A Roman God, a New Year, a Paycheque a Sports Jacket and that thing called football!

Guest Blog by Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan

Good Morning,

Can I start by wishing everyone who reads this blog a happy, peaceful and prosperous 2013.

In a few weeks’ time a couple of working class lads from Walsall and Wolverhampton will receive a reasonably sizeable cheque through the door. The money will be entirely expected and meticulously accounted for. A similar cheque will have arrived last year, and both will expect the process to repeat itself automatically this time next year.

The sum concerned will be sizeable—many thousands of pounds— and does not come from any insurance policy, institutional pension plan or other type of financially regulated investment. Further, in order to receive a similar amount next year, the two men will have to do precisely nothing! The money will simply come automatically!

Magic eh?

Well no—not really.

You see Neville and James ( for that is what they are called ) earned this money many years ago by completing a job of work, and they have been getting paid for the same job year in and year out ever since!

Except that you don’t know them as Nevile and James! No you may know them as Jim Lea ( who? you may say ) and Noddy Holder (aka Neville John Holder MBE ) the co author of that perennial Christmas classic “Merry Christmas Everybody”.

These two clever boys came up with their “pension” song by making a Christmas cracker out of tunes they had written and discarded in the past. Lea’s chords from years before provided the tune for the verses, while an earlier rejected composition of Holder’s became the chorus, and in this way it was the past work of both men that secured their future—even back in 1974!

As the song is played to death on Radio, in clubs, in pubs, in shops, on TV and everywhere else at Christmas, the New Year always brings a cheque of sizeable proportions for Messrs Lea and Holder.

However there were four members of Slade and not two, I hear you say!

Whilst that is correct, not every member of the band shares the royalties for ever more, with only the actual composers receiving the big bucks year on year — unless of course the gang of four agreed otherwise between themselves – as sometimes happens—but often doesn’t — in bands and other artistic collaborations!

And that, dear reader, neatly takes me to the current topic of the day on this here planet!!! The reconstruction, reorganisation and profit sharing in Scottish Fitba!!!

It strikes me that the SFA, SPL and SFL all want to come up with their own version of the pension song or product — Something that will make future performances interesting and lucrative for ever more without anyone having to put in too much effort in future.

Of course it is recognised that the clubs at the top of the financial tree have the greatest influence in composing this song, but there is an insistence, and so a desire, that even the minor band members should get a greater share of the royalties going forward.

All very honourable. All very interesting,— and all completely missing the point in my humble opinion.

Now, there is a clamour from the fans that the proposed structure of 12 – 12—18 is flawed and leads to daft consequences when worked through. We want 14- 14 – 14 say many fans or 16- 14 – 12 or some other composition altogether!!

Oh—and the fans want the chairmen to consult the fans before making a decision on anything, and they want Messrs Regan, Doncaster and Longmuir to stop telling fans that they need to be “educated” about what is best for the game!

All very noble! All very interesting, —and all completely missing the point once again in my humble opinion.

Jock Stein once famously proclaimed that football is nothing without fans— almost everyone knows that. Yet how many actually stop to consider those words and what he meant.

There is nothing without fans!!!!!

How many times have you heard commentators, journalists, ex players and even fans refer to the fans as “the paying customers” ?  This phrase has made its way into common parlance and is rarely- if ever- challenged or qualified.

So I will ask—is that what the football fan is prepared to be called—“The paying customer”?— is that it?

Are you, dear reader, a paying customer?—and nothing more?

Or is a football fan a “member of a club”—a “ supporter of a club” or even “part” of a club?

If you are just a paying customer does that mean that anyone who turns up at a ground and pays over some money on a solitary Saturday afternoon is to be seen in exactly the same way as the guy or gal who has been a season ticket holder for years and years?

Does the person who sits behind their keyboard and blogs and comments for Britain on matters football—but who never goes to a game or who does not spend a penny following or promoting their proclaimed club – have the same strength of voice as that season ticket holder—or even the guy who stumps up the cash to view a game once a year?

Not a chance in my view!!!

Equally though, if you have a Football Club Board who do nothing whatsoever to attract people into the club apart from throw out a team on a Saturday Afternoon with mixed degrees of success – are they worthy of support from the “paying customer” or anyone else for that matter?

In my view the answer is no— a very loud —NO!!!

If we are going to reconstruct Scottish Football then I am sorry you have to start by looking at exactly what it is you are trying to reconstruct—reconstruct being the appropriate and important word.

The job is to reconstruct—and regain— viable and important interest in Scottish Football and the teams—or clubs—who play in Scotland.

League reconstruction is only part of that process, and the redistribution of television money is only part of the league reconstruction part of the process!

The month of January is named after the Roman God Janus—who had two heads— one for looking forward and one for looking back. Janus was the God of transition—The God of change— and it was always clear that you could only have change going forward by casting an eye back to the past—to see what you wanted to keep from that past, to see what you wanted to jettison, and to see what could be learned from past times.

In the past , football crowds were far larger, revenues proportionally bigger and closer together when comparing clubs, and consequently it might be said that the football product was much better on the park—with various teams outwith the two big Glasgow teams—please do remember the Jags come from Glasgow too and that in the past Clyde and Third Lanark were also natives— competing for and winning trophies.

Nowadays, football clubs have lower attendances—unless of course one of the smaller teams ( I refuse to use the derogatory and well hackneyed phrase that is banded about re smaller Scottish Clubs ) gets to a Hampden final when low and behold anything between 20,000 and 30,000 lost football fans appear as if out of nowhere!!

And hey—if you happen to be a fan of the Ibrox Club or the Parkhead club—don’t go getting too comfy in your seat— where the hell were some of you before Seville or Manchester?

The point is that football is like politics — it all means nothing without participation— real participation. That means fans buying into, spending money on and in, and promoting their club at every opportunity. It means the clubs and their boards using every trick in the book to generate income away from the football pitch. A “Club” in law is no more than a collection of people coming together for a common purpose and a football club is perfectly capable of having genuine “club activity” which does not primarily involve football.

Where are the regional and local initiatives to promote the social aspects of football clubs? Do the facilities for women need upgrading to help persuade more mothers and girlfriends to come to the ground whether that be for games or other events or functions?

In a time of never ending football memorabilia, how many people went to their club shop this Christmas and bought merchandise for family and friends – even if the same family and friends support another club? How many people invite visitors or non football supporting friends to a game on a Saturday—even if it is only every now and then?

In short what do you do to support your club—and what can that club do to get more and more people involved in the club itself or its functions? And what functions could that club become involved in using existing facilities and resources?

Is there a kids club? A  weekday crèche? Are there facilities that are not used six days a week which could be used for community groups who have nothing to do with football—or even sport? Should the club hold daft things like race nights, bingo nights— functions that may well attract people who would no more likely  go to a football ground on a Saturday than suddenly develop Noddy Holder style sideburns?

How many people take an old shirt or T shirt or towel bearing the club colours on holiday to give to a waiter or a stranger or someone who has no connection with the club—with a view to creating a fan or someone with a bit of interest who might just one day become a season ticket holder or even an occasional “paying customer” at the door?

Further, are there folk out there who could actually go along and volunteer services for their club for nothing and so save the club from spending hard earned cash out of necessity? Could you be a gateman? Could you perform a task for your club on a voluntary basis?

You may think that a daft or utopian ideology but sports clubs traditionally always had a social purpose as well as a sporting one. Clubs were a focus for a locality, or a workforce, or a congregation or just about any group of people who want to come together for sporting or social purposes. Further those who volunteered their services for the common good often got great local recognition for their dedication and spirit.

Ask any Dons fan about Teddy Scott—who although a paid employee was Aberdeen FC through and through—pay or no pay!

The clamour for change in football should not be blinded by the words of the three official bodies and the more vocal chairmen of the clubs that want to play in the league – or not as the case may be. Change should come from the fans of the game up—but to be honest until the fans—or should I say the mysteriously disappearing armchair fans—actually come out and support their clubs a lot more often, then we are not going to see valuable and worthwhile change no matter what the league set up or composition.

On Saturday, I listened to Off The Ball on Radio Scotland where the contributors waxed lyrical about journalists of yesteryear who made the game and broadcasting interesting. Jimmy Sanderson, Bob Crampsey et al – they all got a mention.

The discussion sparked a memory for me when they came to discuss the legend that is Arthur Montford—famously referred to by Jock Stein as “ The Sportsjacket” with reference to his never ending collection of blazers.

Arthur was a journalist—both print and broadcast— with the BBC and then STV since 1957 in terms of television—and with the Evening Times and other papers in terms of the written press.

A lifelong follower of Morton and a keen Golfer and golf commentator, Arthur has been retired this many a year although he can still be seen walking up and down Byres Road occasionally. At one time he became Chairman of Morton and he used to write in the club programme on a regular basis—possibly still does! He is by all accounts a nice man—a good man— sufficiently good and of sufficient standing to have been elected as the Rector of Glasgow University in 1975—beating George Brown and Janey Buchan ( if you don’t know who they were then look them up! )— in the process.

He was the first sports journalist to hold that post.

In his Rectorial address Arthur went to great lengths to highlight what can be achieved if volunteers— individuals— club members if you like— put their shoulders to the wheel and strive for change, for a common purpose, and for society in general. He stressed that such communal effort brought about change—brought about improvement— brought about advancement in numerous situations. This was only three years after Jimmy Reid had used the same platform to denounce the “Rat Race” declaring “ I am not a rat!”.

For football to change in this country we need action—action by the fans—action by the clubs—action by the journalists and commentators to highlight initiatives and opportunities for our football clubs to play a greater part in our communities— from kids to pensioners, from toddlers to mums and dads, local residents to occasional visitors.

That is the way to make your voice heard and to make that voice count. That is the way to bring about the change that you want for the future.

There were four members of Slade—but only two wrote the words and music to Merry Christmas Everybody and it is they who earned the right to the pension royalties for ever more. The other two bit part players did not!

Janus was meant to oversee transition to the future by casting an eye on the past and learning from what went before—as should we when considering Scottish Football—and in that spirit you will find a link to the whole of Arthur Montford’s address below— there are things worth learning there.

Here’s to the future—-NOW—– its only just begun!



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About Trisidium

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

522 thoughts on “A Roman God, a New Year, a Paycheque a Sports Jacket and that thing called football!

  1. I am very disappointed to see Ryan Fraser head for the far end of the island. Bournemouth are a very small English club, but now bigger than Aberdeen. Very sad times.

    Ryan is a player that people would be willing to pay to see. He is eighteen years of age and at the very start of his footballing career. He has made less than 25 appearances for Aberdeen.

    I can only assume that his wage must have increased significantly. I don’t understand how Bournemouth can pay more and offer the chance of an improved future to him, but they can.

    How this huge imbalance in the financial power has come about I struggle to understand, but until it rebalances, I think Scottish football will be forced to tread water. Maybe it never will, but I think it will. The finances of English and Spanish football don’t make sense to me. Financial doping appears to be accepted as common practice.

    On the upside, the reported £400k that he has added to the Don’s coffers will no doubt help keep the wolf from the door.

    Good luck Ryan, I wish you well.

  2. TSFM says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 18:29
    14 12 Rate This

    We have also explained that people who deliberately and repeatedly flout the policy of the site will have posting privileges removed.

    In today’s circumstances therefore, I infer that either people cannot or will not abide by those very reasonable rules.

    If, after explicit requests, posters decide to disrespect those rules, then I don’t see how they can complain when we take precisely the course of action we said we would.



    So, you are saying that you have clearly stated rules, and are applying them, without fear or favour ? And you expect this to be OK in Scotland ?

    Good grief, what the hell are you thinking ?

  3. Nuclear

    How this huge imbalance in the financial power has come about I struggle to understand, but until it rebalances, I think Scottish football will be forced to tread water. Maybe it never will, but I think it will. The finances of English and Spanish football don’t make sense to me. Financial doping appears to be accepted as common practice.


    Check the penalties being handed out to Spanish (and other) teams on the UEFA site and await the follow through on English ones due shortly. I cannot believe everyone on here has not seen the rush to “Financial fairplay” compiance going on in England.
    Every Spanish team backed by a local government is at risk.

  4. I knew avoidance of the effective remedy of just calling them the old RTC name of “Pretendygers” would lead to tears.Says it all if you use it. Says it all if you dont. Problem solved.

  5. 5starsorbehindbars says:

    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 19:34(Edit)


    So, you are saying that you have clearly stated rules, and are applying them, without fear or favour ? And you expect this to be OK in Scotland ?

    Good grief, what the hell are you thinking ?


  6. Senior says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 10:30

    Senior, I take your point and you are quite right – my apologies.

    Have a good weekend.


    Regarding today’s events, I missed HP’s post, so I can’t add anything to the discussion.

  7. bogsdollox says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 14:37

    The answer is: It doesn’t fit the agenda of many of the Celtic minded posters. It’s a my clubs older than yours mentality and a revelling in the demise of their bitter rivals. Meanwhile Babylon burns.

    As someone who is entirely Clyde minded, it doesn’t suit my view of fair play. The SFA have handled this very badly, to the detriment of our game and the intense frustration and disbelief of many fans.

    I thought HP’s post would have made a good blog statement until things moved on via LNS but also, as I read it, expected it to be deleted. Wish I’d copied it. Can we pm on here?

  8. Missed the HP post. There’s a lot of talk about it, so it must have hit a nerve. That’s the kind of post worth reading. Shame I didn’t get the opportunity, but I can understand that these forums need policing and need to be consistent with policy. That’s the crux of what we’ve been discussing for months – consistent and unbiased application of rules.

    Still, would like to have had a read!

  9. oops looks like it ,sorry for any offence ,none was meant
    thanks for taking up the mantle after RTC left the building ,best of luck for the future

  10. By way of a humour injection, I was going to write something along the lines of: If a poster takes the huff, leaves, deletes his online indentity, then returns under a new alias – can he lay claim to his previous posts, or is he a completely new poster with no previous posting history? But then I thought I’d better not … oops!


  11. Flocculent Apoidea says:

    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 20:06

    As someone else who is entirely Clyde minded, I agree! You find that a lot – if you don’t follow the party line from TRFC, then it’s because you’re a bitter Celtic fan. Apparently a desire to see fair play is not a decent defence, and the idea that anyone could be indifferent to being for or against them is not something that is easily understood.

    BTW You’re not the guy that shouts ‘F*** OFF DUFFY!!!!’ every 5 minutes, are you?

  12. areyouaccusingmeofmendacity says:

    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 21:10(Edit)

    So Hairy Bee is the Bully Wee Fergie?

  13. TSFM says:

    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 21:13

    If he is, he disguises it well, given how articulate he is on here! Although to be fair, having watched us lose to teams who aren’t fit to lace our boots,there are times when the Bully Wee Fergie does manage to encapsulate the feelings of the Clyde support in his own, to-the-point way!

  14. OT Sean Fallon story;

    Sean was sent by Bob Kelly to Falkirk to make an offer for Hughie Maxwell (around 1964).
    The Falkirk board had met just before Sean arrived and decided to accept no less than £7000. Sean arrived and said “I am authorised by Mr Kelly to offer no more than £14000!”

    Agape, the Falkirk chairman manged to stammer, “Oh dear – we will have to consider that. Would you mind waiting whilst we do?”

    Whilst Sean was entertained by someone on the ground staff for an hour, the Falkirk board, unable to believe their good fortune, played a round of Brag before emerging to tell Sean, “Reluctantly we accept your offer!”

    Wasn’t all bad for Sean though. Two years later he came away with Kenny Dalglish’s signature for a tenner 🙂

    Sweet, sweet man he was.

  15. StevieBC says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 20:53
    Thanks for the link. I simply don’t follow McConville’s logic here. I agree that a “guilty” verdict is as inevitable as it can be (but bearing in mind the FTT result, of course!). What I fail to see is how the authorities can allow the results of games where players with dual contracts were fielded, to stand. I thought a 3 point deduction in such circumstances was automatic? Isn’t that how every previous case has been dealt with? And if there is a 3 point deduction for every game where unregistered players took part, then the titles will go automatically as a consequence, they don’t have to be “stripped” by the panel.

    From the authorities’ point of view, that is surely a more straightforward option than trying to collect a fine from a company which didn’t even exist at the time of the offences, and which, as McConville says, simply isn’t going to pay. Whereas the SFA/SPL have the absolute right to deduct points where the rules on player registration are breached. I don’t see how points deductions could be challenged in court, and certainly not by TRFC. Green’s argument that he bought the titles, so they can’t be taken away, is just about the most ridiculous statement that even he has come out with. If I innocently buy a bike, and it turns out to be stolen, the police will take it away from me, no matter how much I paid for it. If Green has been sold stolen goods, his recourse is with the seller, not the authorities.

    McConville also raises the question of international matches featuring wrongly registered RFC players. What I would say to that is that if LNS &co find that RFC players were not properly registered, then it will be for UEFA/FIFA to sort out the consequences. That will be totally out of the hands of the SFA. In fact the SFA will be in the dock for allowing the situation not only to arise, but to go unchallenged for so long. In fact but for the actions of HMRC, there would never have been a challenge.

  16. StevieBC says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 20:53

    I like McConville, he disects the subject matter in great detail and translates the legalese for laymen such as myself. But he offers an opinion (admittedly more informed than myself) and can get it wrong. I hope he has called this one wrong, but he carries a strong case. Personally I can’t see a future for a company with a business plan as devised by Mr Green.

    Whether top flight football is 2,3 or 4 years away I don’t think matters. SPL players on SPL wages, SPL overheads for policing, staff, maintenance etc. At the same time huge reduction in ticket income. It doesnt add up. With no banking credit facility it looks like a deid duck to me.
    Green’s bluster about Barca youngsters, atlantic leagues, the Apple Dome etc is just nonsense like the hover pitch of old. I am friends with a few Rangers fans and they aren’t mugs – they give the heave ho to any bullshitting cold callers. Yet I’m dismayed that when it comes to the club, they seem to accept any auld cowboy that swings along. Murray, Whyte, Blue Knights, Green.. blind faith in anyone who has a sniff. If it was my club I would be seriously concerned at how they expect to break even, at best, in a climate where the high street giants are starting to drop off the scene

  17. Celtic Paranoia (@CelticParanoia) says:

    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 13:55
    As for deflection – it was you who was originally asked to provide examples where Celtic had been favoured in such a way by the SFA but chose to go down the deflection route with a straw man ‘we could never have known how Celtic fans would react to the liquidation’ rubbish. The point is they would – and did – prevent it.
    You’re beng selective here CP – I gave two examples of where I thought Celtic and Rangers were treated more favourably than the rest of Scottish football. You haven’t responded to that. I’ve consistently been critical of the horrendous behaviour that led to Rangers demise and supported both RTC and TSFM efforts seeking fair play in Scottish football. Your ‘straw man’ name calling is, well… just that – maybe better to give it a rest. Just a final thought – Rangers fans seem to be putting their hands in their pockets in exactly the same way as Celtic fans did, and Dundee fans and Hearts fans did. On TSFM maybe we should be asking why we always pay and what return we get.

  18. Neephied.

    ‘I agree that a “guilty” verdict is as inevitable as it can be’
    Once the guilty verdict is handed down there will be no need for a corrupt body to “strip titles”
    I assume that any club that ended up in second place due to cheating, will themselves assume what is rightfully theirs, the Title. I can’t see anyone objecting to this, it would make no sense.
    I see the IOC have stripped the Olympic Bronze medal from one of the cheats – yes the Bronze.

  19. neepheid says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 21:35

    StevieBC says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 20:53

    What I fail to see is how the authorities can allow the results of games where players with dual contracts were fielded, to stand. I thought a 3 point deduction in such circumstances was automatic? Isn’t that how every previous case has been dealt with? …

    Yes, that is my thinking too.

    But where there could be uncertainty is where the authorities simply choose to disregard precedent, and make it up as they go along – as we have seen wrt The Rangers membership ‘transfer’ and being slotted into SFL3.

    A fine would not be commensurate with the level of rule breaking – and it could also harden negative opinions across the rest of Scottish football wrt to trust and the SFA/SPL/TRFC .

  20. I can see it now, the corrupt bodies throwing the rule book at anyone who claims the Title after having been cheated out of it. The bodies are stupid and corrupt but I don’t think they are that stupid – or maybe…………..?
    To stave off the above scenario I think they will have little option but to award to the runners up The Title..

  21. Is winning all that counts? Are you absolutely sure about that?

    Very little has been said about this…..On December 2, Basque athlete Iván Fernández Anaya was competing in a cross-country race in Burlada, Navarre. He was running second, some distance behind race leader Abel Mutai – bronze medalist in the 3,000-meter steeplechase at the London Olympics. As they entered the finishing straight, he saw the Kenyan runner – the certain winner of the race – mistakenly pull up about 10 meters before the finish, thinking he had already crossed the line.

    Fernández Anaya quickly caught up with him, but instead of exploiting Mutai’s mistake to speed past and claim an unlikely victory, he stayed behind and, using gestures, guided the Kenyan to the line and let him cross first.

    Ivan Fernandez Anaya, a Basque runner of 24 years who is considered an athlete with a big future (champion of Spain of 5,000 meters in promise category two years ago) said after the test:
    “But even if they had told me that winning would have earned me a place in the Spanish team for the European championships, I wouldn’t have done it either. I also think that I have earned more of a name having done what I did than if I had won. And that is very important, because today, with the way things are in all circles, in soccer, in society, in politics, where it seems anything goes, a gesture of honesty goes down well.”

    He said at the beginning: unfortunately, very little has been said of the gesture. And it’s a shame. In my opinion, it would be nice to explain to children, so they do not think that sport is only what they see on TV: violent kicks in abundance, posh statements, fingers in the eyes of the enemy .

  22. Why do we not print a statement which reflects the best of the points raised of why The Rangers cannot be Oldco instead of everybody up putting up something everyday.

  23. i posted that last article because, sadly, it is that attitude that is lacking in the game (and amongst supporters) these days

    in sport there are rules and there is the spirit of the game

    seems to me no one (in authority) cares about the game anymore…thats a big loss

  24. Briggs

    You may well have the answer. Park it under known or disputed facts.

  25. Anyone know what agenda is for the Thomson & Daly event, and if it will be available to view afterwards? They have been the big hitters in this story and bring shame upon the feckless hacks who call themselves sports journalists in Scotland

  26. There are it seems to very real doubts about the LNS enquiry’s findings and whether they will ever actually come up with any – at least in the short to medium term. The enquiry may well use the supposed finding of “innocence” by the FTT to wriggle out of making a decision. I suspect an adjournment again until such time as the UTT reports.

    There is, in truth, no link between the two and at the FTT, Rangers admitted that they had failed to place the entire contractual agreement in the hands of the SFA, yet given the past record of all enquiries on this – I expect a subsequent delay upon any pretext – and so it will drag on.

    In truth the facts of the registration fraud were known to all involved by the end of March 2012, and yet ten months later no hearing has as yet been completed.

    A total joke – but further delays are the modus operandi of the authorities – it is in these that they seek to sap the will of those seeking a just and equitable solution and allow time and reality on the ground to dictate events.

  27. Stripping titles isn`t the ultimate punishment

    And even if it was it would soon be forgotten


    The real punishment is falling under the control of Spivs
    Lots and lots of Spivs
    People with no moral compass
    People who lie for a living
    People who love exploiting the Gullible

    That`s the real punishment

    And it was self inflicted

    And won`t stop until another crisis erupts

  28. blu says: Friday, January 18, 2013 at 21:46

    “I gave two examples of where I thought Celtic and Rangers were treated more favourably than the rest of Scottish football.”
    These examples were not of cases where Celtic received favourable treatment from the authorities. As I said to you then, I do not remember that ever happening. The examples you gave were of Celtic and Rangers negotiating the best deal for their two clubs. That’s a different proposition, and one which is under discussion. Is there a club which does not try to get the best deal for its stakeholders?

    It’s not long since this subject was aired before. The last time as I recall, the worst instance that could be found of Celtic getting special treatment was that CFC get the home dressing room when they play at Hampden. I don’t even know if it’s true or not.

    Maybe it’s time for an embargo on this topic.

  29. Briggs
    I didnt mean you park it. I meant WE should archive it in the list or whatever.

  30. goosygoosy says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 22:53

    That`s the real punishment..

    Agreed..the pain for which will be regular & severe and will be endured for many years to come,long after BDO-LNS-UTT-league reconstruction, blue square etc,etc…

  31. I’m not the Clyde Fergie! Anyone who says I am can take their €$¥# and @€##}{*$ stick it up their €¥%^*$#} *%#€$. You may opt not to, however.

    And it’s Woolly Bee, not Hairy Bee.

  32. So I take a few days off reading and come back to a civil war! Is that what eating horse meat in sub zero temps causes?!

    While I don’t really agree to the end of the Newco/Oldco debate, it is something that has been going on for a good 6 months now, and for 5 of those months I haven’t seen anything added to the discussion. Therefore I fully support the decision from TSFM to end that conversation here. For anyone wanting to continue it do so off this blog. I provided a starting place for you right here, along with the ‘missing’ post


    (please – no more on this thread about this…. there is more important things to discuss now…)

    Onto more important matters… I just read a post of football365 warning about complacency against cheating, following the admission from Armstrong.


    What I couldn’t stop thinking however was that cheating on that scale has already harmed football, namely Scottish Football.

    With the LNS inquiry coming up soon, it will be interesting to see how deep the corruption in the game goes. Anything other than a 3-0 defeat for every game involving an ineligible player will lead me to believe that the incompetence displayed during the summer from D&P was done so with the prior knowledge that whatever happened, the law, courts, and dare I say it, government would be there to bail them out.

    Reversal of results has to be the bare minimum. Anything less and I really don’t care what form reconstruction takes in future years, as I will not be spending time supporting a corrupt sport.

  33. stevensanph says:
    Saturday, January 19, 2013 at 07:01
    3 0 Rate This
    So I take a few days off reading and come back to a civil war! Is that what eating horse meat in sub zero temps causes?!

    While I don’t really agree to the end of the Newco/Oldco debate, it is something that has been going on for a good 6 months now, and for 5 of those months I haven’t seen anything added to the discussion. Therefore I fully support the decision from TSFM to end that conversation here. For anyone wanting to continue it do so off this blog. I provided a starting place for you right here, along with the ‘missing’ post


    (please – no more on this thread about this…. there is more important things to discuss now…)


    Cheers Steven, nice to have you back, and with some sensible advice. On the cycling, the only reason they seem not to want to promote those who came 2nd to 4th is that there is the belief that finding a clean rider could prove difficult!

    If the LNS decision goes the way of the original SPL findings I’d like to see the other teams promoted to the honours. But the usual PR machines are gearing up for this next phase via the most tabloid of the phone-ins and newspapers.

    None of them point out though that the honours in question currently belong to the club in liquidation. In reality, I can’t see the big fuss about stripping of titles. Any fan with a sense of fair play would want titles given to the rightful winner. Once the bluster and spin stops I reckon the thoughtful TRFC fans would see that it was fair.

    But it all hangs on the law lords. A strange situation really, when football authorities cannot follow their own rules, and make a decision one way or the other. A lot hangs on this ruling.

  34. 2 Wee points.

    1. Re all the shouting about TRFC joining another league set up. Would this be in Mr Greens best interest as he would receive over £300,000 if this were to happen. Is this maybe clouding his thinking and his judgement?

    2. Reconstruction. Surely if the powers that be have decided that reconstruction is what we require to save our current corrupt and demoralised league set up then the first thing we have to put in place would be the new governing body. A body of properly elected officials. Only then can a process of fully assessing the merits of any reconstruction proposals put before them begin. This way we can ensure that what is best for the game is highest on the agenda and not individual/group/team ulterior motives. Proper consultation with all interested parties should also ensure that the fans have a voice here as we are the ‘glue’ that will hold the whole process and subsequent outcome together.

    Whilst I believe the current set up is in fact riddled with corruption I don’t buy into the ‘demoralised league set up’ At this moment in time I see no immediate requirement to charge headlong into complete restructuring at what would seem to be very short notice with any proposals that have emerged so far lacking proper investigation into, and proposals for, enhancing the grass roots requirements of the game itself.

    I believe that it is the widely held view that todays SPL may not be the best league in the world but it is certainly the best we have had in years with respect to quality of matches being played allied to the fact that most teams are seeing a rise in attendance figures. This to me proves that we still have a product that is very sellable. With proper, honest and transparent governance and a league set up free from corruption I honestly believe the game can and will prosper in Scotland. Reconstruction may be deemed necessary so we should take our time and consider all things relevant and try to predict where the game will need to be in 15 – 20 years’ time and plan accordingly instead of embarking on the tried and tested blinkered, short term, its all about the money type thinking we have embraced in the past. If this all takes 3-5 years to bring to fruition then so be it. The powers that be will be better off spending this time now to ensure we get it right for the sake of future generations of football fans.

  35. I read Paul McConville’s latest post where he forecasts a financial slap on the wrist as the outcome from the LNS meeting a few days time.
    Can we as a community help LNS in his task by providing a list of recent rule breaches and the penalties awarded by the governing bodies.
    I understand (but might be wrong) that it is an SFA enquiry being held by the SPL so that SFA can be the appellate. If that is the case then two obvious ones which should be drawn to his attention are
    1 The age breaches at an Annan youth team
    2 The reversal of a cup result of Spartans versus Culter (I think it was Culter) for a missing something on the second page of a signing form.

    There are more and collectively we can provide LNS with some precedents to help him see how serious our three administration entities (SPL, SFA, SFL) take any non compliance with their rules and statutes.

    When we get our list together we can then send it to those involved and maybe one of the MSM will see it of interest.

    OK maybe not so we’ll simply email it.

  36. TREATED like pariahs and not welcome in their own country. Rangers owe Scottish football nothing.

    So is it any wonder Ibrox chief executive Charles Green is now exploring a way out?

    My old club has become the black sheep of the Scottish game. They’ve been like a child in school, bullied from pillar to post.

    Eventually, that child wants to leave for a different school. Suddenly, it’s not a nice place to be.

    Apart from the clubs and officials in the Third Division, the rest of Scottish football has offered little in the way of support as the club attempts to recover from liquidation.

    For some reason, they are still being treated with hostility from people within the game. So it’s no surprise to me that Green is exploring other avenues in England. He’s entitled to do so.

    Anything the previous regime at Rangers did wrong is in the past – and that’s where it should have been left. The club took whatever punishments came its way – and the staff at Ibrox are still paying for it now.

    For the sake of the game, everyone should have wanted to move forward together. But that seems to be a problem for some. That notion couldn’t be further from their minds.

    Rangers are one of the most powerful clubs in the UK when you consider their fan base alone. That brings wealth to the game.

    But not being asked to sit around the table when the SFA, SPL and SFL met to discuss the reconstruction plans was yet another indication that they’re not wanted in Scotland.

    It was another slap in the face for the club and the supporters. It would appear they aren’t welcome in their own country, which is a sad state of affairs.

    Why should anyone stay somewhere they aren’t welcome?

    It’s time for Rangers to explore different possibilities and, certainly, the Conference in England is one of them. Green is right to consider his options.

    Like any club out there, they must look to better themselves at every opportunity. To become bigger and stronger.

    The only way to do that is to look at how they can improve on a commercial level – and that’s what Green is doing. England looks like the best avenue and it’s attractive to every club outwith that country.

    They have excellent organisation down there and, because of the quality of product, the marketing potential is huge. So Rangers are wise in exploring something new.

    Believe me, the majority of the Conference sides would welcome Rangers with open arms. They only need to look at how they’ve impacted on the Third Division.

    They will know all about the financial rewards Rangers and their supporters could bring to their clubs.

    And the Conference could offer Rangers a pathway to the top flight of English football.

    Green is clearly looking for an exit strategy, a way out of Scottish football, and I think he’s right to do it. He also appears confident that something can be done.

    And it could happen. There are obstacles to be overcome and we know these things don’t happen quickly. But if the Conference clubs are unanimous in wanting Rangers, that would be a start.

    Then you add Green’s will power and desire to make it happen. He’s clearly a man of action and when he wants something, he doesn’t hold back in trying to get it. He’s already proved that.

    It’s definitely a route worth investigating. In fact, it’s something Rangers should have looked at a long time ago.

    They should have been probing all the time but Green is the man yet again who is exploring it with some fervour. He’ll put wheels in motion and make the right calls to the right people.

    I would think the next step would be Green meeting up with Conference representatives and seeing how they feel about it. For the clubs down there, it would increase their revenues and have major spin-offs.

    I’m an Englishman but I’m only interested in the benefits it would bring to Rangers as a club. It would be a huge loss to Scottish football, no one can dispute that.

    I’ve heard people say that if Rangers and Celtic left, it could be the saviour of the Scottish game because the league would become more competitive.

    But when you take two massive, worldwide brands and institutions out of a country, it automatically makes it weaker. That would be the case, even outside of football.

    The Scottish game is famous for the Old Firm derby. That’s it.

    Outside of Scotland, all it is known for is Rangers v Celtic, not Hibs v Hearts or Aberdeen or any other clubs winning a trophy.

    It’s all about the Old Firm up here. And without it, there’s nothing left.


    File this under: a bad point, badly made.

  37. By Mr Hateley of course. Credit where it’s due…or sumfin like that.

  38. While I would never tell any fan to stop supporting your team, I would suggest that if all the LNS enquiry come up with is a wee fine then cancel your sky sports package for good! Anything less than the 3-0 reversal for every game that had illegally registered players plus a punishment to go along with that and that’s what I’ll be doing. At least this way i will still support my team(going to games, t-shirt ect.) but I will still be punishing them in the long run for not standing up and doing the right thing in the first place by denying all Scottish football teams the money honeypot of Sky TV!

  39. Its not the packaging thats the issue ,its when you bite into whats inside the packaging that the bad taste is,get real Hateley.

  40. timabhouy says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 23:14

    Hey h.p can you repost your deleted post on c.q.n ?

    Hey h.p can you repost your deleted post on every billboard in Scotland? Or even just ones round Cathcart/Mount Florida?

    Hateley’s piece! Gave up about a quarter of the way through – it was so deluded. Too easy to take it apart, I won’t bother. Did Jim Traynor write it for him?

    Alright, I’ve skimmed some of the rest of it and this line stands out, “…I’m only interested in the benefits it would bring to Rangers as a club.” Maybe he’s angling for a job at the SFA.

  41. Is Mark Hateley for real? He’d better watch he doesn’t trip over that petted lip 🙂 the DR sales should fall a bit further after that tosh…….. Even Shug Keevins disagreed with him lol

  42. Don’t buy the Record, anyone got a link or can tell me what hateley said?

  43. creepylurker says:

    Posted above courtesy of gazpops

  44. creepylurker

    Arem arem arem sorry no seriously going on about how sevco are being ‘bullied’ by Scottish football 🙂 see gazpops post @ 9:50 🙂

  45. creepylurker says:Don’t buy the Record, anyone got a link or can tell me what hateley said?

    something about being treated like piranhas.

  46. gazpops says:
    Saturday, January 19, 2013 at 09:50

    Hateley: “It would be a huge loss to Scottish football, no one can dispute that.”

    Over here, Mark! I’ll dispute it!

    I have a bottle of champagne that’s been sitting under the kitchen shelf for years. Should your old club go to England, I’ll finally open it.

  47. finloch says:
    Saturday, January 19, 2013 at 09:06

    Great post fin, and timely….we need to refocus.

    Judging by the relentless hysteria coming from Govan over the last 6 months they are all bricking it ahead of LNS! Hateley’s drivel is just the latest. Well….. for any Sevconians looking in…..you’re all too late! Call them what you will (Sevco, Rangers, the Rangers, Rangers international, ra bherrs) the brand is now tainted and synonymous with malpractice, bad practice, financial chicanery, CHEATING, for future generations you are up there somewhere between, Lester Pigott, Lance Armstrong and Milli Vanilli. No amount of official gerrymandering, threats, or defiant displays will change this. The conduct of everyone associated with this club betrays the fact that underneath it all you know fine the rest of us are laughing (those with a sense of perspective at least)…..and there is no going back.

    Here’s a wee ditty to lighten the mood, the lyrics are somehow appropriate……..


  48. Treated like messiahs and accomodated in their own country
    Rangers* owe Scottish football their very existence
    The spoiled brat that became teachers pet are tripping over their bottom lip
    If they want to go then let them amalgamate with Berwick and
    abscond to England ,thats your loophole Charles -go for it

  49. Hateley:

    “as the club attempts to recover from liquidation”

    Explain this one to me Mark, I have all the time in the world..

  50. Gazpops post at 9.50

    “I would think the next step would be Green meeting up with Conference representatives and seeing how they feel about it. For the clubs down there, it would increase their revenues and have major spin-offs.”

    If the “conference representatives” require The Rangers to pay a one off entry fee, put me down for a donation of £50 towards the cause.

    There’s no denying The Rangers currently have a huge support, but for how long? is the question. Based on what we know about the cost of running such a big operation, it’s going to be a long time, (I would estimate at least ten years) before they could even come close to seriously competing with Celtic, (even allowing for honest mistakes!). I would expect the attendances to gradually fall away and they will be lucky to be getting 20,000 gates in a couple of years time. If Charles Green is still at the helm and keeps to his promise to only spend 33% of income on player wages, the numbers could be even lower.

    The other thing I take issue with is the myth that The Rangers and their predecessors RFC bring a lot of money to other clubs. Yes they bring a lot of money into the game, but the vast majority of that money is spent on players wages and the running of Ibrox. While a few thousand away supporters coming to your ground from time to time, or an away cup draw at Ibrox is a welcome bonus to other clubs coffers, (especially smaller clubs), it is wholly wrong to use this an excuse for special treament.

    Judging by the Old Clubs trail of financial destruction over the last 3 decades and what we’ve witnessed from the new club since June, I honestly believe that Scottish Football would be better off without them. This is not from a “Rangers hater”, I have many good friends who have been Rangers supporters for many years. I used to really enjoy the banter and rivalry between the two clubs and looked forward to the regular contests between the two. However having considered all that has gone on behind closed doors, I have no desire to ever see a Rangers team play again.

    I have sympathy for their fans, although they have “had their moments” none of this financial demise can be laid at their feet. I also have sympathy for the man/woman in the street employees of this new club and would strongly suggest the have redundancy insurance in place. Again it’s not their fault.

    Saddest of all, I think there could have been a way out of this mess via one simple word, Truth. Had everyone involved with decisions regarding the New Rangers been honest and followed the rules, there could have been a way forward. Instead we’ve had the opposite and the closest we’ve had to truth has been silence.

    For me the “infection” that was RFC was removed from the Scottish Football body, unfortunately the surgeons performing the operation had their hands infected and forgot to wash them before transplanting the heart of the Old Club to the New Club, leaving the infection to grow within the new entity. So far the surgeons have not been struck off, but there’s always hope!

  51. Hateley is an imbecile. Won the French first division with Monaco and the rest of his honours came with the old Rangers. Quote
    “Outside of Scotland, all it is known for is Rangers v Celtic, not Hibs v Hearts or Aberdeen or any other clubs winning a trophy.

    Aberdeen 1983 ECWC/ European super cup.

    Dundee Utd CHEATED out of the 1984 European cup final

    Dundee Utd 1987 Uefa Cup Final

    Hibs European cups semis 50’s

    Dundee European cup semis 60’s

    Dunfermline Semis of ECWC 60’S

    Any many more clubs with QF stages of the European cup/ECWC/Eufa Cup.

    Get your coat on and jog on back to your own country with Green when( I wish they get in the conference) the time arises.

    You’re not welcome in our fair minded country you Kung Fu Lookalike dumbass

  52. Lost a post there. Apologies if it pops up.
    Has anyone any idea where we are with the appeal against the FTT decision.
    Was leave to appeal given, who hears the appeal, is it heard in open session or behind closed doors, and how long does it normally take for a decision to be reached.

  53. What the FUQ ? – Frequently Unanswered Questions

    During the last 6 months here at The Scottish Football Monitor, we have developed a reputation for asking intelligent questions about those things in Scottish football that just don’t seem to add up. Despite posters on this blog and its predecessor RTC asking these same questions ad infinitum for well over a year now, a good many remain unanswered (or perhaps ignored and unasked) by those with the power to do so and there are now understandable signs of frustration and (dare I say) despondency being exhibited at the lack of response from the football authorities. In truth, there are still a lot of uncertainties and inconsistencies that need to be explored and resolved before any real progress can be made in our quest to improve the beautiful game in this country.

    In any normal society we could rely on the fourth estate to ask these probing questions on our behalf and to not rest until they were answered fully by those responsible (i.e. those whose job it is to respond to such questions). However, as we have observed over the past few years, most Scottish football journalists are either too lazy, too scared or too corrupted by bias or corporate kickbacks to bother with that old ‘seeking the truth and informing the citizens’ malarkey. As a result it has been left to us citizen bloggers to ask the pertinent questions, solicit appropriate answers, posit theories and opinions, cogitate and postulate potential remedies and dissect all official, superficial or accidental utterances from the usual suspects. (Take that Mr Grossman!)

    To be fair to the Scottish hack pack, they have, at least, now conceded that they are “probably best placed for analysis” of the issues, having already accepted that any new stories are most often first broken and broadcast in the blogosphere. Despite this haughty view of their presumed value being out-and out nonsense, at least they are beginning to realise that the fifth estate (that’s you and me by the way) is starting to seriously intrude on their presumed market share of the minds of Scottish football fans. It is also unfortunate that this ‘analysis’ for which they feel they are best placed doesn’t seem to go as far as actually asking difficult questions of anyone of any importance.

    This state of affairs has most likely been going on for a very long time, it’s just that we either didn’t notice it before or we didn’t have the luxury of Google and forums like this which allow us to analyse and verify or disprove the information we were being fed by the mainstream media. In order to counter this new found ‘voice of the people’ the MSM have come up with a number of little ‘tricks’ which help to keep many of us asleep, ‘onside’ and unquestioning of their authority and their honesty.

    One of these tricks is to generate what is called ‘Hyperattention’. To get this hyperattention, the MSM exclusively focuses on a single agreed narrative about an event or an issue which has the effect of marginalising other points of view that are equally valid, if not more so. In the early days of the Rangers saga it was all ‘we’ll lose the Sky contracts’, ‘Scotland needs a strong Rangers’ and ‘there is no vehicle for demotion to the SFL’ despite all these statements being questionable and at least up for debate. It appears that it is narratives, not facts and objective data, that now take center stage in the journalist’s world.

    Another tactic is simply to manufacture fake news with which to spark controversy and deflect from the real issues at hand. A classic example of this was in the autumn of 2011 when Scottish tabloids (one in particular) decided to concentrate on promulgating an irrational fear and hatred directed towards the Celtic manager, Neil Lennon. Whipping up unnecessary and dangerous hysteria while simultaneously deflecting from Rangers financial implosion and imminent demise. For weeks Neil Lennon was all anyone in the street talked about while on RTC posters were discussing Craig Whyte failing to keep up with Rangers’ PAYE and NI obligations.

    The MSM’s modus operandi is aimed at ‘manufacturing consent’ and has to be planned and organised at a strategic level. They are therefore likely to be beyond the ken of the likes of Messrs Traynor, Keevins, Jackson, Leckie et al. However, that doesn’t stop them from playing a significant role in this corporate conspiracy to encourage the incorrigible and dupe the deluded. At their level they simply have to write what they are told (or not write what they are told not to write as the case may be) and, in fairness, some of them are exceptionally good at that.

    One of the most simple strategies to get people to believe what you want them to believe (and which even the most worn out hacks can employ without direction) is a well- known and well-tested mind control technique of repeating the same mantra over and over again until it becomes accepted as truth in the eyes of the trusting public (think Craig Whyte, Armageddon, World Record Attendances and New Company/Old Club). Once these mantras have been firmly fixed in the minds of their intended victim there is little point in spending time and energy trying to persuade them otherwise. As Mark Twain noted “Never argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level then beat you with experience”.

    Journalists and editors who oversee the making of the news play much the same role as screenwriters in the filmmaking process. Their apparent power stems from the fact that the public tends to look at news as being ‘real,’ whereas they know that movies are totally fake. However, ‘news’ about Scottish football in general and The Rangers in particular is the farthest thing from being real.

    While these ‘public perception devices’ are being utilised more and more often these days, It is becoming apparent that some of our citizens are more susceptible to their influence than others. Sites like this one provide a vehicle for those of us who do not accept the ‘pre-approved’ view of events to air our opinions and resolve our concerns. We seek answers not because we have a latent mistrust of the authorities (though that would certainly be understandable given the way they have behaved) but because the alternative is to sanction wanton greed and corruption and to willingly accept lies as fact. For me, that is a path I have no desire to go down.

    In my humble opinion, it is important that we keep asking the awkward questions because we need answers and we need them soon otherwise a large number of intelligent fans could be lost to the game completely, allowing football to become the stronghold of the stupid, the gullible and the wilfully ignorant.

    But then again, I am just a semi-literate bampot, so what the FUQ would I know ?

  54. ianagain says:
    Friday, January 18, 2013 at 23:22

    I understood what you meant.

  55. From now on, as a Celtic fan, I will now be adding all cheated Titles and Cups to our Trophy haul. All Celtic fans should simply do the same. If Sevco can claim 140 years worth of Trophies on a whim, and this is accepted as resonable and fair by the governing bodies and MSM, I am sure they will have no qualms whatsoever with Celtic simply taking the history of Trophies stolen and cheated by RFC over the past decade. No need for discussion, Celtic fans believe they are entitled to these Trophies and if that is good enough for Sevco it is good enough for us.

  56. Posted on Saturday, 19th January 2013 by Joe McHugh
    Conference clubs have no plans to discuss Sevco at their meeting on Monday.
    Charles Green’s presented the idea to his favourite radio presenters, Andy Gray and Richard Keys, who pushed the idea all week despite there being no mechanism for the move to take place.
    Ally McCoist and the usual subjects joined in the ‘debate’ but despite the hype it will be business as usual at Monday’s meeting.
    Dennis Strudwich, chief executive of the Conference said: “The reason that I know that Rangers joining the Conference is not on the agenda on Monday is because I organised the meeting myself.
    “It won’t be discussed. There is no letter from Rangers about this and no club has brought it up so I can guarantee it won’t be on the agenda.
    “The main reason that I want to shoot this down now is because this is a total lack of respect for the Scottish FA and the Scottish Football League to discuss one of their (associate) member clubs like this.
    “For us to even consider this would be extremely disrespectful to them and also to our own football association because we haven’t discussed it with them.
    “Quite simply there is no mechanism for this. Rangers are light years away from joining our league.”
    Any switch of leagues would require the approval of the SFA, FA, UEFA and FIFA. In England and most associations throughout Europe any new club must supply three years of audited accounts before being granted membership, in Scotland that rule does not apply.

  57. Home early from work yesterday and flicking through the dross that is daytime telly, came across an early episode of Bergerac. For younger viewers, this was a detective series set on the island of Jersey. Anyway, among the regular cast was an English character actor called Terence Alexander who played, I believe, Bergerac’s faither-in-law, Charlie Hungerford.
    The part was cast as the ‘panto villain’, working guy made good entrepreneur, ever so slightly dodgy but can’t put your finger on it, rough diamond, nodding acquaintance with the tax man, you know the type. If you can’t recall the guy, Google should help.
    Anyone else reckon that Charlie Hungerford has had a change of surname, moved to the South Side, bought the assets of a defunct fitba team at a knock down price and is now kiddin on that he runs Scottish fitba? Would explain a lot!!

  58. Apologies all…I didn’t mean ‘credit to Hateley’…I just forgot to credit him as the ‘author’ of that dirge.

  59. Does anyone else think that the Ceo of the Conference is correct in saying that the 3 years audited accounts rule does’nt apply in Scotland, I think it does apply, but our SFA chose not to use it in regard to Newco. Maybe the conference CEO was just being a tad sarcastic.

  60. manandboy says:
    Saturday, January 19, 2013 at 16:54
    4 0 Rate This

    With it being quiet an’ all with the footie being on, this is just a little reminder.

    BTW, this is really just for those who follow New Rangers, people like Campbell Ogilvie and Stewart Regan and some guys in the newspaper industry, so if you’re a regular on here, you’ll find this a bit boring, so I would advise that you skip this and jump to the next comment.

    There are just over 7 billion people on the planet.

    About 6,999.950,000 of that total know that RFC is dead.

    The rest, mainly New Rangers supporters, are in a very confused state, mainly about who they are, where they are and where they’re going, and what time it is, stuff like that. And they keep getting their name wrong too. It’s a shame really.

    One more thing. They think that they are right and the other 6,999,950,000 are wrong.

    I hope this helps them get things a little clearer.

    One last time – RFC, all of it, is DEAD.

    To quote ‘gazpops’ – can we also “File this under: a bad point, badly made”

  61. Folks,

    You may notice my moniker has changed from TSFM. A bit pretentious to be the eponymous blogger – and damn confusing sometimes to differentiate between the person and the blog. Truth is when PL started the blog he just copied the MO of the RTC blog. I feel like a bit of a prat when I use it.

    New post (revised version of Auldheid’s original Question of Trust). Please carry on discussion there.

  62. ordinaryfan says:
    Saturday, January 19, 2013 at 14:02

    From now on, as a Celtic fan, I will now be adding all cheated Titles and Cups to our Trophy haul.

    From now on, as an Aberdeen fan, I will now be adding all cheated Titles and Cups to our Trophy haul.

  63. “rangers owe Scottish Football nothing”, according to mr hately. Well has he forgotten about the millions owed by the failed club to their various creditors? (including ambulance services, local authorities, police, HMRC plus other football debts which was supposed to have been paid)
    And how about some apologies that many think they owe ALL of scottish football for the financial doping and the likelihood, although not legally proven yet, but admitted by them at the FTTT, that they failed to properly deal with player registrations for more than a decade?

    Mr Hately, have you forgotten about all this?

    Maybe he thinks the new club have no connections to the old club…., that must be it.

  64. Friday and Saturday just past. Two of the darkest days in the history of RTC and TSFM. Two days that could have been handled so much better. IMO. Continues to be the best Blog available.

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