Good Evening.
As we ponder the historic vote to create a new Governing body to oversee Scottish League football, I cannot help but wonder what brilliant minds will be employed in the drawing up of its constitution, rules, memorandum and articles of association?
Clearly, Messrs Doncaster, Longmuir and even Mr Regan as the CEO of the SFA will be spending many hours with those dreaded folk known simply as “ The Lawyers” in an attempt to get the whole thing up and running and written down in the course of a few short weeks.
In truth, that scares me.
It scares me because legal documentation written up in a hurry or in a rush is seldom perfect and often needs amendment—especially when the errors start to show! The old adage of beware of the busy fool sadly applies.
It also scares me because the existing rules under which the game is governed are not, in my humble opinion, particularly well written and seem to differ in certain material respects from those of UEFA. Even then, adopting the wording and the approach of other bodies is not necessarily the way to go.
I am all in favour of some original thought– and that most precious and unusual of commodities known as common sense and plain English.
Further, the various licensing and compliance rules are clearly in need of an overhaul as they have of late produced what can only be best described as a lack of clarity when studied for the purposes of interpretation. Either that or those doing the studying and interpreting are afflicted with what might be described as tortuous or even tortured legal and administrative minds.
If it is not by now clear that the notion of self-certification on financial and other essential disclosure criteria necessary to obtain a footballing licence (whether European or domestic) is a total non-starter — then those in charge of the game are truly bonkers.
Whilst no governing body can wholly control the actions of a member club, or those who run a club, surely provisions can be inserted into any constitution or set of rules that allows and brings about greater vigilance and scrutiny than we have at present—all of course designed to do nothing other than alert the authorities as early as possible if matters are not being conducted properly or fairly.
However, the main change that would make a difference to most of the folk involved in the Scottish game – namely the fans— would be to have the new rules incorporate a measure which allowed football fans themselves to be represented on any executive or committee.
Clearly, this would be a somewhat revolutionary step and would be fought against tooth and nail by some for no reason other than that it has simply not been done before—especially as the league body is there to regulate the affairs of a number of limited companies all of whom have shareholders to account to and the clubs themselves would presumably be the shareholders in the new SPFL Ltd.
Then again to my knowledge Neil Doncaster is not a shareholder in The SPL ltd– is he?
I can hear the argument that a fan representative on a league body might not be impartial, might be unprofessional, might be biased, might lack knowledge or experience, and have their own agenda and so on—just like many chairmen and chief executive officers who already sit on the committees of the existing league bodies.
Remember too that the SFA until relatively recently had disciplinary committees made up almost exclusively of referees. I don’t think anyone would argue that the widening of the make up of that committee has been a backward step.
However, we already have fan representation at clubs like St Mirren and Motherwell, and of course there has been an established Tartan Army body for some time now. Clubs other than the two mentioned above have mechanisms whereby they communicate and consult with fans, although they stop short of full fan participation– very often for supposedly insurmountable legal reasons.
As often as not, the fans want a say in the running of their club, but also want to be able to make representations to the governing bodies via their club.
So why not include the fans directly in the new set up for governing the league?
Any fan representative could be someone proposed by a properly registered fan body such as through official supporters clubs, or could be seconded by the clubs acting in concert with their supporters clubs.
Perhaps a committee of fan representatives could be created, with such a committee having a representative on the various committees of the new league body.
In this way, there would be a fan who could report back to the fan committee and who could represent the interests of the ordinary fan in the street in any of the committees. Equally such a committee of fans could ensure that any behind the scenes discussions on any issue were properly reported, openly discussed, and made public with no fear of hidden agendas, secret meetings, and secret collusive agreements and so forth.
Is any of that unreasonable? Surely many companies consider the views of their biggest customer? This idea is no different.
Surely such a situation would go some way towards establishing some badly needed trust between the governing bodies and the fans themselves?
If necessary, I would not even object to the fan representatives being excluded from having a right to vote on certain matters—as long as they had a full right of audience and a full right of access to all discussions and relative papers which affect the running of the game.
In this way at least there would be openness and transparency.
In short, it would be a move towards what is quaintly referred to as Democracy.
Perhaps, those who run the game at present should consider the life and times of the late great Alexander Hamilton- one of the founding fathers of the United States of America and who played a significant role in helping write the constitution of that country.
Hamilton was a decent and brilliant man in many ways—but he was dead set against Democracy and the liberation of rights for the masses. In fact, he stated that the best that can be hoped for the mass populace is that they be properly armed with a gun and so able to protect themselves against injustice!
Sadly, Hamilton became embroiled in a bitter dispute with the then Vice President of the nation Aaron Burr in July 1804. Hamilton had used his influence and ensured that Burr lost the election to become Governor of New York and had made some withering attacks on the Vice President’s character.
When he refused to apologise, the Vice President took a whacky notion and challenged him to a duel! Even more whacky is the fact that Hamilton accepted the challenge and so the contest took place at Weehawken New Jersey on the morning of 11th July 1804.
The night before, Hamilton wrote a letter which heavily suggested that he would contrive to miss Burr with his shot, and indeed when the pistols fired Hamilton’s bullet struck a branch immediately above Burr’s head.
However, he did not follow the proper procedure for duelling which required a warning from the duellist that they are going to throw their shot away. Hamilton gave no such indication despite the terms of his letter and despite his shot clearly missing his opponent.
Burr however fired and hit Hamilton in the lower abdomen with the result that the former secretary to the treasury and founding father of the constitution died at 2pm on the twelfth of July.
The incident ruined Burr’s career (whilst duelling was still technically legal in New jersey, it had already been outlawed in various other states).
In any event, in Hamilton’s time full and open democracy in the United States of America would have met with many cries of outrage and bitter opposition. Yet, today, the descendants of slaves and everyone from all social standings, all ethnic minorities and every social background has the constitutional right to vote and seek entry to corridors of power.
In that light, is it really asking too much to allow football fans to have a say and a presence in the running of a game they pay so much to support?
paulsatim says: June 13, 2013 at 12:13 am
Thursday’s DR back page. Some guy called Prior, hailed as ready to splash cash with you know who! http://t.co/JppKYxNKn5
===============================
Just in after having a few beers after work – and the above did make me laugh!
So, the MSM can’t go for “off the radar wealth” billionaires again…so why not try a “City genius eyes Gers ” ?
Genius and Gers don’t belong in the same sentence.
A “City genius” interested in a football club – a football club in Govan in SFL2?
Really? !
The Scottish MSM continues to underwhelm.
Pathetic.
Good Morning,
Does anyone else find it interesting that amid the revolutionary changes brought in the other day, that quietly and without fuss, the definition of what is and what is not a “club” has been amended?
“club” means a football club playing Association Football in accordance with the provisions
set out in Article 6 and, except where the context otherwise requires, includes the owner and
operator of such club;”
So— in the event of a future administration or indeed liquidation of a limited company which is the owner or operator of the club— does this now then mean that it is the “Club” which has gone into administration or liquidation?
Also– does the amendment hint that this is what the SFA had always intended?
It would be interesting for someone to ask those in power what caused them to alter a definition which had obviously stood for a substantial number of years?
Delbhoy says:
June 13, 2013 at 12:48 am
==================================================
That was great Delbhoy. The Alliance party really were a Godsend for ‘Spitting image.’
Are any of their supporters claiming ‘It’s the same party!’ these days? lol.
Can you imagine the fun Spitting image could have with the current mob running our game?
What with their endeavours to save old ‘trigger’s broom F.C.’ What fun!
I think Neil Doncaster would be their easiest subject to work on since Norman Tebbit!
http://www.scotzine.com/2013/06/craig-whyte-a-scotzine-love-story/
good
I read a quote from Stewart Regan saying ‘we can’t afford another summer of bitterness and acrimony’. Has he not realised the bitterness and acrimony from last summer continued right through the winter and is still alive and kicking. One of the main reasons for that is the utter contempt his organisation have treated supporters with.
What planet is this guy on?!!!!!
As usual an excellent post BRTH. My worries over the last wee while have been that a much needed change in Scottish football would come around with a hastily contrived rulebook. As for fans having a say in the running of the game, has this not been going on for years? The only problem has been that they all seem to have been fans of the same club.
Well done StevieBC, you are just in after a few beers following work at 5:08am. Good show.
🙂
The chap from Connemara says he wants to look under the hood of Rangers, I suppose he means bonnet, but then again he might mean hood. Remarkable story, if true. But these days you begin to wonder if it’s all stuff from Spinmeister Ltd.
He seems interested in charity though, so I’m sure Rangers recent charitable events will come to his attention. I know religion is a no-no here, but a big part of me would rejoice if he was … well, ok, a post deletion might ensue, so I’ll just hope that he is 😉
The SPFL
I’d say that, yet again, it’ll be a while before the head on this particular pint has settled and we discover what is beer and what is froth.
test 2
I’ve added a Login/Logout button to the main menu, so registered people can navigate in and out more easily.
There appears to be a problem with cookies, since the login is timing out and not persisting between sessions. I’m trying to fix that right now.
Some people are having moderation problems because they are changing the email address they sign in with. WordPress regards this a first post – and these go to moderation for approval.
More boring stuff later.
@ BRTH
The wonderful George Harrison once said, “if everyone who had a gun just shot themselves there wouldn’t be a problem”. I have no doubt that if he had said this to messers Hamilton and Burr on the eve of the weekhawken tragedy it would have fallen on deaf ears. But then again our two protagonists behaviour is at the very root of George’s frustration. Two men who had the power of change through communication settled their differences in that absurd manner. Any communication must be a good thing and involving fans at the core of the process should surely be encouraged. Who knows even the start of Scottish footballs very own Velvet Revolution. I certainly hope so.
john clarke says:
June 13, 2013 at 1:01 am (Edit)
Delbhoy says:
June 13, 2013 at 12:48 am
‘ I think I met Edward Snowden during that log-in process. He says hello and is asking for stunney with the papers…’
——-
I love it! and where the he.l is said stunney, anyway? Did he tupe over? Don’t think I’ve seen any posts from him on TSFM.
____________________________________________________________
JC
Stunney has tuped over, has delivered the papers and has contributed on occasion. He has been in poor health for a number of years though, and this affects his ability to participate. However he is casting a watchful eye over us 🙂
resin_lab_dogH says:
June 13, 2013 at 1:09 am
Got to agree with that. Maybe has always been the plan to “cleanse” them. Brings new meaning to the “unseen fenian hand”!
Re Prior, I posted this on the LSE (no, not the stock exchange site):
Good luck to him. He seems to be investing with his heart more than his head, which is fair enough, and £600k to him is small beer. Would caution against thinking just because someone is smart they are always right – I am sure Kieran would agree with that. I suffered some fall-out when LTCM blew up – it was run by a bunch of Nobel Prize winners and the former head of Salomon’s bond trading desk, made crazy money, but blew up when Russia defaulted. BTW a £50m fund is not big (presumably it was at GSAM not GS) – LTCM lost $1.8bn…
As I say though, there is nothing that Kieran says there that indicates he thinks he’s going to make money on this – am curious as to why he’d waited to buy in – buying in at the IPO would have meant the money benefits “the club”, not current share-owners… And the fact that he seems to think that paying £600k “to see what’s under the hood” of a plc strikes me as a bit odd, but fair play to him and to Rangers. Adding to the Republic striker Jon Daly, you now will have the biggest shareholder from an Irish family too. Times have changed for the better.
Hearts look like their gonners and blaming rangers as well.
The board of Heart of Midlothian plc today outlines the club’s current financial position and hopes that all supporters become fully informed of the situation the club is facing.
Due to recent unexpected circumstances away from Tynecastle, the club is now experiencing a shortfall in funding.This shortfall, due to recent uncertainty, has created a significant noticeable blockage in projected revenue streams for the club.
While this hesitation is understandable it is unwittingly damaging the club’s current efforts to improve its financial situation including current payments to HMRC and raising doubts over future payments to players and staff.
It is now crucial to the football club that we find a solution to bring in enough finance to allow us to trade into the new season when normal trading can resume with the benefit of SPL and game-related income streams. The payments to HMRC and players/staff salaries are the most important issues in our focus these days where very limited time remains available to the club.
However given that the revenues for season tickets has dried up and no other realistic income is available quickly enough, the club will consider offers for the players of the current squad, including the most promising talent in order for the most necessary and important payments to be made. The board had planned to bring income in through the sale of players while considering the financial forecast for next season but now this will need to happen much earlier in order to preserve the business. We understand that this will lead to significant on-field pressure but at all times we must consider the health of the club and preserve it for future generations.
We will adjust our expectations for the new season accordingly but will still be focused on the playing side of the business. Our financial deficit can, in part, be attributed to our worst league finish in over 30 years last season. This had a significant direct impact on the business. Other factors that hit revenues include the absence of Rangers Football Club from the SPL and significantly increased stadium costs particularly in relation to the Main Stand.
The biggest threat to the club at present however is hesitation and inaction. We hope that those supporters who have purposely held off will reconsider and make the decision to back the club in the best way possible in order that we can meet our targets.
Provided we can achieve security for the club, it is the view of the board that there is a viable strategy for the change of ownership to a willing buyer or investor.
The most difficult part in this is finding an agreement with the creditors, however we know that there is goodwill with Ukio Bankas, as demonstrated by the statement from the Ukio Bankas administrator yesterday. We also believe that UBIG remains supportive of Hearts.
We will be regularly updating you as the situation develops.
http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/20130613/board-statement-financial-and-player-update_2241384_3208756
upthehoops says:
June 13, 2013 at 7:20 am
I read a quote from Stewart Regan saying ……….
——————————————————————–
Now try and convince me that this one was Not authorised by the Blue Room …..
Interesting to me that the Catholic Herald mentions his book @ GS was £25m, the Record says £50m.
Ok own up ……. who spilled the beans …… WP login gone ….
as last post was loading I watched it morph … had to refresh ….
At least inew/old/new/old/new login remembered me ….. looks OK TSFM
Test Post …..
Taking pilgrims lead from yesterday I sent email to SFL to ask which 6 teams voted against the merger and this reply received this morning.
Dear XXXX,
I refer to your e-mail received yesterday evening in connection with the above.
I would advise you that the votes taken yesterday for the various Resolutions were done by secret ballot and accordingly, we are unable to assist with your enquiry. However, I’m sure that the comments attributed to club officials in the various sectors of the media, websites, etc. will reveal some of the clubs that voted no with regard to The Scottish Football being wound-up.
Kind regards,
David Thomson
Operations Director
So there you go, it’s a secret, no transparency.
Test
TSFM says:
June 13, 2013 at 9:33 am
‘JC
Stunney has tuped over,…’
—–
Delighted to hear it.
And sorry to hear that he’s not well.
Hope you recover soon, Stunney.
twopanda says:
June 13, 2013 at 7:19 am
http://www.scotzine.com/2013/06/craig-whyte-a-scotzine-love-story/
good
————–
It was a good article and very detailed. I haven’t done an investigation but I got the impression they has access to Charlotte material that I have not seen. Could Charlotte have mailed some information directly to certain media outlets?
A fresh front opening up. Not long now?
Tomo seems to be pretty sure the info is hacked, but that doesn’t explain why its radioactive. There are “illegal” leaks all over the place and the papers get round them by using words like “it’s been reported that…” and “there are rumours that…”.
Even if no-one wants to refer to them directly, it’s fine to use them as a deep background resource. There is NOTHING wrong with anyone now asking Regan if he did run a press release by RFC before releasing it – and if he’s ever done it before or since – and if he’s ever been so accommodating to any other team/company.
In fact, because it demonstrates such blatant corruption if it is true, it shows the MSM’s complicity and corruption in not asking such basic and necessary questions.
ptd1978 says-
Exactly, I’m sure the msm are using this possible illegality as an excuse to keep quiet and hope it all goes away.
The reason they are not asking questions is that they don’t want to know the answers.
The best wee corrupt country in the world? (Copy Alex Salmond)
Hearts statement claiming the absence of rangers from SPL is one of reasons behind their financial situation
REALLY?
Not mad overspending by the club for years then?
NTHM,
They have used the absence of Rangers as an excuse, akin to a loss of essential funds, due to a Garden Fete being cancelled due to bad weather.
Other clubs have managed without the Blue Pound.
iamacant says:
June 13, 2013 at 10:54 am
———————————–
Or more likely ….. that they have not recieved Blue Room Approval yet ….
Sorry…. but will not let you forget (SFA) … or brush under carpet …
Robert Coyle
That Hearts item suggest supporters are holding back on buying SBs because of the uncertainty surrounding their clubs future.
It shows how important certainty is in keeping a club going from one season to the next and why we are experiencing the silence of the lamb eaters with regard to The Rangers who might be facing a similar problem.
How are sales going there btw?
Perhaps out of the box thinking like setting up a supporters liaison group in keeping with BRTH’s blog might be the quid quo pro that overcome fans resistence. I mean clubs want our money but not any say in how it is used.
I’d ask Hearts supporters to sign up for £10 month DD to become part of an influentual support group and Hearts could borrow against that extra income to see them over the hump.
Football really has to find alternatives to once a year cash injections. Nobody is using cash nowadays.
I remember admittance being one and sixpence ( 7.5p) or free if lifted over. Those days of thousands of one and sixpence have gone but still clubs act as if they have not.
Regarding Scotzine, they have this on their website regarding their new magazine:
If you are interested in writing for our Scottish Football magazine then email editor@scotzine.com
There are several posters here who have done research on key issues. No reason their material couldn’t be distilled into articles for the new mag. All strength to the new independent media.
Is there any other point to which you would wish to draw my attention?
To the curious incident of the dog in the night-time.
The dog did nothing in the night-time.
That was the curious incident.
Recent jpgs, pdf files and sound clips. Yet the SMSM has not barked?
Compare and contrast:-
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/dec/06/print-freelancer-football-scoop-online
Castofthousands.
Your question perhaps supports the explanation given by AT with regard to the way the material is coming out.
If as suggested an inbox or copy of it was lifted lock stock and barrel, if it is anything like mine it would take ages to find those that all relate to the same theme, just ploughing through those under one subject heading would take time.
If it is stolen goods the messages cannot be used themselves but they can be used to open up genuine lines of enquiry.
Danish – Paul67 @ Celtic Quick News has been doing that for a while – guys like BRTH & James Forrest have contributed to the e-magazine/deadtree version.
jockybhoy says:
June 13, 2013 at 12:12 pm
1 0 Rate This
Danish – Paul67 @ Celtic Quick News has been doing that for a while – guys like BRTH & James Forrest have contributed to the e-magazine/deadtree version.
———-
Brilliant jockybhoy.
I saw something about the launch of the new mag and their appeal for contributers, also on sports other than football. Actually, I might be getting my crossed lines here because The Away End seem to have a similar initiative:
http://free.yudu.com/item/details/968084/The-Away-End-Newspaper-Issue-One
Reconstruction.
A Rational Opinion,by Mr McMurdo!
123 years of history were flushed down the toilet yesterday as the SFL clubs caved in to pressure to “merge” with the Lawwell-controlled SPL.
It wasn’t that change didn’t need to happen nor even that such a merger wasn’t a good idea – it is the manner in which the SPL cabal have steamrollered all opposition, forcing SFL President Jim Ballantyne to say: “This is a takeover and not a merger. The SPL has swallowed us up. They can use nice words about it – but it’s a takeover.
“The SFL has had to be a casualty. The SFL is the one which has had to take the hit and I’m very sad about that.”
The real tragedy about this takeover is that there was no input to the proceedings nor opposition from Scotland’s biggest club; only, it would seem, meek compliance and acceptance. It is hard to believe such a stance would have been taken if swashbuckling Charles Green had still been CEO at Ibrox.
My understanding is that Rangers will accept their place of powerlessness in the new set-up and the old days of dignified silence will be the norm once more.
Instead of hitting out at the cabal, there are likely to be further self-destructive attempts to discredit and smear certain people in the ongoing Civil War at Ibrox.
Strong rumours still persist that certain people on the board are planning to topple Craig Mather and bring back the deeply unpopular Martin Bain.
Should this prove to be true, I would expect a massive backlash from fans who are already sickened at the board’s determination to pursue a path leading to disintegration through bitter infighting rather than launch a robust defence against the club’s enemies.
Make no mistake. The cabal have won the battle for control of Scottish football.
And Rangers directors squabbling out of self-interest and pettiness have let the cabal win.
Many Rangers fans are sickened and disgusted this morning, waking up to the reality that Scottish football is now completely dominated by a coterie of people who mean Rangers real harm.
These people will stop at nothing to keep Rangers under their heel while all the time milking the club’s commercial value for their own ends.
Of course, the one man who could have opposed the cabal was effectively silenced and conveniently removed at just the right time.
A coincidence?
Maybe in one of Peter Lawwell’s parallel universes…
I have no doubt that there will be those at Ibrox who will take the view that all Rangers have to do now is just do their talking on the pitch and work back to the top flight.
This is true but only if Uncle Peter lets them.
Rangers are now ring-fenced in Scottish football with no ruling body to protect the club.
Me, I’m not expecting the witch-hunt to abate.
In fact, it’s only just begun.
The Long Journey from Peskyville
Like it or not we are currently the irritable end of the strange entity that is Scottish Football.
We might be or even believe we are at the forefront of the intellectual debate but those in power have no requirement to listen to anyone other than the very few who control their committees.
Our view that Power has corrupted is not even fully shared by the people who run our clubs because while they might agree if really pushed, they have enough to do in just surviving.
They have players to sign, release, train, pay, manage, develop etc. and a bunch of other real stuff to get on with like cutting the grass, paying HMRC (some of them) and organizing stewards!
We might have knowledge on TFSM that says all is not well with our game.
But that doesn’t help our clubs.
I’d argue that we have and are failing them.
We have not demonstrated how our knowledge can be good for each and every business that makes up each and every club.
We remain on the outside somewhere out there in Peskyville and the sad fact is that in any given instance if it is easier for our clubs to do nothing and try to work with what they have rather than take a leap of faith into a new world then that is the path they will take.
They will not rock the boat.
They will not open themselves up to all kinds of unknowns.
Don’t beat up our clubs though.
Even the best run ones are not set up to address the macro issues that we care about and historically have left the big stuff to their associations and committees.
The sad but serious fact is our clubs have to focus on their own survivals and that ain’t easy.
Fans are no different.
Most just want enjoy the banter, to read about who might be signing, about the local kids coming through, to see a game or two and have a few beers with their mates.
Most still read the red tops (less and less often) or listen to the radio and mostly believe what they hear.
Its mostly gossip.
But football gossip becomes a source of small talk for us all and is a universal language that breaks down barriers all over the world.
Football remains an escape and most don’t want it to be too serious or be more than just chit-chat.
And yes the game in Scotland is almost certainly in a slow and unstoppable decline but year on year the change is gradual.
So gradual that there is no grass roots panic or anger.
And the endemic corruption we know about and abhor is never visible and never openly aggressive.
And we also now have The Premiership and La Liga etc to keep us happy so Scottish Clubs will soon be our wee teams as we tupe towards Bayern, or Barca, or Man U or PSG!
Even council telly has lots of football and the internet has changed the broadcasting world for ever
Peskyville People Purpose?
Most TSFM people are a wee bit different.
We have club leanings but also care about stuff.
Stuff that others don’t seem to.
We see the bigger picture but get frustrated when others can’t or don’t or even won’t see it too.
We want a quick win – but sadly I think that is a mirage and we probably don’t even know or agree on what a quick win would actually achieve.
I am the first who’d like to see Ogilvie, and Regan and Longmuir and Doncaster and their wee pals all heading down the road with P60s but what then?
What then because guys and girls, we won’t save Scottish Football with a nuclear strike.
We need influence a hell of lot more people and get them to help change evolve.
We can help that evolution by being the home of Facts and Facts Plus.
Facts
We could be THE source of knowledge on Scottish Football.
Knowledge that stands up to debate (which we should always welcome)
Knowledge that we share with everyone. Not just those who visit our site
Facts on stuff like our list of unanswered questions
Stuff like when did the SFA change which rules and why?
Or was there really an opportunity for the clubs to put up an alternative to CO’s re-election?
Or how did The Blue Club register their players for the Sevco vs Brechin game and who had the licence?
Or what is in and who sanctioned and who signed the 5 way agreement and is it a legal document?
But our real strength could be
Facts Plus
We publish what the facts really mean
Like the cost in real pound notes to other named clubs of Rangers getting their European License or being allowed to limp out their last SPL season.
Or the real cost to real clubs of the years of illegally registered Rangers players
Or the financial losses to Dunfermline caused by the promotion of Dundee. Because someone slowed down the crash of the dead club.
The journey from Peskyville could see us become THE on line alternative to the MSM on Scottish Football. (The irony is if they had done their job properly then we would not have had to rise).
Over time we will grow an inclusive community who have more knowledge.
Knowledge that we freely share.
It promises to be a long, long journey from Peskyville to Cloudville.
I for one am in for the duration.
Do people like McMurdo really truly believe the drivel they spout? Or deep deep down, when only their secret face is on, do they acknowledge to themselves the real unvarnished truth abotu things? I really do despair for humanity when I read drivel like his.
TSFM. Can you do anything about the miniscule letter box slit that is now provided for typing posts? Me no likey.
I should add that I post from my phone only.
Re mcmurdo’s “..no ruling body to protect the club” interesting choice of word as the The Rangers’ protection racket is potentially weakened, we can only hope so. Must be mortifying for him to contemplate the possibilty that his team may be lose its special protection….not that I believe that it really will.
“swashbuckling Charles Green”
“Instead of hitting out”
“ongoing Civil War at Ibrox”
“massive backlash from fans”
“bitter infighting”
“the club’s enemies”
“The cabal have won the battle”
“people who mean Rangers real harm”
“keep Rangers under their heel”
“no ruling body to protect the club”
“I’m not expecting the witch-hunt to abate. In fact, it’s only just begun”
Quotes from McMurdo (or is it leggo in short breeks?)
Why do they always have to show a hint of violence in their musings?
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
June 13, 2013 at 1:12 pm
Reconstruction.
A Rational Opinion,by Mr McMurdo!
————————–
That is really interesting, interesting in a ‘were not in the same universe type way’.
But, while we might not be in the same universe we both saw the same thing in the demise of the SFL with this lovely line;
“Rangers are now ring-fenced in Scottish football with no ruling body to protect the club.”
Put that through the sevco translate bot and I get this;
“Rangers will not get a leg up as promised and two major rangers supporters in positions of power have been removed.”
Maybe, McMurdo is right, just ask yourselves was yesterday (membership issues aside) actually a really small win for the bampots?
If the rules on trialists remain as reported then I believe it was.
Apologies to torrejohnbhoy, I accidentally gave you a thumbs down cutting and pasting 🙁
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
June 13, 2013 at 1:12 pm
0 1 Rate This
Reconstruction.
A Rational Opinion,by Mr McMurdo!
The real tragedy about this takeover is that there was no input to the proceedings nor opposition from Scotland’s biggest club; only, it would seem, meek compliance and acceptance. It is hard to believe such a stance would have been taken if swashbuckling Charles Green had still been CEO at Ibrox.
******************************************************************
…. “swashbuckling Charles Green”….
He was certainly a’ that an’ a puddin supper! However, sadly, the comedy routine down Govan way is at an end. I am of the opinion that what remains of this tragi-comedy is the tragi bit. More tales of fresh investment while the CF revelations pass without comment.
To be honest, if a person of integrity were to emerge at Ibrox as a saviour / steadying infuence / fresh start (delete as appropriate) I, for one, would welcome them. Imagine if you will. Fiscal prudence, honesty, an inclusive perspective, all in the spirit of healthy competition.
Or am I just beginning to sound like a swashbuckling bam?
Lord Wobbly on June 13, 2013 at 1:45 pm
1 0 Rate This
TSFM. Can you do anything about the miniscule letter box slit that is now provided for typing posts? Me no likey.
I should add that I post from my phone only.
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I’m having some gremlins from my phone also. Return and spacebar can freeze my text and I have to hit done and then click back onto the draft to enable the keyboard again. Sometimes when I click on the space to input text the page jumps to the top and I have to scroll all the way down. Me old fingers just ain’t up to it. 🙂
blindsummit63
June 13, 2013 at 1:42 pm
Et All re McMurdo:
Any article I seem to read be it here or elsewhere that involves Rangers and where valid points as clear as the nose on ones face are made you get people like McMurdo who as others have highlighted seem to be on a different plain if not planet. The aggression that is in there is unbelievable and there seems to be this mental blockage that cannot accept facts as they are factually presented. In BRTH style it reminds me of what Hilter said in 1940
“It would be easier for the Devil to go to church and cross himself with holy water than for these people to comprehend the ideas which are accepted facts to us today”
Greenjack if you are reading this I do not see you in the same light I may add. I don’t always agree with you but you are not entirely blind unlike Mr McMurdo
Last Saturday I emailed Regan re Rangers European Licence. I didn’t expect a reply and I never received one. Of course, it was possible that the message went straight to spam. Therefore, this afternoon I emailed again but, this time, with a tracker added.
I sent the email at 2.34 and the email was opened by someone using his email account at 2.40. Interestingly the tracker shows my email was opened with an iphone at or near Tipton and opened again with his email address at 2.54 in Glasgow. Clever stuff technology.
If no reply comes then I know that is a conscious decision and not as a result of the message disappearing into spam.
My email was
“Dear Mr Regan
Five days ago I emailed re Rangers FC’s European licence. I have received no reply and so I try again.
From documents posted on the web – http://www.scribd.com/doc/146504920/Licence-Issues – it is alleged that you sent an email on 7 December 2011, the subject being as shown in the title of my email. The email you are alleged to have sent seems to show your asking for views on a statement to be released. Your alleged email is appended below in blue italics.
Did you send this email? On the date shown? To the participants shown?
The sequence of emails at the above website – http://www.scribd.com/doc/146504920/Licence-Issues – purports to show that, as suggested by Ali Russell, the SFA did not issue the statement. Is it standard SFA practice, before release of an SFA statement, to ask an individual member club for its views on a subject which affects or concerns it?
If it is standard practice can you tell me when this practice was last followed?
I look forward to hearing from you.
Kindest regards
Calum Carr“
—————————-
So the answer to all their travails according to McMurdo is.. Bring back Charles Green, who has been comprehensively vindicated of having any links to that c*** (that’s you by the way) Craig Whyte?
Talk about inviting the fox into the chicken coup.
Interesting that McMurdo’s rant openly admits the worry that there might not be anyone there “to protect” them.
well, apart from pick any from Regan, Ogilvie, Ballantyne, Longmuir or Doncaster, of whom I suspect at least two or three will remain firmly in place to continue the protection.
Protection from what?, I hear you ask. Well, in my view its protection by those in charge for when the establishment club need to fiddle things to gain an advantage or have their misdemeaners overlooked.,Quite what the real pressures have been on these professional chaps is beyond me really.
Sadly, I believe McMurdo and others’ views are more about “protection from whom”, ie their notion of a supposed “cabal” of non rangers men.The implication is of course that its a catholic cabal existing to destroy rangers, as opposed to just non sectarian folk who wont want to continue to support corruption and a fear and favour culture.
How can you debate this with them though?
BTW, great post from Finloch
hmmmm, running out of cash perhaps?
Jim Hannah @RFC_Jim 26m
@RFC_Jim If you put money into the RFFF would you be for giving some of the money for a Fans/Club museum in Copland House Yes or no
the bears on FF are not too happy about this…..maybe they aren’t so dim after all – this IQ thing must be rubbing off on them!
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:16 pm
—
‘…Clever stuff technology…’
—–
Bit too clever for me, I fear. In Tipton in the west midlands, and 15 mins later in Glasgow? Can you explain the technology to a dinosaur ( and the email tracker)?
And well done on your direct approach.
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 3s
Everyone knows David and Paul were involved long before RFC Admin day right. Same guys? http://www.scribd.com/doc/147604924/Duff-Team-Involvement-at-Rangers …
http://www.scotsman.com/news/scottish-news/top-stories/duff-phelps-cleared-of-misconduct-over-rangers-1-2941143 … #COI
Just seen wee Malcolm Murray scuttling around Berkeley Square, Mayfair, a favourite haunt of hedgies and spivs. He was resplendent in his Rangers golf sweater, five stars and all. The best word I could use to describe his appearance is haunted!
http://www.scribd.com/doc/147604924/Duff-Team-Involvement-at-Rangers
another morsel for stewart regan to chew over, regarding the sfa granting the uefa license, whilst the rfc group and club. were trading whilst insolvent ?!
re. the latest CF – irrespective of ‘who was in league with who’, the Grier email certainly seems to have been asking some of the the right questions. I wonder what CW’s responses were?
John Clarke says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:39 pm
Bit too clever for me, I fear. In Tipton in the west midlands, and 15 mins later in Glasgow? Can you explain the technology to a dinosaur ( and the email tracker)?
____________________
Two people, at least, must have access to his email address. I would imagine it’s common in business. Therefore, here I’d expect SR himself, his PA?, secretary?
My ex doesn’t have access to web other than through a library. I can access her email if she needs me to. Trust is all it takes.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:41 pm
—————-
Kind of backs up surrender no Johnston’s assertion that the only time he saw Whyte panic was when it looked like HMRC would appoint their own administrators, thus depriving him of the DnD’s. Fancy that.
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:55 pm
‘Two people, at least, must have access to his email address…’
——
Thanks for that explanation, C.
(Trust is all it takes, indeed.
How nice if we could believe and trust in the integrity of the SFA?)
john clarke says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:39 pm
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:16 pm
—
‘…Clever stuff technology…’
—–
Bit too clever for me, I fear. In Tipton in the west midlands, and 15 mins later in Glasgow? Can you explain the technology to a dinosaur ( and the email tracker)?
And well done on your direct approach.
*************
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:55 pm
Two people, at least, must have access to his email address. I would imagine it’s common in business. Therefore, here I’d expect SR himself, his PA?, secretary?
My ex doesn’t have access to web other than through a library. I can access her email if she needs me to. Trust is all it takes.
+++++++++++
Or…………….maybe Charlotte lives in Tipton. 🙂
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 3s
Everyone knows David and Paul were involved long before RFC Admin day right. Same guys? http://www.scribd.com/doc/147604924/Duff-Team-Involvement-at-Rangers … http://www.scotsman.com/news/scottish-news/top-stories/duff-phelps-cleared-of-misconduct-over-rangers-1-2941143 … #COI
==================================================
Anyone think Lord Hodge would be interested in this wee snippet.
Might help with his ongoing COI investigation.
Naw,I didn’t think so either.
From KDS:
Jim Hannah þ@RFC_Jim 26m
@RFC_Jim If you put money into the RFFF would you be for giving some of the money for a Fans/Club museum in Copland House Yes or no
So, it looks like TRIFC are asking folk who contributed to RFFF if some of that money should be used to fund upgrades at Copeland House. Why do RIFC need access to that money? Is there a financial issue holding up the once heralded improvements to the ticket office, superstore and Copeland House? Why the need for money from RFFF? The share issue indicated that funds raised would go towards this.
As of 12 November 2012 the Fund stands at: £530,663.59, It has not been updated since then according to http://www.rangersfansfightingfund.com/
————————————————–
Has the question of the legal status of the RFFF ever been answered?.
If this is true can they just hand over money raised to a PLC?.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:41 pm
2 0 Rate This
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 3s
Everyone knows David and Paul were involved long before RFC Admin day right. Same guys? http://www.scribd.com/doc/147604924/Duff-Team-Involvement-at-Rangers …
http://www.scotsman.com/news/scottish-news/top-stories/duff-phelps-cleared-of-misconduct-over-rangers-1-2941143 … #COI
***************************************************
No conflict of Interest!? WTF evidence was perused by the IPA that allowed them to reach this conclusion?
Squirrels!!
We all knew that there was prior association and evidence of collusion. But, when primae facie evidence is presented which directly contradicts the nonsense we are asked to take as read, it really gets ma goat!
I know I am assuming the veracity of the CF stuff but the absence of any dissention kinda proves a point.
Rant over.
Finloch says:
June 13, 2013 at 1:16 pm
Braw ! the baddies won,t like to hear that though! which is even “Brawwwer”
Iamacant@1:53
Triumphalism has been their stock in trade since forever.Being the ‘establishment club’ gave them an undeserved cloak of respectability.Now that that cloak has been stripped away,they revert to type.
Good post BRTH, although I was about to congratulate you on managing to compose an article without a tenuous historical link. Then I got to the last five paragraphs! 🙂
From:Jack Irvine
Date: 4 July 2011
To: Ali Russell , C_Whyte
Yes I thought of posing in a bowler hat and a sash. Is that OK?
==================================
From:Jack Irvine
Date: 4 July 2011
To: Craig Whyte
Hello hello da da da da da da.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
It’s great to see that the PR genius is so professional, and not a sectarian bone in his body.
Just jumping in with a post before catching up on this afternoons conversation.
I have been for a long walk and seem to have accumulated the following thoughts in the process. The identity of Charlotte.
newtz has described how an e:mail address could be captured and given CW’s propensity to delay paying bills this is certainly a strong possibility. Much of the stuff we have seen looks as if it has been sourced from CW’s inbox.
The photocopies of CW’s mobile phone screen the other day (mails from Jim Traynor) suggested a much closer link with CW. Who else would have his mobile phone? However, this would be a dead giveaway that CW himself was indeed the source. This in turn would blow his continuing cover. Would CW photocopy his mobile phone for our delectation. Why not just download them onto his computer and release them as an e:mail like the other stuff and maintain the possible myth of an e:mail hack. Someone else mentioned a burgulary at Castle Grant. Might a computer and old mobile phone have been taken. Or…
Data is notoriously difficult to wipe from device memory. It needs either to be done by a professional or a sledgehammer taken viciously to the offending devices. There are a number of ways this information might have been acquired.
Then there was the e:mail from Jim Traynor (Rangers) to Kenny McAlpine (The Sun). CW could have been copied in on this and Charlotte has just removed the header. Why remove the header for this e:mail and not on others. There is no consistency or there is more than one source.
In conclusion, either someone has organised a complex attack or has been buying up stuff from illicit sources. Charlottes profile remains vague for me.
Maybees this dude from AccountingWeb explains the consequence of the effect:-
“I’m no expert but it appears that Craig Whyte’s Liberty Capital by securing the major assets against the shareholding acquired from David Murray’s MIM Ltd for £1, (conditional on him paying off the bank overdraft which he did with Ticketus money!) has now placed these well out of reach of HMRCs Liquidator BDO. At least the liquidators latest press statements confirmed as much. This being so then Ibrox Stadium and Murray Park and the Albion Street car park (?) willl belong to a Rangers newco wherever it ends up playing football. Valued at around £100m Charles Green has a binding contract to pick them up for £5.5m from Duff & Phelps. Nice.
The controversial Craig Whyte has taken the biggest gamble of his venture capitalist career here. Not only did he, it seems, put the main assets beyond the reach of HMRCs liquidators, he has perhaps potentially saved MIM Ltd around £49- £75m in back taxes interest and penalties, as claimed due in the press, for EBT advice given to MIM Ltd the former Rangers owners by Paul Baxendale Walker. Whyte accepted the EBT’s were Rangers’ liability whilst Alistair Johnson of the old Murray Rangers board would not have it.
Craig Whyte and David Murray still have a lot of explaining to do here under caution to HMRCs liquidators.”
john clarke says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:39 pm
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:16 pm
—
‘…Clever stuff technology…’
—–
Bit too clever for me, I fear. In Tipton in the west midlands, and 15 mins later in Glasgow? Can you explain the technology to a dinosaur ( and the email tracker)?
And well done on your direct approach.
*************
Carucal says:
June 13, 2013 at 3:55 pm
Two people, at least, must have access to his email address. I would imagine it’s common in business. Therefore, here I’d expect SR himself, his PA?, secretary?
My ex doesn’t have access to web other than through a library. I can access her email if she needs me to. Trust is all it takes.
+++++++++++
It’s also possible that the user has at first logged in via a mobile device in Tipton, and later logged on to servers in Glasgow to retrieve email that way. There doesn’t need for there to be two people with access to the account for this scenario to occur.
Are they the Govan club invincible, bullet prove, untouchable, above the law of the land, above SFA law (no laughing) and all football fans outside Govan wrong, paranoid and spiteful against one club? I ask this is as number of accusations on certain issues linked to the club formally known as Rangers seem to be either not been proven or proved and not punished or not really investigated properly. There have been some major accusations and issues and below are just some that I can recall.
Even though Rangers admitted that they were guilty of the Wee Tax Case back in 2000 and it was also proven that they tried to hide side letters and the outcome was that they owed HMRC £4.2 Million the SFA in its ultimate wisdom done SFA about it, bearing in mind SPL started in 1998. ( recent SPL investigation concerning dual contracts etc…only went back to 2000) Why.
John Clarke commented on the farce of the FTTT result which makes you think only in Scotland. The RTC in one of his early blogs stated that if Rangers were successful in their appeal that HMRC would appeal and appeal the verdict as the evidence was overwhelming. Again I wonder what the outcome will be of the UTT in July as the institution and its powerful influence in this country seems to somehow prevail against the odds to defend this one team.
The illegal registration fiasco was wholly dependant on one man Sandy Bryson’s evidence and this was took on board with no questions asked. Only in Scotland.
The five way agreement seems to be such a blatant aid to help Rangers (until we are told different or shown the details of the agreement) we cannot help but think SFA again aiding one club. The statement no financial advantage is absolutely shocking.
A conditional licence under what conditions? Have these conditions been adhered to? We will never know unless maybe CF will shed some light on it. Where the Govan team properly registered as players before the Brechin game? And who were the registered to? Maybe ask Sandy Bryson that question be as well asking Sandie Shaw.
A 12 month transfer embargo, which was made up (which Sevco still complain about) when the alternative option was to kick them out the league. Saved again
Credit to Auldheid not letting go of the licence issue but again will there be a positive and honest ending or again nothing to see here move on. Who will EUFA listen to? Will any club chairmen raise this issue with EUFA?
Not to forget the INTERNAL investigation at Govan concerning links between , Charlie and Sevco. SFA have received the investigation results…. wait for it …………I cannot see any action taking and the decision from Govan will be accepted (please prove me wrong).
CF has been a breath of fresh air as there is no way in our wee country would ANY of this recent information have seen the light of day say 10/20 years ago ( thanks to MSM and their loyalty to one club). So as far as I am concerned long may it continue. CF also offered the MSM the gig concerning authenticity of certain documents (no takers yet as far as I know).
From BRTH earlier today that during SFA AGM the other day the definition of a club had been amended. “Club means a football club playing Associated Football in accordance with the provisions set out in Article 6 and, except where the context otherwise requires, includes the owner and operator of such club”.
So as a result of the above statement are we to assume and accept that the club that is been liquidated are still the same club? And we will change rules (again) in the future.
They are not the same team, we as fans all know this, they (SFA and MSM will never say or print this at this time) Social Unrest was a term used by Regan in past, feeble excuse. Stick by the rules or go and maybe just maybe we will get men in (outside the tentacles of the old regime) who will carry out their job properly.
We can never give up and people like CF are a welcome participant and maybe in the future the clubs that we support may have enough legal evidence to put this team to its final resting place.
The final two words in my fear of justice ever prevailing.
Campbell Ogilvie.
I am struck whilst lurking on CQN, kerrydale street et al just how tortured illogical and just plain stupid many of the responses to the unanimous support for CO’ s continued tenure. There are definite signs that denial is nit cinfibed to Sevconians.
Either Celtix did not actually support CO as no vote was taken – clearky nonsense as to fail to oppose is de facto support. Or the Celtic board are conpiling a huge dossier to take to UEFA when the time is right or they are going to use the evidence available to control the SFA Ibrox cabal or they are positioning themselves to leave and will use such info to ensure no ipposition to their planned removal to sine foreign parts or it is part of some PL masterplan or long game.
All nonsense of which Sevconian defenders would be proud.
Only one interpretation of Celtic’s actions or more accurately inactions can be sustained by the evidence available.
The Celtic board wish for a swift return of Rangers and the Old Firm paradigm – the death of Rangers clearly notwithstanding.
All of the unsubstantiated nods winks and hints of long games and masterplans are pure Timbeamery. They have clearly learned well how to keep a gullible and overly attached support base onside even in the face of acting directly contrary to their wishes and beliefs.
Danish Pastry says:
June 13, 2013 at 12:08 pm
“If you are interested in writing for our Scottish Football magazine then email editor@scotzine.com“.
—————-
newtz, I hope you don’t mind, I’ve mailed the latest of your maps I have to Scotszine :
http://flic.kr/p/er6Gtu
I did credit you with its composition.
It may give them a bit of grisle to chew on. Perhaps they may come looking for other stuff like Auldheid’s accounts or the various rule and ruling intepretations/misinterpretations. I wouldn’t want to perpetrate a copyright infringement but this may be a usefule corporeal vehicle to uplift our/your work.
Tommy says:
June 13, 2013 at 4:54 pm
It’s also possible that the user has at first logged in via a mobile device in Tipton, and later logged on to servers in Glasgow to retrieve email that way. There doesn’t need for there to be two people with access to the account for this scenario to occur.
___________________
Possibly/probably. I’m no technowhizz – if there is such a word. I’m easy whatever has happened. My email to Regan has been opened. That was the purpose of the tracker. The details are irrelevant.
Do I receive a reply? Almost certainly not but, then, I’ll just go back to him again ….. and again.
I’ll give him a few days, get back to him and report here.
Wendi Deng Fakeovers……..mmmmmmmmmmmmmm sounds nice …
I see that 785,740 RIFC bought at 50p each, Has Kieran bought in?
Who cashed out?
Apologies in advance, but I’ll be messing around with the social login for the next half hour to try to make it a bit better.
Correction Taxman Cometh:
785,740 RIFC Sold not bought
http://www.lse.co.uk/ShareTrades.asp?shareprice=RFC&share=rangers_int