The Offline Game


First off, the violence was abhorrent. Fans fighting fans is …

Comment on The Offline Game by tayred.

First off, the violence was abhorrent. Fans fighting fans is plenty bad enough, but fans attacking players takes moronic to a whole new level. It takes a special kind of cowardice to assault someone surrounded by thousands of your mates. At least there were plenty cameras around, lets hope each and every one of those that perpetrated violence on Saturday get what they deserve.

But, that part aside, how many times over the last couple of weeks have we seen pitch invasions? Every play-off from down south has had a pitch invasion, Barca etc etc. Why? What has led to this re-emergence of a long forgotten phenomena? Why has there not been a more active response to prevent this happening? Why did nobody imagine such a thing was possible on Saturday? We are all mostly human – you see something happening on TV and you think well if they can do it why can’t we.. not so long ago streakers were rampant, not so much now, now its fully clothed mass pitch invasions that are the flavour of the month.

Idiocy aside – is this the start of the armageddon we were promised? This situation has been bottled up and carefully matured by the SFA, SPFL, SMSM and each and every one of our clubs (the fine folks at Raith Rovers aside) over the past 4 years. We now have on one side the untouchables, the entitled Peepul back to “where they belong” and everyone really hates them now so they really, really don’t care! On the other side you have fans from every other club, sick and fed up of the bias and blatant corruption of our game. Bottled, matured and now ready to explode into our stadia and onto our streets when the next season begins? 

Well done Regan & Doncaster, and all the cowardly chairmen , well done.  

tayred Also Commented

The Offline Game
WOTTPIMAY 31, 2016 at 14:24 
Add to that there is still the Fraudco issues to be resolved that could, on a left field issue bring up issues with ownership, along with other unresolved legal matters sitting on the back burner. Stadium maintenance has been identified as being needful by the current board so anyone coming in would have to consider that as well.

Unless of course the likely outcome of the stadium ownership is already clear to King and as such he has a trade off between securing ownership plus subsequent maintenance/upkeep of neglected and ageing stadium or building a new stadium elsewhere (may well be the cheaper option in the long run).

It might be easier and cheaper to repeat the crash and walk away to pastures new, badge it up as a new Rangers (although it will be sold as the same Rangers) and Bob’s your uncle – debt free, shiny stadia and in Englands rich and pleasant land.

Still don’t think it will happen though.

The Offline Game
Hi Reiver, I do. But work beckons for me so I’ll have to save that for another day. But I think it is a topic that this wonderful place should devote more time to discussing. 

The Offline Game
If the club (which club would that be?) moved to Carlisle, they will lose a lot of support.

The true blue football supporter within the ranks won’t be interested. That group may well give birth to a new club, and another journey up through the pyramid which may well in time bring a blue presence back to the SPFL. I’d imagine such a club would have a good chance of successfully ridding itself of a lot of baggage along the way, and I for one would welcome that approach (shame it didn’t happen post 2012). 

Meanwhile those more fanatical supporters happy to stick two fingers up to the “haters” and head off into the promised land that is the English Leagues, will probably lose interest very quickly when the dramatically reduced chances of winning anything become painfully obvious. I doubt they can secure sufficient investment to make in-roads towards the top league for years, and even if/once they get there I can’t see Carlisle Rangers having anything like the romance of a Man Utd, Chelsea or even Newcastle to secure the funding required to make a realistic challenge on any of the major trophies. European football would be a pipe dream. It would have to be a form of Glasgow Rangers, playing in and registered as a Glasgow team to stand any chance.

The model I’ve seen described would surely be a non-starter.

Recent Comments by tayred

Who Is Conning Whom?
Finloch, who is to say that Milne hasn’t told TRFC and McInnes exactly that – Once the money is available away you go and talk.
Seems to me that all that AFC can be held as being guilty of at the minute is not seeking the SMSM to do their dirty work for them, not spouting off through broadcasters and journalists and unbelievably behaving in something approaching a professional way. Something TRFC couldn’t even begin to imagine doing.
AFC supporters are most certainly being treated with contempt by the SMSM and by TRFC, and in all probability by McInnes but Milne…. in this case I think its too early to say. That said… it wouldn’t surprise me!
I have my problems with Milne, but in this case I think he can’t win regardless of how it ends. I only hope come the end of it all he will pay more attention to feelings of the AFC supporters than those of TRFC and their compliant media. 

The Vice Closes
DUNDERHEID, no. The law doesn’t come into it. It has already proved to be utterly useless at doing anything about it because its unworkable. Freedom of speech is valuable and should be guarded. No problems with that. 

But here we are in a chat site full of intelligent people. People it seems that are quite happy for certain chants to be sung, despite complaining like hell when “the other side” gets off with it week-in week-out. I just don’t understand it! The one line answer “its not sectarian” floored me, and I’ll wager most outside the South-West of Scotland won’t understand it either.

Listing songs other clubs sing that are just as objectionable is fine – I don’t like them, nor understand why perfectly sensible people find them amusing. But while TRFC are belting out their well known ditties and CFC fans bring out their IRA songbook, its very hard to tackle the ignorance in songs about the economics of housing in urban environments! The Jimmy Saville related songs are quite simply revolting. 

Anyway. Its a pointless argument as it sadly seems too ingrained in people from all the big to be solved anytime soon. Have a good weekend folks.

The Vice Closes

My point wasn’t to open a debate on what is and what isn’t sectarian – quite frankly thats a side argument – if its offensive I don’t care if its sectarian or not.  But to question why it appears to be ok with some to sing about the IRA, and why the excuse appears to be because it “isn’t a sectarian song”.

Be it sectarian or not, there is no place for this at a football match in any normal society. It depresses me that so many are willing to accept this situation, and as mentioned elsewhere it seems incongruous that CFC fans are so ready to point the finger at TRFC fans whilst watching some of their own fans start the slide down that slippery path once again.

I’ll also add here that my own teams fans sing songs that may be considered by some offensive and I really wish they didn’t, but meantime you will never hear me defending those fans that are singing them.

The Vice Closes

TONYSEPTEMBER 21, 2017 at 18:08 30 23
TEARSOFJOYBut to the meat of the matter, that irresistible force : sectarian singing. The hypocracy that surrounds Celtic on this matter is staggering and the number of CFC fans that take the moral high ground on this matter equally so. CFC fan sing pro IRA songs – we all know it, we’ve all heard it. So let’s stop pretending otherwise.

IRA songs are not sectarian

I was going to ignore this message, but then I saw the amount of support it got from the SFM community. I was appalled. Its not a sectarian song apparently, and perhaps strictly speaking it isn’t, but to outsiders looking in it is every bit as repugnant as anything that TRFC fans (or indeed any other group of fans) may wish to sing.

I admitted perviously, I’m not an expert on the Irish politics. The IRA may have noble beginnings, standing up to the oppressor, one mans terrorist is another freedom fighter etc etc. But, as someone who had young family in that shopping centre in Manchester that particular day, I find it incomprehensible that anyone would believes glorifying the IRA is something that it is ok to sing about at a football match – a football match for gods sake.

The song may not be strictly sectarian for the pedants amongst us (and this site thankfully has many pedants pointing out the wrongs of the world in a more useful way), but to those looking at Celtic & Rangers from the outside it is impossible to separate the IRA/UDF or whoever from sectarianism and henceforth that song to the rest of us most certainly IS sectarian. Stop the whataboutery, stop the hate and bile returning to your support. If you need a target aim for Regan and the rest of the SFA or the Scottish media who are disgustingly wilfully helping to fan the flames of bigotry by turning their collective backs on the issue once again.

If Celtic and Rangers want to have any thoughts of joining the English leagues, then they will have to rid themselves of this baggage once and for all. Until then you most certainly won’t be welcome. But then “nobody likes us and we don’t care”. This stuff is not welcome at any of the other 40 odd grounds around Scotland, the lack of it over the past few years has been a joy – please don’t let it come back.

I know you CFC fans all hate the term – but two cheeks. By re-opening that once forgotten song book you are becoming one with your hate filled brothers from the other side of town. If you can’t see that then we might as well give up now.

My family walked out of Manchester that day unscathed thankfully. There are enough problems in this world without letting this nonsense get a firm foothold back in our society. 

The Vice Closes
The song book – if the SFA/SPFL had stepped in right at the start of the issue of the TRFC songbook this wouldn’t an issue. If they had applied all the rules without fear or favour this wouldn’t be an issue. But by their repeated silence on the issue the TRFC fans grew bolder and soon realised they could do and sing whatever they liked. Sadly CFC fans appear to have decided that if “they can do it, then so should we”.

Yes, both clubs have historical links to Ireland. But god does it bore the pants off those from the remaining clubs around the land listening to this perpetual school boy playground drivel. Yes, ok it is far from being a school boy issue – I don’t understand all the issues relating to Ireland, and I sincerely doubt many others do. What I do know is that the majority of those fans belting out these revolting songs don’t understand them either, if they think they do its from the perspective of one side of the argument and even then deeply flawed. For them it is a school playground issue – they don’t really care about the politics or the history, its just what they do on a Saturday afternoon cos thats what their fathers did. Its tired, its pathetic and it has no part in any modern society. 

Yet, in Scotland it isn’t just present, but due to the inactivity of those with the power to do something about, it it is flourishing. The press couldn’t give a stuff either… why? Cos it sells tickets and it sells newspapers. I love my country, but it has issues that the majority find downright mystifying and embarrassing – is it only money that allows this to continue? I mean it couldn’t be anything else could it?

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