Scottish Football and the case for a Bismarck!

Avatar Bybroganrogantrevinoandhogan

Scottish Football and the case for a Bismarck!

Good Evening.

When considering any type of protracted negotiation or discussion that seems to be going on too long, there is a story that is always worth remembering– whether it is actually a true story or not as the case may be.

It is said, that heads of state all met at a congress in what is now modern Germany sometime after the Franco Prussian war of 1870-1871.The entire congress was being run almost singlehandedly by the then Prussian Chancellor Otto von Bismark and he was keen to get all the necessary signatures on paper to seal some deal or other.

However, others at the congress were not too keen to sign up to certain elements of the proposed deal and so they hithered and dithered and in the eyes of Bismark they simply waisted time by concentrating on the minutiae- the little matters, with a view to ensuring their own interests were best served in these small areas– and did not focus on the big issue.

Having tried to talk these others round and educate them in his own beliefs and point of view on the bigger picture without any success, Bismark grew weary of the continuing delay and the posturing of his colleagues. All attempts at reason and diplomacy had failed in his eyes and so he decided to take a different tack.

Accordingly, it is said that whilst others were still inside debating endlessly on this matter or that, Bismark left the building and began simply shooting the windows in with the aid of a riffle which he just happened to have handy.

Those inside were naturally alarmed at this turn of events. They soon forgot about the minutiae under debate, they abandoned the previously expressed self interest and simply signed up so that they could get away from the mad chancellor and his house.

Job done so to speak.

Whilst I do not in anyway condone the behaviour of Otto von Bismark in this instance, and have no doubt that he was an autocrat, what I will say is that he believed that there was too much time being spent on the unimportant stuff and not enough time recognising what really needed doing– from his point of view of course.

Today– and it seems every day for months— we have endless debate about the future of Scottish Football. League reconstruction and the redistribution of footballing wealth has become a marathon– even before it has started.

Yet I believe that at the moment all parties concerned are not focusing on the radical reform that is fundamentally needed which is the creation of one, strong, properly structured and constituted body which is capable of the proper and ethical governance of Scottish Football and the business that surrounds football.

No matter what system you try, or distribution you agree, without proper sensible strong governance you are wasting your time.

Further, whatever body is set up, and whoever is chosen to be its CEO (or whatever the head honcho is going to be called), they must tackle the issue of corporate and fiscal compliance and the proper administration of any body corporate which actively takes part in Scottish Football– and that includes any such body or person who is involved in the running of a member club.

In addition, in so dealing with any corporate malfeasance or chicanery or whatever, the rules have to be applied with a rod of iron by an iron body.

As we can now clearly see, Football clubs and football in general is not, and never will be, immune from the effects of bad corporate governance and on occasion downright manipulation of facts, figures and contracts.

Whilst great play has been made of the fact that Gavin Masterton has handed over his shares in Dunfermline FC ( or its holding company ) the fact of the matter is that this in no way solves the problem faced by the football club. Whoever gains control of that club will still have to rent the ground from Mr Masterton’s company– and it is a rent that the club may just not be able to afford.

Ever!

It is only my opinion of course, but I am of the view that Mr Masterton has sealed a loan deal with his bankers which is of a type and duration which could not normally be achieved by other borrowers. The Loan has a lengthy period during which no repayments are necessary and interest can continue to accrue.

All very good you may say, but the level of debt concerned is not one that appears to be sustainable by Dunfermline FC and so whoever buys the club as a going concern ( if anyone buys it at all ) will have to pay an agreed rental to Gavin Masterton– and if the rental is not sufficient to repay Mr Masterton’s lenders, then I suspect that the end game here will be a search to find a buyer for the ground at some point over the next twenty years or so, with the hope that as part of the deal a space will be found somewhere for a new ground like New St Mirren park– the difference being that in that instance St Mirren were in charge of their future whereas Dunfermline are not.

The Governance of that club and the financial arrangements behind the club should have been looked at and examined by the SFA long before now– and the Dunfermline fans warned about the dangers of any such arrangements. Effectively those finance arrangements, should they continue, will probably mean that the club will have no option but to move from its established home!

All to suit one man!

Thankfully Dundee were spared a full takeover by Giovanni Di Stefano, however is it not a bit worrying that this man who has been jailed for over 14 years for various fraudulent acts, was allowed to roam around Scottish Football for a prolonged period?

Not so long ago Di Stefano did play a part at Dens, was in line to buy almost 30% of the shareholding, and was oft quoted in the papers and so on. The thing is that there were those who were prepared to give him a place at the Dundee table and in so doing invited him into Scottish Football.

Surely the SFA, had they been inclined to, could quite easily have pointed out that many of the claims of Mr Di Stefano were at least dubious if not completely incorrect? Yet nothing was being said at the time and silence prevailed.

Whilst not in the same calibre as Di Dtefano, Vladimir Romanov has now been at Hearts for a prolonged period. While I have no quibbles about the legality of Romanov’s takeover of Hearts, any money of a sizeable size which is transferred into Scotland from a foreign country will be subject to scrutiny by the Crown office to ensure that it is clean. Lithuania in particular is said to have a banking system which is governed loosely and sometimes does not meet the compliance standards expected in this country.

With his bank having gone bust, Romanov still retains the majority shareholding at Tynecastle, but there are questions still to be answered about what has happened at Hearts but life will be very different for the Edinburgh club going forward.

Again– could the SFA have done more to monitor the situation and could they have demanded clarity and detail from the Hearts owner as to his business dealings and the detailed arrangements with his bank?

At Ibrox, well things just go from the weird and inexplicable to downright astonishing– and all through a tremendous amount of smoke and mirrors.

It is clear that the SFA have no idea what to believe from Charles Green or for that matter Craig Whyte. On the face of it, there are clear links between Whyte and Green with the former paying over a six figure sum in return for absolutely nothing it would appear– with similar transactions going between Whyte’s colleague, Aiden Early, and Charles Green.

What is clear is that Green gave a clear undertaking to the SFA that he had nothing whatsoever to do with Whyte and would have nothing to do with Whyte going forward. Now, at the very least he is admitting that he met Whyte on several occasions, and whilst he may have made representations to Craig Whyte— these were all lies designed only to get Whyte to where Green wanted him.

This is hardly the act of someone who has been bona fides in his business dealings either with Whyte or with the SFA as the licensing body.

It is against this background that the Scottish Football Agencies need to wake up before they find the fans of the game ( at least those who want to stay interested in the game ) doing a Bismarck and panning in the windows of this whole house of cards.

Football Clubs, football fans, and indeed football itself needs protected from the financial and corporate shenanigans, and the governing body must be much more active and permanently vigilant in watching out for and if necessary anticipating the people and the transactions which have and will jeopardise clubs and the game in general going forward.

It is clearly no longer acceptable to rely on self regulation or mere declarations and undertakings from the clubs themselves. The Administrators must be much more active and employ far greater professional expertise in carrying out an almost constant analytical and reporting function in relation to club finance and corporate regulation.

All and any changes in funding, boardroom changes, investor changes and anything else major should be the subject of immediate and proper scrutiny by the SFA and there should be fair, immediate and stiff sanctions for non compliance, and any type of dilatory behaviour on the part of club officials who would seek to conceal the truth or who fail to properly disclose vital matters which should be out in the open.

Further, the funding detail– such as the never ending loan re Dunfermline should be a matter of public record in all its detail so that fans and investors can make information based value judgements when dealing with any club.

Such stiffer regulation should not develop into anything like a corporate witch hunt or any kind of draconian big brother syndrome, however the need for change given all of the current troubles is obvious to one and all.

Further, the attempted fudge surrounding Rangers league status last summer and the ongoing disquiet surrounding the position of Campbell Ogilvie does nothing to boost faith in and the reputation of Football Administration in Scotland.

Things are far from clear and there appears to be continual dithering and fudging. No one has any idea where the Nimmo Smith Report has gone nor what import it is to have— if any. Why is that?

Dithering and bumbling over detail is no longer an option. Strong clear governance is required to protect the game from being hijacked by those who have their own corporate and financial agendas.

Such people cannot be allowed to determine the way Scottish Football runs  or to conduct themselves in a fashion that leaves football and everyone involved in limbo.

It is time for Scottish Football to find its own Iron Chancellor!  There is a need for someone who will, if necessary, come along and shoot the lights out of any club or Company Director who wishes to play fast and loose with the game of football.

About the author

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broganrogantrevinoandhogan author

Boot wearing football, sport & total nonsense fan-- Gourmet, Bon Viveur and eedgit! - Oh and I write a bit occasionally!

5,402 Comments so far

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twopandaPosted on3:26 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:10

Why `peculiar`? – Do tell
All Directors are in place
Media hoose paid large amounts of money over the last two year and where is the benefit to anyone?
Why do the SPL promote a solution that assumes a consensus vote occurring
Why are you defending this charade?

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Night TerrorPosted on3:26 pm - May 7, 2013


@smugas

Is that a “Never”?

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Madbhoy24941Posted on3:28 pm - May 7, 2013


1.Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 09:26

And the really big fear may still be the UTT because if it rules in favour of HMRC ( as it may well do– though that is not guaranteed ) then the possibility exists that the liability for tax may still exist if there is any chance of the current Rangers set up remaining liable for ” Footballing debts”.

——————————————–

Interesting piece BRTH but wasn’t there a declaration from HMRC that Sevco would not be held responsible for any historic debts owed by Rangers? Or was it “owed by the oldco”? If that was the case then would HMRC pursue the club and not the company?

Of course this could be just another clever use of words by Charles Green when he told everyone that HMRC assured him.

Or if the loans were to be called in, would it be the case that they were not actually seen as a debt at that time?

Think I need to take some time to digest all this before commenting further.

P.S. Some of the big hitters back online today, welcome back. I know you have not actually been away but it’s good that you are posting as it lifts the blog to another level, not because I believe you guys know everything, more about it raising the game of the others.

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Night TerrorPosted on3:28 pm - May 7, 2013


@twopanda

What is this charade of which you speak?

Please be as specific as you can.

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Madbhoy24941Posted on3:32 pm - May 7, 2013


john clarke says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:15

Who goes-Doncaster or Longmuir?
————————

Both!

Time for a Spring Clean!

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angus1983Posted on3:33 pm - May 7, 2013


11-1 surely becomes an irrelevance?

Lurker … TRFC should be in the third tier (whatever they decide to call it).

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bluPosted on3:35 pm - May 7, 2013


verselijkfc says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 14:40
2 0 i Rate This

Scapaflow14
Chris McC is a journalist, the motivation(s) of the people leaking stuff to him will interest him, but not as much as getting the info out before someone else gets it. It’s would be a mistake to think that only one person is feeding him or anyone else for that matter.

Don’t disagree with that but the purpose of the BBC is to provide balance, even where none obviously exists (one can argue this lofty ambition is long since deceased); this is, again, printing PR with one side of the story, not even an attempt at balance; of course, if he’s being fed by other competing interests then he should do his job and build the story using that info too. Not like he has to “sell copy” is it? The UK license payers are gifting him his job.

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verselijkfc, I agree. Mr McLaughlin’s only interest, in common with most journalists, seems to be getting something out there first. There is never any questioning or analysis. There is a whole culture that seems to believe that because the news media is avaialble 24/7 that you have to fill space rather than bring real news and analysis. If his Malcolm Murray claims are proved to to be right I’m sure he’ll quite pleased with himself though.

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SmugasPosted on3:35 pm - May 7, 2013


So to round things off, the reconstruction (that isn’t) consigns sevco to 3 seasons at best until competing in the top league (unless a drastic expansion next year) and RTC conservatively gives sevco 2 years tops to survive without massive financial injection, club licence and top tier football whilst Malcolm has gotten sacked for pointing out that the licence and the investment would be extremely fool-hardy if they want to ever see their cash back.

Makes perfect sense to me.

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Night TerrorPosted on3:36 pm - May 7, 2013


@twopanda

Peculiar – as in there is a major change to the way professional football is structured in this country, every change universally agreed as being for the better as far as I can see, and you focus on its value as a smokescreen for something else?

That I find peculiar.

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twopandaPosted on3:41 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:28

The question was to you but un answered
We can keep it simple to suit
Charade
Is pretence – by pretenders – to fool
Since when have the planted [ and timed] stories done any good for Scottish Football at any level – ever
Specific enough?

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SmugasPosted on3:41 pm - May 7, 2013


@NT

I know what you mean (as I did with Mcgollybubble as well btw)

No the timescale I’d like is a balance between the ‘required-reformers’ ie. SFL1 who need change, and those I’d best describe as ‘back-burners’ meaning the upper SPL teams and the part time lagards who might fear a true pyramid system coming in.

So not never, no. But not 3 months either!

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Forres Dee (@ForresDee)Posted on3:43 pm - May 7, 2013


League Reform.

To me it’s looking like reform has been pushed through by the next sponsor.

A little Chapeau to whomever they be.

Fairer financial distribution and a play-off place, what’s not to like about that, I know that’s been my biggest gripe while DFC struggled to exit the first division.

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Night TerrorPosted on3:45 pm - May 7, 2013


twopanda says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:41

The question was to you but un answered
We can keep it simple to suit
Charade
Is pretence – by pretenders – to fool
Since when have the planted [ and timed] stories done any good for Scottish Football at any level – ever
Specific enough?

Are you saying this SPL/SFL merger has been orchestrated and timed by Media House to help The Rangers keep their boardroom conflict off the front & back pages?

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twopandaPosted on3:48 pm - May 7, 2013


What merger~?

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Celtic Paranoia (@CelticParanoia)Posted on3:48 pm - May 7, 2013


madbhoy24941 says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:13
6 0 i
—————————–

Night Terror

PMG commented critically on Celtic supporters conducting a “protest” against Remembrance Day minute’s silence from outside the stadium in 2009/10 and also on the idiots at Dens Park this season. There may have been others.

So not accurate to say he is never critical of Celtic

I do agree that his sweetie wife taxi driver talk approach can be frustrating and can appear to be made to fit the facts retropsectively.

He has been a key plank in getting the RFC Tax case and related stories out into the public domain based on actual proper journalism, for which he deserves credit

However it does appear he is venerated in some circles and it is never wise to take the word of anyone as sacrosanct – friend or foe.

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Night TerrorPosted on3:49 pm - May 7, 2013


smugas says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:41

No the timescale I’d like is a balance between the ‘required-reformers’ ie. SFL1 who need change, and those I’d best describe as ‘back-burners’ meaning the upper SPL teams and the part time lagards who might fear a true pyramid system coming in.

So not never, no. But not 3 months either!

Gotcha. Disagree on the timescale, but fair enough.

Given how hard it has been to broker any change at all, and that this looks pretty good as far as it goes, I wouldn’t hang about.

If it’s doable now, I’m happy they’re doing it now.

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aramintamoobeamqcPosted on3:50 pm - May 7, 2013


Small rumour that the Cardigan of Dignity has walked as well as Murray.

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wottpiPosted on3:50 pm - May 7, 2013


Nice to see at least some movement towards a single body, wealth distribution, play-offs and a pyramid system. Still not perfect but a move in the right direction.

If it goes ahead then lets not get wrapped up in branding etc. Its the Scottish Football League – end of story.

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Forest Hills (@ForestHills1903)Posted on3:53 pm - May 7, 2013


angus1983 says:
11-1 surely becomes an irrelevance?
————————————

I m not so sure – the original plan for the 8-8-8 leagues had 42 clubs and some in the SPL were determined to keep the 11-1 vote. Obviously the way they planned to have it set up had some restrictions that only the clubs in the top Division could vote on.

It will all come out in the wash as they say.

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Night TerrorPosted on3:54 pm - May 7, 2013


@twopanda

“what merger?”

First paragraph of the BBC piece – “Scottish Premier League clubs have unanimously agreed on a package of measures that would deliver a merged league body in time for next season.”

Are you being deliberately obtuse or am I missing something fundamental, as we seem to be suffering a communication failure about something that does not seem terribly complicated to me.

Either way, could you please let me know?

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HirsutePursuitPosted on3:55 pm - May 7, 2013


scapaflow14 says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:17
1 0 Rate This
john clarke says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:15

Don’t forget a new water tight rule book. The timescales, look a wee bit ambitious?
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If one becomes a subsidiary of the other, the existing structures and separate rules books can remain in place meantime. These, in truth, are likely to be minor considerations.

The SFL is paid £2m per year as part of the settlement that allowed the creation of the SPL in 1998. In addition, the SFL was paid £1m for this season’s TV rights. Assuming this proposal goes ahead, what will happen to the £3m that the SFL clubs would be expecting to receive?

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angus1983Posted on3:56 pm - May 7, 2013


So, anyway, the most important thing … pies.


“ON behalf of our client, Rangers Football Club, Azure Support Services would like to apologise to fans who attended the Manchester United Legends game on 6th May for the shortage of hot food at half time.

This came about as a result of a higher than expected attendance at the game. We had not correctly anticipated the numbers attending this event and more than 23000 fans arrived to cheer on the two teams.”

This is obviously a smokescreen (word of the day). Anyone who’s seen the pictures of McCoist playing in yesterday’s game will have their own suspicions as to why there was a shortage of pies for the fans.

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SmugasPosted on4:00 pm - May 7, 2013


NT

Thumbs up from me too. As long as its done properly.

And I’ll also make a major decision for them to set them on their way. What about SFL1, SFL2, SFL3 and SFL4.

Just saying.

(I’m of course expecting some bastardisation of ‘Premiership,’ then Championship then…)

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carntynePosted on4:00 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 13:41

12

4

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TW (@tartanwulver) says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 13:16

Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 11:27

PMG is indeed at least honest that he has, or at least doesn’t try to hide that he has, a particular point of view to promote.

When has he ever reported an inconvenient truth? He must have stumbled upon plenty, surely?

I’m sure we would all be interested in any inconvenient truth that PMG has failed to report on.
Do you have any such example?
========================================================================

I’m not sure being up front about your allegiance fully compensates. Not for me, anyway. If a contrary version of events is barely even acknowledged,

I get suspicious that confirmation bias is clouding judgment and giving an incomplete understanding.

Successive Rangers owners, CEO’s and Chairmen have offered contrary versions of events which in the end amounted to nothing more than…”It wizny us”.

When you digest some of the ridiculous defences put up by Rangers and their sympathizers to the charges leveled, it makes you suspicious, and leads to questioning every word they utter.

…’clouding judgment and giving an incomplete understanding’…is a good way of describing it.

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twopandaPosted on4:07 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:28

Are they merging? Really? –all cut and dried is it?
Personally would be delighted – one less silly overhead – and spread money more fairly
But Is it a today happenstance – or a controlled agenda
Controlled agenda are evidenced throughout this fracas – betterment of Scottish Football is not

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Night TerrorPosted on4:13 pm - May 7, 2013


@carntyne
Err, I was asking the question about when PMG had reported inconvenient truths, such as FTT(T) and Nimmo Smith. Got a couple of responses regarding Celtic fans behaviour. They seem somewhat minor to me – who could approve of loutish behaviour? – but I appreciate the info. I’m not saying PMG has never reported stuff that did not suit his point of view – just that I wasn;t aware of any. Hence my question about when he had ever done so.

I don’t really understand your second point unless it can be summarised as “But whatabout Rangers???”, in which case I don’t think I have anything useful to add.

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BrendaPosted on4:14 pm - May 7, 2013


AT, PMG ???? Please, what’s happening? come on tell me 🙂 I won’t breathe a word!!! Honest 😉

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parmahamsterPosted on4:14 pm - May 7, 2013


twopanda says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:26
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Why `peculiar`? – Do tell
All Directors are in place
Media hoose paid large amounts of money over the last two year and where is the benefit to anyone?
Why do the SPL promote a solution that assumes a consensus vote occurring
Why are you defending this charade?

=======================================================================
Are you seriously insinuating that this reconstruction statement is a media smokescreen, put together by the SPL/SFL/SFA and orchestrated by Jack “Scoop” Irvine, all for the benefit of TributeAct FC keeping its’ dirty linen hidden – again?

Seriously?

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Night TerrorPosted on4:15 pm - May 7, 2013


@twopanda

Are you saying this SPL/SFL intended merger has been orchestrated and timed by Media House to help The Rangers keep their boardroom conflict off the front & back pages?

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redetinPosted on4:19 pm - May 7, 2013


madbhoy24941 says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:28

Interesting piece BRTH but wasn’t there a declaration from HMRC that Sevco would not be held responsible for any historic debts owed by Rangers? Or was it “owed by the oldco”? If that was the case then would HMRC pursue the club and not the company?
#################################################

The words were “the new company will be free from claims or litigation”. Here is what the UK HMRC said:-

“A liquidation provides the best opportunity to protect taxpayers, by allowing the potential investigation and pursuit of possible claims against those responsible for the company’s financial affairs in recent years. A CVA would restrict the scope of such action. Moreover the liquidation route does not prejudice the proposed sale of the club. This sale can take place either through a CVA or a liquidation.

So the sale is not being undermined, it simply takes a different route. Liquidation will enable a sale of the football assets to be made to a new company, thereby ensuring that football will continue at Ibrox. It also means that the new company will be free from claims or litigation in a way which would not be achievable with a CVA. Rangers can make a fresh start.”

#freshstartmyarse

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/news/rangers.htm

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bogsdolloxPosted on4:21 pm - May 7, 2013


twopanda says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:07

Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:28

Are they merging? Really? –all cut and dried is it?
Personally would be delighted – one less silly overhead – and spread money more fairly
But Is it a today happenstance – or a controlled agenda
Controlled agenda are evidenced throughout this fracas – betterment of Scottish Football is not

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I’d say controlled agenda by SPL/SFA and certain clubs.

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Night TerrorPosted on4:25 pm - May 7, 2013


@bogsdollox
“I’d say controlled agenda by SPL/SFA and certain clubs.”

A controlled agenda to improve and stabilise the game?

Are you seeing a downside that I am not?

What is wrong with what has been agreed today?

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scapaflow14

scapaflow14Posted on4:26 pm - May 7, 2013


Araminta Moonbeam QC says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:50

If that’s true, then Squire McCoist won’t be far behind – though if I was getting North of £700k for old rope, I may just hang on till the pay cheque bounces…..

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aramintamoobeamqcPosted on4:28 pm - May 7, 2013


I think we are all to attuned to the ‘squirrel release mechanism’ that we treat news coming out of Ibrox or the governing bodies with contempt.

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aramintamoobeamqcPosted on4:28 pm - May 7, 2013


*so attuned

blooming ipad

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bogsdolloxPosted on4:29 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:25
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Nothing is wrong with what has been agreed today (other than gate sharing). The way agreement was reached just doesn’t smell right. What was all that “take it or leave it” pish we got from Doncaster and the scapegoating of St Mirren and Rossco? Only to arrive at a unanimously agreed position only days later.

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Celtic Paranoia (@CelticParanoia)Posted on4:38 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:13
0 0 i
Rate This
@carntyne
Got a couple of responses regarding Celtic fans behaviour. They seem somewhat minor to me – who could approve of loutish behaviour? – but I appreciate the info
——————————————————-

Who could indeed approve of loutish behaviour? But I could show you plenty who would say it was only a small minority, it’s societie’s problem not football, it’s an Old Firm problem, the other side are just as bad blah blah etc etc

An unequivocal statement is refreshingly rare these days

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Night TerrorPosted on4:39 pm - May 7, 2013


@bogsdollox – there is gatesharing in the agreement?

Personally, I see today’s announcement as a smokescreen arranged by Peter Liewell to hide the fact he’s heartlessly knocking down a primary school, probably still with the little kidlywinks still in it, drowning out their screams with his cackling!

I bet you won’t see that on tomorrow’s front pages now!

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tomtomPosted on4:45 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:39

I bet you won’t see that on tomorrow’s front pages now!

========================================

No, you’ll have to wait until they come out 😀

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wottpiPosted on4:47 pm - May 7, 2013


So 1/4 to 5. Normally around this time someone announces that there is more info to come in the evening bulletins.

Will Chris McLaughlin be leaked more info or will STV get the exclusive given the BBC are banned from Ibrox??

OR

Damp squib?

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bogsdolloxPosted on4:49 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:39

@bogsdollox – there is gatesharing in the agreement?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Oops – i meant to say no gate sharing.

By introducing a potential second relegation spot from the SPL via play offs we have succeeded in introducing an element of drama to the end of the season.

To my mind there should be three 14’s with two automatic relegation places from the SPL, autopromo for the winner of SPL2/SFL1 and play offs between positions 2-5.

With drama created at the bottom end of the table our attention should turn to creating some at the top, instead of a one horse race – hence my long held belief in gate sharing being a way to enable other SPL clubs to improve the quality of their squads and compete on a more consistent basis.

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paulmac2Posted on4:53 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:

Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:39

@bogsdollox – there is gatesharing in the agreement?

Personally, I see today’s announcement as a smokescreen arranged by Peter Liewell to hide the fact he’s heartlessly knocking down a primary school, probably still with the little kidlywinks still in it, drowning out their screams with his cackling!

I bet you won’t see that on tomorrow’s front pages now!
………………………………………………

Don’t worry your cotton socks…this proposal will not get past the members of the SPL when it is brought before them….

For we can be certain that St. Mirren and Ross County at least will vote against it…as it does not redress the issue of the 11-1 voting structure which was one of the elements they insisted needed changed….which this doesn’t!

How and ever…You say Peter will be putting on the hi-viz jaket tomorrow and doing some demolishin work?…is there no end to that mans talents?

Lawwell for prime minister!…..the man they love to hate for being a raging success!

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Night TerrorPosted on4:56 pm - May 7, 2013


@bogsdollox

Then we are agreed! Hurrah!

Today’s agreement is good as far as it goes, and I too would like some gate sharing to enhance the competitiveness, in the top division particularly.

An excellent day for Scottish football that could not conceivably get any better.

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bogsdolloxPosted on5:02 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:56

@bogsdollox

Then we are agreed! Hurrah!

Today’s agreement is good as far as it goes, and I too would like some gate sharing to enhance the competitiveness, in the top division particularly.

An excellent day for Scottish football that could not conceivably get any better.

===========================================================

No we are not agreed. The day could get better if news was to emerge that RIFC had ceased trading!!

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chipm0nkPosted on5:03 pm - May 7, 2013


redetin says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:19

======================

HMRC will not chase the old club for debts, it’s pointless they don’t exist any more.

However that does not mean they won’t chase individuals, depending on how the debts arose and who benefited.

They choose the liquidator they did for a reason. It was not just to ensure a tidy liquidation process, it was also to get to the bottom of how this all happened and who was responsible.

Whilst I am not saying it will happen civil and / or criminal actions against certain people are still a possibility.

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chipm0nkPosted on5:08 pm - May 7, 2013


I see the RIFC share price has dropped by 2p (3.54%)

Losing a CEO (under a cloud) and potentially a Chairman (on a no confidence vote) can’t have helped.

Surely AIM must be looking very closely at what is goingg on. The business only floated in December.

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Night TerrorPosted on5:13 pm - May 7, 2013


I think the point of listing on AIM is that they don’t look very closely at all.

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Long Time Lurker

Long Time LurkerPosted on5:14 pm - May 7, 2013


scapaflow14 says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 15:17

Thanks, can’t see any chance of a foot-up if Phill’s tweets from yesterday are anything to go buy – where SFA looked for assurance that Sevco will not be invited into a SPL2.

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Shooperb

ShooperbPosted on5:29 pm - May 7, 2013


Mmmm – On the face of it, this agreement looks to be pretty good news. We’ve finally got playoffs, a pyramid structure (which would leave my team’s coat on a shaky peg, with us finishing 2nd bottome of the league set up!), redistribution of money etc.

However, call me cycnical, but I just find it all very strange that we go from a complete no go to suddenly finding ourselves in a far fairer set up! I think the last 18 months have conditioned us to think the worst, so we end up being suspicious of anything that appears to offer fairness! What’s the catch?

As pointed out, it’s still unclear about what is happening to the 11-1 voting structure, and the set up still doesn’t address the 4-games-a-season-against-the-same-team nature of the competition that bores the @rse off most of us. However, it does seem as if we are finally moving in the right direction, for once.

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easyJamboPosted on5:34 pm - May 7, 2013


Another teaser from the Beeb

BBC Sportsound ‏@bbcsportsound 3m
RT @bbckennymac: #BBCSportsound news for @RFC_Official fans tonight.

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Forres Dee (@ForresDee)Posted on5:38 pm - May 7, 2013


The trickle of info has started, is the AIM shut?

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bogsdolloxPosted on5:39 pm - May 7, 2013


easyJambo says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:34

Another teaser from the Beeb

BBC Sportsound ‏@bbcsportsound 3m
RT @bbckennymac: #BBCSportsound news for @RFC_Official fans tonight.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Swines!! Worse than Phil Gobbldygook!!

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wottpiPosted on5:40 pm - May 7, 2013


easyJambo says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:34

Oh well. Only 45 minutes out and got the wrong reporter. 🙂

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Night TerrorPosted on5:40 pm - May 7, 2013


Piegate at last night’s game, no doubt. The Beeb have really got it in for Rangers, haven’t they?

Anyway, let this not distract from a fabulous good news day in Scottish football that could not and certainly will not get any better.

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joegonePosted on5:41 pm - May 7, 2013


Graeme Speirs just tweeted Walter Smith has resigned

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goosyPosted on5:43 pm - May 7, 2013


1. areyouaccusingmeofmendacity says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:29
However, call me cycnical, but I just find it all very strange that we go from a complete no go to suddenly finding ourselves in a far fairer set up! I think the last 18 months have conditioned us to think the worst, so we end up being suspicious of anything that appears to offer fairness! What’s the catch?
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Until further notice I would look at it this way
We may have just witnessed the first major decision by the governing bodies that ignored the impact it will have on TRFC

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Night TerrorPosted on5:45 pm - May 7, 2013


Good point, goosy.

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dreddybhoyPosted on5:46 pm - May 7, 2013


joegone says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:41
2 0 Rate This
Graeme Speirs just tweeted Walter Smith has resigned

======

No he didn’t it’s a fake account

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Forres Dee (@ForresDee)Posted on5:47 pm - May 7, 2013


joegone says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:41
2 0 Rate This
Graeme Speirs just tweeted Walter Smith has resigned
============

No he hasn’t.

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joegonePosted on5:50 pm - May 7, 2013


so it would seem ah well

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bogsdolloxPosted on5:50 pm - May 7, 2013


joegone says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 17:41

Graeme Speirs just tweeted Walter Smith has resigned

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Hoax fail – Walter does not do walking away.

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scapaflow14

scapaflow14Posted on5:53 pm - May 7, 2013


Another interesting article from the Standard

http://www.therangersstandard.co.uk/index.php/articles/current-affairs/254-the-actual-way-forward-no-room-for-sentiment

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scapaflow14

scapaflow14Posted on5:56 pm - May 7, 2013


Mr Murray allegedly saying I’m staying put, and Mr green took part in the meeting. This is going to get, I was going to say messy, but…

http://local.stv.tv/glasgow/224401-chairman-malcolm-murray-loses-no-confidence-vote-at-rangers/

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Night TerrorPosted on6:03 pm - May 7, 2013


Good article on the Rangers Standard, that.

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scapaflow14

scapaflow14Posted on6:09 pm - May 7, 2013


“The board members who gave Mr Murray a vote of no confidence are believed to be asking him to stand down from his post once the independent investigation into dealings between Mr Green, commercial director Imran Ahmad and former owner Craig Whyte has been concluded. However, it is understood that Mr Murray has no intention of leaving his position at Rangers.”

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chipm0nkPosted on6:10 pm - May 7, 2013


If the board has no confidence in the Chairman, and he has refused to leave his post, then an EGM and his sacking must surely be the only way forward.

That cluck seems to be getting more flustered all the time.

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Lord WobblyPosted on6:26 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 18:03
0 0 Rate This
Good article on the Rangers Standard, that.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
It makes some decent comments, but they still cling to the fallacy that the Club continues with an unbroken history. EVERYONE associated with Ibrox would be far better off coming to terms with the truth of the Club’s demise, rather than this constant stumbling from one crisis to another. Only then can they move on and build for the future.
They would also get far more credit from the wider football community if they fessed up rather than trotting out their continued belligerence.

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neepheidPosted on6:31 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 18:03
0 0 Rate This
Good article on the Rangers Standard, that.
++++++++++++++++++++++++=
It’s a shame the author spoils his piece by fantasising about the £20m IPO money. How does he think his club has been meeting its £2.4m per month expenses since December? Is this £20m IPO money like the magic porridge pot-you just keep spending, but there’s always £20m left?

The bears never cease to amaze me. Their gullibility knows absolutely no bounds. Just buy those season tickets, bears, it will all be fine. Well, no it won’t, actually, but then when it clearly isn’t all right, I’m sure it will all be someone else’s fault.

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jonnyodPosted on6:38 pm - May 7, 2013


Good news from the reconstruction talks
12-10-10-10 looks like I can enjoy another season of corrupt free football in the SPL

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NawlitePosted on6:41 pm - May 7, 2013


I start by saying that any understanding I have of what is going on in the RFC* boardroom has been garnered from this blog and my limited ability to join things together. As a result, I realise my conclusions can be described by others out there as misinformed and by more learned posters here as incorrect. Perhaps Goosy, for example, can comment on my take on things from his ‘spiv-aware’ point of view!

If Murray goes, is this evidence that the spiv side has won for the moment? My understanding is that he was brought on board purely to add some credibility to the AIM launch and following the successful collection of funds, his purpose has been well and truly served. Now – with his knowledge of how a company should run and how a board should function – he is simply a liability to the spivs as he knows where to look to see that they are bleeding the club dry. As his purpose has been served, he is easily jettisoned, whereas the rest of the ‘Rangers people’ on the board/in management are still useful in trying to bleed the fans again i.e. Walter and Ally still involved helps when STs are issued (see Ally’s ‘WATP speech from the weekend). They are also protected by the fact that their lack of financial acumen means they don’t know what to look out for.

If Murray is pushed out, what does he do? His reputation is not well served if he is seen to be sacked by spivs, surely, and I am led to believe his reputation is important to him. He surely cannot simply walk away – with or without a payoff for his silence. Would he HAVE to share what he knows – and presumably was unhappy with – to protect his reputation?

Putting things together, it appears to me that although we tend to focus on the noisy incumbents (Whyte, Green, Ahmad, McCoist etc) the real power is with Stockbridge who is still around, presumably working quietly in the background. There is someone moving pieces around (most recently bringing in Mather from left field) and he is my prime suspect. His move to Bearsden on behalf of Ticketus/Zeus/Octopus has him leading things from the get-go and his focus on finance may make him the power. With Whyte gone; Green gone; Ahmad gone, he must be the one making sure the Ticketus money is recouped – or am I making that too simple? I know some posters believe it all leads back to SDM – am I wrong to focus on Stockbridge/Ticketus in isolation?

Learned friends, am I understanding things (roughly!) correctly?

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jonnyodPosted on6:51 pm - May 7, 2013


nawlite
I agree with most of your thoughts on the Sevco circus but I will always be of the opinion that SDM / Ticketus is where it all starts and were it will end .CW/CG/IA/DK/MM/WS/AMC/DP are IMO just bit part players .

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TaysiderPosted on6:56 pm - May 7, 2013


I agree with those who suggest one merged body, play offs, pyramid and redistribution amount to a good step forward. I found the BBC Sportsound conversation this evening a bit annoying, suggesting that virtually nothing has changed with this. For me, 12/12/18 was almost a side issue.

Of course we still need to see the detail and we don’t yet know how the SFL will vote. I wouldn’t be surprised if the distribution down has reduced. There will only be 10 teams now in the second tier. Also the SPL teams are accepting play offs for less gain, as 12/12/18 with the 8/8/8 split was meant to generate additional income to help fund the distribution.

For those suspicious that this could be agreed by the SPL so soon after 12/12/18 fell apart, maybe those who were prepared to sponsor the League said you need to get your act together or we can’t sponsor you? Plus plays offs will increase the funding we can offer?

The combined league has already been referred to as the SPFL (Scottish Professional Football League) so I won’t be surprised by that name and really couldn’t get excited about it. Same applies if the top two tiers are the Premier and Championship. If it helps them get money in, so be it.

For those who want to see more change, surely that will be easier with one League body. We need to be careful not to naturally default to cynicism and negativity, even if previous experience has proved such responses right in the past!

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aramintamoobeamqcPosted on6:57 pm - May 7, 2013


So, I’m back to the theory of earlier today – Murray wants to air the linen re the independent report – spivs don’t want it to be published. Murray could force an EGM. Watty must be realising that if he sides with the spivs then he could be in big trouble when the report comes out, either at an EGM or via a well placed leak. I’m assuming Murray is trying to salvage his rep.

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Danish PastryPosted on7:08 pm - May 7, 2013


Night Terror says:
Tuesday, May 7, 2013 at 16:39
9 21 Rate This

@bogsdollox – there is gatesharing in the agreement?

Personally, I see today’s announcement as a smokescreen arranged by Peter Liewell to hide the fact he’s heartlessly knocking down a primary school, probably still with the little kidlywinks still in it, drowning out their screams with his cackling!

I bet you won’t see that on tomorrow’s front pages now!
————-

I’m not sure if your post is in jest NT but the prospect of the demolition of yet another listed building is very sad. I believe the magnificent Whitevale Baths & Steamie was bulldozed not long ago too. But what better building for a Celtic Museum than at a refurbished, classic primary school as the centrepiece? Do architects lack imagination? Or is it soul they lack? The news item about the demolition order was very depressing, much more so than anything football related I’ve read of late. These buildings are a huge part of Glasgow’s heritage. I hope Historic Scotland can stop the impending vandalism.

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Long Time Lurker

Long Time LurkerPosted on7:10 pm - May 7, 2013


Found this on CQN

O.G.Rafferty 14:26 on 7 May, 2013 leftclicktic, 14:20

Still being put together. Hopefully worth the wait
_______________________________

Hope whatever the story is – that it is published soon.

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