The “Lawwell Letter” is trending everywhere this week. To elucidate, it is email sent to (among others) Peter Lawwell and Eric Riley of Celtic on 26 July 2012 by SPL CEO Neil Doncaster.
The email came with an attached copy of the Five Way Agreement (hereafter “5WA”, the deal between Sevco, Rangers, the SFA, the SPL and the SFL). Now that it has been made public, it seems safe to speak openly about what it all means for us as folk who believe in sporting integrity.
I would preface my comments with a caveat though. On the face of it, the Celtic Chief Executive appears to have misled the gathering at the recent Celtic AGM. He was asked by a shareholder if Celtic were involved in the Five Way Agreement. Lawwell replied, “No”, and gave same “No” response to the follow up question, “have you seen it?”
Given that a copy of that email was in the possession of a few folk before that AGM, I have to admit to being surprised by that answer – although even more surprised at the apparent lack of due diligence implied by the lack of knowledge of its content.
We have attempted to contact Mr Lawwell to ask him if he would like to comment on the apparent discrepancy between the evidence and his answer (and I am sure we are not the only ones to have done so). To date, we have received no response. Given the complete lack of acknowledgement of the existence of this anomaly in the MSM, we should perhaps assume that none will be forthcoming.
Perhaps there is an explanation (yes I know), but Celtic should know, like Rangers old and new have come to realise, that silence on these matters breeds deep suspicion and distrust.
Assuming for the minute that Occam’s Razor applies here, there may be an uncomfortable truth emerging for Celtic fans – that Rangers (old and new) do not have a monopoly on dishonesty. There is also an uncomfortable truth that should emerge for Rangers fans too – that as we have said all along, this has never been about just Rangers, but about the governance of the game.
If the Celtic CEO did lie to the AGM a few weeks ago what are the consequences? He broke no laws as far as I can see. One insider I spoke to said simply this,
“So he lied. So what? What happens now? It’s irrelevant”
That is of course absolutely true. As long as controlling shareholders are happy that Resolution 12 is buried, and that no deep inquiry into governance is held into the workings of the game in Scotland, the lie is nonpunishable, though it would be a mistake to believe that accountability is confined only to the corporate rules governing Boards and shareholders; the corporate veil of “I was only following company policy” can be readily challenged in the court of public opinion, which has no statute of limitations.
What all this demonstrates of course is that Celtic have been saying one thing to their fans and shareholders, nodding agreement in private meetings about how appalling Rangers behaviour was, tut-tutting over how amateurish the authorities were, and wringing their hands in frustration at what a sham the LNS inquiry turned out to be.
At the same time, they have done nothing, allowed small shareholders to spend not inconsiderable suns progressing the matter, and quietly hoped that the “appetite” for justice would diminish so they could get back to whatever it is they and the rest do when subject to little or no scrutiny.
Whilst ten in a row is on the table of course, they can get away with it. To Celtic fans right now, understandably, nothing else matters. But what if TIAR is derailed? Not a stretch to imagine that the Parkhead kitchen could get uncontrollably hot in that circumstance. And when the TIAR squirrel finally ends its scurry, in either success or failure, where will the fans attention be diverted?
Perhaps the arrogance that permits making (allegedly) false statements to a general meeting, and (allegedly) misleading shareholders over Res 12 is borne of the knowledge that the parachutes are ready to be deployed when either of the above scenarios come to pass? If TIAR is achieved or goes south, are they already prepared for an emergency exit?
Celtic have two major shareholders whose combined holding is over 50% of the club’s shares. Dermot Desmond and Nick Train. Desmond is now in his eighth decade and Train is reportedly having some business difficulties. Both may well be moved to get out anyway, but fan unrest would make their decision a whole lot easier.
And Lawwell himself is – if you believe the MSM – on the wanted list of nearly as many top clubs as Alfredo Morelos.
The foregoing of course is extremely “Old Firm” centric, and as the two biggest clubs in the country they certainly have the biggest impact on the game, culturally, socially and financially. However there is no get-out clause here for others.
We KNOW there is evidence of fraud surrounding the licencing issue in 2012. We KNOW there is evidence of a cover up over that, and the EBT-related registration issues for Old Rangers. We KNOW that the Five Way Agreement was signed by football authorities in the knowledge that it would rob their own rules of judicial authority with regard to compliance by RFC prior to 2012.
We also know that NOT ONE club has taken a meaningful stand against any of it.
Clubs are saying one thing to supporters and doing their best to derail those supporters’ efforts on the other. We can also infer (not unreasonably) that the folk who run the clubs think that we as fans have no right to interfere in how they run their operations.
As I said earlier, Celtic can do what they like whilst TIAR is live, but afterwards, however it ends, the fans and shareholders involved in Res 12 will still be asking questions. Celtic in particular know how fatal it can be to alienate their own fan base – a fan base that has flexed its muscles with devastating effect for the boardroom in the past. And it is the wrath of the fans of all clubs that will eventually see the charlatans get their just desserts.
Our job as fans is to continue to hold those who care little for the honour and beauty of football to account, to continue to press them on their refusal to deal with arguably the biggest sporting scandal in Scottish history.
The bottom line (which is of course what the folk in boardrooms care about) is this. They need us far more than we need them. As fans of different clubs, the sensibility of those of us at SFM recognises that the real battle, the real war, is not between rival fans or rival clubs, but between the arrogant, self-entitled clique who run our game; who lie for fun, who cheat and belittle the sport; and the good folk who make it possible for the game to prosper.
Resolution 12 is not just about Rangers – nor is it just about Celtic. It deserves to be embraced by every true football fan in the country. The Res 12 franchise needs to widened
Sooner or later the fans will demonstrate their unhappiness with the money men. They did it in 2012, and they will inevitably do so again.
redlichtie 4th March 2020 at 22:10
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Not sucking on the scuderia intake valve in the way the duopoly in scottish football are perceived to have nourished a cabal of flatulent cowards.More money involved? Undoubtedly, but it is all comparative. I wonder who the Monsieur/Señor/Herr Turnbull equivalent is in Formula one.Not directly football related but if no one objects then please keep us updated Red.
Formula One Racing needs a strong Sauber
Where now for the Gerrard Roadshow ? What do the board do ? The fans have had enough , tonight may have been the end for them going by the reaction on the forums. Of course it's always best to judge the mood after a 24 hr cooling off period . Will Bayer Leverkusen be the last straw for grasping ? I cannot see them progressing in Europe any further , even an on form team would struggle against the Bundesliga outfit . This lot must be terrified at what awaits them . Will be interesting to see if the media turn on Gerrard in the hope that he walks , but with a long contract I expect he will dig his heels in and seek a pay off. That's where the problems start……… time to get the popcorn in methinks.
Does anybody know what the usual timetable is for UEFA Disciplinary Proceedings?
As things stand Bayer Leverkusen are playing the Sporting Wing of T'Rangers Pan-Global Everyone Anyone Tabernacle Choir in Govan a week tonight. Given the Choir's repertoire in Portugal (no "alleged"-I heard it) if UEFA are in any way serious about racism, sectarianism, offensive behaviour etc. shouldn't we have heard by now what the consequences of that repertoire are? UEFA have been aware of the problem from the start of the campaign and I fail to see how an earlier partial closure sanction for precisely the same behaviour can be followed by a Three Wise Monkeys stance. You either have Rules or you don't. Unless you've got a mate named Bryson.
In better news with a view to dealing with the coronavirus threat NHS Scotland are to be commended for their advice that contamination risk will be restricted by only allowing National Football Trophies to be handled by Scott Brown. NHS Scotland have thanked T'Rangers for their self-imposed eight year isolation period from handling these Trophies.
Timtim 4th March 2020 at 23:56
Where now for the Gerrard Roadshow ? What do the board do ? The fans have had enough , tonight may have been the end for them going by the reaction on the forums…
============================
Prior to the Accies game, it looked like both sides were establishing their positions via the SMSM;
Gerrard was not for walking away, as he still had lots to do… [i.e. he wasn’t walking away without a payoff]
&
the Blue Room was still backing Gerrard, [i.e. a negotiated payoff was not on the agenda, nor in the bank account.]
An impasse.
…swiftly followed by the feeble, home defeat to Accies.
No bounce back WHATSOEVER from the feeble, Hearts cup exit.
Which just leaves the Leverkusen game.
Makes sense to do what they always do down Govan way: just kick the can down the road?
IF Gerrard – somehow – gets past Leverkusen he’ll probably last to the end of the season, at least, IMO.
Not an ideal situation for Gerrard, the players, the Blue Room or the bears… nobody is happy!
Which is nice.
With the Leverkusen game now looming the word schadenfreude is just so, so appropriate.
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
Flybe going out of business today, sadly with job losses and passengers being stranded, is likely just to be the start of Covid-19 issues. It appears to be evidence that companies not managing to live within their means before the virus appeared will be at greatest risk.
With the news that Germany has an increasing problem with Covid-19, to the extent that an official has described it as a pandemic, there must be a possibility that the Leverkusen game will be disrupted in some way.
adam812 5th March 2020 at 10:43
….
With the news that Germany has an increasing problem with Covid-19, to the extent that an official has described it as a pandemic, there must be a possibility that the Leverkusen game will be disrupted in some way.
====================
Mibbees revert to the old European method of deciding a tie: toss a coin?
And, it would be interesting to be a fly on the wall at Murray Park today…
https://philmacgiollabhain.ie/2020/03/05/when-an-expensive-shambles-is-great-value/
Quite staggering if accurate in more ways than one . Firstly Gerrard commanding a wage of 2.5m in his 1st management job although King was utterly desperate at the time so may well be spot on and secondly the golden handcuffs clause that will cost Gerrard 2.5m if he chooses to resign. His backroom team consist of 8 members so what is the total outlay for team Gerrard ? and do they also have handcuff arrangements? There is absolutely no way Gerrard will saddle himself with a 2.5m debt and if his wages are such what does it take to pay him off, a minimum of 2.5m I would imagine . The mood doesn't seem to have lessened among the fan base , everyone has to be sold for many multiples of their true worth and a new squad of Galacticos assembled for whatever it takes. Meanwhile back in the real World , Dave King is very quiet , no news of the share issue, no news of a new retail deal just new court cases to look forward to.
"The Karma has returned. A 'landslide' victory and a momentous day for Hamilton and the fans. The war is over, the administration men have won"
Timtim 5th March 2020 at 12:04
…
Dave King is very quiet, no news of the share issue, no news of a new retail deal just new court cases to look forward to…
==================
King has indeed been incredibly, and unusually, quiet these last few months.
It seems to be mostly PR p!sh being communicated from Ibrox these days, and mostly via the SMSM.
I just can’t imagine that King has been told to zip it, because of his Cold Shoulder – or that he would even comply if told.
[“The dugs in the street know” that King doesn’t do Compliance. 🙂 ]
So, has King finally given up on RIFC/TRFC – to the point where he could be prepared to take a painful hit to his wallet to exit?
This turmoil developing around Gerrard won’t be helping any sales pitch either…
It looks to me like TRFC were so annoyed
by Hearts knocking them out of the Cup that they decided to get their own back last night by ensuring Hearts went back to the bottom of the league
that must surely be the only explanation for a third defeat this year for the team in second place by the team at the bottom of the league!
I wonder if that's ever happened before, that the club in second place has lost three times (twice in the league) to two different incumbents of the bottom place in the league! It's possibly happened over the full season before, but surely not in the space of just over five weeks!
Timtim 5th March 2020 at 12:04 https://philmacgiollabhain.ie/2020/03/05/when-an-expensive-shambles-is-great-value/ Quite staggering if accurate in more ways than one . Firstly Gerrard commanding a wage of 2.5m in his 1st management job although King was utterly desperate at the time so may well be spot on and secondly the golden handcuffs clause that will cost Gerrard 2.5m if he chooses to resign. His backroom team consist of 8 members so what is the total outlay for team Gerrard ? and do they also have handcuff arrangements? There is absolutely no way Gerrard will saddle himself with a 2.5m debt and if his wages are such what does it take to pay him off, a minimum of 2.5m I would imagine . The mood doesn't seem to have lessened among the fan base , everyone has to be sold for many multiples of their true worth and a new squad of Galacticos assembled for whatever it takes. Meanwhile back in the real World , Dave King is very quiet , no news of the share issue, no news of a new retail deal just new court cases to look forward to. "The Karma has returned. A 'landslide' victory and a momentous day for Hamilton and the fans. The war is over, the administration men have won"
____________________
My understanding of what PMGB wrote is that it's not Gerrard who would have to stump up a year's wage should he walk, but TRFC (if Gerrard walks)!
Now that seems incredible and seriously unlikely, but remember, this is the club that paid SDI/MA a small fortune to end up with a worse contract than the one they were paying to get out of. They do have a history of committing contractual balls-ups whenever they are desperately trying to appease/impress their supporters to hand over their cash! And, unless Gerrard signed on the dotted line without seeking advice from a top lawyer, why on earth would any money grabbing ex-footballer agree to be handcuffed to any club, let alone one with a turnover in managers like the new club has!
I wonder of Super Ally has any gardening tips he could pass on, as that seems to me to be the most likely scenario if an impasse follows, with Super Murty taking over for a few dollars more a week than he's on now.
Allyjambo 14.01
btw, I see McNulty is facing the beaks for his stamp on Clare.
Apologies to Allyjambo but I hope that Ross County win this weekend too especially as this could, fingers crossed, be the last chance to have a victory against any version of Rangers!
With the coronavirus wiping out the handshake will it be assumed decisions will now be made on a nod and a wink.
jimbo 5th March 2020 at 14:22
And so he should. Didn't even try to pretend it was an accident, and he must have known that he'd landed on Clare whether deliberate or not, as there's quite a difference in the feeling of landing on someone's back and landing on the grass. In an accidental 'stamp' it would be an automatic response to apologise, McNulty didn't even look like he cared.
By the look on his face, and with his head in his hands just after it happened, Scott Allan appeared to be in little doubt that a red card was on its way.
And it's another balls up by one of our senior (ha, senior?) referees as Clancy was looking straight at it from, I'd guess, less than 20 yards. Oops, that means McNulty has nothing to fear.
Regarding the effect of the Coronavirus on Scottish Football, as a 'left field' (lighter?) thought, watch out for an orchestrated campaign by the SMSM and (of course) Sevco's Fat Boy Fat for the rest of 2019-20 season to be abandoned (purely on public health grounds you understand) – with the SFA unable to declare a title winner at time of implementation of the decision since no team is far enough ahead.
Timing would be of the essence here.
Only kidding – or am I ?(you decide Dear Reader)
I should admit that I'm a fully paid up member (many years standing!) of the Paradise Paranoia Society – but I might just be right!
‘Allyjambo 5th March 2020 at 14:19
My understanding of what PMGB wrote is that it’s not Gerrard who would have to stump up a year’s wage should he walk, but TRFC (if Gerrard walks)!’
##########################
My understanding of what PMacG has written is slightly different from both Allyjambo’s & Timtim’s.
I think Phil means that there is a £2.5m ‘release clause’ in Gerrard’s contract, similar to Roger’s (rather more costly) one which Leicester City paid when he left CFC. However, these release clauses are only worth anything when the manager is in demand & chooses to leave mid-contract.
I wrote yesterday (before last night’s match) that I thought Gerrard would prefer to be sacked than leave of his own volition. That wasn’t based on any thoughts of ‘release clauses’, but on the premise that Gerrard & his people could better spin a dismissal which, in these circumstances, is other people (the board) blaming you for failure, rather than a resignation, which is an admission of your own failure.
In the latter case, questions would be asked about his abilities/testicular fortitude as a (rookie) manager ‘walking away’ from one of the ten biggest jobs in UK football; hardly a ringing endorsement for anyone considering appointing him to a top-flight job in the future.
bect67 5th March 2020 at 15:29
That might be a good plan for TRFC if only it was just Celtic who might lose out, for it's very likely that shutting down the league would see an end to TRFC's only current income stream, gate money, while the very expensive players they have will all need to be paid.
Wouldn't it be ironic if they pushed for this and, while they only delay Celtic's 10 in a row, they hasten their own demise!
bect67 5th March 2020 at 15:29
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Regarding the effect of the Coronavirus on Scottish Football, as a 'left field' (lighter?) thought, watch out for an orchestrated campaign by the SMSM and (of course) Sevco's Fat Boy Fat for the rest of 2019-20 season to be abandoned (purely on public health grounds you understand) – with the SFA unable to declare a title winner at time of implementation of the decision since no team is far enough ahead.
Timing would be of the essence here.
Only kidding – or am I ?(you decide Dear Reader)
I should admit that I'm a fully paid up member (many years standing!) of the Paradise Paranoia Society – but I might just be right!
———————————————————————-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/51756886
Maybe not paranoid enough????
I proffered a possible solution a few days ago
Cancel the Euros and the CL, EL for next season and complete the domestic competitions in the summer. UEFA, the Media and sponsors would just love that. 
Wonder what Adrian Sprott is doing nowadays….
Scottish Football needs strong diddy teams.
Recession…. Most of us have endured this. You know that feeling when ‘the company’ is struggling and you’re worrying about salaries ‘going in the bank’ on pay day(?) Is it not the case that Gerrard has not lost the dressing room (double negative acknowledged ); but rather ‘the club’ have lost the players? Could it be that the acceleration of discontent amongst the credit card squad is intrinsically linked to the common ‘belief’ that ‘there’s no money left’ (© Liam Byrne)? Or does Gerrard’s ‘under the bus’ style lie with Newton…? ‘..’for every action there’s an equal and opposite reaction’? ©. That’d explain the Euro performances and the ‘let’s get the flock out of here’ mindset.
bect67 5th March 2020 at 15:29
'..watch out for an orchestrated campaign by the SMSM and (of course) Sevco's Fat Boy Fat for the rest of 2019-20 season to be abandoned (purely on public health grounds you understand) – with the SFA unable to declare a title winner at time of implementation of the decision since no team is far enough ahead…'
%%%%%%%%%%
One of the appealing features of the SFM blog is the underlying strain of humour that every now and then bubbles forth, and your post made me smile, in recognition of your recognition that perhaps it might be a wee step too far of 'exaggerated paranoia'. in order to make a point.
Then I remembered that it is undoubtedly true that our Football Governance people were, and continue to be, ready to cheat
The 5-Way Agreement is not a creation of paranoia : it is there, as a matter of fact, signed by the SFA and the SPL/SFL in 2012 and has since then been endorsed by the successors in office of those who signed it ,by their refusal to rescind it and refusal to declare that TRFC is a new club, and not at all 'continuity RFC of 1872'.
What, therefore, might we not expect of them in the cheating line?
Another appealing feature of the blog (to me, at any rate) is that many posts throw up ideas and subject matter that lead me to try to educate myself in areas of life's experience of which I'm ignorant.
Your post ,bect67, led me to try to find out what the national associations did when the Second World War broke out, and how the decision to abandon the season was taken and what the league positions of clubs in the various leagues at the time of abandonment was.
As it happens,
"It was decided that the Football League should begin on 26th August. More than 600,000 people watched these games. On Friday, 1st September, 1939, Adolf Hitler ordered the invasion of Poland. The football that Saturday went ahead as Neville Chamberlain did not declare war on Germany until Sunday, 3rd September. The government immediately imposed a ban on the assembly of crowds and as a result the Football League competition was brought to an end. Blackpool, who had won all three games so far that season, was top of the First Division table at the time."
I have not yet researched whether Blackpool was credited with the First Division league championship for that 1939/40 season!
I got carried away, in fact, in reading the stuff at this link
https://spartacus-educational.com/2WWfootball.htm
Younger readers will appreciate that some of the names mentioned in that piece are of football players/managers who were still in business in football ( e.g Matt Busby) when I was a teenager!
It's a quiet night, so I suggest you might have a read at the link.
@stifflersmom, I have read your post 3 times and am still not sure if I understand it . If you are suggesting that the dip in form has coincided with the reality of their financial predicament hitting home then I think you maybe correct. Those in and around Ibrox must surely have a better feeling of the situation and atmosphere than , well the rest of us really . I can see the board emphasising to Gerrard the financial significance for success this year . The phrase "all in" that he used recently maybe one that he has heard others in the boardroom use on a few recent occasions . These concerns spread from board to management to players and the pressure to win (which is high during normal times) becomes overwhelming . The upcoming games v Leverkusen and Celtic could break them both mentally and financially , the pressure will be intense .
I am still assuming that this season's schedules will be fulfilled. But, in a general sense, how do we think that clubs throughout the world will be affected by the Corona virus going into next season?
The threats of a prolonged closedown and and/or playing games behind closed doors are likely to be very real.
Even if neither actually transpires, I'd imagine season ticket sales are still likely to be hit. If people are concerned about being in crowds, how many will commit to the expense of paying for a seat they think they'd be unlikely to use?
Consequently I think most clubs are likely to want to trim their costs (players) over the coming months.
Transfer fees are likely to be significantly depressed this window. A glut of players looking for clubs and clubs unwilling to sign up to new or extend existing contracts.
Day to day finance for clubs who may be relying on season ticket sales and/or summer transfer fees will be problematic. Those without significant cash reserves could be facing a real challenge.
Unfortunately, I fear even some well run clubs could go to the wall without some radical action.
Am I being unduly pessimistic or could it be even worse?
stifflersmom 5th March 2020 at 23:16
Recession…. Most of us have endured this. You know that feeling when ‘the company’ is struggling and you’re worrying about salaries ‘going in the bank’ on pay day(?) Is it not the case that Gerrard has not lost the dressing room
———————————————————————————
Regarding Sevco's form, I was thinking along similar lines, and looking for a possible explanation as to why the cash hungry footballers are playing poop. For most players, appearance money and win bonuses are King.
It seems reasonable to assume that these "perks", would be relative to the value of the competition entered. As such Euro matches would provide better perks, than domestic fitba', and would also come out of a pool of new income, and not the "already spent", season book kitty.
However it would not explain why a wee trip to Dubai would bring discontent to a head.
I do have a recollection that the Sevvie players had a form of zero contract that did not include holiday pay…..Technically the winter break is a mini close season.
I guess that much like everybody else, if players are told they are on holiday. They will be on holiday, and engage in holiday pursuits.
A couple of training sessions would not be an unreasonable demand from the club, for picking up the tab which sent them, "On holiday", to the same resort as Celtic, albeit on a budget package.
For players cash may be king…….But for Sevco, it's all about the headlines. The Sevvies lurve 'em.
Although coming from a different angle Stifler, I believe the drop-off in form to be cash related. Speculative?… Oui !, but speculation born of known knowns.
I believe the drop-off in form to be
Other teams got wise.
The Herald and Graeme McGarry are having a go at Steven Gerrard today basically stating that he is only keeping his job because of his reputation as a player and comparing his record to that of Liam Brady when he managed Celtic for two seasons. Looks like the operation to move SG out the door has begun in earnest.
JJ has also “unlocked” his latest article which offers some further insights as to why SG is still hanging on.
Ex Ludo 6th March 2020 at 09:09
'…The Herald and Graeme McGarry are having a go at Steven Gerrard today basically stating that he is only keeping his job because of his reputation as a player .'
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I doubt if there was any football manager in Scotland who did not scratch his head in wonderment at the appointment of Gerrard on the very unsound basis that 'he was a superb player ergo he will be a superb manager'
That appointment must be seen as perhaps likely to have the same damaging effect on TRFC that SDM's hubristic 'for every fiver….. we'll spend ten' had on the now defunct Rangers of 1872. It may now kill TRFC as surely as Murray's cheating killed the old Rangers.
And whatever we may think of the importance of Truth to the general run of Scottish football hacks, we can expect that they also were astonished when Gerrard was appointed, but were told to keep comment about the appointment positive rather than negative.
If the 'Herald' is now being negative and expressing what it always thought, then I imagine that they must have been given the nod from Ibrox (in the same way that Pravda used to be authorised by the Kremlin) to re-write history in order to help ease Gerrard out.
I wonder if the SFA has issued an instruction to clubs advising players whilst on the pitch not to spit or blow their noses? If not, why not?
While watching the highlights of TRFC v Hamilton game I started to wonder about the current Morelos goal drought and why it might be happening now. Most of us relate it to the many off-field dramas he seems to be involved in, and I'm sure they don't help, but could it actually be that his previous scoring form/spree was actually an exceptional spell of form rather than a true indication of the player's ability? Could it be that TRFC have missed the boat (if there ever was one) in making a lucrative sale while he was showing form rather than genuine class?
I ask this as I often remember a cricketing quote (I think attributed to the great Richie Benaud) that goes something like: 'form is temporary, class is permanent', which might just be what we are seeing from Morelos. In other words, great players can have dips in form while average players can have a spell of exceptional form. In both cases the 'form' doesn't last and normal service/true ability returns.
I wonder, too, if the scouts and decision makers of the clubs who can spend millions are aware of this and waited to see if his form in the first half of the season was temporary or permanent.
To:
Cc:Complaints Scheme
Fri, 6 Mar at 11:11
Dear Mr
We have received your complaint against the FCA and this will be allocated to an investigator in the Complaints Team in due course.
Recently we have experienced an unexpected increase in the number of complaints reported to us. Unfortunately, this means as a result, our reply to your complaint will take longer than we would normally expect. We are sorry this is the case, but please be assured that we are taking action to resolve the issue as a matter of urgency.
We will aim to update you every four weeks.
In the meantime, if you have any queries please do not hesitate to contact us.
Yours sincerely
FCA Complaints Team
Risk & Compliance Oversight Division
12 Endeavour Square
London
E20 1JN
Tel: +44 (0)20 7066 9870
http://www.fca.org.uk
Complaints Scheme
complaints@fca.org.uk
+44 20 7066 9870 "
____
Well, that's somewhat encouraging!
I hope, of course, that they will agree that I have a point, but even if they do, I doubt if they would ever admit to being in breach of their statutory duty, if they can possibly avoid doing so. And even if they were so to do, I don't see what action they could now take.
But I'd settle for moral victory!
'Allyjambo 6th March 2020 at 11:31
…I ask this as I often remember a cricketing quote (I think attributed to the great Richie Benaud) that goes something like: 'form is temporary, class is permanent'…'
##########################
I'll counter your cricket quote with one from golf, often wrongly attributed to DCK's pal (if he's any left!), Gary Player: 'The harder I practice, the luckier I get.'
https://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/07/14/luck/
BTW, I thought it was Sam Snead or Ben Hogan who said it originally…
Morelos is off the boil. Is it due to head-turning transfer speculation, his personal life, apparent weight gain, cavalier attitude to time-keeping, or have defenders sussed him out a bit? Probably all of the above, to some degree.
My youngest son (who doesn't follow football) will attend his first Scottish football match tomorrow . A flat mate has given him a ticket for the Hearts v Motherwell match in the Gorgie stand . I am slightly concerned that he may enjoy it too much and decide to become a Hearts supporter . As a parent I have only made 2 requests to him , do not vote Conservative and do not support Rangers*. Should I threaten to cut his allowance ? I mean a Jambo in the family …….. Meanwhile Sebata has had a small move up to 216 from 210 which is background noise , the real indicators are the US Treasury yield which are collapsing (indicating panic) and Deutsche bank (down 35% in last 3 weeks) which if it collapses has the ability to take down the whole rigged game . It is no surprise that the FCA have seen a rise in complaints but at least they had the decency to reply to JC's letter.
Jingso.Jimsie 6th March 2020 at 11:45 Morelos is off the boil. Is it due to head-turning transfer speculation, his personal life, apparent weight gain, cavalier attitude to time-keeping, or have defenders sussed him out a bit? Probably all of the above, to some degree.
_____________________
But is 'on the boil' his true ability, or is his current form more indicative of the level of player he truly is?
In seasons past he seemed to get into the right places, but either missed a sitter, sclaffing it wildly, or saw the keeper make a great save etc, then the first half of this season we saw his form result in a barrowload of goals, but now he's back to the Morelos of previous seasons. Looks like he's bound to score, time and time again, only to narrowly miss or see his shot saved, blocked, cleared off the line.
Even now he's not a bad player, whether scoring goals, or not, but to be worth millions, whether 5 or 20, he needs to keep scoring goals, and he needs to score at least one in the games his team are otherwise going to lose/draw; which is not what he is doing. And, of course, Old Old Firm (OOF) strikers, and Not So Old Firm (NSOF) strikers, will always be judged by their record in matches against each other, particularly by potential buyers from down south. I'm not sure, but I don't think his record against Celtic is all that great, and, as I say, that's what he'll mostly be judged on.
Timtim 6th March 2020 at 12:12
The TD is not from me, Timtim, honest, but I can say that my sister's three kids are all Celtic supporters and it doesn't hurt, well not all that much
Like your son, my own son is not in the least interested in the beautiful game, but at least his sympathies are with Hearts…and his taste in music is pretty damn good, too
(gets it from his auld man
).
Mind you, we could both be sickened by five o'clock on Saturday…if it's Motherwell he ends up supporting (that'd be because they've won, not because I've anything against the Well
).
It's all about timing, someone once said…
1) Securing Gerrard was the ideal decision at that time.
A big name to lift the TRFC profile and players, with a potential source of quality/cheap loanees, an immediate sellout of ST's, and a potential boost to sponsorship revenues +
It was a bold and inspired action by King: I'll give him that.
2) Gerrard needs time – and at the right club – to become a successful manager.
It seems like he has a decent backroom team who have performed better than expected in Europe – but worse than expected domestically.
Gerrard led a closeted, comfortable lifestyle as a millionaire footballer with – presumably – a good support network at Anfield.
He played for one UK club – with a final, 18 months stint with LA Galaxy.
He then managed an Under-18 Liverpool side for one season.
He then went straight to Ibrox as the manager.
So, why would he automatically succeed with dealing with a demanding Board, managing squad politics, one to one man management, budget pressures of a club, driving his own transfer preferences, and the 1,001 other things demanded from high profile footy managers?
When Gerrard does leave TRFC he could go to a lower league, English club to learn his trade – like players/managers of old.
Currently, Lampard bucks that thinking at Chelsea [so far anyway] to some extent, after just one season at Derby.
But, IMHO, this reinforces a perception that Lampard has usually come across as a sharp / smart character.
Gerrard could still become a decent manager in his own right, but he needs time to develop the required skills – and perhaps in a less demanding environment?
All tongue in cheek AJ , when he was 5 he said he was going to support Livingston , when I asked why he said "well they need all the help they can get" .
Not a court hearing as such, but an “Unopposed Motion” was granted at the CoS yesterday in the undernoted case.
A51/19 Imran Ahmad v the Chief Constable – BBM Solicitors
Timtim 6th March 2020 at 12:12
'..the FCA have seen a rise in complaints but at least they had the decency to reply to JC's letter.'
%%%%%%%%%%%
It's taken them 8 months just to acknowledge that they have got my stuff! It will be interesting to see how quickly the 'investigator' can get round to 'investigating'. I will not be holding my breath!
HirsutePursuit 6th March 2020 at 01:20
ooooo
It's not only the concern about standing in crowds that might deter people from buying season tickets, but the possibility that matches might be played behind closed doors and they would therefore either lose out financially or have to seek a refund for matches they could not attend.
The same might be said for this season. I see from the link below that the SFA / SPFL are accepting the possibility of matches behind closed doors this season and expressing concern about the loss of revenue from walk up ticket sales. I would have thought those with season tickets would have a case for reimbursement of money spent by them (and the club?) already, and that this might be a greater concern for clubs with large numbers of season ticket holders.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/51756886
macfurgly 6th March 2020 at 13:33
Don't worry, Macfurgly, our football governors will be on top of it and will already have a solution lined up so that no one loses out. Not.
One thing I think they should try doing, and so already be in negotiations with everyone involved, is to arrange live TV/online coverage of all matches (at least in the top two tiers), at a charge to the viewers.
I think most clubs have their own online TV channels, not normally available to view by the UK based public, but it might be possible to provide this in these special circumstances. A charge for each game would obviously be made and giving ST holders free access would go some way to appeasing disgruntled ST holders.
Either that or they could perhaps set up a deal with Premier Sport to cover all matches (obviously at different times and days). Wouldn't be great TV with no atmosphere, but it would be better than supporters missing every game, or the games not being played.
Obviously clubs will still lose lots of money, but it might go some way to appeasing ST holders and give us all a chance to watch our clubs for the rest of the season.
PS I can't see TRFC wanting this as they will still lose money while watching Celtic move to nine in a row, but for everybody else I'd imagine any income, should closed door matches come to pass, will be welcome. It might also keep sponsors onside as they'd be gaining access to the public via TV.
The UK FCO has been incredibly reluctant / slow to advise against travel to certain countries, due to the Coronavirus.
Hence, IMO, I think the UK government would be even more reluctant to negatively impact UK businesses with an outright bans on large gatherings.
And, would [some] footy clubs not have a form of 'Business Continuity' insurance coverage in place?
[…assuming they have kept their premiums up to date…
]
'Allyjambo 6th March 2020 at 12:25
But is 'on the boil' his true ability, or is his current form more indicative of the level of player he truly is?'
######################
That's a very good question.
I suspect he may have reached his apogee in respect to his natural abilities as a footballer, which has carried him this far. (Perhaps that's why there are never any proper offers for him; real, professional coaches & scouts can see this!)
I've no doubt he could improve as a player with the correct coaching & physical training. I do wonder if he would be up for that, though.
Jingso.JimsieJingso.Jimsie 6th March 2020 at 16:14
I think he's almost certainly the type of player who needs the right motivation and, probably, the right coach and atmosphere at whatever club he plays for. Only time will tell if the player of the first half of the season was the real Morelos, or a player just on an exceptional run of form, but things certainly aren't working for him just now and that great form has been sandwiched between pretty mediocre periods for a player rated even at the lowest of the estimates he's had pushed his way. And, of course, we must never forget he is one very dirty wee bar steward, and doesn't look like a player capable of cleaning up his act no matter who is managing or coaching him.
It is 5 years ago today that Mr king walked through the ibrox gates. He has kept the show on the road, but at what cost?
Will we end up with a The, The rangers?
Will we end up with no ibrox club?
Are the ibrox club any better off?
Have they like Morelos hit their peak?
Can the ibrox club survive another manager merrygoround without Mr king’s (Backing)?
The ibrox club/company still never got that NOMAD, will they get a new shirt deal in time for the new season?
Will Mr kings legacy be brushed under the carpet like Mr Murray’s
Will the fans get that statue of Mr king they so wanted?
@Cluster1
They have ran out of cash , they have ran out of real Rangers* men , there is no share issue as it would expose all the skeletons in the closet , there is no retail deal , the debt is piling up , the court cases are mounting , the manager is broken , the team are shell shocked, the fans have had enough and the media are primed to find a scapegoat. Nobody can be sold as the window is shut , the players on long lucrative contracts won't leave for less aka the management team , King can't find a buyer for his shares , the cold shoulder contagion will continue til he does, and if they don't cut their losses substantially a euro licence will not be forthcoming . The board,the manager,the players , the media and even some of their delusional fan base know where this is heading. I know without access to the figures it's mostly speculation but all the circumstantial evidence and the body language are screaming it's game over. The hail Mary is winning the Europa League (or even the SPL) and selling a player or 2 for 15-20m , possible – yes, realistic – no.
Cluster One 6th March 2020 at 19:41
'..Will we end up with……'
%%%%%%%%%
…an independent report on the UEFA licence questions of whether RFC of 1872 lied to the SFA, and whether the SFA knowingly endorsed any lie, and whether,if that had been the case, there will be any criminal prosecutions forthcoming?
.. the rescission of the 5-Way Agreement , the public acknowledgement that TRFC is Not RFC of 1872, and the recognition that TRFC are not entitled to any of the sporting achievements of the defunct Rangers?
… the shaming of those in office who may have been guilty of crime/abuse/misuse of office for sordid reasons?
…the full restoration of truth, honour and integrity in the governance of Scottish Football?
…a decision by the FCA that the IPO Prospectus was deliberately misleading?
Questions, questions, questions-all caused (ultimately) by one cheating s.d's hubris and the unwillingness of football governance to deal with that cheating as it should have been dealt with.
Cluster One 6th March 2020 at 19:41
It is 5 years ago today that Mr king walked through the ibrox gates. He has kept the show on the road, but at what cost?
…………..
Timtim 6th March 2020 at 21:07
John Clark 6th March 2020 at 21:24
……………….
But will there be a statue?
……………;-)
Morelos and TRFC. They seem to be having a very similar season. Both performing out of their skin in the first half, then the off-field shenanigans begin and continue as the form of both nosedive. I wonder; if our speculation holds any vestige of reality, will we see either next season?
Indeed, we could add King of the can kickers to the conundrum, for he, too, had a good time of it (as a demigod with the bears) in the first half of the season and now his own form is so bad he can't even do a runner.
I wonder if the reason that King hasn't left as yet is down to him believing that he had a buyer for his shares lined up at the end of last year. That buyer may have pulled out, having done a bit of due diligence on the viability of the business before signing on the dotted line, then thought "nah, it's not worth it"
easyJambo 6th March 2020 at 22:50
I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't the first time either. Indeed, I'd be surprised if it hasn't happened before, with someone making an offer that then allows them to look under the bonnet.
Cluster One 6th March 2020 at 21:42
‘..But will there be a statue?’
%%%%%%%%%
I rather doubt it, Cluster One.
Rather than having been any kind of saviour of TRFC King became a liability, a busted flush, and something of a millstone round the neck of a struggling club,what with being ‘cold shouldered’ by the world of finance:something that even arch-cheat SDM managed to avoid!
Having said that, King has one saving grace: he acknowledged that Rangers in Liquidation could be resurrected if someone paid all the debts that had caused it to be liquidated; and in that way acknowledged that TRFC is not the Rangers of 1872.
But that saving grace makes his guilt in continuing the pretence that TRFC is ‘Rangers’ all the more iniquitous! He knows the truth, has acknowledged the truth, but continues to act against the truth.
The man has deep, deep problems.
Any statue to him would deserve the fate of the statue to Saddam or Stalin.
John Clark 7th March 2020 at 00:00
Cluster One 6th March 2020 at 21:42
‘..But will there be a statue?’
%%%%%%%%%
I rather doubt it, Cluster One.
=======
Don't speak too soon JC!
"Football is a funny old game", and it wasn't that long ago that there was a life size statue of Michael Jackson outside Craven Cottage…
In the future there could be a King statue on Edmiston Drive, but it's mibbees more likely to have been crowd funded by Internet Bampots – to recognise his achievement of finally killing off any Ibrox club,
…with King's statue standing proudly in front of a mega Aldi / Lidl store.
John James seems to be in a good mood this morning.
I wonder what his PROTECTED: (PASSWORD: GEEZSYERDOSH) magna opera are like if this is the public Uriah Heep version?
John Clark 7th March 2020 at 00:00
Any statue to him would deserve the fate of the statue to Saddam or Stalin.
……………….
That was my way of thinking also, in Nov when he announced he was stepping down the ibrox fan base wanted to build a statue. I had pictures in my head that when the full extent of his clash with Ashley becomes reality of what he left behind for the ibrox fan base hits home.
Lugosi@09.37
I had to look, being the parasite that I am. Oh dear.
LUGOSI 7th March 2020 at 09:37
if this is the public Uriah Heep version?
…………….
Seen Uriah Heep live at the Edinburgh playhouse once. Singer had the crowd eating out of his hand, i enjoyed the guitar playing and the song Return to fantasy.
Ex Ludo 7th March 2020 at 10:17
Lugosi@09.37 I had to look, being the parasite that I am. Oh dear.
=======
Well, only JC gets a name check: pure jealous!
The frustrated chap does have a point though: I wish BP would hurry up and let us out of this "library basement"…
I find the recent comments about JJ very unfair. I always believe in giving
people a fair say. I always believe in honesty.
To criticise someone for asking for money to run and maintain there website
is unkind to say the least. This website has just ran a
“GEEZSYERDOSH” for the past month and rightly so. It costs money to
run a blog.
Watcher@12.15
Over the years on this site I have always noted a healthy degree of scepticism of everything that is written on line a propos *Rangers.
JJ is suggesting that this site accepts everything written by PMGB as gospel. He is one of many voices offering his world view which is tested here and elsewhere.
On a personal I’ve always followed the advice of Abraham Lincoln in that you should not believe everything you read on the Internet.
watcher 7th March 2020 at 12:15
For someone who plagiarises so much material it is a bit rich of him to accuse others of it.
He was caught lifting whole articles from elsewhere and posting them without giving credit for goodness sake.
I have no problem with him asking others for money though. If people want to pay for badly written nonsense it's their own business.
watcher 7th March 2020 at 12:15
6
10
Rate This
I find the recent comments about JJ very unfair.
……………..
By the time you posted 12.15 there were 3 comments on the jj site.
LUGOSI 7th March 2020 at 09:37
I wonder what his PROTECTED: (PASSWORD: GEEZSYERDOSH) magna opera are like if this is the public Uriah Heep version?
……………
Ex Ludo 7th March 2020 at 10:17
I had to look, being the parasite that I am. Oh dear
……
StevieBC 7th March 2020 at 11:34
Well, only JC gets a name check: pure jealous! enlightened
The frustrated chap does have a point though: I wish BP would hurry up and let us out of this “library basement”…
……………
If you believe 3 comments like that are unfair? Hang around you should see the unfair comments the SFA web site gets;-)
@watcher
There is a difference between asking for support and demanding payment then referring to those who don't as parasites . He claimed the unwaged would always have a voice on the "speakeasy" he changes the goalposts constantly .When people want to know how much it costs for a password , they are told to send a donation first . He said peoples details would never be revealed then posted a contributors details when they disagreed . The comments on Sebata holdings were discussed here 24 hrs before he chose to highlight them (time stamped fact) yet we have the audacity to suggest he took them from here . The fact that he highlights it shows he does come here and read the comments. As for his vitriol at P McG just put that down to total jealousy from their difference in earnings. This is someone who claimed they were stealing £1m a year of water from a church a mile away. John James biggest problem is John James
I don't really understand these things as well as others but can I just confirm my understanding. There is no requirement for a PLC to release an interim report if they don't actually trade shares on the stock exchange.
If that is the case whilst it might be worrying for the shareholders that Rangers haven't done so (yet) they would not actually be doing anything wrong.
H you are correct.
But if I was an RIFC shareholder I'd be wondering what's going on: uncertainty and all that.
Don't think King can be @rsed this year. 🙂
StevieBC 7th March 2020 at 16:43
Thanks for that.
Exactly, if I was a shareholder I would be seriously concerned and thinking "how bad can it be".
Especially with the predicted cashflow / turnover issues, however the Europa run may have helped that.
If there was good, or even decent news they would be talking about it.
Not sure when they were all published but past RANGERS INTERNATIONAL FOOTBALL CLUB PLC six monthly UNAUDITED TRADING RESULTS to the dates undernoted were signed off as follows :
31 December 2018 – DCK 25 February 2019
31 December 2017 – DCK 29 March 2018
31 December 2016 – unsigned/undated
31 December 2015 – unsigned/undated
31 December 2014 – Paul Murray, Interim Chairman 30 March 2015
31 December 2013 – David Somers, Chairman 27 March 2014
31 December 2012 – Malcolm Murray, Chairman 4 March 2013
In the main the current situation is not as tardy as we might think but, as has been commented on by Homunculus, if there was good news I’m sure they would be shouting it from the rooftops ASAP.
Scottish Football needs a strong Arbroath.
redlichtie 7th March 2020 at 17:40
Not sure when they were all published but past RANGERS INTERNATIONAL FOOTBALL CLUB PLC six monthly UNAUDITED TRADING RESULTS to the dates undernoted were signed off as follows :
31 December 2016 – unsigned/undated
31 December 2015 – unsigned/undated
==========================
If it helps:
The interim accounts to 31/12/2016 were published on 23/03/2017
The interim accounts to 31/12/2015 were published on 07/03/2016
Hearts is an example a plc where the shares aren't traded on an exchange. They don't publish any interim accounts.
Full disclosure: for a while a few years back I made small monthly subscription payments, (as I still do for SMSM), to that other site.
My logic was: I support citizen journalism and value those who make the effort to call out the corrupt SMSM.
Initially I was happy to contribute… but eventually – and regardless of that other blog's content – when I was being collectively slagged off for being an SFM contributor, it became an easy decision to cancel my monthly payments.
IMHO, it was a very decent blog to start with – and could be again?
I've only just got round to reading today's 'Scotsman'. Andrew Smith's back page piece has the headline "Gerrard:Our players need 'protection' from within ", with a smaller heading " Ibrox boss calls for in-house help after criticism of Tavernier's programme notes"
Smith cites a number of utterances made variously by Kent, Tavernier, coach Michael Beale and Gerrard himself which have caused disquiet within the camp.
Smith writes that "The Ibrox manager believes there is a need for greater filtering of the club's football personnel, in what might be seen as a curious criticism of Rangers' in-house media"
He quotes Gerrard " Sometimes when you say certain things, it's got to be checked before it goes out at certain times… … … The players in that dressing room are at stages of their career where they are all trying to improve and learn and grow and none of them think they are there.So I think at times they are going to get things wrong and make mistakes. At the same time, we are a club where we need protection at times.We need people to look out for us at times and help us."
Communications with the outside world ( via official PR) are pretty dire, and in my opinion have had an entirely negative effect.
For there to be no sensible internal oversight of what appears in the match programme, and no standard briefing given to players who might be interviewed by the Press, seems crassly incompetent.
For the manager himself to draw public attention to such incompetence as an excuse for the incautious expressions of criticism or daft 'explanations' of why things go wrong is in itself proof that TRFC really does need help in the communications field!
What was Gerrard thinking about when speaking to Smith?
John Clark 7th March 2020 at 20:02
Smith writes that “The Ibrox manager believes there is a need for greater filtering of the club’s football personnel, in what might be seen as a curious criticism of Rangers’ in-house media”
…………….
And it has all of a sudden taken SG two years to notice.
Cluster One 7th March 2020 at 21:22
'….taken SG two years to notice.'
%%%%%%%%%%
Doesn't say a lot for his general awareness of how RIFC plc /TRFC is being run as a business or of his role in ensuring that his professionals stick strictly to their profession as footballers, and don't stray into the field of commentators or analysts!
And, really, he himself should button his lip, or stick to the tried and trusted banalities, always finding positives.
(Do you think, if I offered my services to the Ibrox board ,I might be taken on as a consultant? It offends me [as an old and treasured friend used to say in discussions] that any organisation should be so badly managed at every level. I couldn't live with that!)
The old aphorism holds perennially true: a fish rots from the head.
This story from tomorrow's Sunday Post might raise a few eyebrows. Of course such things could never happen in Scotland.
Cluster One.
Uriah Heep?
Thank God. Someone on here as old as me!
HS