Peace – Not War

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Peace – Not War

We normally don’t talk about on-field stuff on SFM, but given the over-optimistic coverage of the prospects of TRFC (particularly in the ESJ © The Clumpany  and DR) it is worth noting that since they beat Celtic on penalties in last year’s Scottish Cup semi final, they have played in four huge games which were real barometers of progress ;

  • Hibs in the Scottish Cup Final: 2-3
  • Celtic in the Premiership: 1-5
  • Aberdeen in the Premiership: 1-2
  • Celtic in the League Cup Semi-Final: 0-1

On each occasion, they have failed the test, not only by failing to get a result, but by being second best in most on-field departments.

The point is not one of wider Schadenfreude, or even an in-depth critique of the abilities of the team or manager, but of how the TRFC board and the MSM, in falsely inflating their side’s prospects, do a disservice to TRFC fans. Aided and abetted it seems by the manager who – even allowing for the positive spin managers need to put on things post defeat – is refusing to accept reality.

We often talk about turnover as the yardstick by which performance can be (roughly) measured. If that were the only yardstick, one would expect TRFC to be right up there with Celtic. But it is more complicated than that. For Celtic and TRFC, there are massive overheads (e.g. stadium costs) that have to be dealt with and taken out of the equation before Glasgow apples can be compared with Aberdeen and Edinburgh varieties.

Even allowing for that it seems pretty clear to me that TRFC have more disposable income (for spending on players and contracts) than Hearts or Aberdeen for example, but the gap is now not as great as raw turnover figures would suggest  – and the margins are probably slim enough that they can be easily blurred by managers at other clubs who have a good grasp of tactics, an eye for a player, and a proper understanding of football psychology.

To compound the problem for TRFC, there are two rather large eggs in the TRFC transfer basket which are now cracked or broken.  A dangerous waste of resources in fact. Whether it was Warburton or King who went to the market for Barton and Kranjčar is irrelevant. More relevant is the reason marquee signings like these were made.

Once a manager is recruited, you stay out of his domain

Yes, Barton’s signature in particular has used a huge chunk of the already scant budget, and that is a real blow to the manager’s planning, but the real problem is that the club has deliberately pushed fan expectations skyward, all of which is counter-intuitive given the rough calculations in the preceding paragraphs. More worryingly for Rangers fans, the board’s own expectations for the playing side are unrealistically high – and given the business expertise contained therein, puzzlingly so.

TRFC is a focal point for tens of thousands of people. The people who run the club are also influential opinion formers and how they set the tone for those thousands is important.

Tub-rattling, dog-whistling, and the WATP mentality have been employed almost exclusively thus far in the ‘journey’. All of which may have rallied the troops and provided a welcome injection of funds, but it also antagonised almost every football fan in the country who wasn’t a Rangers follower. And in view of how those funds (including the £21m IPO) seemingly disappeared into the ether, did it really help the club realise any ambitions going forward?

TRFC are looking up at the north face of a financial Eiger today

I can’t help feeling that had they been replaced with humility, some regret, and gratitude to those who smoothed their path into the leagues, then the view from the club deck would a lot more attractive today than it is.

The journey could have been an expansive one bent on winning friends along the way, clearly differentiating itself from the Murray era, and carrying assurances that the new Rangers would never treat the game in Scotland as shabbily as its predecessor.

Seems intuitively obvious to me that a mission statement like the following would win hearts and minds;

“The latter-day custodians of Rangers have destroyed our club and shamed its traditions of sporting integrity, fair play, and honest endeavour.

“However the ethos and identity of our club will not be allowed to slip into obscurity.

“We will build a club worthy of the traditions of sporting integrity and fair play. It will be open and accessible to people of all colours, creeds and nationalities,

“It will be a long journey, but it is one which we relish, and one which will in time restore Rangers to the upper echelons of the game“

Managing expectations realistically with a ‘we are thankful to keep the Rangers name alive’ would have played better with the bears.

I don’t believe there is a football fan in the world who wouldn’t sign up to that had they found their club in the same circumstances as 2011 Rangers. I don’t believe that Rangers fans are any different either, but the problem is that their moral compass is being calibrated by people whose past records make them least qualified for the task.

Instead of a plan to win Scottish football over, we got boycotts, victim-hood, denial, and that wonderful new oxymoronic idiom, post-liquidation. Really though, it should all have been so different.

Water bills notwithstanding, TRFC are looking up at the north face of a financial Eiger today, but they chose to climb an Eiger instead of a Munro, and they sold false hope and snake oil to the fans on the way.

They have no money with which to recruit players of sufficient quality to challenge at the top. They are facing a massive bill for repairs and maintenance of a stadium that has atrophied under six or seven years of neglect. They have similar infrastructure problems at their training ground. They need to build a scouting infrastructure which currently consists of one man and several local volunteers. Their income from merchandising is non-existent due to a testicles-drawn dispute with Sports Direct. They owe several millions of pounds of soft loans which they cannot convert to equity because of that same dispute, and the people they have gone back to again and again for top-up finance have ever shortening arms and lengthening pockets.

.. we understand the value that Rangers can bring to the to the Scottish game and we want it to be realised.

Miracles of course do happen, perhaps in the shape of a magician manager who can get them access to European cash almost immediately. Unless that comes to pass, there is no way forward for Dave King and his board, other than to make peace immediately with Sports Direct and actually stump up the cash he promised two years ago; cash he promised to bridge the resources gap which is widening by the week.

A widely accepted wisdom in many football boardrooms these days is that the main recruitment priority of any board is an excellent manager. A really good manager can make a team out of ordinary players, but a poor manager will have difficulty sculpting a winning side from even very good players.  So in a club with limited resources, it makes sense to spend a major part of your budget on a very good manager.

Another widely accepted wisdom in boardrooms (even if not always followed) is that once a manager is recruited, you stay out of his domain.

The boardroom at Ibrox is not awash with wisdom it seems. First of all they put their faith in a manager with little or no experience in the game. That may well have worked out with a bit of good fortune, but does anyone really believe, after his disappearing act in the wake of the Cup Final defeat and his absence at the Barton signing conference, that Mark Warburton is master of his own domain?

If not, does the ‘come hither’ curled finger of fate attached to Jimmy Traynor’s hand at last week’s press conference convince you?

I would guess that there are at least half a dozen experienced managers with a track record of success who would relish the challenge of putting TRFC on the map at the opportunity cost of a Barton for example. Instead it seems – if the rumours are true – that Warburton’s autonomy was breached so that said Joey could be hired to boost ST sales.

No group of fans is entitled to expect success. Rangers fans, and Celtic fans, have historically come to expect that very thing. It is understandable to some extent, but it should never be confused with an actual entitlement to success – and that is what the board at Ibrox are selling to the fans in return for their cash – which as we have seen is not being converted to the promised on-field successes.

the ‘come hither’ curled finger of fate attached to Jimmy Traynor’s hand should convince us that Warburton is not his own master

To a large extent, I think some of the online comments in fan sites in the wake of the Celtic match have been sensible and mature. Reality amongst Rangers fans is at last beginning to bite, and that can only be a good thing for TRFC. Rangers fans are beginning to understand that too many liberties have been taken with their loyalty to and love of the jersey. The problem for the fans is that whilst they come to terms with what may be a realistic timetable and roadmap towards success and parity with the top clubs, the current board and their chums in the press are invested in having them believe the opposite.

Already the cheerleaders in the red tops are proclaiming their ‘gulf-denial’ credentials in the hope that enough fans will be convinced of it. The problem is that the fans know the gulf exists – and not only that does exist, but it is unrealistic to expect it not to.

The Level5 effect is wearing off. In the past five years, £21m quid in investment, £6m in loans, and five years worth of ST sales have all come and gone. Will Rangers fans really do those sums, observe that in each of the four milestone matches mentioned at the beginning of this article there is nothing to show for it, and agree that there is nothing to concern them?

Rangers fans will no doubt call us obsessed to produce an article like this – about them. But football is uniquely interdependent – we all need each other. It is a game where we benefit from the traditions, the colour and the fanaticism of rivals. The fact is that we understand the value that Rangers can bring to the to the Scottish game and we want it to be realised.

Sadly though, the current people in charge at the club are people who revel in making war on fellow clubs and business partners as well as the national broadcaster and BT Sport. They have also failed to deliver on promises of investment and success to their own fans, and escaped press scrutiny of that failure. Whilst they are there, we see only division in Scottish football with no coming together possible for generations.

I believe that the vast majority of fans who love Rangers, like the rest of us, have had enough of a war on too many fronts to count. It’s time to make peace – with everyone. Football in this country can’t be fixed until that happens.

About the author

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Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

1,368 Comments so far

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easyJamboPosted on4:53 pm - Nov 23, 2016


The Record story describes Somers as acting for both TRFC and RRL in the deal.  Whether or not the deal was fair to both parties it may depend on what else was in the agreement, e.g. who pays the rates, maintenance, insurance utilities etc.?

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John ClarkPosted on4:56 pm - Nov 23, 2016


The bit of the lease that was copied  at the end of Radar’s article has  ” Duration of lease 120
                                                                                                                     Rent 1       
Seems very imprecise, for a legal document, surely? 120 what’s – days, weeks, months , years..?
 and 1 what?  ..penny, pound, hundred pounds, thiusand pounds, million pounds?
Anybody know anything about the quality of legal minds at Brodies LLP?   03

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wottpiPosted on6:32 pm - Nov 23, 2016


Re the Superstore rent.

Once again we are missing the woods for the trees.

Like anyone one in the financial mire who has to rely on money lenders, exorbitant HP agreements, higher energy tariffs (possibly on a card) etc,  RIFC Plc were always going to be in a position where they were required to enter into deals and terms that others would have steered clear off.

They have always been, to use that now well worn phrase, a loss making business with no line of credit from the banks.

If you down want to get eaten alive then don’t swim with sharks. However if you have to go into such waters you better be prepared to swim like feck and take the consequences.

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on7:56 pm - Nov 23, 2016


BORDERSDON
NOVEMBER 23, 2016 at 16:32
================================

I can assure you that one thing I will not argue with him about is rental value, particularly as it relates to sporting venues.

I just thought the very specific nature of the deal, one party being a football club with the shop to rent and the other specialising in merchandising sport gear with all of the expertise and contacts in that area may have led them to come to an agreement where the actual rent paid was in effect a side issue. The two parties bringing different things to the deal. Particularly if it was going to be a joint venture between the two which would actually be operating from the shop.

If it is in reality a sports direct outlet, going by a different name then that puts a totally different complexion on it, in my opinion.

Always happy to learn.

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bfbpuzzledPosted on8:58 pm - Nov 23, 2016


The full details of any lease need to be known before passing sensible comment on a rent. It might be possible, given the type of location, use and a potential symbiotic relationship between the parties, that there is a turnover rent in addition to the £1. This would involve a percentage of the turnover being paid To the Landlord with a deminimis bottom figure.
There are other reasons why a peppercorn rent might be used for instance if the tenant carries our capital works to the building from which the Landlord benefits in the future. That is a strong possibility here if the building been as well maintained as the rest of the estate. Indeed the £1 might well overstate the value in such situations- and it would not be the first time that £1 has been too much to pay for something down Ibrox way
With the above kind of possibilities being in play, coverage of the headline £1 figure by the DR and at least on the STV news has been irresponsible at best and dangerous at worst. There are many potential unknowns as well as known unknowns.
Enough speculation from me back to my book.

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jimboPosted on10:07 pm - Nov 23, 2016


See wee Messi if I hear him telling everyone how much he loves Celtic07070707

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gunnerbPosted on10:24 pm - Nov 23, 2016


Coming up to that time of goodwill.blah blah blah. Just purchased two pieces of crockery for friends of mine who need some enlightement. Just to point out the merchandise is there and supports the site. Dont forget the appeal for The Holyrood Boxing Gym and Codys Xmas Toy Box . https://www.justgiving.com/crowdfunding/codystoybox. I realise that this time of year places many demands on the purse but it is easy to overlook the small deserving cause on our own doorstep.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on1:23 am - Nov 24, 2016


Uncle Mick provided much needed funds, in what was a much heralded interest free loan, although it is hard to escape the appearance of what seems like “Terms and Conditions. 
   He demanded, and through the courts, was granted confidentiality of these T & C’s. 
   Does anybody know the T & C’s of the current lenders “Interest free loans”?….Have they demanded confidentiality?
If so, why so?
People in glass houses etc.

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John ClarkPosted on10:21 am - Nov 24, 2016


jimboNovember 23, 2016 at 22:07
”  See wee Messi……”
_________
Quite unrelated to last night’s game, I enjoyed a little bit of schadenfreude earlier yesterday when I
a) heard the Chancellor say the government will be introducing ‘penalties’  for people ( perhaps like struck-off lawyers-turned- porno film actors?) who devise tax avoidance measures which  HMRC subsequently successfuly challenge in the Courts.
b) heard that Neymar will( apparently) stand trial on corruption charges, facing, if convicted, a two year prison sentence and an eight and a half million pounds fine.
c) heard that the SFA will be … [ naw, I just made that yin up! But I live in hope…]

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coatbridgeloyaltycadPosted on11:31 am - Nov 24, 2016


Corrupt officialNovember 24, 2016 at 01:23 Uncle Mick provided much needed funds, in what was a much heralded interest free loan, although it is hard to escape the appearance of what seems like “Terms and Conditions.     He demanded, and through the courts, was granted confidentiality of these T & C’s.     Does anybody know the T & C’s of the current lenders “Interest free loans”?….Have they demanded confidentiality
=============
Confidentiality ?  The RRM board was elected on a pledge of openness and transparency, why would there be a need for confidentiality ?

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scottc

scottcPosted on1:13 pm - Nov 24, 2016


BFBPUZZLEDNOVEMBER 23, 2016 at 20:58 There are other reasons why a peppercorn rent might be used for instance if the tenant carries our capital works to the building from which the Landlord benefits in the future. That is a strong possibility here if the building been as well maintained as the rest of the estate. Indeed the £1 might well overstate the value in such situations- and it would not be the first time that £1 has been too much to pay for something down Ibrox way

Indeed BFB. Was there not, in fact, during the time of the great water scandal, some reference to the Superstore refurbishment? I seem to recall that from one of the comments at the time. Perhaps SD paid for that.

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theravenPosted on1:46 pm - Nov 24, 2016


I’ve never been in the Rangers Superstore, but I do find it hard to believe that it operates like a Sports Direct shop selling Celtic and other teams merchandise!

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Pat ByrnePosted on5:54 pm - Nov 24, 2016


Traynor having his latest rant, well it is thanksgiving afterall

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on7:25 pm - Nov 24, 2016


Not the usual type of output from the SMSM, but then again it was not in the sports pages.
The ibrox club. (no mention of a company) had used the disguised remuneration avoidance technicality to evade tax and national insurance payments for top players and staff.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on7:42 pm - Nov 24, 2016


sorry tried to post pic. so here is full article’
Thursday 24 2016.Gers tax ploy axed.
The tax dodge loophole which landed Rangers in a multi-million pound HMRC prosecution was outlawed in Autumn statement.
Chancellor philip Hammond described the schemes as “clear examples of contrived avoidance”.
 The ibrox club had used the disguised remuneration Avoidance technicality to evade tax and national insurance payments for top players and staff.
And last year rangers lost “The Big Tax Case” to HMRC in a final appeal to the court of session. That case could be heard again in the UK supreme court but the loophole has been closed for similar schemes in future starting from April.
A Treasury spokesman said “it’s not possible to avoid paying tax on or national insurance on earnings”.

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PortbhoyPosted on8:43 pm - Nov 24, 2016


Raven, … near meltdown a couple o’ years ago. 12
THERAVENNOVEMBER 24, 2016 at 13:46 I’ve never been in the Rangers Superstore, but I do find it hard to believe that it operates like a Sports Direct shop selling Celtic and other teams merchandise!

http://i2.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article2364372.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/Rangers-Megastore-Celtic-duck.jpg

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on9:23 pm - Nov 24, 2016


Using EBTs incorrectly in order to reduce your tax was never a “loophole” it was classic tax avoidance.

Tax avoidance is not and never has been perfectly acceptable as some people would have you believe. That is tax management.

Tax avoidance is using a legitimate scheme, incorrectly, for a purpose which was never intended.

Investing in an ISA is tax management.

Using an EBT to receive contractual payments is tax avoidance.

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jimboPosted on10:04 pm - Nov 24, 2016


You are right I reckon but until the Supreme Court issues it’s verdict nothing can be taken for granted.

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John ClarkPosted on10:20 pm - Nov 24, 2016


From the ‘Herald’ 23 hours ago: Chris Jack [reporting on what ‘football finance expert’ Alan Pattullo had to say about TRFC finances ahead of tomorrow’s AGM] has this to say:

“….as chairman Dave King outlines his plans for the future and seeks approval to hold a fresh share issue to raise funds. More than £10million has already been handed over by King, Douglas Park and a handful of well-off supporters as part of deals that will see their loans transferred into shares”

Now, is that not the very essence of journalistic chicanery?

It clearly implies that King and co will somehow inject NEW funds into the club by simply being repaid their loans in shares, and does not   mention  the fact that club1872’s ( and all shareholders’ shares) will be reduced in value.

Jack is either a very ignorant man or something less ( in true SMSM style) than a proper journalist.

I have no reason to think he is ignorant.

And if Ashley, in the event that the shareholders blindly and foolishly pass the Resolution on disapplication, does not seek an injunction to have that Resolution frozen and challenged in Court as an outrageous piece of Directorial self-interest at the expense of the club and the general run of shareholders then he is more of a fool than the gullible small shareholders.
In my opinion.

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goosygoosyPosted on11:20 pm - Nov 24, 2016


BBC
Aberdeen left-back Graeme Shinnie reveals that he will be wearing his lucky pink and white boxer shorts on Sunday ahead of his team’s Betfred Cup final against Celtic.(Scotsman)
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Dearie Me
Is this what passes for football journalism nowadays?

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jimboPosted on11:21 pm - Nov 24, 2016


Loans transferred into shares?  In the name of the wee man who would want that?

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jimboPosted on11:32 pm - Nov 24, 2016


GoosyGoosy,

I quite like Aberdeen and I know Shinnie is talking tongue in cheek. But his under garments will be no help when we thrash them in the final. 0402

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John ClarkPosted on12:27 am - Nov 25, 2016


jimboNovember 24, 2016 at 23:21
‘..Loans transferred into shares?  In the name of the wee man who would want that?’
_______
Why, none other than someone who wants to make damn sure that he and his henchmen have control over what happens.
In so far as there may be money to be made out TRFC , whether as any kind of ‘successful’ newish club or as an administration wreck, it is important to be in there with significant shareholdigs.
Ask any South Africa based chap fae castlemilk!
Or, indeed, any son of a decent City of Glasgow polisman.

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John ClarkPosted on12:35 am - Nov 25, 2016


goosygoosyNovember 24, 2016 at 23:20
‘…Dearie MeIs this what passes for football journalism nowadays?’
___________
Ah, the good old BBC Radio4  has a very particular, very emphasised, liking for pink, I find.While good old BBC Radio Scotland has  a particular, very emphasised , liking for succulent lamb.
Me, myself,personally, watching Master feckinchef, am not too keen on pink succulent lamb.

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upthehoopsPosted on7:11 am - Nov 25, 2016


My predictions for today’s Rangers AGM.

1. The club is in a fantastic financial position with no external debt and very wealthy backers. 
2. There are no significant repairs required to the stadium. 
3. WHEN they reach the Champions League group stage they will go one better than Celtic and compete. 
4. The SFA handled the Cup Final pitch invasion disgracefully. 
5. They will not tolerate any form of poor coverage by the media whatsoever. 
6. They can’t discuss issues like Resolution 12 but nothing whatsoever will impact on this clubs great history, no matter what. The big tax case is nothing to do with them, despite it affecting the history they claim they own. 
7. Hibs and Celtic may be the subject of some snide remarks to much applause and laughter. 
8. The media will not challenge a word of it, even when THEY are being criticised. 
9. …and they all lived happily ever after. 

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SmugasPosted on7:27 am - Nov 25, 2016


…..at a cost (to them) of between £1-3 million per annum.  And if they can do that without our contribution and they don’t automatically feel entitled to win as a result then good on them.

Historical inconsistencies like LNS, the BTC and the 2011 Euro licence notwithstanding of course.

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rougvielovesthejunglePosted on8:38 am - Nov 25, 2016


Well I’ve just wished my RIFC supporting neighbour a Happy AGM Day 2016.

With due tributes to Mark Daly’s excellent journalism of 2011, I’ve also pointed out that in time, today will most likely become known as the day Dave King sold the new clubs jerseys.

An exceedingly Black Friday for the 4 year old clumpany!

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John ClarkPosted on10:36 am - Nov 25, 2016


upthehoopsNovember 25, 2016 at 07:11
“9. …and they all lived happily ever after.”
SmugasNovember 25, 2016 at 07:27
“..at a cost (to them) of between £1-3 million per annum. And if they can do that without our contribution..”
_____________
But fear not!
The 4-year-old club will get a bob or two from the friendly with RB Leipzig in January, and, the rumour mill grinds out, a lucrative sponsorship deal from the owners of that 7-year-old club, none other than Red Bulls.it.  Possibly even a buy-in!

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goosygoosyPosted on11:18 am - Nov 25, 2016


JOHN CLARKNOVEMBER 24, 2016 at 22:20   From the ‘Herald’ 23 hours ago: Chris Jack [reporting on what ‘football finance expert’ Alan Pattullo had to say about TRFC finances ahead of tomorrow’s AGM]
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
If you google
 ‘football finance expert’ Alan Pattullo
the words
“finance expert”
are crossed out by google

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bluPosted on11:46 am - Nov 25, 2016


GOOSYGOOSYNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 11:18

Ken Pattullo, a Managing Partner at Begbies Traynor, oversaw a survey of the financial health of Scottish clubs last year and believes wealthy fans will once again have to stump up.

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SmugasPosted on12:04 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Now we know the limitations of our journalists ‘hand-picked’ to cover the Rangers AGM (courtesy of the Herald) and equally we should accept the limitations of tweet journalism 140 characters at a time.  That said I can’t help but note these two nuggets:

Oops. And Andy Newport?!? just posted a short clip of Dave blanking reporters. And although the image is fuzzy isn’t that a familiar bald head and pointy finger following him?

Chris Jack: “Dave King says board would be open to investment from other parties and board will spend more than they are making to get club back to where they want to be.”Have to be mindful of shareholders that are not supporters of the club.”

And

Chris Jack: “King says business plan completely independent from funding plan.”

 

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John ClarkPosted on12:16 pm - Nov 25, 2016


SmugasNovember 25, 2016 at 12:04
‘…Chris Jack: “King says business plan completely independent from funding plan.” 
_________
Isn’t there some kind of necesssary relationship between planning your business and having some idea of where your funding is coming from?
Is King talking absolute garbage, but less colourfully than a Charles Green?

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SmugasPosted on12:25 pm - Nov 25, 2016


JC

If you put “Being mindful of non fan shareholders and having an independent business plan” into google translate it comes back with “akin to throwing good money after bad – be particularly wary in situations where a sense of entitlement and false expectation prevails.”

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The Cat NR1

The Cat NR1Posted on12:52 pm - Nov 25, 2016


In their parallel universe it is possible to separate club and company, so why not business plan and funding plan?
I’m sure the SFA are taking note. 21
===========================
John ClarkNovember 25, 2016 at 12:16   3 Votes 
SmugasNovember 25, 2016 at 12:04 ‘…Chris Jack: “King says business plan completely independent from funding plan.”  _________ Isn’t there some kind of necesssary relationship between planning your business and having some idea of where your funding is coming from? Is King talking absolute garbage, but less colourfully than a Charles Green?

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The Cat NR1

The Cat NR1Posted on1:06 pm - Nov 25, 2016


John Clark
November 25, 2016 at 10:365 Votes 
upthehoopsNovember 25, 2016 at 07:11 “9. …and they all lived happily ever after.” SmugasNovember 25, 2016 at 07:27 “..at a cost (to them) of between £1-3 million per annum. And if they can do that without our contribution..” _____________ But fear not! The 4-year-old club will get a bob or two from the friendly with RB Leipzig in January, and, the rumour mill grinds out, a lucrative sponsorship deal from the owners of that 7-year-old club, none other than Red Bulls.it.  Possibly even a buy-in!
============================================================
Would they bring out a special OrangeBull to mark the occasion?
 
500M potential worldwide customers could generate a huge turnover, and with the club/company/engine room subsidiary getting 1p cashback for every 1,000,000 unit sales of OrangeBull that could solve the funding plan (or is it business plan?) gap almost overnight.
 
I’m sure Neil Patey would confirm that to be the case.

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PortbhoyPosted on1:35 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Did the 12co. turkeys vote for an early Christmas ???

Shoorly no’ !!!

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The Cat NR1

The Cat NR1Posted on1:55 pm - Nov 25, 2016


HomunculusNovember 24, 2016 at 21:2328 Votes 
Using EBTs incorrectly in order to reduce your tax was never a “loophole” it was classic tax avoidance.
Tax avoidance is not and never has been perfectly acceptable as some people would have you believe. That is tax management.
Tax avoidance is using a legitimate scheme, incorrectly, for a purpose which was never intended.
Investing in an ISA is tax management.
Using an EBT to receive contractual payments is tax avoidance.
====================================
That’s heading into tax evasion territory.

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PortbhoyPosted on2:30 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Mark Warburton at this morning’s a.g.m., 
The Rangers (?) remain the biggest club in Scottish football”, 
https://youtu.be/tW7x4uDg8Cg

I doubt it.   21

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on2:41 pm - Nov 25, 2016


PORTBHOYNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 14:30
Mark Warburton at this morning’s a.g.m., The Rangers (?) remain the biggest club in Scottish football”,
    ———————————————————————————–
  Biggest club, with the 2nd biggest stadium, 2nd biggest ST sales, 2nd biggest turnover, and 2nd rate players…………
I can see his point.  But only when I wear my Stevie Wonder glasses. 20

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PortbhoyPosted on3:02 pm - Nov 25, 2016


dave king, …  post a.g.m. interview an hour ago.

https://youtu.be/x87zaZw_Ev4
 mmmmmmmmm !

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on3:06 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Re: the ‘Red Bull investment’ spin in the SMSM from Level42.

Actually there are some shared values with TRFC;

A nasty product which is over-hyped, over-promoted…and leaves many observers wondering why they have any customers at all…and leaves a bad taste in your mouth !

But to be fair, Red Bullsh!t, [(c) JC], is marginally more believable than a tie-in with Apple or Dallas Cowboys.   09

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torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958)Posted on3:06 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Afternoon all.
It seems this mornings RIFC AGM can be summed up as follows:
1. It’s Ashleys Fault.
2.We’re skint.
3.We’ll need to borrow more for the forseeable future.
No word on Res 11 with result of the vote to be announced next week.I’d have thought by now the RIFC board would have an idea of how things stand.They did say that the Ashley/Easdale alliance would not be supporting the resolution.Same old stuff about “getting back where we belong”,challenging CFC & competing in Europe.No one explained how admitting that borrowing will need to continue for seasons to come sits with UEFA & their FFP regulations.I’m sure the SFA are on this as we speak.
No real sign of drum beating,though.FWIW.the directors looked broken when boarding the bus when leaving the Armadillo.They couldn’t look anyone in the eye.No statements,smiles etc.Mark Warburton even had a “minder” when being interviewed.
Normally,reading between the lines I’d have said they’ve lost Res 11 but with most things RIFC/TRFC,you just don’t know.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on3:34 pm - Nov 25, 2016


TORREJOHNBHOY(@JOHNBHOY1958)NOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 15:06
     “No word on Res 11 with result of the vote to be announced next week.I’d have thought by now the RIFC board would have an idea of how things stand.They did say that the Ashley/Easdale alliance would not be supporting the resolution”
   ———————————————————————————————————————————–
   TJB,. They did say they met recently to try to persuade the potential vote blockers. Below is what Phil says about that meeting…. I suppose the difficulty they face is how do you buy the appeasement of a man who has everything, and the financial wherewithal to resort to the courts for what he feels is his.  What do they have to offer, other than a skelly eyed heid on a stick?
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/squirrels-and-white-flags/

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wottpiPosted on4:23 pm - Nov 25, 2016


CORRUPT OFFICIALNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 15:34

Ashley may be looking after his own patch and perhaps seeking to shame DCK at the same time but I for one would not be putting any money of a nuclear result next week.

Frankly, we have hear all this talk of ‘tanks on the lawn’ before and the last time General Ashley went to court his lawyers appeared to make a total arse of things. IMHO from the reporting allowed it looked like amateur hour.

If you are going to go up against a guy who knows how the keep the SA tax authorities and courts running around for years you better come with your ‘A Game’. 
 
It really is down to who is the slippier of the snake oil salesmen and to be honest he and DCK (albeit it is acknowledged the latter is a convicted tax dodger) are probably as bad as each other.

As an aside re the post AGM interview it is interesting DCK saying this time next year he expects T’Rangers to be in Europe.

He better have more cash in the wings because the current squad may not make it past the qualifiers even if they do bag a Euro slot.

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campsiejoePosted on4:24 pm - Nov 25, 2016


PORTBHOYNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 15:02
The man is a fantasist
He can’t fund the current operation, but is talking about a massive stadium refurb
When will they waken up

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on6:22 pm - Nov 25, 2016


PORTBHOY
NOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 14:30
============================

One if forced to wonder what he bases such a claim on.

League Position?

Number of Season Tickets Sold?

Quality of Squad?

Turnover?

Profit?

Market Capitalisation?

Credit Worthiness?

Sponsors?

It really is difficult to think of any area where The Rangers can claim to be the biggest club in Scottish football. In fact it’s actually an embarrassing claim for someone to make. He must be sitting tonight cringing. 

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on6:23 pm - Nov 25, 2016


WOTTPINOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 16:23

   “Ashley may be looking after his own patch and perhaps seeking to shame DCK at the same time but I for one would not be putting any money of a nuclear result next week.” 
    ——————————————————————————————————————————–
   If I am honest, I would say that I don’t know what to expect next week in court, but if I have discovered anything over the past couple of years, it is that cans are often booted down the road. 
   I think that would be the least surprising outcome. But I have no specialist knowledge other than playing the averages.  
  I don’t see anyway for Sevco to “nice” their way out of it. In fact with boycotts and PR they have shown the opposite, and I don’t see they will negotiate (out of court) Uncle Mick to accept less than what he considers his due, so its game on.      

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jimboPosted on6:25 pm - Nov 25, 2016


At the Celtic AGM, PL spoke of major developments at Celtic Park.  Now that is a goer.  04  Sorry, not trying to gloat.  02

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Carfins FinestPosted on6:32 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Change of subject and sorry if it has been covered but did Celtic FC Have their meeting this week with the Res 12 guys as promised?

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Carfins FinestPosted on6:37 pm - Nov 25, 2016


….did a TRFC Shareholder actually tell the AGM that he was not prepared to attend away games to ensure that the opposition does not benefit financially from matchday visits from his Club/Company? Starnge, if true, that these shareholders are more interested in the financial health of their opponents more than their own. Some may say ‘Obsessed’ not to mention missing the whole sporting challenge mindset.

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Carfins FinestPosted on6:53 pm - Nov 25, 2016


The old Rangers FC, with regular Champions League income still managed to lose over £60 million. Why would anyone think that Sevco reaching any sort of European Football would be the holy grail? The cure all? Why will these people, who all seem reasonably well educated, not see the parallels between what killed off Rangers FC and their current batshit crazy plan.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on6:59 pm - Nov 25, 2016


WOTTPINOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 16:23
As an aside re the post AGM interview it is interesting DCK saying this time next year he expects T’Rangers to be in Europe.
——————————
And then he was asked what if those expectations are not met…..what! he was not asked.
———————————–
CARFINS FINESTNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 18:32       2 Votes 
Change of subject and sorry if it has been covered but did Celtic FC Have their meeting this week with the Res 12 guys as promised?
——————
from what i could gather. meeting held and more meetings in early Dec.
both parties trying to find time to arrange meetings. @Auldheid may have more details,as i think that is were i read it

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AuldheidPosted on7:08 pm - Nov 25, 2016


CLUSTER ONENOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 18:59
There was a one to  one last week  mainly on process.  Full meeting in December.

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Carfins FinestPosted on7:18 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Cluster OneNovember 25, 2016 at 18:59
AuldheidNovember 25, 2016 at 19:08
==========
Thankyou.
 

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on8:05 pm - Nov 25, 2016


AULDHEIDNOVEMBER 25, 2016 at 19:08
thanks, i thought i remembered it was information from yourself i had read

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fan of footballPosted on8:05 pm - Nov 25, 2016


So the AGM 
IMO all does not seem well at the newest club in Scottish football .
all talk of getting European football with the manager pleading for time for young players to come through .
Looks to me like there are some bills that will need paying and by the look on the faces at the top table ,they will need paying very soon 
Club 1872 the balls now in your court 
all the best 

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Cygnus X-1Posted on8:58 pm - Nov 25, 2016


The RIFC AGM today, was another event, of such staggering incredulity, that has left me bewildered & amazed. How can King & Co get away with such palpable, risible nonsense? Where are the sane, rational supporters? Do they exist? Have they all been neutered?
Across various platforms, during today’s meeting, King makes any number of contradictory & nonsensical statements. They were highlighted on Twitter & other places, and yet where is the questioning & challenging of this mince?
Where are the existing shareholders, what do they think of this rubbish? Clearly, no one in the SMSM will raise their heads above the parapet, but it seems( to me) that the collective amnesia, denial and sleepwalking will lead to another certain administration event, because NO business can sustain indefinitely, more money going out the backdoor, than is coming in through the front.
And of course, it could all have been so different……       

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SouthernExilePosted on9:15 pm - Nov 25, 2016


Two cheers for a football administrator, chairman of the FA Greg Clarke. 
Disclaimer: I know the guy a bit, in his earlier corporate life he was my boss’s boss for a few years. He was chairman of Leicester City at the time and used to hold their board meetings in our offices. He is a no nonsense guy who you wouldn’t want to get on the wrong side of. 
In his first few months he has had to deal with the Allardyce fiasco (out on his ear) and now the evolving sex abuse scandal. I hope and think he will respond well. 
Thank goodness we have men of equivalent stature in the SFA. 

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on11:04 pm - Nov 25, 2016


A good spot from @cartuja today

https://twitter.com/cartujakds/status/802133687798296576

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jimboPosted on1:31 am - Nov 26, 2016


Stevie BC,  I think your the only American poster on here.  I love Rodgers & Hammerstein.  Would love to post You will never walk alone but not sure I would get past moderation.  So, instead, this is for you mate.  It’s brilliant and from London of all places!

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jimboPosted on1:36 am - Nov 26, 2016


Sorry this is what I meant to post.  John C will like this. A man of class.

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wottpiPosted on8:16 am - Nov 26, 2016


Joel Sked at the Scotsman clearly didn’t get the Level 5 memo.

Refreshing stuff.

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/six-curious-statements-from-the-rangers-agm-1-4301072

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Carfins FinestPosted on9:13 am - Nov 26, 2016


STV;s Raman Bardwaj was very unhappy yesterday after being reprimanded by James Traynor for asking a question re resolution 11 as King and Co were heading for their escape pod…sorry Minibus. A clip posted on Facebook/Twitter by Cartuja clearly shows in the reflection of the minibus window Traynor having words with Bardwaj and the latter walking away with the sort of look you had when yer mammy skelped yer ear.

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Cluster One

Cluster OnePosted on10:18 am - Nov 26, 2016


WOTTPINOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 08:16       7 Votes 
Joel Sked at the Scotsman clearly didn’t get the Level 5 memo.
Refreshing stuff.
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/teams/rangers/six-curious-statements-from-the-rangers-agm-1-4301072
—————————-
In front of 700 fans…..
I’m sure i read somewhere 5000.anyone got a figure?
was it not MW saying i have to stand in front of 5000?

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on10:19 am - Nov 26, 2016


“We have to spend more than we currently make for a number of years to get club back to where it belongs,”

That is exactly the sort of mentality and attitude that Financial Fair Play rules were brought in to fight.

It doesn’t even make sense, if you are having to spend more than you earn how is that you being where you belong. 

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John ClarkPosted on10:36 am - Nov 26, 2016


Carfins FinestNovember 26, 2016 at 09:13
‘…Traynor having words with Bardwaj and the latter walking away with the sort of look you had when yer mammy skelped yer ear.’
_________
 I give him credit for at least trying to ask a question, but it  was  a bit disturbing, to see how meekly Bardwaj almost slunk away.
Is it just me? or wouldn’t  the rest of you also have been inclined to tell the blustering fool of bully that you would ask any damned question you pleased, with or without his ‘permission’?
It makes me wonder Just how  dependent on that club  these guys  are, and not  just for succulent lamb  but for their daily bread and butter?
Having to kow-tow to a character like Traynor ( or to some ar.sehole of an editor who would require me to do so) would not at all sit well with me.

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Carfins FinestPosted on11:00 am - Nov 26, 2016


John ClarkNovember 26, 2016 at 10:36
========
John. I believe Raman like most other so called journalist are shoot scared of this egomaniac bully because of threats to cut off the supply of printable shoot released regularly to them from level 5. Have no idea why as this charade is way past its sell by date. Is there any way back for these so called journalists? I fear not. They will disappear when the current entity playing out of Ibrox shuffles off its mortal coil.
 

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upthehoopsPosted on11:56 am - Nov 26, 2016


HOMUNCULUSNOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 10:19  
“We have to spend more than we currently make for a number of years to get club back to where it belongs,”
That is exactly the sort of mentality and attitude that Financial Fair Play rules were brought in to fight.
It doesn’t even make sense, if you are having to spend more than you earn how is that you being where you belong. 

==========================

Yet so far not one single member of the media has dared raise the issue of whether they actually qualify for a licence.

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goosygoosyPosted on12:01 pm - Nov 26, 2016


HOMUNCULUS
NOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 10:19
“We have to spend more than we currently make for a number of years to get club back to where it belongs,”
That is exactly the sort of mentality and attitude that Financial Fair Play rules were brought in to fight.
It doesn’t even make sense, if you are having to spend more than you earn how is that you being where you belong. 
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
To someone who owns companies that illegally spent other peoples money for decades that makes perfect sense. He made himself very wealthy doing it
King was also Director of a football club that illegally spent a lot of other peoples money before it was liquidated
He is now saying that TRFC belong in a similar place
i.e.
Spend as much of other peoples money you can get your hands on
Ignore the consequences
Wait on the law catching up with you

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on12:02 pm - Nov 26, 2016


UPTHEHOOPS
NOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 11:56
==================================

If they end up in a league position which earns a European place I think the SFA will grant them it, at their discretion.

They will stick two fingers up to all of the clubs living within their means, in particular the fourth place club which actually deserves to play in European competition.

I do not think the SFA would even consider doing anything else. Too much chance of civil unrest.

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FinlochPosted on12:40 pm - Nov 26, 2016


If I didn’t know better I would think that Messrs Cosgrove and Cowan had been briefed by someone unknown to help rally the Rangers fans into a total boycott of Sports Direct’s Ibrox superstore.
Quite amazing for a national broadcaster to allow such a commercially biased, one-sided diatribe.
Talking the whole Ashley side down in a clever, pretendy even-handed, but in reality quite denigrating way, and never mentioning the fact that minimum quantities and guaranteed prices for unsold stock might be the kind of contractual detail that professional retailer/producers would have buttoned down.

Really disturbing radio even from a channel whose Scottish Football editorial bias bends over so backwards for its favourite club.

Quite disgraceful guys.

Really disgraceful.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on12:44 pm - Nov 26, 2016


CARFINS FINESTNOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 11:00
John ClarkNovember 26, 2016 at 10:36========John. I believe Raman like most other so called journalist are shoot scared of this egomaniac bully because of threats to cut off the supply of printable shoot released regularly to them from level 5. 
    ——————————————————————————————————————————–
   If only our hacks would waken up and smell the coffee. Journalists are the ones with the power in the Rangers(I.L.) sSFA/ Sevco saga. There is no need to drink from the poisoned watering-hole. There is more than enough fresh, pure, and untainted  water supplies. All of them eager to spout forth, and hose down the manky stank. 
   Jabba may be the playground bully, but it is the head-master who is letting him away with it that the fire-hose should be pointed at. 
   It is sheer gutless cowardice in my book.

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upthehoopsPosted on2:53 pm - Nov 26, 2016


HOMUNCULUSNOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 12:02  
If they end up in a league position which earns a European place I think the SFA will grant them it, at their discretion.
They will stick two fingers up to all of the clubs living within their means, in particular the fourth place club which actually deserves to play in European competition.
I do not think the SFA would even consider doing anything else. Too much chance of civil unrest.

====================

I read recently a respected contributor on another forum discuss a conversation with a Celtic Director. He asked why Aberdeen, Hearts and St Johnstone are sitting back and accepting Rangers spending outwith their means to gain a Euro spot above those three clubs who live within their means. The answer was ‘what makes you think they are just sitting back accepting it?’.

What would really help is if the media were to seriously pose the question of whether FFP may rule out Rangers getting a licence. Saying nothing gives the SFA a free hand. 

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Homunculus

HomunculusPosted on3:20 pm - Nov 26, 2016


UEFA explanation of the FFP Rules

http://www.uefa.com/community/news/newsid=2064391.html

Are clubs no longer allowed to have losses?

To be exact, clubs can spend up to €5million more than they earn per assessment period (three years). However it can exceed this level to a certain limit, if it is entirely covered by a direct contribution/payment from the club owner(s) or a related party. This prevents the build-up of unsustainable debt.

The limits are:• €45m for assessment periods 2013/14 and 2014/15• €30m for assessment periods 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18

In order to promote investment in stadiums, training facilities, youth development and women’s football (from 2015), all such costs are excluded from the break-even calculation.

5m euro is around £4.25m

30m euro is around £25.45m just now.

Rangers would fall foul of the first figure but not the second.

Even if they were to fall foul of the rules, there are a whole range of potential punishments in place.

Non-compliance with the regulations does not mean that a club will be excluded automatically, but there will be no exceptions. Depending on various factors (e.g. the trend of the break-even result) different disciplinary measures may be imposed against a club.

There is a catalogue of measures:

a) warning

b) reprimand

c) fine

d) deduction of points

e) withholding of revenues from a UEFA competition

f) prohibition on registering new players in UEFA competitions

g) restriction on the number of players that a club may register for participation in UEFA competitions, including a financial limit on the overall aggregate cost of the employee benefits expenses of players registered on the A-list for the purposes of UEFA club competitions

h) disqualification from competitions in progress and/or exclusion from future competitions

i) withdrawal of a title or award

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StevieBC

StevieBCPosted on3:21 pm - Nov 26, 2016


OT
——–
JIMBO
NOVEMBER 26, 2016 at 01:31 

Stevie BC,  I think your the only American poster on here.  I love Rodgers & Hammerstein…

Sorry this is what I meant to post.
John C will like this. A man of class.
===========================

Thanks for that Jimbo but to be pedantic I’m a Weegie in America.

…still hoping to acquire some class though… ?

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