Still a Battle for Survival


Still a Battle for Survival

Apologies for the lack of activity this past few days. I had been expecting a guest blog, but it has failed to materialise thus far. I will endeavour to get that together over the next few days. In the meantine, the moderators would like to thank everyone for their cooperation in keeping some sanity in the face of the recent trolling activity. The self-policing aspect has been admirable over the last few days – as has the level of scrutiny applied to the information which has been coming in.

There have been, understandably, some comments on the blog and elsewhere about a perceived obsesssion here with Rangers and their offspring. Whilst I agree that the focus of this community should have a wider perspective, I don’t think it is obsessional to engage with the big story of the day – in fact it is neccessary that we do so.

Ultimately though TSFM’s longevity will depend on our ability to look at the wider issues, and that is at the top of our minds. We have recently been approached by some people about the possibility of our creating and publicising our own Scottish Football Financial Secrecy League in line with that created a while back for Christian Aid. That may give us some credibility as a watchdog, and utilise the expertise that many contributors have offered so freely in the past.

Right now though the new Rangers show is still headlining, and it is of interest, in the light of the impending share issue, whether the economics of running the new Rangers is really as precariously balanced as has been claimed by some of our number.

If our supsicions of Charles Green’s motives are correct, then we are bound to demonstrate why we think the share issue could be a device to either pay off Ticketus, or Green’s investors to the detriment of the fans.

If the new club’s finances are as precarious as has been stated, then it would point to the share issue being used as a cut and run exercise; but I am not at all convinced of that precariousness.

For example, I don’t accept that The Rangers are paying players an average weekly wage of even as much as £2500. I suspect that the actual figure is considerably less than that, and I hear that basic salaries for the higher quality new players is nearer the £1500 a week mark, with considerably less being offered to the younger guys. Of course performance bonuses would be added to that, but if my figure is correct, Green has a considerable amount of headroom to pay those bonuses.

On the other hand, Green will not have the sponsorship bucks, the media cash, or the prize money that old Rangers would have taken for granted, so there is a defecit there. It may also be of interest to see whether the reported figures for ST sales can be verified. I don’t think it would be churlish for Rangers fans to demand proof of that success before stumping up for a share or two, but one would have to say that reported high figures may well influence an investment decision – and in spite of those impressive numbers (35,000 STs sold) private investors still remain in hiding. It is at times like these that Adam would be an invaluable asset, bringing as he did an alternative and forensic accounting perspective to the somewhat wishful thinking of our non-Rangers tendency 🙂

If the success of Charles Green’s project is determined solely by how much money he makes, then it is in the interest of Rangers fans that any plans to line his own pockets via a share issue (if that is really his intention) are exposed. If Green’s accusers are correct (and let’s not forget that Rangers diehards like John Brown are among their number), then we would have to assume that his biggest success yet has been to get the bears onside, buying imprssively high numbers of STs, after the initial hostility he faced.

Rangers fans who have involved themsleves in critical thinking over the matter will know that some serious damage to the new club will be the result if Green is allowed to pull off any such scam, but they will also know that if he is genuinely invested in the well-being of the club, he is probably their best hope.

That is the dilemma they face.

All talk of stripping titles and history is a red-herring. The real problem for new Rangers is not lost titles or trophy notches on an Ibrox crossbar. It is, as it has been all summer long for old Rangers, survival.

About the author

Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

455 Comments so far

slimshady61Posted on7:32 pm - Sep 10, 2012

The most revealing fact this evening is that 2 years ago the First Tier Tribunal (Tax) asked the SFA if they had any knowledge that RFC(IA) were operating dual contracts and to provide them with whatever evidence they had to that effect.

They received nothing from the SFA, which at that time of course was operating a “business as usual” policy under the transparent and ethical presidency of Campbell Ogilvie.

So in 2010 the SFA thought everything was hvnky d0ry, because they were at the time free from any interfering internet bampot or other buffoon gently enquiring as to what was going on.

The hope at that time will have been that the tribunal collapsed or found in favour of RFC(IA), and David Murray could transfer the shares to a suitable, [SFM Edit] successor.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

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coineanachantaighePosted on7:34 pm - Sep 10, 2012

timtim says:
September 10, 2012 at 19:11
No,QP played in 2 FA cup finals both v Blackburn Rovers and lost them both
Beat me to it! You soccerudite person you. 🙂

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timtimPosted on7:35 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Its all going to plan nicely
Remember the arch villain in all this is Sir David Murray ,he is the cause of the demise of Rfc
Craig Whyte entered stage left and carried the can for him ,everyone (nearly) was duped by the intrepid turnaround expert before his exit stage right. Even Ally admits the club was badly run for 10 months (try 10 years Ally).
Charles leapt into the waters and fought the Great White salvaging all that was dear to the worlds greatest club and now the finger of blame is being pointed at Bogits FCs and their hired hands in Blazers.
Charles is blameless ,he may even end up a hero in his version of General Custards last stand
in the eyes of the fans. If the plan was collapse and cash in the real estate assets then the patsy has been found. If the plan is to find a scapegoat to rally the fans for the share issue then he’s got that as well ,either way its a win win for Charles (and Craig and Sir David) and a lose lose for the fans of Rfc* .

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john clarkePosted on7:35 pm - Sep 10, 2012

campsiejoe says:
September 10, 2012 at 18:47
‘Charlie has effectively called Celtic out as well in that statement, and silence is now no longer golden..’
I say again, Celtic have no duty to get involved unilaterally in making statements.

In fact, they now have a positive duty to keep their mouths shut since the agenda has now switched to frothing-at-the -mouth Green attacking certain clubs! That evil man will do his damndest to convince people that Celtic have all along been the prime movers in RFC’s downfall and extinction.

Secondly, I would say that the SFA now has to square up to the fact that its own rule breaking has emboldened the evil one and his cohorts.

They must now really bite the bullet, and expel Sevco/Rangers as not having been entitled under the rules to SFA membership as a ‘transfer share’ recipient, because they are manifestly not the Rangers club against whom EBT charges have been made. (CG is quite right about that.) and should have been treated as a brand new applicant for membership.

They must then instead insist that D&P, as the legally responsible ‘de facto’ directors of RFC(IA) under their Administrators’ function, answer the charges and defend that club.

And their failure to do so should automatically be taken as an admission of guilt, and the consequent football consequences of failing to tell the SFA of all payments made to players ( e.g.stripping of all illicitly gained titles) should be applied, and the record books amended to reflect the true position..

CG’s ‘The Rangers’ might, unfortunately, have to get a refund of any payments they made as part of their bribe to get SFA membership, but that wouldn’t do them much good when they are expelled from participation ,sine die, in any kind of recognised football under the auspices of the SFA, or Uefa.

I think we are in for very much more interesting times.The existing SFA will be crucified whatever they do, bad cess to them for their chicanery and double-dealing.

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ollielogiePosted on7:37 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I agree Captain Haddock!

Just when you think things are going quiet…..along comes Charlie stirring it up again. The gift that keeps on giving.

Think its a win/win situation for Charlie: he whips up forment and stays: and the bears keep turning up, paying for cross bar challenges no one will win and charley prepares for a listing. 2. He whips up forment and goes complaining that Establishment shut the club, the bears turn on the rest of us and he walks away with the £ raised so far and an asset sale.

I like this movie though….popcorn?

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ollielogiePosted on7:43 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Smallteaser says

That made me laugh out loud! Can you imagine SR and ND faces when they read charlie and Duffers (copyright acknowledged) statement!


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john clarkePosted on7:46 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Logie says:
September 10, 2012 at 19:37
” … and charley prepares for a listing….’
This is the really incredible thing. I’ve always thought his eyes had a kind of Enoch Powell look in them.
And Enoch Powell was a baleful, malevolent racist, madman- ask your fathers/grandfathers, whose political madness makes Thatcher’s look like the definition of sanity!.

How could Cenkos Securities even begin to think of constructing a Prospectus for a share issue of a club that on a daily basis contributes to its own destruction?

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HighlandjaggiePosted on7:49 pm - Sep 10, 2012

A ten year ban from the SPL for taking the piss should derail mr. Green.

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smallteaserPosted on7:51 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Duff & Phelps
““This has been communicated to the SPL and considering that further involvement in this matter is not in the interests of its creditors, RFC 2012 PLC will have no further involvement with the Commission.”
Does this mean that D & D will not supply any documentation pertaining to players contracts or registration details??
Does the onus now fall on the SFA to provide the copies of the said documents??
Will they all still be available.?
The good news is that without any defence from either RFC this should be finished very quickly.

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jonnyodPosted on7:51 pm - Sep 10, 2012

So CG calls the powers that be out AGAIN ,what’s the betting there will be silence from SFA/SPL AGAIN .
hearings have been deliberately delayed and sanctions have been worthless thus far ,so why would that change now .
IMO a pact has been made with the devil and there is no turning back now ,instead of just applying the rules as they were ,the SPL/SFA have allowed themselves to be corrupted by this scam and it has now descended into farce .
No one will come out of this well and reputations have already been trashed ,there are peepil making decisions now that will out in the future and I have no doubt this year and possibly next will go down as the years that killed Scottish football for the real football fans
The damage is already irretrievable IMO

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john clarkePosted on7:53 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Galling fiver says:
September 10, 2012 at 18:46
‘..Phone the Polis somebody.’
And ask them how their wee investigation is coming along after all this time? 🙂

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john clarkePosted on7:58 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Lost my wee koala again! ( is that because I wasn’t asked to sign in on my password when I made my first post this evening?)

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WOTTPIPosted on7:58 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Just a wee thoughts.
Were any of the TUPE 5 on ebts?
Therefore although not a spl member can Sevco be called because they still hold the player registration.

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campsiejoePosted on7:58 pm - Sep 10, 2012

john clarke @ 19:35


Until now, I have agreed with you regarding Celtic’s stance
I feel though that the statement deserves some sort of response, even if it is only along the lines of asking Green to be specific about the clubs he is referring to

Up till now he has been on the front foot, with no one prepared to say boo to him, so it’s time for a change
He needs to be drawn out, and then he can be attacked, which may allow us to regain the initiative, and put him on the back foot

As for the rest of your post, I’m in the same camp as you

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StevieBCPosted on8:00 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Just when you think that the credibility of the SFA and SPL can’t sink any lower…

In case anyone missed it over the last 6 months in particular, Charlie is now just rubbing everyones noses in it: only one club matters in Scotland.

Will Regan or Doncaster actually respond to this latest outburst? (I know, I know.)

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essexbeancounterPosted on8:01 pm - Sep 10, 2012

john clarke says:
September 10, 2012 at 19:58
0 0 i Rate This

Lost my wee koala again! ( is that because I wasn’t asked to sign in on my password when I made my first post this evening?)


JC…I am off out into the wilds of suburban Essex to look for it…I pray to all my gods that the “Essex lion” doesn’t get to it first…!

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Long Time LurkerPosted on8:03 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Wow, just wow.

Mr Green is either off his head (and believes what he is saying) or he is playing a dangerous game – putting petrol on the fire. I cannot believe that somone would be so reckless as to creatae an us and them situation with RFC(IA)/Sevco and the growing fan base who have rightly called out for fair play and sporting integrity.

The statement by Green is cowardly – it will stoke up resentment, it will raise passions and sadly no good will come from this.

This is cowardly, dangerous act is beyond rotten to the core.

The whole saga needs to end and end soon. The truth must be found and exposed to public scrutiny. Laws (criminal and civil) must be applied fairly and reasonably and sporting rules should also be applied without fear or favour.

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AlthetimPosted on8:05 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Charlie Green bangs his gums about not attending the hearing into the alleged dual contracts issue involving Rangers. So what? Why should he, or anyone connected with T’Rangers attend? Why would a representative from T’Rangers be invited in the first place? It’s got eff all to do with them.

Rangers FC PLC, now known as Rangers (2012) Ltd are alleged to have used illegal (in football terms) EBT’s to remumerate players outwith registered contracts, not The Rangers Football Club Ltd, formerly known as Sevco. Nowt to do with T’Rangers or Charlie boy.

I didn’t bother reading Charlies statement. It’s irrelevant to the issue at hand. Charlie is being very clever, using the situation to curry favour with the supporters of the old club, perpetuating the persecution myth and reinforcing the siege mentality.

Charlie knows full well that T’Rangers aren’t Rangers. He’s doing a wonderful job fooling the Rangers fans into thinking otherwise though. There’s a pied piper/flute analogy in there somewhere but I won’t pursue it.

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john clarkePosted on8:11 pm - Sep 10, 2012

campsiejoe says:
September 10, 2012 at 19:58
” ..He needs to be drawn out, and then he can be attacked,..’
I understand your desire that CG should be challenged, and if I were ever to find myself in a one-to-one confrontation, I’d do a lot of challenging.

But this latest madness of his can do nothing except hasten his downfall.

The clubs that he attacks ( i.e the majority of the SPL clubs) will have a lot to say.

Every club that has ever submitted to the SFA’s hearings and adjudications will have a lot to say.

Every club that chose not to threaten civil legal action when it might have done, but accepted the jurisdiction of the football authorities, will have plenty to say.

I would not be surprised if a head of steam now builds up irresistably for an Extraordinary
General meeting of the SFA to be called urgently.

For Celtic to speak now, even in defence of themselves, might, in my view, create a fault line that could be exploited by Sevco sympathisers like, for example, CO and the other wretches.

(Ps. can I call myself campsiejohn? :))

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john clarkePosted on8:17 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Essex beancounter says:
September 10, 2012 at 20:01

Thank you. If he’s taken for a bear, he might be safe from the lion, but he definitely wouldn’t want to be taken for such!
If you find him, I hope you have one of the very few types of eucalyptus leaves that he eats. Failing that, he will enjoy a deep-fried Mars bar, and Mars Ltd can sod off!

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john clarkePosted on8:20 pm - Sep 10, 2012

mine of 20.11.
Irresistably should, of course, be ‘irresistibly’. Apologies.

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smartie1947Posted on8:23 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Essex Beancounter@20.01

“Essex lion” my bahookie.
Just like Charles Green he turned out to be a big pussy.

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TSFMPosted on8:23 pm - Sep 10, 2012

john clarke says:

September 10, 2012 at 19:58(Edit)

Lost my wee koala again! ( is that because I wasn’t asked to sign in on my password when I made my first post this evening?)

Don’t think the problem is this end. is the avatar showing up beside the comments box just before you post?
There was a Gravatar problem last week when it wasn’t rendering the avatars, but others seem to be fine.

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AuldheidPosted on8:27 pm - Sep 10, 2012

campsiejoe says:

September 10, 2012 at 18:47

I’m guessing but I think Celtic’s policy has been to follow due process as diligently as possible which means saying nothing in public that might derail that process, be it FTT or EBt/Dual Contracts Enquiry.

I can understand the frustration at the silence but that silence just keeps handing CG another shovel.

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Galling fiverPosted on8:28 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Is Mr Chali G, “is it because i is blue”, really looking to get booted out so he can keep the ST money?

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Long Time LurkerPosted on8:28 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Auldheid says:

September 10, 2012 at 20:27

Excellent point

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smallteaserPosted on8:30 pm - Sep 10, 2012

When is THE Rangers not Rangers?
When Charlie G says so.
Check Charlies statement, 9 times he mentions the word NEW, why then was a transfer of membership given by the SFA?, why was there no vote on another club getting entry to the SFL?

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john clarkePosted on8:31 pm - Sep 10, 2012

TSFM says:
September 10, 2012 at 20:23

Thanks for replying.
I can’t actually remember whether it was there before clicking ‘post comment’. It might sort itself, bit it’s of no geat consequence.

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campsiejoePosted on8:32 pm - Sep 10, 2012

john clarke @ 20:11

Either individually or collectively, the clubs now need to do or say something
A member club of the SFA has openly challenged the football authorities, and that club has to dealt with, and dealt with severely

As for calling yourself campsiejohn, feel free, as long as you satisfy the residential requirements 🙂

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jw hardinPosted on8:35 pm - Sep 10, 2012

The demise of The Govan Club its potential for public disorder will be resolved by D Murray appearing in court. Only then will the public, especially fans of TGC, will grasp the enormity of these crimes.

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smallteaserPosted on8:36 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Auldheid says:
September 10, 2012 at 20:27

I think Celtic are holding there counsel, publicly because it would cost them fans.
No matter what statement they come out with, they along with every other club in Scotland, are complicit in this.
From the attempt to get them into the SPL, to the refusal by the SFL for a vote of no confidence, they are all complicit.
Chickens are coming home to roost and we have all been done over “for the good of Scottish football” of course

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StevieBCPosted on8:41 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Charlie is an asset stripper.
His job is to extract maximum profit for himself and his backers – even if it involves leaving a trail of devastation in his wake, (for employees, creditors etc…).
Wrt Sevco: job done (almost).

The SFA governs Scottish football.

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MikecPosted on8:43 pm - Sep 10, 2012

If Charlie boy states that the Company he now controls has never been part of the SPL and therefore not Liabable for the former owners actions I can understand that, however the investigation being held tomorrow is into the question of alleged dual contracts of a football club previously know as “Rangers” . Is he now then admitting that the “Club” I.e. “Rangers” is not the club his current Company controls ? I.e. a completely different club.
Is that not when this site has been maintaining for months.

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Eastern ex-patPosted on8:44 pm - Sep 10, 2012

So CG says he purchased all the history of the old Rangers FC but, despite ‘having’ all the history, we are not in any way connected with the old club when it comes to potential sanctions.

Even after a relaxing holiday, this is confusing……

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chancer67Posted on8:45 pm - Sep 10, 2012

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justshateredPosted on8:48 pm - Sep 10, 2012

What a bizarre statement.
It has all the mad ramblings of Colonel Gadaffi at his height.
Of course what Chas fails to mention is the fact that it is the player’s registrations which are illegal.
He may indeed win on a point of principle but the fact that the player registrations are submitted to the SFA seems to have conveniently slipped his mind. RFC were playing in competitions that were under the auspicious of the SFA and it is their rules that have been broken.
Indeed the SFA had stood back from launching it’s own enquiry as it was going to be the one that heard the appeal after the SPL had carried out it’s own investigation.
Meanwhile Chas works the “we’re the same club but a different club” angle.
The interesting thing is that in his latest edict Chas clearly states that he was given information regarding Bill Miller’s bid. So while everyone had to sign confidentiality documents with Duff and Phelps they themselves were telling Chas how all the negotiations were going. That in itself could end in a lawsuit from the USA.

Just as you think things could not get any worse he then asks the question that everybody in Scotland, with the exception of the media, have been asking for over a year. Why has it taken so long to investigate this?
Well I don’t know about anyone else but I formulated the answer to that question about March; corruption from an organisation which long ago lost the moral authority to rule Scottish football. An organisation that deliberately dithered and abandoned it’s rule book to suit one club to ensure that that club lasted until the end of the season so that the switcheroo could occur. Make no mistake about it if RFC had gone into liquidation in mid season then the game was over and there was no way back. That they were allowed to limp on to the end of May sticking it to all and sundry must be one of the biggest scandals in Scottish corporate history. The Police, despite saying, that they wanted paying up front to police their remaining fixtures never got their, sorry our, cash.
The SFA now stand accused of bringing its own sport into disrepute. The SPL has been a disaster for the development of our national game and should be disbanded.

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Fans Against CorruptionPosted on8:49 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Be assured, you will hear nothing from the SFA on this.

They realised a long time ago where ultimately this would lead, and did what they do best – cr*pped it.
An utterly dysfunctional organisation, hiding behind an untrue and yet unchallenged premise that they COULDN’T be involved.

Just consider for a second. The organisation who have applied and will police a registration ban for Sevco have previously said that they could not get involved in an investigation …… into registration malpractice!

This is the same organisation who could have put all of this beyond any argument by insisting that this new club apply for a new membership, instead of by-passing their own rules with a concocted “transfer”, shying away from facing up to the fact that one of its own members had cheated itself to suicide.

Cowards who should be run out of the office they are not fit to hold.

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bad capt madmanPosted on8:50 pm - Sep 10, 2012


Good point about CG being on the front foot. He does get an unbelievably easy time from both the msm and the football authorities.

When will he be challenged on his statements?
When will he be asked to provide evidence for his claims?
When will he be asked why his previous assurances and agreements have not been kept?
When will he be asked to provide the information on his previous promises? (who are the financial backers? When will he pay the football debts)

As many have said, and sorry to say it again, the SFA really need to provide both leadership and a consistency of proper compliance. That is what they are there for. That is their purpose. Can they show they are fit for it?

The SFA of course, aren’t just the officials, all clubs share responsibilities to ensure rules are followed and officials only act within their powers.

I wonder if it will be CG who makes the five way agreement public to substantiate his claims? That would be interesting.

Again, as others have said, the frankenstein monster is running amok, beginning to take it’s revenge, and it won’t end well for anyone. Not the villagers, not the monster, not the monster makers.

Well, except in the Young Fronkenstein version, but I don’t expect this particular monster to turn into a sophisticated gent.

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campsiejoePosted on8:53 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Auldheid @ 20:27

I understand the points you are making, but at some point Green has to be challenged
Timing, as always is crucial

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ZilchPosted on8:55 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Will be interested to hear more informed opinions than mine, but like others I see no reason why CG / Sevco should be involved with an SPL investigation into dual contracts used by RFC(IA).

D&P appear to be offering their last ounce of professional credibility on the SEVCO sacrificial altar, presumably on the back of a guaranteed pay-off at some later date? Offshore trust anybody?

CG continues to stir up social unrest in order to maximise income, with flagrant disregard for the consequences on the streets of Glasgow and surrounding areas. Decent fans of the Gers should be appalled.

The MSM has either still not got a clue or have failed to evolve the spinal structure that helps other bipeds cope with modern living. Plus ca change eh?

The SFA / SPL / SFL are doing what? We shall see. They hold the future of the sport in their hands. They are all associations of members. Only those members can force the associations to abide by their published rules. Failure to enforce those rules in a fair and transparent manner at this time has to be met with votes of no confidence. We have to keep up the pressure on our clubs to defend the integrity of the sport – it is the only way the business will survive.

FWIW, I don’t agree that Celtic have any unilateral leadership role to play at this time, other than to maintain their silence. It is for ALL clubs in the SPL to show leadership and insist upon fair play. Likewise, it will be for ALL clubs in the SFA to insist upon fair play when the appeal is heard there.

The essence of this blog is the responsibility that WE ALL have to ensure that sporting integrity is the guiding light through these dark times.

Damn – I had plans to do some work this week…. Oh well, interesting times and all that.

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M8 DreamersPosted on8:56 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Once more Scottish Football has been subjected to the total conceit and arrogance of Charles Green of Sevco/Rangers Tribute Act who continues to believe that they are in total control of Scottish Football and are to be completely immune from any form of punishment for any offence.
As he claims that his new Fantasy Football team have absolutely no connection with the SPL as they are part of the SFL, perhaps the best thing that could happen when the SPL Commission find them guilty of the EBT Scheme, is for the Commission to pass a “Life Ban” on the Rangers Tribute Act being a member of the SPL at any time in the future.
It is absolutely essential that the SPL take full cognisance of the SPL Commission decision to ensure that whatever punishment is determined, is applied.
The stripping of titles is of little importance, if Rangers Football Club are found guilty, because every football supporter within Scotland will know the real truth for once and the guilty parties will be dealt with through the Courts and Football Authorities.
On a more minor issue, any Rangers Tribute Act supporter that is taken in by Charles Green with his “£1 million crossbar challenge” deserves everything that comes there way. You would be just as well buying Lottery Tickets and throwing them away before the draw is made.

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adamate12Posted on8:57 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I understand now – CG has only bought the good history! And to suggest the fact that the scam didn’t work every year that therefore it wasn’t really a scam is a joke

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goosyPosted on8:58 pm - Sep 10, 2012

The only truth Green told was that he was only here for the short term
Forget every motivation behind his comments except one
“Making as much money as possible in the short term”
Every word Green utters this side of the fund raising is dictated by the aim of ensuring the crooked few get as much money as possible from the gullible many

Having got his “short term” promise out of the way on Day 1

Green has only one script

“I hope you like what I say”

How any ex RFC fans can give money to someone who has publicly declared he will soon be off

is mind boggling

It beggars belief.
Any who do deserve all they get

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bad capt madmanPosted on9:02 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Wonder if any bears due up in court in the next day or so will be inspired to use the CG defence tactic and intimate that they will boycott the preceedings.

Wonder also how they’ll feel when it doesn’t work, either for them or for CG himself.

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pau1mart1nPosted on9:02 pm - Sep 10, 2012

adamate12 says:

September 10, 2012 at 20:57

I understand now – CG has only bought the good history! And to suggest the fact that the scam didn’t work every year that therefore it wasn’t really a scam is a joke

i am told mr traynor repeated this on air this evening.
unbelievable degree of stupity from the bold james.
even for him.

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chancer67Posted on9:08 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Charlie is trying to get Celtic to bite (I hope they keep shtum for now) because he knows what is coming,the true fans of oldco know what he is up to and what we are witnessing at Ibrox is mass hysteria and denial that the club is gone.

The Rangers fansites are full of fans who admit they are attending Ibrox for the first time in years some as many as 20 years, so what has happened to the fans who are no longer going ?

Decent Rangers fans the ones with disposable income that Charlie is after wont be fooled by his call to arms of the rabble rousers, and the bigots wont be able to afford the share option so this is looking like a last hurrah from Charlie.
The sooner this despot is put in his place and chased down the road the better Scottish football will be for it.

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adamate12Posted on9:11 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I think they are using the Lance Armstrong Defence – when you realise you are about to be found guilty make a quick exit protesting your innocence.

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PaulsatimPosted on9:13 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Mr McG ‏@weegie67
Debt? We’re Newco. Titles? We’re Oldco. Punishment? We’re Newco. History? We’re Oldco. EBTs? Newco. SFA Licence? Oldco. #TheRangersWaltz

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campsiejoePosted on9:15 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I have long been of the opinion, that the SFA/SPL have been aware of the dual contracts, and were quite happy to turn a blind eye to the problem as long as Murray was at the helm
All of that changed when the MBB appeared, and helped RFC into administration

I am sure that this event never entered the Stooges thinking when they were turning their blind eye, nor did they think the FTT posed any problem to the comfortable status quo
Charlie has dirt to dish, and by the sounds of that statement he is prepared to dish it

So all of the scheming, rule breaking and bending, could be about to unravel, and no matter what happens, the SFA/SPL are going to be totally discredited
Give in and they will be shown to be incompetent, gutless cowards
Stand up to him and they will be exposed as the corrupt organisations we all suspect them to be
Either way we are at a watershed

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SBhoyPosted on9:19 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Celtic Football Club…..Haud yer weesht…

IMO CFC are doing the right thing, Mr Lawwell and Co. will obviously be / have been monitoring the situation very closely, for the last 12 – 18 months.( Or longer?) I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that the SSM and his administrators, will have been and will continue to be notifying / updating the relevant bodies within their own association (SPL,SFA) of their concerns, with a CC at the bottom to the relevant world body (FIFA).

Celtic have nothing to fear in the demise of sevco Scotland (barring some financials, which they will overcome) but have much moral high ground to claim, and rightly so, as they are managed professionally, and with Integrity.

Celtic, The Football Club, which includes the vast majority of their fanbase, are among the most respected Clubs participating on the European / World stage, they have proven this time and time again, year after year.

At times like this, I am proud to be a Celtic fan, and have every confidence in the Clubs Board of Directors.

I do not wish to end this post on a negative note, but CG, and those before him < CW < (s)DM < and all of their cohorts, have, for various reasons, fame and financial gain, made a mockery of the Scottish game!!

End it Now Please, eradicate this once great institution to the annals of history.

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longtimelurkerPosted on9:19 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Pretty obvious, to me at least, that there has been government interference in this fiasco.

The clubs and the football authorities have quiet clearly been told that they have no say in this matter, why else would the entire football establishment in this country, with the exception of one or two principled individuals and clubs who refused to be silenced such as TH and Clyde FC, make no public statements in relation to the public utterances of Green, Jardine and McCoist?

Make no mistake, professional football in this country has been compromised by the actions of The State.

I can never recall any other club or club official making these sorts of inflammatory statements without official comment from the football authorities.

We are crossing the Rubicon guys.

And surely the silence from the clubs and the authorities tells you that something massive has gone on, as people have said on both here and on RTC you have to focus on what people are not saying not what they are saying and in this respect the silence tells you all that you really have to know.

Frankly I am ashamed of Scottish football, it is a complete sham.

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CrazyHorsePosted on9:21 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Charles Le Vert est fou comme une boîte des grenouilles!

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Sugar DaddyPosted on9:26 pm - Sep 10, 2012

CG adopting the Lance Armstrong defence by refusing to take part.

Unfortunately, dual contract players won titles in the SPL so entirely appropriate they investigate.

How does he keep track of what days/investigations/meetings when he is Rangers and when he is not Rangers?

The icing on the cake will be when he presents the share issue. What journalist will ask the question whether fans are buying into the club or company?

its been quiet for a few weeks but this farce is entering a new phase. What with the FTT around the corner, dual contracts investigation underway and best of all reports that Rangers fans are hiding Downfall in book shops.

The Rangers are about to plumb new depths.

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Lamp Post SanniesPosted on9:28 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Re the stripping of titles if Original Gers are found guilty it’s really quite simple.

The Eeh Bah Gummi Bears claim to have bought 54 league titles from Oldco, as well as assorted cups. That’s fine but if it’s proven that oldco won some of them outwith the rules then they’ve actually been stolen from the rightful winners and oldco had no legal right to claim ownership. So sorry Charlie but although you may have purchased them from D&P in good faith it turns out they’re stolen property and like anyone who has found out they’ve unwittingly bought stolen goods you have to give them back.

You could of course then take D&P to court to sue them for the purchase price for any stolen trophies but good luck with that claim

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RanchofrancoPosted on9:29 pm - Sep 10, 2012

It’s patently obvious that Minty with the connivance of the SFA has engineered this whole farce.
Whyte was clearly instructed to set in the motion the series of ‘unfortunate’ fiscal events that would enable the charade of a D&P administration to ‘tidy’ up the paperwork in the hope of a successful CVA that would allow the debt to be dumped whilst the History and the valuable human capital remained intact and playing in the lucrative SPL/CL competitions whilst their cheerleaders in the despicable Scottish sports press enraptured of the mighty Gers would go into full blown deflective overdrive to salute the genius of such a cunning plan by one or other within the hokey cokey rainbow consortiums of ‘Knights’ who came up trumps.
Well,HMRC and the Bampots managed to head that off at the pass for a week or so until Minty had fully appraised the lurking wolverine Green of plan ‘B’ and set him about the SFA hen house he had corruptedly controlled so assiduously and for so long that they surrendered all pretence of legislative authority to the demands of the baying hordes at Ibrox.
By sheer force of twisted logic and by real threats of violence, an abhorrent, delinquent club that should have legitimately been declared dead and buried weeks ago continues in it’s shambling zombie state to issue menacing proclamations that undermine the whole fabric of a decent society.
From book banning intimidation to refusal to accept either consequences or punishments for their sordid fiscal and sporting misdeeds the spiritual heart of the Sevcovian has been laid bare for all to see.This state of impunity is a consequence of the debauchery that Murray the megalomaniac imposed upon all the vested interests whose remit should only have been concerned with the upholding of good governance for all, not the wilfully corrupt protection at any cost for one reprobate club.

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longtimelurkerPosted on9:30 pm - Sep 10, 2012

paul martin says:
September 10, 2012 at 21:02
2 0 Rate This
adamate12 says:

September 10, 2012 at 20:57

I understand now – CG has only bought the good history! And to suggest the fact that the scam didn’t work every year that therefore it wasn’t really a scam is a joke

i am told mr traynor repeated this on air this evening.
unbelievable degree of stupity from the bold james.
even for him.


The implication being that in those years they never cheated enough.

Stupid is as stupid does.

As many of the more erudite posters on here keep saying.

‘Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.’

Mark Twain.

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CharliePosted on9:40 pm - Sep 10, 2012

In another context is acquiring someone’s history not called Identity fraud and you go to the pokey for that?

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kellsPosted on9:41 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Not sure if i missed the point but should it not be the SFA who deal with the dual contracts issue as they are the governing body or would that be to close to the heart of the corruption

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Para HandyPosted on9:42 pm - Sep 10, 2012

smallteaser says:
September 10, 2012 at 20:36
 9 4 Rate This
Auldheid says:
September 10, 2012 at 20:27

I think Celtic are holding there counsel, publicly because it would cost them fans.
No matter what statement they come out with, they along with every other club in Scotland, are complicit in this.
From the attempt to get them into the SPL, to the refusal by the SFL for a vote of no confidence, they are all complicit.
Chickens are coming home to roost and we have all been done over “for the good of Scottish football” of course

As soon as one rule was broken to allow a new club to enter the SFL, all where complicit. Even those who garnered much support on here, the Clyde BoD and Turnbull Hutton as examples, have gone from being outspoken and defiant to complicit in a stitch up which would make banking heads proud.

If you wanted any proof that, “In order for evil to flourish, all that is required is for good men to do nothing.” Look no further than this.

The entirety of Scottish football is to blame. The larger and more influential the entity choosing to stay silent in this, the more blame can be apportioned. “Arguments” such as, “Had we said anything the press would have pilloried us.” are specious and easily dismissed.

Given the perfect storm of this debacle, a double dip recession, a national team that, even were it not governed by an apparently morally bankrupt organisation, continues to promise nothing and deliver exactly that, a MSM which is in terminal decline and sporting alternatives being brought into everyone’s front room by the Olympics, I cannot see Scottish football ever recovering.

Within the next ten years, many clubs will cease to exist as anything other than part timers, a shell of their former selves.

A terrible state of affairs but one brought upon Scottish football by the silence of the lambs.

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Ordinary FanPosted on9:43 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Charles Green is more than likely not allowed to be at the hearing. He just can’t come out and say “Of course we will not be at the hearing because we are not RFC, this nothing to do with us, we are just a mere tribute act.”
Also the SFA and MSM are too terrified to contradict Green, so whatever he says becomes truth.

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longtimelurkerPosted on9:46 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Ordinary Fan says:
September 10, 2012 at 21:43
1 0 Rate This
Charles Green is more than likely not allowed to be at the hearing. He just can’t come out and say “Of course we will not be at the hearing because we are not RFC, this nothing to do with us, we are just a mere tribute act.”
Also the SFA and MSM are too terrified to contradict Green, so whatever he says becomes truth.


‘You can fool all of the people…’

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SBhoyPosted on9:48 pm - Sep 10, 2012

gie’s a gonk says:

September 10, 2012 at 21:28

To be fair g a g, he did only pay a single shiny quid for the history?

Geez, I’ll give it back to him

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TheBlackKnight TBKPosted on9:50 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Me thinks the laddie doth protest too much…… But why?


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DelbhoyPosted on9:56 pm - Sep 10, 2012

” Further to our earlier statement:
Not only will St. Mirrenoff ( P&D League ) not be attending the S.P.L. meeting tomorrow,
every one of us denies having sex with David Becham. And Katherine Jenkins.
Our lawyers have been informed “.

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AuldheidPosted on9:59 pm - Sep 10, 2012

campsiejoe says:

September 10, 2012 at 20:53

Yup. You know me – infinite patience produces immediate results.

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dunloytimPosted on9:59 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I really hope that the sniveling coward that is the ceo of the spl tonight fetches his spine from whatever cold storage unit he left it in.Absolutley disgusting that this cretin Green has now proved beyond any shadow of doubt who is running our game.
Doncaster and Regan were warned that leniency would be seen as weakness and dead club and it’s supporters would take full advantage of that cowardice and weakness.Somebody joked[i think it was a joke]to call the police but this should happen as he is winding up a support who are more than willing to act on his rant’s

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longtimelurkerPosted on10:00 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Surely Harper McLeod must be studying this latest statement by Green with interest as he (CG) has called H M’s integrity into question?

“Furthermore, as a Club we are not satisfied that the issue of conflict of interest relating to advisers to the SPL has been satisfactorily dealt with.”

Any solicitors on here care to comment?

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broganrogantrevinoandhoganPosted on10:12 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Good Evening,

Somebody somewhere once said that September would be an interesting month……………..

Charles Hardin Holley ( with an e ) was born in Lubbock Texas on September 7th 1936.. so just a few days ago would have been his 76th Birthday. Of course by the time he tragically died in a plane crash ( with J.P. “The Big Bopper” Richardson and Richie Valens ) on 3rd February 1959 the world knew him as simply Buddy Holly.

The change of name came about because his family simply referred to him as “Buddy”, and when Decca records signed him and his band up to their label in 1955 they misspelled his name as “Holly”— with the reult that the world got Buddy Holly — although in truth he was still Charles Hardin Holley.

It just goes to show you that you can actually have two legal names at once and still be the same person.

Today, in an astonishing statement, Mr Charles Green of The Rangers Football Club issued a statement where he mirrored Buddy Holly— he seeks to persuade the world that his company can have one name but be two legal people!

We are Rangers… We are Not Rangers…. yes we are Rangers…. just not the Rangers with the debts… we are The Rangers who are debt free. We are not part of the SPL, but we own the titles that the SPL awarded to someone else entirely who were called…… well Rangers…… and if the SPL, who issued those titles, in any way decide to take those titles away from that other somebody who is or was called Rangers…. then we will not be giving them up because they belong to us…. The Rangers…….and we will not be going to any legal hearings about this issue……. but if there is a decision which we don’t like then we will be appealing to the courts against the decision which we were not party to and which may well have not been against us at all but against that other Rangers… because……. well…… just because……ok?

Mr Green’s statement today is one of the strangest statements I have ever seen given that it is supposedly made after he had taken extensive legal advice.

Let’s just look at some of what he said today:

“The club ceased to be subject to the SPL’s rules when it was ejected from its league,” he said.

“Our lawyers have made that point repeatedly to the SPL in correspondence and yet our requests for an explanation from the SPL have been completely ignored. The SPL’s silence on these issues is deafening.

“The outcome of the SPL’s process will have no legal effect.”

He goes on:

“”To make it crystal clear, the new owners purchased all the business and assets of Rangers, including titles and trophies.

“Any attempt to undermine or diminish the value of those assets will be met with the stiffest resistance, including legal recourse.”


“As far as I am concerned, Rangers Football Club has won a world record 54 league titles, and, whatever the decision of the SPL commission, these titles cannot and will not be taken away from us and our Manager Ally McCoist is in total agreement.”

Quite separately Mr Green berates the five way agreement, seemingly implying that the agreement includes some kind of deal on EBT’s and the relevant sanctions:

“”What compounds the breathtaking hypocrisy of the SPL in this whole saga, is that the SFA, the SPL and us – as the new owners – took part in numerous discussions regarding the new company’s league status during which it was made clear that a deal was there to be done where ‘the EBT issue’ would be dealt with as part of a package of sanctions which would be implemented in return for membership of the SFA and a place in either the SPL or Division One.

“We do not accept that people who are willing to come to an agreement on such matters then have a right to instigate a full blown inquisition when matters do not unfold as they thought they would.

“In our view, it beggars belief that an authority which can be heavily involved in these discussions to the point that the chief executive Neil Doncaster repeatedly stated he was not interested in stripping titles from Rangers can lurch from that position to setting up its own commission under the chairmanship of Lord Nimmo Smith.”

Now follow me if you will:

Imagine you buy a watch from a man selling watches from a tray in a street market. You have paid the price, and you have the watch. Then imagine the police come to the door and let you know that the man had stolen the watch, that it was not legally his to sell and so they demand that you hand the watch over to them for return to the rightful owner.

Well it would appear that if you are Mr Green you will refuse to hand it over and go to court. yet you cannot obtain a good title from someone who does not have a good title to give in the first place.

Further, imagine that when you buy the watch from the man in the street, you already know that he is under investigation for obtainig watches illegally. You can’t even argue that you have been duped in that case because you already know that any title proffered by the seller may well be flawed.

That is where Charles Green stands with regard to the question of titles.

Except that it is even worse than that– because the hearing starting tomorrow is an investigation into matters which took place before his company even existed, and concerns the winning of competitions by a team called Rangers who the Governing body presumed at the time had acted within the rules.

It now appears that there is every possibility that at the material time, the team called Rangers did not act within the rules at all and so the SPL, as the governing body and the perpetual proprietors of the SPL title must act within the Rules of football and review the results.

Now, if Charles Green is the owner of the same club that participated in those championships, then he is undoubtedly under the jurisdiction of the SPL– because what the panel is investigating is the conduct of Rangers in the relevant seasons, and saying that they have no jurisdiction because Green’s Rangers are in SFL 3 is a really very poor legal argument.

If the SPL were investigating season 2011-2012 would Dunfermiline not be subject to the SPL jurisdiction because they had been relegated?

That makes no sense.

Further, in referring to the titles as “Their titles” and talking about resisting their being stripped of the same titles– Green shows no clear understanding of the law– a law that is very clear and very simple.

First– the title belongs to the SPL. In any one year, the SPL award that title to the team that amasses the most points over the football year— provided they play within the rules!!!

Forget who Rangers are, might be, could be, should be or were— If the team called Rangers did not comply with the rules, and actually broke the rules– with the result that all results that were so obtained have to be reversed and replaced with a 0-3 scoreline—- then the simple fact is that no team called Rangers won anything– and any ward of a title to anyone using that name under such circumstances is totally and legally invalid!

Further, as the owner of the SPL title is in fact the SPL, then that same SPL has every legal right to withdraw its award of Champions to any team — it it can be shown that the award was gained by way of illegal actions on the part of that team or a false pretence being made by that team or its management.

The titles do not belong to “Rangers”– they were supposedly won by “Rangers”— but if they broke the rules– then they weren’t won at all.

It really is that simple.

The statement today shows that Mr Green has no real undertanding of the law— or that he is simply choosing to ignore the law and running away from it.

He can’t afford to go to any Tribunal and have a high court judge declare that Rangers the original club are dead– and he and others can’t afford to go to the court and answer questions about EBT’s, payments, dual contracts or anything else.

In short, what the days statement confirms is that you can run but you cannot hide from the law.

You can make all sorts of public proclamations, and even have the papers print them as if they were gospel, but the fact remains that when the facts and circumstances are placed before any court or tribunal, a legal ruling will ensue and it is likely that any such ruling will not be to the liking of Mr Green, Mr Whyte or Mr Murray.

Perhaps Mr Green’s legal team have already been told that they will have no right of audience at tomorrow’s hearing– as after all his company was not a party to any of the contracts under discussion and they were not registered with the SFA or SPL at the relevant time.

Obviously Mr Green would not want the potential share buying public to hear that.

No– Mr Green’s statement was made after he took some legal advice– and that advice told him he was behind the eight ball without a cue.

Perhaps he should heed the advice of Mr Sonny Curtis…………… Sonny Who?

Well following Buddy Holly’s death, Sonny Curtis– a lifelong friend of Holly’s— took his place with the Crickets, taking lead vocal and playing lead guitar.

A year after Buddy’s death, the band released their first album without him, and called it “In style with the Crickets”.

Mr Green should note that they were no longer Buddy Holly and the Crickets,…….. just the crickets. Similar…. but just not the same.

He should also note that on that album was a Sonny Curtis penned composition which would later be recorded by Bobby Fuller, The Clash, The Dead Kennedys, Bryan Adams, John Cougar Mellencamp, Bruce Springsteen, Roy Orbison, Tom Petty, Social Distortion, Mike Ness, Hank Williams Jr, Waylon Jennings, the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band, Green Day, The Ramones, Grateful Dead, Stray Cats, Mary’s Danish, Mano Negra, the Big Dirty Band, Lolita No. 18, The Brian Jonestown Massacre, Attaque 77, Die Toten Hosen, Status Quo, Nanci Griffith, and The Men They Couldn’t Hang.

They all had their own reasons for recording the song and sending out its core message;

I fought the law… and the law won!

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HirsutePursuitPosted on10:17 pm - Sep 10, 2012

One of the benefits of having three highly qualified legal brains behind the duel-contract investigation is that the legal parameters would be set, such that:
1. The Rangers Football Club Ltd are on outsiders. They have no legal connection with the actions of The Rangers Football Club plc and therefore, as a club, have no part to play in proceedings.
2. The Rangers Football Club plc are also on the outside. No longer a member of the SFA nor operating as a football club nor holding any information that could help, the administrators of the former club could be of no assistance to the enquiry.

The enquiry can look at information already in possession of the SPL; but they could never insist on co-operation from the new club. If D&P have “forgotten” to include some critical details – why should Sevco’s Rangers help out?

Charles Green’s statement today simply pre-empts the enquiry in stating that this has no lawful relevance to his club. No punishment can legally be meted out to his club for the misdeeds of another.

D&P’s statement states the obvious – that they have no interest nor capacity to help the enquiry.

Nothing today will make any difference to how the enquiry would have progressed.


Our primary role as Administrators was to rescue the business which has been achieved by Charles Green and his consortium…
…will be read with much interest by BDO, the IPA and quite possibly by Lord Hodge.

The administrators have three statutory duties. None of those statutory obligations is saving the “business”.

If this is genuinely what they said, then they may well have signed their own warrant.

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PartizanPosted on10:19 pm - Sep 10, 2012

There is a new blog post up. Suggest BRTH you post again there.

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posmillPosted on10:27 pm - Sep 10, 2012

The governing bodies do everything they can to get you fast tracked into the top flight. It doesn’t work due to massive fan backlash.

Same governing bodies speak of imminent league restructuring – which would get you fast tracked into the top flight – but the public’s having none of that either.

So how do you treat these governing bodies which have done everything they can (including not doing much that they should have) to get you fast tracked into the top flight?

You ridicule them. You taunt them. You undermine their already-low credibility to the extent that their continued operation is virtually untenable.

And yet the governing bodies do nothing.

So the governing structure of Scottish football collapses, along with the existing league system.

A new governing body is formed, with a whole new league structure, and (wouldn’t you know it!) you get fast-tracked into the top flight.


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PaulsatimPosted on10:39 pm - Sep 10, 2012

Guys, there’s a new blog,

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AngusPosted on10:42 pm - Sep 10, 2012

BRTH – wondered where the Buddy Holly thing was heading for a while there. Nice little story arc. 🙂

As said above, an important and lucid post which should be reposted on the new blog entry – too many will miss it otherwise.

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aldo67Posted on10:50 pm - Sep 10, 2012

BRTH> awesome stuff.your conscious stream must be worth millions.
tomorrow ( today ) is end game.let the people sing.
the dog whistle has been whetted by green et al.
time for the vet to be called to put to sleep.

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john clarkePosted on10:59 pm - Sep 10, 2012

I have been trying to read up in the SFA’s articles of association, the SPL’s articles, and the Judicial Panel Protocol.

The Judicial panel is the creation of the SFA.
The Compliance Officer is a creation of the SFA.
There is no scope ( it seems to me) for the SPL to lay charges.

The Compliance Officer would be the one to do that, on a reference from the SPL, perhaps.

But the charges would be against Sevco/Rangers AS members of the SFA, not as members of the SPL.

So Charlie boy is, perhaps, technically right , when he argues that the SPL have no jurisdiction, no power to bring charges against a non-SPL member.

But that is irrelevant, because the SFA do have jurisdiction!

Even if it was some daft bugger in the SPL who brought the charges , then that can quickly be rectified by Vincent Lunny swiftly taking ownership of the charge sheet on behalf of the SFA, since Sevco/Rangers are ( however illicitly) members of the SFA ,and are required to accept its jurisdiction, under penalty if they fail to do so, and it was SFA articles that were (allegedly) breached….

Likewise, the SFA can approach the Court to seek to compel D&P, as officers of the Court, to release documents etc that relate to the past actions of the directors of the club that are material to the circumstances that led to the club’s insolvency .

I don’t know who CG uses as lawyers, but I don’t think their advice is terribly sound.

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