Good Morning,
A number of years ago I sat and watched while the late David Will, one time chairman of Brechin City, former President of the Scottish Football Association and Vice President of FIFA, peered over the upper rims of his glasses at the assembled board and management of St Johnstone Football Club and proceeded to brand them all as a “shower of thrawn buggers!”.
The reason for the tongue in cheek outburst from Scotland’s highest ranking official from the world of football was the organisation of the centenary dinner celebrating 100 years of the Perth Club— which the club saw fit to hold well outside the centenary year. Will had been invited to speak as a guest at the dinner ( yes Mr Cosgrove I was there ), along with then manager Alex Totten and Craigie Veitch the former sports editor of the Scotsman.
For those who are not familiar with old Scots words, Thrawn can have a couple of meanings which are very similar. If someone is being obstinate, stubborn, uncompromising, perverse or intractable then in auld Scots we say that he or she is being thrawn. Equally, the original meaning has been said to be crooked, twisted, misshapen or deformed. A tree could be thrawn, as could someone’s arm or other part of the body. To be thrawn-leggit was to have a crooked leg.
These meanings then sort of morphed into meanings like difficult or contrary, and so twisted and crooked in that sense, and when David Will called St Johnstone a shower of “thrawn Buggers” he meant that they were being awkward, contrary and perverse in holding a centenary dinner when it wasn’t actually the centenary. He was of course being lighthearted.
That episode came to mind this week when I read the latest statements from Alastair Johnston and Charles Green. Both set out an argument which suits their individual purposes and adopted perspectives, and both perhaps chose to ignore counter argument or salient facts which would obviously derail their logic and train of thought. With the greatest of respect to both men— what a pair of thrawn buggers!!!
In that vein let me recap as to where I think we stand on this September morn in relation to the EBT debate, the question of “Club” and the Independent enquiry into payment outwith contract.
Clearly, all of these issues are closely linked but each stands in its own wee pocket or chapter, and when taken together they serve to make a whole book or paint an overall scene.
The EBT issue has been repeatedly explained on the RTC blog and elsewhere but at the risk of repeating what is already known the fundamentals are as follows:
Employee Benefits Trusts under certain circumstances are or were a perfectly legal business and accounting tool.
However, in order for the trusts to provide substantial tax advantages, any reward, remuneration or compensation they provide to a beneficiary must not form part of their contract of employment or work package. If this rule is not strictly adhered to, then tax is payable on the sums “given” to the employee, with the employer being liable for tax and national insurance contributions of any employee.
It is alleged by HMRC, that a number of persons who were at one time employed by Rangers PLC have received benefits by way of a specific EBT. Further, the benefits which these employees received were clearly related to their contracts of employment and so these payments are liable to tax, together with interest for late payment and penalties for non-declaration and so on.
This is denied by Rangers PLC and by Murray International Holdings, and MIH have instigated and conducted an appeal against the HMRC view, with that appeal being determined by an independent tax tribunal (The FTT). The basis of their argument appears to be that the benefits received by the beneficiaries were nothing to do with MIH or Rangers and that these payments were purely discretionary and at the instance of the trustees of the trusts concerned– none of whom have any connection with Rangers PLC or MIH. Therefore– there is no tax payable.
Against this there seems to be a plethora of evidence which contradicts this stance including a number of side letters or second contracts which show that any payments to these EBT’s were indeed contractual and part of an overall contract of employment “package”– and if that is deemed to be the case then tax, interest and penalties are indeed, and always were, due.
These contracts or side letters then seem to fly in the face of the documentation lodged with the SPL and later the SFA, as both bodies require sight of all contractual documentation relating to players remuneration and their terms and conditions of employment. Contracts have to be in standard form and lodged with the appropriate bodies to ensure that the player is in fact properly registered to play for the team.
Further, the rules of football prohibit any player being paid by a third party, and so payments made to a player by someone other than his employer is a breach of that rule.
It is this issue that the Nimmo Smith Tribunal is to investigate and rule upon.
For their part, Rangers PLC appear to argue that the existence of EBT’s were always declared in the notes of their accounts, and so the footballing authorities should have known that they were in use at the club. More recently, Alastair Johnston has stated that the club did receive a request for clarification from the SFA in 2011 to which the Rangers PLC board responded disclosing documents ( although he does not specify what documents ) over and above the normal documentation sent re player contracts. Johnston has gone on to state that there was no response or follow up whatsoever from the SFA, and the appropriate UEFA licence simply arrived in the post without further ado. He concludes that as a result of the documentation sent, the SFA must have known at that time that the EBT payments were being used for “player compensation” purposes.
Now, AJ argues that if any misdemeanour or breach of rules has occurred it does not merit the much discussed and publicised “stripping of titles” and that any failure on the part of the Rangers PLC board amounts to no more than an oversight or an administrative error which does not justify the ultimate penalty.
Let’s just pause there and remember who and what AJ actually is in life. Alastair Johnston holds the posts of vice-chairman and member of the board of directors of International Management Group, the leading international sports and entertainment group. Now everyone knows that IMG was formed by Mark McCormack and represents sports stars as their agent. However what is less well known is that the majority of IMG’s work comes from broadcasting – not necessarily mainstream broadcasting – but the broadcasting of certain events to mobile phones and so on and in this context the company works with the likes of Vodafone and other major service providers in the sector. Further the company has the rights to market and broadcast the sports activities of a huge number of schools and colleges in the US as well as music channels, entertainment and so on.
I raise this aspect for one very important reason.
That entire industry is based on one thing and one thing only and that is………… a Licensing system. Broadcasters of any sort obtain the rights to broadcast by way of a licence. They licence content, they licence by area and geographical location, they licence for set time periods,they share licences, sell licences, create licences and terminate licences. Without a licence, they can have all the technology in the world, all the necessary content and so on but they are not able to show it, sell it and profit from it. Proper licensing is vital!
Further, they are very precious about licences- and rightly so– because unless they have the licences tightly tied up, others in the same field can attempt to steal their content, their territory and their rights– all of which are valuable assets.
So go back again and look at all AJ’s comments about proper registration of contracts, about proper administration of documents and licence applications for players, UEFA competition and so against the background of him being a grand fromage in a major company whose absolute lifeblood depends upon proper licensing.
Do you remotely believe that the continual and prolonged inability to properly declare all relevent contracts and player documentation to a licensing body ( both SFA and SPL in this instance) can be merely an oversight or an administrative error?
Further, take a look at the accounts for Rangers PLC at least in the year ended 2005, where it is made very clear that the football management side of the business was working extremely closely with the board in all business and contract matters.
The SFA in particular fulfills a licencing function– a function which is so important that without passing the tests laid down, any club of no matter what size simply cannot play or participate in the sole sphere it is designed to participate and play in. There are strict rules about licences, and a duty on the SFA as well as Rangers PLC to make sure that all of the conditions that must be fulfilled in order to gain a licence have in fact been met. It is not a process that should be left to chance or a process that any major organisation would leave to a junior member of staff or without there being a company defined process and procedure to ensure that the applications and compliance issues are properly dealt with.
Further, if you think about how a footballer player signs for a club– the negotiations, the transfer fee, the personal terms, the contracts, the agents commission and so on, you will realise that a player signing and the terms of his contract – or contracts for that matter – cannot simply come about by accident and outwith the boards knowledge or consent.
In short, it is impossible. It is also impossible, in my respectful opinion, to proceed on a decade long process of administrative errors involving the repeated failure to disclose secondary contracts or side letters. As someone once said to me, there comes a point where a continued and continual series of repeated errors or omissions starts to look suspiciously like a plan!
However, if we were to take AJ’s comments at face value, and accept that there were repeated failures on the part of the Rangers Board by accident, then to be honest there would be every right for shareholders and investors to hold the Directors liable for such negligence. Directors regularly and properly insure themselves against such claims– so I wonder if AJ has paid his insurance premiums?
Further, if he as Chairman presided over such mismanagement, then no doubt his time at IMG is limited as I doubt such an organisation could afford to have such a dunderheid permanently ensconced in a senior managerial position.
However, AJ appears to be a positively straightforward chap when compared to Mr Green.
He of course is on record as saying that if the proposed CVA were to be rejected and the club forced into liquidation then the club dies, the history dies, and so on and so forth– but of course that was yesterday or the week before or even the week or months before that. That was the message that Mr Green wanted to convey at that time in the hope that HMRC would buckle down and accept the proposals.
Now, Mr Green seeks to sing a different tune, and recently latched on to Lord Nimmo Smith’s comments about the “club” being a continuing entity and capable of transfer from one owner to the next. He muses that if that is the case then the “club” may well in fact still be a member of the SPL and the SFA as no matter what happened to Rangers PLC, Rangers FC are ” a continuing entity” and therefore should not be forced to apply to rejoin any body which it was always a member of– such as the SPL and the SFA. Of course this then means that all the history and so on remains– despite what he himself said earlier!
Now of course, Charles makes for a good soundbite and is mad keen to ensure that as many Rangers fans as possible take up shares in “the club” when he offers them for sale.
Yet there is the problem,– shares in what are being offered for sale? According to Charles– and following his logic— he can offer as many shares in the Rangers Football Club Ltd for sale as he wants — but that company will not actually be Rangers FC– will it? If Rangers PLC was not actually Rangers FC– then what was it that David Murray was offering for sale all those years ago? Or could it be that Charles has just got it plain wrong?
You see for some reason he did not quote Lord Nimmo Smith in full– especially that part where the learned judge gave a brief description of his interpretation of the law of clubs.
For example Charles chooses not to comment on this sentence from the learned judge:
“This is not to say that a Club has legal personality, separate from and additional to the legal personality of its owner and operator. We are satisfied that it does not, and Mr McKenzie did not seek to argue otherwise. So a Club cannot, lacking legal personality, enter into a contract by itself. But it can be affected by the contractual obligations of its owner and operator.”
Earlier, Nimmo Smith said this:
“While it no doubt depends on individual circumstances what exactly is comprised in the undertaking of any particular Club, it would at the least comprise its name, the contracts with its players, its manager and other staff, and its ground, even though these may change from time to time.”
So let’s pause there.
A club is an undertaking— in other words any type of loose arrangement involving a group of people with a common purpose. If a club is not an incorporated club ( a limited company ) then to be anything other than a loose idea of a few folk getting together for a common purpose such as a holiday or a meal or to read a book or anything else– then of course it should have a formal constitution and a set of rules for its members.
So– where is the constitution for Rangers Football Club? Where are its rules of admission which says who can join? Are there certain rules that preclude you from joining? Is there a set limit on how many members there can be at any one time? Who are the officers of this club?
At the current time, Mr Green seems to be very keen on everything British and everything of a loyal and royal nature. So here is a quote from the pages of the Royal Yachting Association of Great Britain on the legal status of unincorporated clubs and so on.
“Since an unincorporated club has no legal status, it is incapable itself of owning property or being party to a contract. It is therefore standard practice to appoint trustees, who are usually required in the rules to comply with committee instructions, to hold the property (whether freehold land and buildings, yachts or a long leasehold of a reservoir) on behalf of the club members.”
Eh going by that statement – Rangers FC never owned Ibrox or Murray Park– and indeed can never own Ibrox and Murray Park. Someone had to be the trustee.
Further, it can never have been granted a licence to play football— you can’t grant a right to a non legal entity or to a body which has no legal status. You cannot accept a licensing application from a body which has no legal status. You cannot be employed by a body with no legal status.
Rangers FC has no constitution, no legal persona, is not allowed to own property ( heritable, moveable or intellectual), can’t enter into contracts and so on.
In short, Rangers FC is a body with no legal status– it does not exist and has never existed— unless it is to be found within the confines of Rangers PLC which everyone now recognises is in Administration and will soon be liquidated.
Still don’t believe me?
Ok here is a recent release by the Scottish legal commission setting out changes that they want to make to the law so that “clubs” can gain some legal status:
“In Scotland, and indeed throughout the United Kingdom, unincorporated associations are not recognised as entities separate from their members. Consequently, such organisations cannot carry out acts such as entering into contracts, owning property or engaging employees. The lack of legal personality can also give rise to unfortunate, and perhaps unforeseen, repercussions for members. For example, it is possible that, under the current law, a member of an unincorporated association could, by virtue of that membership alone, find himself or herself personally liable in delict to a third party injured at an event organised by the association. Further difficulties relating to this area of the law are set out in our Discussion Paper on Unincorporated Associations (DP 140) which was published at the end of 2008.
Our Report recommends a simple regime, with the minimum of administrative burdens, to ensure that associations and clubs are recognised as legal entities. Separate legal personality will be accorded to associations which satisfy certain conditions. The main conditions are that the association has at least two members; that its objects do not include making a profit for its members; and that it has a constitution containing certain minimum specified provisions. These provisions are: the association’s name; its purpose; membership criteria; the procedure for the election or appointment of those managing it; the powers and duties of its office-bearers; the rules for distributing its assets if it is dissolved; and the procedure for amending its constitution. Many associations will already have constitutions which contain these provisions but, for those which do not, we anticipate that style constitutions will be made available, free of charge, on the websites of organisations such as the Scottish Council for Voluntary Organisations”
Maybe Charles should seek some advice from the Scottish Council on Voluntary organisations? And perhaps he should note that part about not making a profit for members too!
Then again, as Lord Nimmo Smith has said the actual status of a club and who or what a club is depends on individual circumstances. So with regard to Rangers, let’s look at who would know– for example, who did Charles get “Rangers” from? Duff and Phelps of course — so what do they say?
Well they have stuck to their guns because in each and every report that they have issued to the court, the shareholders and the creditors they have included the following definition:
| Rangers / the Company / the Club | The Rangers Football Club Plc (In Administration), Ibrox Stadium, Glasgow, G51 2XD (Company number SC004276); |
Now that doesn’t really help Charles does it.
Ok so, lets ignore Craig Whyte because everyone knows that he was a diddy— let’s go to folk that are far more sensible– how about the Board of Rangers PLC before Craig Whyte– what did they have to say:
Well, here is a statement from May 2011 which seems to set out who and what the then Directors thought amounted to the club– and let’s face it– they should know!
“Further to today’s statement from Wavetower Limited (“the acquirer”), the Independent Board Committee of The Rangers Football Club plc (“the club”), comprising Alastair Johnston, Martin Bain, John Greig, John McClelland and Donald McIntyre, (”IBC”) would like to make the following statement:
“In recent weeks the IBC has been engaged with the acquirer and has secured an enhanced financial commitment from Wavetower for future investment into the club. The decision on the sale and purchase of the majority shareholding in the club firmly and ultimately rests between Murray MHL Limited (“MHL”) and Lloyds Banking Group (“LBG”).
“Although the IBC has no power to block the transaction, following its enquiries, the IBC and Wavetower have differing views on the future revenue generation and cash requirements of the club and the IBC is concerned about a lack of clarity on how future cash requirements would be met, particularly any liability arising from the outstanding HMRC case.
“Wavetower is purchasing MHL’s 85% shareholding in the club for £1 and the club’s indebtedness with LBG is to be assigned to Wavetower. This share transaction would ordinarily trigger a requirement on Wavetower under Rule Nine of The Takeover Code for a mandatory offer to be made to the other shareholders.
“Given this transaction structure and following discussions with the Takeover Panel, the IBC considers there to be no purpose in the acquirer making such an offer to acquire all other shareholdings at effectively nil value per share. Accordingly the IBC has agreed that the offer period for the club will now end.
“In agreeing that no offer should be made to all shareholders the IBC has insisted that the acquirer issues a document to all shareholders setting out the full terms of the transaction, comprehensive details on the acquirer and the sources of its funding and giving firm commitments to agreed future investment in the club.
“The IBC is committed to ensure that the transaction and future investment and funding proposals should be transparent to all the shareholders and supporters of the club”
Ah— that doesn’t really help Charles Green’s current argument either does it?
So here we are, on the cusp of the FTT ruling, with a share offering in the offing, and SPL enquiry scheduled for November and no doubt Mark Daly and the Panorama team beavering away in the background getting ready for another documentary.
The decision of the FTT may reveal yet more of what the bold AJ describes as “Administrative errors” by way of failing to administer EBT’s properly so resulting in a massive tax bill, and the SPL enquiry may reveal further “Administrative errors” in failing to properly record player contracts for a decade, with the result that players were never properly registered in the first place and so were illegal players during championship winning games.
Yet all that is history and in the past.
Today’s Rangers has a new hero, a new commander– even though who he works for is a closely guarded secret and remains a mystery to most of us who may be interested to find out who Charles Green really is and who he represents. He seems to attack certain quarters then retreat, antagonise and appease, and has a habit of constantly contradicting himself when it suits.
In the interim he reminds me of the most famous creation of the American writer Timothy Zahn who brought about a revival in the fortunes of the Star Wars franchise, bringing it widespread attention for the first time in years. He did this by creating a new villain to follow in the footsteps of the administratively challenged and ultimately vanquished Darth Vader.
Zahn describes this new villain’s command style as considerably different from that of Darth Vader and other typical Imperial commanders; instead of punishing failure and dissent, he promotes creativity among his crew and accepts ideas from subordinates. He is a tactical genius who has made extensive study of military intelligence and art, and is willing to retreat instead of making a stand in a losing battle.
His full name and his true origins are only known to a few select individuals of the Empire and the New Republic.
To quote Wikipedia:
“His name is ………… reminiscent of the old Scots word meaning Twisted ot Crooked.
The character’s name is……….. Thrawn.
I suspect that we are about to see some pretty Thrawn statements from a shower of Thrawn buggers as the late David Will would have said!
bogsdollox says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 13:17,
scapaflow14 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 13:21
I was in my local when TFF was organising hold-ups…sorry! collections for “the cause”. Having followed the story closely on RTC I was aware of the entire corrupt,shambolic,shameful background to how “ra peepil” found their team in the grubber, BUT astonished was not the word for what I felt that evening. People were literally tearing money from their pockets to “sponsor” one of “ra peepil” who was going for a “walk” in support of the RFF …for what it’s worth i think Chuckles might make himself a few bob from this one…not enough to save them though, that’ll be up to someone else after he beggars off with the dosh!!!
My feeling is that they will be trying to show how “loyal” they are, and will throw quite a bit of cash at this whilst Chuckles is rubbing his hands together like some cartoon villain…har,har,har!
RFF…not TFF, apologies…………….BUT it IS Friday!!!
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:02
If I follow your post correctly, you are agreeing that Mr Green is full of brown smelly stuff and is wifully misleading the Ibrox faithfull.
A belated welcome to the forces of light is in order!
Excellent post from Humble Pieat 1:45 a.m.The genuine frustration felt by all of us is encapsulated in that one piece.Oh that we could create a Scottish football media on the basis of performance,with specific marks for objectivity and reference to sources.
Which Scottish football writers would gain entry? Starter for ten.
scapaflow14 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:07
Yes and No he is delivering sound bites and rhetoric that he knows the majority of fans want to hear. Unfortunately it can be a double edged sword. He now is forced to play to the hard line gallery, and that is where his original strategy may go belly up.
rantinrobin says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:15
All of them, I’m afraid. As much as I despise the Traynors of this world, the only way that I can be sure that the Thomson’s and the Daly’s will be able to publish what they want, is to ensure that the Traynor’s can publish what they want.
The final responsiblity lies with all of us, to apply a bit of critical thinking to what we read and hear, and to call the nonsense for what it is.
I have mentioned the need for reflection from “ra peepil” on both this blog and previously on RTC,…so please disregard my post about the possible success of a share issue organised by Chuckles.
I was forgetting that the collection for the RFF was also on a Friday evening and drunken bears were throwing fivers and tenners about…I don’t think the pub realised enough for a single £500 share and what with all the institutions desperate to sponsor this share issue (tee hee) it seems more likely that “ra peepil” will revert to type and look to their latest saviour to bail them out……………..much like they did the last time they were asked to dig deep.
Apologies again…must learn to engage brain before posting.
Sometimes even bears in the woods can smell what they just did!
bogsdollox says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 13:17
As I keep saying until someone starts asking the awkward questions then there are going to be people out there with blue tinted spectacles willing to part with their cash.
Many on here and RTC before (including myself) predicted that T’Rangers would suffer a significant drop in crowds if in Div 3. However hats off to the fans who have provided that to be incorrect. Even at lower prices the turnout has to be applauded.
That being said these people may now be asked to part with at least £500 a pop and but there is no obvious plan on where that money is going.
When Fergus McCann worked his magic at Celtic it was clear that the ground needed improving and that there was a potential to gain extra income by an increase in the number of season ticket holder. In other words even though they might not see any return in terms of cash the fans knew where their money was going to be used and what the bigger picture was.
Previously there were clearly enough bears who saw that cash given to SDM cash was going up against a wall.
Mr Charles is cleverly trying to project an image of a brave new world where all the top companies in the world are interested in a current Scottish Div 3 who have no access to European football for at least another three years. I have no doubt people can see the potential in Rangers but to be frank even at full potential both they and Celtic are bit players in terms of attracting the big money companies and investors because of the league they play in week to week.
Lets say 30k that have bought season tickets are willing to get on board for £500. Thats a cool £15m and not to be sniffed at.
If you live within your means then that is going to help get you through this season and with and the next without any major problems. Assuming you don’t have any hidden liabiliites!!
However if that money gets spent on pay offs and building hotels, cancer centres and the like, it will not be going on the park and will certainly not be generating any immediate income.
If people don’t take up at the above rate then you are looking at £10m or £5m etc.
That then makes it harder to get outside investment as people will be saying that if the fans aren’t buying into the plan then ‘why should we?’. In other words these outsiders will be asking what are we getting out of any deal and is our money just going to be pee’d against the wall. If it doesn’t look attractive they won’t sign up and even if they do it won’t be for much and in a manner that suits them e.g Sports Direct.
In these economic times I do believe that there are many opportunities for the rich to get even richer.
The question for T’Rangers fans is – Is the Club in the position where it is truly ‘rich’ and can benefirt from its position or has the balance tipped and they are now no different from the run of the mill clubs and businesses just trying to make ends meet?
If the latter, then how many times will those running the club return to well in attempt to repeat former glories?
wottpi says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 12:14
“Is there a need from somewhere to ensure they do get listed on an approprate exchange?”
___________________________________________________________________________
The AIM for instance? Ha ha, walk into my parlour said the spider to the fly!
We’ll short this sucker till it’s worth fractions of a penny, cos it’s only going in one direction..
Scapa ,I still have faith that the the establishment will move this story on in a way which exposes fraudulent and corrupt activity unsurpassed in our sporting history.The unfolding events,naming of names,charges,judicial process,enquiry following liquidation will give the journos plenty to write about and yes I agree the quality input from Daly & Thomson will prevail.
We can but hope.If this does not happen then our country will acquire a very tarnished image.
abigboydiditandranaway says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:22
Well we do not even know the terms of the share issue whether it is private or public? So how can you be so sure of the outcome? The last share issue was at a time of relevant strength, now the circumstances are totally different. The RFF has responded well as have the support, did you believe we would get these crowds in the 3rd division?
wottpi says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:24
erm!…………………………………………………………………….I think that’s what I was trying to say!
Thanks for putting that so succinctly, now I know what I meant!
Ah’ve no’ even had a drink yet…
But Ah’ll get ma coat anyway!
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:30
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abigboydiditandranaway says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:22
Well we do not even know the terms of the share issue whether it is private or public?
======================================
I think we do. Green is on record as saying that shares will only be sold to members of the “Rangers Family”. That can only mean a private sale. Additionally, there is no way that an acceptable prospectus could be produced for a stock market listing before next summer. Accounts could not be produced, for a start, and I think the members of Green’s consortium are reluctant to be identified, for whatever reason.
I have been very impressed by the level of support and season ticket sales in SFL3, these have far exceeded my own forecasts. I have no doubt at all that Green will get £20million plus by selling shares (almost certainly non-voting) in a private company this Autumn. Those investing will almost certainly lose their shirts, Green will make his profit and walk away, and that will be the end of Sevco. In my opinion.
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:30
The other day you suggested that £500 minimum investment was not on.
Therefore given all we know about Mr Charles and allowing for blue tinted spectacles being worn by those in denial what do you think, as a Gers man, would be reasonable minimum price to ask for and how many of a crowd of 45k would take up the offer, if it was on the private ‘Rangers Family’ route?
That way we can do the back of a fag packet calculation to provide a range of income that Mr Charles might expect and how that compares with the known and claimed expenditure.
Cole describes FA as a ‘bunch of to##ers’
That sort of thing would not be tolerated in Scotland.Our association would treat such statements as ‘bringing the game into disrepute’. Well, at least with some offenders.
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:30
I am not “so sure” of the outcome hence the confusion I have displayed in my somewhat rambling posts.
I certainly did not think that the new club would attract the attendances they have done and fair play to the supporters for that…now if they could only deal with that pesky bogit problem!( then they WOULD be winning friends)
To be fair, if you pardon the lapse into footballerspeak, it remains to be seen how the share issue will go…
It is possible that the bears having had the fright of their lives will respond robustly and buy up shares as if they are going out of fashion. This could see Chuckles ride happily into the sunset as per his stated intention with a few quid left over for the next owners to build the club up with a fan base alert to any possible future shenanigans and ready to put a stop to same…
OR
It could be a failure.
Even if all 45K bought £500 worth shares (or a share certificate) or whatever it is they are offering that would raise £22.5M. Now that clearly isn’t going to happen so calculate how many Bears you think will buy shares multiplied by the average spend equals the probable amount raised. ie 5K fans spending £1K each = £5M raised.
Ha ha this is what I mean by hyperbole and bluster, do you serious believe this nonsense?
Green then went onto outline his future plans for the club. These included:
The owners want to get more non-exec directors on board for good governance. No single investor will be allowed more than 10%.
Over 5 million worldwide fan base: wants to include them all much better than before.
Green has agreed a deal to buy Edmiston House from Murray. This will see the Ticket office moving to where superstore is now. The Megastore will move to bottom 2 floors of Edmiston House. The upper floors are to be converted into a sports bar.
The club is committed to ensuring our merchandise is readily available in USA. Former Ibrox favourite Reyna is going to help us create academies in USA, and Bocanegra will join him once he hangs up his boots. The club believes the American market to be massive.
The Asian Market is well known to our investors. This Market is seen as the biggest upcoming market, Rangers are going to get involved in a big way. The club is currently looking at partners to develop brand/ tours etc.
As previously known the JJB deal terminated has been terminated and replaced by Sports Direct. Green wants to get back to 2005 levels of retail sales of £20M and profit of £5.6M per annum. The new deal with Sports Direct will help us do this. The club has been talking to Adidas, Puma and Nike about taking over Umbro deal which has been terminated, an announcement is expected soon! Puma are probably the favourites due to connections with Sports Direct.
The club believes media rights are going to be huge over next decade, i.e TV migrating to web. Rangers are in talks with TV and tech companies. It is expected that media income alone will reach £100M within 10 years. Looks at example of the Champions League final which generated £1.7B.
Green believes there will be a Euro league of sorts within a few years and that RFC will be a part of it, citing that the global fan base is too big to exclude us. Green also alluded to The Champions League which would be worth £20M income to club per season.
The Club are going to revalue property assets at more realistic £30-40M in next balance sheet. The players are worth £2M on the balance sheet.
We have a strong youth player base, in 3 years we will have 6 under 22 players with over 100 appearancess, this experience will stand club in good stead.
In January 2012 the wage bill was £30M per annum. It is now £6M per annum. Policy to bring in players on good wages (£20k pw) but not pay large fees we don’t get back. Looking to bring in 10 players like that between now and top league return, making max wage bill of £16M per annum. Ally McCoist believes title winning squad achievable under that budget.
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:30
Well we do not even know the terms of the share issue whether it is private or public? So how can you be so sure of the outcome? The last share issue was at a time of relevant strength, now the circumstances are totally different. The RFF has responded well as have the support, did you believe we would get these crowds in the 3rd division?
———–
I think that there’s merit in what you say, and I believe that Green isn’t looking towards the ST holders, but to the 250,000 who wrecked Manchester.
neepheid says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:44
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:30
0 0 Rate This
abigboydiditandranaway says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:22
Well we do not even know the terms of the share issue whether it is private or public?
======================================
I think we do. Green is on record as saying that shares will only be sold to members of the “Rangers Family”. That can only mean a private sale. Additionally, there is no way that an acceptable prospectus could be produced for a stock market listing before next summer. Accounts could not be produced, for a start, and I think the members of Green’s consortium are reluctant to be identified, for whatever reason.
I have been very impressed by the level of support and season ticket sales in SFL3, these have far exceeded my own forecasts. I have no doubt at all that Green will get £20million plus by selling shares (almost certainly non-voting) in a private company this Autumn. Those investing will almost certainly lose their shirts, Green will make his profit and walk away, and that will be the end of Sevco. In my opinion.
======================================
Neepheid,
I disagree.
I’m not surprised by the CURRENT level of support turning up at Ibrox, sorry, i-Brox 1.0
lets face it, they have the option of turn up or let the club die. I don’t see too many fans taking that decision easily.
Also, Chuckie has been cleverly playing the poor put upon sevconian card – claiming everyone is against them – the SPL, SFA and that HMRC haven’t even found them guilty and that the EBT’s were legal and it’s simply not right what CW did to the club – boo feckin hoo!
So, they buy a CHEAP season ticket which gives them their games to go to, with friends and stick to their old routine, indeed, the timmy conspiracy and hatred to their club has acted as a rallying point
but we are only a small number of games into the season, the BTC has returned a decision, the SPL investigation hasn’t sat. CG plans are not yet clear.
if Ally keeps up his sparkling run of form – out of cups, struggling away from home, then it’s only a matter of time before the crowds dwindle
once the extent of cheating in the BTC comes out – more will leave
once the titles are removed with the overwhelming evidence – more will leave
when talk of a share issue hits, famililes will be preparing for christmas and i’m sure many a bear will have lost some of the appetite and their wives will be more interested in presents for the bairns or keeping the heating on full tilt for the winter to let them chuck £500 notes into chuckie’s pension fund
The level of support doesn’t surprise me now, £15 a game is good value – and I understand a LOT of the bears going along just now are not the same bears that went last year. Plenty of “nouvelle-bogots” attending just now in the time of oranje crisis
Even if they are cantering the league come feb, i bet crowds are still impressive, but more likely to be 20-25k
share subscription – £3m tops
IF Rangers are such a valuable and prospective money making proposition why did Sir David Murray sell for a quid? and why didn’t he or others snap them up post liquidation?
European leagues, Internet TV, Asian markets, American markets, worldwide academies yada yada yada ……………….. Iam surprised that every big club in the world isn’t rolling in it given how easy Mr Green makes it sound for a Scottish 4th tier club to catapult itself into a major league soccer franchise.
Apologies to all re “Cenkos” …. As this blog gains momentum / and my workload becomes more demanding ….. I can’t find enough time to keep up my addiction …. It was just something that stuck in my mind ….. Once again sorry lads n lassies
Charlie Brown says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 15:00
IF Rangers are such a valuable and prospective money making proposition why did Sir David Murray sell for a quid? and why didn’t he or others snap them up post liquidation?
European leagues, Internet TV, Asian markets, American markets, worldwide academies yada yada yada ……………….. Iam surprised that every big club in the world isn’t rolling in it given how easy Mr Green makes it sound for a Scottish 4th tier club to catapult itself into a major league soccer franchise.
————————————————————————-
Precisely, so why waste your time forensically analysing his comments, they are not designed to be believed by you they are targeted at those who wish to believe, and they hit the spot, it is brilliant marketing.
Charlie Brown says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 15:00
European leagues, Internet TV, Asian markets, American markets, worldwide academies yada yada yada ………………..
—————————————–
of course, lets say CG has gone out and drummed up interest in all these things with these companies – and lets say Disney/Apple/Google TV decide they want exclusive “soccer” content/link ups, yeah, they might look at Scotland as Sevco has knocked on their door – but when they actually look at the market do you think they will “test the water” with Sevco in the 3rd division or will they look at city rivals Celtic in Europe and at the top of the SPL?
Celtic have tried knocking on the door of the US (where we have a much larger deomgraphic) and Asia – Du wei, Naka, Ki etc and we have also run a number of academies and had friendlies over there (most recently real madrid this year)
UEFA aren’t having euro leagues yet – but when they do, 3rd division teams who dom’t meet uefa criteria won’t be involved
Internet tv looks promising – but it’ll be the big 5 markets 1st before anyone knocks on sfl3’s doors
Charlie Brown says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:53
Even if all 45K bought £500 worth shares (or a share certificate) or whatever it is they are offering that would raise £22.5M. Now that clearly isn’t going to happen so calculate how many Bears you think will buy shares multiplied by the average spend equals the probable amount raised. ie 5K fans spending £1K each = £5M raised.
=================================
5k fans @ the £500 minimum would be a very reasonable uptake in my opinion. I think if you took a snapshot of the 40k plus crowds they would include a huge number of parents and children. I don’t think it would be unreasonable to suggest that this demographic group would be highly unlikely to buy into the dream in significant numbers (purely down to economics rather than a lack of desire) so we are left with the hardcore who also have disposable income before christmas. I think Charlie might find this group a little bit thin on the ground.
However like a lot of others I was astonished by the recent crowd levels so I suppose anythings possible, although getting 40k fans to part with £10/£5 to watch a game is a lot easier than getting 5k to part with £500 for a worthless certificate. The 40k can see what they are getting for their money, as for the “investors”……..???
All this talk about the global appeal brings 2 things to mind; Misha Sher’s calamitous tilt last year at marketing Rangers to a global audience (the highlight of which was playing shill to a money spinning tour of games against Celtic without having consulted them) and Hugh Adam opining back in February 2002 that the global appeal was a myth.
test..
People all have a maximum amount of cash they are prepared to pass onto their football club, golf club etc etc.
Previously the devout were shelling out, on an individual basis, around £500 for an average SPL season ticket.
If you are a family then add on the missus and the kids as appropritate.
You may add on food and programmes along with replica kits and DVD’s etc. However it is looks like a good deal of that money is not going directly to the club as the rights appears to have been sold off previously.
Regardless it must be possible to estimate the spend per bum on seat that gets back to the club coffers.
Given the lower ticket prices this year, the devout may be more than happy to pass on the difference in price from an SPL brief back to the club and possibly a wee bit more given the dire situation. However that may not result in any greater income overall than that achieved in 2011-2012.
The fact remains that, while the situation is dire, some people will just not be able to put any more cash the clubs way.
You may seek to target the 250k that went to Manchester and the 5million Bill Ngs of this world who have been true blue all their lives but if their expenditure is limited to a replica strip, a few DVDs at Christmas and the occassional attendance as a glory hunter it is unlikely many will part with £500.
The whole thing is a financial tightrope act but the difference being that on here many people are wanting the act to fall from a great height.
wottpi says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:24
bogsdollox says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 13:17
As I keep saying until someone starts asking the awkward questions then there are going to be people out there with blue tinted spectacles willing to part with their cash.
==========================================================================
They’re not all mugs though. Some will “invest” for emotional reasons but parting with cash for many will be an economic question not an emotional one.
Managed to get round to bein SFM wordpressed over & changed my nom deh plumb.
All media & print rights still remain with me tho for the Duff & Duffer brand/franchise…
🙂
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 15:09
The very obvious question is why DD is marketing rangers, there is a very obvious answer, one that the less than business minded will be non too enthusiastic about.
Humble Pie says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 01:43
Smokin’
There is little to no global market for Rangers – Global footballing brands are a rarity indeed – United, Real Madrid, Liverpool, Barca – even great clubs with long histories, like Ajax, Benfica, and Celtic struggle to make any global impact. The idea that a discredited and “iffy” club from a footballing backwater can have any global appeal is nonsense. They have appeal in NI where they feed prejudices and in Scotland – and that’s it. Any Global strategy – in the Scottish lower leagues with no Champions League exposure is just rubbish.
As to justice being done – eventually – I doubt it. the facts will be exposed, individuals will be pursued, but the vast majority of those who write about it in the Scottish MSM and the fan base of Scottish football will simply ignore them. The authorities will not act beyond the bare minimum that they can get away with ( think going to the courts and transfer embargo – going back to appeal – never happened)
LNS’s report will be damning and the SFA will doctor it to sound tough – life ban for Murray , loss of titles – but ensure that no meaningful action will be taken against Rangers. All that can be done is ensure that the facts are placed before the world and never forgotten, so that any who ever seek the redemption of Rangers, who have an ounce of decency or honesty will immediately realise just what the club is.
I genuinely cannot understand how any right thinking person can support Rangers after all of this – I mean genuinely.
Their club have been exposed as tax fraudsters, they have gone bust. they now have a vocal support of crazed loyalist lunatics calling the shots, They feast on anger and poreceived injustice when all they have had is rule break upon rule break to ensure their survival. As far as I am concerned there are no decent Rangers fans left. Any decent Rangers fan would have walked away. if anyone chooses to stay then any claims to decency on their behalf have gone.
And yet they are supposedly an essential institution to Scotland. Only a hideously deformed country could possibly see RFC as anything other than an embarrasment and a disgrace.
If a politician comes in to save a country that’s in dire straits, or if a busnessman comes in to turn around a failing enterprise, you can tell early on if they are of genuine calibre because they will admit early on: “Sorry, but I’m going to have to take some unpopular decisions”.
It is four months since Charles Green took over “Rangers” – a failing business that was clearly in dire straits.
If I were a Rangers fan I would be wondering why, in all that time, Charles Green has not done or said anything that was at all unpopular.
From the minutes of the IPO meeting Green had with THE most gullible bunch of fecktards you are likely to meet
“MONEY
Capita will issue the Initial Public Offering (IPO) share information next week. IPO presentation shows RFC (in Europe) is a £60m turnover club, RFC (no Europe) is £40m club. Division 3 will be “lower”. CG said when Div3 was confirmed, he should have cut 25% of workforce, but didn’t. Took the decision to retain staff, keep the talent/skills as he believes the whole ‘team’ is important moving forward to where he expects us to be.”
perrywhyte says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 15:27
All this talk about the global appeal brings…to mind; Misha Sher’s calamitous tilt last year at marketing Rangers to a global audience…
==================================
Rather unfair on poor Misha, IMO, as he did have a few obstacles to overcome in his new role.
Remember, Wee Craigie had opened an office for Misha “in the City” – but never told Misha, [or anyone else for that matter], the location of said office !
“Took the decision to retain staff, keep the talent/skills as he believes the whole ‘team’ is important moving forward to where he expects us to be.”
hmmm, week financial management, not prepared to take the hard decisions……stock markets like management like that. Maybe HBOS will give them an overdraft to help out
Reposted in light of the SFA’s failure to act on CG’s disrepute charges….and your many kind comments re my previous post.
Is cowardice in the ranks of the SFA destroying Scottish football ?
It is my view that it is not Rangers (old or new,) per se, who are responsible for the slow lingering death of the game in Scotland. Yes, those now notorious ‘guardians’ of this once ‘prodigious institution’ are certainly guilty of financial doping (cheating), disregarding the articles of association and bringing the entire game into disrepute. However, notwithstanding the undoubted effect this has had on both creditors and loyal supporters of the (now defunct) club, this has served only to bring the whole sorry state of affairs in Scottish football to a head. In my humble opinion, it is the repeated failure of ‘Scottish football’s governing body’ to act, ‘without fear or favour’ on the numerous and blatant breaches of their own rules, that has brought us to where we are today.
Over the last year or so, no-one, not one person, I have spoken to, including supporters of the Old and New Rangers, has indicated any respect for the SFA nor any individual who holding office in said organisation. Any residual trust in this failed institution existing, outside the bubble of the Rangers saga, must be based purely on cognitive dissonance because, and let’s be honest here, Scottish football is a shambles, at all levels. Whatever they have been doing for the last thirty or more years to improve the game in this country has evidently been unsuccessful.
There is no doubt that it was the failure of Rangers to pay their statutory PAYE and NI contributions which forced the club into administration, the subsequent hiving off of their assets and their inevitable liquidation. It is also unquestionable that this has and will continue to have a negative knock on effect on the finances of the whole of Scottish football. However, if we could ignore dEBTs, financial instruments and tax evasion for a moment we may get to the nub of what exactly is/ has been going on here. These financial issues are complex, legal, corporate and commercial and will no doubt run their course in due time. However, in the meantime, we should perhaps concentrate on what Donald Rumsfeld would call the ‘known knowns’, by which I mean, those things that we know that we know.
Football is a sport that involves, to varying degrees, kicking a ball with the foot to score a goal. Sport being a form of competitive physical activity which, through casual or organized participation, aims to use, maintain or improve physical ability and provide entertainment to participants. Sports are governed by a set of rules or customs, which serve to ensure fair competition, and allow consistent adjudication of the winner. These rules are governed by the all encompassing principles of respect, fair play and sportsmanship and are agreed to by all participants. Simple enough one would think!
So, it is an absolute prerequisite in sport that all participants in any game agree a set of rules. In order to maintain these established rules and discourage rule breaking, the rules have to be enforced. Enforcement requires two things: sanctions or ‘punishments’, if you will, for rule breakers and enforcement officers to apply the rules (in this case the SFA).
The failure of the SFA to simply apply their own ‘agreed’ rules has allowed a few nefarious individuals to usurp these rules to the detriment of the game as a whole. The apparent overseers of the game in Scotland are guilty of abrogating their responsibilities in favour trying desperately to maintain the status quo. By their wilful inaction, they have allowed an entirely new corporate entity, which exists solely to maximise profit for its investors , to claim, by virtue of some assets that they may or may not have acquired, that they are that once proud institution called Rangers.
This new corporate entity now seeks to extract as much of the hard-earned cash of the many decent and loyal supporters of the old club as they possibly can before this ‘fiction’ is exposed and they ‘sell out’ and move on to ventures new. Their Marketing Plan is as simple as it is devastating. It could be called ‘Play up to people’s prejudices’. That many of the old Rangers supporters have failed to see this is a tragedy for which the Scottish sports media are also eminently culpable. However that’s for another time.
It is the SFA who have sat back and allowed this situation to unfold. They are the governing body in this country and, as such, have a responsibility not only to the participants of the game but also to the spectators (or fans, if you will). By allowing Mr Green, Mr McCoist et al to claim, without counter, that their new club is the same as the old club and that this club and supporters are being attacked from all sides by the SFA, the SPL and the mhedia (sic), they have not only undermined their own authority, they have allowed tens of thousands of football fans to be duped into parting with their cash believing they could save their beloved (soon to be deceased) club.
The money paid towards season tickets, the RFFF and any matchday profits could potentially have bought the necessary assets of Rangers on behalf of the fans, with any surplus used to agree a payment plan with creditors, potentially stopping the original club from being liquidated and thus have a chance of preserving their precious history while rebuilding their club from the ground up. I am sure that the fans would have bought into that, but now it’s too late. The officers of the SFA are seen to have endorsed this ‘now, then and forever’ fiction by their obfuscation and voluntary inertia. In doing so they have fermented discord and distrust amongst fans as well as, some might argue, Scottish society as a whole. That the ordinary taxpayer continues to contribute to this farce through the provision of government grants makes a mockery out of a sham.
So one should ask, “what is the motive behind the SFA allowing this situation get so out of hand ?” Pragmatism ? Well, no, they have had to go out of their way to bend, fudge and ignore their own terms of reference in order to keep the fiction alive. Vanity ? Again no, I doubt the SFA have ever been so unpopular with fans across the board as they are now. That leaves us with cowardice. It is my view that Mr Regan, Mr Ogilvie et al are scared of what they perceive might happen to them if they try to enforce the rules. If the SFA can’t apply them ‘without fear or favour’ then the reality is that the rules are just there to be broken.
Dr King once said, “Cowardice asks the question, ‘Is it safe?’ Expediency asks the question, ‘Is it politic?’ Vanity asks the question, ‘Is it popular?’ But, conscience asks the question, ‘Is it right?’ And there comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but one must take it because it is right.” It is well past time for someone within the corridors of power at the SFA to do the right thing. Just come out and say it ! “The Rangers are a NEW club in the third division of the SFL”. There, that wasn’t so hard now. Was it ?
Observer says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 16:09
If I were a Rangers fan I would be wondering why, in all that time, Charles Green has not done or said anything that was at all unpopular.
Agreed O
IMO i think there are two reasons for this…
1..CG has not the sightest clue regarding what to say,he has /is being fully briefed coached, informed & guided by the very few but chosen peepul who know what needs to be said regarding the rfc(ail) sevco fans.
2..CG is acting on the loyal & amazing reaction from his target audience.When he attempts to deviate from the script in anyway, he always ends up in the S**t. His natural BS is suited more to the bottomfeeders,vile scumbags & fellow conmen, this is where he thinks his trick will work.What he didn’t bargain on was just how pathetically easy this is going to be..no need for tough love, he is king of the castle…………………FOR NOW !!
Humble Pie.
Another excellent post. I’ll disagree with one small point though. Messers Regan and Doncaster may well be motivated by fear. Mr Ogilvie is a different kettle of fish altogether.
I wasn’t going to post as I didn’t think I would have much to say personally, however, I think Charles Green has been telling a few more porkies…
We’ve talked to contacts in British Land and Ardmore.
Stephen Smith (Head of Investments) at British Land knows nothing about any deal or discussions with Green. Direct quote – “not interested in the slightest”.
Nor does Cormac Byrne the MD at Ardmore (would the people down Ibrox way really take kindly to an Irish builder rebuilding their dreams?)
Unless Green actually has the cold hard cash in his bank account, then neither BL nor Ardmore would be interested in dealing with such a precarious financial situation without putting in place some form of bond (payable by Green and likely to be cost-prohibitive). He literally is just flying by the seat of his pants and throwing names out to impress.
I’ve also been asked to express an enormous debt of gratitude to everyone for the incredibly kind words which people have posted about corsica. His family have read through the page and are in awe that so many people have taken the time to express their thoughts. I have a letter from his widow which I will try to scan and email to TSFM to post.
Humble Pie says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 16:24
To be fair Rangers being a new club in Div 3 is exactly the SFA stance and this was relayed to T’Rangers fans by e-mail in response to enquires with regard to why as runners up in the SPL they weren’t seeded in the League cup.
Check back and you will see it referenced and it was taken from Rangers Media. If I can find the link I’ll post I again
It is the SFL who recognise the continuation of the oldco history in a different way than they do with Airdrie and Lord NImmo Smith’s interpretation of SPL rules that are causing confusing.
However I agree if Campbell Ogilvie and Stewart Regan want to come out of hiding and publicly repeat the contents of said e-mail to clarify the SFA’s position once and for all, I am all for it.
corsicacharity says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 16:55
Many thanks for your contribution and passing on the news from Corsica’s family.
You also raise an interesting point which I have been banging on about for ages – and will do so again 🙂
“Unless Green actually has the cold hard cash in his bank account, then neither BL nor Ardmore would be interested in dealing with such a precarious financial situation without putting in place some form of bond (payable by Green and likely to be cost-prohibitive)”
As you say any serious organisation would ask for some kind of bond or guarentee given what has gone before.
Just like the SFL asked Livingston for a £750k bond in case they didn;t see out the season after having gone through administration and been demoted.
We know that T’Rangers have a much bigger fan base to rely on for income but surely the business principles are the same and some form of bond should have been requested.
However there seems to be no record or public acknowledgement that once was requested.
doontheslope says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 16:52
Fair point doontheslope, although Mr Ogilvie does appear to be teflon-coated. I can’t recall anyone in football or in the media ever saying a bad word about him. Hmm ! funny that !
Perhaps he holds another position, outside of football, which confers on him some magical powers of invisibility and invincibility and where people hold him in some awe. You know, like the Dungeon Master in Dungeons and Dragons. Or perhaps he’s just a really nice guy and a great administrator. 🙂
Te statement interested me in only a couple of places:
What do these mean:
“Consortium were misled by press and ‘other individuals'”
Did the consortium pull out Charles?
” When asked if there were any barriers to maximising profit over our media rights, he said part of the deal to re-enter Scottish Football was to give a number of games over to Sky/ESPN, but now that we are out of SPL, there are less barriers”
Is this Charlie reneging on another part of the 5 way agreement.
Who believes this stuff
“500 million globally could watch RFC (I thought they were about to be liquidated)….
RFC (there they are again) believes we can generate £100 million per year in media rights”
http://www.vanguardbears.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=291
IPO presentation states RFC has a current global fan-base of 5M due to “Massive Scots diaspora”, believes 500m globally could ‘watch’ RFC. Highlighted recent SKY viewing figures vs Peterhead as an example of level of viewing interest in RFC. CG believes football on TV is becoming a thing of the past. Gave example of his own £55/month SKY bill and hasn’t been home to see a match. He would have been better paying a couple of quid and watching games on his phone while sitting in airports, train journeys etc. TV will become web-based. “Content is King”, gave example of YOUVIEW.COM owner Marc Watson paying £738M for ‘a handful of EPL matches’.
RFC believes we can generate £100M per year in ‘media rights’. When asked if there were any barriers to maximising profit over our media rights, he said part of the deal to re-enter Scottish Football was to give a number of games over to Sky/ESPN, but now that we are out of SPL, there are less barriers, we still need to comply with certain legal issues e.g. 3pm Saturday K.O. being a no-go, but as long as we move K.O. times, eventually we can call the shots. We now have a ‘reduced reliability’ on TV feeds. He gave the example of next month’s LIVE league match vs. East Stirling, this is being sold to web viewers online in the UK as well as abroad, and expects this to be the way forward. When asked about illegal streams etc. affecting these sales, IA explained they have a number of tech-solutions to fight this. He and BS also explained that the media rights revenue was not solely limited to match streaming, there would be other avenues such as maximising social networking, interactive feeds, fans can talk directly with players/management, pre/post match etc. interact with players not available for selection, such as injured or sidelined players, while the match is on.
Amusing extracts, IMO, from the VB statement today / summary of Green pitch last night.
=====================================================================
“…RFC want more Non-Executive Directors…Club needs good governance…”
Then just 4 short sentences later;
“…CG then explained how it all came about…they set up a bank account, asked some people to put some money into the account, no paperwork just trust…”
As you do, “no paperwork just trust”… 🙄
Yes, they can just choose to ignore Anti-Money Laundering Legislation, as The Peepil don’t need paperwork.
Or more probable: Charlie is just talking more absolute mince !
iceman63 says:
“I genuinely cannot understand how any right thinking person can support Rangers after all of this – I mean genuinely.”
Former MSP, Duncan Hamilton wrote eloquently about this some months back –
http://www.scotsman.com/scotland-on-sunday/opinion/comment/duncan-hamilton-for-football-to-maintain-a-shred-of-integrity-rangers-must-pay-the-price-1-2359544.
He might misjudge his fellow supporters in slacking their jaws and taking the Green hook but he does reflect a basic truth – for most supporters, we just can’t help it. Even where TRFC are concerned. Only the image-conscious, TV-intellectuals like Pat Nevin can make the jump. The rest of us are where we are because…(read Duncan’s article).
Iceman63’s despair is understandable, less so the tendency of some posters to read the TRFC story as the story of Scotland – we are an irredeemable, nasty, brutish, self-serving myopia pf a wee country, etc. I prefer to look a bit beyond to James Robertson’s And the land lay still, James MacMillan’s sacred music, Humza Yousaf MSP’s youthful Asian Scot idealism, Vicky Featherstone’s final season at the NTS (see, Pat, I can do it too) and, of course, the prize-winning prose of RTC and the insight and imagination of the contributors there and here.
Good Evening,
I have written a rather long article– over 11,000 words and so do not feel comfortable clooging up thee pages with such verbosity!!
Accordingly I have posted it on my wordpress page– on which I normally never write at all.
The Link is here.
The Silence of the Lambs—- and when the wheels come off the bogey! http://wp.me/p1G95H-6 via @wordpressdotcom
Obviously I am more tha happy to discuss on here or elsewhere.
BRTH
nowoldandgrumpy says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 17:30
http://www.vanguardbears.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=291
IPO presentation states RFC has a current global fan-base of 5M due to “Massive Scots diaspora”, believes 500m globally could ‘watch’ RFC.
—————————————
I believe the 500m figure.
I have been banging on for years that first the Indians, and then the Chinese, will be outbred by the Scots as they spread across the globe.
It’s all in the book “The Blue and White Planet” by Tam McMalthus.
Charlie’s pronouncements area bit like when your mate fixes you up on a blind date with “a real cracker” who turns out to look like Joyce Grenfell. Following that disappointment he then tells you the following week that he has got you another blind date with “someone even better” and you’re still stupid enough to believe him/her. Another week, another disappointment but you still trust their judgement.
They truly deserve each other.
For me, the admission that jumped out from that piece of nonsense from Green is when he revealed that Imran Ahmad and Zeus Capital had approached him back in FEBRUARY to become CEO at iBrox.
As I pointed out last month, Brian Stockbridge of Zeus had been sent to Glasgow within days of the former club going into administration.
Funnily enough, we heard nothing of their interest while several deadlines for bids came and went.
Except that during this time a number of the bidders mentioned that representatives of Ticketus had been attempting to get involved with them.
Funny that.
And as soon as Ticketus announced they wouldn’t be backing any other bids, Green appeared on the scene with what was clearly a stitched-up agreement with Fudd and Duffer.
The bizarre collection of mysterious investors named to date are only exotic distractions. Sevco is a Ticketus front.
And they want the Rangers’ fans cash as soon as possible.
Even they couldn’t be that gullible and stupid, could they?
Oh, wait . . .
RFC 1872 always required a strong and ‘Clean’ Celtic FC to be deemed worthy and large enough on the European/World stage to be capable of gaining sponsorship from the worlds elite Blue Chip Companies. Why does Mr Charles believe that these same companies would now be falling over themselves to invest in a Club playing in the proverbial backwater that is percieved to be Scottish Footballs 4th tier whilst their erstwhile closest rivals soar to greater heights both at home and in Europe.Football in Scotland seems to be on a better footing since the Govan mobs demise. One glance at the antics of Mr Charles and the disease attached to this new club would make proper, high fliers and investors move swiftly on. The only people lining up to witness the long road back to the top for Sevco are the deluded, blinkered masses who seem to be once again acting like the moth attracted to the flame. The bright light being a share issue designed to remove any cash and any dignity that the orcs may have kept out of Mr Charles’ reach up until now. They know its wrong but they have nowhere else to turn now.How this must be hurting.
Best essay yet, I think, from B R H & T.
Lots of ‘that’s it in a nutshell’ such as:
“So who signed those (side) letters on behalf of the Rangers PLC board?”
Looking forward to some of answers from the coming FTTT statement…
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan on Friday, October 5, 2012 at 17:43
Silence of the Lambs?
I hope that is not a slight on us Aberdeen FC fans 🙂
davis58 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 14:53
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
In short…NO…but it is not me he needs to CONvince…
Long Time Lurker
No it is not meant to be a slight on anyone lol— although given the population of Aberdeen and Aberdeenshire I really do wish your club could attract bigger crowds on a regular basis.
Cheers
On Charles Green’s notion of a multi-million RFC fan-base, this has been trotted out before in an attempt to reinforce the sense of importance that the fans attach to the club. It is difficult to believe that Charles Green, given the local on the ground advisers he has access to, is in any way deluded into thinking that Rangers potential is so exponentially high.
At Celtic Park around ten years ago, when Alan McDonald commissioned Olswang to report on Celtic’s multimedia potential, the figure of £100 million was also mentioned. The Olswang report was very bullish in its excessive overestimation of the potential Celtic support, it talked of delivery systems changing from TV to IP (a major reason that Celtic pushed for non-exclusive IP rights for all SPL clubs to broadcast their own matches. The report also spoke about new league mechanisms, giving rise to the talk of the Atlantic League.
Curiously, the man chosen by McDonald (who genuinely believed in the report) to sell this pup to the Celtic fans, was none other than our old friend Jack at Media House.
If I didn’t know better, I’d assume that Jack had just found an old copy of the Olswang report, substituted the word “Celtic” for Rangers, stuck a Sevco badge on the front and handed it to Charlie 🙂
Both Celtic and Rangers, in my view, persistently overestimate the global attraction of their clubs.
In Rangers predicament, it may be damaging since it is yet another mythological rainbow being arched out with no pot of gold at the end of it.
And Charles Green is no Alan McDonald.
I’m going to ‘ have a go’ at Humble Pies’ offerings….(sharp intake of breath)
can we have some spacing between paragraphs.
It’s brilliant, it’s just hard to read
😉
Observer says: at 17:47
nowoldandgrumpy says: at 17:30
some things never seem to change – G51
next we`ll here they`ve done a deal with TU 😉 – Blimey
from our good friend roddy – June 2011
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/rangers/8590398/Rangers-fans-buy-into-Craig-Whyte-regime.html
What I like most about Brogan’s latest blog is that it in timely fashion re-focuses attention away from the current (thoroughly enjoyable) Charles Green farce & back onto the very serious stuff that has gone on before at RFC & which is surely about to be laid bare.
There may well be absolute carnage around the corner for very serious figures in Scottish, and perhaps English, football.
To quote from the blog:
“If Campbell Ogilvie is found to have been the author of any of the so called side letters or second contracts, thus instigating and furthering the implementation of EBT payments to any player, can he remain in situ within the SFA?
If it is discovered that certain EBT payments were paid to persons who were not employees of Rangers PLC but who were employed by other companies and organisations, and where these same people have been deemed to be among those who are to be treated as “other service providers” within the meaning of the Rangers PLC accounts—will we ever get to learn what service these same people provided?”
BRTH
Great read once again.
TSFM says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 18:30
=======================================
I would love it if we could track down a copy of that Olswang report to compare it with Jack’s
rehash.
And again, here is more of the blusterings from Chuckie and his gang:
“22,690,000 shares have already been issued – these are with the initial backers (consortium). Imran Ahmad estimates a further 22M+ in the next round. The minimum investment is 500 shares. IA was asked what price will one share cost? He explained that a bunch were traded at 50p early on, and more recently 1M where traded at £1. He estimates somewhere between £1-£1.50 per share, it will be finalised when the value of the club is established.”
If 22million shares have been issued (at prices between 50p and £1), why hasn’t Companies House been informed?
At present, the share capital of The Rangers Football Club Limited is listed as £2.
By the way, according to Fudd and Duffer, how much are Ticketus owed by RFC PLC RIP?
Wouldn’t be £22million, would it?
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 17:43
I think people get carried away with who when and why or if the wheels come of the bogie, or even if the game is a bogie.
That decision will rest with the FTT irrespective of how many words we post.
I do know that the police investigation is getting absolutely nowhere fast, one would expect for such heralded and certain criminal wrongdoing they would have found something by now, but there again perhaps there is nothing to find. Maybe Whyte is just to good at his day job of relieving fools like ticketus and others of their money, seemingly quite legally by all accounts.
Levein “disappointed”? Now why didn’t Craig Levein simply say: “We don’t need thugs in our team, we need footballers”. He should have suspended Naismith for another two games himself.
johnboy5088 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 18:44
And again, here is more of the blusterings from Chuckie and his gang:
“22,690,000 shares have already been issued
_______________________________________________
It’s a characteristic of companies where CW and his like are involved.
Recently, MHG (10.6% owned by CW’s Liberty Capital) issued a further 1,000,000,000, yes, one billion, new shares to Beia Investment Partners (LLP).
http://www.merchanthousegroup.com/rns/new-funding-directorate-changes-rpts
TSFM says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 18:30
Good post. At the risk of being shot for heresy, both Celtic and Rangers are big fish, (still true of Rangers in terms of support), in a small pond.
I seriously question whether either would have any real impact if the mythical entry into the English Premier were to happen, let alone a pan-European league. Mid table triers at best.
Observer says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 18:36
What I like most about Brogan’s latest blog…
If it is discovered that certain EBT payments were paid to persons who were not employees of Rangers PLC but who were employed by other companies and organisations, and where these same people have been deemed to be among those who are to be treated as “other service providers” within the meaning of the Rangers PLC accounts—will we ever get to learn what service these same people provided?”
==================================
Yes, that specific point comes up frequently, and is most interesting.
I have had my fingers and toes crossed for a very long time that certain Scottish MSM ‘sports journalists’ will be identified as recipients.
Would it not be the ‘absolutely’ cherry on the cake if it was later revealed that a certain hack – more commonly referred to as a Star Wars character – had benefited from the dodgy scheme ?
Allegedly… 😉
StevieBC says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 19:29
Would it not be the ‘absolutely’ cherry on the cake if it was later revealed that a certain hack – more commonly referred to as a Star Wars character – had benefited from the dodgy scheme ?
————————–
You know what, Stevie?
I’m gonna email him & ask him!
Nothing ventured…
Purely to clear the air, that is!
Observer says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 19:38
StevieBC says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 19:29
Would it not be the ‘absolutely’ cherry on the cake if it was later revealed that a certain hack – more commonly referred to as a Star Wars character – had benefited from the dodgy scheme ?
————————–
You know what, Stevie?
I’m gonna email him & ask him!
Nothing ventured…
================
Good luck then Observer.
Please update us if he deigns to respond to an Internet Bampot! 😉
BTW, hats off to Brenda for her tenacity!
I hope she is being handsomely sponsored for this:
http://higheredcareercoach.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/bigstockphoto_Business_Woman_Sitting_On_Cloc_164596.jpg
johnboy5088 says:
Friday, October 5, 2012 at 18:10
For me, the admission that jumped out from that piece of nonsense from Green is when he revealed that Imran Ahmad and Zeus Capital had approached him back in FEBRUARY to become CEO at iBrox.
==================================
That would explain his comments (when the HMRC position was made public) to the effect that if HMRC knew way back in February they were going to block the CVA then why didn’t they tell us then.
Last minute bid my aris, planned all along as we had thought.
Duff and Phelps must have known about all of this.
corsicacharity,
Your post and content is exactly the kind of post that makes this, and RTC, the influential sites they are/were.
Please hang around the place.
Corsica. RIP.
@BRTH No it is not meant to be a slight on anyone lol— although given the population of Aberdeen and Aberdeenshire I really do wish your club could attract bigger crowds on a regular basis.
_______________________________________________
A lot of apathy and a large number of Glory chasers especially in the shire.
Also Pittodrie is an awful place to watch football