The Existence of Laws

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The Existence of Laws

A Blog by James Forrest for TSFM

I am a socialist, and as a socialist I believe in the fundamental goodness of people. Some people find that hard to believe when they read the stuff I write.

I published my first novel recently, on politics and the corrupting nature of it, and it is a deeply cynical book, a book where no-one has clean hands come the end. What has surprised some of those who’ve read it is that I didn’t focus on the lies and smears of the right, but the hypocrisy and deceit of those who claim to be of the left.

Corruption, you see, doesn’t respect political boundaries or points of view. It’s like rainwater. It finds every crack, and gets in there.

My political beliefs revolve around two apparently paradoxical elements; the belief in the inherent decency of people and the need for a strong, and powerful, state. I believe the second underpins the first, and this brings me into conflict with a lot of people, some on the left and some on the right. Too many people see the state as inherently evil, as something that interferes too much in the lives of ordinary people. As something suffocating.

Yet the state exists to protect us. It exists to provide a safety net. It exists to regulate and to oversee. If the state is made up of bad people, if the gears of society are captured by those with malicious or selfish intent, the results are obvious; war, corruption, chaos.

The vast majority of our problems in the modern age can be neatly summed up in two lines from Yeats’ poem “The Second Coming”, which I used to open my novel. “The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.”

We live in a time when those who are protecting their own interests have assumed such power that they’ve cowed the rest of us. They have become a law unto themselves. They have changed the nature of the game, because they have sapped our will to the extent some barely put up a fight anymore. The weak get weaker, and the strong use their strength to crush the rest even more. It is a vicious struggle, a downward spiral.

Society is held together not only by the endeavour and common interests of its citizens but by a collection of laws. We elect the people who make those laws. They do so in our name, and we can remove that right every four years. That is a powerful thing, and we do not appreciate it enough. The present corruption exists because we allow it to exist.

The people around me continue to puzzle over my uncommon interest in the affairs of a football club on the west of Glasgow. My own club plays in the east end. I tell those who ask that my primary interest in the goings-on at the club calling itself Rangers is no longer about football; how could it be, after all? With promotion this year they are still a full two divisions below us, emasculated, skint, weak and unstable. If we were fortunate enough to draw them in cup competition the match would be over, as a tie, by the halfway point … in the first half.

In footballing terms they are an utter irrelevance.

Rangers is more than a football club to me. They are a symbol. Their unfolding calamity is an on-going outrage. What is happening there, what is being allowed to happen, is an offense to decency. It is a stain on the face of our country.

In short, it is a scandal. It is a scandal without parallel in sport.

Yet it’s not just a sports story either. If it was, I might not be so focussed on it. What is happening at Rangers is a colossal failure of governance. It is a damning indictment against the very people who are supposed to oversee our game. It is a disgraceful abrogation of responsibility from those at the top, those who claim to be “running things.”

If this is not a failure of governance it is a result of corruption at the heart of our national sport. It says they are bought and paid for, and I will say no such thing here.

So let’s give them the benefit of the doubt. We’ll say instead that what they are is weak, indecisive, inept and disconnected from reality.

It reminds me of our political class, which has become insular and ignorant about what the public wants, and what it needs. It’s not a wonder parties like UKIP can achieve national vote shares of 25% at local elections. Nigel Farage strikes me as a dog-whistle politician, the kind who knows how to appeal to a select group of voters. He is little different to Charles Green, the man who beguiled Rangers fans into handing over large amounts of money, because he was “standing up for the club.” It is easy to do what he did, easy to do what Farage is doing.

Real leadership requires toughness. Say what you like about the Tories, but they have that in spades. Yeats was right about the worst being full of passionate intensity. Green was. Farage is. Cameron and Osborne personify it in their political outlook.

It is easy to be cowed by blunt force politics, and by “tough talking Yorkshire men” and venomous speeches about “strivers and skivers.” The politics of divide and conquer is the oldest form of politics there is, and it’s no surprise to see it practiced by some of the vested interests in the game here in Scotland. Yet, lest we forget … something significant happened last year. The maligned and the ignored, the weak and the voiceless found something they never realised they had. They discovered that, in a very real sense, the power was in their hands.

Last year, the fans rose up when the governing bodies and the media went all-out to save Rangers from the self-inflicted wounds caused by a decade of cheating, malpractice and ineptitude. I have no problem calling that what it was.

What happened at Rangers seemed incredible, but it was all too predictable, and some of us had been talking about it for years before it hit. The Association seemed caught in the headlights but it would amaze me if they really were as insular and ignorant as they appeared. They must have known how bad the outlook was for Rangers. They just chose to ignore it.

They were aided and abetted by a thoroughly disreputable media, a collection of cowards and compromisers, charlatans and frauds, masquerading as journalists, but who long ago laid aside any claim to be bold investigators and settled for commenting on events as they unfolded. More often than not, with their ill-informed opinions, sometimes due to weaknesses in intellect and others wilfully ignorant, they failed even in that.

Entire newspapers became PR machines for crooks and swindlers. They aided in the scam because they didn’t do their jobs, some because they were lazy, some because they were incompetent and others because they wanted a seat at the table and were willing to sacrifice whatever integrity they once had in exchange for one.

That all of this was embraced by the Rangers fans is amazing to me. They trusted when they should have been asking questions. They closed their eyes, covered their ears and sang their battle tunes at the top of their voices so they wouldn’t have to hear anything they didn’t like. As incredible as I found it then, and still find it now – and now, even more so, when they have already seen the results of it once – I find it pathetic too, and I do feel pity for some of them.

A lot of these people are genuine football fans, and nothing more. They have no interest in the phony narrow nationalism, or the over-blown religion, or the notion of supremacy which manifested itself in a ludicrous statement from McCoist when interviewed recently on Sky.

Some of the Rangers fans look at their team of duds, kids and journeymen, they look at a boardroom of cowards and crooks, they look at a failing manager in his first (and last) job in the game and at a dark future and are not in the least bit impressed by, or interested in, the chest-out arrogance espoused in those ridiculous words “we are the people.” They know full well that their present crisis was made by men like McCoist, and they understand that pretentious posturing is not an act born of strength, but a scrambling around in the gutter, and a symptom of weakness.

They understand their position, and they hate it. And because they care about Rangers, because they value the club, because they cherish those things that made it a great Scottish institution, they want that back. They understand that before the Union Jack waving, Sash singing, poppy wearing, Nazi saluting, Orange element became the public face of their support Rangers meant something else, and that, above all things, is what pains them the most.

People do not hate Rangers. When the country appeared to turn its back last year, they were turning the back on favouritism and the bending of rules. Yet it would be a lie to say that there is not an element of dislike in the gleeful mockery of many rival fans.

But they don’t hate Rangers either. They hate the version of it around which a certain section of the support continues to dance. They hate the version which hates, and so too do many, many, many Rangers supporters, and they definitely deserve better.

David Murray chose not to openly challenge that version. Indeed, he encouraged certain strands of it to flourish and grow, with his “Britishness Days” and his effort to turn the club into the “team that supports the troops.” Other clubs have done as much, if not more, for the British Army than the one that plays out of Ibrox. Other clubs have given more money. Other clubs have lent their support to those on the front lines. They just chose to do it with respect, and with class, and with dignity. They chose to do it in private, understanding that there eventually comes a tipping point between looking after the ends of the soldiers and using them to promote your own.

The army has not battened on to Rangers. Rangers has battened on to them, and although it is unclear when an altruistic motive became darker, what started out as a gesture of solidarity is now used to entrench division and promote a notion of superiority.

Craig Whyte took over from Murray and immediately understood the lure of the “dog whistle.” He knew too that the media would accept whatever he told them, without question, and as he spoke up for “Rangers traditions” he made sure the lunatic fringe was well onside. He met face to face with the hard-core extremists in the support first and made them his praetorian guard. They spoke up for him until the day the club entered administration.

So, whereas Murray pandered to them and Whyte used them to further his own ends, it was only a matter of time before someone suggested to Charles Green that he could use the same tactics to win over the support. He went even further and blatantly promoted and encouraged this mind-set, and stoked the hate and nonsense to frightening new heights. The same people who cheered Whyte to the rafters jumped on board the Big Blue Bus and the results are clear.

Through all of it, the ordinary Rangers fan has seen his club buffered against the rocks, battered, broken, smashed to smithereens and sunk. Now there’s a big hole in the side of the lifeboat, and they are terrified that further tragedies await.

They are right to be concerned. Much of the media is still not telling them what they need to know. The people in charge of their club – the owners who have lied, the former hack who covered up the truth about Whyte and now acts as a mouthpiece for Green, the “club legends” who are content to sup with the devil and take his greasy coin when they should be standing toe-to-toe with the fans – are trying to silence those members of the press who do have facts to present.

How many times now have media outlets been banned from Ibrox for daring to report the truth? The manager who demanded the names of a committee last year defends those inside the walls who are desperate to keep secret the things that are going on. He is either an unprincipled coward, or he is, himself, bought and paid for. The fans suffer for it.

The “inconvenient truth” is still being kept from them, and this denies them any chance to play an active role in their club. Indeed, it is all too possible that they’ve passed a point of no return, and that their club is heading for a new liquidation event and it can no longer be stopped.

In either case, their power has been eroded to the point at which they must feel they have nothing left to do but stand back and watch what happens next.

They are wrong. I am a socialist. I believe in the inherent good of people. I think the ordinary decent Rangers fans are the only people left who can save their club … and the means by which they will do it is as simple as it could be.

They must stand up for “big government.” They must embrace the need for a “strong state.” They must lobby the SFA, and they must trust the SFA and they must get the SFA to follow its own rules and thereby save them from any further harm.

There is a tendency amongst some Celtic fans to see our governing bodies as pro-Rangers. If it is true then those running our game are ruining Scottish football without benefiting the thing they love more. The incalculable harm that has been done to Rangers in the last 20 some months is a direct result of the subservient media and the willingness of the football authorities to be “deaf, dumb and blind.” Those who believe this has actually helped the Ibrox club have not been paying attention in class. It has irrevocably scarred them, and it may yet have played a hand in destroying them once and for all, as a force if not as a club entirely.

For years, the SFA sat and did nothing as a club in their association operated a sectarian signing policy. They did nothing whilst the fans sang sectarian songs. In their failure to act they strengthened those elements of the Rangers support, instead of isolating, alienating and eventually helping to eliminate those who saw that club as a totem pole of division and hate. Their failure over EBT’s, and their lack of scrutiny, led to one of the greatest scandals in the history of sport, and I say that with no equivocation at all. The testimony of their registrations officer in the Lord Nimmo Smith investigation was a disgrace and in years to come it will rank as one of the most disreputable and damaging moments in the association’s history.

The most egregious failures of all were the failures in the so-called “fit and proper person” tests, which allowed first Whyte and then Charles Green to assume controlling positions at Ibrox. They will pass the buck and say the responsibility lies with the club itself, in much the same way as they are content to let the club investigate itself at the present time, but any neutral who looks at this stance knows it is unprincipled and spineless. It’s like letting the defence set the terms at a trial. It is foxes investigating the chicken coop.

It is a blueprint for corruption, and a recipe for disaster.

It is now too late for the SFA to declare Green “unfit”, as it was too late when they finally slapped that title on Craig Whyte. He and his allies own Rangers, and they control its destiny. They can push the club to the wall if they choose, in the final extremity, if that gets them what they want. The time for changing that is past. The damage has already been done. The barbarians are not at the gates. They are inside the walls, and sacking the city.

The SFA will be forced to punish Rangers for the sins of the owners, for the second time in as many years, and whilst it is right that the club face up to that, all the better to send a message to other clubs and other owners, the SFA cannot be allowed to slither off the hook here as though this was none of their doing. Green will skip off into the sunset. Craig Whyte has yet to pay his fine. These people never cared about Scottish football and they don’t care now.

The SFA are supposed to. Our governing body is supposed to govern, for the good of the whole game, and not as a support system for a single club. What they have allowed to happen on their watch is absolutely shameful and if the people responsible were men at all, with any sense of accountability, they would resign en masse.

They can pretend ignorance, but only the truly ignorant would accept that. Craig Whyte was not inside Ibrox a week before RTC and other sites were dismantling his entire business history, with some of the people here doing the work the SFA would not. Whyte himself claims to have made the governing bodies aware of the scale of what was facing the club, and they did nothing at all. Heads should have rolled a year ago.

In October of last year, on this very site, I posted an article in which I wrote:

“Which isn’t to say the due diligence matter isn’t worrying, because, of course, it is. Again, no-one is going to convince me that the SFA has conducted proper due diligence on Charles Green and his backers. No-one will convince me they are satisfied that this club is in safe hands, and that the game in this country will not be rocked by a further implosion at Ibrox. They failed to properly investigate Craig Whyte, because of lax regulations requiring disclosure from the club itself, regulations which are just a joke, but they can be forgiven for that as the press was talking sheer nonsense about him having billions at his disposal, and a lot of people (but not everyone!) were either convinced or wanted to be convinced by him.

To have witnessed what Whyte did, to have witnessed the Duff & Phelps “process” of finding a buyer, and having Green essentially emerge from nowhere, with a hundred unanswered questions as to his background and financing, for the SFA to have given this guy the go ahead, only for it to blow up in their faces later, would annihilate the credibility of the governing body and necessitate resignations at every level. There would be no hiding place.”

There are times when it is fun to be right, but this is not one of them. It is dispiriting and disquieting to have been so on the nose. It scares the Hell out of me, as someone who loves football in this country, to have seen this matter clearly when the people running our game apparently either did not or chose to ignore very real, very obvious, concerns. The Internet Bampots had no special insight or access to information that was denied those at the SFA. We just weren’t prepared to ignore it and pretend that it wasn’t there. There was too much at stake.

I have become convinced that things will never change until the Rangers supporters join us in demanding the full and unabridged truth here. They need to come out from under the bed, and confront their fears. They need to be willing to take the consequences, so that their club can emerge clean from this, and start again, with all this behind them.

And it can all happen with one simple thing. The application of the rules.

The existence of laws comes down to a simple principle; they protect society from those elements within it who are interested only in their own selfish ends. We may cry out at those rules and regulations we see as “restrictive”, but the law was not made to restrict our freedoms but to protect them. Had the SFA years ago acted against Rangers sectarian signing policy, and the songs from the stands, the club would not have mutated to the point where there was no help on hand when they needed it the most. Let’s not kid ourselves about this; Whyte and Green were only able to grab control because the club itself has a dreadful image which put off respectable and responsible buyers. The SFA could have helped change that perception years ago and did nothing.

The SFA could have conducted its own investigation into who Craig Whyte was. They could have asked David Murray for full disclosure when he was running up £80 million of debt, a sum of money that is beyond belief for a single club in a small provincial backwater league. Had they had the guts to do that the club would never have spent itself into oblivion and forced the hand of Lloyds, which led indirectly to their ignominious end.

The SFA could have fully investigated Charles Green and the means by which he took control, instead of rushing through a license. His emergence at the last minute was transparently suspicious and designed to force them into a quick decision, but they did not have to bow to that pressure by making one, without being in possession of the facts, as it is now 100% clear they were not.

Had they asked for every document, had they insisted on legal affidavits and personal securities from investors (and this would have been perfectly legitimate and is common place in other licensing areas) none of this would have come to pass. After Craig Whyte they had a moral responsibility to the rest of the game to get this one right and their failure is without parallel in the history of Scottish football.

As the club hurtles towards a new abyss, names are cropping up which should send a shudder down the spines of every honest, genuine supporter of not only Rangers but every team in the land. The SFA claims that a strong Rangers is essential for the sake of Scottish football, but they have been extraordinarily lax in protecting that club, and therefore the game, from destructive elements. Craig Whyte and Charles Green had dubious personal histories, and the acquisition of the club itself was mired in controversy and scandal. Yet it was allowed.

Neither Green nor Whyte were known to have operated outside the law, yet neither was worthy of trust or stood up to scrutiny. Neither man should ever have been granted the status as fit and proper persons to assume a role in our national sport, and if it is true of them what can we say about the three men who are, presently, being touted as the Great White Hopes for a bright, new Rangers future; Dave King and the Easdale brothers?

King recently cut a deal with the South African government over an on-going dispute over taxes. In other words, he pled guilty and accepted the central plank of their argument; that for years he was engaged in wilfully with-holding vast revenues from their Treasury. The media does not like to put it like that, and the SFA seems willing to ignore it utterly, and this would be scandalous enough. But it does not stop there. HRMC rules – as well as the SFA’s own governance documents – actually bar him from serving on the board of the new club.

Last but not least, aside from being an admitted tax cheat, King is also awaiting trial in South Africa, having been indicted for corruption, forgery and fraud – 300 charges in total. Yet as recently as last week, we were told that the Association was willing to look at him and consider representations from his lawyers. This is almost beyond belief.

If Dave King’s position is untenable, and he is yet to be convicted of a crime, what can we say about the position of the Easdale’s? One of the two brothers, Sandy, has already served jail time. He is a convicted criminal, a fraudster nonetheless, who’s “victim” was the same Treasury who are appealing one case involving the old club and liquidated it entirely over another. This is precisely the kind of “businessman” the fit and proper person test was supposed to weed out, and if the SFA holds its nose here the reek will stink out the halls at Hampden for decades. If King or the Easdale’s are judged fit and proper, then who exactly is the test for? What exactly do you have to do to fail it? How do we explain the existence of laws, when these are not applied?

Pascal says “Law without force is impotent.” The SFA’s weakness has allowed one version of Rangers to destroy itself, and has allowed an existential risk to another. If the next power at Rangers resides in South Africa or Greenock I can say with some certainty that the Association is engaged in an even more dangerous roll of the dice, because the surfacing of fresh scandal will be an ever present risk, and will be of the sort no-one will survive.

The damage to Scottish football will take years to heal. The Scottish game has been through enough trauma. It does not need more. It barely survived the last calamity to hit Rangers. The rest of us should not be forced to pay the price of the next one.

The greater damage will be done to Rangers itself. If the Green crisis ends in another collapse – as it well might; another administration event is a certainty, and another liquidation is a much more likely prospect than it was before 14 February 2012 – the club will once again have to start from the bottom, and this time the reputational damage will be impossible to repair. The club faces internal strife, sporting sanctions, and criminal investigations. The last takeover might be declared a fraud. the Whyte takeover will almost certainly be. The share issue might be invalid, as well as criminal, and the people involved may well end up in jail. Lawsuits could follow from investors, there could be as yet unknown consequences from the Upper Tier Tax Tribunal (thank you Brogan Rogan for pointing out what those might be) and a host of other issues.

Rangers fans must be the loudest voices here. How do you want the world to view your club in years to come? Do you want one to be proud of, or one forever associated with the shame and disgrace of these days gone by? The one which bailed out on its tax obligations. The one with supporters who disgrace your very name. The one which allowed Whyte and Green to take you to the cleaners and send you to the wall. The one which handed over control to one convicted criminal and another awaiting trial. Do you want to be reborn clean, or mired in the muck?

David Murray destroyed your financial stability. He made it so no bank would issue you a line of credit and no investor of note wanted to buy. Craig Whyte liquidated you. Charles Green has cast the future of the Newco into doubt and acted in a manner which has annihilated your credibility with the financial markets for decades to come.

Between these three men, they have taken everything from you, and the press and the people who run the game here, as well as some of your own blindly ignorant fans, have allowed them to do all this and more. Now they conspire to hand the keys to Ibrox to other men of questionable character, who will wreck further havoc on the reputation of the club.

The Scottish Football Association has damaged the game it was supposed to protect, but above all else their greatest failure of governance was a failure to protect one of its biggest clubs from its own excesses and those of its owners.

Rangers fans, the SFA have betrayed your trust, more than the trust of any other club. What you must insist on now is full disclosure and transparency from the powers that be in Hampden. The SFA has to end the charade of allowing your club to handle this in-house. They must hand everything over to an outside agency – whether a legal one, or a footballing body like UEFA – and they must demand co-operation and answers, and threaten to withhold the license if they don’t get them.

You must not be afraid of that. You must embrace it. The men with their hands on the gears at Ibrox are motivated by money, and nothing more. If the license is withdrawn their “investments” are worthless. They cannot risk that.

You must demand that the rules on fit and proper persons are applied, and where necessary even made stronger, to prevent your club falling into unclean hands. You must demand that they protect your reputation from further damage, by getting this all out there and acting accordingly, even if that means your club does not play football for at least a year.

You must be willing to suck it all up, knowing that what will emerge is a Rangers which has been cleansed and moves forward with honour, and dignity, led by custodians who treasure it rather than those who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

The Rangers Standard has recently emerged as a genuine voice for those in your support who are sick and tired of what Rangers has become, and want it restored to something that is worthy of the love and respect in which you hold it. On that website, there are discussions about the kind of club you seek to be and about whether the institution of Rangers is about more than just football.

If that’s how you feel about it then you know it is about more than how many titles the club can claim, about more than just results on the park, about more than just the game. Rangers, like Celtic, is an idea. It has to be something you are proud of.

I am a socialist, but one with a fevered imagination and a tendency to write very dark things. This piece won’t have been good reading for some of you (perhaps all of you haha!) but I think there’s more hope in here than in other things I’ve written.

In spite of everything that’s come to pass, I still believe. I believe in Scottish football. I believe in our system of football governance, even if those who are working in it are failing on some level.

In society, as much as we strain against them, laws exist for our protection. To fail to enforce them is to leave us at the mercy of those elements who would do us harm. The rules of football ensure the protection of all clubs, not just a few.

The failure to enforce the rules has never had graver consequences than here in Scotland.  The irony is that bending and breaking them has hurt the one club those violations were designed to help. It cannot be allowed to happen again.

The rules must be applied without fear or favour.

The best must find their conviction, and their passionate intensity once more.

James is a co-editor of the On Fields of Green Blog http://www.onfieldsofgreen.com/

About the author

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Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

5,802 Comments so far

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ecobhoyPosted on9:04 pm - Jun 9, 2013


pau1mart1n says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:25 pm

Loving TE’s marvellous response – “No idea” about who wrote the article in his paper regarding FARE.
Vaguely sports related you’d think ?
Is the chief sports writer just incompetent or em, being economic with the truth ??
Or a bit both?
==================================================================
Slightly more subtle I would think. Nasty ‘sports’ stories aren’t down by sports journos. The info is usually given to an ordinary news journo to do so the the sports guys can hold their hands up in horror and say one of those bloody news guys done it – sport knew nothing about it or we would have stopped it.

Total fiction but it keeps everyone happy and English might not actually know the name of the news journo involved.

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CastofThousandsPosted on9:07 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Haven’t seen PeterJung’s tidied up audio. Have moderators confiscated it?

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Gaz

GazPosted on9:08 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Madbhoy24941 says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:53 pm

The problem seems to be that the media, clubs and administrators are all just too comfortable and cosy with each other.

To the extent that the head man at the SFA sent a press release to Rangers to OK before he actually released it.

There is very much a country club, all boys in it together feel to the whole thing. All mates together and we, the football fans are just the mugs who pay their wages for them.

That’s probably why they were all so surprised, indeed horrified, that we would not accept their plan to put Rangers straight into the SPL. And why the MSM have been so determined to “move on for the good of Scottish football”.

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ecobhoyPosted on9:10 pm - Jun 9, 2013


resin_lab_dog says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:52 pm
ecobhoy says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:37 pm
___________________________________
I just laughed so hard a tiny bit of wee-wee came out. 🙂
==============================================

No need to rip the pash out of my jokes 🙁

@ Mullach: And the cretan plonk is finished but twas nice.

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ForresDeePosted on9:12 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I now believe that the nuclear event is inbound.

It is however, not an ICBM fired by the forces of good into a den of iniquity under the auspices of freedom.

It is a ‘dirty bomb’ filled with material of an unknown nature by forces unknown for reasons unknown.

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pilgrim1888Posted on9:38 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Test

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on9:38 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I am not a lawyer, but I struggle to see anything which – taken in context – may create a ‘substantive loss’ for someone relating to CF discussion on here where a robust defence of either truth and/or honest opinion and/or public interest couldn’t be advanced.

Whether the contents of the CF posts are factual or not, their existence is a fact.

One of the key discussion elements on this blog has been over how much credence they should be afforded, and the extent to which they correlate with what else was known – and publicly stated – at the time the documents and recordings relate to.

Legitimate debate involving the expression of honest opinion has been conducted based on what they contain.

The material relates to a set of topics the discussion of which on this forum significantly predates the CF material, topics which align directly with the pre-stated aims of this blog. The bloggers were led to CF by her postings on this site, not the other way round.

All of the material has been accessed by logging onto a publicly available twitter account.

And the new LRA also makes individuals, not the moderators/bloggers responsible for their posts, so we are not harming TSFM if we do inadvertently stray over the line.

So relax guys. We really aren’t doing anything wrong. And if any kangaroo lawyer was to establish that we were, it’d the law that needs changing, not our behavior!

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2013/26/introduction/enacted

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EKBhoyPosted on9:42 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Not had time to go through the tapes but read the various emails which are laughable from supposedly professional pillars of society. The more you think about it , only 3 sources of this information :

– current insider at Ibrox, unlikely due to the ‘horses head syndrome’ and tendencies to keep everything in-house
– CW who has been the bookies favourite but all this is doing is making him look a twerp and revealing all his information he will be using for a pay-off, what benefit is he getting?
– lastly, another national organisation who has the power to obtain any information.

I suspect this information was about to buried and a disgruntled member of a well known recently Scottish outfit are leaking like a sieve. Makes sense when you think about the C4 reluctance to publish.

Still one of the last emails may encourage Desmond to purchase the offending PR company and sort of close it after making life pretty miserable for the key staff, move to Dublin office and so on.

Whilst in au contraire mood , it will be interesting to see how long Campbell can keep this up , it’s incredible really. I expect him to be retained unopposed , as who in their right mind would pick up this poisoned chalis.

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jonnyodPosted on9:42 pm - Jun 9, 2013


test

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bangordubPosted on9:44 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Given the reluctance of the msm to risk litigation, perhaps someone needs to call the lawyers bluff?

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ecobhoyPosted on9:52 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Graham Spiers ‏@GrahamSpiers 1h

@CharlotteFakes Very amusing to read that! IM’s ‘account’ of our meeting is 80% accurate, but with a bit of ‘spin’ for CW’s comfort

=========================================================

Well unless someone has hacked Spiers twitter account or is impersonating him it looks as though the CF produced email is real. Interesting that Spiers has confirmed but English is wriggling. Is he a bit ashamed because he has been used and caught out. I actually thought he was one of the good guys and now I know he ate the succulent lamb in a broom cupboard with the light switched off.

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ecojonPosted on9:53 pm - Jun 9, 2013


So we actually have a MSM journo confirming CF material. I think the dam is starting to leak 🙂

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lurchingfrompillartopostPosted on9:53 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Test

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ecobhoyPosted on9:55 pm - Jun 9, 2013


So we actually have a MSM journo confirming CF material. I think the dam is starting to leak 🙂

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jonnyodPosted on9:57 pm - Jun 9, 2013


So CF begins to tell tales about media manipulation and peepil in the SFA and all of a sudden litigation threats start getting fired around ,anyone surprised .
Looks like whoever is behind the CF leaks has not been taken seriously by his target audience and has upped the stakes .
The biggest question outwith all this is why are Sevco seemingly determined to run the club into the ground by increasing costs rather than cutting them to affordable levels .Call me a cynic but the surprise announcement that Airdrie utd can change the name back to that of the old club without having to settle the debts IMO will soon be emerging in this story also .

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:00 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Eco Eventually they will be drawn in.

If I may paraphrase ” YUPYUP YUP YUP”

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pilgrim1888Posted on10:03 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Now that Stewart Regan has raised his head above the parapet to announce the SFA deal with sky we can surely expect questions to be asked of him to explain his alleged email regarding oldco’s UEFA license. “Can you confirm if this email is genuine” would suffice. Too much to hope for? I expect so…..

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jonnyodPosted on10:03 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Also if CO is re-elected in next weeks meeting then I think we can all assume the rest of the Scottish clubs are more than happy with what has been going on in the last 18 months .
Confirmation indeed to the posters who think their clubs are linked to this fiasco .

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:06 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I’ve disappeared very Argentinian.

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Humble PiePosted on10:10 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Sorted! Cheers guys.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:15 pm - Jun 9, 2013


jonnyod says:

June 9, 2013 at 10:03 pm

Also if CO is re-elected in next weeks meeting then I think we can all assume the rest of the Scottish clubs are more than happy with what has been going on in the last 18 months .

What!

He’s up for re election. When What date.?

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Kip StrangePosted on10:16 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Test.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:17 pm - Jun 9, 2013


im limboed TSM

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:19 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Tech wise chaps and gals something’s wrong.

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Gaz

GazPosted on10:21 pm - Jun 9, 2013


The interesting thing is that there seems to be as much discussion about whether it is legally OK to discuss this material as there is actual discussion on the material.

People were happy to talk about this stuff for months and now that there has been material shared which supports a lot of what we thought it seems that people are becoming less willing to do so.

I find that quite extraordinary.

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john clarkePosted on10:21 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I attach for interest a copy of an email sent just now to Magnus Linklater, whose name the person alleged to be McKerron uses to ‘threaten’ an alleged journalist named, allegedly, Spiers, for allegedly being off message in his reporting of the RFC ( allegedly once a football club).

Dear Mr Linklater,
I would be very surprised if you are unaware of the twitterer who tweets under @charlottefakes.
The tweets and associated links are very entertaining.
( I pass no judgment, of course, as to whether anything tweeted is true, or whether any copy of a letter that is referred to in the tweets is a copy of an authentic letter)
But you may be amused to note that the author of the document to be found at this link
i.imgur.com/7N6DWtn.jpg and http://i.imgur.com/VTTNpF3.jpg

who is giving an account of dressing-down he gave to a Mr Spiers , reports to the addressee of his missive as follows:

” I did drop into the conversation that both Gordon and I were in (sic) first name terms with Magnus Linklater, his editor…”

You may want to have a look at the letter by clicking on the link.

You will be able to judge its authenticity by contacting these supposed ‘first name terms’ friends, if indeed you know them.

If it is not a fabrication, of course, I am sure you would not wish to have any ‘first name terms’ friends feel that they could threaten a journalist working for any paper of which you are the editor, simply by using their ‘friendship’ with you as a weapon.

If they thought they could, that would not say an awful lot about you as an editor, would it?

And your late, great father would surely turn in his grave.

Regards,
John Clarke
Ps. Incidentally, your father’s little volume on Mary Queen of Scots ( published 1933) is, to my mind, a gem.

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lurchingfrompillartopostPosted on10:23 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Internet = reading stuff, listening to stuff, following links arising from interest in the unfolding of corruption, rule-bending and breaking, secret protectionism, love of money, institutional incompetence, failure to govern, etc.

RTC and TSFM have given a forum for those who care to research and opine and try to build a truth jigsaw on what data can be gathered from around the fringes of the secret places, because those who should have acted correctly didn’t.

Given the speed at which these serious misdemeanors are ‘punished’ it might be a long time before we’ll get banged up for retweeting for the crime of seeking truth. Wouldn’t have to in the first place if the rules were enforced by those who should. Don’t care about that anyway as resin_lab_dog says it’s the law that needs changing. That would cement the absurdity of this saga for someone to get done for that while the prime movers all retired to France. Ho ho.

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WalterPosted on10:25 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I think this has been a big day for revelations: Tom English engaging with CF, and Spiers involved too.

Hopeful that we are seeing a bit of honesty.

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on10:26 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Ogilvie & AGM
============

Just been perusing the SFA website to locate the AGM Agenda for Tuesday (?) – and the minutes of the AGM from last year.

Maybe they’re hidden away in the website but couldn’t locate them. I presumed that this information – and for an organisation in receipt of public monies – would be publicly available information.

So my comment is limited to the apparent re-election of Ogilvie as President. I am assuming he would also be unopposed?

If correct, is it possible for the Internet Bampots to register a late candidate?

As a protest to the SFA and its ridiculousness – I was thinking along the lines of those elections which returned an animal as mayor: how about a goat for SFA President? (Works on several levels… 🙄 )

Or has that Aberdeen woman still got the mannequin she registered as a candidate in the council elections last year?

Either way – goat or mannequin – they would be more trustworthy as SFA President than the incumbent.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-human_electoral_candidates

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TSFMPosted on10:27 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Had some hitches today with the login. The social media connect stuff we were using was causing some confusion, but we have now reverted to the same connector as before – with the same requirement to be registered with wordpress.com.

We may have to ask people to register on the site itself in the fullness of time, but unless there is massive abuse that will be implemented gradually.
No doubt there will still be some snagging to be sorted over the next few days, buy I hope it doesn’t inconvenience anyone unduly.

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SouthernExilePosted on10:29 pm - Jun 9, 2013


On the day that a remarkably brave and articulate 29 year old is revealed as the one that stripped the clothes off of the world’s mightiest empire, this coyness about ooh can we retweet that seems a bit………

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pau1mart1nPosted on10:29 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Why does TE keep replying as Ted Crilley though?
Granted, it is funny, but is he not meant to be the serious journo?

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on10:31 pm - Jun 9, 2013


john clarke says:
June 9, 2013 at 7:31 pm

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resin_lab_dog says:
June 9, 2013 at 7:17 pm
“—Yep. On a ‘follow the money’ basis –> Charlotte fakes = Ticketus…….”
——
I’ll buy the fact that you wouldn’t have to search far for a motive!

But if the Ticketus gang have got clean hands, why not go direct to the authorities with their ‘evidence’ and blow the whole of any and all conspiracies apart?

And if they haven’t got clean hands, how would this drip-drip process get them their money back without they themselves being implicated in a possible conspiracy to defraud?

The fact that they sort of shut up after LH’s judgment that they were unsecured creditors,kind of puzzled me, although it’s hard to see what else they could have done.

Sadly, what with being an utterly upright citizen an’all, without the guile of a street urchin, I cannot get into the money-men’s minds!

______________________________________________________

Its a good question.
Possible reasons why they might not go direct to the authorities with their ‘evidence’ and blow the whole of any and all conspiracies apart:

(i) Publicity shyness. These strike me as ‘behind the scenes’ fellows rather than the type of people who advertise on the side of buses. They’ve probably had all the attention they want by now. Most TRFC followers have forgotten they were ever there. The clubs TU lend to don’t like to make a song and dance about their cosy little arrangements, and nor do they. Their customers are in the phone book. Thay aren’t hard to find. TU don’t need to advertise. Whilst their tax affairs are entirely legal, doubtless, and their investors all fine upstanding citizens, public scrutiny can be an unwelcome distraction at times, as many protagonists is this saga are finding out.

(ii) They’d be giving away a potentially lucrative asset for free! Would going to the authorities get them paid? Not a chance! Would turning the thumbscrews on RIFC and all the other chancers get them paid? Mebbes. Would making a film out of it all? erm… sign me up! … now how would you maximise the impact of a story like this? That would rather depend on how you use the information in your possession. Which in turn relies on maintaining control over it.

(iii) I doubt very much the authorities would accept redacted versions of the material. Maybe some of the value from some of the stuff in charlotte’s stash is damaging and is valuable to TU simply because it has not been disclosed.

Or, perhaps more pertinently:
(iv) What authorities do you mean exactly? Would you trust these proper authorities to do anything with it (And I don’t mean hire a shred-it van)?

Footballing governance? aah… That’ll be a matter for the SFA then d’ye think?

EBTs and Tax? That’ll be HMRC then… that’s all right with all you TU investors isn’t it?
…And HMRC will do what precisely? Go after TRFC with no publicity whatsoever. Tax affairs are confidential.

Strathclyde’s finest perhaps? Plod’ll be over it like a cheap suit I’m sure what with his in depth knowledge of financial fraud, and given how quiet things are down Glasgow’s east end. Then again…

First Minister’s office…. ‘Dear Mr Salmond. I have some nuclear information that requires you to take some action will massively P155 off several hundred thousands of Scots voters a few months ahead of a national referendum on your raison d’etre. Where shall I leave it?’

Scottish press? … “Dear Mr Jackson…
aye right.

Bloody hell.. who else is there? Channel 4 News maybe?

… We might possibly be well and truly through the looking glass here chaps!

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Gaz

GazPosted on10:33 pm - Jun 9, 2013


The last time I listened to Mr Spiers on radio he absolutely denied being a Rangers supporter, and if I remember correctly mocked the caller who had said it.

I found that strange at the time, as I distinctly remembered him being entirely open about it in the past.

I don’t know if the cock crowed three times, however it could have.

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TSFMPosted on10:36 pm - Jun 9, 2013


The CtH stuff has turned up the heat on an already very warm Sunday. Legally, I don’t think we have overstepped any mark here, but I think when someone of AT’s stature advises caution, it is worthwhile listening.

It should be remembered that what is out there is only an implication of guilt/wrongdoing/disreputable behaviour. Extrapolating from there to stating those as matters of fact might be jumping the gun a bit, and we should all remember that we are responsible as individuals for things that are said on the web.

The rush to conclusion is understandable given the sordid nature of this affair from day one, but it seems fair that the healthy scepticism this blog was built on should be applied no matter the bias of the information.

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SquigglePosted on10:38 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Keep plugging away Mr Speirs, you’re doing a grand job! You’ll even get a seat in the recently cleared Club-deck for your efforts, you can sit next to Mr Regan and soon to Sir Campbell. ‘That creep Lawwell’ will be there every second weekend to get his orders too.

Total rubbish

What I thought I’d said.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on10:41 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Regards,
John Clarke
Ps. Incidentally, your father’s little volume on Mary Queen of Scots ( published 1933) is, to my mind, a gem.

It is John but what a come down. vv Father to son.

If I was him id get tore right in.

TSFM getting tired of logging in each post

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TSFMPosted on10:45 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Ian again,

Tick ‘remember me’

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CastofThousandsPosted on10:47 pm - Jun 9, 2013


resin_lab_dog says:
June 9, 2013 at 9:38 pm

“So relax guys. We really aren’t doing anything wrong”.
————–

I’m sure you’re right resin. Jack will be feeling comforted though that he still has some influence. Once he ruled with a rod of iron. Now all he’s got is a thumbs down. Don’t want to humiliate the guy totally. I mean, if Graham Speirs was once considered a renegade then Jack must be having a seizure reading the stuff we’re posting. The sun going down on an empire.

When the levee breaks Jack, the mountain mans gonna have to leave his home.

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SquigglePosted on10:53 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Long before CG made a complete crumpet of himself he had embarked on tour of worldwide sevconians, worldwide megabuck sponsors, met the ECA, signed a lease at the airport and posed for Puma – has any one thing he said come to pass?

The guy was a complete chancer, was he challenged by MSM? Despite that we now know – he was in close contact with SR/ND/SFA/SFL, did they ask him to be a bit less arrogant on the terraces? Did the media ever wonder why he could get away with that and some SPL managers can’t fart without challenge?

MSM are a disgrace. Is CF Mr AJ?

Idea surely for TSFM. Boycott. The MSM. Works for the Establishment club!

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john clarkePosted on10:54 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Apolgies to all: I foolishly forgot that Magnus Linklater retired as Scottish editor of The Times some months ago. Haven’t been able to find a public (or even private!) email address for him.

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upthehoopsPosted on10:59 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Charlotte is being a very astute lady tonight. By posting info which mentions MSM hacks she is almost forcing them into speaking to her.

Personally I think the dam which is currently holding back MSM reporting may soon develop a wee trickly leak which will quickly deteriorate, leading to total failure of the dam.

On that note I will bid you all a very good night as Monday and all its joys beckons.

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newtzPosted on11:08 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Yay ……. back to normal login ….. Thks

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willmacufreePosted on11:20 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Test

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goosyPosted on11:24 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Could Charlotte`s real aim be to attract the attention of a publisher or film producer?

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john clarkePosted on11:35 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Re my ‘bounced’ email to Magnus Linklater, I think I’ll send him a hard copy to his postal address. Apart from anything else, That will allow me to use my real name -maybe’s.

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greenockjackPosted on11:37 pm - Jun 9, 2013


I think some are getting a little over excited about Charlottes recent offerings and showing a degree of naivity as to how PR people and the press go about their work. I´m surprised given how closely this site has examined their deeds in recent times.

It´s hardly surprising that a PR company looks for ways to influence, distort, spin, lie etc and that they don´t have much in the way of ethics on the shopfloor. A place which when involved with a high profile public business will often involve the media.

Neither can we be surprised at the media, to whom we generally give the thumbs down when it comes to their competence and work ethic.

It´s not a nice world out there and if you extrapolate spin-managment upwards it is used to facilitate all kinds of nasty goings-on, including taking countries to war and huge lose of life.
Dr.Reid could tell you more about that.

Personally I despise the overt advent of spin, the general acceptance of it and that companies like Media House can make so much money on the back of what many may term as questionable practices.
So PR companies and spivs should IMO not be allowed such an easy ride in society and statute.
——————————-

Note that Rangers are not the only high profile club that will have considerable influence and won´t be shy to use it when necessary with the media and the governing bodies.

I am curious to see the outraged reaction on here to the investigation into the background of FARE given that this is the first place to assemble as much circumstancial on individuals and groups that are deemed relevant.

The PR guy who inferred that Spiers simply wasn´t that good a journalist got it spot-on.

The governing bodies need new leadership but we´ve known that for a while.

The tapes were interesting. They helped fill in some blanks, had me revising previous theories and give rise to more questions.

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dedeideoprofundisPosted on11:38 pm - Jun 9, 2013


QT, but could you please reinstate the “” to the top of each page, it makes for easier navigating through the murky depths.

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phill450Posted on11:45 pm - Jun 9, 2013


“But if the Ticketus gang have got clean hands, why not go direct to the authorities with their ‘evidence’ and blow the whole of any and all conspiracies apart?”

The whole point of Octopus Investments seems to be offering investors “tax efficient solutions” – I think with the recent spotlight on Google, Apple and Amazon, they would rather keep a slightly lower profile at the moment

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greenockjackPosted on11:50 pm - Jun 9, 2013


phill4500
The 21st corporate century seems oblivious to ‘spotlights’, everything carries on regardless.

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CastofThousandsPosted on11:59 pm - Jun 9, 2013


Magnus Linklater

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schottie59Posted on11:59 pm - Jun 9, 2013


greenockjack says:
June 9, 2013 at 11:50 pm

well I hope there is a “Crocodile Dundee” to blast the spotlights oot……and cause maximum confusion and alarm ! go go Skippy …

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dedeideoprofundisPosted on12:00 am - Jun 10, 2013


Sorry. Older comments. Newer comments.

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WeeBullyPosted on12:08 am - Jun 10, 2013


Crocodile Dundee star Paul Hogan is accusing his once-trusted tax adviser of absconding with $34 million he helped Hogan hide offshore in Switzerland. (From http://www.icij.org)

Can’t trust anyone!

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Resin_lab_dogPosted on12:15 am - Jun 10, 2013


StevieBC says:
June 9, 2013 at 10:26 pm

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0

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Ogilvie & AGM
============

As a protest to the SFA and its ridiculousness – I was thinking along the lines of those elections which returned an animal as mayor: how about a goat for SFA President? (Works on several levels… 🙄 )
Or has that Aberdeen woman still got the mannequin she registered as a candidate in the council elections last year?
Either way – goat or mannequin – they would be more trustworthy as SFA President than the incumbent.

____________________________________

Sadly, I suspect that while the SFA presidential election will indeed be a farce, it will more closely resemble this one:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2013/may/05/royal-society-scientists-prince-andrew

(Not aware of any animals actually winning UK elections. I do remember a Lib Dem candidate being outpolled by a penguin, but it turns out to have been a fake: it was actually a guy in a suit.)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-17960490

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greenockjackPosted on12:29 am - Jun 10, 2013


SouthernExile
On the day that a remarkably brave and articulate 29 year old is revealed as the one that stripped the clothes off of the world’s mightiest empire, this coyness about ooh can we retweet that seems a bit………
———————————————-
Well said !

The corporate/political elite are gradually eroding freedom of speech.

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BrendaPosted on12:31 am - Jun 10, 2013


test

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CortesPosted on12:56 am - Jun 10, 2013


The Presstitutes ( (c) Prof Craig Roberts) really are in charge in the greatest little country in the world if this scandal is not dealt with promptly. In absence of prompt and effective action by Scottish Ministers, despite being a lifelong SNP voter and activist, I shall vote NO to independence, since it would appear to me that “the rules for US are different from the rules for THEM”.
Rant over

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bogsdolloxPosted on1:41 am - Jun 10, 2013


Araminta Moonbeam QC says:
June 9, 2013 at 1:53 pm

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Latest CF stuff very interesting. Attempting to intimidate public officials a bit of a bad move. I knew Jack was a wrong ‘un but it is all there in B & W now. He seems to think he’s in an episode of The Sopranos.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

And also the instruction to have “in house security” tap up there pals in the Force for info.

This kind of stuff is ILLEGAL and a matter for the err — police and certainly one for an MP with a backbone/grudge/death wish

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bogsdolloxPosted on1:50 am - Jun 10, 2013


twopanda says:
June 9, 2013 at 2:27 pm

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Is this the kind of thing PR Companies do in Scotland?
Or just one bad apple
Perhaps another `independent` inquiry to look forward to?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

They seem very well connected and determined to influence civic and political life in a behind the scenes way and very ILLEGALLY.

Let’s hope our politicians sort them out.

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bogsdolloxPosted on2:31 am - Jun 10, 2013


Gaz says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:37 pm

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john clarke says:
June 9, 2013 at 8:26 pm

The biggest scandal ever in Scottish sport, involving fraud, lying, cheating stealing, rule breaking, rule changing and extending to the administrators of the game and they refuse to report on it.

They are not journalists or even reporters. Sports writers at the most, and even that is pushing it.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Spineless liars is what they are. National papers – too much in thrawl to the sensitivities of the “BIG TWO”. Change it.

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zendavistaPosted on2:37 am - Jun 10, 2013


A bit O/T but shows the turmoil caused when owners take over a football club with no Idea of what it means to fans and no idea how to run it http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA1TVgMFmkw&feature=youtu.be

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Seedy LonerPosted on2:46 am - Jun 10, 2013


Cortes – off topic I know, but are you really suggesting that the potential benefits to Scottish society that independence can offer (benefits moral, financial, and cultural) are really worth denying simply because you think that the Scottish Government hasn’t done enough? What else do you think they can do? Or is this just a fit of pique?
How by voting No do you think things will improve? All of what’s happened at Ibrox has happened because UK agencies have allowed it to happen, either through negligence or incompetence or both. Voting No will change nothing. Indeed, it will ensure that everything remains, at best, the same as they are now.

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bogsdolloxPosted on2:51 am - Jun 10, 2013


Cortes says:
June 10, 2013 at 12:56 am

The Presstitutes ( (c) Prof Craig Roberts) really are in charge in the greatest little country in the world if this scandal is not dealt with promptly. In absence of prompt and effective action by Scottish Ministers, despite being a lifelong SNP voter and activist, I shall vote NO to independence, since it would appear to me that “the rules for US are different from the rules for THEM”.
Rant over
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

They will let you down that much is inevitable. But don’t vote NO on account of the charlotones in the SNP. Other parties have many more than youse. Vote yes and join the SSP.

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bogsdolloxPosted on3:45 am - Jun 10, 2013


Re this Jack Irvine character – when was he operating for the News International? His methods seem very similar to the LAW BREAKING that was going on within News International. Was he there at the time?

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tomtomPosted on7:00 am - Jun 10, 2013


Was there ever a time when the NOTW got their stories legally?

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upthehoopsPosted on7:27 am - Jun 10, 2013


Re-the media silence on Charlotte

a) Are they staying silent in order to cause no more damage to their beloved Ibrox club?

or

(b) Are they worried what might come out about them if they have a go at the likes of Jack Irvine?

or

(c) Are they just scared of being intimidated and threatened?

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EKBhoyPosted on7:35 am - Jun 10, 2013


Upthehoops

d. ) All of the above

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greenockjackPosted on8:04 am - Jun 10, 2013


UtHps on MSM silence

Ask AT.

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Peter DPosted on8:35 am - Jun 10, 2013


Re the remixed audio of CG from May 9. There is an issue with the file I uploaded to soundcloud. For some reason the volume on the updated file is very low. Need to do some more work on it. No time until later in the week.

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ecobhoyPosted on8:45 am - Jun 10, 2013


Walter says:
June 9, 2013 at 10:25 pm

I think this has been a big day for revelations: Tom English engaging with CF, and Spiers involved too. Hopeful that we are seeing a bit of honesty.
========================================================

I hate throwing cold water about. Spiers has been open with CF and that’s good because he has confirmed the contents of the email reflected his conversation.

However English isn’t engaging with anyone but trying to avoid the question. As I said yesterday I always thought he was a good guy but unless he comes clean then he’s a putrid lamb guzzler in my book.

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redetinPosted on9:12 am - Jun 10, 2013


StevieBC says:
June 9, 2013 at 10:26 pm

Ogilvie & AGM
============

Just been perusing the SFA website to locate the AGM Agenda for Tuesday (?) – and the minutes of the AGM from last year.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

StevieBC, you make an important point! We need TRANSPARENCY in the SFA. You would expect to find SFA agendas, minutes of meetings, public correspondence etc available to the general public. Virtually every public body and organisation does this now. You would expect to find minutes of meetings with the SPL/SFL and individual clubs unless the info was commercially sensitive.

There is an urgent need for the SFA to open its records to scrutiny by the football-paying public.

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valentinesclown

valentinesclownPosted on9:23 am - Jun 10, 2013


What if all cf comments are ALL true, what will be the outcome?? It al is so complicated who could we trust to deal it it fairly in this country?

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SamPosted on9:25 am - Jun 10, 2013


test

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SamPosted on9:30 am - Jun 10, 2013


Jack Irvine, a former executive for News International – which owns NotW and Mr. Murdoch’s other print media holdings in Britain – says bunging has been “commonplace in British journalism for as long as I’ve been in it, probably before.”

“There’s always been a very close relationship between reporters and policemen,” adds Mr. Irvine, now chairman of the public relations firm Media House. “It might be as innocuous as a relationship where someone goes for a pint with someone. At other times, a journalist might be asked for 10 quid [pounds], 20 quid, 50 quid. It goes on, it has always gone on. I’m not saying it’s right, but it does go on.”

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