The Immortality Project

ByHumble Pie

The Immortality Project

The Immortality Project – or – Death and Denial – Guest Post by Humble Pie

Death has a tendency to put everything else into perspective.

My family recently suffered a bereavement. It wasn’t a sudden death but it was still far too quick and far too soon for any of us to get our heads around. As our loved one’s illness progressed, each of us, in our own way, began to prepare for the inevitable. In the end, whilst it was not unexpected, it was nevertheless very traumatic, for everyone concerned.

Grief is a strange and often debilitating set of emotions. Even now, a few months on, when the intense sadness and tears have given way (mostly) to disbelief, we still find it hard to fully comprehend what has happened. We might never completely ‘come to terms’ with that fact, however, we do accept that it DID happen, much as we all wish that it hadn’t.

Many of you will be familiar with the Kubler-Ross model of the five stages of grief; Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression and Acceptance. Well, I am aware of having experienced each of these stages over the last year, as well as a couple of others which I wasn’t prepared for (a lot of personal reflection, a little guilt and a not insignificant amount of pain).

It seems to me that the Rangers supporters have been purposefully ensnared in an interminable cycle of the first two stages of KR; alternating between the denial of the death of Rangers and anger at what they feel has been done to their beloved club then back again to denial. This, as any first year psychology student will tell you, is a very unhealthy state of mind which, if not addressed, can quickly lead to physiological and behavioural problems.

At its lowest level, for example, people throughout the ages have continued to set places at the dinner table for their long-dead loved ones. They know in their hearts that the person has died but are comforted by the familiarity of doing the same things that they have always done. However, in extreme cases people have even kept and maintained the actual cadavers of the deceased, dressed them, talked to them and watched TV with them, in a state of absolute denial.

In archaeology, accepting and recognising the inevitability of death through conducting ceremonial burial services is considered to be one of the very first signs of a civilised people. You see, grief is a uniquely human and cathartic process i.e. it can produce ‘a feeling of being cleansed emotionally, spiritually, or psychologically as a result of an intense emotional experience’.

In short, grief is ultimately a good thing which leads you through a series of natural psychological steps towards acknowledgement of an unalterable situation, allowing you to take stock, re-evaluate and start to move on with your own life in a positive way.

That is what should have happened with the fans of the old Rangers.

Instead, this ‘never-ending cycle of the undead’ was positively encouraged by those many unscrupulous individuals who saw a way of making a fast buck from maintaining the ‘Then, Now and Forever’ illusion. Worse still, this resurrection fantasy is being facilitated by the very people whom we have entrusted to stop this kind of thing from happening in the first place. If only the SFA or the MSM had told them the truth, they might have had a chance to actually face up to the situation.

Unfortunately, these two bodies were so complicit in Rangers demise, so right up to their necks in the brown smelly stuff, that they were too afraid to face the inevitable anger which would have rightly come their way. So, they made up grim fairy tales to feed to the bereaved souls about non-existent ‘holding companies’, the ethereal ‘club’ which transcends death and by suggesting that it is ‘all a matter of opinion’.

Ernest Becker, in his 1973 Pulitzer Prize winning book ‘The Denial of Death’, posits that “human civilization is no more than an elaborate, symbolic defence mechanism against the knowledge of our own mortality”. This fear of death acts as an emotional and intellectual response to our basic survival instincts.

‘By embarking on what Becker refers to as an ‘immortality project’, in which a person creates or becomes part of something which they feel will last forever, the person feels they too have become part of something eternal; something that will never die, compared to their physical body that will die one day’. When this ‘immortality project’ is threatened it leads inevitably to fear, depression, loss of identity and sense of purpose.

In that case, the initial reaction of the fans to the imminent demise of Rangers was entirely predictable and understandable. “No way, this can’t happen to us, we are the people”. However, as soon as the full realisation of their club’s inexorable slide into liquidation began to sink in, came the expected anger. But towards whom should their righteous wrath be directed?

“Who did this to us, who are these people?” they cried. “Not I”, said Sir Murray of the Mint, “for I was duped”, “Nor I”, said President Ogilvie, “for it was never my role”. “Nor I”, said Mr Smith, “for I never knew nothing or nothing”. “Not us”, squealed the media monkeys in unison, “for that’s what we were told”, “Nor us”, said the SPL “it was nothing to do with us”.

“Who then?, we demand to know who these people are”, howled the horrified hordes. “T’was the Whyte knight”, they all concurred, “he alone caused this calamity”. “And the bampots”, sneered the slimy slug. “And the taxman”, puffed the pundits. “And the unseen hand of Mr Lawwell”, whispered the bilious bears from the safety of their den.

There were even those who tried to warn them, not least Hugh Adam, Phil Mac and RTC but they didn’t want to know. Even when their very own Messrs Green and Traynor spelt out, in no uncertain terms, that liquidation meant the death of their club, still they chose wilful ignorance. The MSM, with access to the same information, encouraged them to keep their heads firmly ensconced, ostrich stylee, on the banks of that ironically blue and white river in Egypt. Which just goes to show ‘you can lead a lamb to knowledge but you can’t make it think’

The point though is that the Rangers fans have heard the truth and once you have heard something you cannot unhear it. Even if you reject it, even if you deny it, it gnaws away at the back of your mind, infecting your subconscious.

Almost a year ago, I posted the following on TSFM. http://theinternetbampot.wordpress.com/2012/09/ in which I postulated that the SFA were too frightened to say anything which might imply that The Rangers were a new club.

Looking back at that post, I am amazed at how little the landscape has changed.

A year on and it has become apparent that the corporate cancer that destroyed Rangers has continued to metastasize in its new host. Charlotte’s revelations may have shown us that the rabbit hole goes much deeper than we first suspected. However, in my humble opinion, the information provided has only succeeded in ‘poisoning the well’ and deflecting attention from the main culprits in this disaster. Layer upon layer of complexity has been added to an already opaque story and the majority of her utterances appear designed to engage the more enquiring minds on this forum and consume their excess mental energy.

I know that some people are bored with this ‘debate’ but, to my mind, the single most important step for the redemption of Scottish football is the fan’s acceptance that The Rangers, who currently ply their trade in the SPFL First Division, are a new club. Once they have accepted that then everything else that they perceive has happened to them will begin to make sense. They will see that rather than everyone having a fly kick at them when they were down, most were actually trying to help them. It will also dawn on them that the very people who have been telling them that there is an anti-Rangers conspiracy against them are actually the same ones who are screwing them over.

Rangers were not relegated to div 3, The Rangers applied as a new club and were granted entry into the bottom tier of Scottish football. They are not banned from European competition, merely ineligible as a new club without the requisite financial ‘history’. Any reference to ‘rulings’ from ECA, ASA, the BBC Trust and any internal or so-called ‘independent’ enquiries are completely irrelevant, as none of these bodies are the final arbiter in this case. Scots Law is clear that there is no distinction between club and company after incorporation, when the company dies the club dies with it. That is not a matter of opinion, it is a matter of fact.

Sooner or later The Rangers fans are going to realise this fact and when they do, there will be hell to pay. Until they do, their new club can never become truly cleansed. Only then can they move on and only then can they join together with fans of other clubs to root out the real cancer at the heart of Scottish football.  That’s why the MSM and the SFA are still petrified to say anything. In the meantime the real creators of this disaster are sneakily positioning themselves further and further away from the scene of the crime.

I am sure the majority of us would happily accept a new Rangers, cleansed of its financial, emotional and supremacist baggage. A club that all decent Rangers fans could support without feeling any guilt about Rangers downfall or that they were being taken for mugs. The prospect of a new dawn in Scottish football, where sporting integrity took primacy and clubs lived within their means was very real. However, as usual the SFA couldn’t miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

The truth is that Scottish football is in the state it is in, not because Rangers died but because those with the power and mandate to effect the prognosis sat back and did nothing. I am sure that they believe that ‘time heals all wounds’ and that the longer this injustice is allowed to stand the more likely it will be accepted by the man in the street. No doubt the authorities feel it is in the national interest to ‘let sleeping dogs lie’. However I cannot accept this. I believe that it is vital that we are able to face up to reality so we can move on for the benefit of all football supporters.

Scottish football is at a crossroads right now, I think we all feel it. Rampant corruption has become so mainstream that many of our fellow supporters have began to accept this as the norm. However, it just doesn’t sit right with me and I suspect that many regular contributors and readers of this blog feel likewise.

We have quite lost our way and we live in a society which spends vast amounts of money paying people like Jack Irvine to ensure that we stay lost. The mainstream media treat us like little imbeciles and demand that we conform to their assumed ‘professional superiority’. The PR machine plays up to our stereotypes and feeds our fantasies while the poorest people pay to swallow their poisonous propaganda and relentless trivia.

So what can we do ? Clearly, battering out a few blog posts and strongly worded letters to the various authorities involved has been rewarded by the square root of FA.

How can we make this an opportunity for growth rather than contributing to the destruction of Scottish football ? It is not good enough to tear down a system unless we have a better system to replace it. However, I believe that it is not the system itself which is broken. It is that those charged with administering the system are hopelessly corrupted, hugely conflicted and unable to apply their rules without fear or favour.

By their incapacity and inaction (wilful or otherwise) the SFA have facilitated a motley crew of various spivs, chancers and con-artists to glean the last few meagre pickings from the bones of the emaciated loyal supporters of this new club purporting to be the once mighty Rangers. They have permitted these ne’er-do-wells to collectively appropriate many tens of millions of pounds from the Rangers fans, the creditors and the public purse. They have already allowed this corporate malignancy to spread to a new host, ‘The Rangers’, and the absence of ‘moral hazard’ makes it more likely that the disease will continue to spread.

Benjamin Franklin once said, “‘Nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes.”

Someone else once said, “The wages of sin are death, but by the time taxes are taken out, it’s just sort of a tired feeling.”

I sense that we are all beginning to get tired of this. It is time to stand together, all football fans, face the facts and direct our anger against the officers of the SFA who have allowed this sham to develop into a catastrophe.

I have no doubt that my humble opinions expressed here will raise the ire of many deluded souls. However, I am comfortable in the knowledge that the only people who get mad at you for speaking the truth are those that are living a lie.

RIP Big Man.

 

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3,959 Comments so far

BawsmanPosted on2:52 pm - Sep 16, 2013


They had £10 Million a couple of months back.

Will they see HALLOWEEN (last day for AGM) before it’s all gone?

That’s a serious question to the guys with the spreadsheets.

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scapaflowPosted on3:49 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Allyjambo says:
September 16, 2013 at 2:35 pm

AJ the Great Administrator Friar Tucked two clubs and the SFA. World’s Greatest Football Administrator, more like Wile E Coyote. Shame on those incompetents and cowards who re-elected him unopposed….

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Exiled CeltPosted on3:54 pm - Sep 16, 2013


One thing I am surprised that was not corrected by the esteemed panelists on Sat was Paul Murray’s claim to be the one that “outed” Craig Whyte. Along with his best pal Keith Jackson, its simply incredible that both are now claiming to be the one that broke the story.

Trying to remember exactly why RTC was a prize winning website………….of course the same folks were too busy to find the identity of the website owner to worry about the “99% crap” being spouted on there……..and abuse Phil for his breaking of the story……..to worry about whatever was being spoken about in detail being true apparently!

Now 18 months later, the lesson has still not been learned…..

As George Bush said, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice, shame on….er…………..you or me………..LOL

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on4:04 pm - Sep 16, 2013


So, Scottish Cup second round draw was earlier today (see blow for full details)

now, last year, weren’t Sevco in the draw at this stage (1-0 away to 10 man forres) -as SFL3 members, however, as “THEY” had been in the SPL the previous season they were exempt from the next round. But they DID play the 3rd round didn’t they? (7-0 against Alloa)

they got all the way to the dizzying heights of the 5th round when DUFC humped them

At least this year there will be no confusion/rule bending on their inclusion

—————————————-

Berwick and Peterhead paired in Scottish Cup draw

Berwick Rangers’ home tie against Peterhead is the only pairing of senior Scottish teams in the draw for the second round of the Scottish Cup.
Highland League leaders Brora Rangers will play Cove Rangers, one of potentially four ties featuring teams from that competition.
Wick travel to Turriff United and Formartine host Inverurie Loco Works.
And Fort William could face Lossiemouth if they beat Newton Stewart and Culter in their respective replays.
Those teams featured in goalless draws in the first round of the cup and meet again on Saturday.
Preston Athletic’s reward for their 4-3 win over Huntly is a trip to Hampden to take on Scottish League Two side Queen’s Park.
The matches are scheduled to be played on Saturday 5 October.
William Hill Scottish Cup second round draw
Gala Fairydean Rovers v Clyde
Turriff United v Wick Academy
Albion Rovers v Spartans
Queen’s Park v Preston Athletic
Brora Rangers v Cove Rangers
Dalbeattie Star v Montrose
Edinburgh City v Fraserburgh
Berwick Rangers v Peterhead
Keith v Elgin City
East Stirlingshire v Threave Rovers
Stirling Albion v Whitehill Welfare
Auchinleck Talbot v St Cuthbert Wanderers
Formartine United v Inverurie Loco Works
Fort William or Newton Stewart v Lossiemouth or Culter
Buckie Thistle v Annan Athletic
Deveronvale v Linlithgow Rose

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BigGavPosted on4:09 pm - Sep 16, 2013


borussiabeefburg says:
September 16, 2013 at 11:33 am

Use blockquote with at either end a ‘less than’ and then a ‘greater than’ before the start of the quote, and a ‘less than’ and then a ‘greater than’ preceded by a /

I think I’ve got it now!
Thanks to you, and to Tif Finn who also replied.

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SmugasPosted on4:15 pm - Sep 16, 2013


scapaflow says:
September 16, 2013 at 3:49 pm

I don’t care if the world’s greatest administrator won sooper dooper guy of the year three years running he IS conflicted and he is PERCEIVED to be corrupt. He should have gone as any man of true principle would have in February 12. That he didn’t makes me hope now even more that CF’s latest allegations bite him in the rear that makes him wish he’d never heard of the letters EB or T.

This post was made shortly after personally receiving 2 pieces of mail today. Item 1. A demand from PAYE for monies that they claim, wrongly, that one of my business persona is due. Item 2. An offer of a discounted season ticket from my FSPFL club of choice which, when you cut through the waffle, is in response to my apparently not having renewed a near 20 year seat (and 30 year relationship). Funny that.

And yes I added the extra F deliberately.

Rant over.

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Carl31Posted on4:25 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I need to re-read stuff like the disciplinary tribunal and its appeal chaired by lord Carloway, the LNS SPLIC and the 5WA to try to make some more sense of various things, but as a taster of a longer post …

Considering a few docs of the governing bodies together…
1. The SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter defines a ‘Person’, and includes a ‘club’ in the definition. The SPL has it that a ‘club’ is a ‘Person’, in a legal sense.
2. The LNS SPLIC holds that Rangers FC are without legal personality – which I take to mean ‘not a legal Person’ as the SPL has it in 1 above. If in terms of the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter, then this Rangers FC is not a ‘club’.
3. The LNS SPLIC charges are set against Rangers Football Club Plc and Rangers FC.
4. The LNS SPLIC refers to the existence of the 5WA, but not the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter, but it should be noted that by the time of the SPLIC ground rules, the 5WA existence was public knowledge whereas the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter wasn’t.
5. The 5WA has ‘Rangers FC’ as a football club.
6. The Rangers FC defined in the 5WA can’t be in the same terms as applied by LNS in the SPLIC to its ‘Rangers FC’.
7. The ‘Rangers FC’ charged by the SFA and in its tribunal (predating the 5WA), stood accused of non-remittance of social taxes, amongst other things. Given that an entity that has no legal personality cant remit any kind of tax since it will have no banking facilities, then that ‘Rangers FC’ that was issued with a registration embargo, can’t be the same one that is defined in either the 5WA or the LNS SPLIC.

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scapaflowPosted on4:31 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Smugas says:
September 16, 2013 at 4:15 pm

Expecting anyone who sits around the comfy tables at Hampden to display honour, integrity or even a wee bit of contrition, is as pointless as waiting for hell to freeze over. They will not resign, step down, or move aside, power will have to be prised from their grasp with a very large crowbar.

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jean7brodiePosted on4:45 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Allyjambo says:
September 16, 2013 at 2:35 pm
———————————————————————
AJ what you refer to is called ‘The Dilbert Principle’ ie
” … companies tend to systematically promote their least-competent employees to management…”

Says it all really!

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scapaflowPosted on4:51 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Smugas says:
September 16, 2013 at 4:15 pm

Ah the Peter priciple

“In more formal parlance, the effect could be stated as: employees tend to be given increasing authority until they cannot continue to work competently. It was formulated by Laurence J. Peter and Raymond Hull in their 1969 book The Peter Principle, a humorous[1] treatise, which also introduced the “salutary science of hierarchiology”.”

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Paulmac2Posted on5:18 pm - Sep 16, 2013


There is nothing….not one thing on this planet shocking enough that could be produced…presented…or revealed about Campbell Ogilvie that would make him resign from his paid employment at the SFA…

He has absolutely no shame…no moral conscience or strength of character in this Scottish football farce…

He will not resign under any circumstances…because he could not care less about Scottish Football…he is a shameless man who is paid by Scottish football to assist…help…promote…advantage one club who gave him TAX free lump sums of money…and in return he does what he is told by the new re-formed club…

No matter how loud we shout he will not walk away….

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john clarkePosted on5:32 pm - Sep 16, 2013


BigGav says:
September 16, 2013 at 4:09 pm
‘..I think I’ve got it now!’
—-
Go to the top o’ the class!
I look at the link, and I scratch my head, astonished that although it’s written in English, it might as well be in Sanskrit for all the meaning it has for me.
I’d need an hour’s individual tuition before I could do that neat little boxing of quotes!
But what a good thing it is, because it clearly separates the poster from the person who is being quoted.

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on5:39 pm - Sep 16, 2013


None of the new CF revelations comes as a shock to me .
Of all the inquiries and investigations there seems to be a recurring theme
Not guilty verdict ,smiling faces on the steps of Hampden
Guilty but with such a meaningless sanction ,smiling faces on the steps of Hampden .
The J Farry scandal should have rocked Scottish football to it’s core ,the fact it was one days news next days chip wrapper should tell us all we need to know .
Funny to that one of the men in the Farry scandal survived the debacle to inflict IMO one of the most disgraceful pieces of evidence in the LNS farce all these years later .
The peepil running Scottish football have not been fit for purpose for many many years now .If anything they are getting worse .

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tic6709Posted on5:39 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I may have missed it but have the Sevco accounts been published today ?.

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scapaflowPosted on5:46 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Paulmac2 says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:18 pm

Paul,
Ok, whose worse, Mr Ogilvy for having no honour, or those who had the responsibility and the ability to remove him, and instead re-elected him unopposed?

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scapaflowPosted on5:49 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Tic 6709 says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:39 pm

Nope not so much as a debit

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StevieBCPosted on5:51 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Tic 6709 says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:39 pm

I may have missed it but have the Sevco accounts been published today ?.
============================
Haven’t seen anything yet Tic 6709.

But I am sure ‘Adam’ would know when the audited accounts will be published… 🙂
[That one’s for the RTC addicts !]

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scapaflowPosted on5:54 pm - Sep 16, 2013


StevieBC says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:51 pm

Stevie, Adam is probably beavering away in whatever foreign land he was hiding in, cooking up the books as we speak….

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rantinrobinPosted on5:54 pm - Sep 16, 2013


john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:32 pm

JC ,with regard to boxing of quotes,it is neat and ever so helpful,but like you,it is beyond my ken.On this ,as with most sentiment, we stand together.

PS,fantastic post Ecobhoy at 8:43 a.m.

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Tif FinnPosted on6:00 pm - Sep 16, 2013


41. john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:32 pm

Go to the top o’ the class!
I look at the link, and I scratch my head, astonished that although it’s written in English, it might as well be in Sanskrit for all the meaning it has for me.
I’d need an hour’s individual tuition before I could do that neat little boxing of quotes!
But what a good thing it is, because it clearly separates the poster from the person who is being quoted.

Put blockquote before the start of the text, then put /blockquote after it and that should do it for you.

both should be encased in < and it's counterpart

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Tif FinnPosted on6:06 pm - Sep 16, 2013


It’s counterprt is > obviously

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sickofitallPosted on6:11 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Bbc1 tonight panorama all about tax avoidance in the uk should be good

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rantinrobinPosted on6:13 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Tif Fin You lost me on the first line.I would need a flow chart before I could attempt block quote.

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Danish PastryPosted on6:14 pm - Sep 16, 2013


john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 12:51 pm

“… the pleasure that is to be obtained from football , when I drank my coffee while reading in today’s ‘Scotsman’ the match reports of the 18 games in the first round of the Scottish Cup .
I all of a sudden grew nostalgic, thinking of the first ‘real’ game I ever attended- Parkhead Juniors …”
——–
Indeed John, it’s good to get back to basics. I’d say one indirect benefit to flow from The Sevco Schenanigans is the exposure the lower leagues have been getting. The way these teams have flourished for all the right reasons, in spite of being effectively given survival rations and cast adrift in a lifeboat by the SPL boys, is magnificent. Like you, I’ve been taking a much greater interest in the leagues outwith the SPL. I can even see that in my native Dennistoun a new team is doing well in the world’s oldest amatuer football league! The ash pitch at the end of Finlay Drive is now plastic grass, which means that ‘Dennistoun Amatuers’ play only a few hundred yards from where the now defunct Dennistoun Waverley used to play. A nice wee bit of local community continuity.

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scapaflowPosted on6:29 pm - Sep 16, 2013


The Scottish hacks really look after their own, not

BBC issued a statement supporting Jim Spence

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/you-might-not-have-seen-this/#more-4013

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Humble PiePosted on6:39 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Hi guys,

Just catching up with the last few days postings. Ecobhoy’s post this a.m. is absolutely on the money. The work that Ecobhoy, newtz, castofthousands et al have undertaken to expose the corruption at the heart of our beautiful game is nothing short of exemplary. These posters are doing the work that our feckless MSM was supposed to do. I believe that we owe them all a debt of gratitude for their tireless efforts. More power to your elbows chaps.

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BarcabhoyPosted on6:42 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I read Ecoboys excellent article. My initial reaction is to agree with all he said, but I think the debate would benefit from a legal interpretation of the CF letter

Ecoboy may of course had a legal opinion as part of his article.

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PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on6:46 pm - Sep 16, 2013


http://www.newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/8033-the-attacks-on-jim-spence-are-an-attack-on-democracy

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tic6709Posted on6:49 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I agree 100%,Thanks to all the great posters on here this is The Information Highway on Scottish Football.

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StevieBCPosted on7:30 pm - Sep 16, 2013


scapaflow says:
September 16, 2013 at 6:29 pm

The Scottish hacks really look after their own, not

BBC issued a statement supporting Jim Spence

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/you-might-not-have-seen-this/#more-4013
===========================
Unless I missed it last week…

Why was this BBC statement not posted on the BBC Scotland website – in the News and/or the Sport section ?

Did the BBC not want anyone to see it at all ?

Confused.com

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ecobhoyPosted on7:31 pm - Sep 16, 2013


a testing time

“41. john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:32 pm

Go to the top o’ the class!”

Will it work?

EDIT: Obviously not back to the drawing board 🙁

EDIT: Who’s a clever bhoy then? 🙂

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PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on7:41 pm - Sep 16, 2013


@StevieBC
Quite so….

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helpmaboabPosted on7:49 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Stan Collymore ranting about the cost of fitb’a tops in the English Premiership.Dons fan contacts programme extolling the virtues of the incentives Aberdeen give to their season ticket holders.eg free tickets,jersey etc.Collymore makes a comparison along the lines of “a league that’s on it’s backside(SPFL).I wonder who created that impression.Oh I remember,Regan,Doncaster.Ya couple a clowns.

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rantinrobinPosted on7:51 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Alright Ecobhoy.Smug moment on the use of Blockquote.After your great post today you are forgiven.

On a more serious note I am appalled that The Scottish press failed to publish the BBC statement re.Jim Spence.

Thanks Phil for bringing this to our attention.

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Exiled CeltPosted on7:59 pm - Sep 16, 2013


StevieBC says:

September 16, 2013 at 5:51 pm
Tic 6709 says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:39 pm

I may have missed it but have the Sevco accounts been published today ?.
============================
Haven’t seen anything yet Tic 6709.

But I am sure ‘Adam’ would know when the audited accounts will be published… 🙂
[That one’s for the RTC addicts !]
***************

Alas poor Adam has once again found himself in another part of the world where internet cannot reach for a year – like the last time he vanished – just be thankful he cannot comment many times spinning everyone in circles – ad infinitum!

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ecobhoyPosted on8:23 pm - Sep 16, 2013


rantinrobin says:
September 16, 2013 at 7:51 pm

Alright Ecobhoy.Smug moment on the use of Blockquote.After your great post today you are forgiven.

On a more serious note I am appalled that The Scottish press failed to publish the BBC statement re.Jim Spence. Thanks Phil for bringing this to our attention.
=====================================================
All part of Life’s great adventure 🙄

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john clarkePosted on8:33 pm - Sep 16, 2013


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scapaflowPosted on8:36 pm - Sep 16, 2013


john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 8:33 pm

As eloquent a comment on the SFA as De Gaulle’s empty chair……

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john clarkePosted on8:36 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Tif Finn says:
September 16, 2013 at 6:00 pm

Like this?

Obviously not, I see.
I’ll try some other time.

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PhilMacGiollaBhainPosted on8:38 pm - Sep 16, 2013


@rantinrobin
Cheers.
Actually I thought I had missed it in the Scottish tabs.
That is why I asked BBC PR today.
I was surprised.

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on8:40 pm - Sep 16, 2013


scapaflow says:
September 16, 2013 at 6:29 pm
11 1 Rate This

The Scottish hacks really look after their own, not

BBC issued a statement supporting Jim Spence

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/you-might-not-have-seen-this/#more-4013

===================================

Aren’t the BBC a media organisation?

Don’t they have SEVERAL football based programs across a variety of media – web, tv, radio and they even have a football magasine.

They also have several current affairs programs focussing on media reporting of significant events

So, why was this statement read out at the start of every football related show – including Match Of The Day and other “English” focussed programs – as well as Sportscene, Off The Ball, Sportssound and every Radion Scotland News bulletin?

If I was Jim, I’b be handing my notice in and looking to pursue a constructive dismissal case.

absolutely shocking treatment of their own employee.

Oh, and the statement is completely missing the fact that WHAT HE SAID WAS THE TRUTH!

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BrendaPosted on8:46 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Those audited accounts are fair taking their time 😉

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JimmyBeeJayPosted on8:48 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Hi all,

I am returning, I was a very small contributor to RTC but like others on this site it is an everyday visit for me.
I continue to be amazed and bemused that the truth remains behind closed doors, that’s politicians for you. Can anyone unlock this mess and clear the stench of corruption?

I don’t know if my if this has been discussed before (I don’t recall seeing it). Would it not be possible for those such as Oglivie, Reagan, Doncaster, the SFA Board etc etc to be asked why if they knew what was going on with Rangers/Sevco, they did not carry out their responsibilities to both the taxpayer and Scottish Football fans? I believe that rather than asking what did you do? The question should be, why did you not do what you are paid to do? The fans and the taxpayer require that these answers should be provided, if they as the games administrators cannot supply these answers to us, they should resign or be sacked immediately.
I think that this is a very reasonable request, and if they had all the information in front of them, and failed to do thieir duty, to do nothing to inform or protect the taxpayer and the fans, they must go now!

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Paulmac2Posted on9:10 pm - Sep 16, 2013


scapaflow says:
September 16, 2013 at 5:46 pm
……………………………………………

I agree…I also stated as such when it took place…they had the chance to remove him…however who was willing to stand against him? I believe a fair few know what has been going on and no one was willing to step in and be dragged into the firing line..or have their family targeted in their efforts to clean up the dishonesty taking place..

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The Round BawPosted on9:11 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I’ve looked everywhere, been in to every cupboard, up and down the country, nothing ! Zilch ! It leads me to believe that when the SPFL took over planet fitba , Ogilvie and Reagan were bundled into the same spacecraft as Longmuir & Ballantyne !

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john clarkePosted on9:16 pm - Sep 16, 2013


PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
September 16, 2013 at 8:38 pm
‘..That is why I asked BBC PR today.
I was surprised.’
——–

I have been incensed enough to fire off by email this letter to the Editor of the ‘Herald’
“..Dear Sir,
I learn today that BBC Scotland issued a statement in support of Jim Spence against the vile moron(s) who approached him in the street in circumstances caused him some anxiety, and prompted him to report the matter to the police.
It appears that only the Saturday edition of the London “Times” carried that statement.
If this is true, it is an appalling indictment of you as an editor of a serious Scottish newspaper .
Do you think that intimidation of a journalist is something that is acceptable?
Or are you yourself so intimidated and afraid ( of little jack?) that you disgracefully resile from any kind of legitimate criticism mindless, thuggish supporters of a football club and leave a fellow journalist unsupported?
Please, as a duty to truth and the freedom of the Press, publish the BBC’s statement at the earliest opportunity.
Or man -up, call it a day and slink off into some nether world of PR and no more sully the honourable chair of Editor.

Yours sincerely,

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ecobhoyPosted on9:25 pm - Sep 16, 2013


http://sport.bt.com/sportfootball/football/scottishfootball/scottishpremierleague/black-apologises-for-silly-bet-S11363833916598

Black is now bleating and mumping his gums today claiming:

‘I broke the rule and deserved the punishment. I shouldn’t have done it. There are a lot of players out there who are still doing it. I could sit and name players but I’m not going to do that. I’d certainly not like to see any players in Scottish football getting done for breaking the rule like I did.’

We already know his manager claims to have a list of who knows how many hundreds of names by now of footballers breaking the rules on gambling. What worries me about Ally’s list – if true – is that it seems to have been compiled from information provided by his own players.

This only reinforces my belief that there is a climate within certain clubs in Scotland where football gambling is not only happening but gamblers in one club know who the gamblers are in other clubs. That is not only unhealthy but very dangerous as even a one-eyed man can see enough to join the dots.

So when is the SFA going to act? They have a clear option – either scrap the no-gambling rule as they don’t intend to do anything concrete about enforcing it or actually enforce it.

I also now wonder why Black was singled out as it appears everyone and their granmy who is involved in the game is betting on and against teams including their own. With such widespread prevalence of gambling it sets the scene for the possibility or organised match-fixing.

Perhaps that’s why the SFA is frightened to look under the turf because they might actually have to get their hands dirty cleaning out the stables.

Fans deserve to have a clean game and so do the Bookies and punters and serious doubts are now being raised about what is actually going on and the SFA has taken its traditional head in the sand stance.

Black and McCoist are not the only footballers who recently have made similar claims and any that have should be interviewed by the SFA and asked to provide names and if they fail to do so they should be disciplined either as party to allowing gambling to continue against the express rules of the game or by bringing the game into disrepute because they have no evidence and are just trying to take the pressure off Black especially from his own fans who are appalled at his betting against their team.

The SFA is clearly unfit for purpose and every day brings fresh proof of that but they will ignore all complaints so perhaps the best way to make a point is to complain to the Bookies and especially those who sponsor the game in any shape or form.

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sickofitallPosted on9:27 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Who on here thinks there will be administration mark 2 in the next six months thumbs up yes thumbs down no

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scapaflowPosted on9:31 pm - Sep 16, 2013


ecobhoy says:
September 16, 2013 at 9:25 pm

You are entirely correct, but, its really a symptom of two virulent infections that afflict Scottish Football:

1. The game is dirty, corrupt to the core

2. An awful lot of Scottish football players are fundamentally unprofessional, Whatever his perceived faults, Paul Le Guen was right about the booze, burdz and chips lifestyles of supposedly professional athletes.

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rantinrobinPosted on9:34 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Well at leat JC got a block up.My apologies to all over my abject failure on blockquote.All part of life’s rich tapestry.

If at first you don’t succeed….give up.Naturally that does not square up with the determination of all on this site to establish the truth.

Carry on

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tomtomPosted on9:39 pm - Sep 16, 2013


rantinrobin says:
September 16, 2013 at 9:34 pm
0 0 i
Rate This

A test
========================
Has Barca passed on the nuclear info to you 🙂

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Carl31Posted on9:40 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I need to re-read stuff like the disciplinary tribunal and its appeal chaired by lord Carloway, the LNS SPLIC and the 5WA to try to make some more sense of various things, but as a taster of a longer post …

Considering a few docs of the governing bodies together…
1.    The SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter defines a ‘Person’, and includes a ‘club’ in the definition. The SPL has it that a ‘club’ is a ‘Person’, in a legal sense.
2.    The LNS SPLIC holds that Rangers FC are without legal personality – which I take to mean ‘not a legal Person’ as the SPL has it in 1 above. If in terms of the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter, then this Rangers FC is not a ‘club’.
3.    The LNS SPLIC charges are set against Rangers Football Club Plc and Rangers FC.
4.    The LNS SPLIC refers to the existence of the 5WA, but not the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter, but it should be noted that by the time of the SPLIC ground rules, the 5WA existence was public knowledge whereas the SPL to Sevco ‘let youse aff’ letter wasn’t.
5.    The 5WA has ‘Rangers FC’ as a football club.
6.    The Rangers FC defined in the 5WA can’t be in the same terms as applied by LNS in the SPLIC to its ‘Rangers FC’.
7.    The ‘Rangers FC’ charged by the SFA and in its tribunal (predating the 5WA), stood accused of non-remittance of social taxes, amongst other things. Given that an entity that has no legal personality cant remit any kind of tax since it will have no banking facilities, then that ‘Rangers FC’ that was issued with a registration embargo, can’t be the same one that is defined in either the 5WA or the LNS SPLIC.

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tomtomPosted on9:42 pm - Sep 16, 2013


What happened there to Rantinrobin’s post? It’s made me look stupid and I’m more than capable of doing that by myself 🙁

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ecobhoyPosted on9:48 pm - Sep 16, 2013


@ tomtom

I know the feeling – I had to edit my explanation four times before I got it right LOL.

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davythelotionPosted on10:01 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Black may be a gormless half-wit who didn’t understand the Byzantine ‘don’t bet on football matches anytime, anywhere’ rule. His gaffer is another kettle of fish. His understanding of the rule is crystal clear. How do we know this? Because he has disclosed his knowledge of rule breakers who are players, coaches and officials!
No doubt the law keepers will be sitting down with Ally to take a statement from him.
Or
Nothing will happen
Or
A Levensonesque inquiry will be commissioned into Ally’s revelations
Or
TRFC fans will boycott Ladbrokes for grassing up Black
Or
Ian Black, after admitting betting against the team that he was playing for, will be dismissed for gross misconduct
Or
Ian Black will become a folk hero to TRFC supporters because he got caught
Or
TRFC will issue up to date, accurate, audited accounts which will leave all the doubters dumbstruck with shock at their liquidity
Or
A deafening silence will continue to thunder forth from Govan vis-a-vis the ‘Club’s’ proximity to financial meltdown.

I know what options my money’s on!!!!!

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rantinrobinPosted on10:03 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Like this Ecobhoy?

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ecobhoyPosted on10:04 pm - Sep 16, 2013


rantinrobin says:
September 16, 2013 at 9:34 pm

Well at leat JC got a block up.My apologies to all over my abject failure on blockquote.All part of life’s rich tapestry.

Well at leat JC got a block up.My apologies to all over my abject failure on blockquote.All part of life’s rich tapestry.

To get the above at the start of the quote type a left facing chevron then type blockquote then type a right facing chevron.

Then at the end of the quote type a left facing chevron then type / then type blockquote then type a right facing chevron

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rantinrobinPosted on10:04 pm - Sep 16, 2013


You’re a great teacher.Thanks Eco.A good day for you,and so say all of us 😛

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ecobhoyPosted on10:06 pm - Sep 16, 2013


rantinrobin says:
September 16, 2013 at 10:03 pm

Very very clever – while I was waxing lyrical about my perfect explanation I managed to delete it – what a hoot 😳

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ecobhoyPosted on10:09 pm - Sep 16, 2013


davythelotion says:
September 16
6, 2013 at 10:01 pm

I know what options my money’s on!!!!!
=========================================
Yea but are you giving better odds than Black ❓

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Not The Huddle MalcontentPosted on10:12 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I don’t think fans give a flying feck if a footballer placed bets on games of football

If they did, then on the back of the claims of several ex players/pundits, McCoist and Black that gambling is widespread then the fans would be calling for their clubs to investigate and for the SFA to get involved.

What several people involved in the game are saying is the game is corrupt, rules ignored and players could be fixing games for their own financial benefit. The authorities aren’t interested and unwilling to protect the game and serve the “customers” who fund it all.

Really, this is worse than the SPL trying to shoehorn Sevco into the league last summer – this is confirmation that the players and management aren’t honest tryers, that even if there are some who play in the right spirit, they are easily undermined by a large number who dont and ultimately, the money we hand over to watch a fair game is in false pretences.

If fans care about the gambling issue (instead of the whack-a-sevconian issue) this weekends games would be to empty houses as fans gathered on the steps of Hampden to protest.

If it had been Gary Mackay Stevens instead of Eric Black then there wouldn’t be the debate and the player would be banned for several months.

The only way we’ll get the game we deserve is if the fans take action. It is time for a blanket boycott of the scottish game until the key office holders at the SFA & SPFL are replaced.

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tic6709Posted on10:24 pm - Sep 16, 2013


We’re all going to try now.

Maaary had a little lamb>/blockquote>

Thanks eco, i’m getting closer.
spelling deliberate.

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jimlarkinPosted on10:32 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 16, 2013 at 8:40 pm
35 1 Rate This

scapaflow says:
September 16, 2013 at 6:29 pm
11 1 Rate This

The Scottish hacks really look after their own, not

BBC issued a statement supporting Jim Spence

http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/you-might-not-have-seen-this/#more-4013

===================================

Aren’t the BBC a media organisation?

Don’t they have SEVERAL football based programs across a variety of media – web, tv, radio and they even have a football magasine.

They also have several current affairs programs focussing on media reporting of significant events

So, why was this statement read out at the start of every football related show – including Match Of The Day and other “English” focussed programs – as well as Sportscene, Off The Ball, Sportssound and every Radion Scotland News bulletin?

If I was Jim, I’b be handing my notice in and looking to pursue a constructive dismissal case.

absolutely shocking treatment of their own employee.

Oh, and the statement is completely missing the fact that WHAT HE SAID WAS THE TRUTH!

————————————

A cowardly act (by sevconians)

…followed by

…another even more cowardly act (by the BBC)

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upthehoopsPosted on10:34 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 16, 2013 at 10:12 pm
================================
McCoist turned the Black affair into an anti-Rangers story, and with some success it would seem. Of course, that success was only possible because some in the media switched to whataboutery mode in order to support McCoist’s claims. The message was clear as McCoist waved his (probably blank) sheet of paper and some friendly faces were trotted out in support. Rangers and Black are now portrayed as the good guys because they won’t tell on everyone else they know about. How this club can claim to be uber dignified and hold the moral high ground over others is beyond me.

I truly and honestly believe had this been a player from any other club, or Black himself at a previous club, he would not kick a ball for at least six months.

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mirrenmanPosted on10:34 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I’m not going to bother trying it out

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jean7brodiePosted on10:34 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
September 16, 2013 at 10:12 pm

Eric Black???? Sorry you erudite person!

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Lord WobblyPosted on10:47 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I thought a blockquote was something that Jack delivers to the Scottish print media. 🙁

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john clarkePosted on10:53 pm - Sep 16, 2013


And ( see when my blood is up!) this to William Hill:
“..Dear William Hill,
Many of us here in Scotland have been appalled to learn from Ally McCoist ( manager) and Ian Black(player) of Rangers International Football Club that there are hundreds of professional football players in Scotland who flout the rules of the SFA forbidding anyone associated with a professional club to bet on any football game anywhere in the world, let alone in Scotland, let alone bet against their own team in a match in which they are playing.

You will be aware that the said Ian Black was found guilty ( having admitted the charges) of placing many bets on football matches, including bets against his own team in three matches in which he played.

He was given a derisory 10 match suspension ( 7 suspended) and an equally derisory fine.

McCoist, in defence of Black, declared that he had a list of players , over a 100, who were known to be regular punters on football matches.

And in a statement today, Black asserted that he knew that there were many that he could name.

The SFA has been extraordinarily silent on the subject, not inviting either McCoist or Black to come forward with their lists or otherwise back up their assertions.

Now,you will know better than I what kind of message this sends out to us, the punters.

It says, loudly and clearly, that Scottish Football may be really ‘dirty’; that players ( and God save the mark!, officials) may be bent; that match-fixing may be far more easily arranged than hitherto thought.

As a sponsor of the SFA, I feel you really must take the SFA to task over their extraordinary complacency and/or dysfunctionality in this matter.

It is hard enough for the punter to weigh up which team is the form team. If we have to weigh up which players or officials may have ‘fixed’ the match we would be in an impossibly nonsensical position.

Bookies all over the place will be ripped off.

And, as sponsor of a perceived dirty sport, you will be seen as having been had.

Would you consider , please, making some kind of public statement on this matter?
Your sincerely
( real name and address supplied, as with letters earlier)

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john clarkePosted on11:04 pm - Sep 16, 2013


mirrenman says:
September 16, 2013 at 10:34 pm
—-
Clever clogs!!

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BawsmanPosted on11:05 pm - Sep 16, 2013


john clarke says:
September 16, 2013 at 10:53 pm

————————————-

I’ve stated from square 1 that it will be something akin to the old IRS Al Capone moment, something from left field that will get justice administered to the festering sore.

This could be the silver bullet………….go ma man JC.

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john clarkePosted on11:10 pm - Sep 16, 2013


Like this, maybe???

No, not at all!FFs

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john clarkePosted on11:16 pm - Sep 16, 2013


One more attempt:

To get the above at the start of the quote type a left facing chevron then type blockquote then type a right facing chevron.

Then at the end of the quote type a left facing chevron then type / then type blockquote then type a right facing chevron>/<

It’s all in what is meant by left facing, right facing chevrons!!

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TSFMPosted on11:16 pm - Sep 16, 2013


This;

Blockquote syntax

Produces this

My nicely formatted quote

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leavesntreesPosted on11:17 pm - Sep 16, 2013


As an avid follower, and daily reader of the TFSM, I see the LNS report is back in the firing line again. As a long time ‘lurker’ I have to agree with ‘echoboy’ in regards his take on Lord Nimmo Smith possibly being ‘used’. LNS Report P.7 [18]

“[18] The Commission also referred to paragraphs 3 and 4 of the list of preliminary issues which had been before it at the preliminary hearing, to the effect that the SPL was, by its conduct, barred from seeking the imposition of sanctions, or at least of a particular sanction, in the event of a breach or breaches of the Rules being established. For the reasons given at paragraph [53] of our earlier written reasons, we reserved these preliminary issues to be reconsidered, if necessary, at a later stage. Mr Mure informed us, however, that they were no longer to be argued, so we shall say no more about them.”

Although it seems clear that there had been a backroom deal done (5WA), prior to the hearing, between the SPL and Oldco that no sanctions(titles?) would be imposed even if they were found guilty! LNS seems to suggest that he wanted to ‘reserve’ these issues to be looked at again at a later stage. It looks to me he wasn’t given a chance and was told nothing to see here and told to move on by Mr Mure (Oldco representative). Is there anything that he could have done faced with both parties unwilling to participate?

On a lighter note, everyday I find myself stunned at the analytical abilities and quality of the posts on the TSFM. The hacks in the Scottish Media are being put to shame on a daily basis. I only hope the regular posters here who continually crack the dam get some credit when it eventually bursts and hopefully washes clean the game that I love.

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BarcabhoyPosted on11:21 pm - Sep 16, 2013


I haven’t seen Ecoboys rationale for his article, so I have to caveat this

I tweeted that I agreed with what he wrote, but for context I would have liked a legal interpretation. Having looked again at the side letter, my take on it is now as follows

Everything Ecoboy wrote is correct if you believe the side letter guaranteed that no titles would be stripped.

My problem is that isn’t how I interpret this. Or more correctly , I don’t believe that explanation to be absolute. Why mention Sevco ? The case on EBT’s was against Oldco. A plausible explanation is that Sevco wanted a guarantee they wouldn’t be fined for the actions of Oldco. That isn’t unreasonable given nobody would invest with the prospect of unknown and unlimited fines hanging over Sevco’s head. Given the amount of money other clubs were deprived of because of David Murrays illegal behaviour and tax evasion scheme, there was a prospect fines could have been huge

What is unclear , is why this was dealt with by a side letter, but as it wasn’t a condition imposed for SFA/SFL membership , then maybe that’s how it should have been dealt with

Having said that, the people who believe this is a smoking gun have been excellent contributors on here, so I’m certainly not dismissing their view

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