Reflections on Goalposts

ByDanish Pastry

Reflections on Goalposts

A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.

One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.

My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.

We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.

These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.

The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.

At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.

The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.

This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.

How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.

You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.

Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.

About the author

Danish Pastry author

4,642 Comments so far

scapaflowPosted on7:44 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Tif Finn says:
January 17, 2014 at 5:56 pm

Unfortunately, not everyone who is involved, however loosely, in this everyday tale of Scottish Football, is playing with a full deck. There is no point in making it easy for the sort of feckwit who abused Ms Haggerty by publishing details of potential targets

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Paulmac2Posted on7:48 pm - Jan 17, 2014


easyJambo says:
January 17, 2014 at 5:55 pm
………………………………….

Really?…he needs a contract to sign to give back 50 %….

The word liar is bouncing around my head and I don’t know why?

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Angus1983Posted on7:55 pm - Jan 17, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 17, 2014 at 7:44 pm

——
Very true, Scapa. However, one only has to put the chap’s name into Google and his LinkedIn profile is the top result. I don’t think the bears have anything against him or his trawling for advertisers, and why should they? Anyone witha particular anti-Rangers feeling could probably find a better blue target for their ire too.

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weescotsmanPosted on7:56 pm - Jan 17, 2014


I currently just happen to working in Pacific Quay for the Beeb on a 3 month I.T. contract; I’m so tempted to print out a few choice quotes from TSFM and leave them in strategic locations. Like the sports and news desks…… haven’t managed to espy the shrinking violet known as Chic so far, not that I really want to, but I have spotted Dougie Vipond. Nearly bumped into the lovely Jackie Bird a couple of times, unintentionally of course.

Dare I be so bold to leave some of the choice material on here for MSM hacks to “discover” then ?

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neepheidPosted on8:00 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Paulmac2 says:
January 17, 2014 at 7:48 pm
1 0 Rate This

easyJambo says:
January 17, 2014 at 5:55 pm
………………………………….

Really?…he needs a contract to sign to give back 50 %….

The word liar is bouncing around my head and I don’t know why?
==========
Could our hero be delaying so that in the event of insolvency, his own claim as creditor is maximised? But then a man who signed his own employment contract without even knowing what the pay was, would never, ever think like that. Would he? What a leg end! When will the bears open their sleepy eyes and see what this unpleasant, self serving wee scunner has done to them – and to their “club”?

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scapaflowPosted on8:00 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Angus1983 says:
January 17, 2014 at 7:55 pm

Angus, I was thinking more that the Celtic Connection might be problematic for both parties

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paulsatimPosted on8:11 pm - Jan 17, 2014


jake the snake ‏@celticservant 17m
MELTDOWN! 85,000 posts on FF! pic.twitter.com/bqVmgS0cKm

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paulsatimPosted on8:11 pm - Jan 17, 2014


part deux

jake the snake ‏@celticservant 16m
This Earl of Leven is falling apart. Magic. pic.twitter.com/OmSiRxJm8H

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Angus1983Posted on8:19 pm - Jan 17, 2014


paulsatim says:
January 17, 2014 at 8:11 pm

jake the snake ‏@celticservant 17m
MELTDOWN! 85,000 posts on FF! pic.twitter.com/bqVmgS0cKm
——
Not a bad original post there, although the Division 3 thing might be a bit ambitious. 🙂

Scapa – aye, point taken.

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AquinasPosted on8:19 pm - Jan 17, 2014


CanuckBhoy, you make a brilliant point, I found it an education and from what I can follow I’m agreeing with you 90%.

10% of me says there isn’t enough smart people on SS Sevco to avoid the bergs, if you have worked out a plan that would make sense, roll in 10,000 maniacs (sorry) and they will wreck the plan and the tribute act before the spivs can lower the curtain.

SPFL up yer game!

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TailothebankPosted on8:30 pm - Jan 17, 2014


So there we have it .. AMcC is still on £800 k per annum..no pay cut yet! …and as a MANAGER in that institution as in every company in the land who in a crisis should be backing up the CEO till his nose bleeds..is in fact railing against him by backing the players…
In every other company in Scotland bar absolutely none with that behaviour ..he would be ‘liftin his jaicket and be doon the road tae the broo wae a right good boot up the a..e ‘.and by the way every RFC fan knows it !
What a complete clown and duplicitous character!!!..
By the way how weak is Wallace if he doesn’t fire him on the spot????
Even worse again are our media who instead of telling the truth and hanging him out to dry and consequently helping to get rid of him ..actually lionise him!
we can all laugh but It must be absolutely murder to be an informed RFC fan right now
Phew!

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paulsatimPosted on8:32 pm - Jan 17, 2014


upthehoops says:
January 17, 2014 at 4:11 pm
49 0 Rate This

I see Keith Jackson is scheduled for Sportsound Extra again this weekend.

Someone needs to ask him about this, http://t.co/FlzlEMd803 and his boak inducing article last week!

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Danish PastryPosted on8:38 pm - Jan 17, 2014


CanuckBhoy on January 17, 2014 at 6:54 pm
34 2 Rate This
——–

Perceptive stuff.

Post more, please.

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paulsatimPosted on8:42 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Then again, some still dont get it!!!
jake the snake ‏@celticservant 32m
Keep calm – carry on. pic.twitter.com/6emamJBTOv

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on8:48 pm - Jan 17, 2014


M.c.f.c,

Do you think the Oldco’s creditors should have to pay for BDO’s unnecessarily incurred PR costs? Haven’t they suffered enough?

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StevieBCPosted on8:52 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Tailothebank says:
January 17, 2014 at 8:30 pm

So there we have it .. AMcC is still on £800 k per annum..no pay cut yet! …
What a complete clown and duplicitous character!!!..
By the way how weak is Wallace if he doesn’t fire him on the spot????…
=============================================
For some reason the above and Wallace’s claim – “There is no threat of Administration II. Categorically” – made me think of the following Alan Partridge episode: could Wallace just get rid of McCoist and his expensive players in a similar fashion ? 😉

“Without a second series of his programme, Alan is forced to fire all the staff at his company, Peartree Productions. However, when the staff ask him if he has a second series, Alan panics, and tells them that he has been successful.

While the staff prepare a party, and Jill, his ageing, chain-smoking, divorcee receptionist (Julia Deakin) goes out to buy some snacks, Alan tries to extricate himself by firing staff members for various “offences,” such as leaving an unwashed coffee cup on the table and rolling eyes. While he is locked in his boardroom, the staff leave.

Jill returns, wondering where everyone has got to (he tells her they have gone to a spice museum)…”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%27m_Alan_Partridge

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on9:15 pm - Jan 17, 2014


We can all have a bit of I told you so regards the Sevco fans but there are more serious point here .
1. we all knew when the old Ragers died there would be a club to fill the void and maybe it has not turned out to be the kind of club we had hoped for or have been run the way the SFA had hoped .
2.As liquidation is not an expectation this time round ,it is imperative that the club when it comes out of administration is run on a sustainable model .
3.The peepil running our game ,passes a rule stating that any club going into administration will be relegated 1 div without exception as of the start of next season ,
4.We may never get the new club we hoped for but this season MUST see the end to any club going down the overspend for promotion route .
5. If Sevco go into administration before the end of this season and gain promotion it will confirm to me that the whole game in this country is rigged but even so the rules at the start of the season may not have prevented it ,so that is that .(funnily this may be a rule Sevco 2012 will be happy to adhere to ).
I have yet to see any change in the MO of the new club that will help the current supporters curb their hubris and when you think of WS and AMc comments ,two men steeped in the culture of the fan base changing their expectations may be that step too far .
IMO WS was probably told that to make the new football club viable they would have to vacate Ibrokes and that is why he came out with such a ludicrous statement and I believe AMc has been told the same .

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m.c.f.c.Posted on9:17 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 8:48 pm

M.c.f.c,

Do you think the Oldco’s creditors should have to pay for BDO’s unnecessarily incurred PR costs? Haven’t they suffered enough?
—————————————–

i think BDO are big enough and rich enough to pay a few grand for their own PR advice – they are already looking like just more feet-dragging, fee-vultures to many observers of the Rangers saga

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on9:26 pm - Jan 17, 2014


pau1mart1n
what a concept 😀 😀

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on9:30 pm - Jan 17, 2014


JackBauer says:
January 17, 2014 at 6:49 pm

I would love to know who is really pulling the strings and employing these guys on the board, the recruitment remit seems to be to find the biggest clowns with the least common sense. It’s almost as if someone wants them to fail…..
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Yes, it is almost as if they are set up to fail either that or the FD is more than rubbish at setting budgets and monitoring them! :mrgreen:

Who benefits if they fail? The ones after the realisation/rental of the properties and a sale of the “club” bit to The Man Who Would be Dave?

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on9:39 pm - Jan 17, 2014


CanuckBhoy says:
January 17, 2014 at 6:54 pm

Sound unreasonable to anyone?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Nope.

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on9:40 pm - Jan 17, 2014


mcfc
I agree with you totally
BDO IMO will do nothing and will achieve nothing in this saga ,all the creditors in this farce have more than likely wrote the whole debacle off as a bad business deal as for getting any money back (see the duff n duffer deal)
An earlier poster wrote that the fact BDO are not doing anything does not mean they are not going to do anything ,I hope he is right because I have no interest in the ragers other than them adhering to the same rules as the other 41 clubs .It’s ragers 1872 I am interested in and the peepil who ran and allowed them to be run the way they were for 20 yrs .
IMO that is were the demise of the old club originated from and anything going on just now is collateral damage

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on9:42 pm - Jan 17, 2014


never lose sight of the
SDM-TICKETUS -CW connection .

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on9:45 pm - Jan 17, 2014


M.c.f.c,

No doubt BDO are big enough and rich enough to incur a few thousands pounds of costs. But the PR costs to deal with what I imagine is envisaged would be more than that. But why should they incur any irrecoverable costs at all – after all BDO is a business like any other.

BDO is probably big enough and rich enough to entirely forego a fee on the Oldco job – but why should they? Being an insolvency practitioner is not a public service, its a (supposedly) profit-making part of BDO’s business. I don’t know if you have noticed but its tough out there for there for professional services firms as well. Accountants go bust too.

I think at the end of this BDO will be writing off a fair chunk of WIP anyway. It is unreasonable. For us to expect them to incur costs they can’t recover to allay our suspicions because of the conduct of others to date.

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Paulmac2Posted on9:49 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Take a read through the piece below and the answers Craig Whyte provided back in Jan 2012 when challenged on the clubs finances…which coincidently were running at a 10 million pa loss before Admin hit …then Liquidation soon followed…

Is it just me that sees a consistency in style and reply from what CW says below and what GW is throwing at us now?
……………………………………………………………
Date: 31st January 2012 at 3:03 pm
Written by: Joe McHugh

Rangers chairman Craig Whyte has issued a statement highly critical of the Daily Record but drawn short of withdrawing privelidges from the newspaper.

This morning’s edition of the paper painted a bleak picture of the clubs’ finances with former Chairman Alastair Johnston and former director Paul Murray speculating that the club could be about to be placed in administration.

The main issues raised by the Record was that four seasons of season ticket money had been mortaged to a company called Ticketus and that HMRC had issued a demand for VAT of £5m on that deal.

While denying the VAT element Whyte admitted to a deal with Ticketus without going into any specifics.

He told the Rangers website: “First, I would like to address specifically the latest attempt to undermine Rangers in today’s Daily Record which devotes five pages to trashing our efforts to get this Club back on a sensible financial footing.

“In the most lurid terms, the Record accuses the Club’s management and, specifically me, of using supporters’ money to help fund the buy-out of Rangers. Not true.

“The Club is accused of not paying £5million in VAT. Not true.

“What is true is that Rangers, like many other clubs, has a financing arrangement in place with a company called Ticketus which enables the Club to receive revenue from a portion of season ticket sales in advance.

“There is nothing unusual or untoward in this arrangement which was put in place at the Club long before my takeover last year and was used by the previous management. For members of that regime to criticise the use of a scheme they put in place is, frankly, outrageous.”

He added: “The Daily Record’s approach to this story sought to distort and dramatise the matter. I for one will not be reading or buying the Daily Record again and I’m sure many other Rangers fans will share my disgust at yet another smear on this football club.”

Whyte’s statement confirmed that a fee had been agreed with Everton for the sale of Nikica Jelavic but it’s unlikely that there will be enough time to bring in any replacements.

The statement claims that the Croatian wanted to leave and that there was no point in trying to keep a player who no longer wants to be at Ibrox.

Whyte went in to some detail about the summer transfer window which involved 14 different deals including lucrative contract extensions for Allan McGregor, Steve Davis and Steven Whittaker.

Football clubs are notoriously wary of giving out too much information on their finances but the new Rangers chairman confirmed that there is a £10m deficit between the clubs income and expenditure.

He added: “As it stands at the moment Rangers has operating costs of approximately £45 million a year and revenues of around £35million – not including revenue from possible Champions’ League and Europa League participation.

“As we know, European money cannot be taken for granted and it doesn’t take much to work out that without it there is a big financial hole to fill every year – regardless of who owns the Club.

“I’ve said many times that in Scottish football we have to move on from this mindset that you have to keep spending more and more money – that’s what got this Club into financial trouble before. We have to live within our means, continue to develop talent and spend wisely.

“These are challenging financial times for Rangers – as they are for many other businesses. What I can say to you as a Rangers fan is that everything I will do as chairman will be in the interests of the Club and I thank you for your continued support.”

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DenPosted on9:54 pm - Jan 17, 2014


As he was new in the job it was fair to give Mr Wallace the benefit

Is Jim Traynor still head of communication at Ibrox, because the ability to shoot themselves in the foot continues unabated.

For anyone heartened by Wallace’s AGM statement on the cost base at Ibrox, believing that he may just be the man to do the job today must have been a sickener.

Faced with his first test he has messed up big time. To quote the DR article.

“The thing that is slightly disappointing is the way some people are looking at this as an offer which has been made by the club to the players – and that offer has been rejected. No offer has been made. This is more of a conceptual discussion about the possibility of some sort of reduction to see if such a plan would be supported by the players.”

Whatever you call it, the players were asked to agree a 15% reduction and it was REJECTED. It was not a conceptual discussion it was a concrete proposal which was REJECTED, hedidn’t deny it was put to the players and it was from him he just tried to hide behind semantics.

He backed down and appears to be wrong footed by McCoists media campaign. Wallace looks weak, if he ( or Nash) is going to cut costs he needs to stand up to McCoist and fire him if necessary.

One thing he proved is that he is not plain speaker, the article was an object lesson in obfuscation fortunately there was not a journalist in attendance to push for clarity.

Notably he was clear on one point;

“There is no threat of Administration II. Categorically, there is no threat of Administration II.”

There may be Administration though.

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scottcPosted on10:00 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 9:45 pm


I don’t know if you have noticed but its tough out there for there for professional services firms as well. Accountants go bust too.

Always room at Ibrox for another CA 😉

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scapaflowPosted on10:08 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Den says:
January 17, 2014 at 9:54 pm

I’m actually starting to wonder if Mr McCoist wants pushed out the door. Being able to say “Sorry brothers, I would love to be able to tell you everything, but, my settlement precludes me from commenting” would be awfully convenient, as would the, (erroneous), perception that he had gone as a result of trying to protect his players.

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on10:10 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 9:45 pm,

I think at the end of this BDO will be writing off a fair chunk of WIP anyway.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Why?

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on10:16 pm - Jan 17, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:08 pm

Den says:
January 17, 2014 at 9:54 pm

I’m actually starting to wonder if Mr McCoist wants pushed out the door. Being able to say “Sorry brothers, I would love to be able to tell you everything, but, my settlement precludes me from commenting” would be awfully convenient, as would the, (erroneous), perception that he had gone as a result of trying to protect his players.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Or his salary and share options. Somebody has not been upfront with Young Alistair on this scam but at least he’s getting something from it even though he and that other old geezer were duped.

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on10:25 pm - Jan 17, 2014


I think the only show left in town through this debacle is the UTT decision ,IMO HMRC will want that not to pursue other bigger fish but just to threaten them with the possible end game .
BDO ,OPERATION HORNET ,don’t make me laugh .
I may not be in the know regards BDO and tax issues but I am a veteran of Scottish Football and I know were my money would placed and it ain’t on the liquidators or the taxman .
One thing I will say in defense of the poster who believes that BDO may be sorting things out ,maybe you are looking at it from a normal investigation ,that IMO is were you slip up .
This my friend is not and never was a normal investigation and if you do not believe me ,post again in 18 month time .

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on10:26 pm - Jan 17, 2014


fergusslayedtheblues says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:11 pm

I am not a sevco supporter but even I am beginning to feel enough is enough regards the spivs ,all the real supporters want is a team to support .
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I have always said that it is an outrage that their supporters have been treated in this way. It’s not nice and none of us would wish that on any fan.

Taking my football hat off for a minute, I have no sympathy for a club that doesn’t fit into a better more enlightened Scotland and if it went under for good I wouldn’t have a problem. In fact if it was just about football and not a rallying point for sectarians and fascists I would be fine with that.

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scapaflowPosted on10:30 pm - Jan 17, 2014


GeronimosCadillac says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:16 pm

No, I’d expect he’d to get a fairly good package, with a gagging clause.

I also think that in the long dark nights, he knows he doesn’t have it in him to lead a much reduced squad to promotion to the premier.

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jean7brodiePosted on10:40 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Can’t stomach this portrayal of AMcC as a conflicted, duped young man!

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on10:45 pm - Jan 17, 2014


jean7brodie says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:40 pm

Can’t stomach this portrayal of AMcC as a conflicted, duped young man!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Ok,ok I accept and he probably does too that he’s not young any more.

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scapaflowPosted on10:45 pm - Jan 17, 2014


jean7brodie says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:40 pm

Hand caught in the cookie jar, trying to extricate it while holding on to as much as possible. Any conflict arises from him having to live here once the dust settles.

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on10:52 pm - Jan 17, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:30 pm

GeronimosCadillac says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:16 pm

No, I’d expect he’d to get a fairly good package, with a gagging clause.

I also think that in the long dark nights, he knows he doesn’t have it in him to lead a much reduced squad to promotion to the premier.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

And the package would be bigger if you didn’t take a wage cut?

To be fair to Young Alistair and his dog – he’s tried his best but isn’t up to it. Most Rangers fans knew this when under Sir Walter he made a complete arse of the Cup games he was in charge of but still he got the managers job. Maybe a patsy was required?

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on11:05 pm - Jan 17, 2014


scapaflow says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:45 pm
jean7brodie says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:40 pm

Hand caught in the cookie jar, trying to extricate it while holding on to as much as possible. Any conflict arises from him having to live here once the dust settles.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
And the ones who will make the real money won’t have to live anywhere near here.

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scapaflowPosted on11:06 pm - Jan 17, 2014


GeronimosCadillac says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:52 pm

Has the wage cut actually happened?

I try to see the good in people, afraid I’m failing when it comes to Mr McCoist. He provided continuity with the the old club, he rallied the fans in the most disgraceful fashion imaginable, got a contract he wouldn’t have been able to dream of elsewhere, a barrow load of 1p shares and heaven knows what else.

If he’d gone at the start, started over somewhere else, and learned his Manager’s trade properly, he might have made a half way decent manager, but we’ll never know now.

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on11:11 pm - Jan 17, 2014


GeronimosCadillac says:
January 17, 2014 at 10:26 pm
I had a long reply to your post but on reflection you summed it up better than I ever could

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on11:11 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Why do I think BDO will be writing off WIP on this job? Because insolvency practitioners invariably face WIP write-offs in all of their jobs – there is never a 100 percent recovery. The bigger the job, the bigger the fee, but also the bigger the WIP write off.

I expect HMRC will have reached an agreement with BDO over the amount that BDO can actually charge.

And believe me – I know that this is no ordinary investigation. And so do BDO – all the more reason for them to tread slowly, carefully, cautiously but most importantly accurately.

Finally, some civil proceedings cannot be brought by liquidators if other investigations by other authorities pertaining to the same subject matter are ongoing. That may (I don’t know) be delaying matters that would otherwise already have been commenced.

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LurkPakPosted on11:19 pm - Jan 17, 2014


My last post seems to have disappeared also, apologies if I caused offence. McCoist’s continuing deceit makes me lose the plot sometimes.

After the little gem of his pay cut still not being finalized played in front of me, I felt a definite shift in my feelings towards the fans themselves. The whole affair reeks of corporate hooliganism and the Spivs should be taken to task rank and file for their blatant abuse of their own fanbase.

An apt quote for Rangers fans from some fun books written by a former Strathclyde Uni lecturer.

“The personal, as everyone’s so fucking fond of saying, is political. So if some idiot politician, some power player, tries to execute policies that harm you or those you care about, take it personally. Get angry. The Machinery of Justice will not serve you here – it is slow and cold, and it is theirs, hardware and soft-. Only the little people suffer at the hands of Justice; the creatures of power slide from under it with a wink and a grin. If you want justice, you will have to claw it from them. Make it personal. Do as much damage as you can. Get your message across. That way, you stand a better chance of being taken seriously next time. Of being considered dangerous. And make no mistake about this: being taken seriously, being considered dangerous marks the difference – the only difference in their eyes – between players and little people. Players they will make deals with. Little people they liquidate. And time and again they cream your liquidation, your displacement, your torture and brutal execution with the ultimate insult that it’s just business, it’s politics, it’s the way of the world, it’s a tough life and that it’s nothing personal. Well, fuck them. Make it personal.

Quellcrist Falconer
Things I Should Have Learned by Now, Volume II”
― Richard K. Morgan

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on11:19 pm - Jan 17, 2014


IMO the whole concept of the sevco 2012 business plan is to take the admin hit this season and keep dropping as many debts as is possible .
The fans now see admin as nothing more than dumping creditors and amazingly their dignity allows it .
Will they admin their way to the SPFL ,ask CO .
I think even the ex ragers fans are ashamed at what has went on to ensure there is a team in blue playing out of Ibrokes

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on11:25 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 11:11 pm
hy do I think BDO will be writing off WIP on this job? Because insolvency practitioners invariably face WIP write-offs in all of their jobs – there is never a 100 percent recovery. The bigger the job, the bigger the fee, but also the bigger the WIP write off.

I expect HMRC will have reached an agreement with BDO over the amount that BDO can actually charge.

And believe me – I know that this is no ordinary investigation. And so do BDO – all the more reason for them to tread slowly, carefully, cautiously but most importantly accurately.

Finally, some civil proceedings cannot be brought by liquidators if other investigations by other authorities pertaining to the same subject matter are ongoing. That may (I don’t know) be delaying matters that would otherwise already have been commenced.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Writing off WIP doesn’t mean the job was unprofitable because it depends on how the charge out rates are structured initially.

Your last para is very interesting.

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JimBhoyPosted on11:29 pm - Jan 17, 2014


TSFM think i lost a post to moderation last night also.. When that happens do i subsequently have to revalidate by checking email and linking back to this site or posts are held up?… I wouldn’t mind knowing what piece offended from my comment. Mainly so I can avoid it again…

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on11:32 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 11:11 pm
I may have been relating to your previous post this morning regards BDO
First of all if you are familiar with BDO’s methods and remit then I will take your posts at face value .
From where I am coming from is probably something you have never experienced in your field .
We on here have had them all ,law lords ,HMRC lawyers SFA registration experts ,SPL ,SFL SFA SMSM and others .
Question to yourself .
Are BDO looking in the right direction back rather than forward

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fergusslayedthebluesPosted on11:39 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Call me a cynic but can we record today as a day a new poster began defending BDO,s handling of the omnishambles
IMO I have seen it all before

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GoosyGoosyPosted on11:50 pm - Jan 17, 2014


Well
I`ve finally figured out what needs to be done
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
CW should be hired by the fans group as a Consultant
Why?
Of all the people who have sat in the Board Room since June 2011
Craigie is the only one who can be trusted
After all
It wasnt his fault the team were crap in Europe

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on11:58 pm - Jan 17, 2014


I have no vested interest in BDO – I have an interest in insolvency matters though. If it looks as though I am sticking up for BDO then maybe I am – but not because I have a vested interest in them. While I can happily accept that they have not yet done anything in the public domain on this that would satisfy doubters, I would suggest that so far neither have they done anything that could properly allow anyone to say “aye they are at it as well”.

I may well be wrong. I have watched this whole affair unfold with amazement. The FTT decision astonished me. The administration process bewildered me. Ticketus’ initial funding decision looked ludicrous. Something is rotten for sure.

I am a new poster (only been posting in 2014). My initial posts were squarely on insolvency law matters (gratuitous alienation/unfair preference/insolvency TUPE). I do know how BDO and other insolvency firms work. I know very well how they work. Perhaps because of that I am more willing than others to give them the benefit of the doubt.

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JimBhoyPosted on12:15 am - Jan 18, 2014


http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/454576/EXCLUSIVE-Easdale-brothers-to-plough-20m-into-Rangers
Great news for the rangers fans I would say… 😆
😉

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on12:24 am - Jan 18, 2014


I am not sure that it is the done thing on here to answer (or indeed ask) such personal questions – but no – I am not and have never been employed by BDO nor have I ever been a partner in BDO. I am not an accountant nor an insolvency practitioner so little chance of me being involved at BDO in the future either.

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scapaflowPosted on12:25 am - Jan 18, 2014


JimBhoy says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:15 am

And so it begins :mrgreen: 😆 😳 😀 👿

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on12:25 am - Jan 18, 2014


JimBhoy says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:15 am
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/454576/EXCLUSIVE-Easdale-brothers-to-plough-20m-into-Rangers
Great news for the rangers fans I would say… 😆

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

If it’s in the Express it is obviously true and yet I can’t see the direct Diana connection but assume she supported the Queens XII by default before she was liquidated.

As for the numbers mentioned in the Article – how much of it is profit after paying back the bank for the money they borrowed to buy Aviva? The sums don’t add up. The only thing that does is their unquenchable thirst for cash businesses.

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scapaflowPosted on12:29 am - Jan 18, 2014


Oh dear

DR Back Page whit a face
https://twitter.com/

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JimBhoyPosted on12:29 am - Jan 18, 2014


http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/24395665

4 October 2013…. £800k then, £800k now, £800k forever….

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andyPosted on12:32 am - Jan 18, 2014


JimBhoy says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:15 am
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/454576/EXCLUSIVE-Easdale-brothers-to-plough-20m-into-Rangers
_______________
The brothers are already understood to have knocked back approaches for McGill’s Buses amid rumours that one £80m offer wasn’t enough and that they’re holding out for £100m.

If they succeed in getting a buyer at that price, the speculation is they will aim to increase their stake at Ibrox by investing about £20m. :slamb: :slamb: :slamb: :slamb: :slamb: :slamb: :slamb: :slamb:

£80m is not bad for a company who made 100k profit over the last 2 years 😛

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StevieBCPosted on12:32 am - Jan 18, 2014


The Easdales Sugar Daddies…
Immediate reaction.
1) OMG! Enough with the boll*x stories from Govan.
& a wee bit later
2) Would that £20M investment be in the form of used notes – allegedly. 😉

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scapaflowPosted on12:33 am - Jan 18, 2014


andy says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:32 am

Next up Greenock Born Gazzilionaires.

GeronimosCadillac says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:25 am

Spot on

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JimBhoyPosted on12:33 am - Jan 18, 2014


http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-manager-ally-mccoist-ill-2151031

Earlier still….11 Aug 2013

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GeronimosCadillacPosted on12:36 am - Jan 18, 2014


Campbellsmoney says:
January 18, 2014 at 12:24 am

I am not sure that it is the done thing on here to answer (or indeed ask) such personal questions – but no – I am not and have never been employed by BDO nor have I ever been a partner in BDO. I am not an accountant nor an insolvency practitioner so little chance of me being involved at BDO in the future either.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
For a non accountant and non insolvency practioner I’m impressed by your very well written posts explaining Insolvency law, protocols etc and even your assertion that WIP (work in progress) won’t be fully recovered by BDO and then in later posts you went on to offer an opinion.

I’m not having a go BTW – we need more posters like you on here. What team do you support?

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MartinPosted on12:43 am - Jan 18, 2014


Jimbhoy,

The telling sentence “If they succeed in getting a buyer at that price, the speculation is they will aim to increase their stake at Ibrox by investing about £20m.”, seems to undermine the headline.

EXCLUSIVE: Easdale brothers to plough £20m into Rangers

I might plough £20m into Rangers, I don’t have £20m and if I did I wouldn’t “plough” it in, but I might.

I do hope the Express reporters are looking into this when they have a break from counting Romanians or insulting peoples intelligence .

There’s a headline in it.

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m.c.f.c.Posted on12:48 am - Jan 18, 2014


OK – officially obsessed – researching bus websites after midnight – but this discussion by apparently knowledgeable and reasonable people suggests McGill is worth no more than £30m. Rumours of £80m bids seem to be puff by local papers – no bidders have confirmed any thing close. So Easdales’ £20m injection to Rangers seems to be the latest Saviour myth.


I still maintain £30 million is a more realistic takeover price. First Group only got got £80 Million for their entire London operation comprising 900 buses
[btw McGill has 350 buses

AND


And if the Easdales are looking for £100m, then they’ve not got a hope in hell with a 350 strong fleet comprising some average ex London kit, some middle aged Arriva kit, and a smattering of newer stuff.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=88620&page=9

would value the company around 20 million depending on asset value. possibly even less. normal rule of thumb is Profit x 3 assets x 2 cash at bank x 3. i bet that does not come anywhere near any figures floating about.

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?p=1680096

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on12:50 am - Jan 18, 2014


What team do I support? Are you going to ask me which school I went to next? I don’t support any Rangers if that is what you mean? Are other posters routinely asked this?

Campbellsmoney
Try not to take offence too easily I don’t think there was anything untoward in the question. Nobody is accusing you of anything.
TSFM

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TSFMPosted on12:51 am - Jan 18, 2014


Several posts have been removed again today due to what is now becoming the routine practice of name calling. If you don’t want to describe people by their correct names, please post somewhere else.

It is childish, oafish, cheapens what we are about, and most importantly is not in keeping with our rules of posting.

I would prefer not to have to suspend folk for something as daft as this, but the mods don’t want to spend their evenings rooting out the offenders. If I add to the banned words list, I’m pretty much saying that our standards have fallen way below what we have set for ourselves. A better alternative would be to ban those who refuse to sign up to the blog ethos.

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JimBhoyPosted on1:01 am - Jan 18, 2014


Eyeballed the bears den earlier. I see the Easdales £20m headline, I read that Ally did well on the telly interview. If Ally had sat in front of the camera dressed as the Devil and admitted that he was NOT taking any pay drop but he thought the fans had been brilliant, he gets on well with the CEO and the players within their rights to refuse a pay cut… We’d be reading tomorrow that Ally, the legend, manager supreme, cheeky chappie backs the players, the board and fans… Talk about playing both sides of the fence whilst sitting on it.. I wonder who Craigy will get to play Ally in the film?

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Fritz AgrandoldteamPosted on1:04 am - Jan 18, 2014


JimBhoy says:

January 18, 2014 at 12:15 am

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/454576/EXCLUSIVE-Easdale-brothers-to-plough-20m-into-Rangers
Great news for the rangers fans I would say… 😆
😉
—————————————————-
Jack’s getting desperate……………

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CampbellsmoneyPosted on1:07 am - Jan 18, 2014


Re valuing companies (bus or otherwise) – usually a multiple of profit is an initial benchmark – adjust for asset value (no multiples of asset values or cash) and think about sustainability of that profit going forward. Will that profit still be earned going forward if there is a change of ownership?

Many companies with large fleets don’t even own those assets – they are on finance.

Without seeing the accounts I should hesitate to express an opinion but why would you spend even 30million (let alone 80million) to earn 100K a year? It would take 300 years to get your investment back. Ok you might be buying 30million of depreciating assets as well but you would be better with your money in Premium bonds.

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JimBhoyPosted on1:20 am - Jan 18, 2014


IMO the Easdales are in no league to make any further large investment into rangers, actually I wonder if there are some regrets there already, if their purported investment is indeed accurate (who knows).. I am not even sure Mr King has that wedge that he is made out to have.. These guys don’t get rich by betting on risks…

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JimBhoyPosted on1:25 am - Jan 18, 2014


Less than 2 wks of the transfer window left (assuming that applies to 1: rangers and 2: teams in the 3rd division). It is gonna be a tough job shifting £1m off the player payrole in that time.

So rangers could run away with the league, official winners in a few weeks and then see an administrative event just after… What would happen then? Surely not title stripping..!!!

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StevieBCPosted on1:31 am - Jan 18, 2014


Hurrah for The Rangers!
Just when they desperately needed a Sugar Daddy…two came along at the same time!
Aye Right!

As observed above by FA, Jack’s just having a laugh now…

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JimBhoyPosted on1:34 am - Jan 18, 2014


Last post of the eve from me… I fear for some of the younger players at rangers. It will be easier for AMcC to make a call on removing them from the payrole rather than the more experienced players he has brought in.. I think some token journeymen will be let go but the majority will be the younger players.I would expect some of the bigger earners to publically state they are taking pay cuts for the good of the club, much heralded in the red tops. Or maybe they will offer to take the cut pending the obligatory 6 months to get the paperwork amended.

Here’s to the young Ibrox talent, if released going on and making a name for themselves..

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N ParkerPosted on2:59 am - Jan 18, 2014


(The brothers are already understood to have knocked back approaches for McGill’s Buses amid rumours that one £80m offer wasn’t enough and that they’re holding out for a £100 m.)

Didn’t that company (i forget the name of it) publish a recent statement in the paper categorically denying they had any talks or offers from anybody at The Rangers, anyone else read that ? Seems to me, it’s a likely ploy to get the ST.s rolling in.

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peterjungPosted on4:09 am - Jan 18, 2014


Listened to the Radio Scotland podcast from last night and I was surprised to hear that the BBC are still “banned” from all things The Rangers.

This seems to have been going on so long that I fail to recall what the original reason given for this “ban” was and who imposed it?

• Craig Whyte
• Charles Green
• Malcom Murray
• Jim Traynor
• Ally McCoist
• God only knows who…..

Can anyone recall the roots of this?

Also…I seemed to recall reading that all SPFL clubs have some sort of contractual obligation in giving access to the media? Anyone know if this is indeed the case and what are the details?

Also when this ban was mentioned on the podcast it was seemingly brushed over in a jocular fashion….while over on SSB I recall that Hugh Keevins never misses a chance to bang on about his own ban from Celtic Park….

……just re-read this before posting….what a list of chancers…and that is not even the half of it….

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TartanwulverPosted on7:00 am - Jan 18, 2014


So the Rangers PR folks are reduced to stories saying that IF the Easdales get £20 million more than a notional amount from someone for selling their bus company (apologies to any Rangers supporters if you consider it to be a bus club), that they MIGHT punt that extra money into some dimension of the Rangers black hole…why not make it a notional £30 million? Then Ally could get the extra £10 million still owed for the Charles Green Memorial Warchest.

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essexbeancounterPosted on7:47 am - Jan 18, 2014


scottc says:

January 17, 2014 at 10:00 pm
Campbellsmoney says:
January 17, 2014 at 9:45 pm


I don’t know if you have noticed but its tough out there for there for professional services firms as well. Accountants go bust too.

Always room at Ibrox for another CA 😉
=============================================================================
Well, that my CV off in the post…just wondering if the Equal Opportunities legislation passed in 20th century UK has permeated the working practices of the Govan club…!

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