEO was the SPL Chairman in situe when the LNS findings arrived.He had concerns.

His company sponsor the Scottish Cup and it would be interesting to get an insight into the betting industries “take” on the integrity of the game in Scotland and integrity of taking bets on a sport where integrity seems to be a stranger in a strange land.

I’ll give it a couple of weeks to give them them a chance to reply before I publish what I asked.

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bluPosted on4:14 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Castofthousands says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:07 pm
===========================
CoT – I take your point but I think referring to facts – it was widely reported (NO1 BOB did use quotation marks too), it was in the official findings of SARS that Mr King was referred to in such terms. Fair enough, I say. Good luck to anyone who wants to sue (No.1 Bob of course!) and good luck to Rangers if Mr King gets in.

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CastofthousandsPosted on4:16 pm - Mar 14, 2014


James Doleman says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:02 pm

“The full statement demands a security over Ibrox and Murray park to be given to supporters before King hands over the season ticket money.”
——————————
For some reason to me this feels like it is closing the loop. Might this in a sense guarantee TRFCL season ticket uptake for next year. Those who were going to buy from the club will buy from the club. Those that smell a boardroom rat might be persuaded into the King scheme. Result is TRFCL get at least as much dosh at they anticipated. Bears are placated by feeling that they have somehow wrested control. ST money is available to pay off Whyte and whoever else might be involved in the cabal. Deeds get signed over to the fans, er, Kings trust????

It just sounds like some kind of conjuring trick to me.

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AuldheidPosted on4:22 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Twopanda

If the value of Ibrox as a revenue gathering venue over a limited period exceeds the outlay of whoever owns it or its value as a piece of land (and Rangers supporters should be well versed in that subject by now) then King has some leverage by choking off the revenue.

If on the other hand the outlay of the owners is less than what it can be sold for for development then King’s hand is not so strong but too many unknowns to predict the outcome.

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TommyBPosted on4:25 pm - Mar 14, 2014


John Brown is waiting on Edmiston Drive, if anybody is getting sight of the deeds he wants to be there

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Danish PastryPosted on4:31 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:11 pm
1 0 Rate This

Ah sponsors. Now there is a thing …
————-

I remember you mentioned that a wee while back. Other sports as well as individual sportsmen and women have lost sponsorship in a big way in the past.

The most obvious recent example is cycling. And the slightest whiff of doping these days and whole teams are booted out. The price they pay now is too high, compared to the past.

Still baffled as to why Doncaster picked up a pay rise for what is under-achievement on the sponsor front.

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SmugasPosted on4:32 pm - Mar 14, 2014


James Doleman says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:02 pm

The full statement demands a security over Ibrox and Murray park to be given to supporters before King hands over the season ticket money.

And the full response will be one of the following:

1/ bwa ha ha ha ha aha
2/ Sorry, David who?
3/ Eh no.
4/ Eh no, we’ll be keeping yer stadium, you gie us the ST moneys or its minus 15 frae the word go, comprendez

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Caveat EmptorPosted on4:34 pm - Mar 14, 2014


I see that according to Matthew Lindsay in the Evening Times that the glib fella is now a ‘Castlemilk born financier’ and that he has ‘vowed’ to hing aboot ‘until a trust for pooling season ticket money is in place’. Hope he’s got comfy digs, he may be here a wee while.
The MSM would have us believe that he will remain in situ until he has around £8m of the Bears hard earned in his pocket, next to the deeds for Ibrox. Then what? Back to the veldt for a period of reflection? Saddle up the white charger? Break out the war chest?
Which raises the question – Who still takes in all this blatant moonbeams?

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JimBhoyPosted on4:40 pm - Mar 14, 2014


We all know Dave King is over for a holiday, meeting up with Davie Leggat down the Loudon to reminisce about their old presbyterian grannies…

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TartanwulverPosted on4:42 pm - Mar 14, 2014


The moral of the Uli Hoeness / Dave King tax sagas seems to be that those who are found to have bypassed taxes on a mega scale only become penitent when the authorities back them into a corner and cut off all means of escape. If the only remaining strategy is a humble acceptance of a penalty, then that will be taken. Which argues all the more for HMRC to take a very robust approach to pursuing not just Rangers, but any of those who think that ‘only the little people pay taxes’.

http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2014/mar/13/bayern-munich-uli-hoeness-tax-evasion-disgrace

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/bayern-munich/10697554/Bayern-Munich-president-Uli-Hoeness-accepts-prison-sentence-for-tax-evasion-and-steps-down.html

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No1 BobPosted on4:54 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Castofthousands says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:07 pm

I have no problem reporting what was said about the “glib and shameless liar” during the various court cases that “the glib and shameless liar” has been involved in in South Africa. Indeed, the very same phrases have been quoted at one time or another in all of the Scottish newspapers.

The press have no issue with reporting verbatim what is said in South African courts as evidenced by the current coverage of the Oscar Pistorius trial. And neither do I.

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AuldheidPosted on4:56 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Steviebc 2.15 am.

It is disappointing but perhaps the sponsor disatisfaction expressed by Eddiegoldtop will start to get the message across that dishonesty does not pay in a language the folk at Hampden understand -money

I look forward to seeing how that message is expressed and received.

It is more likely to get attention than my attempt to get a view from William Hill CEO Mr R Topping who was in the room when thev SPL Board considered their response to LNS, the response they sweated over and then said nothing.

I’m hoping said gentleman is hopping mad at being misled. I would be in his shoes.

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SmugasPosted on5:02 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid,

Is that the same R Topping who’s firm continued to take bets on the winners of the league in 2012 in the full knowledge that one participant, and until someone blew a 15 point lead, the favourites to win the damn thing, knew they were about to go into administration? Is that the guy bursting at the seams with integrity that you mean, yeah? (and that’s not to belittle your efforts btw I’m just lashing out in blumin’ frustration).

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Caveat EmptorPosted on5:16 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Further thoughts on the glib fella demanding a security over Ibrox on behalf of the members of his soon to be legalised ST cabal. Has he cleared this with Chico and Craigie? Perhaps we missed a wee stopover in Monaco or a chateau (complete with ample stabling) on his way here.
As Der Bomber would say ‘showz ra deeds!!’

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easyJamboPosted on5:25 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Craig Houston (Sons of Struth) explains why he confronted Sandy Easdale on Wednesday night.

https://www.facebook.com/SonsOfStruth/posts/1453792971518493

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wottpiPosted on5:33 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Dear Mr Tesco

Frankly I’m not happy with the way you run your business.
Neither are a few of my mates in the Glasgow area who use your stores.
We have clubbed together and demand that you pass over the deeds to your Silverburn Extra store otherwise we won’t be parting with our hard earned dosh to buy any of your ‘Finest’ range.
To show we are serious we intend to hand out a pile of red cards in the Silverburn car park this Saturday so that simiarly minded shoppers will join us on this ambitious project that will save Tesco stores by placing it in the hands of its customers.

Yours (expecting a huge GTF reply)
Davie Juan King

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James DolemanPosted on5:42 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Dear Mr Sainsbury

Rather than pay for my groceries this week I have given the money to a foreign based businessman, Mr David King. Please send my goods as usual and Mr King will pay you as soon as you hand him the keys to the shop.

Arra Best

A Bear

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twopandaPosted on5:53 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid says:
March 14, 2014 at 4:22 pm
Twopanda
If the value of Ibrox as a revenue gathering venue over a limited period exceeds the outlay of whoever owns it or its value as a piece of land (and Rangers supporters should be well versed in that subject by now) then King has some leverage by choking off the revenue.
If on the other hand the outlay of the owners is less than what it can be sold for development then King’s hand is not so strong but too many unknowns to predict the outcome.

———
Yes – that’s true AH
Para 2 would appear the case reinforced that many outlays probably recovered already.
So King & Co would have to buy them out?
So why would hedge funds give away securities?
Where is there any logic in that?
Liquidity possibly at a push – that wouldn`t last very long?
Those bears that still want STs can buy them – any way they like [or not] – in May or 4 months later in September. That 4 Months would be a financial test – and maintaining funds for any safeguarded controlled admin option. Not sure all bears would sign up to a King Deal and yet to be convinced 100% of bears will allow themselves to plundered yet again in spiv feastings irrespective of what’s going on till matters are normalised
But there are some known known`s
No Accounts for SFA FPP in two weeks – and Uefa will enforce the `No exceptions prove the rule` stance – stop the 3 Year Clock for future participations. The SFA will huff and puff to the pressure brought – but no accounts leaves no wiggle room at all.
No Accounts – believe it or not – would relieve certain spivs of `Accountability` – so some spivs will lose no sleep if the recent accounts never come to light. A `walk-way`?
But – If that happens – there should be investigations where a lot of money went.
The SFA are untrustworthy so pointless wasting time on them – but other agencies should take an interest – and the spivs won`t like that – either conclusive – or inferred to reputation
So a spiv scorched earth thing not attractive – to say the least
So then – They say, or claim – they have the property deeds – so why the contingent liability – why all the legal activity [and expense] over sevco5088. – and why wonga `securities` limited to property they acquired post admin. Not convinced the spivs have power cards on all the property fronts – and with such a groundswell from bears awakening to the nonsense not sure they can say they control or `own` the `club` – or in company terms the IP & Brand.
So on that – one could postulate that `securities` is another planted red herring to placate.
There`s no logic to it from what [we think 😉 ] we know
Bears should have all the cards here – but zilch poker skills

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AuldheidPosted on6:17 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Folks
Just when I’m going out we got a reply.

Dear Sir,
I confirm receipt of your undated letter, addressed to me and copied to Mr Doncaster which I have discussed with my client. I do not know your name or address or the position which you have with the TSFM and am unable to address you as other than ‘Sir’.

The SPL Commission Decision of 28 February 2013 (“the Decision”) deals, amongst other matters, with the failure by “Oldco” (as defined in the Decision) to provide relevant information at Issue 4 on page 33 of the Decision. Whilst I was only able to secure and provide to the Commission copies of a number of the ‘side letters’ the list of those players who had received such letters was in the public domain and for the purposes of the ‘Issues’ before the Commission it was not suggested by Oldco or Newco that the fundamentals of the side letters were significantly different over the 10 years or so that Oldco had given such letters to each of the individual players involved.

The Commission was provided with evidence regarding the existence of both the Murray Group Management Remuneration Trust and the Rangers Employee Benefit Trust. This is referred to at paragraph 35 of the Decision. The Commission chose in its Decision to group these together as “MGMRT”. Both are referred to in the published accounts of Oldco and copies of those accounts were provided to the Commission.

I refer you to the Annex to the Decision which includes six lists of Specified Players, 1A, 1B, 2A, 2B, 3A and 3B. The numbering relates to 3 periods during which different regulatory regimes applied. The A reference is to players for whom we had a copy “side letter” and the B reference is to players for whom we did not have a copy of a side letter but in respect of whom there was other evidence that a side letter had been issued by Oldco. The Commission proceeded on the basis that with respect to the Issues the position of all of the Specified Players was the same except where specifically identified in the documents and other evidence.

The Commission was provided with copies of “side letters” relating to the players whose names appears in the A lists of Specified Players and whilst the Commission and I did not have copies of the side letters for those players whose names appear on the B lists, the evidence of side letters having been issued by Oldco to each of the players listed in the three groups of B Specified Players was also disclosed to the Commission.

At paragraph 36 of the Decision the Commission held that the same general arrangements applied in respect of all of the Specified Players whilst the details and precise form of the individual side letters varied over the years.

Since the involvement of Specified Players in EBT Payments and Arrangements with Oldco and the existence of side letters given to each of them was known to the Commission and included in the Decision it is not readily apparent what substantive new allegations with respect to the actions of Oldco in relation to EBT Payments and Arrangements under the earlier Rangers Employee Benefit Trust so far as relates to the Issues are now being made. Your letter does not suggest that the scheme of the EBT Payments and Arrangements was different as between the first and second trusts and associated sub-trusts so far as concerns the player registration matters with which Issues 1, 2 & 3 were concerned. The Commission does not suggest in the Decision that it determined the Issues before it on the basis that any of the Specified Players had not been part of EBT Payments and Arrangements during the period of their employment by Oldco and/or that one or more of them had not received a side letter from Oldco.

Accordingly, I am not clear in what respects it is being suggested that the Commission was “misled” as regards any of the Specified Players in particular and/or in relation to the participation of Specified Players in EBT Payments and Arrangements in connection with the Rangers Employee Benefit Trust. For the Commission to have been misled it would be necessary for it to have been induced into a false belief by the actions or inactions of a party and/or third party and for it to have relied on that false belief in coming to its various decisions.

You will note that the Commission determined at paragraph [111] (1) that there had been breaches by Oldco with respect to all of Issues 1, 2 and 4 and in respect of most of 3. The excerpted parts of 3 are stated in the paragraph. The finding of breach extends to the Registrations with the SPL, as it then was, of all of the Specified Players; i.e. all of those for whom we had copy side letters and for those for whom we did not but in relation to whom it was known that side letters had been given by Oldco and that whether in respect of the first and/or second trusts.
==============================
Initial reaction is that either the nature of the DOS EBTS as irregular was not deemed significant and LNS was thus able to overrule HMRC or they did not have the HMRC letter and other evidence (which they should have had and missed this point.

Have to go. Grateful for comments.

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Para HandyPosted on6:24 pm - Mar 14, 2014


rougvielovesthejungle says:
March 14, 2014 at 1:08 pm

===============

Us “Northeners” have a notoriously dry sense of humour.
Having read your earlier comments Para, I thought I’d use “Partick” once again just to see if you would bite
————————–

I just went for the typical Glasgow response. Hence the wee sheep icon. 😛

(Plus any excuse to plug my cricket club).

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CastofthousandsPosted on6:39 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid says:
March 14, 2014 at 6:17 pm

“Just when I’m going out we got a reply.”
——————————
Gut reaction is like you that the ‘irregularity’ issue of DOS has been ignored. Focus is placed on registration al la LNS.

I didn’t think you would get a response and as others have said you had no particular right to expect one. The fact that you did indeed get a response is telling.

Any follow up needs to be carefully thought out. You don’t want to wait too long as this might be a window of opportunity. However it may be one of those cases where if you don’t take your chances any opportunity may be lost. Needs to be carefully considered and dissected. On a public forum your tactics might be a bit exposed but if the material is good then this may override any lost element of surprise.

I’m not great on LNS but may have to take the plunge. For those who are eager to ingest I’ll post links to the decision and reasons below.

http://www.scotslawthoughts.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/commission-decision-28-02-2013.pdf

http://www.scribd.com/doc/143094729/SPL-Commission-Reasons-for-Decision-of-12-September-2012

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on6:52 pm - Mar 14, 2014


James Doleman says:
March 14, 2014 at 5:42 pm

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1

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Dear Mr Sainsbury

Rather than pay for my groceries this week I have given the money to a foreign based businessman, Mr David King. Please send my goods as usual and Mr King will pay you as soon as you hand him the keys to the shop.

Arra Best

A Bear

______________________________________________

Was listening to a fans representative on Sportsound just there.
It is SO easy to see why they are in this mess.
Came across as the fans seem to be expecting season ticket money to be used for the day to day running of the club, with the Laxeys being expected to raise £50m to pay for the squad and stadium development.
‘Delusional sense of entitlement’ does not do justice. to the attitude expressed.
They have learned nothing.
Oh well… pull that chain… and down they go!

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No1 BobPosted on7:16 pm - Mar 14, 2014


http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/rangers/u/picture-dave-king-arrives-in-glasgow-for-talks-with-gers-board-and-fans.1394796716

“The 58-year-old Glaswegian, who invested £20m in the club before it was consigned to liquidation in June 2012”

Is the Evening Times starting to print the truth or is the unnamed author just off message?

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on7:31 pm - Mar 14, 2014


did a swift double take on this… before realising it pertains to a different sort of beached cetacean entirely, rather than the second coming of the King!

http://www.inverness-courier.co.uk/News/Rangers-rescue-stranded-Beauly-Firth-porpoise-14032014.htm

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ianagainPosted on7:38 pm - Mar 14, 2014


easyJambo says:

March 14, 2014 at 5:25 pm

Craig Houston (Sons of Struth) explains why he confronted Sandy Easdale on Wednesday night.

https://www.facebook.com/SonsOfStruth/posts/1453792971518493
========================================================
Craig you are a brave guy, braver than DK who bottled it after first meeting the bus brothers.

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CastofthousandsPosted on7:39 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid says:
March 14, 2014 at 6:17 pm

“Just when I’m going out we got a reply.”
———————————
Auldheid, we haven’t seen the annexes yet. Perhaps TSFM will allow you to post them up beside the header blog.

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Flocculent ApoideaPosted on7:45 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Is it possible Mr King repeatedly “jets in” to Glasgow simply to reduce his tax liability in South Africa? Even better if he does it publicly and takes back a Daily Record article of said “jetting in” as evidence of where he’s been. All this ‘Rangers’ talk could be just a smokescreen.

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ianagainPosted on7:47 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid

From the reply the quote:
. Whilst I was only able to secure and provide to the Commission copies of a number of the ‘side letters’ the list of those players who had received such letters was in the public domain and for the purposes of the ‘Issues’ before the Commission it was not suggested by Oldco or Newco that the fundamentals of the side letters were significantly different over the 10 years or so that Oldco had given such letters to each of the individual players involved.

——————————————————

Who was the “I” .Was it MCKenzie directly? In which case my reply would be “you will no doubt then be pleased to see that I (Auldheid) came up with a few more interesting letters than you managed”.
And what are you proposing to do about them?

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Cluster OnePosted on7:47 pm - Mar 14, 2014


“If [the fans] invest, we’ll setup a bank account that all the season ticket money can go in there, and we can guarantee that we will buy this club over from this regime because it’s coming back into Rangers hands.

“Gone are the days, of the, the money that we spent. It’s going to be handled differently this time. The fans are going to buy it over. We have the backing from powerful people who are going to invest, but the fans will invest, and they’ll offer Charles Green, if he says he’s got the title deeds in his name, we’ll make an offer, once we see the hidden letters, any deeds that have been done in the past, if there’s any stumbling blocks, where’s Ticketus in all this, we’ll deal with that, once we see the title deeds, of this stadium, that I was proud to play for, in a number of years through nine-in-a-row, and we’re going to get our club back, but we need a bit of honesty from Charles Green.”
john brown, june 2012.
all sounds a bit DK

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Exiled CeltPosted on7:49 pm - Mar 14, 2014


I have informed my landlord that unless he signs over the house to me with immediate effect, I will not pay another penny in rent…………..

Cardboard box anyone?

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ianagainPosted on7:59 pm - Mar 14, 2014


http://www.scribd.com/doc/210130622/2011-03-23-Rangers-DOS-Docs

http://i.imgur.com/q88NFQq.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/ytPbuSp.jpg

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John ClarkPosted on8:00 pm - Mar 14, 2014


My thanks to scottc and TSFM for instructions on how to drop the ‘e’ from my blog name. I’ve followed the instructions, and wait with trepidation the outcome when I press ‘post comment’! But before I press the button, can I say that, by coincidence I too received a reply today, but
from Hampden Park- from Mr Doncaster, in which he very politely and regretfully appears not to understand what I mean.
I’ll need to fish out my letter (it related to the ‘Telegraph’ report about the rejection of the ‘demotion’ penalty for going into administration), but that can wait till later.
I press the button now!

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ianagainPosted on8:01 pm - Mar 14, 2014


The annexes for anyone who wondered what they were

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John ClarkPosted on8:02 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Hadn’t bargained on my ‘new’name triggering-off Moderation, though! 🙁

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:04 pm - Mar 14, 2014


I don’t want to seem like I’m pandering to the crowd here, but I don’t really see the attraction of what Dave King is offering with regards to the tickets. “Starve the board of money but continue supporting the team by buying at the gate”. Fine Dave. Fair plan. But what the **** do I need you for? I can buy at the gate on my own steam thanks. You’re rich, I’m not. You’re shooting your mouth off, I’m not. Pony up and buy the club, like what I would do if I could afford it, or hold your counsel and let us make up our own minds if you have nothing to offer.

Apologies, possibly more suited to a rangers blog than here. But it annoys me, this endless stream of rich guys telling us what to do. Where were you two years ago Dave?

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ianagainPosted on8:11 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Ryan

Many more like you I know of are of the exact same opinion.

Do it yourselves if you wish.

Personally I don’t see the fans burning the club to the ground just to suit DKs ego.

Do you?

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:17 pm - Mar 14, 2014


If that was the way it went I wouldn’t see it as burning the club to the ground. I would see it as recognising the situation we are in, recognising that we want to carry on, and recognising that something has to give if we are to stop all of the earnings being sucked out of the club. Not that I’m saying I’m of that view, but I could empathise with it.

I know people here don’t agree, but I see Rangers as an inherently viable and profitable business. The fact that it is not and has not been in recent years is not due to the potential of the business but due to gross mismanagement and naked greed. That’s why every day of this nonsense and every comment on here pains me because I don’t believe it has to be this way.

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on8:23 pm - Mar 14, 2014


RyanGosling says:
March 14, 2014 at 8:04 pm

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____________________________

Apologies, possibly more suited to a rangers blog than here…

_____________________________________________

‘Here’ seems just fine from where I am sitting. Most welcome and relevent input.
(Not sure what shrift you’d get on some of those other blogs, however)

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ForresDeePosted on8:25 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Just a thought about Dave King being ‘summoned’ to ibrox. Is he a shadow director and is this all just bluster and cover?

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:29 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Resin- thanks. I lasted one night on rangers media before being banned for being a t***. No joke, that is the official message I received.

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ianagainPosted on8:32 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Ryan

Any thoughts on how the perennial outgoings vv incomings can be addressed?

Apart from the recent obvious “thievery” that’s been rampant. What to do?

Play the kids and get on with it?

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:33 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Nearly deleted my last post immediately because I felt bad about writing that about other fans of my own club. I did not delete it because on consideration I feel no shame in laundering such dirty washing in public. And I do not believe that there are actually that many who would treat me that way, it’s just that there are some vocal and powerful ones who would and do. I know someone who was involved in setting up rangers media and when he heard of my ban he was disgusted and as far as I know is looking into who did it and why it happened.

Lots of people post quotes from rangers media here. Some rough and stupid things are said. We are not all like that.

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wottpiPosted on8:35 pm - Mar 14, 2014


RyanGosling says:
March 14, 2014 at 8:17 pm

Ryan I feel your pain and frustration and agree with the fan base and potential income there is no reason for Rangers not to be run in a better manner.
However is it not the case that even if good men honest and true were in charge the fans would have to accept the reality that it may still be a long road back to the top?

Still too many dreaming of trebles, warchests and the like.

Maybe the Albion Rovers draw was the best result your club has had all season.

For some it has been a dose of reality which is a good thing.
Unfortunately for others it has probably just reignited the calls for more unsustainable spending.

What’s your thoughts on the percentage split in the fan base of realists like yourself and fantasists?

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parttimearabPosted on8:37 pm - Mar 14, 2014


RyanGosling says:
March 14, 2014 at 8:04 pm

Pony up and buy the club
————————–
Ryan
I understand where your coming from here but equally do you really want any potential investment to line the pockets of Laxey/Blue Pitch/Margarita/etc….?

The DK/Union of fans proposal is certainly risky and DKs motivation and commitment (financially) may be open to question; but the alternative…..?

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CastofthousandsPosted on8:37 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Auldheid

First obvious contentious point is the line in your received response “The Commission chose to group these together as MGMRT”.

From LNS

“(We note that the MGMRT was preceded by the Rangers
Employee Benefit Trust, but we are not aware that they were different trusts. We shall treat
them as a continuous trust, which we shall refer to throughout as the MGMRT.)”

Surely the awareness of the difference between the trusts would have been identified by the fact that one scheme had been found to have contravened tax guidelines whereas the other has so far not been.

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:38 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Ianagain,

I don’t see it as being an overly difficult thing to be honest. X number of season ticket sales multiplied by X cost of season tickets gives you your base income. Budget on that. Merchandise etc gives you a bonus on top of that. The following year, you can use that to strengthen the team, develop the grounds etc. net player sales will impact that budget. Its all very simple at a high level. Lots of people here have said that ibrox is a millstone around rangers’ neck, I respectfully disagree; ibroz with its large capacity is the thing that allows rangers to attain such an income as they do.

Thing is, if the cost of tickets multiplied by the number sold does not cover the expenses required to maintain the business, then I’m wrong and the business fails. But that’s not why we failed last time and that’s not why we are struggling this time.

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RyanGoslingPosted on8:42 pm - Mar 14, 2014


Wottpi

I think it’s incredibly difficult to try to split the fans between realists and fantasists. Because we are all fantasists, it’s more a question of how many among us are also realists.

How many would keep paying their money to support the journey, the team, the vision, while watching crap and potentially not seeing back to back promotions? Depends. I’ve posted here before, I think if there was a clearly communicated vision of where we were going, and how we were getting there, and that due to wanting to do it right I might take a bit longer than we’d hoped for, I think the fans would get on board with that. But I don’t think the fans will tolerate the constant off field nonsense for much longer.

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James DolemanPosted on8:43 pm - Mar 14, 2014


I see Ryan is talking about his favourite subject again, Ryan.

🙂

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on8:44 pm - Mar 14, 2014


RyanGosling says:
March 14, 2014 at 8:17 pm

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I know people here don’t agree, but I see Rangers as an inherently viable and profitable business.

______________________________________________________

There is a few statements in there that need to be unpicked…

Leaving aside that ‘Rangers’ technically are in liquidation and therefore cannot be in any sense seen as ‘an inherently viable and profitable business’ (apoligies if this seems churlish) , there is absolutely an inherently vaiable and profitable football business to be had out of the Ibrox franchise.

I think there are very few people here who would disagree with you on that.
The point is that to realise this, things have to be done differently to the past.
Very very differently. A radical and wholesale shake up of the basis on which the club operates is essential, looking at every aspect is required. Nothing less is going to cut it.

And the problem is that a great deal of the Ibrox contingent liked things the way they were. Things were going along there very nicely for a while and the world order was just as it should be for some. A few piddling facts and economic realities aren’t going to penetrate that bubble any time soon, and if they try to they can just be shouted down until they go away. It has worked up until now. I mean if they can even rewrite the past to deny the death in liquidation of the club you support and its history, the more mundane realities of basic finance, fair play and respect for others in the sport haven’t a hope of penetrating with those elements.

And there are others among the Ibrox faithful who are just inherently conservative (small c). Change is a struggle. Manana…

Meanwhile… down she goes.
An inherently viable and profitable business, but bashing away at itself like a fly on a window trying to reach the sun. If it doesn’t overcome its nature and – god forbid – do something differently… well window ledges are littered with dead flies.

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