The Day I was on the Scotland U-23 Bench

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The Day I was on the Scotland U-23 Bench

It’s been a crappy year. If you don’t believe me, look at the two lists below this piece – full of people who have left us since Jan 1 2016. Some might say in a post Brexit/Trump world they are all better off, but that is neither here nor there.

In addition we have witnessed yet another year of the “black is white – new is old” suspension of disbelief argument from the football authorities. The same dysfunctional crew who gave us the 5-way agreement and whose cerebral CPU cycles are dominated by a strategy to choose the correct term to use for various concepts like; liquidation, Rangers FC, pitch invasion, independent inquiry, (to name just a few).
They now think we will be satisfied with what their crack investigation into child sex abuse – and its no doubt cherry-picked and narrow terms of reference – will come up with.

Still in place at Hampden, is a Press Officer who thinks he IS the SFA, and a chief executive who should BE the SFA, but who prefers, in his own words to do “nothing”. These are the people who, in the midst of a public debate over concerns for racism and homophobia in the game, have given a coaching job involving young people to a man who has been proven a racist and a homophobe.

These are the people who constantly have their hands out for public funds, including one to fund a grade-A bonkers facial recognition scheme to root out sectarianism (and all the other ISMS that they have just endorsed by appointing Malky Mackay).

Yet we complain about the Americans when they elect an insane man to power?

All is however not lost. Within living memory, and since it is Christmas, I’d like to relate a warm, cuddly, sentimental and very true story about the late Jock Stein. It is proof that there was a time before the madness that has enveloped Scottish Football when real people of quality, blessed with empathy for fans, roamed these lands.


Rewind to 13th May 1975. Myself and three great friends, two teenagers from each half of the Old Firm, decided to walk over to Hampden Park to see Scotland playing a friendly match against Portugal. Two of the guys – ironically the Rangers ones – lived in a wee street right across the road from Celtic Park, and we set out from ‘their bit’, walking through Strathie’s Park and down Springfield Road into Dalmarnock Road. We were a bit behind schedule and of course we were all skint so we had to walk. As my mates dithered, I walked on ahead shouting at them something like ‘hurry up!’ (although a tad less politely).

As I approached the junction of Dalmarnock Road and Adelphi Street, I absent-mindedly did a bit of jay-walking and was nearly hit on the backside by a ton of German tin making a left turn. The passenger window of the car was rolled down, and I prepared an impetuous come-back to what I was sure was going to be a rollicking.

Instead, a strangely familiar man in a thick Irish brogue poked his head out of the window and said; “Where you going?”

As my brain registered “Sean Fallon”, I made a quick connection, turned to the driver and saw that it was Big Jock. Thoughts of “what an honour to be knocked down by Jock Stein” flashed through my befuddled between-ear mass.

Recovering quickly;  “To the game” I said.

“Jump in!” shouted Mr Stein

“My pals are just behind me”

“Tell them to jump in as well”

I never asked the guys when they realised it was the greatest living Scotsman driving the car, but we didn’t know many folk with a Merc, so I suppose they knew it wasn’t a relative who had stopped me.

The four of us climbed into the spacious big bench seat in the back of the car for the fifteen minute journey. Immediate questions.

Yes Jock (we were pals by now 🙂 ) was going to the game and so was Sean, but they were going home for something to eat first. Yes, it was a great perk of being a manager that you didn’t have to queue, but what did we think of the team?

The chat at the time was that Kenny Dalglish hadn’t hit it off with Scotland because Bremner was cramping his style. Bremner was injured that night, so my pal Gerry Connor (permission to use his name has been granted!) told The Boss (we were really close by now) that we expected KD fireworks.

What did we think of Hutchinson? Since it definitely appeared to be posed in rhetorical fashion we chose “not very much”.
The Gaffer concurred.

One of the Rangers guys (Big Jimmy) wondered aloud why Alfie Conn, by then of Spurs, was not selected. It was a ridiculous situation said my mate. Probably keeping him for the U-23s he thought out loud, before realising that Jock was the then Under 23 manager.

“Oh, eh, um, sorry! I forgot that was you!” said Big Jimmy. “No worries, he’s a very good player” said Big John (by now we felt we had known him forever).

Truth is, we were scared shitless; totally in awe of the man driving, DRIVING US, to the match. He really wanted to know what we thought, who we liked to see play, who we would pick who wasn’t in the squad.

Another thing was that despite it being huge for us all, we all wanted it it over with as quickly as possible so we could talk about it. But it wasn’t over yet. The final flourish was when we got dropped off at the Beechwood. We got out of the car as the crowds were descending on Hampden. Stein’s car was noticed right away, but who were these young scallywags emerging fro the back?

“Thanks Boss, thanks Sean!” we all shouted so the bystanders could ear. Stein smiled, waved at us and sped off to Kings Park for his dinner.

“See you in the morning Gaffer!”

Chests puffed out, we all assumed the pose of Scotland Under-23 starlets. Scotland won 1-0, but I can honestly say I don’t remember a bloody thing about that match. I do remember being on the Scotland U-23 bench though 🙂

The moral of the story is clear to me. In the background of Dave Scott’s claim in our podcast that the SFA needed to get its act together, and to engage more with the fans, the men of the Stein mould, our greatest football generation, are perhaps the last generation to possess the ability to do that.

He could have just beeped loudly in frustration and went off home for his dinner that evening, but he saw four young fans – guys who loved the game anyway – and made us love it a bit more after that fifteen minute ride. For a few minutes out of his time, Jock Stein gave us all a lifetime of a cherished memory, which I have dined out on, and will continue to dine out on, forever.

Many years later, footballers of that era told me that it was commonplace for the likes of Billy McNeill and John Grieg to do the same in Glasgow, for Pat Stanton and Davie Holt in Edinburgh, and for Alex Hamilton and Jerry Kerr in Dundee.

Sadly, three decades later, I regularly witnessed footballers go to extraordinary lengths to avoid autograph hunters, ducking out of back doors and having stewards deliver their cars to remote places away from the public gaze.

Of the four lucky boys who chanced upon Jock Stein that night, I am still in touch with two. Big Jimmy has fallen of the radar, last heard of in England somewhere – as is Gerry, condemned to a purgatory of watching Blackburn Rovers!

Despite that, we will always share the bond of the night we were on the Under-23 bench seat in the back of Big Jock’s Merc.

We should remember that the game in this country prospered when it was more in tune with the people who followed it. Perhaps market equilibrium will one day bring it back, who knows, but for now, football is an industry where no-one in control at the clubs gives a flying doo-doo what we think.

 

At least we still have our memories. Of the great Jock Stein, to whom I was briefly related, of his assistant Sean Fallon, who I got to know a bit in later years, and of many football folk I was privileged enough to know, and who are no longer with us.

Just like the class of 2016 below, we miss them all.

 

Non Football Deaths in 2016

Date Name Age
04 Jan Robert Stigwood Producer 81
08 Jan David Bowie Musician 69
14 Jan Alan Rickman Actor 69
15 Jan DanHaggerty Grizzly Adams Actor 74
18 Jan Glen Frey Musician 67
28 Jan Paul Kantner Musician 74
19 Feb Harper Lee Author 89
28 Feb George Kennedy Actor 91
08 Mar George Martin Producer 90
09 Mar Robert Horton Wagon Train Actor 91
10 Mar Keith Emerson Musician 71
17 Mar Larry Drake LA Law Actor 66
18 Mar Joe Santos Rockford Files Actor 84
22 Mar Richard Bradford Man in a Suitcase Actor 81
24 Mar Garry Shandling Comedian 66
06 Apr Merle Haggard Musician 79
21 Apr Prince Musician 57
24 Apr Billy Paul Musician 81
19 May Alan Young Mr Ed Actor 96
03 Jun Muhammad Ali Boxer 74
14 Jun Ronnie-Claire Edwards Waltons Actor 83
28 Jun Scotty Moore Musician 84
19 Jul Garry Marshall Actor/Producer 81
13 Aug Kenny Baker Star Wars Actor 81
20 Aug Gene Wilder Actor 83
06 Sep Hugh O’Brian Wyatt Earp Actor 91
25 Sep Arnold Palmer Golfer 87
28 Sep Shimon Peres Politician 93
14 Oct Jean Alexander Coronation St Actor 90
24 Oct Bobby Vee Singer 73
24 Oct Pete Burns Musician 57
03 Nov Kaye Starr Singer 94
07 Nov Leonard Cohen Musician 82
11 Nov Robert Vaughan Actor 83
13 Nov Leon Russell Musician 74
25 Nov Fidel Castro Politician 90
06 Dec Peter Vaughan Porridge Actor 93
07 Dec Greg Lake Musician 69
08 Dec John Glenn Astronaut 95
18 Dec Zsa-Zsa Gabor Actor 99
24 Dec Rick Parfitt Musician 67
24 Dec Liz Smith Royle Family Actor 95
25 Dec George Michael Musician 53
27 Dec Carrie Fisher Actor 60
28 Dec Debbie Reynolds Actor 84

 

 

Football Deaths in 2016

Date Name Club Age
22 Jan Tommy Bryceland St Mirren 76
22 Jan John Dowie Celtic 60
04 Feb Harry Glasgow Clyde 76
24 Feb Jim McFadzean Kilmarnock & Hearts 77
11 Mar Billy Ritchie Rangers Goalkeeper 79
20 Mar Alan Cousin Dundee, Hibs & Falkirk 78
24 Mar Johan Cruyff Ajax, Barcelona 68
31 Mar Jimmy Toner Dundee 92
06 May Chris Mitchell Queen of the South 27
11 May Bobby Carroll Celtic 77
14 May John Coyle Dundee United 83
20 Jun Willie Logie Rangers, Aberdeen 83
03 Jul Jimmy Frizzell Morton 79
06 Jul Davie Nicol Falkirk 80
08 Jul Jackie McInally Kilmarnock 79
21 Jul Dick Donnelly East Fife Goalkeper/Journalist 74
05 Aug Joe Davis Hibs Captain 75
21 Aug Rab Stewart Dunfermline 54
05 Sep Max Murray Rangers 80
13 Sep Matt Gray Third Lanark 80
01 Oct David Herd Man United & Scotland 82
10 Oct Eddie O’Hara Falkirk & Everton 80
16 Oct George Peebles Dunfermline 80
18 Oct Gary Sprake Leeds United 71
08 Nov Ian Cowan Partick Thistle, Falkirk & DAFC 71
16 Nov Daniel Prodan Rangers 44
25 Nov Jim Gillespie Dunfermline 69
26 Nov Davie Provan Rangers 75
10 Dec Tommy McCulloch Clyde Goalkeeper 82
11 Dec Charlie McNeil Stirling Albion 53

About the author

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Big Pink administrator

Big Pink is John Cole; a former schoolteacher based in the West of Scotland, He is also a print and broadcast journalist who is engaged in the running of SFM . Former gigs include Newstalk 106, the Celtic View, and Channel67. A Celtic fan, he is also the voice of our podcast initiative.

653 Comments so far

Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on4:19 pm - Jan 8, 2017


SMUGASJANUARY 8, 2017 at 16:00
something for the mods

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on4:39 pm - Jan 8, 2017


The BDO annual meeting of creditors will be held tomorrow.
Will we find out anything new or is there a confidentiality clause that keeps everything from the public,or was anything released to the public after the last annual meeting?

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on4:49 pm - Jan 8, 2017


I’m afraid https://johnjamessite.com is continuing with the notion that Stewart Robertson’s income was leaked to the press by Jim Traynor.

From his latest

“King is at pains to conceal how much he trousered from selling Micromega Malfeasance as there are many hungry mouths to feed at Ibrox, including Stewart Robertson who pulled down £233,000 including a £53,000 bonus. I wonder who leaked this information to the press?”

There is a photograph of Jim Traynor directly below that.

In one of the replies

“Yes it seems Stewart Robinson has most certainly been flung under the bus, why else would his and only his salary and bonus be shoved out into the public?”

And another directly below that

“Clearly Robertson has questioned the value of employing Jabba. So Jabba releases his confidential salary into the media. What is the public interest of media outlets publishing such personal info? I suggest a complaint is in order.”

An opinion which the blogger himself seems to endorse. His reply 

“This is my reading of the situation. Traynor is a luxury that they can ill afford. Twelve players have now been paraded as prospective loanees to give the impression that all is hunky dory at the club. This is what Traynor does for a living. If the shares had not been delisted, his artifice would have inflated share prices. However in the current climate briefing the press to give Rangers fans a feelgood factor after their third successive defeat to Celtic, is of limited value. He should be cut or at least mothballed until season tickets are back on the agenda.”

The thing is, and this is not an exclusive, Mr Robertson’s remuneration package is contained in the accounts released by The Rangers Football Club Ltd. This is quite normal practice, the packages for all the directors, including non-executive directors are all there. For both 2016 and 2015.

This information is in the public domain and freely available to download. It has been for some time now. The accounts were signed in November last year an seem to have been available at Companies House since 21st December. 

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on5:41 pm - Jan 8, 2017


Homunculus
January 8, 2017 at 16:49

Totally see your point, but though the information was freely available, I am certain that most of the bears, and all of the most thug-like, would have been unaware of it, and most of those who were previously aware of it wouldn’t have taken it as significant. Now, though, every bear, sensible and not so sensible, has read it in a light that suggests they should view the money Stewart Robertson takes, his rightful remuneration, in the same way they view Graham Wallace etc took theirs ie perfectly legal and proper, just not like Real Rangers Men should, and therefor are wage thieves! To my mind, the context of the article is more important than it’s newsworthiness or whether it is a leak or not. It could, I suppose, be argued that it has been ‘leaked’ into the bears consciousness!

The fact that there was, therefor, no news in the article, nor any reference to what the statement referred to was – and no follow up to this ‘statement’ through any other source – shows that the whole piece must be agenda driven, and I don’t think the agenda has anything to do with making Stewart Robertson’s life at TRFC any easier!

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on7:15 pm - Jan 8, 2017


ALLYJAMBO
JANUARY 8, 2017 at 17:41
============================

He has accused Jim Traynor and Rangers of leaking private and confidential information with regards their MD’s salary and remuneration package. 

The information isn’t private and confidential and it is in the public domain, so why would either have to leak it. Though it is possible that someone (unlike the blogger I won’t speculate) made sure that journalists were aware of the accounts being released. It’s entirely possible that interested parties monitor Companies House to see if there are any documents released which may be of interest to them. 

My take on it is that it is an attack on the people he claims to have leaked it, rather than on Mr Robertson. 

Whichever, it is once again an example of him getting something fundamentally wrong. 

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easyJamboPosted on7:17 pm - Jan 8, 2017


The remuneration info below is in the public domain from the latest accounts (all including bonuses, benefits in kind and pension contributions). Some aren’t named specifically, but reasonable assumptions can be made about who are the highest paid directors:

P Lawwell £999,264
S Regan £332,438 (2015)
S Milne £300,000
N Donaster £247,000 (maximum) (2015)
S Robertson £ 233,000
C Levein £154,000
L Dempster £153,396

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easyJamboPosted on7:42 pm - Jan 8, 2017


It looks like Bella Caledonia, one of Scotland’s independent online titles, is about to go bust. It’s not just the traditional media outlets that have financial problems.

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upthehoopsPosted on8:01 pm - Jan 8, 2017


Carrying on from the earlier chat about Level 5 influencing reporting. The Sun and Daily Record online have banner headlines about a Bournemouth reserve ‘jetting in’ for talks with Rangers. Oh, and Celtic were once interested in him, as were Borussia Dortmund and AC Milan. The Sun have him as the next Andrea Pirlo. Why are Bournemouth letting this guy go, or is it just when Rangers come calling, there is nothing they can do?

I’m willing to bet an awful lot of Rangers fans will not be conned by this rubbish. 

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tony

tonyPosted on8:20 pm - Jan 8, 2017


UPTHEHOOPS
i’m willing to bet they will be

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gunnerbPosted on8:42 pm - Jan 8, 2017


EASYJAMBOJANUARY 8, 2017 at 19:42
 It looks like Bella Caledonia, one of Scotland’s independent online titles, is about to go bust. It’s not just the traditional media outlets that have financial problems.
____________________________________________________________________________
If true then it is a real shame. I think the issue is trying too soon to finance the offering.I am led to believe that very few online news sites actually break even. Of late our own SFM site is asking for financial support and in the past the response from readers/members has been gratifying. SFM is a single issue site..it debates Scottish football from every aspect but is still a single issue site. I would say that this is it’s strength. I recall in the past an attempt to expand and diversify the site into a more holistic sporting monitor.I, amongst others, opposed this as a dilution and loss of focus. I have no idea of the age demographic of the monitor,perhaps this is where we are failing.Should we be reaching out and trying to attract a younger more active audience?and if so how ? Do official supporters clubs have any contact with SFM??It is disappointing that a single issue site with such a regular readership is still not able to finance itself from advertising and it is even more irritating that such a regular readership is unable to subscribe sufficiently , this truly highlights the dillema all online news/interest sites have.The paywall formula is a disaster and doesnt work, millenials have been fed free since the web was born and it will ever be thus. The future for SFM has to be a greater media footprint..more facebook,more twitter more podcasts more likes ,thumbs up etc. . Unfortunatley I am a luddite who couldn’t twatter or fudbook to make a difference but surely some of you out there know how to do this.Spread the word guys!

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AuldheidPosted on9:01 pm - Jan 8, 2017


AllyjamboJanuary 8, 2017 at 08:37
Cluster One January 7, 2017 at 22:45
Perhaps a wee reminder of what happened in Feb 2013 at the SPL Board Meeting 3 months after the FTT in Oct 2012 found in favour of MIH/RFC on their use of ebts, would be helpful in the forthcoming propaganda war in the lead up to the COS Decision that will emerge after mid March 2017.
TSFM blogged on the matter in Sept 2014 and the original is archived somewhere, however there is a copy at
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6uWzxhblAt9ZWwyMHozSWNORXc/view
(note that the other hyperlinks in the above do not take you to the original TSFM blogs but again there are copies.)
Whilst the blog relates mainly to the information not provided to Harper MacLeod, it is interesting to note that in respect of the forthcoming COS decision that the SPL Board were advised by their legal counsel:
” Rangers in effect said that if the EBT details were required to be disclosed the reason they did not disclose them was because of an error by them in understanding what was required to be disclosed and that in any event they had secured no competitive advantage from not disclosing since the tax position would have been the same whether they disclosed to the SPL/SFA or not.”
Two points arising are:
1. Deliberately withholding side letter information from HMRC suggests that concealment of such from Authority was key to the continuing use of ebts and was not an error of understanding when it came to informing the SFA of their existence, but a continuation of a deliberate policy not to provide authorities with the full details of ebt payments for fear it would end the financial advantage  they provided. A simple enquiry to HMRC from RFC about using side letters in 2000 is all that it would have taken to prevent such an incredulous and catastrophic “error of understanding”.
2. As long as EBTS were deemed a proper form of tax arranging, with or without side letters as the FTT ruled in Oct 2012, this argument about the tax position being the same would stand and at the time the Commission was deliberating in 2013, the MGMRT ebts, regardless of side letters, were deemed “not irregular” (to use LNS words.) so the tax position would be unaffected. 
However, and here is the crux of the matter, if the ebts as used by RFC were irregular then regardless of registration rules in respect of side letters the tax scheme used to evade paying full tax on players wages was not regular and so not open to other clubs, which gave RFC an unfair advantage that manifested itself  in a better quality of player on the field of play which if done on an illegal basis calls for a sporting sanction.
The first point, as reported in the TJN/TOG report, has always been a reason from 2014 to suspend the findings of the LNS Commission , but the second point, since it formed the basis of legal advice on which  that SPL decided not to appeal the Commission Decision, makes it essential the matter is reviewed by The SPFL Board post COS, using all the evidence about all the ebts RFC used or the game as they say is a bogey.
There is clearly no stomach for it by SFA/SPFL but a decision by COS in favour of HMRC will undoubtedly lead to demands by supporters of all clubs disadvantaged by irregular ebts since 2001, for the SPFL to set aside LNS
Who knows, men of courage on the SPFL Board might see it as an opportunity to reset the moral compass of Scottish football as well as demanding honest governance.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on9:10 pm - Jan 8, 2017


AULDHEIDJANUARY 8, 2017 at 21:01
Thanks for a bit more info and clarification

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PortbhoyPosted on9:17 pm - Jan 8, 2017


 https://i.imgflip.com/1ha90i.jpg
View Comment  SMUGASJANUARY 8, 2017 at 16: 
Portbhoy,
Would a cartoon like that be taken in similar good form, here or elsewhere, if it was at the expense of Tiernan?
Sorry all.
————————
Hi SMUGAS,
I hope I’ve not upset you !
btw, who’s Tiernan ???

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SmugasPosted on9:19 pm - Jan 8, 2017


Apologies.  Young left back for Celtic.  Currently injured.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on8:12 am - Jan 9, 2017


HomunculusJanuary 8, 2017 at 19:1
ALLYJAMBO JANUARY 8, 2017 at 17:41 ============================
He has accused Jim Traynor and Rangers of leaking private and confidential information with regards their MD’s salary and remuneration package. 
The information isn’t private and confidential and it is in the public domain, so why would either have to leak it. Though it is possible that someone (unlike the blogger I won’t speculate) made sure that journalists were aware of the accounts being released. It’s entirely possible that interested parties monitor Companies House to see if there are any documents released which may be of interest to them. 
My take on it is that it is an attack on the people he claims to have leaked it, rather than on Mr Robertson. 
Whichever, it is once again an example of him getting something fundamentally wrong. 
______________________________________________

Sorry, Homunculus, I wasn’t being critical of your post, or suggesting it is right to exaggerate the failings of the media (or anyone), just wanting us not to lose sight of what really matters, which, in this case, is the way an unnecessary, and ultimately uninformative and un-newsworthy, article has been produced by a journalist, and to question why it might have been produced in such an agenda laden way. I reckon that JJ was not the only one who considered this ‘revelation’ of Robertson’s remuneration to be a ‘leak’, the writer of the article (can’t remember the name, and he’s definitely unworthy of any effort to check) apparently thought he was leaking some exclusive info, too.

We here at SFM want to get the message across, to as many people as possible, that the SMSM are both incompetent and agenda driven in an effort to favour one club. It is in the interest of that goal that other sites (and hopefully, one day, a mainstream publication) put out that same message, whether or not they get all the peripheral details correct or accurate (however desirable it might be that they do).

Taking on board your point, though, it would have strengthened the message to have pointed out how stupid and incompetent the ‘journalist’ was to produce an article clearly on the premise that it contained some sort of exclusive revelation, and consequently could have raised the question, is the writer thick or compliant? He could, of course, be both!

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bluPosted on9:50 am - Jan 9, 2017


PortbhoyJanuary 8, 2017 at 21:17

Portbhoy, if those posts belong anywhere, it’s surely a Celtic site?

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on11:38 am - Jan 9, 2017


Ok, own up!
Which Bampot authored Keef’s latest article about King?  09
Was shocked to read a Keef article without sighing / laughing / shaking head.

Of course there has to be an agenda for this article to be so critical of the absent chairman.
TRFC not paying their PR bills…?

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on12:29 pm - Jan 9, 2017


StevieBCJanuary 9, 2017 at 11:38 
Ok, own up! Which Bampot authored Keef’s latest article about King?   Was shocked to read a Keef article without sighing / laughing / shaking head.
Of course there has to be an agenda for this article to be so critical of the absent chairman. TRFC not paying their PR bills…?
_________________________________

Not that I expect a response, but I tweeted this in response to his tweet

From Jackson:

‘Monday’s column: Where’s Dave? https://t.co/tkO9nR4jdY

From me:

‘@tedermeatballs You seem surprised! Just how many bampots said this would happen, even before he smarmed his way into Ibrox? Just like Whyte’

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John ClarkPosted on12:45 pm - Jan 9, 2017


gunnerbJanuary 8, 2017 at 20:42
‘…….SFM is a single issue site..it debates Scottish football from every aspect but is still a single issue site. I would say that this is it’s strength…’

AuldheidJanuary 8, 2017 at 21:01
‘…….The first point, as reported in the TJN/TOG report, has always been a reason from 2014 to suspend the findings of the LNS Commission , but the second point, since it formed the basis of legal advice on which that SPL decided not to appeal the Commission Decision, makes it essential the matter is reviewed by The SPFL Board post COS, using all the evidence about all the ebts RFC used or the game as they say is a bogey.’
_______________
Perfect synchronicity!
gunnerb reminds us that SFM , while raising all kinds of interesting football and football ‘business’ matters that most of us, I think, enjoy and are informed by, is single-minded in its insistence that there are and have been serious questions about the Integrity of the Scottish Game. Unless these questions are satisfactorily answered , and answered truthfully, none of us can have any trust in the integrity of any game, or any ‘competition’ , whether under the auspices of the SPFL or the SFA.
That is, we just cannot be sure that there is no  ‘ Fixit Committee’, ready and happy to do dirty deals with crooked club chairpersons whose lack of any notion of ‘sporting integrity’ brings death to their club, and the loss of substantial revenue to other clubs.
And wise old Auldheid gives us a very clear picture of just one of the sets of circumstances which justifies our single-minded insistence on establishing the truth;circumstances which long pre-date ,but led ultimately to,the death of RFC at the hands of CW.
It is a stark fact that serious allegations have been made, on as yet uncontradicted evidence, that the SFA in particular ,but with the knowledge and tacit consent of the bulk of its member clubs ( also members of the then SPL or SFL and now members of the SPFL) has abused its power, and continues to abuse its power by defending the indefensible and constructing a myth ( or Big Lie) and subverting its own disciplinary code.
And it is the fact of those allegations that is the unifying bond that unites us as a body seeking truth in a way that transcends particular club loyalties .
If I have been lied to, cynically played upon, taken for a mug, by  the Celtic board, I would as happily hang( metaphorically) Dermot Desmond and the rest of the Celtic board  as readily as I would (metaphorically) hang (even now) SDM, or other subsequent low-life minor irritations such as Dave King and the bunch of useless toss-pots on the boards of TRFC and RIFC.
No one in his right mind can be ‘loyal’ to folk or institutions that play them for mugs.

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Charlie_KellyPosted on1:08 pm - Jan 9, 2017


I haven’t read Keith Jackson’s article but I’ve seen the headline and also some of the comments on the various RFC fan forums and by all accounts its pretty critical of the glib & shameless one.
So what do we think is going on? Has Keith gone off script here or is he still on the “level 5” bandwagon? If it’s the latter then that begs a second “WTF is going on” question. Have level 5 not been paid their christmas bonus and decided to go rogue on Dave King?
Or is it simply because it’s the winter break and they have literally run out of positive guff to write so they’ve turned their hand to some criticism? 

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Jingso.JimsiePosted on1:28 pm - Jan 9, 2017


STEVIEBC

JANUARY 9, 2017 at 11:38     

Ok, own up!Which Bampot authored Keef’s latest article about King?   Was shocked to read a Keef article without sighing / laughing / shaking head.
Of course there has to be an agenda for this article to be so critical of the absent chairman.TRFC not paying their PR bills…?
—————————————-

If you want a ‘sighing/laughing/shaking head’ read, may I suggest you read Allan Patullo’s ‘TRFC Buzzword Bingo’ interview with Stuart McCall in today’s Hootsmon?

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/rangers-need-war-chest-to-stop-celtic-s-10-in-a-row-says-mccall-1-4334673

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PortbhoyPosted on1:40 pm - Jan 9, 2017


BLU,
PortbhoyJanuary 8, 2017 at 21:17
Portbhoy, if those posts belong anywhere, it’s surely a Celtic site?

But BLU, I thought this was a …………. only kidding !!!
Sorry if I’ve offended you.

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John ClarkPosted on1:41 pm - Jan 9, 2017


Charlie_KellyJanuary 9, 2017 at 13:08
‘….Has Keith gone off script here …’
_______________
I wouldn’t worry about it, Charlie_Kelly: it is generally accepted that said Keith is in a  la-la land where ‘journalist’ means ‘ a person who writes to order: Whoever gives the ordure’.

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bluPosted on2:19 pm - Jan 9, 2017


PORTBHOYJANUARY 9, 2017 at 13:40  BLU,PortbhoyJanuary 8, 2017 at 21:17Portbhoy, if those posts belong anywhere, it’s surely a Celtic site?
But BLU, I thought this was a …………. only kidding !!!Sorry if I’ve offended you. 

PORTBHOY, I’m not offended, but I stand by the point made.  

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TrisidiumPosted on4:13 pm - Jan 9, 2017


STICKY

Uncomfortably, given the recent conversation on our external friends, it is time for our biannual funds appeal 🙁

I will be sending out an email to members (all 1314 of you – how very Scottish!) today or tomorrow (or whenever I can get to grips with the software that sends the mails). From that mail, and from the front page, you can see that we did ok last year, although we did use up our cash reserve and BP picked up the tab for the rest.

Our grand plans to build a radio presence has not panned out, partly because it is difficult getting people to work for nothing 🙂

Inconveniently we need at least half a dozen people to give up some time for that. However, the weekly podcasts are the first step towards that same goal of having a radio SFM at some time in the not too distant future. Our hope is that the work being done on that will entice some radio wannabbes to get involved.

We are planning (in the course of 2017) to do a programme on Hibs’ cup win, and a series of programmes setting out the timeline of the Rangers collapse, and its consequences for Rangers, other clubs, and the game in general.

We intend to seek crowdfunding to make that happen with the best possible production and editorial values.

Meanwhile, if you have a notion to help financially, the DONATE page is just a click away 🙂

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on7:32 pm - Jan 9, 2017


On Keith Jackson’s expose of Dave King.

I haven’t read any more than is contained in The Clumpany’s tweets, but can be pretty certain that, while it is maybe quite critical of King’s lack of honouring his pledges, that Jackson steers well clear of reminding his readership of King’s well known previous proven dishonesty and glib use of lies, and how that proven dishonesty should have led the bears to ensure that he never had anything to do with their club, at all. I am sure, too, that he doesn’t remind his doting public that he was as complicit in giving King all the overhyped press he sought as anyone else in the SMSM was.

But why this piece now? Well, from memory, it’s not the first time Jackson has called for King to come up with the goods, in that he is no different from every other gullible bear, they want King to act like David Murray, and provide money that isn’t necessarily his. They don’t care where it comes from, as long as it’s spent on beating Celtic.

I’d suggest, too, that there might be something else to be produced by Jackson soon, a much more King friendly piece, that will appear all the more believable because the writer has recently been less the sycophant than he normally is. Hyperbole is usually more believable if it comes from a ‘severe’ critic than from…just another sycophant!

It’s also notable that it has led to an outpouring of Dave love on social media, always nice to have that ramped up if bad news is just around the corner!

Finally, I’d suggest that if there is any genuine attempt to oust King via the media, a true resume of his past, married to his TRFC record, would pretty much clinch it! Until then, I doubt there will be any dramatic switch in the aims of the PR agenda, other than as an occasional reminder from level5 that an invoice is overdue!

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on8:02 pm - Jan 9, 2017


On Keith Jackson’s expose of Dave King.
Why wait over a week to ask were is DCK?
When they knew there was to be a  minute’s silence  to be held to remember the victims of the Ibrox Disaster and they knew before the game was played that the club was to pay their respects to the 66 Rangers fans who lost their lives on the January 2 1971. And all eyes were diverted towards the celtic fans and for those fans to be asked to remember the disaster.And questions asked if they would.
No one from the SMSM or from ibrox fans clubs was asking would DCK be there to show his respect.
No one had there eye on  a visit from DCK the way they had on the visiting fans.If no one asked the question before the game were is DCK why did no one ask after the game were was DCK. Why wait over a week?

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on8:10 pm - Jan 9, 2017


to late to edit…
Why did the ibrox chairman that (fought so hard ) to get the club not bother turning up for a remembrance service?

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on8:51 pm - Jan 9, 2017


Cluster OneJanuary 9, 2017 at 20:02 
On Keith Jackson’s expose of Dave King. Why wait over a week to ask were is DCK? When they knew there was to be a  minute’s silence  to be held to remember the victims of the Ibrox Disaster and they knew before the game was played that the club was to pay their respects to the 66 Rangers fans who lost their lives on the January 2 1971. And all eyes were diverted towards the celtic fans and for those fans to be asked to remember the disaster.And questions asked if they would. No one from the SMSM or from ibrox fans clubs was asking would DCK be there to show his respect. No one had there eye on  a visit from DCK the way they had on the visiting fans.If no one asked the question before the game were is DCK why did no one ask after the game were was DCK. Why wait over a week?
____________________________________________
Jings, Cluster, give the man a break!

We’ve seen how long it takes Keith Jackson to answer a simple question on twitter (and we are still waiting), so how do you expect him to write a whole article in less than a week? 21 

Seriously, though, could you imagine the seethe if he’d written something similar immediately after that defeat by Celtic? The build up to that game just had to be all positivity, nothing else aloud. Not only would he have been the most reviled hack in Sevcoexcuseland, the masses might actually have been mad enough to realise they’d been conned by King, and that’s not part of the agenda. The past week has seen the ‘signing’ bonanza take effect, so the hunt for a man to blame has died down a bit, or, rather, reverted to the usual hunting grounds amongst the ‘Rangers haters’!

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on9:08 pm - Jan 9, 2017


Cluster OneJanuary 9, 2017 at 20:10 
to late to edit…Why did the ibrox chairman that (fought so hard ) to get the club not bother turning up for a remembrance service?
___________________

When the club’s PR outlets, the SMSM, were ramping up the importance of the Remembrance Service, the very least the club’s head (de facto Chairman) could have done was to let the support know, prior to the game, that he regretted being unable to attend a very important moment in the club’s history. It’s almost as if this man, who paints himself as the realest of the Real Rangers Men, didn’t see it as worthy of his time, even to say sorry.

Quite sad, really, and a bigger insult to the memory of those who died than even the idiot bear who couldn’t stop his bile from being shouted out during the silence.

I realise there was talk of Celtic supporters breaking the silence, too, but, regrettable as it was, it was less of an insult than when it’s done by one’s own.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on9:35 pm - Jan 9, 2017


 was it Daryll i am the SFA Broadfoot who was two is company three is a crowd with John Clark?
post on twitter saying he is leaving the SFA

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on11:05 pm - Jan 9, 2017


Just a wee bit of my usual boring pedantry.

Rangers, the football club is operated by The Rangers Football Club Ltd. I would argue that it is The Rangers Football Club Ltd.

Those cleverer than I could probably say which entity is actually a member of the SPFL.

Actually, thinking about it, I can do that. The SPFL Ltd has shareholders, those shareholders are the member clubs. Each of the member clubs holds one share in the company. 

So here are some of those members clubs / shareholders.

Heart of Midlothian PLC

Hibernian Football Club Ltd

Dundee United Football Company Ltd

The Dundee Football Club Ltd

The Rangers Football Club Ltd

Celtic PLC.

So, bottom line The Rangers Football Club Ltd is a member of the SPFL. Dave King does not hold a position with The Rangers Football Club Ltd, he never has. He is not the chairman of a football club in Scotland, no matter what anyone says.

He is the chairman of a PLC which owns shares in a Scottish football club. That is not the same thing. 

Pedantry over. 

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gunnerbPosted on11:36 pm - Jan 9, 2017


ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 9, 2017 at 21:08     EDIT
Quite sad, really, and a bigger insult to the memory of those who died than even the idiot bear who couldn’t stop his bile from being shouted out during the silence.
I realise there was talk of Celtic supporters breaking the silence, too, but, regrettable as it was, it was less of an insult than when it’s done by one’s own.
________________________________________________________________

There is no high ground on this AJ. 

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on11:56 pm - Jan 9, 2017


HOMUNCULUSJANUARY 9, 2017 at 23:05

No disrespect intended, but that has  been the position since Chazza started his club using the assets he bought , is it not ? RFC is (IL) .Not ill .

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upthehoopsPosted on7:08 am - Jan 10, 2017


I see ‘Sir’ Walter Smith has emerged via today’s Daily Record. He sat down over a cuppa with the Record’s chief tiger of sports journalism and gave the fascinating insight that ‘Rangers must spend’ in order to be better than Celtic.  The online headline reads :

‘EXCLUSIVE: Walter Smith urges Rangers chairman Dave King to spend NOW to stop Celtic winning 10 in a row’. (please note the emphasis on NOW).

Oh, and the reason the great man is speaking is to mark the 10th anniversary of his return to Ibrox.  So following on from the 10th Anniversary of Paul Le Guen leaving Rangers, they now have this.  

So in summary:

1) The man whose reckless spending did so much to consign the old Rangers to liquidation is advocating the new Rangers do the same. Perhaps he should demand that the old Bank of Scotland board are re-instated first.

2) There are no other occasions at any other Scottish football clubs which can ever be deemed to be a 10th anniversary. 

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Charlie_KellyPosted on9:32 am - Jan 10, 2017


I must admit to a wee chuckle at Walter Smith’s comment along the lines of “There are a couple of people there just now who were previously on the board at rangers and they know what it takes to make rangers successful”
Yes Walter they know what it takes. WE ALL KNOW WHAT IT TAKES! We all know what it took from about 1986 onwards! It takes massive spending of money you don’t actually have, running up unsustainable debts and engaging in illegal tax avoidance. THAT’S what it takes Walter!
Lance Armstrong knows what it takes to win the tour de France

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TrisidiumPosted on9:36 am - Jan 10, 2017


Folks, one of the consequences of a mailing exercise like the latest funding mail, is that accounts with emails that permanently bounce are automatically deleted (if the account holder has not posted recently). I note that one or two prominent posters who have been inactive recently have fallen foul of that.

There are one or two recent posters whose accounts will have to be deleted manually (and all the posts on those accounts) if email addresses are not updated.

The reason for this is that we have been advised NOT to publish comments that have no valid email address.

So Mark C & Elijah Baley – please update your email addresses asap 🙂

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on10:51 am - Jan 10, 2017


UPTHEHOOPSJANUARY 10, 2017 at 07:08 
I see ‘Sir’ Walter Smith has emerged via today’s Daily Record. He sat down over a cuppa with the Record’s chief tiger of sports journalism and gave the fascinating insight that ‘Rangers must spend’ in order to be better than Celtic.  The online headline reads :
‘EXCLUSIVE: Walter Smith urges Rangers chairman Dave King to spend NOW to stop Celtic winning 10 in a row’. (please note the emphasis on NOW).
Oh, and the reason the great man is speaking is to mark the 10th anniversary of his return to Ibrox.  So following on from the 10th Anniversary of Paul Le Guen leaving Rangers, they now have this.  
So in summary:
1) The man whose reckless spending did so much to consign the old Rangers to liquidation is advocating the new Rangers do the same. Perhaps he should demand that the old Bank of Scotland board are re-instated first.
2) There are no other occasions at any other Scottish football clubs which can ever be deemed to be a 10th anniversary. 
___________
Maybe we see here what the PLG nonsense was all about, or at least a continuation of the same agenda, whatever that might be. It appears to be a media campaign to force King to splash the cash, with, first, concerted articles in the media on how unsuccessful a man with a different method was, and now bringing out his successor to champion his tried and ‘successful’ splash the cash (all the way to destructon) plan. In-between we’ve had Jackson’s call for King’s money and the continued bandying about of high cost players as imminent TRFC signings.

So, so far this year, that’s ten days, we’ve had blanket coverage of PLG’s failure, ongoing big signing nonsense ramping up the bears expectations, a call from the DR for King to fulfill his overinvestment promises, and now PLG’s superhero successor, Walter Smith, reminding everyone just how successful spend, spend, spend can make a football club. I don’t know what it is, but something is afoot, and it’s not attached to anyone’s ankle 14

And, though there’s probably no conection (but who knows in this saga), Darryl Broadfoot leaves the SFA! I wonder where he’s off to, any new PR firms starting up? One that might benefit from inside knowledge of the SFA, and know what’s causing that growing lump under the carpet! Pure devilment on my part, of course, but I wouldn’t be at all surprsed if it’s related to his favourite football club in some way, even if he’s just decided it’s time for him to get out of dodge…or someone else has, because, in the coming months, the SFA might not be a good place for anyone connected to either Rangers to be! One way or the other.

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on12:06 pm - Jan 10, 2017


PADDY MALARKEY
JANUARY 9, 2017 at 23:56
===================================

I’m not really sure what you though might have been taken as disrespectful, however I can assure you nothing was. I fully appreciate the point you are making, but that’s not the discussion I was really involving myself in, apologies if that wasn’t clear. 

With regards my post, the point I was really trying to make, re-iterate really as we are all already aware of it is that it is TRFC Ltd which holds the membership of the SPFL. Dave King does not sit on the board of that company, he is not the chairman of that company.

The SMSM constantly refer to Mr King as Chairman of Rangers, it isn’t true. He is the chairman of a holding company which owns Rangers shares.   

In reality I can see the position where Stewart takes his orders from Dave King and the board of the PLC (most of whom are on the board of TRFC Ltd if memory serves) however to me it’s just another example of the SMSM deliberately misleading their readership. I believe they used the same trick with regards “fit and proper” in relation to King. In fact avoiding that particular test may well be why he doesn’t sit on TRFC Ltd’s board in the first place. 

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bordersdonPosted on12:12 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Cluster OneJanuary 8, 2017 at 16:39
The BDO annual meeting of creditors will be held tomorrow. Will we find out anything new or is there a confidentiality clause that keeps everything from the public,or was anything released to the public after the last annual meeting?
———————————————————————
Anybody know owt about this? Was there a meeting? Will we know what was discussed? Or was it just BDO letting creditors know how many more £kkkk’s they have charged?

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on12:56 pm - Jan 10, 2017


I wonder how much of the latest out-pourings of “King ! Splash the cash”, are down to the fact that he has had a wee windfall recently, and run out of excuses not to.

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ChristyboyPosted on1:05 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Can I just say that I am more than happy to pay my SFM subscription and more than happy with the output. I prefer quality rather than quantity any day.  A big 04 guys.

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Mark CPosted on1:29 pm - Jan 10, 2017


TRISIDIUM – I have checked with my provider and there was a blocking issue for some reason. My email in my profile is correct.  Can you try sending again please as they say they have fixed it and unblocked it……or something along those lines.

Noted Mark!
T

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on1:48 pm - Jan 10, 2017


CORRUPT OFFICIALJANUARY 10, 2017 at 12:56 
I wonder how much of the latest out-pourings of “King ! Splash the cash”, are down to the fact that he has had a wee windfall recently, and run out of excuses not to.
__________________

I have not read how much the sale of what was just a part of Micromedia business went for, nor how much King, himself, received, but I doubt very much it was the kind of sum that would put him in the position of pumping the kind of money the SMSM bears are looking for. There was something I read that gave the impression that £10m was the amount paid, and if King actually received anywhere near that figure, I doubt very much, or any, of it will be winging (jetting) it’s way to TRFC. Without any prospect of a return, rich men don’t throw 10% of legitimately earned income at a basket case of a football club, even if they wouldn’t have difficulty getting such a sum legitimately out of the country it sits in.

From memory, much of the estimated wealth of King was tied up in Micromedia, and so the proceeds of the sale haven’t made him richer, they’ve just made some of that wealth more liquid, for all we know it might actually have been sold for less than previously valued. None of us know what King might have that money earmarked for, but it might just as likely be needed to settle some outstanding debt, as be available for use as further ‘investment’ in RIFC, or even a genuine investment with a reasonable chance of a return!

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on2:26 pm - Jan 10, 2017


ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 13:48
     “I have not read how much the sale of what was just a part of Micromedia business went for, nor how much King, himself, received,”
    ——————————————————————————————————————————–
    I have come across similar figures, around the 8 to £10m mark, but it was unclear if that was pre or post tax. I think you correct that anything DCK puts in, he will be looking for a return on, but maybe he sees the way, via indirect returns, a la David Murray and his access to doors opening for him.
   I doubt it will open any SARS doors for King re his overseas investments limitations, but I believe at least some of the windfall, may be attributed to his family trust.
   None of that will matter too much to his fellow board members who are desperately trying to raise capital. They will just be thinking, “The guy who promised us money, has come into money”. …..Should be a go-er !
   It’s nowhere near enough, but every little help, keeps the lights on a little longer.   
   How much of it King needs, to maintain his wine-cellar at an ambient temperature, is another matter, but one which his colleagues will give little truck to.  
   He has it. They want/need it.

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woodstein

woodsteinPosted on3:23 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Test

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SmugasPosted on3:25 pm - Jan 10, 2017


 He has it. They want/need it.

And to complete the circle, if he would only give it then everything the MSM have written about them re-emerging as a premier force should come true.  So what’s not to like?  What are we missing?

Answers on a postcard please to Mr B Madoff, US knick, US somewheres. 

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on4:02 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Another site having a pop at this website, for reasons unclear ?
Yet both sites have similar overall objectives, IMO.

But suppose it must be validation of sorts: to be ignored would be worse? 09

Keep fighting the good fight BP, Tris et al. 

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on4:11 pm - Jan 10, 2017


View Comment  Corrupt officialJanuary 10, 2017 at 14:26 
ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 13:48      “I have not read how much the sale of what was just a part of Micromedia business went for, nor how much King, himself, received,”    ——————————————————————————————————————————–    I have come across similar figures, around the 8 to £10m mark, but it was unclear if that was pre or post tax. I think you correct that anything DCK puts in, he will be looking for a return on, but maybe he sees the way, via indirect returns, a la David Murray and his access to doors opening for him.    I doubt it will open any SARS doors for King re his overseas investments limitations, but I believe at least some of the windfall, may be attributed to his family trust.    None of that will matter too much to his fellow board members who are desperately trying to raise capital. They will just be thinking, “The guy who promised us money, has come into money”. …..Should be a go-er !    It’s nowhere near enough, but every little help, keeps the lights on a little longer.       How much of it King needs, to maintain his wine-cellar at an ambient temperature, is another matter, but one which his colleagues will give little truck to.      He has it. They want/need it.
________________________________

I think an important factor is that whatever King got out of this sale, it hasn’t necessarily made him richer, just provided him with more liquid funds. If the price paid was actually less than his investment was previously estimated at, he is then poorer! Or put another way, if one of us was lucky enough to have shares valued at £1m and sold half of them at the price we’d previously valued them at, we would still have a fortune on £1m. We would not be any richer. It seems to me that those advocating King should put in more money to the club because of this ‘windfall’ just don’t seem to realise that he is not necessarily any richer than he has been at any time since marching into the Blue Room! And that’s before we take into account the fact that he might not be prepared to lose any of his money on any loss making business! Dodgy business, yes, but one in which he is sure to make a loss…no!

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AuldheidPosted on5:38 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Up The Hoops 7.08
Facts, Figurers and Circumstances.
What Walter Smith was good at was spotting players who would make his team stronger and in an environment where free money was freely available it did not make sense for Smith to develop a development approach.
 
In his first spell at RFC from 91 to 98 the football world in financial terms was his lobster, so it is not surprising that on his return in Jan 2007, even although the bank had started to reduce the amount of free money it provided SDM, that Walter once again eschewed the development approach and spent spent spent, to the tune of £12m .

(RFC’S accounts for 2006 show the debt was at a manageable £6m (although we don’t know how much debt was hidden or moved to MIH accounts to acheive that result). ) 

That £12m funded the sacking of Manchester but reaching a UEFA Europa League final via dogged football shows Walter did know what dogged footballers bought in could achieve.
 
However the Europa League, as we all know does not bring in as much to reduce debt as the CL and to get at that in 2008 you need to spend even more.
  
So it was that Walter spent another £17.4m in Aug 2008 to form the team that won the three titles with CL access from 2009 to 2011 raising reported debt level to £31m.
  
To be fair Walter also sold Hutton , Celluar and Cousins for £19.5m to bring his net spend from 2007 to £10m (excluding wages).
  
What is interesting is that by Aug 2008 HMRC had delivered a number of Determinations relating to ebts to Rangers, starting in Feb 2008 including one for Walter for a payment by ebt in 2002/03 tax year when he was at Everton.
 
Also noteworthy is that a number of Walter’s signings eg Mendes, Davis, Celluar were paid by ebts, so chances are Walter was well aware by Aug 2008 that HMRC were disputing this method of payment.
 
A Decision that could have been made in Aug 2008 was NOT to spend on some of the new recruits and use the receipts from the £19.5m for Hutton etc as a contingency against having to pay HMRC, but such a decision would of course meant reduced chance of CL money.
  
The other factor to be taken into account in Aug 2008 was the belief that the bank would still provide free money ad infinitum but that belief proved wrong with the bank crash in Oct 2008.
  
The obvious analogy here is of the frog in the saucepan except the heat was turned up drastically in Oct 2008 and has stayed high since.
 
That Walter does not seem to appreciate that is intriguing. Does he simply not appreciate those days of free money and tax supplements are gone or is it an unwillingness to recognise his part in the downfall of RFC?

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on5:38 pm - Jan 10, 2017


ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 16:11
     “It seems to me that those advocating King should put in more money to the club because of this ‘windfall’ just don’t seem to realise that he is not necessarily any richer than he has been at any time since marching into the Blue Room! And that’s before we take into account the fact that he might not be prepared to lose any of his money on any loss making business! Dodgy business, yes, but one in which he is sure to make a loss…no!” 
     —————————————————————————————————————————-
    The problem being for King, is that in a PR barney, he is on a hiding to nothing because that is not what he said.  He has even been reported as “holding finances in reserve” for the current transfer window.  I don’t see that he can’t cough, and STILL remain chair of the PLC. 
   Remember also that the auditors signed off the accounts, “satisfied” that director loans were assured. If he was one of the directors, the auditors may take a dim view of any future assurances. 
   There is no escape for King other than to cough. …And no doubt will be much heralded as the new coming if/when he does.
   Aside from all his difficulties, FFP rules, and converting loans to equity may be one of the biggest stumbling blocks. Without knowing the figures, it maybe not a loan, but a gift that is required.  They are surely close to the max conversion rate, with further injections required before March
   No returns there then. ….It’s an intriguing, if bewildering scenario unfolding.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/dave-king-ive-already-lost-3279538

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easyJamboPosted on6:13 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Auldheid January 10, 2017 at 17:38
(RFC’S accounts for 2006 show the debt was at a manageable £6m (although we don’t know how much debt was hidden or moved to MIH accounts to acheive that result). )
=========================
RFC’s net debt peaked in 2004 at £74M.  It dropped to £23M in 2005, following the £51M MHL underwritten, but BoS funded,  rights issue and a £15M “windfall” from Rangers Media.

The further reduction to £6M in 2006 was achieved off the back of making the last 16 of the Champions League and an £18M payment from JJB Sports.

Over the next three years the debt went up to £17M, £22M then £31M, despite reaching the CL Group stage and the UEFA Cup Final in the middle of those three seasons.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on6:18 pm - Jan 10, 2017


BORDERSDONJANUARY 10, 2017 at 12:12       8 Votes 
Cluster OneJanuary 8, 2017 at 16:39The BDO annual meeting of creditors will be held tomorrow. Will we find out anything new or is there a confidentiality clause that keeps everything from the public,or was anything released to the public after the last annual meeting?———————————————————————Anybody know owt about this? Was there a meeting? Will we know what was discussed? Or was it just BDO letting creditors know how many more £kkkk’s they have charged?
——————————-
Maybe no one turned up as they keep getting told by the SMSM and the ibrox management team it is still the same club01
————–
Notice of an annual meeting of creditors to be held on 9 January 2017, which is attached for
creditors’ information at Appendix 3.

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upthehoopsPosted on6:29 pm - Jan 10, 2017


I see a certain other site describing the membership on here as ‘mostly retired individuals with too much time on their hands. ‘

I wish…

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easyJamboPosted on6:37 pm - Jan 10, 2017


ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 13:48
“I have not read how much the sale of what was just a part of Micromedia business went for, nor how much King, himself, received,”
=======================
The Financial Services part of Micromega was responsible for 3.9% (£2.8M) of the Group’s revenue (£72M), but 5.6% (£495k) of the profits (£8.8M) in the full year to March 2016

In the last six month reporting period to September 2016, Financial services accounted for 5.6% (£1.8M) of the Group’s revenue (£42M) but 7.9% (£406k) of the company profits (£5.1M).

That sector of the business seems to have been growing, but I would have thought that an £8M-£10M figure would be a bit on the high side, although I’m no expert in valuing businesses.

King (through the family trust) owned 63% of the company the last time I checked.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on6:48 pm - Jan 10, 2017


EASYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 18:37
     Cheers EJ    04

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tony

tonyPosted on6:54 pm - Jan 10, 2017


UPTHEHOOPS
aye me too

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bfbpuzzledPosted on7:13 pm - Jan 10, 2017


I wonder how the blogger on the other site knows the demographic here. Unless he has access to information which no one on this website has no way of knowing, he must be speculating without the benefit of any hard data.
I suspect that there are retired folk here and my experience  is that far from having too much time on their hands they have too many hands on their time.

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SmugasPosted on7:19 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Auldheid @ 17.38

i hadn’t realised an EBT to Smith had been publicised (albeit it was always mooted). He was always the most notable absentee from Mark Daly’s programme given the high earners he was managing and his achievements at that time.  Are we still to believe that whilst in Rangers honest employ (as opposed to his apparent Everton dishonest employ) that the noble cardigan did without!

on another note, in his candied (nope, no spelling error) interview in the Record today best summarised as spend spend spend why would one do that when better players than they could otherwise afford bore no link to success on the park apparently?

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on7:19 pm - Jan 10, 2017


I was listening to Super Scoreboard on the way home tonight. The guest pundits being Roger Hannah and Gordon Dalziel.

A lot of the talk was of Walter Smith’s comments with regard Rangers finding the money from somewhere to compete with Celtic. I was intrigued by the position taken by Mr Hannah who said on several occasions that the board would not be putting Rangers into debt in order to do this. I’m sure as a professional sport journalist working in Scotland he must be aware that they are already in substantial debt.

He also spoke about bringing new “investors” in and them providing money to the club in order to improve the team. I assume he wasn’t talking about people providing gifts to the club (which simply doesn’t happen anyway) as such a person wouldn’t be an investor, more of a donor I would have thought. 

Anyhow, I assume he was meaning there being some sort of rights issue, possibly underwritten if they want new people investing.

Simple question here, the AGM authorised a rights issue, they are clearly desperate for money, why not have the rights issue and raise some. 

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Big PinkPosted on7:26 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Homunculus

Because the rights issue is not seen by King as an instrument to raise funds, but a means of gaining control via the debt for equity swap.
Staggeringly no-one asks why the board, having been authorised to sell another 80m shares, with potential to raise some badly needed funds, have refused to do so unless preemption rights are abandoned.
No one asks whose best interests are served there; the club or Kingco.

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TrisidiumPosted on7:28 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Homunculus, On your way home from the local Darby & Joan ? ??

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on7:37 pm - Jan 10, 2017


UPTHEHOOPSJANUARY 10, 2017 at 07:08       24 Votes 
I see ‘Sir’ Walter Smith has emerged via today’s Daily Record. He sat down over a cuppa with the Record’s chief tiger of sports journalism and gave the fascinating insight that ‘Rangers must spend’ in order to be better than Celtic.  The online headline reads :
‘EXCLUSIVE: Walter Smith urges Rangers chairman Dave King to spend NOW to stop Celtic winning 10 in a row’. (please note the emphasis on NOW).
——————————
Walter Smith urges Rangers chairman Dave King to spend NOW…and that spend maybe to keep fans on board
As i said in an earlier post these older rangers men may also be running scared the fans may do walking away with no overinvestment no big name signings no chance to outspend celtic fans.Time has caught up on kings Bluster if the fans don’t get any encouragement they may walk away.A wee ST price hike on top of broken promises may be the straw that breaks the camels back.
What ibrox fan could stomach another season of being duped

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SmugasPosted on7:47 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Wouldn’t worry about that  Cluster1.  They haven’t played their “Pay more for season tickets or we’re back in the 4th” joker yet.  They’ll be turning up to spite themselves!  Music to a G&S criminal’s ears.

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upthehoopsPosted on7:53 pm - Jan 10, 2017


HOMUNCULUSJANUARY 10, 2017 at 19:19  
I was listening to Super Scoreboard on the way home tonight. The guest pundits being Roger Hannah and Gordon Dalziel.
A lot of the talk was of Walter Smith’s comments with regard Rangers finding the money from somewhere to compete with Celtic. I was intrigued by the position taken by Mr Hannah who said on several occasions that the board would not be putting Rangers into debt in order to do this. I’m sure as a professional sport journalist working in Scotland he must be aware that they are already in substantial debt.

—————————————-

I decided to listen to the first 20 minutes of this tonight while going through my evening ablutions. If John James is looking in I’d like to point out that was after I came home from work. Anyway, I too was intrigued by the stance Hannah was taking. Dalziel is not the sharpest tool in the box but Hannah should know better.  Whether to spell out the actual truth on Radio Clyde though – that’s another story. After all, they also kept referring to when Rangers were sent down the leagues. I did though get the distinct impression the host, Gerry McCulloch, is well aware of the facts, at least surrounding Rangers true financial position.  Not that he came directly out and said it, it was just the way he was posing the questions. 

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jean7brodie

jean7brodiePosted on8:01 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Could someone please tell me which other site is now taking umbrage re TSFM??

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AuldheidPosted on8:20 pm - Jan 10, 2017


easyJamboJanuary 10, 2017 at 18:13
RFC’s net debt peaked in 2004 at £74M.  It dropped to £23M in 2005, following the £51M MHL underwritten, but BoS funded,  rights issue and a £15M “windfall” from Rangers Media.The further reduction to £6M in 2006 was achieved off the back of making the last 16 of the Champions League and an £18M payment from JJB Sports.
Over the next three years the debt went up to £17M, £22M then £31M, despite reaching the CL Group stage and the UEFA Cup Final in the middle of those three seasons.
===============================

I knew that there had been a transfer of debt due to the underwriting but could not remember the details.

Thanks for that and the other information.

Of course at the time the bank wanted their £18M back in 2011 Alistair Johnson and the media (if you include Chick Young) were stating that the debt had been reducing year on year, but not that it was the result of CL income from 2009. At £18m it still stood at 3 times greater than it had been before WS arrived and when CL income stopped, so did the merry go round. 
Spin, spin spin.
Causes of Rangers Downfall?
1. Sir David Murray.
2, Walter Smith
3 Ally MCoist
Craig  Whyte was more of an instrument than a cause.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on8:23 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Corrupt officialJanuary 10, 2017 at 17:38 
ALLYJAMBOJANUARY 10, 2017 at 16:11      “It seems to me that those advocating King should put in more money to the club because of this ‘windfall’ just don’t seem to realise that he is not necessarily any richer than he has been at any time since marching into the Blue Room! And that’s before we take into account the fact that he might not be prepared to lose any of his money on any loss making business! Dodgy business, yes, but one in which he is sure to make a loss…no!”       —————————————————————————————————————————-    The problem being for King, is that in a PR barney, he is on a hiding to nothing because that is not what he said.  He has even been reported as “holding finances in reserve” for the current transfer window.  I don’t see that he can’t cough, and STILL remain chair of the PLC.     Remember also that the auditors signed off the accounts, “satisfied” that director loans were assured. If he was one of the directors, the auditors may take a dim view of any future assurances.     There is no escape for King other than to cough. …And no doubt will be much heralded as the new coming if/when he does.    Aside from all his difficulties, FFP rules, and converting loans to equity may be one of the biggest stumbling blocks. Without knowing the figures, it maybe not a loan, but a gift that is required.  They are surely close to the max conversion rate, with further injections required before March    No returns there then. ….It’s an intriguing, if bewildering scenario unfolding.
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/dave-king-ive-already-lost-3279538
___________________________

Believe me, I am not defending King. The man is a lying toad, and I hope one day he is destitute, he certainly deserves to be, and not just for his sojourn at Ibrox. My criticism in this episode, though, is for the people that think he must invest this ‘windfall’, as though they still believe he is there solely to make ‘Rangers’ great! The media continue to mislead he bears by suggesting he is what they believe.

He is there solely for Dave King, and the longer it takes the hard of thinking to realise that, the bigger the mess their club will get into.

I doubt King even reads the DR, let alone worries what it says, and much worse things than they’ll ever say about him were said in a Johannesburg courthouse, by people who could really hurt him, and did. Dave King will only leave TRFC/RIFC when he knows he is on a loser, but will leave with rhetoric that suggests he’s been a saviour, and Jackson and co will just as likely hype him up to be, as long as they are ordered to by their paymasters.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on8:30 pm - Jan 10, 2017


I retired when I was 51, and haven’t stopped working since! Does retiring make me stupid, or is it continuing to work that does?

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on8:33 pm - Jan 10, 2017


A week or so ago a sports journalist from a paper was leaving (can’t find the post)or remember his name,and now Mr SFA DB is said to be leaving his job(but i have not seen any confirmation as yet).We did say ther would be more doing so as March dawns.
is anyone keeping a list to see who else bales before questions are asked

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tony

tonyPosted on8:40 pm - Jan 10, 2017


JEAN7BRODIE
John James 

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on9:01 pm - Jan 10, 2017


ALLYJAMBO
JANUARY 10, 2017 at 20:30
=================================

It really depends how good the pension was from your first career, and if you were able to start collecting it from the date of your retirement.

Of course you may be independently wealthy, in which case I trust the work you are now doing is of an altruistic nature. In which case good on you.

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on9:08 pm - Jan 10, 2017


TRISIDIUM
JANUARY 10, 2017 at 19:28
==========================

Coming back from my lessons in spotting plagiarists, fantasists and charlatans. 

Doing the advanced course now, identifying people who are all three.

There’s not many about but they are out there. 

More to be pitied than scorned if I’m honest. So I try not to actually identify them, though if they chose to do that themselves my conscience is clear. 

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on10:26 pm - Jan 10, 2017


Scottish league chiefs hope to crack down on supporter misconduct after issuing a revised rule book.
The updated guidance, which comes into force immediately,
This ongoing work includes this updated guidance for clubs which sets out the reasonably practicable measures that member clubs can take to address this issue and to identify and sanction those who engage in Unacceptable Conduct
———————-
will sectarian singing be classed as Unacceptable Conduct?

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jean7brodie

jean7brodiePosted on10:31 pm - Jan 10, 2017


tonyJanuary 10, 2017 at 20:40
_______________________________________
Thanks Tony. I thought that had being going on for a wee while though?

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