Apologies for the lack of activity this past few days. I had been expecting a guest blog, but it has failed to materialise thus far. I will endeavour to get that together over the next few days. In the meantine, the moderators would like to thank everyone for their cooperation in keeping some sanity in the face of the recent trolling activity. The self-policing aspect has been admirable over the last few days – as has the level of scrutiny applied to the information which has been coming in.
There have been, understandably, some comments on the blog and elsewhere about a perceived obsesssion here with Rangers and their offspring. Whilst I agree that the focus of this community should have a wider perspective, I don’t think it is obsessional to engage with the big story of the day – in fact it is neccessary that we do so.
Ultimately though TSFM’s longevity will depend on our ability to look at the wider issues, and that is at the top of our minds. We have recently been approached by some people about the possibility of our creating and publicising our own Scottish Football Financial Secrecy League in line with that created a while back for Christian Aid. That may give us some credibility as a watchdog, and utilise the expertise that many contributors have offered so freely in the past.
Right now though the new Rangers show is still headlining, and it is of interest, in the light of the impending share issue, whether the economics of running the new Rangers is really as precariously balanced as has been claimed by some of our number.
If our supsicions of Charles Green’s motives are correct, then we are bound to demonstrate why we think the share issue could be a device to either pay off Ticketus, or Green’s investors to the detriment of the fans.
If the new club’s finances are as precarious as has been stated, then it would point to the share issue being used as a cut and run exercise; but I am not at all convinced of that precariousness.
For example, I don’t accept that The Rangers are paying players an average weekly wage of even as much as £2500. I suspect that the actual figure is considerably less than that, and I hear that basic salaries for the higher quality new players is nearer the £1500 a week mark, with considerably less being offered to the younger guys. Of course performance bonuses would be added to that, but if my figure is correct, Green has a considerable amount of headroom to pay those bonuses.
On the other hand, Green will not have the sponsorship bucks, the media cash, or the prize money that old Rangers would have taken for granted, so there is a defecit there. It may also be of interest to see whether the reported figures for ST sales can be verified. I don’t think it would be churlish for Rangers fans to demand proof of that success before stumping up for a share or two, but one would have to say that reported high figures may well influence an investment decision – and in spite of those impressive numbers (35,000 STs sold) private investors still remain in hiding. It is at times like these that Adam would be an invaluable asset, bringing as he did an alternative and forensic accounting perspective to the somewhat wishful thinking of our non-Rangers tendency 🙂
If the success of Charles Green’s project is determined solely by how much money he makes, then it is in the interest of Rangers fans that any plans to line his own pockets via a share issue (if that is really his intention) are exposed. If Green’s accusers are correct (and let’s not forget that Rangers diehards like John Brown are among their number), then we would have to assume that his biggest success yet has been to get the bears onside, buying imprssively high numbers of STs, after the initial hostility he faced.
Rangers fans who have involved themsleves in critical thinking over the matter will know that some serious damage to the new club will be the result if Green is allowed to pull off any such scam, but they will also know that if he is genuinely invested in the well-being of the club, he is probably their best hope.
That is the dilemma they face.
All talk of stripping titles and history is a red-herring. The real problem for new Rangers is not lost titles or trophy notches on an Ibrox crossbar. It is, as it has been all summer long for old Rangers, survival.
No matter the wage bill that CG faces in this venture surely his biggest problem is the running cost of Ibrox and Murray Park. I havent seen anything in reports from D&P to show that they were able to reduce these costs signifcantly. SPL or Div3 these are his biggest overheads,
Chris Shields
You may be right, but wouldn’t lower than publicised wages give him a better chance of surviving those fixed costs if he really is in it for the long game.
Scottish football and this site can’t move forward until Sevco and it’s predecessor have been seen to have been dealt with in a fair and open manner
What the football authorities, the MSM and Sevco supporters fail to understand, is the level of resentment that has built up amongst fans of all of the other clubs
I don’t think anyone is prepared now, to cut Sevco or any of the other players in this fiasco any slack
Rules have been ignored, and bent to breaking point to accommodate this illegitimate child of RFC(IA)
Whichever way you want to look at it, Sevco should have no place in any of the senior divisions in our game
That it has, is in itself a disgrace, and that disgrace is compounded by the metaphorical thumbing of the nose, by Green, McCoist, the Sevco supporters, and the football authorities
Until justice is served, and seen to be served, we can’t move on to the wider issues affecting our game
Agrajag says:
September 7, 2012 at 20:28
CW says:
September 7, 2012 at 19:09
====================
There will be no way to bury the decision on whether or not Rangers fielded ineligible players for years.
There will be no way to bury the punishment if they are found guilty.
In a just World if they are found guilty it will mean changing the record books of Scottish football. It will be huge news either way.
———————————————————-
Agrajag,
Sorry, I wasn’t surmising ! In my own sarcastic way, I was trying to get across that, in my humble opinion, the decision has already, probably been made !
I think we’ll get an official statement on Wed Night / Thu Morning along the lines of “Nothing to see, everything above board, move along !”
If it was a level playing field, and the rules were applied from 14th Feb onwards, we wouldn’t be where we are now.
Old Rangers would have been liquidated, Ibrox, Murray Park, etc would have been sold. The Creditors would have been paid more than they are going to end up with at present.
More importantly, people like SDM, CW (No Relation BTW!), would have been investigated sooner.
I’m just disappointed that 7 months later, we’re still going through this pantomine. In those same 7 months, we’ve seen too many unbelievable rulings in favour of RFC/ Sevco, etc.
From a club supposedly on its knees, it has suddenly risen from the ashes, led by a dubious character from Yorkshire, who is now offering £1,000,000 if someone can hit the crossbar with one kick of the ball !!
The same Yorkshireman who also paid £1 for this “Club”, like his predecessor.
I know ! He was “Obliged” to pay £5.5M after The CVA failed. What a burden that must have been ?
Sorry Folks, something smells Rank Rotten here ! If I’m right about next week, Scottish Football is in murky waters !
Someone mentioned recently that The FTTT is due out sometime in September. What if the 7 days notice has already been given out, and a hastily arranged “Dual Contract” investigation for Tue/ Wed pre-empts the big result ?
I just want to see “Fair Play”. I know I won’t see “Fair Play” !
If it pans out the way I see it, I won’t be setting foot in another SFA Administered Football Ground again.
Rules are being Re-Written here by our Footballing Authorities. That’s the biggest disappointment for me ! They are the “ONES’S” who could have nipped this in the bud.
They haven’t, therefore why should I support them ?
p.s. Scotland play Serbia in an important World Cup Qualifier at 3:00 pm tomorrow. I shall be in B&Q at 3:00 pm tomorrow looking for a new LawnMower !
I grew up in the 60’s / 70’s watching Scotland, getting excited about watching Scotland. The World Cups in Germany (74), Argentina (78) & Mexico (86) were superb, exciting times. I looked forward to the games against England, remember fondly Jordan’s flying header against Czechoslovakia, Dalglish’s header against Wales (Buchan’s pass as well), the wee guy kicking the ball away before Lorimer had the chance to take his free kick against Zaire in ’74 ! Jimmy Johnstone taking the mickey out of Emlyn Hughes at Hamden, Dalglish sticking the ball through Ray Clemence’s legs ! Not forgetting Shilton’s save against Dalglish !
Tomorrow though ? Just don’t have the same enthusiasm !
Is it just me ? Anyone else falling out of love with Football ?
Just for fun and a propos of nothing at all, the redoubtable chairman of Cenkos Securities is to be found here:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/gerry-aherne/50/67/a2b
Is there any movement by Rangers fan groups/trusts etc to organise and demand a more transparent approach to Sevco’s operation? If not, I would be flabbergasted.
Gaz,
I think CG has won them over utterly and completely. For the mass of Rangers fans, he has their collective trust.
He has been very clever of course, but that in itself is not conclusive proof that he is out to shaft them. He’d have to win them over either way.
Para 7 “For example, I don’t accept that The Rangers are paying players an average annual salary of even as much as £2500”
Think you mean weekly not annual?
===========================
[TSFM Edit] – Well it IS D3 🙂
Well spotted!
==============================
There is no other corruption in our game at the minute except the corruption that has aided rosemary’s baby to be born.There are issues to sort out but the level of corruption and how we are be contantly lied to makes this the biggest story in Scotland even outside the world of football.The msm are continuing to spread the lies about dead club and it’s newly born child.This fight has a long way to go and hopefully next week will see a start on the dual contracts investigation but i fully expect the msm to come out with all gun’s blazing telling us all to lay of the poor innocent wee souls.
CW says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:25
====================
Agrajag,
Sorry, I wasn’t surmising ! In my own sarcastic way, I was trying to get across that, in my humble opinion, the decision has already, probably been made !
==================================
If you think that the panel consisting of
Lord Nimmo Smith
Charles Flint QC
Nicholas Stewart QC
Are complicit in a pre-determined outcome and will put their names and reputations to it fair enough.
I personally doubt it. Though I will readily admit to have been very, very wrong, very, very may times before.
Why doesn’t TRFC make any savings or cut costs?
Selling assets would help their financial position but we’ve seen from day one that none of the parties involved with DRFC/TRFC seem to be able to make rational long term decisions.
SDM couldn’t bring himself to downsize in order to meet the tax bills, instead spent what they had already borrowed to get even bigger (and deeper in debt)
CW seemed to think that not paying tax would make HRMC easier to deal with when they came calling for even greater amounts of owed tax
D&P from day one seemed to think they were there to manage the ‘club’ rather than the company in administration, so they didn’t downsize or make savings at all either, making it probably the only administration that didn’t cut costs
(the players took salary cuts but were they actually deferments?)
The SFA couldn’t bring themselves to follow the rules, risking their own positions
The media decided to back RFC/Sevco/TRFC in spite of the majority of football fans being against special treatment
CG …well we’re not sure yet what his strategy is, so can’t really comment on how well he’s carrying it out, but still no cutbacks with a very expensive stadium to run and a large staff to pay. There may be some cheaper players there now, but would that be the case if the high earners who left had not deferred their wages they would not have been released with no fee as they were? He’s also seemingly doing all he can to annoy authorities and the other clubs some of whom are owed money, potentially alienating those who he might need in the future
It would seem that no one can risk RFC/TRFC not being the biggest (i’ll refrain from saying best, but you know what i mean). Do they think that the bears won’t continue to turn up and pay if they see the squad reduced or other cutbacks happening?
Of course downsizing is happening, albeit on a level of selling assets that bring longer term income for some short term cashflow gain, so we see in house income streams now going outwith TRFC.
If CG, SDM, or CW are getting any of this income it might get interesting.
Speculation in this blog is for a meltdown before the end of the season with much egg on faces and a rangers fan base left with having to find external saviours all over again, but this time with no silver left in the family cupboard …(i like the reference even if others might not)
A poster last week sometime I think said TRFC fans don’t really care about any of the financial, legal or moral implications of whats happened, they are only interested in the actual experience of going to games and the pride of their clubs history. This might fit with the seemingly irrational need to keep overspending and risking financial meltdown by everyone who’s been in charge just to keep it the biggest club.
But what happens when the costs get too much, the credit lines eventually run out, the attendances drop? It seems to be an all or nothing risk strategy being taken. Not a sustainable strategy though I’m afraid.
Some sympathies still lie for the decent bears out there, but it looks like TRFC itself is doing what no other party involved in all this won’t, and that is kill the club and company.
So, i’m confused. Is there a plan in all this that really gives CG a good payday? That would only seem to be the case in say 20 years if he is there to run a football club, or under a year if he’s going to bail out when the next big income stream pays back the investors who have the real shares.
Is this a poorly thought out plan B when the SPL place was lost and they’re making it up as they go?
Or, Is he just the front man as many suggest. Ticketus and its parent companies / investors are the real owners and will do their thing to get their money back, whatever that turns out to be. A big TRFC will be able to do this sooner.
Does this bring us back to the first party of the first part, who decided to keep RFC big??????Don’t know about you, but I don’t think there is a sanity claus.
Gaz @ 22:30
As long as Green, McCoist and the MSM are telling them that the world is against them, and they are being victimised, Sevco’s supporters will be blind to the real situation that they find themselves in
Objectivity has never been one of their strengths, and they will always be susceptible to propaganda, from whatever source, that feeds their sense of supremacy and entitlement
Them’s the rules, Agrajag, Them’s the rules.
CW
Understand your cynicism and complete mistrust of the Scottish football authorities and the hands that operate them. However, the panel selected to oversee this investigation will not be puppets.
Trust in the hard earned reputation of these men.
‘All talk of stripping titles and history is a red-herring. The real problem for new Rangers is not lost titles or trophy notches on an Ibrox crossbar. It is, as it has been all summer long for old Rangers, survival.’
~~~~~~~~~~
I don’t think we can describe the stripping of titles merely as a red herring. Doing so doesn’t fully recognise the impact such action would have on the morale and basic beliefs of the vast majority of fans of The Rangers. Their continued commitment equals cash and without their monetary support his end game, whatever it may be, is compromised. He must therefore do whatever he can to avoid this happening with the help of his allies in the MSM & SFA.
Just to prove that we’re not obsessed by the one subject…in the absence of a league programme this weekend might I remind everyone that Sunday sees three Ramsdens Cup Quarter Finals taking place. Those of us in the central belt who would like to spread some football goodwill could do worse than head to Ochilview Park to watch East Stirlingshire play Cowdenbeath. Whoever wins will be through to their first cup semi final in living memory. And if you do head along, why not buy a programme and a 50/50 ticket too.
campsiejoe says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:21
Scottish football and this site can’t move forward until ………………..
—————————-
campsiejoe, should we not be directing our anger at the custodians of the rules who cleared the path for this to happen. We should also be asking why members clubs have not said “Stop, this is outwith the regulations”.
Be glad when it is all over and Rangers (if guilty) get severely horsed. Think it has had a more profound effect on the supporters of every club barring Rangers. They (The Rangers) are just to thick skinned to be hurt.
The problem for Rangers may be survival but the problem for me is justice. The ineligibility inquiry is massively significant. If guilt is established and titles are stripped then we will finally have an objective and undeniable public acknowledgement that a wrong has been perpetrated on the Scottish game. Without that – or a similar acknowledgement – I cannot even think about moving on (unless it’s moving on to some other sport or activity.) I’m not crying out for blood here either, I’m crying out for justice. So far all the evidence I’ve seen points to guilt. But let the committee find them innocent and show me evidence which supports that and negates what has been presented to date and I will be satisfied with that too.
Agrajag / cw
I wouldn’t have concerns over the ability of the panel members or their integrity. What I do have concerns about is what could happen when they report their findings.
We have already seen the SFA interfere with the independent tribunal process by not allowing the original panel to reconvene following the court case, or by seeking their approval on the five way agreement as the SFA said would happen.
What guarantee do we have that the SFA will find a way of not making the findings public or acting on them?
When I say ‘the SFA’ I regret to say that I mean the entire organisation. I personally suspect that when issues are put to the whole group, justice would likely prevail, or if not, then at least its a democratic decision, but when the office bearers, board and committees seem to make decisions, the rest of the organisation stay silent, regardless of the kinds of nonsense we’ve seen.
john clarke says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:27
Just for fun and a propos of nothing at all, the redoubtable chairman of Cenkos Securities is to be found here:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/gerry-aherne/50/67/a2b
——————————–
You’re being mischievous John. I know it’s silly but surely Gerry Is not about to bring TRFC into a new “holding company” named CFC?
“Does this bring us back to the first party of the first part, who decided to keep RFC big??????Don’t know about you, but I don’t think there is a sanity claus.”
Top Marx for this, Captain Haddock!
who is the offspring?
Good Evening,
everyone is familiar with the term ” Pulitzer Prize”. Everyone knows that the Pulitzer Prize is awarded for journalism. What is not widely known is that there are numerous Pulitzer Prizes awarded each year– all in different categories which range from cartooning to photography to music.
Whatsmore, you can’t just draw something, write something, snap something and then if it is really good collect a Pulitzer. Oh No– you have to pay $500 and submit your entry, and then the 103 judges divided into 20 different juries beaver away like crazy to determine just who will be the nominated finalists in any given category.
Josef Pulitzer, was a Hungarian-American newspaper publisher of the St. Louis Post Dispatch and the New York World. Pulitzer introduced the techniques of “new journalism” to the newspapers he acquired in the 1880s. He became a leading national figure in the Democratic Party and was elected Congressman from New York. He crusaded against big business and corruption.
When he died he bequeathed his £2Million to Columbia University and established the Columbia School of Journalism– the only School of Journalism in the Ivy League— which opened its doors for business in 1912.
All very honourable eh?
Except that as publisher of the New York World he fully engaged in a circulation war with William Randolph Hearst’s New York Journal. Both Pulitzer and Hearst used “yellow journalism” for wider appeal; this opened the way to mass circulation newspapers that depended on advertising revenue and appealed to readers with multiple forms of news, entertainment and advertising.
If you are not familiar with the term “Yellow Journalism” it has been defined as a type of journalism that presents little or no legitimate well-researched news and instead uses eye-catching headlines to sell more newspapers.Techniques may include exaggerations of news events, scandal-mongering, or sensationalism. By extension, the term yellow journalism is used today as a pejorative to decry any journalism that treats news in an unprofessional or unethical fashion.
The author Joseph Campbell has defined yellow press newspapers as having daily multi-column front-page headlines covering a variety of topics, such as sports and scandal, using bold layouts (with large illustrations and perhaps color), with heavy reliance on unnamed sources, and unabashed self-promotion.
Any of that sound familiar in this wee land? Aye—- I thought it might.
Earlier in the week I mentioned the paper chase– that trail of business documents and letters etc that are the staple diet of lawyers and accountants who will seek to determine the facts and legal standing and implications of any contract or its breach.
Some made comment after that post saying that they had reason to doubt that the paper chase would be followed through and were sceptical about the true facts and information ever reaching the public.
I can understand that fully……. except.
The Paper Chase is not a creature of fiction or myth. Rules, regulation, legislation, banking procedures, accounting practice, professional standards, insurance conditions and all sorts of other business and regulatory matters dictate that certain paperwork for everyday standard business procedures simply MUST exist.
Whatsmore– in certain circumstances the absence of such paperwork raises more questions than answers– and if paperwork is repeatedly missing in key areas then a conclusion has to be drawn— and it is not a favourable conclusion.
What is readily available is years and years of print journalism– where Yellow Journalism has been deployed– sometimes most unconvincingly and without any real attempt at disguising it as anything other than exactly what is and was. Any such public statements can and should be checked and compared to all documents uncovered in the paper chase to see whether or not the press themselves were mislead at times in the past.
Take, for example, the virtual proclamation on or around 15th February that Rangers PLC would enter and exit the Adminsitration process all within a short period of time, and that they would come out the other end stronger and fully able to conduct business as usual!!!
To anyone who knew anything about it, this was a statement of complete and utter fantasy and could rightly have been dismissed as total rubbish. Yet it was pronounced as if it were a certainty!
Yes there was a statement from Craig Whyte but there was also lots of unnamed sources and mysterious so called spokesmen who were quoted up to and including that point.
Such pronunciations were common from the red tops to the broadsheets.
A few weeks later, Roddy Forsyth declared on BBC Scotland that he regretted the absence of financial journalists who could ask awkward questions of David Murray over the years, the implication being that Roddy is a sports Journalist while the Rangers PLC accounts– with their financial vagaries, EBT’s, Inter Company transactions, Amortisations, Valuations and so on— were matters for business and financial journalists— and not the likes of him.
The problem with that argument is that the likes of the Telegraph and the Herald are awash with business sections, money sections, financial supplements and the likes which have to have been written by someone.
Further, even a supposed dearth of financial experts does not excuse the promolgation of blatant inncuraccy in business matters without even a cursory check to see whether or not what is being said is true. Even the journalistic style used at times seems to set out what the paper has been fed as if it is a proclamation from on high with no hint of doubt or consideration of an alternative or counter argument.
This then takes me to Charles Green, who today announced that he was appointing a certain firm as financial advisers and consultants in relation to raising capital for The Rangers Football Club Ltd as it is now known.
However, did you notice that in his statement he now seemed to cast doubt on whether or not there would in fact be a share issue? After all his previous statements to an ever listening press, would that element of doubt be the kind of thing to prick the interest of an enquiring journalist or two?
You would think so– maybe even hope so!
Others have already mentioned the conditions for entry into the AIMS market– which seems to be Green’s preferred stage—and whilst they are less onerous than the main stock market exchange they still require a fair degree of compliance.
Rather than go through the tedious regulations ad nauseam, here is a pretty good guide to AIM flotations from one of the big law firms who get involved in such things.
http://www.makingaimeasier.com/introduction%20to%20aim.aspx
Perhaps of key importance is the part where they don’t talk about the rules and regulations, but about the AIM in the current financial climate:
“However, in the last 12 months the FTSE AIM All Share Index has dropped from over 1,100 to below 700 by mid- September 2008. The uncertainties in the markets are clearly impacting on companies contemplating coming to AIM and those already quoted.
So what does it all mean? In the short term there will be few IPOs and only those companies who are very strong candidates will be able to come to the market.
We also anticipate that a number of smaller AIM companies may decide to go private if the transaction can be financed and/or to de-list.”
If anything, things are fiscally tighter now than in 2008— back then the crash was bad but nowhere near as bad as it became and few thought it would last that long. Today, we are still in official recession if not double dip,there is no growth according to official statistics and few will brave a prediction as to when things will get better.
In other words, now is not necessarily a good time to be coming to the AIM market unless your offer is very very strong— and a football club of any size in the lower tier of Scottish Football– even with the room for progression that Charlie’s club undoubtedly has— does not strike me as the strongest of candidates.
However, the point is that to even get to the prospectus stage the company has to produce reams of clear, unequivical and binding paperwork……. a paper chase for all to see, yet a paper chase that some might want to remain hidden.
At the same time the FTT will start or be part of another paper chase, which under normal circumstances should be a matter of public record.
The SPL tribunal which sits next week will have its own paper chase, as should the SFA with all its powers— after all it is a public body.
The Rangers story has plenty of fat to tempt the football journalist, the sports journalist, the financial journalist, the public sector journalist and even the gossip columnist. It is all there, the paperwork exists…. it is only a matter of going in the right direction and asking the right people the right questions to uncover its whereabouts or to elicit that it is mysteriously missing.
Josef Pulitzer did indeed engage in Yellow Journalism, but his last will and testament decreed that his legacy would be best remembered for rewarding those who ignored such journalistic practices and who instead brought about quality journalism, literature, drama, art and photography. And of course over time Pulitzer has become associated as THE prize for that strangest– and perhaps in Scotland– rarest of beasts— top class investigative journalism.
If he were alive today he would smell a story…….. and not just the one he was being fed either.
The question now is whether Scotland actually has anyone who wishes to follow in Pulitzer’s footsteps or whether they would rather carry on down the Yellow Brick Road they are used to?
The Asset Sale
The 4 Spivs are D&P, Whyte, Green, Ticketus and Close Leasing
The Aims of the Spivs
The aims which hold these Spivs together are as follows
D&P need to exit with a legal asset sale that enables them to get their fees paid with no objection from the court. So their aim is ensuring the asset sale is legal
Green`s consortium need their investment back plus a bit of profit. So their aim is to smooth the route to a fundraising and get out
Ticketus need their money back plus enough profit to make it all worthwhile. So their aim is to continue the ST income stream they agreed with Whyte or be repaid in full by Whyte
Close Leasing need their loan money back plus enough interest to make it all worthwhile. So their aim is to continue the Close Leasing loan they made to RFC or be repaid in full
Whyte needs the cooperation of the others to ensure his floating charge is not invalidated in court. He needs his debt to Ticketus off his back. If he can do this at no cost he is in profit for whatever he gets since he only spent £1.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Trade offs between Spivs
D&P needed a buyer (ie Sevco 5088) or their administration fees were at risk. D&P also needed both Whyte and Close Leasing to sign off on the asset sale as floating charge holders
Green needed Whyte to sign off on the name change. He also needed both Whyte and Close Leasing to sign off on the asset purchase as floating charge holders
Whyte needed Ticketus to agree not to claim RFCG for £27.5m Whyte also needed Close Leasing to agree not to claim RFCG for their loan to RFC(I.A.) Whyte also needed the consent of D&P and Green for the RFCG floating charge to follow the assets and move to Sevco 5088
Close Leasing held the RFC liquidation trump card of being first in line with a floating charge that ranked higher than the one held by RFCG(Whyte). They didn’t need to agree to the asset sale and their objection would have killed it stone dead. So Close could demand full repayment of their loan( or an even better deal) before agreeing that their floating charge would follow the assets to Sevco 5088.
Ticketus needed their ST contract(invalid under Scottish law) to move to an English co or they would get nothing in liquidation and be forced to sue Whyte for their £27.5m debt So they needed their ST contract to move with the assets to Sevco 5088.This kept it alive and under English law was now attached to any Co who played at Ibrox. But they needed the consent of D&P and Green for this to happen
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
So everybody needed everybody else to pull together or they were all dead
In theory Whyte could have objected to the sale to Green and fought Close Leasing in court for the assets if no sale had been made and liquidation followed. However HMRC would probably have joined in and prolonged the entire process
In practice although Whyte had most to gain he could achieve a more certain outcome if he surrendered most of his theoretical entitlement in order to secure the cooperation of the others
There was a problem however. Whyte had a floating charge over both Ibrox and Murray Park. While he would be prepared to modify his floating charge he could not risk giving it up entirely. He could only hive off a whole asset so it had to be either Ibrox or Murray Park. He gave up Ibrox
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Where are we now?
Whyte
I suspect Whyte has given up his floating charge to Ibrox in exchange for Sevco accepting a clean floating charge over Murray Park. This is why as of Aug 2012 there is a Whyte floating charge in the title deeds for Murray Park but not for Ibrox
,,,,,,,,,,
Ticketus and Close Leasing
I suspect Sevco 5088 now carry the debts due to Ticketus and Close Leasing and will recover them from Sevco Scotland as the price of “selling” Ibrox The quantum of these debts would be subject to negotiation but will be in the range £30m to £45m
Meaning
Sevco 5088 owe “£xm” to Ticketus and Close Leasing
which they will be able to pay because
Sevco Scotland owe “£xm” to Sevco 5088
,,,,,,,,
Green Consortium
I suspect Sevco Scotland bought (NOT transferred free of charge) the assets from Sevco 5088 but haven’t yet paid for them. So Sevco Scotland now own Ibrox and Murray Park outright However Sevoc Scotland have registered a floating charge in favour of Whyte over Murray Park which is probably many £ms. The annual interest on this charge will need to be paid to a Whyte co out of Sevco Scotland income
Green will have revalued both assets significantly after getting SFA recognition that Sevco Scotland is a new football club that plays at Ibrox. This will be acceptable from an accounting standpoint
Green`s next step is to sell shares in Sevco Scotland. This will be supported by revealing the revaluation the company now has in the books
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
The Switcheroo……How was it done?
As long as RFC were not in liquidation the Ticketus and Azure Catering (Close Leasing) contracts were valid and the Close Leasing floating charge was unchallenged (The RFCG floating charge was also unchallenged although D&P described the RFCG debt as “TBA”)
However
With willing participants
There was nothing legally to stop these contracts and floating charges following the assets and being reassigned from RFC(IA) to Sevco 5088 under the purchase agreement between Green and D&P
Since this reduces the debt owed to Creditors it would be difficult for another Creditor to challenge the purchase terms
As an English Co owning the assets Sevco 5088 are then obliged to honour these floating charges and contracts under English law. No problems with Scottish law as each contract is now between two English cos( Sevco 5088 v Ticketus, Sevco 5088 v RFCG and Sevco 5088 v Close Leasing)
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
So
After Sevco 5088 sell the assets to Sevco Scotland this meant Sevco 5088 were left to honour the Ticketus and Close Leasing debts even though they no longer own the assets. At this point I suspect the RFCG floating charge over Ibrox and Murray Park was reduced to become an RFC floating charge over Murray Park only. This explains why on 6 July Sevco Scotland registered an RFCG floating charge over Murray Park but no floating charge over Ibrox
These changes could only happen under a written agreement between Sevco 5088 and Sevco Scotland detailing the conditions of the asset transfer
In effect Sevco 5088 become a conduit for collecting the Ticketus ST income and repaying the Close Leasing loan debt. Sevco 5088 will not be responsible for paying interest on the Whyte Murray Park floating charge since this is a Sevco Scotland debt
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
However
It is illegally unsound to transfer assets from Sevco 5088 to Sevco Scotland without any bookkeeping. In effect these assets have to be sold as well as transferred
Given that the assets were in RFC books at over £100m I suspect the transfer price was as high as possible perhaps over £50m
Irrespective of the revaluation Sevco Scotland probably now owe Sevco 5088 for the undernoted debts
Ticketus …………£27.5m to £40m spread over the life of the STs……….probably to be funded by future ST sales
Close Leasing….exact debt unknown but perhaps £5m ……… to be repaid with interest
Ibrox and Murray Park……..unknown but perhaps £50m as suggested above
In addition Sevco Scotland on 6 July 2012 registered a floating charge over Murray Park in favour of RFCG (Whyte) The amount is not declared but could be in the £5m to £10m range So Sevco Scotland will also have to pay interest on this debt
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Summary (My opinion)
The Ticketus and Close Leasing debts have escaped liquidation and will have to be repaid by Sevco Scotland
Similarly the Whyte floating charge has avoided a court challenge in a reduced form as a floating charge debt over Murray Park .This debt will have to be repaid by Sevco Scotland with annual interest until it is extinguished .
These Sevco Scotland debts are likely to be in the region of £30m to £50m
The only source of funds to repay these debts is the fund raising. However this fund raising also has to repay the Green Consortium for its role in the scam .The most likely scenario is that the fundraising will be drained of cash by Green and his Backers This leaves little or no cash for repayments to Ticketus, Close Leasing or Whyte out of the fundraising
These debts will have to be repaid by Sevco Scotland out of future income
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
In a nutshell
Sevco Scotland are stuffed financially to the tune of around £30m to £50m and will be hobbled for years trying to pay off their debts.
The big question in all of this is the willingness of ex RFC fans to support the Sevco fundraising
If it’s a massive positive response then Green will exit leaving a debt of perhaps only £30m. If its a flop then another liquidation is inevitable
Many contributors, trolling or not, have called these pages ‘the rangers football monitor’ or some such, and have grumbled that so much traffic seems to be covering the Rangers and their travails. I answer by reposting much of a post I entered on another site recently, below:
Currently, this Rangers Saga is THE story in Scottish football.
@CW
well written, i am of the same mind, surely there has to be some recourse to the laws of the game.. we are already into murky waters and the Scottish game deserves some clarity..
Don`t see the point of an independent SPL Inquiry if it submits reports to a non-independent compromised board, that gerrymandered, spun stories, ignored fans consultations and to date has applied only a 10 point penalty in reality for a 134m insolvency.
Of course we could trust in the SFA that gives a three match one year suspended ban for breaking two canon SFA laws for a shaming episode………..[cont`d p 94] … from a non-independent compromised board, that gerrymandered, spun stories, ignored fans consultations and to date has applied only a limited transfer ban for over 21s, in lieu of termination / expulsion – that they can’t even properly police
The miscreants coming on show will be quaking in their boots – with laughter
After we take our jaws off the ground we could simply take it that all this is a complete waste of time.
Until such times as both boards are placed on gardening leave to be replaced with groups that can be respected and trusted to assess independent inquires objectively and fairly for the good of the game.
Which aint gonna happen as the very last thing on these people’s minds is the good of the game – or even the long term good of TRFC if only they knew it – they are hopelessly compromised and useless in end effect
rant over [for now]
Goosy
Marvellous stuff but I must admit I struggle to follow the trail (and the soon to be Mrs Logie’s patience is wearing thin on her birthday so I must go)
My hope is a BDO forensic investigation will uncover the trail over time – is this unrealistic?
jonny says:
September 7, 2012 at 17:02
Long Time Lurker says:
September 7, 2012 at 16:59
Shame on AT – in the introduction to Downfall (which is excellent, hard hitting) he gives “Duff and Duffer” a mention, without providing the correct copyright acknowledgement that we have become accustomed to seeing both here and on RTC.
=====================================================================
Who does the copyright belong to ,I thought I was the first one to coin the phrase
…………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
ahem… !! jonny/LTL
…The Duff & Duffer brand as well as the D&D/Duffers derivatives are copywrite protected for me..fully licenced to me & totally owned by me..kerching & as for any legal challenges
..,bring em on!!
Hey…Thomo boy…easy tiger..am always watchin…
😉
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
September 7, 2012 at 23:17
Good Evening,
—————————
Calming influence. Let’s safe our energy until the results come out.
Correction: “save”. Should have come home earlier.
Agrajag says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:39
CW says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:25
====================
Agrajag,
Sorry, I wasn’t surmising ! In my own sarcastic way, I was trying to get across that, in my humble opinion, the decision has already, probably been made !
==================================
If you think that the panel consisting of
Lord Nimmo Smith
Charles Flint QC
Nicholas Stewart QC
Are complicit in a pre-determined outcome and will put their names and reputations to it fair enough.
I personally doubt it. Though I will readily admit to have been very, very wrong, very, very may times before.
——————————————————
Thanks Agrajag,
I didn’t even know who was on The Panel.
As a Layman, I don’t personally know those elequent members of the panel.
Words like “Lord” and “QC” don’t mean too much to me. The recent Westminster Expence’s Scandal tells me what People in “Authority” are like.
I only know that I try hard to live my life within The Law, as I was brought up to, and expect others to do so as well !
In answer to your question :
“If you think that the panel consisting of
Lord Nimmo Smith
Charles Flint QC
Nicholas Stewart QC
Are complicit in a pre-determined outcome and will put their names and reputations to it fair enough.”
My answer : Probably !
My reason : In 1 or 2 years, when it has all settled down, we’ll be back to the old Status Quo. Nobody will have ever remembered the 2 QC’s and The Lord who let it go. They will still be earning a decent living, Rangers will be back where they think they should be.
It’s a sad reality in this modern world to look after “The Institutions”. RFC are one of those so called “Institutions”.
If the 2 QC’s and His Lordship come back next week with a “Stinging” Verdict, I will come back on and Eat my Hat (All be it, a scraggy “Thinsulate” winter bunnet !).
Really hoping I’m wrong !
This may sound like a strange question but has anyone heard why Celtic’s accounts have been delayed?
I know fans have already received their new shares certificates but no overall figures have yet been released.
Due to the ongoing “issues” over the summer I understand that a lot of season tickets were left unsold as at 30 June 2012, when the financial year ended, and the Ki sale can also not be included in the figures but I’m led to believe that the figures are bad.
Now after the outcome of “The Rangers” decision a lot of fans, like myself, renewed their season tickets but that was too late to be included in last years figures. Also the Ki transfer was too late to alter the stats.
These figures will augment the balance sheet eventually but the board should still state this in the accounts.
I’m just wondering has anyone else heard anything with regards to the accounts as this is the Scottish Football Monitor and we are here to look at every club regardless of whether we like it or not..
Ian Black is not on 1500 a week. Try 6k plus 2k appearance.
As all of the signings were free transfers I would lay a bet that they all forego the usual large signing on fee for larger guaranteed weekly wage.
Might as well hoist up the wage calculator again.
Making allowances for unknowns – to break even annually players wages weekly have to be in the order of
Years1&2 £1,127
Year 3 £2,857
Year 4 £4,918
Year 5 on £6,072
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aq2m3ggkEX2RdER0WURDZEhOdmxVWGo5aFZEUVdMS1E#gid=0
If the wages in Yrs 1 and 2 were to double there would be a £3.2M loss each year.
If Ticketus are still in there somewhere looking to recover their £27M from Yr 3 wages become
Yr3 £1.785
Yr4 £3, 846
Yr 5 On £5,000.
Neither set are exactly the size of wage to attract CL quality players, which means that in order to survive The Sevco Rangers would have to develop an entirely different business model both football and commercial, that would be competing against a local rival, whom if they choose, would give any investor cause to pause on where they should put their money.
At present Sevco are runnning on adrenalin but when that runs out what remains of substance and sustainability to keep them going or is the proposed share issue just a defibrillator?.
Captain Haddock says:
September 7, 2012 at 23:03
Agrajag / cw
I wouldn’t have concerns over the ability of the panel members or their integrity. What I do have concerns about is what could happen when they report their findings.
We have already seen the SFA interfere with the independent tribunal process by not allowing the original panel to reconvene following the court case, or by seeking their approval on the five way agreement as the SFA said would happen.
What guarantee do we have that the SFA will find a way of not making the findings public or acting on them?
When I say ‘the SFA’ I regret to say that I mean the entire organisation. I personally suspect that when issues are put to the whole group, justice would likely prevail, or if not, then at least its a democratic decision, but when the office bearers, board and committees seem to make decisions, the rest of the organisation stay silent, regardless of the kinds of nonsense we’ve seen.
———————————————————
Sir,
Normally I agree with you, but in this case I have a funny feeling that even the SFA are the proverbial “Puppets on a String ” !
Must be hard Mr Reagan (& Mr Doncaster, SPL Main Man !) having your Ba&&$ yanked daily
Actually, my concerns are more to do with the High Heid Yins who have let this saga drag on for SOOOOO long !!!
TBH, I actually feel sorry for SR & ND, being dragged into this mess !
SR actually came into his post with a Vision to help Scottish Football (I can believe that).
ND, I feel was more inclined to see a “Good Opportunity !”, but probably still wishing he had stayed at Norwich (I can believe that !)
Next week will be pivitol, in a lot of ways. If it’s a TU for RFC (IL) it will be time to shut the curtains, and last one out “Put Out The Lights !”.
p.s. Whatever McMurdo wrote the Blog yesterday morning, Shame on You !!!!!
It was disgraceful, and a lot of Rangers Supporters will have been offended as well !
If it was The Son, I pity him ! He couldn’t have even been born then !!
If it was The Son, who is The Dad that has sadly put him up to it ?
What a sad world some people live in ?
scottish football is in the doldrums and has been struggling for years, many thousands of supporters of all clubs were still going through habit and the human fear of change of habit.
From February onwards this year many had thought seriously about giving it up and were only prevented by doing so by what we thought was the SPL and SFA directors doing the right thing with regards to Sevco.
We all know now that even the chairmen and directors of the lower division clubs only acted as they did through self preservation with the threats of their own fans walking away ringing in their ears, this is obvious now when we see how T Rangers are allowed to conduct their business.
A full unregistered team playing Brechin city but not a word from Brechin.
Players signed after window closes, not a word from competing teams.
Player signed from Hearts who are still owed money from agreement to let Sevco in.
Money owed to Celtic,not paid and not a word from Celtic
Money owed to Dundee utd and nothing more than a short press release.
Strict conditional membership was given and not been adhered to, but not a peep from anyone.
Scottish football is on life support and the fans who bought into the false promises of their club chairmen will NOT be fooled again, we are looking at the real death of the game here and I dont think it can survive any more favours being made to Rangers.
But still the people who run our game are willing to alienate every single club and supporter in the country to ensure that one club survives and survive they will but I honestly see a future of part time football for most clubs and even celtic and rangers within a few years being unable to pay anything above a few thousand pounds per week.
It would seem its survival at all costs and as Rangers will no longer be “up there” then they(SFA/SPL/SFL) will just bring everyone else down to a level that Rangers can compete at.
TSFM – I am struggling to see why you are so confident that the players at T’Rangers are on is averaging around 2500 a week. Elbows, Alexander and Lee Wallace are in no way anyway near that – all were on SPL wages that should have been TUPE’d over. If they took a pay cut we woudl have been told so – to prolong the we are in this together propoganda. Add in that Bocanegra and Goian are on loan with 2nd division clubs in Spain and Italy, those clubs will not be paying wages for these 2 players that Rangers NIL were paying in SPL – am sure that T’Rangers are responsible for parts of their wages too. Factor in also that Edu, Bocanegra, Broadfoot and Goain were on the books until recently, the average costs are increased.
Now Little, Templeton, Black, Sandaza, Kyle and Shiels are nowhere near 2500 a week either – and I doubt Cribari, Argyruou and Faure will be either.
So factoring in all these signings/players are way above 2500 a week – there is no way there is an average of 2500 a week.
Maybe they are being paid shares in T’Rangers much as Swally was purported to have been given – which turned out to be false.
I suspect that it is the case that Elbows is paid more in one week than the entire squad of Montrose is paid in a month – given they are part timers as well.
While the future of Scottish Football will be discussed fully in the future, as many bloggers on here have stated, the only issue to discuss on a daily basis at present is the continuing fiasco with Rangers Football Club or whoever.
The impending EBT Enquiry (6 months late) is merely a minor issue, as the possible penalties of being stripped of League Titles and Cup victories are totally irrelevant as these would only be applied to the Oldco and not Newco, which would have no effect on present day Scottish Football..
The mmost important issues that are at stake is for the full truth to be determined on all matters regarding Rangers/Sevco or whoever to ensure that every guilty party who has caused this corruption and fraud are identified along with anyone who has colluded to cover up this issue.
Once all guilty parties have been determined, they will all be dealt directly by the Law and/or the football authorities to ensure tat none of these people will never have any say in the future running of Scottish Football.
The future of Scottish Football will be unable to move on in the future until this has been achieved.
”If you don’t need to know, you don’t get to hear.” says:
September 7, 2012 at 23:46
I was simply standing up for the rights of the copyright holder – your good self 🙂
Getting back to Phil’s book – its good, reveals some of what has happened at the FTTT hearing (obviously according to the author’s sources).
Phil repeats much of what he has said on his blog – with some new information and analysis. Its good to see the whole story come together, in a permanent record as a single volume.
I would hope that as the days progress – questions are asked of the SFA and SPL i.e. have you read the book – do you have any comment to make?
RTC if you are watching – can you give a hint as to when your book may be published?
sjmetalicar says:
September 8, 2012 at 07:58
Southampton denied they gave anything other than a nominal fee to get CG off their backs – the money discussed and stated as per “Record Sports Exclusive” was actually money put aside by Southampton to FA dawn sawf in case they lost the case that Davies was a free agent.
CG got nothing much at all.
And please note and I wil repeat that part again in case you skimmed over it…………
Southampton put money aside in case they lost the case………
If only S*DM had done the same thing 3 years back, we would not be where we are – but the Bears could not stomach a few lean years of marquee player signings nor trophies, so S*DM kept spending to keep the Bears onside …………but apparently its not their fault………..
* – means soon to be taken off him hopefully! (copyright acknowledged!)
spanishcelt says:
September 8, 2012 at 02:53
Spot on spanishcelt, my feelings exactly.
You have to wonder if directors and chairmen of all the other clubs are aware that this is how many supporters feel, because as you say; continued favours to one club will be more likely to result in “armagedon” than any of the baseless threatd we have heard to date.
How things pan out with sevco will have play a huge part in my renewing next season or not.
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
September 7, 2012 at 23:17
61 1 i
Rate This
A few weeks later, Roddy Forsyth declared on BBC Scotland that he regretted the absence of financial journalists who could ask awkward questions of David Murray over the years, the implication being that Roddy is a sports Journalist while the Rangers PLC accounts– with their financial vagaries, EBT’s, Inter Company transactions, Amortisations, Valuations and so on— were matters for business and financial journalists— and not the likes of him.
The problem with that argument is that the likes of the Telegraph and the Herald are awash with business sections, money sections, financial supplements and the likes which have to have been written by someone.
Further, even a supposed dearth of financial experts does not excuse the promolgation of blatant inncuraccy in business matters without even a cursory check to see whether or not what is being said is true. Even the journalistic style used at times seems to set out what the paper has been fed as if it is a proclamation from on high with no hint of doubt or consideration of an alternative or counter argument.(my edit)
=====================================================================
BRTH….superb piece along the lines of what we have become accustomed to!
I have posted a few times along the lines of the above (highly edited) excerpt, implying the question as to why no one wanted to ask the question(s) of RFC(IA)
Surely, even allowing for the stunning silence of my fellow beancounting supporters of RFC(IA) who simply continued to do the “ostrich act”, it would not have taken much for a competent journalist to have asked a few basic questions, and not too probing at that.
But that then is one of many the core inabilities of the Scottish MSM…is it not?…not that the English MSM are that much better, but at least the do not appear so heavily “conflicted” (copywright S Regan)
The independent inquiry, headed up by Lord Nimmo Smith, will sit on both Tuesday and Wednesday. No evidence will be heard at this stage.
A statement from the SPL on Friday afternoon read: “The Scottish Premier League today announced that the Independent Commission to inquire into alleged EBT payments and arrangements made by Rangers in relation to players during the period from 2000 until 2011 will sit on Tuesday 11 and Wednesday 12 September.
“The hearing will be chaired by Lord Nimmo Smith and will consider submissions from parties on various procedural matters. It will not be a hearing of the merits of the case.
“The other members of the independent Commission are Mr Charles Flint QC and Mr Nicholas Stewart QC.”
The panel will deliberate on the perfidy and punishment of Rangers. One would assume that evidence of not registering players contracts would reder their participation invalid.
Automatic 3-0 loss in every such game.
Automatic loss of every title (including League Cups)
Sevco would still be in Div 3 ahead of associate members who played fair.
Sevco are a new team according to UEFA and ineligible for EUFA tournaments for 3 years.
I pray that the Panel eject Rangers posthumously from the League
I pray that Sevco go into liquidation.
dunloytim says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:38
There is no other corruption in our game at the minute except the corruption that has aided rosemary’s baby to be born.
——–
That’s good then. Glad to know that Scottish football is squeaky clean apart from where RFC and CG are concerned. 🙂
Fisiani says:
September 8, 2012 at 10:25
I pray that the Panel eject Rangers posthumously from the League
======
They may be ‘ejected’ from a league of which they are not a member.
As a punishment that is even less punitive than being subjected to the comfy chair.
They cannot be ejected from the league of which they are a member because it is an SPL tribunal.
The tribunal may recommend expulsion from SFA but that would be a matter for further consideration by, probably yet another panel, the organisation which is presided over by the gentleman who received EBTs sufficient to enjoy a very good night out.
Re the Independent inquiry , I am now expecting a very technical / legal decision to go largely in favour of Rgers (as was) , as I suspect the rules are open to interpretation in various places and there will be some nonsense about ” acting in good faith” and all that will happen will be a fine and a censure for the directors. A legal loophole will be found to avoid any real punishments.
The alternative is that the inquiry is then forced to act against Rgers which will lead them to the door of the SFA and how they allowed this to happen. I suspect that the inquiry will have already been given a very tight remit to avoid this scenario, which will also allow the worthy sorts on it to escape the melee with their dignity, if not their conscience intact.
Nowoldandgrumpy says:
September 8, 2012 at 10:09
Not taken long for the SPL to cultivate the ground
“in relation to Players”
Managers, Coaches, Transfer dealings, Board Members, and Owners seem not to be included.
– Quelle Surprise
in an earlier life there would have been only one word……………..chapeau !!!!!!!!!!!!!
(oops!) to describe CampsieJoe’s post at 22 .21
Good Morning.
Erudite contribution from BRTH as usual.
When the various bodies deliver their findings I have no doubt they will be damning, however if the findings are delivered to, and left in the control of, the SFA and anyone who has had the benefit of an EBT, perhaps the findings will not see the light of day.
Betting is that Rangers(IA) are in liquidation and so no need to flog a dead horse and Sevco will escape because it wasn’t them.
Personally I cannot see Sevco surviving financially. I do not see a share issue being possible, however if I am wrong, I think Lord Charles of Sevconia will take the money and run.
This month should be a watershed, hopefully in which all the bad guys will be flushed out.
CW says:
September 8, 2012 at 00:24
In answer to your question :
“If you think that the panel consisting of
Lord Nimmo Smith
Charles Flint QC
Nicholas Stewart QC
Are complicit in a pre-determined outcome and will put their names and reputations to it fair enough.”
My answer : Probably !
==================================
I think that is a disgraceful slur, however you are perfectly entitled to your opinion.
EKBhoy says:
September 8, 2012 at 11:14
I don’t see a highly technical / legal decision. It should be a binary case – the rules on player registration were either followed or they were not.
The rules as I understand them require that all payments made to players from whatever source should be stated as part of their registration.
It should then be a matter of fact – how were the players paid – were details of all payments and sources of those payments provided?
RTC had an excellent blog on this – and provided Harper McLeod with some assistance, pointing out that a prima facie case against the club exists
http://rangerstaxcase.wordpress.com/2012/05/22/doncaster-dooms-spl/
In the pre-internet age it may have been possible behind closed doors with little scrutiny from the outside and the lack of an inquisitive media to try and argue that the club acted in good faith and that this was all a mistake. There is much information within the public domain and I would imagine if there was any fowl play – then more information may suddenly come to light from sources such as RTC. Hopefully, more detail and background information will be available from the FTTT decision. Sunlight is a very powerful disinfectant!
The judicial panel also have their professional reputations and integrity to uphold – I cannot see anything other than a fair and reasoned judgement being made.
In addition, there will be a lot of interest in the outcome from clubs throughout Europe – who may believe that they were unfairly denied an opportunity to advance in European competition where RFC fielded ineligible players. The SFA cannot afford to have those clubs cry fowl.
EKBhoy
I don’t agree sorry.
I think the two days of debate will focus on:
A– Exactly who is in the Dock?
B– Do Sevco, their Chairman and their manager have any right of audience at the main event?
c– Do Sevco, and all above, have any right of audience at this debate stage?
D– In the event of the case proceeding against the company in Adminsitration, and that company
being fined, are Sevco duty bound to pay that fine in terms of the 5 way agreement in which
they undertook to pay all footballing liabilities. Any such fine imposed now arises from actions
which had been undertaken and were under investigation at that time.
E– Does this investigation and any hearing potentially compromise other proceedings (civil or
criminal) which may be instigated by the crown– any part of the crown?
F– Who has primary jurisdiction on the matters under review and is the SPL actually free to
conduct this hearing at this time?
G– Should these proceedings, or the ultimate findings, be made public– it is an enquiry after all-
and who should be the witnesses?
H– All parties to agree the powers available to the panel– including powers of citation, recovery
of documents in the hands of third parties who may or may not be involved in the hearings.
J– In light of previous events, agreement on press releases, comment and recation whilst the
hearing is in session and clear understanding on the steps that can and will be taken should
anyone make comment which is likely to bring about a repeat of the event which took place
earlier in the year when panel members received phonecalls, letters and so on.
H– Make a reasonable estimate on the time needed to conduct the proceedings from start to
finish— which obviously involves getting a handle on where Rangers PLC (as was) stand
on the allegations and what the thrust of their argument in defence is going to be– given that
the initial Harper Mcleod report says that there is a case to answer.
I— Set out the batting order and the everyday procedure that will be followed- how many copies
of productions, timescaling witnesses and so on.
By doing all of that you set the scene for the hearing and avoid procedural mayhem. You also get the job done in the shortest possible time.
The rules on the registering of documents, players contracts and so on are quite clear and unequivocal– ask Auldheid— and whatsmore their proper interpretation has implications and ramifications for all associations across Europe.
No there will be no technical sliding about in the mire looking for an easy way out– the bench is comprised of big hitters with big reputations who cannot afford to become engaged in a justice which is the equivalent of a second rate shabby fix just to suit a club that is now defunct.
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan @11:36
Well said sir, especially the last paragraph
BRTH
No there will be no technical sliding about in the mire looking for an easy way out– the bench is comprised of big hitters with big reputations who cannot afford to become engaged in a justice which is the equivalent of a second rate shabby fix just to suit a club that is now defunct.
===============
I do so hope you are correct.
I am an innate pessimist but sometimes I behave contrary to my natural inclinations and your words above have given me one such time.
It won’t last, of course.
ltl and brth
I suspect that the 2 days as you suggest will be agree the batting order , witnesses and utimately the evidence will show that they breached the rules. The counter argument will be they acted in good faith at all times and on that basis although bang to rights guilty , the punishment will be a low key affair, it seems to me that if the rumour that Ogilvy is going to UEFA soon then Regan and the rest of the SFA will do everything they can to keep an inquiry away from the SFA door, If. I was Sevco I would be demanding that the SFA license guys rock up to give evidence … I suspect that is the last thing the SFA want, as I said earlier all the correct processes will be followed, they will be guilty, and then slapped on the wrist. This will be turned around by Green as a victory and a vindication that they did nothing wrong.
Timewilltell
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
September 8, 2012 at 11:36
A– Exactly who is in the Dock?
B– Do Sevco, their Chairman and their manager have any right of audience at the main event?
c– Do Sevco, and all above, have any right of audience at this debate stage?
==============================
I don’t even understand why Sevco being involved in the process would be a consideration.
Rangers still exists, if anyone is entitled to an audience it is Craig Whyte, members of the Rangers board, or their appointed representatives.
It is they, or their predecessors who failed to report the payments properly. It is they who will be able to explain what they did and on what basis they did it. Charles Green and his board, of the new club, weren’t there at the time. If they were they may have something to offer.
Goosy,
Many thanks, a riveting read which at last makes sense of the how and why of all this.
Is there a place or two in your analysis / hypothesis for SDM?
Was his role just one of selling to CW as the first buyer? Or was it finding a likely partner who would keep onside ? is SDM still connected to ticketus / octopus / Zeus? Some earlier posts suggested as much.
It would seem unlikely that he just somehow chanced upon CW and sold everything for £1 just to get rid of RFC. Mind you the entire scenario you describe might also seem unlikely except that its the only half sane explanation I’ve seen so far.The combination of partners, sources of funds and the operation of the plan being able to cope with changes and setbacks would require a managing role somewhere. No plan ever goes smoothly from stage to stage, it requires constant monitoring, analysis and reaction to circumstances. How is this being done? Would it require a trip to Zurich?
So, it makes me wonder just how all this got started. When would such a plan be cooked up? who picked the potential participants? What ground rules were in place before the main idea was mooted and details got fleshed out? Is there a paper trail? Or is it more murky than that with gangster style repercussions? And just who is the lead conspirator? The most obvious candidate for me of course is SDM.
As they used to say, ‘You don’t have to be crazy to work here, but it helps’. Another stock phrase that comes to mind is ‘it’s a crazy idea but it just might work’
I had partly written the post below but had laid it aside to do other things. Therefore yesterday’s news, which leads the post now, encouraged me to tidy it up and finish it off. For the avoidance of doubt, I am not suggesting that Mr Green or his associates are doing anything underhand or inappropriate. However, the stance seems to re-emphasise the Schrodinger’s Cat like qualities of the Rangers Football Club “entity”.
I wonder about the issue of the corporate entity v club idea, and suggest a scenario for Rangers fans to consider in the event that they choose to invest in the “corporate entity”.
Sky News’ City Editor reported the following yesterday:-
The new owner of Rangers Football Club is close to appointing advisers to kick off a swift return to the London stock market.
Read the rest here – http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2012/09/08/the-corporate-entity-is-not-rangers-football-club-unless-mr-green-tries-to-sell-shares-in-it/
Agrajag says:
September 8, 2012 at 11:57
Rangers still exists, if anyone is entitled to an audience it is Craig Whyte, members of the Rangers board, or their appointed representatives.
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In this world of smoke and mirrors I presume you mean RFC 2012 Ltd. Remember the name change? In which case would it not have to be Duff&Duffer enter stage left?
Parson St. Bhoy says:
September 8, 2012 at 12:13
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Rangers, then now and forever. Changing the name of the legal entity didn’t change who and what they were are and always will be.
Well until they are wound up.
Correction. (Smoke got in my eyestalk)
After reading Paul McC.’s blog it should should be RFC 2012 PLC. Short of continually refering to Companies House the smoke and mirrors tactic works well.
Angus @ 10-43
If there is some other corruption going on in our game that is not connected to rosemary’s baby please enlighten me as to where this is happening.
If my club [celtic] were involved in any shady dealing’s i would want those people removed from any position’s of power untill innocence/guilt was proven.
This story is the only one were it is not only the club involved but the press and the guardian’s of our game are involved as well.
Some brilliant post’s up since last night BRTH and Goosy being the best of them.This might sound stupid but i know they are good when i can’t understand them.
@dunloytim know they are good when i can’t understand them
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😀
The international interlude has afforded the crooks a period in which they can keep a low profile. We haven’t heard anything from any of them this week, and probably won’t hear anything until after Tuesday. So who’s next to keep the Zombiegers myth going? I think it’s Donkey’s turn next. Anybody running a book on this?
Angus says:
September 8, 2012 at 10:43
4 12 Rate This
dunloytim says:
September 7, 2012 at 22:38
There is no other corruption in our game at the minute except the corruption that has aided rosemary’s baby to be born.
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That’s good then. Glad to know that Scottish football is squeaky clean apart from where RFC and CG are concerned.
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Of course there are other things wrong with Scottish football. But let me try an analogy. A few years ago I stepped out of my kitchen door to find the external drain in the driveway was not draining, but expelling – expelling foul-smelling muck, raw sewage, and other various other items of disgusting domestic waste. At that point, none of the many shortcomings of my house and garden mattered, except the emergency action to deal with the immediate mess and a swift, effective solution to permanently fix the drain. We weren’t, at that point, too worried about the fact that the grass needed cut and the bedrooms needed decorating. Even those problems that might become serious in the long term, like roof maintenance or boiler servicing, could not capture my attention while there was actual sh!t running down the drive.
Helpful?
one of the problems here is that the SFA and Sevco’s only concern is getting Sevco back to the SPL as quickly as possible.
As long as a “Rangers” survive then they dont really have any interest in any other clubs who fold over the next few years and I think several may just do that, they will put it down to whichever particular club not being viable and without a sustainable business model.
But the facts are, it will only take maybe 3 or 4 dozen fans from a smaller club to forced away this season, followed be each season of them having a similar number of mates who follow their leads and also decide they can no longer support the crooked game.
After 3 or 4 seasons you have a small club losing a couple of hvndred diehards and that would be enough to put several lower league clubs out of business.
They know there will be a fall off in crowds over the next few seasons and for some reason and they are banking that “Rangers” coming back into the SPL will be the saviour of our game instead of the destroyer that it actually is.
liviaburlando says:
September 8, 2012 at 13:34
……..there was actual sh!t running down the drive.
Helpful?
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Yes, but when sh!t was flushed into the gutters was it still Sh!t or was it The Sh!t?
Helpful. 🙂
I do, however, believe it would be disingenuous to claim that there was nothing wrong with the rest of your house simply because you had one big overarching problem.
In order for the new club to make it to the SPL they will have to survive.
That is currently by no means certain.
Any objective look at them makes it clear that they need a cash injection from somewhere. That may well be a share issue, but if it isn’t it will have to be from somewhere else.
I do not believe for a second that the SFA / SFL did not know this when they ignored their own rules to leapfrog them into senior football in Scotland.
liviaburlando says:
September 8, 2012 at 13:34
Of course there are other things wrong with Scottish football. But let me try an analogy. A few years ago I stepped out of my kitchen door to find the external drain in the driveway was not draining, but expelling – expelling foul-smelling muck, raw sewage, and other various other items of disgusting domestic waste.
Even those problems that might become serious in the long term, like roof maintenance or boiler servicing, could not capture my attention while there was actual sh!t running down the drive.
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And your solution was simple, bring it to the attention of people who knew what was needed to resolve the problem.
In they came, no time wasted, concluded on the obvious problem and then REMOVED THE TAMPON in the drain that was causing problems for everything connected to it.
So all we need is someone to remove the TAMPON that is The Rangers/Sevco/Newco/nextco and everything else can flow freely again in a clean environment.
Fitting that we have a shower of fannies running our game?