Good Afternoon.
Announcing outstanding financial successes for Rangers PLC the then Chairman of the club opened his Chairman’s report in the annual financial statements with the following words:
“Last summer I explained that the Club, after many years of significant investment in our playing squad
and more recently in our state of the art facility at Murray Park, had embarked on a three year business
plan to stabilise and improve the Club’s finances. The plan also recognised the need to react to the
challenging economic conditions facing football clubs around the world.
Following a trend over a number of years of increasing year on year losses, I am pleased to report that
in the first year of this plan we have made important progress by reversing this trend. Our trading loss
for last year of £11.2m reflects a £7.9m improvement versus the £19.1m loss for the previous year and
although it will take more time to completely reach our goals, this is a key milestone. We also intend to
make significant further progress by the end of the current financial year. This improvement is the
consequence of having a solid strategy and the commitment and energy to implement the changes it requires”
Later on in the same statement the chairman would add:
“Another key part of our plan is associated with the Rangers brand and our Retail Division goes from strength to strength. Our financial results this year have been significantly enhanced by an outstanding performance in merchandising Rangers products, in particular replica kit, which makes our Retail Division one of the most successful in Europe.”
In the same set of financial reports, the CEO would report:
“To further strengthen Rangers hospitality portfolio, a new dedicated sponsor’s lounge was unveiled this season. The Carling Lounge is a first for the Club and was developed in conjunction with our new sponsor, Carling. ”
and
“Our innovative events programme continues to grow and this year saw a record number of official events including the highly successful annual Hall of Fame Awards Ceremony, Player of the Year and 50 Championships Gala Dinner, all of which catered for up to 1000 guests.
At Rangers, we continually develop our portfolio of products and as a key area of income for the Club, we evaluate the market for new revenue opportunities on an ongoing basis in order to exceed our existing and potential customer expectations and needs.
Demand for season tickets reached an all time high last season with a record 42,508 season ticket holders in comparison with the previous season`s figure of 40,320. Over 36,000 of these season ticket holders renewed for this season – a record number.
For the new season, we are delighted to welcome brewing giant, Carling on board as our Official Club sponsor. Carling is one of the UK’s leading consumer brands with a proven track record in football sponsorship.
The Club also continues to work with a number of multinational blue chip brands such as National Car Rental, Sony Playstation 2, Bank of Scotland and Coca-Cola. This year, we will also experience the evolution of the Honda deal via Hyndland Honda and welcome the mobile communications giant T-Mobile to our ranks.”.
The year was 2003 and in the previous 24 months Rangers Football Club, owned and operated as a private fiefdom by Sir David Murray, had made operational losses of some £30 million.
Yes – 30 MILLION POUNDS.
Of course the chairman’s report for 2003 was written by John F Mclelland CBE and the CEO was one Martin Bain Esq.
As Mr Mclelland clearly stated, by 2003 the club already had a trend of increasing year on year losses covering a number of years and was losing annual sums which stretched into millions, if not tens of millions, of pounds.
However, the acquisition of Rangers Football Club was absolutely vital to David Murray’s personal business growth, and his complete control of the club as his own private business key was more important than any other business decision he had made before buying Rangers or since.
When he persuaded Gavin Masterton to finance 100% of the purchase price of the club, Murray had his finest business moment.
By getting control of Rangers, Murray was able to offer entertainment, hospitality, seeming privilege and bestow favour on others in a way that was hitherto undreamed of, and he bestowed that largesse on any number of “existing and potential clients” and contacts – be they the clients and contacts related to Rangers Football Club or the existing and potential clients of David Murray, his businesses, his banks, or anyone in any field that he chose to court for the purposes of potential business.
His business.
It wasn’t only journalists who benefited from the succulent lamb treatment.
Accountants,lawyers, surveyors, broadcasters, football officials, people in industry and construction, utilities, financiers and other areas of business were all invited inside the sacred House of Murray and given access to the great man of business “and owner of Rangers” while attending the “record number of official (hospitality) events”.
Twelve months on from when John McLelland made those statements in the 2003 accounts, David Murray was back in the chair at Ibrox and he presented the 2004 financials.
In the intervening 12 months Rangers had gained an additional £10 million from Champions League income and had received £8.6 million in transfer fees from the sale of Messrs Ferguson, Amoruso and McCann. Not only that, the Rangers board had managed to reduce the club’s wage bill by £5 million. Taking all three figures together comes to some £23.6 million in extra income or savings.
Yet, the accounts for 2004 showed that the club made an operational loss of almost £6 million and overall debt had risen by an additional £7 million to £97.4 million.
However, the 2004 accounts were also interesting for another reason.
Rangers PLC had introduced payments “to employees trusts” into their accounts for the first time in 2001 and in that year they had paid £1million into those trusts. Just three years later, the trust payments recorded in the accounts had risen to £7.3 million per annum — or to put it another way to 25% of the annual wage bill though no one in Scottish Football asked any questions about that!
By the following year, the chairman announced that the 2004 operational loss had in fact been £10.4million but that the good news was that the 2005 operational loss was only £7.8 million. However Rangers were able to post a profit before taxation if they included the money obtained from transfers (£8.4 million) and the inclusion of an extraordinary profit of £14,999,999 made on buying back the shares of a subsidiary company for £1 which they had previously sold for £15 million.
All of which added up to a whopping great profit of ……… £12.4 million!
I will leave you to do the maths on 2005.
Oh and of course these accounts included the detail that 3000 Rangers fans had joined David Murray in participating in the November ’94 share issue where the club managed to raise £51,430,995 in fresh capital most of which was provided by Mr Murray… sorry I mean MIH ….. sorry that should read Bank of Scotland …… or their shareholders……. or should that be the public purse?
The notable items in the 2006 accounts included the announcement of a ten year deal with JJB Sports to take over the merchandising operation of the club and increased revenue from an extended run in the Champion’s League. However, the profit before tax was declared at only£0.1 million in comparison to the £12.4 million of the year before but then again that £12.4 million had included player sales of £8.4 million and the £15 million sweety bonus from the repurchase of ones own former subsidiary shares for £1.
Jumping to 2008 Rangers saw a record year in terms of turnover which had risen to £64.5 million which enabled the company to record a profit on ordinary activities before taxation of £6.57 million although it should be pointed out that wages and bonuses were up at 77% of turnover and that a big factor in the Rangers income stream was corporate hospitality and the top line of income was shown as “gate receipts and hospitality”.
However, 2009 saw a calamitous set of figures. Whilst Alastair Johnston tried to put a brave chairman’s face on it, the year saw an operating loss of £17.325 million which was softened only by player disposals leading to a loss before taxation of a mere £14.085 million.
Fortunately Sir David did not have to report these figures as he chose to stand down as chairman in August and so Johnston stepped in and announced that he was deeply honoured to do so.
In 2010, the income stream jumped from £39.7 million to over £56 million with the result that the club showed a profit before taxation of £4.209 million.
However, by that time the corporate hospitality ticket that was Rangers Football Club was done for as a result of matters that had nothing to do with events on the football field in the main.
First, the emergence of the Fergus McCann run Celtic had brought a real business and sporting challenge. This was something that Murray had not previously faced in the football business.
Second,the Bank of Scotland had gone bust and Lloyds could not and would not allow Murray to continually borrow vast sums of money on the basis of revalued assets and outrageous hospitality.
Third, the UEFA fair play rules came into being and demanded that clubs at least act on a semblance of proper corporate governance and fiscal propriety.
Lastly,Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs tightened up the law on the use of EBT’s which meant that Rangers could no longer afford to buy in the players that brought almost guaranteed success against domestic opposition.
On average, since 2002 Rangers PLC had lost between £7 million – £8 million per year – or roughly £650,000 per month if you like – yet for the better part of a decade David Murray had been able to persuade the Bank of Scotland that this was a business that was worthy of ever greater financial support or that he himself and his MIH business was of such value that the Banks should support him in supporting the Ibrox club whilst operating in this fashion.
Of course, had Murray’s Rangers paid tax on all player remunerations then the losses would have been far larger.
Meanwhile, all the other clubs in Scottish football who banked with the Bank of Scotland faced funding cuts and demands for repayment with the bank publicly proclaiming that it was overexposed to the football market in Scotland.
But no one asked any questions about why the bank should act one way with Murray’s club but another way with all others. No one in football, no one in the media and no one from the world of business.
Looking back,it is hard to imagine a business which has been run on such a consistent loss making basis being allowed to continue by either its owners or by its bankers. However, a successful and funded Rangers was so important to the Murray group that David Murray was clearly willing to lose millions year after year to keep the Gala dinners and corporate hospitality going.
Rangers were Murray’s big PR vehicle and the club was essentially used by him to open the doors which would allow him to make more money elsewhere on a personal basis and if it meant Rangers cutting every corner and accumulating massive losses, unsustainable losses, then so be it.
Today, the new regime at Ibrox run the current business in a way which clocks up the same colossal annual losses whilst the club competes outwith Scotland’s top division. Each day we hear that the wage bill is unsustainable, that the playing staff are overpaid, that the stadium needs massive investment and that the fans are opposed to the stadium itself being mortgaged and the club being in hawk to lenders.
Yet, in the Murray era the Stadium was revalued time and time again and its revaluation was used as the justification for ever greater borrowing on the Rangers accounts. The playing staff were massively overpaid and financially assisted by the EBT’s and most years the Chairman’s annual statement announced huge losses despite regular claims of record season ticket sales, record hospitality income, European income, shirt sponsorship and the outsourcing of all merchandising to JJB sports instead of Sports Direct.
The comparison between the old business and the current one is clear for all to see.
It should be noted, that since the days of Murray, no major banking institution has agreed to provide the Ibrox business with any banking facilities. Not under Whyte, not under Green, not under anyone.
Yet few ask why that should be.
The destruction of the old Rangers business led those in charge of Scottish football to announce that Armageddon was on the horizon if it had not actually arrived, yet today virtually all Scottish clubs are in a better financial and business state than back in the bad old days of the Bank of Scotland financed SPL. Some have succumbed to insolvency, and others have simply cut their cloth, changed their structure, sought, and in some cases attracted, new owners and moved on in terms of business.
In general, Scottish Football has cleaned house at club level.
Now, David Murray has “cleaned house” in that MIH has bitten the dust and walked down insolvency road.
What is interesting is that the Murray brand still has that capacity to get out a good PR message when it needs to. Despite the MIH pension fund being short of money for some inexplicable reason, last week it was announced that the family controlled Murray Estates had approached those in charge of MIH and had agreed to buy some key MIH assets for something in the region of £13.9 million.
The assets concerned are land banks which at some point will be zoned for planning and which will undoubtedly bring the Murray family considerable profit in the future, with some of those assets already looking as if they will produce a return sooner rather than later.
However, what is not commented upon in the mainstream press is the fact that Murray Estates had the ability to pay £13.9 Million for anything at all and that having that amount of money to spend the Murray camp has chosen not to buy any football club down Govan way.
Perhaps, it has been realised that a football club which loses millions of pounds each year is not such a shrewd investment and that the Murray family money would be better spent elsewhere?
Perhaps, it has been realised that the culture of wining, dining, partying and entertaining to the most lavish and extravagant extent will not result in the banks opening their vaults any more?
Perhaps, it has been realised that the Rangers brand has been so badly damaged over the years that it is no longer the key to the golden door in terms of business, finance and banking and that running a football club in 2015 involves a discipline and a set of skills that David Murray and his team do not have experience of?
What is clear, is that the Murray years at Ibrox were not good for the average Rangers fan in the long term and that when you have a football club – any football club – being run for the private benefit of one rich individual, or group of individuals, then the feelings and passions of the ordinary fan will as often as not be forgotten when that individual or his group choose to move on once they have decided that they no longer wish to play with their toy football club.
David Murray did not make money directly out of Rangers Football Club. He used it as a key to open other doors for him and to get him a seat at other tables and into a different type of “club” altogether. He did not run the club in a day to day fashion that was designed to bring stability and prolonged financial, or playing, success to the club. its investors and its fans. He did not preside over Ibrox during a period of sustained financial gain.
Mike Ashley will not subsidise 2015 version of Rangers to anything like the same extent that the Bank of Scotland did in the 90’s and naughties.
However, Ashley, like Murray, will use his control of the Rangers brand to open doors for him elsewhere in the sports retail market, and he will use the Rangers contract with Sports Direct to make a handsome profit. He will also control all the advertising revenue just as he does at Newcastle. In short, Mr Ashley is only interested in The Rangers with a view to using it as a stepping stone to achieve other things elsewhere.
However, don’t take my word for any of this, take the opinion of someone who knows.
Mr Dave King is quoted today as saying the following about the current board of Directors who are in charge of the current Ibrox holding company.
“History will judge this board as one of the worst the club has ever had. There is not one individual who puts the club above personal interest.”
That is an interesting observation from a man who became a non executive director of the old Rangers holding company in 2000 and who had a front row pew for every set of accounts and all the financial statements referred to above.
Whether or not Mr King is a glib and shameless liar is a matter of South African judicial opinion. Whether or not he can spot someone who puts their own self interest ahead of the interests of Rangers Football Club and the supporters of the club is a matter that should be discussed over some fine wine, some succulent lamb and whatever postprandial entertainment you care to imagine.
I wonder if he has ever read the accounts of Rangers PLC and compared them to the corresponding accounts of MIH for the same period?
Billy Boyce says:
January 29, 2015 at 11:01 pm
In view of the OC/NC hysteria this week, I wonder why no one thought of asking The Cardigan to explain his ‘best wishes’ statement: “We wish the new Rangers Football Club every good fortune.”
===========================================================
With an attribution to Sir Walter of The Cardigan would that statement not make a very apt banner for Sunday’s game?
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
readcelt says:
January 30, 2015 at 11:37 am
3
0
Rate This
As we approach Sundays league cup semi final, with all the social issues around it, it got me thinking how you change a culture.
Ignoring it and hoping it goes away certainly isn’t the answer.
——————–
In my opinion, it’s relatively simple.
You denounce it.
I’m with you in that ignoring it and hoping it goes away isn’t productive.
But having no regard for it, denouncing it at length. Refusing to condone it, actively pursuing a new, inclusive, fair way. That’s a different matter entirely.
I have friends who support the teams playing in Glasgow at the weekend. Some will attend.
Some have taken the wise decision not to attend. They will watch it on television.
Some neutrals will also watch it on televsion.
I will not.
I will not watch it on television, I will not buy sensationalist newspapers which dog whistle the whole thing up to fever pitch, then walk away saying “it wisnae us”.
I will continue to quote the truth.
I will continue to correct mistruth.
I will continue to congratulate honest endeavour.
Cultural change is likely to be slow, but it must come. Not just for the sporting aspirations of the nation, but for the betterment of us all as a society.
Respect for one another. It’s not hard, is it ?
The day will come when people will be ashamed to remember that they actually used to espouse the “nobody likes us, we don’t care” attitude.
In time.
valentinesclown says:
January 30, 2015 at 11:53 am
“Neil Doncaster, SPFL chief executive, said: “Supporters are the lifeblood of the game in Scotland…”
When did he realise that?
Now that he realises that, when is he going to engage with the supporters in a meaningful way and answer the questions they’ve been asking for over 3 years?
Will he ever stop treating us like overgrown schoolchildren, and will he ever lose that supercilious smile when pontificating?
All these questions, and many more, won’t be answered any time soon.
James Forrest says:
January 30, 2015 at 9:49 am
_____________________________________________________________________
I find the aggressive tone in some parts of your article a bit much for me. I’d hazard a guess that any similar article coming from a Rangers perspective about how much they want to beat Celtic on Sunday would be rightly derided on here. One for the Celtic minded and can’t see what place the link has on here as TSFM is not a fan site.
Your final sentence is, ‘This reckoning will be most enjoyable for Celtic fans, but it is for all of you, and it’s long overdue’. Well, you’d be giving me something I don’t want and have no interest in receiving. On Sunday I’ll be watching the tennis and predict nothing resembling a football match will be witnessed at Hampden. I hope the game in Glasgow passes incident free and that the idiot element in both sets of supporters can behave themselves.
redlichtie says:
January 30, 2015 at 12:07 pm
Scottish football needs strong, truthful and to the point banners.
And a strong Arbroath 😀
Where do all the politicians, church leaders, community leaders and football governing bodies hide in the run up to an “Old Firm” domestic abuse fest ?
Re Imlach’s book.
It is a valuable insight to how players were treated pre Bosman. Not good.
However it is the workings of the SFA that are revealing.
The awarding of an International cap to Bob Wilson, who made one appearance for Scotland, while players who had more appearances were refused.
The 1954 World Cup in Switzerland fiasco takes some beating for gross incompetence bordering on neglect.
A must, must read for all football fans.
Players were slaves then, now, the worm has truly turned.
I’ve just had notification of a document being removed from my Scribd account due to me not having “authorization from the copyright owner”
I have no additional explanation as to who asked that the document be removed, but for the record the document was an email exchange between Deloittes Forensic and the RIFC Board on 7th/8th May 2013. The discussion point was that some of the early investors were unhappy that they paid more for their shares in TRFC than the 70p price set for the RIFC IPO and had sought compensation.
I’m sure that some other posters will know the details and potential issues (some legal) arising from the price differential and whether any subsequent payments were made.
So who is getting twitchy, and why? 😀
mcfc says:
January 30, 2015 at 11:48 am
Afternoon all.
Posted a couple of times on RTC, but then all but chucked the Fitba after LNS and “Nothing to see here, move along…”
But as the dirty bath water gets faster and faster, as it spins out of control towards the drain, I’ve been sucked back in again, appreciating the good work of poster from all sides.
The reason I registered and posted on TSFM today is, (I may be wrong, as I do skip by about 25% of posts) 😳
But reading the BBC website and dipping my toe in other MSM “news”, I get the feeling that there has been a change in the reporting of OC/NC descriptors and summary sentences at the end of pieces, since the CQN ad. ❓
What I mean is there used to be the obligatory paragraph or two at the end of each BBC report which took the time to describe what happened to RFC 1872. “relegated”, “demoted” “140 year history” “ran into financial trouble”…. As well as the other ones, “Getting back to the top” etc. 🙄
I feel as though the news reports now are tending to avoid this type of language. Sticking more to using descriptive sentences to avoid referring to any of it, and also avoiding the “OF” moniker.
Am I talking nonsense or has anyone else noticed this shift?
Has the ad had lawyer types getting nervous in the world of SMSM?
@easyjambo
didn’t Laxey get some of Monsieur Charles’ shares because of that?
tykebhoy says: January 30, 2015 at 1:03 pm
=======================
Yes. But Laxey wasn’t the complainant referenced in the email exchange.
highfibre says:
January 30, 2015 at 10:52 am
Ecobhoy,
It might be interesting to turn your knee-jerk reaction in to rather more detatched analysis.
———————————————————–
I would indeed be disappointed if my post this morning was regarded as a knee-jerk reaction. I did start a post last night but decided not to send it and had I done so that might well have been regarded as a knee-jerk reaction.
However, I did what I always try to do with a potentially contentious issue – I don’t always take my own advice unfortunately – and slept on the matter.
I slightly rewrote the post after seeing later responses to the original exchange including those by TSFM.
Wrt to a detached analysis I probably wouldn’t be the person to do that although I would hope that I could manage to be objective.
However there are many posters on here much more qualified than I to do an acceptable anlysis should they be inclined to do so.
mcfc says:
January 30, 2015 at 12:35 pm
6 1 Rate This
Where do all the politicians, church leaders, community leaders and football governing bodies hide in the run up to an “Old Firm” domestic abuse fest ?
…………………..
Sorry to be obtuse, mcfc but what is your point?
Personally, I think that those ‘types’ you mention show good judgement and wisdom in not adding to the hype. The media are building up Sunday’s event as something historically special – which it really isn’t! If it is about a desire to see them plead for calm, tolerance and good sporting behaviour etc, do you really think such appeals from people, other than respected representatives of the teams themselves, do any good?
TSFM at 9:28am
Apologies, unfortunately couldn’t resist sniping at the conspiracy theory, which distracted from the point made by the original poster. I was aware that Mr Campbell had expressed some allegiance to the two teams I named and should have just said so.
My Father and Other Working Class Football Heroes is next on my list and happy to read the positive comments about it. The author of that book, Gary Imlach, presents coverage of the Tour de France and (tenuous link) I’ve just started reading ‘The Secret Race’ which is Tyler Hamiltons account of the doping culture in cycling. He was once a teammate of Lance Armstrong and the book starts with a quote from Zola (cracking wee player….)
‘If you shut up the truth and bury it under the ground, it will but grow and gather itself such explosive power that the day it bursts through it will blow up everything in its way.’
Now, that’s a bit long to print on a t-shirt, especially if you’re paying by the letter, but it’s a quote that might be helpful to some members of the SMSM, SPFL and the SFA.
Prohibby says:
January 30, 2015 at 1:29 pm
mcfc says:
Where do all the politicians, church leaders, community leaders and football governing bodies hide in the run up to an “Old Firm” domestic abuse fest ?
…………………..
Sorry to be obtuse, mcfc but what is your point?
=======================================================
Prohibby – my point is simply that these bastions of social values are happy to lecture at length on how others should live their lives – on topics from obesity to FGM – but when it comes to domestic abuse relating to a tribal football encounter they seem – as one – unanimously – to have no opinion – none at all – can’t think of a word to say – about it being a disgraceful state of affairs, or that the commercial enterprises involved should pay the extra social costs that arise – or that UEFA & FIFA should be required to scrutinise and monitor the event closely or maybe that it should be played behind closed doors until such times as it can be attended safely by those currently most vulnerable to domestic abuse.
Yes – the people who make a good living from preaching are stuck dumb by craven cowardice on the matter. That is my point. Is that obtuse ?
Top league crowds in 2011-12
blu says:
January 30, 2015 at 1:54 pm
Top league crowds in 2011-12
—————————————-
@blu – Do the stats identify whether this is actual attendance at a game wrt Home ST holders or are they just all assumed to be in attendance?
The other thing I wonder about is whether it’s an overall attendance figure for each match which includes visiting fans. I would have thought that excluding visiting fans might give a quite different picture – but that’s me guessing.
easyJambo says:
January 30, 2015 at 12:56 pm
19 0 Rate This
If memory serves me correctly I believe the person who was making a big fuss at the time was some Australian Chap but i can’t seem to recall his name.. maybe other posters will be able to help
Thanks for replying mcfc. I can’t agree with the sweeping assertions you make. There are, no doubt, policians, churchmen and community leaders fit your stereotype but, as with many, if not, all stereotypes, I think yours gratuitously applies characteristics of the few to the many. No offence intended but it seems to me that such stereotyping tends to have its roots in prejudice, bigotry and intolerance.
Prohibby says:
January 30, 2015 at 2:19 pm
I think yours gratuitously applies characteristics of the few to the many. No offence intended but it seems to me that such stereotyping tends to have its roots in prejudice, bigotry and intolerance.
======================================================================
Point me to one politician – of any party – who has stood up and said it is unacceptable for an event to cause a spike in domestic abuse for commercial gain.
Point me to the church leaders who have stood together to say that an event that causes increased domestic abuse should be condemned as immoral..
May I remind to of SFA Disciplinary Rule 77. Is creating a solid causal link between football and domestic violence a breach of this rule ?
Disciplinary Rule 77: A recognised football body, club, official, Team Official, other member of Team Staff, player, match official or other person under the jurisdiction of the Scottish FA shall, at all times, act in the best interests of Association Football.
Perhaps you can explain in which direction you think my prejudice, bigotry and intolerance lie based on the comments above.
A lengthy take on Sunday’s game and all the “history” that proceeds by CNN. There is just about someting to upset everyone in here but the writer has had the gumption to ask some questions.
There are two jems:
Years of overspending, inept ownership and the catastrophic adoption of Employee Benefit Trusts (EBTs) — a financial vehicle designed to reduce the levels of income and national insurance tax companies pay — saw Rangers implode in spectacular fashion.
The club staggered into administration in early 2012 before winding up a matter of months later, unable to find a buyer willing to take on its imposing debts and a potentially large tax bill from outstanding court cases relating to EBT use. A tribunal later found the majority of these did not break the law although the UK tax authorities are appealing this verdict.
Liquidation saw assets like the stadium, training ground and some player contracts snapped-up by a “newco” Rangers which was then granted entry to the lowest tier of the Scottish league system.
and:
Unsurprisingly, Rangers supporters see things differently. They state their team remains the same entity as it was the company which ran the club which was liquidated and not the club itself.
The head of the Scottish Professional Football League, Neil Doncaster, stated in a BBC interview earlier this year that he agrees with the latter assessment.
However, the organization declined the opportunity to respond to requests CNN made to its public relations representatives about clarifying whether this position related solely to SPFL rules or to the stricter court of Scots Law as well.
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/index.html?eref=edition&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Prohibby says:
January 30, 2015 at 2:19 pm
I have to agree with mcfc, I haven’t seen too much comment from the “community leaders” denouncing the dreadful deeds that have historically been part and parcel of the so-called old firm match days.
Now admittedly that could in large part be due to the media being in too much of a lather about telling us all how wonderful it is to bother reporting on any brave souls that dare to stick their heads above the parapets to suggest that it isn’t all that. Alas, I’m not so sure.
As neutral axis says (January 30, 2015 at 12:12 pm), the only way to deal with the nasty side of the culture surrounding the “old firm” is to denounce. I don’t hear enough of that going on. I hear sneering comments and wee boy style giggling, almost poking fun at the more sinister side of things from many commentators – acknowledging they are well aware what goes on but completely failing to face up to it, let alone come out and say how distasteful it is.
Hell it even comes into the “football” itself, comments such as “this will be a tasty encounter/a few meaty challenges/nobody will back down in this game” and the one that really gets my goat “the referee will have to be more lenient than normal today” WHY!? Why should he be more lenient, is it ok to behave like a thug when you are in royal blue faced by a man in green hoops (or vice versa)??!
Oh, and I can’t speak for mcfc, but I would be offended by your last line, whether you intended to cause offence or not! I wouldn’t have bothered replying until I read that. To accuse mcfc of “prejudice, bigotry and intolerance” in his comment. Sigh….
UpForTheCup says:
January 30, 2015 at 1:00 pm
But reading the BBC website and dipping my toe in other MSM “news”, I get the feeling that there has been a change in the reporting of OC/NC descriptors and summary sentences at the end of pieces, since the CQN ad. ❓
=======================================================
It’s an interesting situation. The CQN advert account of “club” has passed rigorous lawyer scrutiny, including those of the Sunday Herald. Note that this is scrutiny in Scottish law – not in LNS paid tribunal opinion. It is notable that the ad has not been referred to the Advertisiing Standards Agency by any party on any point. So any contradictory “club” statements in the MSM would be out on a limb without similar legal rigour – which may or may not be financially viable – and may or may not be legally advisable. So it would be logical to see sloppy or conflicted MSM hacks staying well away from the new C word.
Bizarrely, the Scottish legal profession have spoken on the OCNC issue by means of paid advertising – not the high tension civil court case many thought would be necessary to settle the matter.
Tincks says:
January 30, 2015 at 2:43 pm
“However, the organization declined the opportunity to respond to requests CNN made to its public relations representatives about clarifying whether this position?? related solely to SPFL rules or to the stricter court of Scots Law as well.”
That paragraph strikes me as the very thing many of us, myself included, have been looking for, demanding even, throughout this whole badly reported saga, for the MSM to not only ask the awkward questions, but to tell us whenever these questions go unanswered.
We know what the honest answer to that particular awkward question would be. We know why they refuse to answer it.
mcfc says:
January 30, 2015 at 3:08 pm
There have been 17 complaints to the ASA following publication of the ad in the Sunday Herald. It will be interesting to see what the ASA says in response to the complaints. From the reports, everyone (CQN, the Sunday Herald, the ASA, the polis) all seem to have done their homework quite thoroughly.
My apologies mcfc, I had no intention to offend you but rather invite you to recognise stereotyping and from there investigate where the stereotyping comes from. I do regret that you think I am suggesting you are prejudiced, bigoted and intolerant. You may be but I am in no position to make that accusation. I do believe though that any and each one of us has our own prejudices and intolerances. I clearly include myself in that belief.
The trouble I find with your argument is that I want to believe that most people who try to contribute to our society do so out of a good measure of goodness. Sure, there will be many who on occasion – even habitually – display an inclination to pursue things for their own personal interest and benefit. Such is human nature! When that is seen to happen, people have to be challenged but it is just wrong to tar everyone with the same brush, in my opinion.
I don’t follow the lives, behaviour and antics of the groups you refer to and I have insufficient knowledge and inclination to attempt to answer the challenging questions you pose. I will say, however, that none of the church leaders, democratically elected politicians and community leaders that I have come across have ever expressed tolerance of domestic abuse. I am a regular church goer and I frequently hear exhortations to live my life in a way that respects others and does them no harm. When prominent religious leaders of most religions in this society meet and speak together, they thankfully nowadays, speak a message of tolerance and love and repudiate violence and harm to others.
Esteban says:
January 30, 2015 at 3:34 pm
There have been 17 complaints to the ASA following publication of the ad in the Sunday Herald. It will be interesting to see what the ASA says in response to the complaints. From the reports, everyone (CQN, the Sunday Herald, the ASA, the polis) all seem to have done their homework quite thoroughly.
=======================================================================
Thanks for that – I wasn’t aware – is it possible to assess them – they would make in good bedtime reading 🙂
ecobhoy says:
January 30, 2015 at 2:03 pm
And that was my point earlier, can you trust the attendance figures from some clubs.
It becomes more complex trying to sort out the effects of visiting fans and also Blu’s figures only includes the top flight, my link was for 5 leagues, though I don’t know what 5 they were!!!
Given the clubs are all under one organisation I would argue the whole SPFL fan base should be included in any analysis.
Looking at my link other countries with high percentages watching the top two clubs, such as Portugal, Greece, Uruguay they probably do not attract fans for neighbouring associations and countries so one could argue the Celtic and Rangers fan bases will be slightly bolstered by fans travelling from further afield when compared to fans of the other clubs who rely on a more local fan base. The same could be said for Man Utd and other big English clubs.
I still think the overall split will vary but still be close to ‘the Rest’ being at 50% mark and Celtic given the current situation being higher than Rangers in their split. However it is not going to vary greatly that it is worth getting one’s knicker in a twist over a few percentage points.
Prohibby, I think there is a difference between what you are taking about i.e. those people NOT supporting intolerance, violence etc(obviously a good thing that they don’t)and what MCFC is talking about i.e. them proactively coming out and saying that this upcoming match is a bad thing because it causes all of those things. It would be brave and good of them to do so in public. I know I’d respect them more for doing that than just talking about it in whatever small groups you hear them talk about it.
Prohibby says:
January 30, 2015 at 3:41 pm
My apologies mcfc, I had no intention to offend you but rather invite you to recognise stereotyping and from there investigate where the stereotyping comes from.
======================================================================
Apologies not needed, no offence taken
But I stand by my point that in the frenzy being encouraged by the media, clubs, former players and football authorities – political and religious leaders have a duty to go beyond good intentions and show courage in voicing their objections to a money-making event that is unacceptable, immoral, and unethical in terms of domestic abuse – not to mention street violence – and the burden on stressed public services. As I said in my initial comments, which other city in the UK would accept this – so why Glasgow – what is lacking in Glasgow’s and Scotland’s leaders?
“The only thing needed for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing”, Edmund Burke
The rest of us make up about 40-50% of the fitba support in Scotland which is reason enough for me to have no major issue with the bias of reporting on the game in general, and of course the semis this weekend, to tend towards two clubs. But it’s pretty much 100% unless you delve past the lead stories and to add insult to injury the “reporting” consists almost entirely of old firm legends spouting mince. Is all this a surprise, is it something novel reflecting a meeting of the old enemies that has stirred the emotions? Nae really. To be blunt if Celtic were playing Berwick Rangers it would be the same. As the golden rule in Scottish fitba is never to criticise/praise one without criticising/praising the other, I have to add it would be the same if Rangers were playing Elgin City, in both cases the Dons/Arabs “armageddon” semi would nary get a mention. That’s the nature of the Scottish Media and something we could work on but is unlikely to be a priority. There is a lot of hype around the Sunday semi but let’s be honest, it’s business as usual for the rest of us as far as reporting goes. 30,000 plus Dons and Arab fans will go down to the game in spite of the coverage and in spite of the SFA/SPFL writing off Scottish fitba outside the gruesome twosome. Nothing new there, we’ll be fine.
Only the old firm (or whatever you want to call them) needs the old firm (or whatever you want to call them).
mcfc, here is the CQN statement re: the 17 ASA complaints.
http://www.cqnmagazine.com/celtic-su…mplain-to-asa/
CELTIC SUPPORTERS’ STATEMENT – 17 COMPLAIN TO ASA
By cqn on 30th January 2015 Football Matters
SEVENTEEN people have complained to the Advertising Standards Authority over the Statement from Celtic Supporters which appeared in the Sunday Herald on January 25th 2015. The statement set the agenda in the week leading up to the first ever meeting between Celtic and the successor Rangers club, created by Charles Green in 2012 following the liquidation of Rangers FC.
Before accepting the advertisement, which was paid for by crowd funding on the Celticquicknews.co.uk, the newspaper consulted with their own lawyers, provided the copy for guidance to The Committees of Advertising Practice (CAP) and (with the Celtic Supporters’ consent) provided a copy to Police Scotland and indeed to the two football clubs with dates of incorporation in 1888 and 2012 respectively.
The Statement from Celtic Supporters has received extensive media coverage, with the Scottish media choosing to ask opinions regarding the placing of the advertisement and seeking ex-players’ views on whether they regard Rangers to be a new club or not, rather than address the content of the statement or indeed the need for a group of supporters to have to “club” together to bring the facts regarding the liquidation of Rangers and the resultant club continuation myth to a wider audience.
It should also be remembered that all these newspapers carried extensive coverage in the summer of 2012 on the demise of Rangers FC, with front page headlines like RANGERS RIP.
Now with these 17 objections being made to ASA, the content of the Statement from Celtic Supporters (which cost less than all reported figures) can be scrutinised.
It has to be noted that several media outlets, including Daily Mirror, actually re-produced an incorrect early draft of the Statement which was completely different from the final version that appeared in the Sunday Herald. This early draft quoted ex Rangers vice- Chairman Donald Findlay who in November 2014 admitted that he regarded the club currently playing at Ibrox as a ‘new entity’.
CQN Magazine understands that The Committees of Advertising Practice (CAP) advised that the following text within the Statement from Celtic Supporters “appeared to be acceptable” as it is “likely to be regarded as a matter of opinion.”
“The Old Firm. It is our view that this term is now redundant due to the liquidation of Rangers (1872).”
CAP continued with their guidance given to Sunday Herald by making the following points:
“All other claims in this copy are presented as factual. Consumers are likely to be regard these claims as objective and therefore, the advertiser will need to hold documentary evidence to support them. In particular the advertiser should be able to prove the following:
– “Upon incorporation into a limited company, the officers of Rangers Football Club signed up to and adopted a set of Memorandum and Articles of Association which stated clearly that the Rangers Football Club and the new limited company was to be regarded as one and the same legal entity.”
– “For well over 100 years, all football authorities in Scotland, and indeed Europe, accepted that Rangers Football Club and Rangers PLC – as the incorporated private limited company would eventually become – were one and the same legal person and club, and all Scottish Football authorities over a prolonged period of time accepted and endorsed contracts of employment and other legal documents which stated that Rangers Football Club and the limited company it had become were one and the same.”
– “To be clear, there was no transfer of SFA membership between Rangers (1872) and The Rangers (2012) but a completely fresh application for membership by the new club and at no time did Rangers 1872 and Rangers 2012 hold one uninterrupted membership of the SFA.”
Accordingly The Sunday Herald, which is owned by Newsquest Media Group, requested and received from the advertiser all relevant documents. These documents were reviewed by the legal team at the Sunday Herald and were deemed to be acceptable. Accordingly the newspaper decided to proceed with the booking of the advertising space, having gone through an extensive checking process and due diligence on the content of the Statement from Celtic Supporters.
Police Scotland, who had requested a copy of the advertisement, raised no objections. Neither club commented, although the final copy of the Statement was subsequently leaked to a Rangers fans forum two days before publication in the Sunday Herald. Any party benefiting from the courtesy of advance sight of this Statement could have gone to court to prevent or delay publication if the Sunday Herald refused such a request. No such request was made. No such court action was taken. The media, as mentioned above, have turned away from challenging the facts set out in the Statement from Celtic Supporters, no doubt aware that there position in 2012 was completely at odds with the club continuation myth they endorse today.
It will be interesting to see how ASA responds to the 17 complaints they have received, with some Celtic supports already claiming that those who peddle and support the club continuation myth have taken the bait set in the Celtic Supporters Statement.
The Sunday Herald appears to have benefited from this episode with huge exposure and reports of the newspaper selling out and a large number copies being posted all over the world to those interested in reading the truth.
.
Tincks says:
January 30, 2015 at 2:43 pm
However, the organization declined the opportunity to respond to requests CNN made to its public relations representatives about clarifying whether this position related solely to SPFL rules or to the stricter court of Scots Law as well.
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/index.html?eref=edition&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
—————————————————————-
Tbf to the SPFL there hasn’t been a Scots Law civil court decision on the issue so they can’t actually make that comparison. However they are being their usual slippery self by not making that clear as it would strip away that sham legal facade of legitimacy accorded to the LNS Hearing.
If this had been a court case the amount of evidence suppression which has now come to light along with the pre-Hearing guarantees of no-title stripping would lead to an immediate retrial.
And as to Bryson well how can his expert evidence be regarded as credible. But we must remember that his position simply wasn’t challenged before LNS by the SPFL lawyer.
His evidence didn’t come out of the blue and would have been well known about beforehand but it went basically unchallenged.
And of course there was no written transcript produced – making it all the harder to prove engineering of the evidence to arrive at the desired result which IMO had been determined by the SPFL before LNS began his deliberations.
Nawlite, the point you make is very reasonable and fair. There is a ‘but’ though, do you really think a statement from say the Archbishop of Glasgow stating that the upcoming match was a bad thing for whatever reason, would be well received? Allow me to be a bit cynical when I say that, ante factum, those who would be inclined to listen to and heed such a call from their religious, political or community leaders, are unlikely to be the ones likely to abuse in the first place but yes, such a call would not go amiss. Unfortunately, religious leaders tend not to be heard beyond their immediate congregations when they speak on such subjects.
Prohibby – completely agree that such a statement would almost certainly go directly over the heads of those that are most likely to cause the problems.
However, that isn’t an excuse for the continued silence from those in positions of power/responsibility.
Anyway, I wish all and everyone a peaceful weekend.
I hope for the best for the reds on Saturday, but mostly for a weekend to be remembered for great sporting occasions (including from down under).
I would think that in a lot of cases the good and bad baggage that goes along with an ‘old firm’ game is replicated among other clubs albeit on a much smaller scale.
People who go to games, get fueled with drink and break the law, whether on the streets or at home would likely find an outlet for their violence regardless of whether this fixture existed.
The individuals are the problem and I expect they, like dinosaurs, will eventually become extinct. Education is the answer.
Allyjambo says:
January 30, 2015 at 12:19 pm
28 0 Rate This
redlichtie says:
January 30, 2015 at 12:07 pm
Scottish football needs strong, truthful and to the point banners.
And a strong Arbroath 😀
======================================
No matter what banners Celtic fans bring to the semi final this weekend I fully expect the media hacks to all be salivating at the prospect and are no doubt preparing their mock outrage pieces as speak.
Indeed if their is some trouble at or around the ground I would not be surprised in the least to see the newspapers brush over this and focus instead on how some banner or other was really to blame.
After all this is what some in our media have done over the years. Certain clubs and fans are treated with kids gloves and if there exists even the most tenuous route to blame everyone else then it will be taken by these shameless hacks.
As for banners, I think something simple would work very well, and avoid (as much as possible, see above) giving any room for mock outrage from the usual muppets.
If TRFC reach the Premiership in the near future without some healing of the open sores created in our game then I can see banners causing controversy at every Premiership ground in the country for that whole first season.
My simple suggestion which surely cannot even cause mock offense?
“Truth”
That’s what we all need to face up to and accept, its what we all deserve to finally hear from all the shysters in our game today. And its what the media desperately need to get back in touch with.
Could even be accompanied by Alexander Eberts “Truth” on the playlists of clubs across the land.
Billy Boyce says:
January 30, 2015 at 4:16 pm
mcfc, here is the CQN statement re: the 17 ASA complaints.
http://www.cqnmagazine.com/celtic-su…mplain-to-asa/
CELTIC SUPPORTERS’ STATEMENT – 17 COMPLAIN TO ASA
By cqn on 30th January 2015 Football Matters
…
The Sunday Herald appears to have benefited from this episode with huge exposure and reports of the newspaper selling out and a large number copies being posted all over the world to those interested in reading the truth.
==========================================================
Again, if the Sunday Herald made significantly extra sales with the CQN advert included, shirley this is anecdotal evidence that there is indeed a gap to be filled by the print media for more honest reporting.
I’m not suggesting that the Herald becomes pro-CFC, but that it provides more balanced, and factually correct sports reporting.
And if the Herald doesn’t take the opportunity, then another newspaper could ?
It must be worth a punt in a declining print media industry ? :slamb:
On reading the CQN piece about the advert I suddenly remembered my Sunday Herald which my son had bought for me and left on the hall table. I went to get it and it had gone!
After a quick search it turned out that my recycling crazy partner had put it in the paper bin not realising the significance. Panic and a trudge through the snow and a rake through the bin unearthed the treasure. Panic for a few minutes.
And there it was so it’s now in its Rightful Place in my study and, of course, I’m being told it was all my fault 🙄
My boy said that the first shop he went to was sold out and he had to go to a supermarket to get one. Defo one for the scrapbook 😎
MaBaw says:
January 30, 2015 at 4:33 pm
The individuals are the problem and I expect they, like dinosaurs, will eventually become extinct. Education is the answer.
——————————————————————
Yes but not just of the agressors. It still seems that some police officers and even some police authorities still need to be re-educated to accept violence within the home is actually a crime and not an inconvenience simply to be downplayed and written-off as a ‘domestic’ and hardly worth the effort of filling in the paperwork.
Billy Boyce says:
January 30, 2015 at 4:16 pm
======================================================================
Thanks – as Esteban says, it looks like CQN and others have done this properly and professionally. I was interested in reading the individual complaints to see what points they make – but can’t find a list on the ASA website – the best I found was this FAQ which doesn’t address it.
http://www.asa.org.uk/News-resources/FAQs/Dealing-with-complaints-FAQs.aspx
ecobhoy says:
January 30, 2015 at 4:40 pm
My boy said that the first shop he went to was sold out and he had to go to a supermarket to get one. Defo one for the scrapbook 😎
=========================================================================
Sounds like that first Charlie Hebdo issue after the massacre – how many re-prints will the Sunbday Herald need to do 🙂
I thought this had some relevance and was fairly interesting.
http://news.stv.tv/west-central/308290-high-profile-scottish-football-figures-in-sweat-over-tax-avoidance-scheme/
A compelling reason to support the return of the ‘Old Firm’…to suit a major Scottish football sponsor ? 🙁
“SUNDAY’S OLD Firm clash looks set to break Scottish football betting records according to Ladbrokes.
The bookies forecast over £10 million will ride on the outcome of the League Cup semi final across the industry…”
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/old-firm-return-break-scottish-5074013
Maybe the Herald might run the advert again this Sunday for free,if it made them a lot of sales last week and ran out,now that would be interesting.
I remember the first time I saw the Walter Smith/ Chick Young interview.
Stunned doesn’t begin to describe it, bullying pure and simple.
This by a man universally respected in Scottish football? Have none of them seen it?
If Walter Smith had remained at Dundee Utd or been somewhere other than Rangers would he stiil be held in such high esteem by the press after that incident?
Celtic head into the match as 4/11 favourites to settle the tie in 90 minutes, with Rangers 7/1 to take the spoils in normal time, with those long odds not enough to put off one Glasgow-based punter who has £10k riding on the outsiders.
…………………….
Was it Black or Simonsen ?
No Walter.
Scottish Football really hasn’t missed T’Rangers presence. You couldn’t be more wrong.
(BBC National News, 6.00)
Banished down to the lower leagues according to the English reporter.
Not “graciously allowed to restart, in spite of their crimes.” As he should have said.
Keep telling the truth people. Don’t allow it to be overwritten.
Same story different spin from our Scottish recorders of truth
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/roy-keane-alleged-road-rage-5073464
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2933346/Former-Manchester-United-captain-Roy-Keane-investigated-alleged-road-rage-row-taxi-driver.html
neutralaxis says:
January 30, 2015 at 6:28 pm
______________________________________________________
“It is good for Scottish football because everyone all over the world will be watching and hopefully we can put on a show for them,” he said. “Do we miss Rangers? Yes, on occasions like this.”
Looks like Scott Brown has missed them. Another tiresome comment from the almost endless list of Celtic people talking up this fixture. They just don’t get it. The Celtic fans that placed an advert in the Sunday Herald get it. Shame the Celtic captain doesn’t.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/31053942
I thought the STV News At 6 was particularly, shall we say, poor tonight.
It fell just short of having the whole 30 mins live from Hampden
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/
CNN’s view on Sunday’s game.
Matty Roth says: January 30, 2015 at 5:08 pm
I thought this had some relevance and was fairly interesting.
http://news.stv.tv/west-central/308290-high-profile-scottish-football-figures-in-sweat-over-tax-avoidance-scheme/
========================
Apparently Aberdeen’s Stewart Milne confirmed earlier today that he had repaid the tax relief he received.
andygraham.66 says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:15 pm
2 0 Rate This
It fell just short of having the whole 30 mins live from Hampden
=========================
Kenny McDowall wouldn’t let them film it in his living-room. Hampden was the second choice…
incredibleadamspark says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:02 pm
I don’t agree with you I’m afraid. It’s unrealistic 48 hours before the game for any Celtic player to say anything else. It’s leadership from the club, from the executives who run the Scottish game we require to say something.Targeting guys like Scott Brown is just too easy.
Additionally, the propaganda from both print & broadcast media has been overwhelming & I have to confess, it thoroughly pisses me off, especially all these corporate lackeys & ex players on behalf of tv & betting companies alike, telling the world they speak for all Celtic fans……..they don’t
So, plenty of people to blame for the rubbish that this fixture generates, but Scott Brown isn’t one of them, and besides which can you just imagine the permarage if he came out & said, “I don’t recognise the team we’re playing & there is no o*d f*rm”
Bloody riots in the streets 😡
According to Boylesports, Berwick Rangers are playing at Hampden on Sunday.
Is this the unseen F**** Hand or do they know something we don,t?
( Scroll to bottom)
http://www.boylesports.com/betting/football/scotland/league-cup/matches/celtic-v-rangers/?navigationid=23.1,293.1,993.1,7326.1&moremarket=4331239.1,25187.1
Nice to see decent journalists from CNN asking real questions and proof of Neil Doncaster’s recent statement on the same club myth. Put the hacks in our country to shame.
More good news for real football fans!
Motherwell FC and the Well Society are today (Friday) delighted to announce that Les Hutchison has completed his takeover of the club.
John Boyle’s majority shareholding has been transferred to Mr Hutchison, who is providing working capital to enable the Club to become one of the best run community owned football clubs in Scotland.
Mr Hutchison’s input is in the form of an initial substantial then subsequent interest-free loans, which are repayable over a five-year period. The total sum required will be finalised over the coming months.
The ‘Well Society has committed to helping the club with any repayments it cannot meet and will assume control of the club if and when the loans are paid off within the five-year period.
The ‘Well Society has also loaned the club £190,000 over the past two months.
Mr Hutchison has met with all the players andstaff at Fir Park in recent days and a detailed business plan was ratified at a meeting of the new board this afternoon.
‘Well Society Chairman Brian McCafferty will now also Chair the club board. Jim McMahon and Derek Weir also remain as directors.
Three new directors have been appointed – Ian Reid, Peter Kellie and Leanne Thomas, who is Mr Hutchison’s daughter.
All three are from the local area and have been nominated by the new owner to help transform the business across various areas of the Club.
Mr Hutchison said: “I’m very pleased today that we have begun this new chapter of Motherwell Football Club’s history.
“Hopefully we can change the agenda of the club. By my involvement it is now more of a philanthropic and community-based activity.
“The objective and the agreement that is in place with the fans is that in five years or less we make the improvements that are needed at the club, that we move it into the position of being financially self-funded and then migrate the ownership to the ‘Well Society.
“I am extremely pleased with the Community Trust which operates from the Club, who assist some 35,000 local people in all sorts of ways such as kids at school, teens into football, ladies football, basketball and walking football for people my age. Some great work I am keen to encourage and support.
“During the time I am not taking any money out of the Club and none of the directors are taking any money.”
Mr Hutchison has appealed to Motherwell fans to back the project any way they can, for example by considering using the club’s facilities for functions.
“The clear message which has to go to fans and sponsors and to everybody associated with the club and community is that this project will not succeed without their active involvement,” he said.
“If we can have lots and lots of people involved in a small way then we can achieve our objectives.”
Motherwell FC Chairman Brian McCafferty added: “I would like to thank Les Hutchison for his generous loan and for providing his expertise and other resources to help transform the club’s financial fortunes.
“We also owe John Boyle a huge debt of gratitude for facilitating the move towards fan ownership. He has selflessly put the club and fans before his own interests.
“And everyone who has contributed to the ‘Well Society should feel very proud today – you have all played a significant role in keeping the club in the hands of the community.
“The ‘Well Society now has a central role in the running of the club and a clear route to ownership and we encourage allMotherwell fans to help us achieve that goal.
“I’m honoured to be taking on my new role and look forward to a bright new future which engages supporters and the wider community.”
John Boyle’s sixteen-year control at Motherwell Football Club has now formally come to an end. In addition, Andrew Wilson, Stewart Robertson, Graham Barnstaple and John Swinburne are stepping down from the Motherwell board to pave way for the new directors.
Everyone at Fir Park would like to acknowledge the terrific contribution all five gentlemen have made and thank them for their efforts over the decades of combined service.
Cygnus X-1 says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:26 pm
__________________________________________________________________
I take your point and a level of careful diplomacy would have been required but I think the criticism is justified. He could’ve played a straight bat and said something like, ‘I can’t remember the last time we played them but it’s a semi final and a big match and these fixtures get a lot of attention from the fans and the media. People are looking forward to it and hopefully it’ll be a good game.’
Perhaps wishful thinking on my part. There would’ve been nothing controversial about something like that. His comments and that of the many Celtic people, and others, deserve to be called out for what they are – Sometimes an insult to our intelligence and other times just plain wrong. On this occasion, in my view, Browns comments were both.
Maybe a bit harsh but when a group of your own fans feel they have to put their hands in their own pocket in order to express their opinion, if it were me, I’d be very disapointed with my captain right now.
Bill1903 says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:17 pm
1 0 Rate This
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/
CNN’s view on Sunday’s game.
——————————————–
Thanks for that Bill. I read the report and whilst it discusses in generalities, it’s just refreshing to get an external perspective. It got something’s wrong (IMO), historically in the west, Catholics weren’t inclined to vote SNP/independence and felt better protected in the UK (lesser of two evils I was told); what happened in NI couldn’t possibly happen here if part of mainland UK – was the thinking.
Then I watched the video……………. It just hit me like a hammer. Why the f— have we put up with this? This is absolutely shameful and reflects on all of us, our whole society.
I’m utterly ashamed. Politicians and the police play the game where they don’t move on the issue preferring society works it out eventually – they don’t lose votes or get grief that way. Meanwhile we’re all afflicted by this rotten cancerous pish.
It really is time to kill this stone dead.
incredibleadamspark says:
January 30, 2015 at 8:04 pm
Fair enough, but when we consider all the politics, hubris, propaganda & coercion that surrounds this game, not to mention the downright danger of saying anything controversial,I think it’s unrealistic to land that on any football player two days before the game……especially,particularly a Celtic player
Other people(and we know who they are) should be stepping up to the plate firstly to denounce this fixture.
And chapeau to the Celtic fans for their letter to the Herald for being such gallant pioneers in this matter as well 😎
Cygnus X-1 says:
January 30, 2015 at 8:29 pm
_________________________________________________________________
I know it’s maybe a lot to ask and I’m probably being a bit too harsh on Brown. The SMSM don’t have a great record in reporting accurately or responsibly. Controversy sells newspapers.
weeman says:
January 30, 2015 at 8:02 pm
_________________________________________________________________
Fantastic news for Motherwell and its fans. So we now have Hamilton who are a well run, youth orientated club producing its own players (and staff) and selling them on for a tidy sum. Aberdeen and Dundee Utd shedding their debt and producing the goods on the park, with a number of home grown players too. Every other club in the premiership appears to be well run and attendances are up at a number of clubs too. And with over 20 games played 6 points separate the top 4 teams. The national team isn’t doing to bad either.
Can someone explain to me what the problem is? Seriously.
Bill1903 says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:17 pm
4 0 Rate This
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/
CNN’s view on Sunday’s game.
———-
The SPFL declined to talk to CNN? How odd. A free shot at promoting Scottish football worldwide. And what an opportunity to broadcast the myth to a global audience! Is Neil D. now a little unsure of his stance?
easyJambo says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:21 pm
5 0 Rate This
Matty Roth says: January 30, 2015 at 5:08 pm
I thought this had some relevance and was fairly interesting.
http://news.stv.tv/west-central/308290-high-profile-scottish-football-figures-in-sweat-over-tax-avoidance-scheme/
========================
Apparently Aberdeen’s Stewart Milne confirmed earlier today that he had repaid the tax relief he received.
========================
I read that as well.
I’m not sure what to make of that, should we credit someone for doing the right thing AFTER they are caught?
Doesn’t seem morally right to me that wealthy people choose to avoid paying tax at every turn. Even if it is legal due to some loophole or other.
But what do I know.
incredibleadamspark says:
January 30, 2015 at 8:48 pm
———————–
What’s wrong?
Really tempted but naw.
Ok what’s wrong. A club playing out of ibrox aren’t lording it over all the rest of Scottish football perchance :irony:
I was listening to Hawksby and Jacobs on the car radio talk to Gordon Smith about the forthcoming game.
The former talked about the match as a spectacle, the crowd and the passion and how it was so attractive to a world audience and how that audience missed it.
I was reminded of the Romans pouring into the Colosseum to watch the Gladiators v The Lions hoping the lions would win but if they did not there would still be lots of blood and thunder.
Is that all Scottish football is to the world? A reflection of a society that goes to war with itself 4 to 6 times a season and the football is only an excuse?
If that type of match was happening every time there was a London derby bringing out the worst in people the same folk would be demanding the games were stopped.
Oh Gordon Smith was all for games continuing. No surprise there from another incompetent Murray placeman.
Apologies for the long post, but I thought the SFA / SPFL might want to have a wee look for inspiration. If wee diddy amateur sports clubs can manage this process, I’m sure a national regulator with the best administrator in the world could have a go.
Fit and proper persons helpsheet and declaration
Who is this helpsheet for?
This helpsheet and the model declaration are for use by ‘managers’ of a charity,
Community Amateur Sports Club (CASC) or other organisation entitled to UK
charity tax reliefs. The term ‘managers’ applies to the trustees of charities,
directors of corporate charities, directors of corporate trustees, CASC officials
and any other persons having general control and management over the running
of the charity or the application of its assets. For example:
• In a typical small local charity a manager for the purposes of the fit and proper
persons test could include the Chairperson, Treasurer, Secretary and the rest
of the management committee who would have control over expenditure.
• In a larger charity a manager for the purposes of the fit and proper persons
test would include all trustees or directors of a corporate charity but may also
extend to certain employees who are able to determine how a significant
proportion of the charity’s funds are spent. For example, most large charities
have a Board of Trustees and an Executive Board of senior employees. In
such a case the trustees and members of the Executive Board would be
managers of the charity.
If you are a ‘manager’ of a charity you should read this helpsheet and, if
appropriate, sign a declaration based on the model below. You can use the
model declaration below or copy the wording onto your own stationery. The
charity, CASC or other organisation entitled to charity tax reliefs should keep the
signed declaration in case HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) ask to see it. The
signed form should not be sent to HMRC unless HMRC asks to see it.
Why is there a ‘fit and proper persons’ test?
The ‘fit and proper persons’ test is a statutory requirement. The test requires that
individuals who are ’managers’ of the charity, CASC or other organisation are ’fit
and proper persons’ to be managers of such a body. It exists to ensure that
charities, CASCs and other organisations entitled to charity tax reliefs are not
managed or controlled by individuals who might misuse the tax reliefs the
organisation receives. Unfortunately fraudsters have been known to exploit
charity tax reliefs so the fit and proper persons test exists to help prevent that.
What does ‘fit and proper’ mean? A individual is ‘a fit and proper person’ if they ensure, or are likely to
ensure, that charity funds and tax reliefs are used only for charitable
purposes.
In signing a declaration like the one below you are confirming that you will ensure
that funds are used for charitable purposes and also disclosing certain
information about your past that may impact on whether or not you are indeed ‘a
fit and proper person’. When a charity notifies HMRC of certain new managers,
HMRC cross-checks that person’s details against any information it has and will
raise any concerns it has if there is anything to indicate the person may misuse
the charity funds and tax reliefs. Factors that may lead to HMRC deciding that an
individual manager is not a fit and proper person include where:
• the individual has been involved in tax fraud or other fraudulent behaviour
including misrepresentation and/or identity theft
• HMRC has knowledge of the individual’s involvement in attacks against, or
abuse of, tax repayment systems
• the individual has used a tax avoidance scheme featuring charitable reliefs
or using a charity to facilitate the avoidance
• the individual has been involved in designing and /or promoting tax
avoidance schemes
• the individual has been barred from acting as a charity trustee by a charity
regulator or Court, or has been disqualified from acting as a company
director.
However, just because a person has been, say, barred from acting as a charity
trustee or one of the other points above applies, it does not always follow that the
charity will not be eligible for tax reliefs. When considering the application of the
fit and proper persons test to particular managers, HMRC will take account of the
likely impact on the charity’s tax position. For example any person who has no
dealings with HMRC and no control over spending charity funds, even if the
person is not a fit and proper person, is unlikely to affect the charity’s eligibility to
tax reliefs.
What do I need to do?
• If you are confident you will do your best to ensure that charity funds and
tax reliefs are used only for charitable purposes and do not need to
disclose any information listed on the declaration then you should sign a
declaration and give it to the charity.
• If you are confident you will do your best to ensure that charity funds and
tax reliefs are used only for charitable purposes but you do need to
disclose any information listed on the declaration then you should sign the declaration suitably amended – for example by crossing out the relevant
bullet point – and provide details in the final box before you give the
declaration to the charity. The charity will then need to decide what to do.
If neither of the above applies you should not sign the declaration.
I’ve signed the declaration so what happens next?
The charity will keep the declaration and in certain cases pass your details to
HMRC. If HMRC have any concerns about you they will contact you to clarify the
situation.
Model declaration for fit and proper persons
Declaration
Name of organisation in full……………………………………………………………
Name of individual………………………………………………………………………
Role in the organisation………………………………………………………………..
I, the undersigned, declare that:
• I am not disqualified from acting as a charity trustee
• I have not been convicted of an offence involving deception or dishonesty (or any
such conviction is legally regarded as spent)
• I have not been involved in tax fraud or other fraudulent behaviour including
misrepresentation and/or identity theft
• I have not used a tax avoidance scheme featuring charitable reliefs or
using a charity to facilitate the avoidance
• I have not been involved in designing and /or promoting tax avoidance
schemes
• I am not an undischarged bankrupt
• I have not made compositions or arrangements with my creditors from which I
have not been discharged
• I have not been removed from serving as a charity trustee, or been stopped from
acting in a management position within a charity
• I have not been disqualified from serving as a Company Director • I will at all times seek to ensure the charity’s funds, and charity tax reliefs
received by this organisation, are used only for charitable purposes
Signed…………………………………………………………………………………………….
Date……………………………………………………………………………………………….
Home address…………………………………………………………………………………..
…………………………………………………………………………………………………….
Previous address if moved in past 12 months ………………………………………………
…………………………………………………………………………………………………….
Date of birth………………………………………………………………………………………
National Insurance number ……………………………………………………………………
National Identity Card Number (If you have one)….………………………………………..
If you have signed this declaration but want to make any information known or clarify any
points please add them in the space below.
Oh, P.S. hope for safe semi finals for all fans this weekend, and good luck to the Dons!
Tailothebank
Re PM. My last response was 28 Jan. I have resent but if you had a follow up I did not get it.
I note for the first time in year’s we have BBC coverage on the national news of Scottish fitba.
Pathetic.
Ditto BBC Scotland no mention of the Well news or signings.
Scott Brown’s belief that the entire planet will be watching his match, this weekend, makes Charles Green seem like a master of understatement. I’m assuming the quote on here is accurate (I’ve been caught out before 😳 )
If there are concerns about civil disorder this weekend, people may have been reassured by the sight of an armoured, military, reconnaissance vehicle in Glasgow city centre this morning. Clearly prepped for the desert ‘theatre’, the unit may have been on the look out for rowdy Dundee United fans. Weird. It used to be police horses for crowd control, now it’s grenade launchers?Don’t tell Fox News!
I agree with the comment above that the Walter Smith/Chic Young clip is an unpleasant example of bullying. I’m not a fan of Chic Young, certainly not after his outrageous “drugs and guns” outburst, but his treatment reminded me of how some TV cops treat their informants. They have control and power over them and the informant knows there’s no other way. Perhaps this goes some way to explaining why other journalists don’t stand up to WS, even after he’s left Ibrox. What hold does he still have on them, though?
Auldheid says:
January 30, 2015 at 11:23 pm
Your post reminds me of the only occassion I’ve known anyone to take an interest in an OF game down here in the town I live in. My local is basically a Man Utd pub, though plenty City and one or too Liverpool fans go too.
One Sunday afternoon I was in there only half aware that the OF match was on that day. Three guys came in, and obviously noticing my accent enquired if I was in to watch the match. I told them I had no interest in it and they said they were only there because the last one had been so contoversial they wanted to see what happened this time round.
In the end the game was, as I remember, a goal-less draw, that didn’t hold my attention and, at what would have been, time wise, half way through the second half I noticed the TV was on a different channel and the three guys had left, presumably bored with a match that was just like any other when you don’t care about either club and the fists aren’t flying.
In terms of avoiding the predicted riots I’d suggest the best result would be a boring game that leaves both sets of fans deflated. Say, Celtic win with an own goal with absolutely no dodgy decisions made. One set of fans would be deflated because of their team’s poor showing, and they didn’t win, the other because of their teams inability to turn their dominant posession into chances and a crushing victory. Sadly, hatred might still trump boredom regardless of how the game pans out.
Danish Pastry says:
January 30, 2015 at 9:28 pm
44
1
Rate This
Bill1903 says:
January 30, 2015 at 7:17 pm
4 0 Rate This
http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/30/football/old-firm-reunited/
CNN’s view on Sunday’s game.
———-
The SPFL declined to talk to CNN? How odd. A free shot at promoting Scottish football worldwide. And what an opportunity to broadcast the myth to a global audience! Is Neil D. now a little unsure of his stance?
==========================================================
Maybe Mike Ashley wasn’t available to pull the puppet’s strings? :irony:
I’ve made my views on ND clear in the past, but there must be someone in the bunker who actually gives a f**k about Scottish football that could break ranks and shout out loud that the “Old Firm” emperor has no clothes.
Following today’s (yesterday’s?) promising announcement from Fir Park, we seem to have reached a critical mass of clubs hurtling away from armageddon. The SPFL Premier now seems populated by clubs and their fans that are embracing the nouveau reality of cloth being cut according to means. If the Doonhamers, Jambos, Bairns, Hibees, etc joined the Premier, that would do nothing to upset the momentum.
Why are the MSM and administrators stuck in an endless one way system that prevents them from joining the motorway to the new football world?
(That last bit was rhetorical. obviously).
The glib statement that this game will be watched in 50 countries world wide gives the impression of a world eagerly sat by watching live on every stunning move.
The fact is anything on a TV these days is similarly watchable.
Or did I miss some mega !millions TV deal from SPFL.
Again pàthetic reportage.