837 thoughts on “Questions, questions, questions”

1. 
   

   I watched the AFC v. TRFC match on Sky last night.

   Officiating – dreadful. The SFA & the Head of Referee Operations must be so proud.

   Football – poor, but what do you expect on a January night in Aberdeen with the wind howling & a poor surface.

   Commentary – again dreadful. Crokka/Wokka dismal & one-eyed.

   There’s always talk about how poor media deals are for Scottish football. Last night was no advert for the game in this country.
2. 
   

   jj 19th Jan 11.04.

   Officiating – dreadful. The SFA & the Head of Referee Operations must be so proud.
   //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

   I thought Referee Scott Brown was ok tbh. As for the Clancy chap, the least said the better.
3. 
   

   https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/60053881
   What if we make the final ?
4. 
   

   PM, what if we don’t even qualify through the 2 playoff games? Does the Top Tier still shutdown for a month so they can watch the WC? That doesn’t make much sense to me if teams might not have that many players at the WC. Obviously, if clubs have more than the regulated 3 away, then it would make sense, but why announce this before we know?
5. 
   

   nawlite 19th January 2022 At 13:07
   Oh ye of little faith !
   They’re basically just bringing the winter break forward again , and it might end the nonsense among fans that these things are arranged to suit any particular club’s agenda . No sight of the hidden hand !
6. 
   

   I know!! I was trying not to be too downbeat, but there is a chance we might not make it to the finals. What then? The winter break is traditionally just 2 weeks, do we do 4 for no real reason if thast’s how it turns out?
7. 
   

   Hold the front page;

   Shock news Scottish referee sends off a The rangers player!!!

   I suppose, (at half time?) Brother Clancy saw how badly the officials missed the McGregor foul on Hedges, which should have been a penalty and red card, despite the soup-taking sevco apologist Andy Walker’s other-worldly views.

   Clancy will be well down the pecking order now, however I’m sure Brothers Beaton and Madden will do their utmost in Celtic’s next two league matches…
8. 
   

   And VAR continues to be kicked down the road …

   Def penalty, Kent not a 2nd booking and Hayes possible 2nd booking for an elbow

   As a shareholder I think I should ask my club and other clubs why are we not requesting VAR immediately as playing without it is directly impacting our business !
9. 
   

   Albertz11 19th January 2022 At 11:39

   I thought Referee Scott Brown was ok tbh.
   xxxxx
   Looking at the stats, I’m surprised he couldn’t wangle all 3 points for Aberdeen. I guess he was blind-sighted when he forsook the opportunity to award a penalty and red the keeper….
   Or overly confident?
10. 
    

    As a Thistle fan , I thought the ref done well , mibbes Mom .
11. 
    

    Seems like Scott Brown is not only in the heads of some or all Ranger players and you might add some of their fans. It would be interesting if Brown was on the market how long would it take for Rangers to be chasing him. Just think how much better the team could be with him in the line up and the players not having to worry about him getting in their ears with some colorful comments. How much braver would some of their light weight players would be if they knew Brown was backing them up. He would go from black hat to white hat in no time. Every tam needs some one like this to provide upset to the other’s team best players and once word gets around about who can be messed with the results become quite clear. You might hate playing against him, but would definitely like him on your side.
12. 
    

    nbmumfc

    Shock news Scottish referee sends off a The rangers player!!!
    ……………………………………………………………………………..

    Not too much of a shock when you check the facts.
    Stats are from 1946/47 – 2021/22, so not a chosen timeframe to suit one’s agenda.

    Domestic Red cards Rangers 178 Celtic 140
    League Red cards Rangers 141 Celtic 111
    Old Firm Red cards Rangers 42 Celtic 35

    Old Firm Penalties Rangers 35 Celtic 45,

    Steven Whittaker scored a penalty v Celtic on 06/02/2011.
    Subsequently there have been 34 Old Firm encounters in which Rangers have been awarded One penalty.

    Since 2016/17 Bobby Madden has shown 7 RCs to Rangers players and 3 to Celtic players.
    Since 2016.17 Bobby Madden has shown 4 RCs to Rangers opponents and 8 to Celtics opponents.

    Just to be clear i don’t believe that Referees are biased one way or the other, but the stats show that lazy preconceived thoughts can be proven wrong.
13. 
    

    nbmumfc

    Should have made it clear in my previous post that my reference to “lazy preconceived thoughts” was not aimed at yourself but to the various sportswriters, pundits & bloggers who are guilty of this behaviour.
14. 
    

    Albertz “Not too much of a shock when you check the facts.
    Stats are from 1946/47”

    Please keep this relevant, the club concerned only started playing football in 2012 and had not had a red card from a Scottish referee in around 2 years, despite collecting 4 in their first 6 games in Europe this season. Newsworthy indeed!!

    Just before the original Rangers died, we know how lies were told and scrutiny was avoided to ensure they had a licence to play in the Champions League qualifiers when they should have been ineligible. We now face a similar scenario with the new club whose very survival could depend on winning the Premiership this season. Mountains will be moved to accommodate this, let’s hope they fail.

    Just to be clear, I do believe some referees are shockingly biased!!
15. 
    

    What’s this? Two teams claiming one history? And the BBC happy to report on it – what’s going on, haha?
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59974018
16. 
    

    Nawlite 20th January 2022 At 15:31
    ”..What’s this? Two teams claiming one history? ”
    %%%%%%%%%
    Oh, be still, my beating heart!
    I wonder how the Romanian Finance Regulators would view a new public company that launches itself on the market on the basis of a Prospectus that misleads potential investors about the football club of which it is the holding company?
    Good spot, btw, Nawlite: fair brightened up my afternoon.
    As for the BBC, they will report truth in sport anywhere but in Scotland, as they have demonstrated over the last decade or so.
17. 
    

    And here we ago on the Duff and Phelps (the Company) action :
    “LORD TYRE – S Alexander, Clerk
    Thursday 27th January
    Debate
    CA71/20 Duff & Phelps Ltd v The Lord Advocate A & W M Urquhart SGLD ”
    Lord Tyre has earlier ‘procedural hearing ‘ stuff that morning scheduled for between 9.30 a.m and 10.00 am.
    According to the Scottish legal glossary:
    “Debate
    Intermediate step in procedure when legal points are considered, and which can result in the conclusion of a civil case prior to evidence being led.”
    I’m no judge (!) but I can’t see anything other than Lord Tyre finding that D&P have no case.
    The fact that 3 of their employees were ( wrongly) arrested and charged , all charges subsequently being dropped, is no more ‘damaging’ to D&P ( the company) than would be, say, the wrongful arrest of a bank manager to the reputation and good name of his employing bank.
    No?
    [If Lord Tyre agrees with me, I’ll be signing up for a law degree course!!]
18. 
    

    Tuesday was a slow day so I found myself watching the BBC Parliament channel when an urgent question was raised on the ongoing Derby County admin process. An interesting discussion which is available on BBC iPlayer.
    A hat tip to Toby Perkins, the Labour MP for Chesterfield, who reminded the house that Glasgow Rangers and Bury had gone out of existence. ( 17.55 mins into the programme).
19. 
    

    Westcoaster 20th January 2022 At 20:11
    ‘..A hat tip to Toby Perkins,.’

    %%%%%%%
    I am already mentally composing the letter I may send him !
    Thanks for posting that interesting link.
20. 
    

    https://twitter.com/ScotlandSky/status/1484492356309204994

    Do all teams get invited for “constructive” talks when they drop points or is it just the entitled ones?
21. 
    

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-fire-8-point-letter-26011619
22. 
    

    nbmumfc.
    From the opening paragraph of the link you provided.

    “SFA regularly engage with all clubs and remain in dialogue with teams throughout the season”
    ……………………………………………………………………………………………………

    I would add that given the poor display v Aberdeen it could be argued it was a point gained rather than two points dropped.
23. 
    

    @NBMFC – I saw the report on bbc and am truly at a loss. I watched most (not all) of the match. In terms of key decisions that I witnessed:
    1. Penalty and yellow card to the GK not given – VAR would have picked that up.
    2. Kent and Hayes yellow cards. Kent is a given for a shove in the chest. Not sure why Hayes got one – maybe bad language / aggressive posture / dissent.
    3. Kent 2nd yellow. Soft – yes. Stupid – yes. Petulant – yes. Late – yes. Any complaint from Kent – no. He gave the ref a decision to make not long after it being obvious that the ref was done with the playground stuff.
    4. Hayes “elbow” – linesman should have helped his ref out here. Stupid from Hayes which he got away with.
    5. Aberdeen penalty – no question with the handball. Should the penalty have been retaken because the ball got blown by the wind? Movement was to the disadvantage of Aberdeen so I would say no – can’t imagine it being a concern if a blue shirt was taking the penalty…
    I can’t think of anymore “big decision moments” in the game.
24. 
    

    Previosly
    https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/5264509/rangers-michael-beale-kevin-clancy-celtic/
25. 
    

    ‘Wokingcelt 21st January 2022 At 15:07

    Hayes “elbow” – linesman should have helped his ref out here. Stupid from Hayes which he got away with.
    Aberdeen penalty – no question with the handball. Should the penalty have been retaken because the ball got blown by the wind? Movement was to the disadvantage of Aberdeen so I would say no – can’t imagine it being a concern if a blue shirt was taking the penalty…’
    ::
    ::
    Re your no.4 – the AR should have flagged for Barisic impeding Hayes by holding his arm. Hayes wrestled free from his grasp & in doing so accidentally caught Barisic.

    Re your no.5 – Law 14 (The Penalty Kick), Section 1 (Procedure) states: ‘The ball must be stationary on the penalty mark..’

    (It’s page 117 in here – https://downloads.theifab.com/downloads/laws-of-the-game-2021-22?l=en)

    TRFC really have a brass neck. They played poorly & escaped with a point.
26. 
    

    @JJ – thx for the link. Re #4 – wouldn’t disagree but could be viewed as excessive by Hayes.
    Agree TRFC escaped with a point. Be interesting to see what if anything comes of the complaint – both formally and informally (when will Clancy get another TRFC match to ref…)
27. 
    

    I genuinely can’t imagine any other club who had been advantaged by not having a penalty awarded against them AND not being reduced to 10 men early in a match who would then complain about that referee for being unfair to them.
28. 
    

    Wokingcelt 21st Jan 15.07

    I can’t think of anymore “big decision moments” in the game.
    ………………………………………………………………………………………………………

    Just for starters there are two fouls prior to the awarding of the Aberdeen penalty. Pretty big decisions i would say.

    1 Brown raises his arm to impede Barasic who is tracking his man as the ball is crossed into the box.
    2 Ferguson clearly pushes Barasic with both hands before he heads the ball which then hits the arm of Morelos.
    Both clear fouls, both missed by the referee despite him looking directly at them.
29. 
    

    John Clark 20th January 2022 At 23:34
    ‘Westcoaster 20th January 2022 At 20:11
    ‘..A hat tip to Toby Perkins,.’

    %%%%%%%
    I am already mentally composing the letter I may send him !
    Thanks for posting that interesting link.”
    %%%%
    And here is my email to Toby Perkins MP

    To:
    toby.perkins.mp@parliament.uk

    Fri, 21 Jan at 23:20

    ‘Dear Mr Perkins,
    I have just watched (for the third time), on the BBC Parliament channel, the discussion in the House of Commons of the ‘urgent question’ of the position in which Derby County Football Club finds itself in.

    I am not English, do not live in England, and am not particularly interested in ‘politics’. You will therefore forgive me if I say that until I watched that discussion I had not heard of you.

    Believe me when I say that you are now a hero in my eyes, an honest hero.

    Why? Well, because you are the first public person to say, and to say in no less a place than in the chamber of the House of Commons, these words:
    “…clubs go out of existence altogether as we have seen in the case of Glasgow Rangers and Bury..”

    There is a culture of denial in the Scottish mainstream media, including BBC Scotland, of the fact that Rangers Football Club plc , on being wound up in consequence of the disastrous failure of the [publicly acknowledged] incompetent/inefficient Administrators either to find a buyer or to achieve a Creditors Voluntary Arrangement, went into Liquidation- and thereby went out of existence as a football club entitled to participate in Scottish professional football.

    What I want to put to you, however, is not so much a matter of football business, but of insolvency legislation and the launching of new companies on the financial market.

    To cut to the chase: the purchaser of some of the assets of Rangers FC plc [not of the whole of the club, otherwise the club would not have entered Liquidation!] was allowed to create a new club. But had to apply for membership of a recognised league. The new club [ initially un-named except asSevco5088/SevcoScotland] had to apply as a new club.

    As a new club it was admitted into Scottish professional football.
    But it was, by a secret Agreement, permitted to claim to be the Rangers Football Club that was founded in 1872!
    So far, so football.

    Turn to the world of business and finance and the Financial Conduct Authority(FCA) and associated matters.

    We find that the shareholders in a football club created in 2012 swap their shares for shares in a to-be-launched-on-the-market PLC, to be known as Rangers International Football Club plc.

    Oh, then we find that the Prospectus issued in the launching of this new PLC claims that it will be the holding company of Rangers football Club- founded in 1872, and the most successful football club in the world in terms of sporting honours and titles etc!

    Even to a thicko like me, that is a blatant untruth: the club created in 2012 cannot possibly be the club that is currently in Liquidation (under the name RFC 2012).

    It was the Rangers Football Club of 1872 that was liquidated. There was no ‘holding company’, as Companies house confirmed to me recently.

    I have tried to raise this with the FCA. The Nomad , it seems to me, seriously failed in his duty to check the truth of the ‘summary’ of the Prospectus.

    Blank wall!
    Which raises dark suspicions about the integrity of our Financial Regulators: a ‘Prospectus’ which misleads potential investors must surely have to be looked at.
    I do hope that Derby County gets out of Administration.

    As a wee footnote, I would not write to my own MP, because he has never asked questions about the secret ‘5-Way Agreement’ that allows a plc to claim that its primary source of revenue is a 150 year old football club instead of a club that was in fact only admitted into Scottish football in 2012 !

    Yours sincerely,
30. 
    

    And what about this?
    Listen to what one of the non-exec Directors of Celtic plc has to say in today’s ‘The Scotsman’.
    ” You need to be of a certain age to remember Kenny McIntyre [ed: I think that’s a reference to the father of the current BBC Sportsound presenter] when he was Scotland’s fearless political reporter….He would have held in contempt the present-day school of reporting-let’s stand outside Holyrood reading the latest communique, and would you be so kind as to give us a prepared sound-bite, Minister?……Scotland’s broadcasters need to change their mindset and play their part in holding authority to account..”

    What hypocritical cant from someone who sits on the Board of a two-faced plc which refused, and refuses still, to ask hard questions of the Scottish Football authorities.
    Gie’s a brek, Brian Wilson!
31. 
    

    Albertz11 21st January 2022 At 23:11
    //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

    It seems that you, in common with whoever (club or company) wrote the 8-point letter to the SFA, are determined to studiously avoid the most critical point about the performance of Clancy and his assistants.

    None of the subsequent individual ‘refereeing errors and inconsistencies’ that were listed would’ve come to pass if the officials had taken the correct course of action when Allan McGregor clattered into Ryan Hedges in the penalty box. I wonder why that escaped the list of damning evidence.

    Nobody can predict with any certainty what would have happened after such a sending off and penalty, but I’d wager that an increasingly dominant and confident Dons side would have won the game at a canter, based on how the game panned out with a full complement of players.

    Post-match, that failure by the officials to award a penalty and send off the keeper was almost universally acknowledged as something that would have been corrected by VAR.

    If I thought for a moment that Rangers* were in any way highlighting the woeful standard of our officials for the common good of Scottish football, I’d applaud them. Unfortunately, their selective amnesia about certain events merely confirms that they are simply trying to appease the substantial knuckle-dragging element of their support while dictating who should and shouldn’t officiate future matches.

    Their misplaced sense of entitlement is almost reminiscent of their predecessor club before its self-inflicted demise.
32. 
    

    Highlander 22nd Jan 10.06

    Penalty – Yes
    Red Card – No

    Barasic was clearly covering and therefore no obvious goal scoring opportunity was denied by McGregors genuine attempt.
    As you correctly say “Nobody could predict with any certainty what would have happened” and so any subsequent comments are pointless.
    As i said previously i don’t believe referees are biased but some , Clancy being one, are not up to the standard required . Rangers have every right to go through the proper channels and express their concerns.
    Every club has this right but as per usual it only seems to attract attention when Rangers are involved.
33. 
    

    https://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/19867176.demonising-scotlands-referees-puts-risk-endangers-national-game—matthew-lindsay/

    Matthew Lindsay in today’s online version of the Herald –

    ‘…The match official had a split second to make his call at Pittodrie. If the referee was in any way unsure about what had happened then he could not give it…

    …So wasn’t the referee correct to allow play to continue?…’

    Well Matthew, let’s see:

    If he was unsure what had happened, then something must have occurred to make him ‘unsure’. (The alternative is that he found McGregor’s failure to play the ball & Hedges’ going to ground as unremarkable. That is, in itself, remarkable for a ‘top-flight’ referee’.) Was it a foul by McGregor, punishable by a penalty-kick & a yellow (not red, I think, under ‘double-jeopardy’ interpretations) card? Was it simulation by Hedges, who had played the ball beyond the keeper towards the six-yard line & still within the field of play, punishable by an indirect free-kick & a yellow card? Either of those should have led to a whistle, but didn’t. TRFC played on, transitioned upfield & scored.

    Lindsay also writes –

    ‘…Nobody working for broadcaster Sky Sports could agree [that it was a penalty] after watching numerous replays from different angles…’

    Boyd & McInnes both thought it was a penalty when asked at half-time. Walker (who was rarely correct in any of his comments throughout the match) thought it wasn’t, then it was. Crocker? A waste of a seat on the gantry. He appears to be paid for the number of times he can shoehorn ‘Old Firm’, ‘Celtic’ & ‘Rangers’ into his commentary, not for his skills in interpreting what is happening on the pitch.
34. 
    

    Many clubs will contact the SFA with concerns, but rarely do clubs use friendly journalists to get it all over the media that they did so. It’s not that long ago Willie Collum was taken off Rangers games for months, after Rangers publicly complained about one of their players being red carded. I suspect Kevin Clancy will now face the same situation. Any time Celtic have made a complaint in the past the same Referee is defiantly put in charge of one of their games within 3-4 weeks, with huge SFA and media backing. I’m quite sure other clubs haven’t had Referees removed from their games either. If Kevin Clancy is not given a Rangers game for a while now then serious questions really need to be asked of the SFA.
35. 
    

    Not Scottish but nearby .
    https://twitter.com/i/status/1484913906749431808
36. 
    

    Paddy Malarkey 22nd January 2022 At 15:45
    ‘..Not Scottish but nearby …’
    %%%%%%
    Thanks for that link, PM.
    What’s in a name, indeed!
    I went on a fascinating exploration online of why a ‘drone’ is a drone…
    .. ‘Tiger moth’ planes pre-war, ‘queen bees’, the male counterpart , drone, from old English/ Germanic language…
    See this blog? Bloody marvellous at throwing up interesting and stimulating questions that are not necessarily related directly to ‘football’, but which lead people to seek the Truth.

    And of course there can only be actual Truth, no matter how many perceptions of ‘Truth’ there may be!

    Is TRFC the Rangers Football Club of 1872 foundation?
    As an absolute matter of fact and law, it is not, and cannot possibly be: schizophrenic split personalities are not recognised in the Articles of Association of the SPL/SFL or of SFA!

    People lied in 2012 ( and for a decade before).
    They still lie.
    And, like Macbeth, they are so far steeped in lying[as Macbeth was in blood] that going back is not an option.

    God help the lying wretches, who, of course, KNOW that they are liars, and are hanging together for fear of being hanged separately.
    Honest to God.
37. 
    

    Post in thread ‘UB Banner’ https://www.followfollow.com/forum/threads/ub-banner.191784/post-10662219
38. 
    

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/kevin-clancy-axed-rangers-row-26026892
39. 
    

    Paddy Malarkey 23rd January 2022 @ 1758hrs –

    I note from your link that A. Dallas has been handed Motherwell v. Hibs this midweek.

    He didn’t handle a Premiership match from 05.12.20 until 01.12.21. That’s 51 weeks 4 days. (I don’t know why he didn’t get any Premiership matches in between those dates. I suppose it’s in the SFA’s ‘Big Book Of Secrets That Would Blow Supporters’ Minds’ & can never be made public.)

    That last match he handled in 2020, you ask? Motherwell v. Hibs. That’s two of his last three Premiership appointments featuring the same two teams at the same location. Well done, Crawfie! Yer daeing brullianto!
40. 
    

    Paddy Malarkey 23rd January 2022 At 17:58
    %%%%%%%%%
    Your link to the DR’s report that Clancy has been ‘axed’ from this week’s lis.
    Sportsound this afternoon had quite a good discussion about the deficiencies of our referees, and the need for VAR to be introduced so that mistakes can be rectified.
    Reference of course was made to the 8-point – letter from the club that lies about its origins, which of course got Kenny Mac whining aggressively about 2 months having passed since Bankier’s comments about referees yet not a cheep from the SFA .
    In my opinion, McIntyrre is not balanced enough as a chairperson to facilitate discussion , being too eager to give vent over-excitedly to his own views rather than merely pose questions and seek the opinions of his guests and draw them out.
    (Incidentally, although I was/am disappointed that the SFSA appears to have accepted for the moment that challenging the ‘Big Lie’ at the heart of Scottish Football is not within their brief, I nevertheless have completed their online survey, and would encourage fans to do so. The survey can be found at
    https://s-f-s-a.onlinesurveys.ac.uk/scottish-football-alliance-survey
    Scabby and scurvy as it and the crew sailing it may be, I don’t particularly want the ‘SS Scottish Football’ to founder!
41. 
    

    Paddy Malarkey 23rd Jan 17.58

    A couple of points
    The appointments for this weeks games were announced last week before any concerns were raised by Rangers.
    He (KC) didn’t referee any games on weeks 19 (18/12) & 20 (26/12) .
    Was he axed then?
    Desperate attempt by the DR to link his absence to the concerns raised last week.
42. 
    

    I was reading an article earlier from the Times written a few years back. It mentions that Fergus McCann saved Celtic from going out of business with eight minutes to spare. This general theme is mentioned in various media outlets from time to time. My question is if the same outlets say ‘Rangers’ didn’t go out of business when liquidated in 2012, and go on to say they can never go out of business no matter what, how can they so freely say Celtic would have gone out of business in 1994? I think it’s a fair question.
43. 
    

    Add more names to the list of Ranger player (former), Alex Rae and Colin Hendry whom Scott Brown has truly upset and has got deep into their heads. I’m sure during their careers they didn’t try to wind up an opponent, have some form of mocking, etc. Its part of the game and if coaches/managers know it, you can be sure its relayed to players who are good at it. Get over it guys. Will their be another letter on its way to Scottish football hq from Rangers complaining about the lack of a home draw in the next round of the Scottish Cup. Quite an unusual situation for them based on past draws. Finally Alloa did quite a hatchet job on Celtic. Must be some form of a brown envelope on its way from Ibrox for taking out three players Would have been interesting to see their approach to the game if it had been Rangers. I suspect the Alloa team would have been no where near a Ranger player with any intent of a tackle, block, etc.
44. 
    

    Upthehoops 23rd January 2022 At 20:52
    ‘..”..how can they so freely say Celtic would have gone out of business in 1994?” I think it’s a fair question.’
    %%%%%%%%%

    It is indeed a fair question to ask, and it is fairly easily answered: they know that the Scottish Football Authorities would have applied the rules with absolute rigour, and the ‘establishment’ would never have countenanced anything else!

    There would have been NO POSSIBILITY of a dirty 5-Way Agreement under which a new club would have been granted immediate entry into Scottish professional football,[ into even the bottom-most league!] never mind being allowed, by a despicable set of conniving liars in ‘football governance,’ to claim to be the Celtic of 1887/88, magically doing what no other busted football club has managed to do-‘survive’ Liquidation; and getting away with marketing itself as the holding company of Celtic of old without the Financial regulators asking hard questions-so far, at least.

    As I have frequently said, the wickedness of the liars in Scottish Football is bad enough : but it is overshadowed by the complicity of the dreadful wretches in the SMSM who style themselves ‘journalists’.
    A plague on them.
45. 
    

    Vernallen 24th Jan 01.36

    ” Will their be another letter on its way to Scottish football hq from Rangers complaining about the lack of a home draw in the next round of the Scottish Cup. Quite an unusual situation for them based on past draws.”
    ……………………………………………….
    Cup draws from 2016/17

    Rangers (H) 17 (A) 13.
    Celtic (H) 17 (A) 10
46. 
    

    And Big John Beattie asking whether we’ll ever see any of the fraudulently obtained billions of pounds in Covid loans to companies.
    I meantime wonder whether the millions of tax evaded by EBT schemes as operated by at least one football club some years back that conveniently went bust will ever be recovered?
    No?
    I thought not.
    Never heard Big John or anyone else on the BBC slate that EBT football club’s majority share-holder.
47. 
    

    ‘John Clark 24th January 2022 At 18:04

    And Big John Beattie…

    …Never heard Big John or anyone else on the BBC slate that EBT football club’s majority share-holder.’
    ::
    ::
    Mr. Beattie is of the blue persuasion. He admitted as much on air when he was host of Radio Shortbread’s lunchtime news show.
48. 
    

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/crown-office-must-answer-questions-on-rangers-fiasco-cgjtfhjbl

    A former Holyrood cabinet minister has called for an independent review into the workings of the Crown Office following a botched police fraud investigation into the takeover of ‘Rangers’.

    Yet not one single politician, past or present, has ever asked questions why the man who put the illegal tax avoidance scheme in place which led to it all remains untouched, and is indeed still revered by many. Just what is it about this man that allows him to hold such apparent power? It truly beggars belief, and from a personal point of view makes a mockery of the view that Scotland is a fair society. The fact innocent people have been maliciously chased, while someone who had some major tax dealings that were ruled illegal by the Supreme Court is still held in such a high position of esteem within the Scottish Establishment is an insult to every honest taxpayer who ever existed. It’s absolutely sickening to the core.
49. 
    

    Albertz11 23rd January 2022 At 20:18
    Haven’t a clue or much of an interest . I posted the link for information . It’s your mob that have a thing about Kevin Clancy . I think his very name upsets a certain group of fans , regardless of his competence as a referee . So, was he axed then ?
50. 
    

    Albertz11 — 24 Jan 22 — 13:19

    Thanks for your update on draws. Memory may not be what it used to be but seem to recall that sometime after liquidation in 2012 there were a couple of extended streaks in both cup competition where Rangers or TRFC enjoyed home advantage. Stand to be corrected.
51. 
    

    Albertz11 22nd January 2022 At 11:04
    Penalty – Yes
    Red Card – No
    Barasic was clearly covering and therefore no obvious goal scoring opportunity was denied by McGregors genuine attempt.
    As you correctly say “Nobody could predict with any certainty what would have happened” and so any subsequent comments are pointless.
    As i said previously i don’t believe referees are biased but some , Clancy being one, are not up to the standard required . Rangers have every right to go through the proper channels and express their concerns.
    Every club has this right but as per usual it only seems to attract attention when Rangers are involved.

    ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

    So, if it was a definite penalty and the purpose of the letter to the SFA was to highlight the poor standard of officiating, why wasn’t the biggest blunder in the entire game on Rangers’* list of errors and inconsistencies?

    As I alluded to above, none of the subsequent incidents that Rangers* complained about would have transpired if the penalty had been correctly awarded. The sequence of events thereafter would’ve been entirely different and Rangers* wouldn’t have broken downfield and scored, for example, as they’d likely be restarting the game from the centre circle following Aberdeen’s penalty.

    Let me be crystal clear here. I’m arguing that if Kevin Clancy is deemed to be such a poor official that he shouldn’t officiate at Rangers’* matches, then he’s clearly unfit to be in charge of ANY GAME, not just those involving Rangers*. The current franchise playing out of Ibrox seem to want to pick and choose the officials that best suit them rather than genuinely striving to improve the standard of officiating for all the clubs.

    The industrial scale criticism contained in the catalogue of errors letter from Ibrox that resulted in a ‘constructive’ dialogue meeting with the SFA seems to fly in the face of the SFA’s well established policy of punishing managers, players and club officials who dare to criticise match officials. I’ll take your word for it that this avenue is open to all clubs, not just those who shout the loudest.

    Finally, I dread to think of the level of seethe if Scotland’s pluckiest new club ever genuinely ends up on the receiving end of poor officiating if this is how they behave when a stonewall penalty isn’t awarded against them but they still portray themselves as victims.
52. 
    

    ps – note to the mods – is it really necessary to have Albertz11’s posts in moderation? He and I are about as far apart in opinion over ‘the saga’ as it’s possible to get, but in my opinion he nonetheless deserves the same posting rights as the rest of us so long as he remains polite and respectful, which to my knowledge he has always been. It’s annoying missing one of his replies simply because it doesn’t appear until some considerable time after it was typed. There is a danger that the forum merely becomes an echo chamber if dissenting opinion is stifled or discouraged.
53. 
    

    Upthehoops 24th January 2022 At 21:21
    ‘..Yet not one single politician, past or present, has ever asked questions..’
    %%%%%%%%%$
    Yes, indeed ,Uth.
    Likewise no politician or public figure has queried the RIFC plc ” Prospectus” with its nonsensical claim that RIFC lc is the holding company of the Rangers Football Club that was founded in 1872!
    In which connection, not yet having received an acknowledgment to my email , I have sent this email to the FCA:
    “To:
    complaints@frccommissioner.org.uk

    Tue, 25 Jan at 11:44

    Dear R.. L..,
    I refer to my email of 30 December 2021.
    May I be favoured with an acknowledgement of that email?

    Better still, may I have an answer to my basic question:
    has, or will, the FCA examine the ‘Prospectus’ issued by Rangers International Football Club plc in 2012 in connection with its IPO , in which it marketed itself as being the holding company of a football club [ company number SC004276] that went into Liquidation in that year and which is still in Liquidation, when in fact and law it was/is the holding company of ‘The Rangers Football Club Ltd’ [ company number SC 425159]?

    I believe that the Prospectus was seriously misleading, and gave the impression that potential investors would be investing in the historic Rangers FC of 1872 instead of a brand new club first admitted into Scottish football in 2012!
    At a time when Government itself at the highest level is under heavy pressure to explain itself, I think it is of critical importance that Financial regulatory authorities, accountable ultimately to Parliament, should be ready to show that they listen to and respond to serious questions seriously put to them by members of the public.

    Yours sincerely,..”
54. 
    

    Sad to hear the news that former Celtic manager Wim Jansen has passed away.

    Despite being the man who stopped our 10 it was impossible to dislike him.

    Condolences to his family.
55. 
    

    John Clark 25th January 2022 At 12:03
    ………..
    The club web site tells you The Rangers International football club plc is the Holding company of The Rangers Football club Limited. I have not read the prospectus for some time but i takenit is missleading?
56. 
    

    Further to my post of 12.03 today, and having listened to the latest developments in the Downing St ‘partygate’ matter , I have copied my email [ to the Complaints Commissioner] to Toby Perkins MP just for his general interest in failing football clubs, and to say that when Government itself is suspected of hiding unpleasant truths, we may be sure that Government agencis/departments might not be above doing likewise if it suits their book.
    Integrity?
    We have not seen much of that in the BBC/SMSM in relation to the nonsense of the 5-Way Agreement. Are we seeing it in the FCA?
57. 
    

    Looks like Derby FC may be a valuable lesson for all in football. Maybe the SFA should take a look to avoid and such scenario here?

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/jan/25/derby-county-what-is-going-on-and-will-club-survive-key-questions-answered
58. 
    

    Cluster One 25th January 2022 At 12:35
    “..e but i taken it is missleading?”
    %%%%%%%%%
    Have a look at this link for starters , reading the whole of it.

    https://www.investegate.co.uk/ArticlePrint.aspx?id=201212050956047840S
    This excerpt in particular
    “COMPANY BUSINESS (INCLUDING MAIN COUNTRY OF OPERATION) OR, IN THE CASE OF AN INVESTING COMPANY, DETAILS OF ITS INVESTING POLICY). IF THE ADMISSION IS SOUGHT AS A RESULT OF A REVERSE TAKE-OVER UNDER RULE 14, THIS SHOULD BE STATED:

    Rangers International Football Club plc following admission will own and operate Rangers Football Club Limited. Rangers Football Club, based in Scotland, has become one of the world’s most successful clubs, having won 54 League titles, 33 Scottish Cups, 27 League Cups and the European Cup Winners’ Cup in 1972. Playing at the 50,987 seater Ibrox Stadium, Scotland, and benefitting from the world class 37 acre Murray Park training facility, the club has been a dominant force in Scottish football for decades.

    The club generates revenues from match-day sales, broadcasting rights, retail and merchandising as well as other media rights. ”

    It’s very clear to me that potential investors were led to believe that whatever the name of the football club, they would be investing in the historic Rangers that had won 54 league titles etc etc!
    It is astonishing that the ‘NOMAD’ let that go!

    [I’m having difficulty downloading the full IPO Prospectus, but I’ll keep trying. It has of course disappeared off the RIFC/Rangers FC website’s investors page, but I should be able to turn it up]
59. 
    

    ‘Cluster One 25th January 2022 At 12:35

    John Clark 25th January 2022 At 12:03
    ………..
    The club web site tells you The Rangers International football club plc is the Holding company of The Rangers Football club Limited. I have not read the prospectus for some time but i takenit is missleading?’
    ::
    ::
    I thought I’d have a look for the prospectus to refresh my memory.

    I chanced upon this on the Investors’ Chronicle website, bylined Ken Wieland & dated 13/12/2012:

    https://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/2012/12/13/shares/news-and-analysis/rangers-to-debut-on-aim-Cfp9SvZqxYCJG1VyljMyYI/article.html

    This is the first paragraph –

    ‘Rangers International Football Club (RIFC) plc is expected to join London’s junior market on 19 December. For fans, that means the opportunity to grab a stake in Glasgow Rangers, 54-times Scottish champions, as an early Christmas present. The official name is now Rangers Football Club Ltd. RIFC is to own and operate Rangers FC, which, after exiting administration earlier this year, is now debt-free but plying its trade in the fourth tier of Scottish football.’

    Quite hilariously inaccurate, Mr. Wieland.
    [I’m still looking for the complete prospectus online.]
60. 
    

    Dom16 25th January 2022 At 14:34
    ‘…Maybe the SFA should take a look to avoid and such scenario here?’
    %%%%%%%%
    Do you mean this scenario
    “…both of whom believe Derby knowingly skirted EFL rules to gain an advantage at their expense, ..” ?
    Are they accused of giving false info to the EFL about how much they were paying their players, by any chance?
    Surely no club would even dream of cheating like that? And surely if a club were to do that it would deserve to be expelled in total disgrace not merely suffer Liquidation!
61. 
    

    Jingso.Jimsie 25th January 2022 At 16:00
    “..I chanced upon this on the Investors’ Chronicle website, bylined Ken Wieland & dated 13/12/2012:”
    %%%%%%%%%
    Good spot!
    Wieland would have got a job on any of the Scottish newspapers, with such ready disregard for truth!
    Honest to God, I have no difficulty in working out where Dante would put him!
62. 
    

    Highlander 25th Jan 10.15

    ” why wasn’t the biggest blunder in the entire game on Rangers’* list of errors and inconsistencies?”
    ……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………….
    At the conclusion of every fixture both clubs must complete a online form giving the match details. This includes any comments regarding the performance of the match officials. I daresay the incident you refer to will have been included in Aberdeen’s post match assessment . Rangers, like very other club, are unlikely to highlight a decision that benefitted them.
    Re – KC, my personal opinion is that he falls quite a bit below the standard expected from a top level official with two decades experience and should be removed from the list of approved officials.
    …………………………………………………………..

    “SFA’s well established policy of punishing managers, players and club officials who dare to criticise match officials.”
    ………………………………
    We have recently seen Hibernian defender Paul McGinn given a two match ban for being critical of a referee’s performance so it will be interesting to see if this is applied on a consistent basis given the comments by the Celtic manager toward Don Roberson today.
63. 
    

    There must have been a shiver among the board of directors at Rangers today with the news UEFA has cracked down on FFP regulations with two clubs feeling the brunt. I’m sure they were scouring their files for any “overdue payables” that needed clearing by the end of the month. Potential for another share issue? With the potential of being barred from CL play, EL play or EL Conference on the table it might be squeaky bum time. It seems to me the former edition of Rangers had problems discerning overdue payables and payables due. It would be ironic if they did win the Scottish league then not be qualified for the competition due to “overdue payables”.
64. 
    

    JJ…
    https://scotslawthoughts.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/rifc-prospectus.pdf
65. 
    

    HirsutePursuit 25th January 2022 At 23:59
    ‘.JJ…[ link to the RIFC plc Prospectus]
    %%%%%%%%%
    Good man yourself!
    Section B3 is the dastardly cunning bit.
    ” …RFCL [ed: meaning SevcoScotland] acquired the assets and business of the Club… It is the intention of theDirectors and the Manager for the Club to RETURN [ed:my capitals] to top flight football as soon
    as possible. [ed: clearly implying that it was the Sevco club that was in the third division and would aim to get back to the top flight] ”
    It’ such a monstrous fiction that one has to admire CG”s wicked genius, while hoping that he never enjoys any lasting benefit from his ‘cleverness’.
    How could any Nomad ever have accepted that it could be right for a new plc to claim to be the holding company of the most successful football club in the world, when that club had ceased to exist?
    There are as many questions to ask of that Nomad as can be asked about ‘Partygate’, in my opinion.
66. 
    

    Vernallen 25th January 2022 At 22:40
    ‘.. It would be ironic if they did win the Scottish league then not be qualified for the competition due to “overdue payables”.’
    %%%%%%%%
    Such a consummation is devoutly to be wished as being no more than condign punishment for claiming to be what they are not, as well as being a beautiful example of poetic justice!

    But of course the liars in Scottish football governance would easily be persuaded to take a ‘pragmatic’ view’ , as that ar.e-hole of a junior Minister urged the EFL to do in relation to the Derby County situation, and do another fix. They have thus far got away with the first fix, and would try another without a blush.
67. 
    

    Vernallen 25th January 2022 At 22:40

    I believe for UEFA to act against clubs requires the relevant National Association to bring issues to their attention. I don’t think anyone at Ibrox needs to worry about anything on that score.
68. 
    

    Let me say that yesterday afternoon I received a reply from the Complaints Commissioner’s office to my most recent email to them on 25 January 2022. It was more or less merely a repeat of the previous reply , which didn’t deal with my actual complaint about the RIFC plc ‘Prospectus ‘ but about my complaint about the delays by the FCA in replying to previous correspondence. I clearly did not express myself too intelligibly!

    It seems I am out of time to make a complaint to the Complaints Commissioner unless I can persuade her ( the Commissioner is a woman) to accept my reason for not complaining within the normal time.
    Here is what I have sent in reply:

    “complaints@frccommissioner.org.uk

    Wed, 26 Jan at 14:28

    Dear Rachel, (if you don’t mind the informality),
    Let me eat humble pie!

    I had thought that the FCA was the last word in financial regulation, and had not really appreciated that the Complaints Commissioner existed as an independent entity. That was my fault for not really carefully reading what I believed to be a reply to what was not my basic complaint; I was complaining about delays but that was incidental to my substantive complaint which was not about the delays in communication, but about the possibility that a plc had issued a misleading IPO Prospectus and had been allowed to do so by the Nomad/FCA.

    If I may, I now wish formally to complain to the Complaints Commissioner
    That,
    The ‘Prospectus’ issued by Rangers International Football Club plc [‘RIFC plc’] in December 2012 relating to their Initial Public Offer was, in my opinion, misleading in that it represented that RIFC plc would be the holding company of Rangers Football Club[ company number SC004276], whereas in fact and in law it would become, did become, and is the holding company of ‘The Rangers Football Club Ltd] [ company number SC425159];

    that Rangers Football Club plc, having failed to be brought out of Administration entered ‘compulsory Liquidation’ under the name ‘RFC plc 2012’, and ceased operations as a football club in October 2012, having had to surrender its share in the then Scottish Premier League and having in consequence lost its entitlement to membership of the Scottish Football Association;

    that the Rangers Football Club Ltd [co.number SC 00425159 ] is a football club newly created and admitted into Scottish Football only in 2012, and is not and cannot legally be the football club of which RIFC plc claims to be the holding company, and entitled to be marketed as being RFC plc[ company number SC 004276];
    and
    that by claiming that Rangers Football Club Ltd [company number SC 00425159] is RFC plc [company number SC 004276] , the Prospectus issued by RIFC plc is wholly misleading in its claim to be the holding company of ‘the most successful football club in the world’;

    that the Nominated Advisor ought to have been aware of the fact that RFC plc had not been brought out of Administration but went into Liquidation [in which state it continues to this day] and that The Rangers Football Club Ltd came into being only in 2012, and had no history-sporting or otherwise- as a football club.

    As I understand it the FCA itself is unable to deal with this complaint.

    I also now understand that I am ‘late’ in making this complaint to the proper quarter, the Complaints Commissioner.

    However, I ask the Commissioner to understand that I am not at all well-versed in matters of this kind, and that I came to understand the seriousness of this matter (if my opinion of what happened is at all correct) only in relatively recent times. I tried to ‘complain’ as soon as I, as an ignorant layman, thought I had got to grips with what I think actually happened, having checked the source material as best as I could; and ask the Commissioner to him to exercise her discretion and investigate this complaint because, if I am correct, then what happened was that a massive deception was de facto [whatever may have been the intention] practised on the investing public, a deception which ought to have been spotted by the Nominated Advisor: in my opinion.

    I thank you personally for your unfailing courtesy, and of course I sincerely apologise for any curtness on my part, occasioned by my own failings to communicate sufficiently clearly!
    Yours ….”
69. 
    

    JC…
    I’m not sure if this may be of any assistance to you, but the original SPL articles may be of some interest to you…
    https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/SC175364/filing-history/ODAyNTYwNjhhZGlxemtjeA/document?format=pdf&download=0
    Article 4 is especially relevant. Here, the term ‘football club’ is used in its natural, everyday meaning. There is no capitalisation, because the meaning is clear and unambiguous.

    In this article it is expressly stated that only football clubs can hold shares.

    It could be written in this way because all of the football clubs were corporate bodies and could legally hold shares in another company.

    The list of shareholders is given here…
    https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/SC175364/filing-history/OTk3MTk0ODVhZGlxemtjeA/document?format=pdf&download=0

    The IPO capitalised the word Club so appears to have a specific meaning that would be different from normal usage – but no definition (that I could find) was provided to distinguish ‘Club’ from the natural, everyday meaning of ‘football club’. Since, as you say, the original football club is clearly not the same as the current football club, I can only agree with your assessment that the IPO document was, at the very least, misleading.

    Did the IPO take its lead from the updated SPL articles?

    In 2005, the SPL rewrote its articles to be able to distinguish between the holder of a share and the football club. At the time, Brechin could have become eligible to be part of the SPL (under proposals for SPL 2) but is not an incorporated body. As an unincorporated association cannot legally own anything, the share in the company would have to be held by one of the club’s committee members. That, under the original articles, would have meant the committee member (as holder of the SPL share) would be considered to be the football club.
    The new articles simply allowed the share in the SPL to be held by someone other than the football club.
    The new articles even say that the definition of Club should normally include its owner and operator – that is because the owner and operator of a Club is normally the football club itself.
    It is only when a football club is unincorporated that the Club and its owner and operator (the SPL/SPFL shareholder) can be distinguished as separate entities.
    Since Rangers was an incorporated body, even under the new SPL articles, there is no separation between the original Club (as defined by the SPL articles) and the football club that was The Rangers Football Club plc.
    Obviously, there is no separation between the current Club (as defined by the SPFL articles) and the football club that is The Rangers Football Club Ltd.

    No matter how many times Neil Doncaster and others repeat the lie, The Rangers Football Club plc is simply not the same Club (football club) as The Rangers Football Club Ltd

    If the IPO was a fraud, who were partners to it?
70. 
    

    Regardless of contributors affiliations the passing of Wim Jansen should not be allowed to go without this site expressing a collective sympathy to the family of a genuine football man who had an enormous impact on Scottish football .

    R.I.P.
71. 
    

    HirsutePursuit 26th January 2022 At 17:53
    ‘…JC…
    I’m not sure if this may be of any assistance to you, but the original SPL articles may be of some interest to you…’
    %%%%%%%%%
    HP, any confirmation that I’m not an auld monomaniacal eejit chuntering on about an imagined wrong is comfortingly welcome !
    And thank you for your post.
    I think I’m on record as having been no more than quietly entertained by ‘Rangers’ tax difficulties, believing that SDM had plenty of millions to cover any little tax problem if he would but choose to do so, without me for a minute thinking that there had been any fundamental , deliberate cheating of both the taxman and the Football Authorities behind it all.

    The RTC blog [ honour to him] opened my eyes to the ugly facts, and prompted me to begin to attend such of the legal proceedings that were open to the public and accessible by me, who knew/knows not a lot about the business/investment/sports administration/sfa/UEFA/FIFA /legal worlds.
    I have learned a helluva lot since!
    These present days, when Government at the highest level is being questioned as to its fundamental honesty , one can be forgiven for having reservations about the readiness of agencies of government to adhere to principles of truth, if in so doing they make problems for themselves!

    I hope that the Complaints Commissioner ( Ms Amerdeep Somal] will see my complaint, and judge that there is sufficient substance in it as to warrant investigation, even if 10 years after the event.

    She will surely be alive to the fact that if RIFC plc can get away with what I think is a misleading Prospectus, there will be other folk who might follow suit.
    And bang would go the credibility of the FCA as any kind of meaningful ‘regulator’
    Honest to God!
72. 
    

    Might be interesting to see how this Administration turns out . I saw this a few minutes ago
    https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/derby-county-is-given-a-four-week-stay-of-execution/ar-AATciX4
    From the Daily Mail
    Charlie Walker For Mailonline 49 mins ago

    ‘Following a formal review of revised financial forecasts at Derby County, the EFL and Quantuma (the Club Administrators) have today agreed a month-long extension to the deadline set for proof of funding to be provided,’ the statement said.
    The EFL and Quantuma said the stay of execution would allow Derby to continue discussions with interested parties and provide ‘additional time to seek clarity on the claims from Middlesbrough and Wycombe’.

    The statement came after local politicians and officials demanded a meeting with the EFL and Quantuma following days of frustration and ‘radio silence’.

    Derbyshire MPs, led by Conservative Pauline Latham want to meet both parties on Friday.

    The EFL and administrators have not said how the additional month will be funded, however, Derby has reduced its cost base with six players leaving during the January transfer window.

    Sources close to the negotiations have told Sportsmail that the administrators have sought additional lending from MSD Capital, which has already lent the club £20M secured against the ground and a further sum to pay the bills since it went into administration in September.”

    [* MSD Capital appears to be the holding company of Cayman Islands registered company -MSD Partners Europe LLP.]
73. 
    

    John Clark 27th January 2022 @ 1154hrs –

    I’ve been reading up a little on MSD Capital. Its owner is Michael Dell, who basically owns Dell Computers & MSD is run to manage the family’s piles of money.

    Here’s the interesting bit for me:

    Why would a US private investment firm loan a struggling football club a reported £200m (secured against its assets, which aren’t valued at that sum, leaving MSD heavily exposed should DCFC cease trading) to limp along from crisis to crisis when the amount required to remove said club from administration is ostensibly £28m (plus whatever is required to stabilise & restructure the business)?

    Interestingly, Mike Ashley is hovering in the background, as is another US private investment firm, Carlisle Capital.
74. 
    

    Well well well

    https://www.taxwatchuk.org/mr-red/

    Some stirring in the undergrowth?
75. 
    

    This is interesting.

    https://www.taxwatchuk.org/mr-red/