A consortium led by David Low has been in talks with Sir Tom Farmer seeking to purchase Hibernian Football Club. The story has been embargoed for a few weeks, but David agreed to speak to TSFM to give us an exclusive interview and provide us with information about his intentions for the Edinburgh club.
Highlights of the interview include the similarities and differences between the Hibs situation and the one he found at Celtic Pak in 1994; how Scottish Football’s “new level playing field” as Low calls it has created an opportunity for a club like Hibs to be the main challenger to Celtic for honours; the contrast of his consortium’s approach to that of the recent debacle at Ibrox; the role of the fans at every level of the club; the future of Allan Stubbs and Leanne Dempster; and the journey back to the Premiership.
Low is frank about his reputation as a well-known Celtic fan, but highlights his Hibbee credentials and his affection for the club, eschewing the “I was always a Hibbee” line taken by so many people seeking to ingratiate themselves with the locals at various clubs.
Certainly, the experience and finance rolling around Low’s consortium is something that any club could do with, but the fans are crucial to their involvement and interest.
He says he won’t go ahead with the purchase unless the fans are behind them.
“Fans have never been so powerful as they are today, especially with the advent of social media like TSFM”
“We have seen in recent years what a body of fans are capable of when they re together”
“We want to have that togetherness at Hibs, because the only way forward is to have trust between the boardroom and the fans, you only have to look at the levels of distrust between board and fans at Rangers to see that it is a recipe for disaster”
One mission of the blog is to bring information to the attention of the Scottish Football public, that otherwise may remain out of sight.
The David Low interview achieved that quite succesfully. It’s not the fault of the blog that Hibs have declined to respond.
I have never bought a football club, so can’t comment from experience on the strategy necessary to achieve a satisfactory outcome.
Going public, poking the other side with a sharp stick and being confrontational , would not be the normal method employed in attempting to purchase a private company.
However football clubs aren’t normal in any sense when referencing business acquisition. Non Disclosure, no publicity and confidentiality are more normal in a private company purchase. I therefore assume that the attempt (if there was one) to conduct this privately , was not succesful . Hibs have presumably rejected the Low consortium offer in a manner that suggests there is not much room for negotiation.
Going public via TSFM is understandable if that is the case. Pressure on Hibs by their fans would be the best lever to bring Hibs back to the table. Although given the nature and personalities of the Hibs ownership , it is risky.
From my viewpoint, I still think the initial investment is very high if a financial return for investors is anticipated. The answer with regards to the clearing of the debt also needs clarification. Settling the debt from consortium resources doesn’t explain much at all. Hibs have loans which would require an injection of capital to settle. This injection of capital would need to be in the form of new equity , or else Hibs will only be swapping one lender for another .
New equity cannot be raised raised, and then used to settle outstanding loans ( possibly at a discounted rate) , without the agreement of Farmer & Petrie. You either buy them out or get their approval for a new equity issue.
If I was Farmer or Petrie, i would question why someone was prepared to invest much more than the initial investment to acquire Hearts and at the same time provide nothing for existing shareholders. Hearts may have been in administration , but the offer to buy was subject to a succesful CVA and as such placed Hearts in a very similar place to Hibs.
As commented previously , I would doubt Petrie will want to jeapordise his position within the SFA hierarchy by not having a board position on a member club. There is precedent , George Peat being one such, for moving between clubs to maintain SFA eligibility. However if the SFA are in any way serious about killing off the “old boys club” tradition that has hindered good governance for decades, then that would be hypocritical.
In summary , trying to do a deal that rejects any value for existing shareholders, torpedoes their career ambitions and on the face of it does not offer any return for new investors is a challenge.
It wouldn’t be the way I would approach it, but then this is football and normal rules may not be appropriate
@Barca I got the impression from David Low that the proposed takeover was not an aggressive type of investment, where returns were a must, but more a return to a more old-school benevolent ownership model, though with fans having much more of a say in running the club.
wottpi 8:36am
That’s a great post and a measured reply given the clear favouritism displayed towards Celtic and T’Rangers in the TV scheduling.
That said, I do have to object to lumping in women’s qualifying matches with the other games that may not be deemed worth the license payers money. I enjoy women’s football. The standard isn’t always consistently at a high level, but it’s usually entertaining, it’s another chance to cheer Scotland on and the odd ill-informed but of commentary aside (usually after a plug for a men’s game) it comes without the OF blinkered attitude that poisons men’s football in Scotland. I certainly think that represents a great investment for a national broadcaster.
StevieBC says:
August 18, 2014 at 10:07 pm
Torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 18, 2014 at 3:45
Just heard on the news that the Easdales could maybe save their local shipyard.Have they had enough of RIFC?
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Heard that on the car radio, and was immediately intrigued.
Then one of the Easdales gave a short soundbite, sounding serious and even magnanimous, but spoiled it when he stated that as a local businessman he felt ‘obligated’ to save the shipyard. But, to be fair, I do hope the 70 lost jobs can be ‘saved’.
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Obviously I think we would all hope that the jobs can be saved. However I reckon the future looks bleak for the yard as it can’t be kept open unless orders are placed with it. And I’m not sure where they could come from.
There’s nearly always money to be made from companies in trouble and one thing about the Port Glasgow Yard is its waterfront location. I don’t know how big the property is in terms of acreage or whether the shipyard actually owns the land – it could belong to the likes of Clyde Port Authority.
But it seems to me its prime house-building land and on my infrequent train journeys past Port Glasgow it seems that all the old shipbuilding sites have been redeveloped with lots of new housing.
So if the Easdales fail in their attempt to ‘save’ the yard then I’m sure they would be able to cover any costs incurred in their venture. Plenty of money to be made in selling equipment to countries where shipbuilding is still heavily subsidised and also a few bob from the remaining scrap.
So it could be win win for the Easdales. They might even want to use it to transfer the garaging there or even their – I think double glazing or joinery manufacturing business. In fact did they not buy that from the administrator.
I’m also certain the Scottish Government will be forced into announcing a generous package of aid to new businesses in the area.
However now they have the expertise of CG to call on I’m sure things will work out well for them even if shipbuilding finally disappears from the Lower Clyde and its short-term future on the Upper Reaches probably hangs on a certain referendum vote although the longer term looks bleak IMO, in any case.
ptd1978 says:
August 19, 2014 at 9:45 am
I agree and apologise.
The standard of women’s football is far more enjoyable than the product Mr McCoist is putting out on the park. 🙂
Anyway I have no objection to my licence fee being spent on coverage of women’s football, just using it as an example of coverage being given to areas of the game where there may not be much interest and relatively low crowds. It was upthehoops who was implying more priority should be given to games such as Celtic’s league cup opening rounds to keep the two cheeks balanced.
I had hoped that the green side had moved on in this new era to be satisfied with their lot but it seems, for some, old habits die hard.
wottpi says:
August 19, 2014 at 10:30 am
I had hoped that the green side had moved on in this new era to be satisfied with their lot but it seems, for some, old habits die hard.
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I would agree that ‘old habits die hard’ for elements of the support of both the green & blue sides. However the positive thing about it all is that they are certainly dying.
As to being ‘satisfied with their lot’ I think that is likely to be resisted by not just Celtic supporters but by any Scottish Football fan who doesn’t accept that the ordained ‘rightful place’ of the blue side is to permanently dominate all others.
However that ‘baggage’ is disappearing like snaw affa dyke with all sensible Rangers supporters whose primary motive for supporting their club is on footballing grounds.
And we all know that nothing is guaranteed in football even when a rigged cash casino is being operated to the detriment of all other clubs. There are signs among thinking Bears that they understand the need to operate within their financial means and that the days of World Domination are not only gone forever but never actually existed.
wottpi 10:30
No apology necessary. I’m on hols at the moment and only have my phone, otherwise I would have had a look at how many games Celtic played last year that, like the Morton game, had no TV or Radio coverage. I’ll bet there weren’t too many more games in that category. How many times do you reckon it happens to every other team in the top league?
I find it a bit sad when an example like the Morton game is trotted out as something unfair to Celtic. I can’t see any justification for that argument which effectively recommends sacrificing sporting integrity for business interests.
No 1 Bob
Re Barry ‘ s ebt I saw a reference on CQN that HMRC have been in touch or trying to get in touch….
The Most Onerous of Contracts
On Mike Ashley – I haven’t seen anyone object to his further involvement at Ibrox on the grounds that he is the owner of probably the most onerous contract of all. That is, the Sports Direct merchandise retail deal. RIFC/TRFC get much less than many clubs from this valuable cash revenue stream and SD seem to have all the contractual cards wrt voting, cancellation, default etc.
Is it at all feasible that Wallace and Nash are so desperate that they would turn to one of their kidnappers for assistance with paying the ransom? Can we add Stockholm Syndrome to the many psychological maladies endemic in Govan?
Or is Mike just another hapless billionaire being nominated as MSM sugar daddy of the month?
PS Onerous contracts don’t need to be secret contracts – Exhibit 1 – the remuneration of Mr Alistair Murdoch McCoist MBE
ecobhoy says:
August 19, 2014 at 10:59 am
I agree that fans of other teams may still not be satisfied with their lot because domination has always been by one side of Glasgow or the other. I further agree the type of dominance lorded over Scottish football by Rangers (IL) should be discouraged.(I hesitate to say eliminated as I can’t see how you legislate for that)
However my point it that with (and I shouldn’t need to tell you)
-Your main rivals in the grubber
-A second jammy progression in Europe
-One European Cup
-One European Cup Runner up
-One Uefa Cup Runner up
-45 League Championships
-36 Scottish Cups
-14 League Cups
-Best Fans in the universe record
-Financial security
-Nine in a row world records – with the potential to make than into double figures
etc etc
Celtic fans have the least to worry about in terms of any rebuilding efforts down Govan way.
Yes I believe we should all be wary of not returning to the past but hey come on Hoops fans, we all accept that the paranoia was real, yes you could be the biggest victims in the fall out from the EBTS etc, however given where you are now and what lies ahead in the future, take a chill pill,and enjoy the ride!!
Seems Phil has news of a windfall at Ibrox,
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/12-million-loan-for-rifc/
Re the Easdale brothers and their apparent interest in saving the threatened Fergusons shipyard, rather sad that they don’t feel similarly ‘obligated’ to try and rescue Inverclyde’s senior football team from their current doldrums. Still, I’m sure they’re true Rangers men. I blame the parents.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:11 pm
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£12m loan against Ibrox. The only good use of this is for Wallace and Nash to fund rapid and massive austerity (redundancies, squad reductions and sell offs). They may be able to balance the books enough in order to buy another season in which to perform further miracles.
But how will the Pay-As-You-Go fans feel about the Board’s obvious duplicity over Ibrox AND the reality of operating on a budget in-line with their rivals’. How will the loyalty stand up to taking both barrels in the inflated self esteem? Along with the “punitive” interest payments, any drop in gate money may nullify the austerity savings.
Experts say that Shakespeare’s genius was that he told all the great stories of humanity – but he must be spinning in his grave that he wasn’t bold enough to dream up this one. 🙂
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:11 pm
Seems Phil has news of a windfall at Ibrox,
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/12-million-loan-for-rifc/
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Certainly interesting but if the security for the loan is Ibrox Stadium, as Phil suggests, I think it might be Bears requiring ‘chill pills’ rather than myself.
Raises the point for me as to whether the Big Share Issue will still be planned for early next year and how potential investors would react to the main property asset of RIFC being tied-up and TRFCL revenue being used to service the loan.
Perhaps the cash injection might allow Wallace to declare his task complete and ride off into the sunset with saddlebags suitably stuffed.
We certainly live in interesting times. Git yir chill pill here 😆
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:11 pm
Not sure if that would be good or bad news for the bears. On the one hand it would keep the club going for a while longer (good news) but where it would take the club in the future would only be good if they find some fantastic income stream to finance the interest and eventual repayment. Clearly the moment the loan is received they won’t actually have £12m but an amount substantially less after the existing loans are, presumably, repaid and other outstanding issues are taken care of. I’d expect, too, that the lender will want his security looked after and insist that some (a lot?) of the money is spent on maintaining this security to a much higher level than it currently is (no doubt using companies he recommends/owns!).
However it works out, this loan will not be as good for the club/company as a successful share issue would have been, and as for the RIFC shareholders, the one asset that gives them some hope of a return/reduced loss will be gone if the club doesn’t get sorted very soon.
Another problem, that could become a major problem, is that the bears, believing there’s £12m in the kitty, and they only know one use for money in the Ibrox coffers, will insist on a world record (for a second tier club) being spent on the players to take them back to their rightful place (like the £22m did).
mcfc says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:29 pm
But how will the Pay-As-You-Go fans feel about the Board’s obvious duplicity over Ibrox
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Simples ❗ The PR line on pro-Board Bear sites is already clear – The ST refuseniks are the ones responsible for all the financial woes of the club. So the Board has been forced into breaking its promise which was only for one season anyway IIRC.
12 million? Nice. All Wallace, Nash and the gang have to do is say they were lying about using Ibrox to secure a loan.
Surely the first act after that hurdle will be to lose Mr McCoist. When was the last time a manager was sacked after his team scored nine?!? One final world record for Ally as he walks away for the final time.
Of course, after the loan is implemented, there will be a major shareholder who may benefit from seeing them struggle – at least up to a point where the loan is defaulted on. That could lead to some inertia around major decisions (share issue?) if that shareholder decides Ibrox is worth more to them than shares in the club/company currently inhabiting it.
ecobhoy says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:45 pm
The ST refuseniks are the ones responsible for all the financial woes of the club. So the Board has been forced into breaking its promise which was only for one season anyway IIRC.
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Eco – my thoughts exactly – and “Hell mend you ungrateful wretches if you don’t buy shares next year to save Ibrox from a fate worse than ASDA”
But how many Bears will have decided enough is enough?
Couple of comments. (Edit – 4 actually)
1/ Re the interest in Ferguson’s EBT. Why would that matter since at this point in time, appeal pending, it is ‘tax appropriate.’ His contract of course was not fully disclosed to the SFA/SPL for approximately 12 years if you really want your underwear twisted!
2/ Re the 12m loan and the expected expenditure thereon. A loan doesn’t really become a problem as such (as long as expectations can be kept in check), since the loan is designed to fund austerity, in itself a good thing. However austerity does not immediately fund loan repayments and interest, which are of course, an added expense. I just hope the repayment box on the Wonga form doesn’t have the initials ‘CL’ and nothing else.
3/ On TV bias. Not worth going there but I will. As an immediate straw poll, watch at 6.00 on a sunday (typically about 5.45 actually) for the highlights coming up of, say, Ross County. Expect to be delighted at being “First up” maybe 4 times in the season – depending on cup draws 😉
4/ OK a more serious point on tv ‘bias’ or maybe more correctly fan numbers weighting. It is oft quoted as both a good and a bad thing to have such a large fan base. If the fan base is large enough to withstand complacency (fans choosing a fireside armchair instead of a stand seat), then blanket coverage will not erode that fan base, instead it will tend to swell it even more as evidenced by, previously, OF tops in every village in Scotland now being replaced by Chelsea (who were magnificent last night btw – no petrofac for me), Liverpool etc. So at what point do the other clubs “get a shottie.” Lets say one of the large clubs goes into liquidation and its brand name endorsed club thingy carries on, but four divisions lower amidst continuing allegations of fabrication and cover up. Whilst the argument “But we have to show them as they have the most fans, advertising revenue etc” remains absolutely correct what do the small clubs have to do to change this? Indeed, what do the big clubs have to do to change this?
Just asking!
£12m loan against Ibrox.
This equates to 18.3p per share
Current share price is 25.5p
Meaning
A loan of £12m equates to around 70% of the value of the company
So
Even if RIFC were breaking even at the minute a loan of £12m is a very high risk venture
So high it is improbable in the extreme
It is so improbable there has to be a hidden agenda
since.
The only parties prepared to borrow in these circumstances would be Spivs with no intention of paying back any of the loan
And
The only parties prepared to lend in these circumstances would be Spivs lending £12m at a wonga rate that will climb to the value of the total assets very quickly if no repayments are made
In other words
The name of the game is to legally rearrange the books to maximise the return to the Spivs and stiff the Creditors in an upcoming liquidation
A possible scenario if this loan goes ahead
1 The loan gets secured on a floating charge over ALL the assets ie Ibrox, MP and player transfers values. The floating charge gets registered at Companies House at the last possible legal date
2 Most of the £12m moves swiftly through the books and back to Spiv lenders via some perfectly legal transactions perhaps some new onerous contracts created as part of the loan deal
None of the money gets used to clear off legitimate loans or repay current creditors apart from HMRC The only cash retained is to fund the journey to liquidation
3 RIFC go into liquidation on whatever date yields the most money for the Spivs. If that is mid season then so be it
4 No outstanding loans or major trading debts get repaid They will rank behind the £12m loan in the RIFC liquidation
Torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 19, 2014 at 1:11 pm
Seems Phil has news of a windfall at Ibrox,
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/12-million-loan-for-rifc/
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Unless I missed it: what has changed re:Ibrox, and the contingent liability ?
Has Craig Whyte been bought off ?
£12m loan with security over Ibrox?
Lets face it if you wanted land around Ibrox and Murray Park and had £12m in your pocket you could broker a better deal for land that doesn’t contain a crumbling stadium and land that isn’t in the Local Plan for development.
Can’t see it myself, possibly just a lot of posturing and an half ersed effort to tie the club in more knots to squeeze more cash out of it.
That being said they must be running out of options for getting cash through the door.
GoosyGoosy says:
August 19, 2014 at 2:36 pm
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GG – very interesting – but maybe it’s even more desperate – buy STs NOW or we hock Ibrox – it’s your fault and you know where it will end.
If it is the “pool ball in a sock” tactic, I expect the UoF will be insensitive to the message and come out demanding Wallace, Nash and Somers’ heads on stakes. They seem blind to the financial realities and think that the Board are calling the shots and are not just hired hands doing as they are told.
Regarding the 12 million “loan” , was it not already stated that TRFC are in debt to their parent company to the tune of circa 16 million from the ipo money?
If thats the case, this new money will put them 28 million in debt to themselves, not to mention the private loans raised a few months ago which means that even if they paid off hmrc and other outstanding debts they would still be over 30 million in debt on their return to the top flight, assuming they make it this season.
Cant wait to get the chance to buy some shares in this business when they get the go ahead for a new public issue!
Clearly, whoever this proposed lender might be, this time round his eyes must be wide open, and he’s not doing this because he loves ‘Rangers’, he’s doing this because he can see profit for himself or his company. RIFC/TRFC raised, supposedly,£22m in the IPO, at zero interest, and yet that money disappeared like snow off a dyke, much of it, apparently, into the pockets of the people who raised it.
I wonder how much of this ‘loan’ will go in charges over and above the interest? Just imagine if half of it, £6m, went on charges, interest and other ‘onerous’ contracts tied into the loan. The remaining £6m might then be seen as a reasonable price for Ibrox, and perhaps MP and sundry other assets. This ‘loan’ might also finance the existing ‘onerous’ contracts that might be lost should the company fail.
Of course, nothing is as it seems with TRFC, it never has been, or at least, it never has been as portrayed by their PR machine, and this latest could just be, as suggested earlier, nothing more than a stick to hit the ST boycotters with.
Loans to companies are only a step forward if they have a positive use. If, say, they are to finance a new building that will produce a profit making product. In football, perhaps if it’s to be used to increase a stadium’s capacity where there is already a huge demand for more seats, then it will be welcomed by shareholders. A loan, on the other hand, that is needed, not just for future working capital, but to clear existing loans drawn to fund historic overspend, cannot be seen as good news for shareholders. At best, this money might be used to fund the austerity that would take the club to where it should have been over two years ago – a new club, with a huge fan base, utilising it to make steady progress up the leagues at the lowest cost possible, paid for by ticket sales, not moonbeams. Then, once in the top league, going to the market to fund a more realistic target of continued improvement and growth. They didn’t do it then, the fans wouldn’t have accepted it then, and not much has changed since.
wottpi says:
August 19, 2014 at 2:46 pm
8 0 Rate This
That being said they must be running out of options for getting cash through the door.
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Correct.
For £12M I’d be wanting the stadium, carpark, Edmiston House, Murray Park, and the Casino!
(and a wee peak at SDM’s photo album with his palls on the boat).
Ok, paranoia alert prompted by Aj’s post above.
What if…
Spivs have effectively saved Rangers (despite minor technicality re liquidation consciously ignored by the media). For doing so they were paid 5m from the bears. Yes, they put in 17m of theirs (17 plus 5 making the 22m IPO mentioned) but recovered the whole amount in onerous contracts and other whimsical japes. But RFC are operating at a loss that needs funding I hear you cry. Yes, a loss, but only really according to them per their somewhat dated accounts.
Now a further 12m mysteriously arrives from a shareholder. But a/ its a loan and b/ we don’t know who the shareholder is even if they are named as Blue Pitch or whoever. Assume then, that the 12 m disappears on new, or more likely continuing onerous contracts. By my reckoning that leaves 1 shareholder (unnamed) in charge (it does of course require the others to walk away gracefully but then they have the principle shareholders 12m in their pockets) owning the club that he hasn’t actually put that much into (I forget what, for instance, Blue Pitch’s initial investment was) that albeit he has had to put a further 12 m into, but is hoping that that 12m is repayable once higher revenue level football is commenced.
Too fanciful? Put it this way, the loan figure speculated on today could be any figure you want. It is only required to fund a presently unquantified loss. It has a legitimate entry point (loan) and, via existing onerous contracts, an equally legitimate exit point whereupon certain shareholders could hand over their rights. Job done. Oh, and a stadium in security. Bonus!
Whilst looking for something else entirely, I chanced across this – http://www.berwickshirenews.co.uk/news/local-news/football-fans-prosecuted-in-scotland-for-offence-in-england-1-3513209 – it seems that some justice at least has been served on those who invaded Berwick in 2013…
That sums it up nicely.
Charles Green had it all sussed out in about 2 weeks. The fans did not want, and in fact would not accept, austerity, or anything like it. What they “demanded” (the peepil never ask, they always demand, it’s a cultural thing) was moonbeams and yet more moonbeams. A £12m warchest for Ally,(SFL3 mind you!) Green says yes. Champions League anthem at Ibrox? Oh yes, says Charles, might take a year or two, but no doubts at all. Ibrox refurbished? Just buy the shares, boys, you’ll see me deliver on that one.
Has the mindset changed over the last two years? I don’t think so, although other posters seem to believe they can feel the wind of change. My view is this- take away the supremacist mindset and the overwhelming sense of entitlement, and what are you left with? Not a lot, in my opinion. Although I’m sure others will disagree.
Some very clever analysis of potential motives / scenarios by you chaps.
No way of checking sources but Phil does appear to know a friendly and informative mole or two. Now if Wallace and Nash are as smart as they’re supposed to be will they ever sanction this magical £12m loan if there are strings attached?
Funnily enough, it was Tommy from Glasgow who interviewed brother Imran a while back and got him talking about raising substantial sums to ‘take the club forward’. It seemed a bit of a wheeze at the time, now less so.
Whatever can it be they’ve cooked up it? And are Imran, Charles and Stockbridge involved?
DP,
Whilst no lover of higher power illuminati conspiracy theory I have always had the feeling that Green et al were of the quick buck persuasion and that there were other interests in, in the background, from the start sitting happily under the radar waiting for their chance – and by chance I don’t mean any luck being involved!
On the 12 Million loan
Why would an existing major shareholder in Rangers International offer a loan secured against something they already , at least partially own? Unless it
is an attempt to undermine other shareholders. Surely far better for shareholders to liquidate the assets now for a proper share of the return rather than risk losing out to the loan shark??
Smugas says:
August 19, 2014 at 5:19 pm
1 0 Rate This
DP,
Whilst no lover of higher power illuminati conspiracy theory I have always had the feeling that Green et al were of the quick buck persuasion and that there were other interests in, in the background, from the start sitting happily under the radar waiting for their chance – and by chance I don’t mean any luck being involved!
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Not naming any names, nudge, nudge?
The company I work for does not permit us to post on messageboards and forums therefore I have not been able to answer some of the baffling stuff I’ve read in response to my post this morning re BBC coverage until now.
Firstly if anyone can show where I said it was unfair on Celtic that a league cup tie last year was not covered I’ll take my hat off to you. I used it as an example against the tiresome accusation the bias shown is equal. I merely questioned why the BBC were so extravagant in their use of our licence fee to give blanket coverage to an almost meaningless Rangers game. More to the point are the BBC afforded full media conference facilities at Ibrox yet, because if they’re not it makes their indulgence of the club even more baffling. I won’t derail the blog because TSFM has made his views clear in the past, but please don’t tell me it’s impossible for the BBC to operate to biased agendas. They are accused of it every day in other walks of life, and it is an accepted position backed by some of their most prominent ex-employees that the Scottish football agenda in their day was very biased towards a certain club. I’m happy to accept those days are over, but it would be nice to know when the official decision was made to call a halt to it.
DP,
If your meaning Murray (unlikely unless his ego is even bigger than we imagined), king (possibly, it’s got his mark, RFC controlling interest on the cheap although I would have thought the subsequent 12m was a bit steep for him) or another blue knight then I couldn’t possibly comment.
gunnerb says:
August 19, 2014 at 5:24 pm
Why would an existing major shareholder in Rangers International offer a loan secured against something they already , at least partially own?
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The glib – but sadly true – answer is because they expect to make money hand over fist no matter what happens. And that money will be straight from the footballing and maintenance budgets. Of course they would have preferred to get other people’s money via the City – but that seems to be off the agenda. So the loan will be constructed to ensure there is only one winner – the loan shark.
I know nothing about the £12m loan other than what Phil has written. I just have a question…
Is it possible that the loan is being put up by blue pitch/margarita holding (or anyone receiving the benefit of the onerous contracts?)
After all, if they loan their own money to Sevco, knowing that it’s all coming back through onerous contracts IN addition to it being a loan against which they’ve secured Ibrox, then it won’t have cost them anything like £12m at the end, will it?
I know a man with 12 million pounds,his name is Charles.
Spiv School
I’ve always wondered how Green and fellow spivs learn their complex trade whilst avoiding Her Majesty’s pleasure and being done over by older, wiser, double-crossing spivs. Having read the excellent posts on the £12m Loan, I fear that TSFM may be inadvertently serving the role as Spiv School for any readers of a criminal and avaricious disposition. 🙂
gunnerb says:
August 19, 2014 at 5:24 pm
3 0 Rate This
On the 12 Million loan
Why would an existing major shareholder in Rangers International offer a loan secured against something they already , at least partially own? Unless it
is an attempt to undermine other shareholders. Surely far better for shareholders to liquidate the assets now for a proper share of the return rather than risk losing out to the loan shark??
—————–
To my uneducated eye this was what I thought.
My hunch is it’s Laxey that’s offered the loan.They’re down a few bob on their original investment with not much chance of getting it back.A loan at say 15% would bring them in £1.8m p.a. not including any set up fees and the like.It would also,at a stroke,remove control of the most valuable asset from the spivs,who would be paying Laxey rent to retain ownership.Any admin and Laxey are off with Ibrox.If the spivs default then you could essentially have a form of sale and leaseback with whoever owns TRFC paying rent to Laxey,or buying Ibrox back.RIFC would be owed millions by TRFC who would own no real assets.Laxey would hold all the aces.
Probably rubbish but seems a good idea.
upthehoops says:
August 19, 2014 at 5:42 pm
Nice and simple and my last one on the subject-
One – Define what is a ‘meaningless game’ and who it is meaningless to so we can monitor and complain to BBC when the license fee is being wasted. Presumably you also have a threshold for the level of coverage for all scenarios?
Two -Have you so quickly forgot it was the same ‘biased’ BBC Scotland that produced and broadcast the award winning ‘The Men Who Who Sold the Jerseys’
I’ll put that down as the day the corporations attitude changed with regard to Rangers.
As discussed here plenty times, over a good number of years now the BBC TV and radio presenters and pundits are people from across the full spectrum of Scottish Football and they have Cosgrove and Cowan taking pot shots at Rangers and indeed Celtic most weeks as they have done for years. Hardly an organisation that favours one particular club.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
August 19, 2014 at 6:04 pm
All very high risk knowing that the club could be down the pan and all you are left with is lands that may not be easy to develop or sell on.
Not operating in high finance myself but my guess is anyone with £12m to spare would be better placing it under the mattress than thrown anywhere near Ibrox.
Smugas says:
August 19, 2014 at 5:49 pm
1 0 Rate This
DP,
If your meaning Murray (unlikely unless his ego is even bigger than we imagined), king (possibly, it’s got his mark, RFC controlling interest on the cheap although I would have thought the subsequent 12m was a bit steep for him) or another blue knight then I couldn’t possibly comment.
————
I actually thought you might be referring to Ticketus, who must be a bit miffed. But that theory was perhaps debunked a good while back?
The Murray/Whyte thing was just too convenient, but if there was a plan it seems to have gone awry somewhere along the line.
I’ve no idea, but am enjoying reading the various plot lines being presented. Perhaps it really is just as chaotic as it looks?
PhilMacGiollaBhain says:
August 19, 2014 at 4:14 pm
wottpi says:
August 19, 2014 at 2:46 pm
8 0 Rate This
That being said they must be running out of options for getting cash through the door.
———————————————————–
Correct.
in which direction ??
Whilst I’m not particularly promoting Murray per se (and incredibly I’d forgotten all about ticketus) in what way do you feel the plan has gone awry? Liquidation heat passed and conveniently ignored. RFC in div 1, not yet having met CFC so nothing to compare, and a wee anonymous seat on the shareholders bus with which to engage phase 2 namely inject a loan to effectively remove Ibrox out of RIFC, fold it with shareholders taking the 12m and running. Only issue is working capital going further on. Now if only there were ‘000s of fans to ‘dip’ for the final hurdle….
If it has gone awry it is in serious players like Laxey getting in on the act. Suddenly (pick a figure) 2m has become 12m. But as others have said there are ways and means there too!
Pau1 Mart1n
Love it!
upthehoops says:
August 19, 2014 at 7:16 pm
Happy to leave it because long term followers of the blog know what has been discussed before. I am content with the conclusions of those earlier discussions.
If true – Oh the irony for all those who decried LW for being ‘at it’ 🙂
http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/celtic/288953-celtic-avert-champions-league-admin-blunder-as-efe-ambrose-left-at-home/
Admin mistakes and wrong assumptions easily done.
There for the grace of god etc
At least Celtic were professional enough to resolve the situation before the tie.
Still fantastic sums of money seem drawn to the ‘money pit’ in Govan.
It has a gravitational pull for the deluded, gullible, and financially insane.
There is a part of me thinks that this is another rip off, another way of ripping the last organs from the body to sell on the black market.
However there is also a part of me that thinks that this is all predetermined and that the money will be used as a lever to transfer the whole company/club to the owner of the stadium. Something along the lines of; “Sell me the lot or the stadium closes”. It could also be a way of recycling the club/company back to a previous owner who sits in the background hidden behind overseas companies.
This debate is the never ending cycle; they cannot break even until they slash costs but they cannot cut the costs until they get money in to fund paying people off. The fans are depriving the entity of the funds to keep the bogey on the tracks (even with one wheel) and that drives the entity towards sacrificing the ground (something they have said recently they would not do) in a desperate attempt to raise capital.
No bank will lend to them because of the spectre of Craig Whyte in the background. I would suggest that a bank either would not lend money to such a distressed company that has a track record of largesse or, if they did, they would want double digits in interest. This has driven the people in charge of the entity to explore any avenue to secure funding. If this story is true I would expect the person making the offer will be expecting 15% because, as has been pointed out here, the stadium is only of value as a that unless it is torn down and sold for scrap. Phil used the word ‘punitive’ but I do not see this money coming from Laxey’s. No I think they know they have been well and truly done over and regret the day they ever got involved. I simply cannot see them parting with £12M I really don’t.
Still this scandal rumbles on.
RFC/’The Rangers’ fans have been abandoned by the leaders of our sport and particularly by one who received a ‘never to be returned loan’.
They have allowed the worst of businessmen to become involved in our sport to the detriment of all clubs.
Faith in our sports administration is at an all time low because the people in charge are either incompetent, inept, or downright terrified in case they have been taped saying something they should not have.
If the stadium goes where does that leave the stay away fans who were concerned that this was on the cards?
Will they stop going altogether because if they do the entity will simply default or have to go back for another loan secured against Murray Park or one of the other properties. The money received will be offset against the money lost by fans refusing to attend.
Once again they will be consumed by debt but this time, shorn of properties and with nothing to sell, the game really will be a bogey.
justshatered says:
August 19, 2014 at 8:24 pm
==============================
One thing it certainly won’t be is the positive move for Rangers the media will portray it as.
Slightly OT but had an interesting demonstration today of how the Scottish media, and probably the whole media these days, works.
Was looking around twitter yesterday and saw this story
http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/u/six-hundred-us-visitors-scrap-glasgow-visit-plans-after-councils-controversial-decision-to-fl.1408357947
It struck me as odd just the tone, so searched for Mr Cassini and guess what? nothing, no “vice president of any company in the fortune 500 called Richard Cassini. So I Called the Evening Times and they referred me to the Express who published the story first, they wouldn’t comment but on the same day the Herald and Scotsman also put the story on their websites.
So I contacted the council and the SECC and wrote this.
http://www.thedrum.com/news/2014/08/19/glasgow-city-council-expresses-doubts-over-reports-cancelled-conference-due
Ten minutes after we published, this appeared in the Evening Times
http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/u/was-gaza-flag-email-a-hoax.1408445113
Was the original story just too good to check?
Well done James. Hunt this irresponsible nonsense down.
James Doleman says:
August 19, 2014 at 8:33 pm
1 0 Rate This
Slightly OT but had an interesting demonstration today of how the Scottish media, and probably the whole media these days, works.
——–
Nice one James. Story too ‘good’ on several levels for certain people. Is there a Ministry of Lies somewhere? 🙂
Re the £12m loan.
Looks to be a typical example of kicking the can down the road (again).
A rather large sum to boot and I can’t help wondering if this sum was solicited or volunteered?
If volunteered then I guess it’ll have the fingerprints of BPH/Margarita (or should that be big hand prints?) all over it (and I suspect it’ll be rejected).
If solicited then you’d have to wonder if they’re writing off the prospect of a post AGM share issue already?
Danish Pastry says:
August 19, 2014 at 8:44 pm
James Doleman says:
August 19, 2014 at 8:33 pm
Nice one James. Story too ‘good’ on several levels for certain people. Is there a Ministry of Lies somewhere?
——————————–
Where might such a place exist? I hear the 6th floor at Hampden is very spacious.
Smugas says:
August 19, 2014 at 7:05 pm
2 0 Rate This
Whilst I’m not particularly promoting Murray per se (and incredibly I’d forgotten all about ticketus) in what way do you feel the plan has gone awry?
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Only via the old speculation about Murray & Whyte. If they had a plan it probably hinged on the BTC decision coming sooner and the European cash, so helpfully available to them, well potentially. The loss of that income was not budgeted for, imo.
Reading the public interviews he gave, Whyte seemed eager for the tax case decision. Either outcome would have been helpful — if negative, a controlled car crash; if positive, a chance to muddle on till season’s end and an admin that could have seen Whyte still in charge. Either way, he could blame poor results in Europe, sins of previous board, etc, for the predicament. We’ve seen that the fans would have rallied, they’d still have been in the SPL and potentially have avoided liquidation.
What we don’t know is, if they had gone on a Euro run with Super, would the money have disappeared or would it have been used to pay the WTC/see out the season?
James Doleman says:
August 19, 2014 at 8:33 pm
Great work James – yet another example of the arrogance and ignorance of so many in the 4th estate who have lost all sense of morality and integrity.
What on earth are the editors paid for if they allow this regurgitated rubbish to be printed?
‘What does it profit a man if he gains ………….. and loses his soul..”
The truth will out!!
StevieBC says:
August 19, 2014 at 2:44 pm
“Has Craig Whyte been bought off ?”
——————————
That is certainly one possibility. A change of address by Sevco 5088 now places them in the premises of Field Fisher Waterhouse which is precisely where they should not be if this claim was still contentious. Added to this is the apparent exit of Whyte’s champions, Law Financial in February of this year. There are a number of possibilities as to how this came about and how the dispute was reconciled but Phil’s comment certainly provides some corroboration. Nothing is ever simple in this saga but here is the Company Check link; scroll down to ‘event history :
http://companycheck.co.uk/company/08011390#trading-addresses
Here’s confirmation concerning the new ‘Swan Lake’ address :
http://www.fieldfisher.com/PDF/pi-London_PI2.pdf
Allyjambo says:
August 19, 2014 at 3:52 pm
Excellent post and a lot to think about.
As far as the actual loan goes, in business there can be many options raised and considered every day, not all will come to fruition but I will go ahead on the basis that it will progress.
Why now ?
The money has been needed for ages and two years ago Rangers went for less than half the money and were in better shape.
How safe an investment is it ?
The £22m IPO(net £17m ish) was swallowed up in no time while the Company deteriorated. It would seem that nobody has control in the divided Company so you can’t be sure of making sure that it is properly used.
So why risk it ?
Maybe someone has been forced to come up with money at this point because all advice is that the Company should be put into Admin or liquidation forthwith to avoid the Directors (and de facto directors) becoming personally liable for Debts of the Company. Maybe it is too much even for the spivs to ignore.
If you have an insolvent company and you are a spiv you want to ensure that as far as possible you get ownership of the assets when it goes belly up (without the inconvenient liabilities).
Many of us expected the hiving off to have happened a long time ago but the disunity and the fan’s attachment to the ‘big hoose’ may have delayed this. Particularly as the fans provided rich pickings in the meantime, but they seem to have, at last, realised that money can be sucked out faster than they put it in.
Maybe this is the crunch and one of the parties has raised the stakes to get control of the assets. If you are the proud owners of an onerous contract or two you know that much of the money will come right back to you anyway.
You can charge a high rate of interest and up front arrangement fees etc. You can schedule the facility so that tranches will be released on meeting certain milestones (Winning the SPL). For a relatively small outlay you gain control of the main asset of the Company.
Most of the participants are loathe to put anything up, maybe somebody has decided to up the stakes.
Who would do such a thing ?
A stakeholder who sees the gravy train ending and wants to suck the last morsel out of it.
Maybe it is nothing but I still believe that Ibrox will be separated from RIFC into the safe hands of spivs sooner or later.
Travelling fan numbers to be limited to under 1000 for visits to Ibrox over Policing fears re segregation. Question has to be why are there segregation issues now? The following from Queen of The South:
Rangers Away Match Tickets
Over the last few days we have been trying to firm up arrangements for our trip to Ibrox to play Rangers on Saturday 30th August. Both clubs had presumed that we would receive the same allocation of approximately 1,700 tickets that Hearts received for their opening weekend fixture at Ibrox. However, due to problems in segregation at that match, the police have unfortunately insisted that the away support allocation at Ibrox for the rest of the League season is to be less than 1,000 tickets. This is obviously very disappointing for us as a club and is unlikely to be sufficient tickets to satisfy demand from our supporters. We took 1,500 to Ibrox two years ago for a midweek Ramsdens Cup tie.
In accordance with our published Supporter`s Charter, these tickets will be offered to Season Ticket Holders in the first instance and only then, if any remain, to general sale. It is worth noting that we have slightly more season ticket holders than we have tickets for this fixture so although it is likely that any season ticket holder who wants one will be able to buy a ticket, we cannot guarantee it.
Accordingly, sale arrangements for these tickets will be as follows:
Season Ticket Holders
The tickets will be sold from the Club Admin Office at Palmerston on Sunday 24th August on a first come, first served basis. Season ticket holders will be able to purchase in person from 10am for an exclusive period of 3 hours. They should bring with them their season ticket books and hand over Voucher No 1 from it to sales staff. We will also take telephone bookings from season ticket holders at that time (01387 254853) and will check entitlement to the ticket register. There will be no collections of any telephone sales. Tickets ordered by telephone will be sent out by Guaranteed Next Day Delivery at a cost of £6.50 per order.
Please note that due to the limited numbers available sales will be strictly on a one ticket per season ticket holder basis. However, one season ticket holder may bring a number of vouchers in to purchase tickets together with friends or relatives. They do not all need to come in individually as long as one person has all the vouchers and there is a voucher for each required ticket. No season tickets will be sold on Sunday whilst the Rangers ticket sale is in progress.
Due to the limited supply we are unfortunately unable to offer internet ordering for tickets on this occasion.
Non-Season Ticket Holders
At 1pm on Sunday, only providing the season ticket queue has been cleared, then we will sell any remaining tickets to non-season ticket holders on a first come, first served basis one ticket per person.
In the unlikely event that there are still tickets remaining after Sunday then further sales details will be announced as soon as possible. Tickets will NOT be available from the Club Office at usual business opening times. Nor will they be available on Saturday either before or after the Livingston game.
Pricing
Tickets are priced as follows:
£19 Adults
£14 Concessions (over 65 years or 16/17 year olds)
£5 Juveniles (Under 16)
Please note there are no ambulant disabled concessions available at Ibrox. We have been allocated seven wheelchair and carer spots and are presently liaising with the Queen of the South Disabled Supporters Association regarding their allocation.
We understand that these arrangements will not be to everybody`s satisfaction and we appreciate a number of regular travellers may well fail to get a ticket. Unfortunately in such a situation no arrangement will suit everyone and there is a limit to what else we can practically do to allocate these tickets.
Are the polis getting paid Ally?
We demand to know!
£12M guy was probably at the game last night i’ll look up yon Mr Vass he must have all the mugshots, back in a min.
All but one accounted for, must have airbrushed him oot.
12 Million…now there is a figure to play with?
Why 12…why not 10?..or 11?
Is it offered on a draw down?..is it being touted for accounting reasons?..why and who wants it made public that this offer is being considered?..
As a loss making company who has access to income streams is it better to keep a loss making company going for guaranteed income…it only appears loss making due to the money being extracted in onerous contracts and bonuses etc! They know the SFA will not prevent them in what they want to do…in fact the SFA will financially assist wherever possible…will be interesting to see if the SFA continue non Hampden semi finals? Scotland international fixtures?
Is there a better investment for 12 million?…is there a quicker way to get your 12 million back and then some? you bet there is…however is there a better way to shove money you don’t want certain people to know you have?…Tax right offs?…fencing money?
offering 12 million and using a stadium that still requires approx 7-10 million in repairs and refurbishments does not make sense…knocking it down and building something else does make sense…
Offering 12 million if you believe the company can be turned around into a healthy continous profit…possibly…
No…the question of why 12 is the puzzle?
Has conditions been put in place that the loan is to gaurantee the wages will be paid for the comming season and will be drip fed to accomodate this,daily running of the club’s facilities costs will come from other revenue streams that will be paid into the loan provider’s nominated account which all bills will be paid from ,including loan repayments,get them to the end of season with the hoped for promotion and new season book prices ,big take up of these and the party begins for the loan provider,simples.
Maybe the police don’t want the Sevco fans to be outnumbered? Last night took me back to the halcyon days of the Eighties. The crowd, not the score. 😀
What would a paltry 12 M do and the Rangers fans know it. Chris Graham recently, was decidedly distraught about the the recent going ons at Ibrox .If I didn’t know, I would think he is a well informed individual and grounded. Then I remember, Craig Whyte, Charles Green and how he was a big sook! Just wanting a place on the Rangers board.
Paul, had his number
http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2013/02/22/my-thoughts-on-chris-grahams-comments-in-the-rangers-standard-about-his-sportsound-boycott/
PMC, Still Great!
Smugas says:
August 19, 2014 at 4:22 pm
23 1 Rate This
I’ve been saying this for a while, the 17m institutional investment was never what it seemed. I’m sure a chunk of this outlay was quickly recovered through consultancy fees and IPO costs….basically most of it rested in Rangers Bank account for a short period. I was genuinely stumped at the time as to why investors would pay £17m for a flotation that made the club valuation roughly what Celtic’s was, it makes sense now.
I don’t know about the 12m, we’ve got that from Phil Mac and a few of the things he’s said for the last while haven’t come to pass however it may be that things move so quickly that his information is soon out of date!
Aquinas says:
August 20, 2014 at 12:26 am
0 1 Rate This
Is this a serious post? If so, I’ll be polite and say you’ve made a bit of a leap there. I’m a Clyde season ticket holder and before last night’s game was wee bit concerned with the Barry Ferguson angle that was surrounding the game. Nothing untoward, I just thought it was all a bit friendly and familiar, Certainly didn’t promote the “get right intae them” attitude that a team like Clyde needs when going to Ibrox to stand any chance.
Losing 2-1, 8-1 or even winning makes not one iota of a difference to Barry’s EBT however it could have a huge effect on his managerial Career, I’d hazard a guess that that’s what he was most concerned with.
Is there any merit in having a discussion or speculating on what the “onerous contracts” may be?
Catering?
Merchandising?
Car Parking?
Security?
Facilities Management,especially if despite taking payment, the facility itself remains distinctly unmanaged. Not being a regular attender I cannot vouch for the physical deterioration that has been discussed but it would seem to be at least a contender.
ecobhoy.
Re Westhorn. I had a plot in the allotments some years ago.Best tasting vegetables ever.
helpmaboab says:
August 20, 2014 at 7:19 am
1 0 Rate This
ecobhoy.
Re Westhorn. I had a plot in the allotments some years ago.Best tasting vegetables ever.
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Would it be fair to say that you had green fingers?
MercDoc says:
August 20, 2014 at 12:02 am
7 0 Rate This
What would a paltry 12 M do and the Rangers fans know it. Chris Graham recently, was decidedly distraught about the the recent going ons at Ibrox .If I didn’t know, I would think he is a well informed individual and grounded. Then I remember, Craig Whyte, Charles Green and how he was a big sook! Just wanting a place on the Rangers board.
Paul, had his number
http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2013/02/22/my-thoughts-on-chris-grahams-comments-in-the-rangers-standard-about-his-sportsound-boycott/
PMC, Still Great!
———————————–
Great blog,well worth a re read