UEFA Club Licensing. – To Comply or not to Comply ?
On 16 April 2018 The UEFA Club Financial Control Body (CFCB) adjudicatory chamber took decisions in the cases of four clubs that had been referred to it by the CFCB chief investigator, concerning the non-fulfilment of the club licensing criteria defined in the UEFA Club Licensing and Financial Fair Play Regulations.
Such criteria must be complied with by the clubs in order to be granted the licence required to enter the UEFA club competitions.
The cases of two clubs::
Olympique des Alpes SA (Sion Switzerland )
and
FC Irtysh (Kazakhstan)
are of particular interest to those following the events under which the SFA awarded a UEFA License to Rangers FC in 2011 currently under investigation by the SFA Compliance Officer because
- The case documentation tell us how UEFA wish national associations to apply UEFA FFP rules
- The cases tell us what might have happened to Rangers FC in 2012 had they not gone into liquidation and as a consequence avoided the same type of sanctions that UEFA applied to Sion and Irtysh.
FC Sion (Olympique des Alpes SA)
Here we are told how the Swiss FL and then the UEFA CFCB acted in respect of FC Sion in 2017 where a misleading statement was made in the Sion UEFA licensing application.
Full details can be read at
but this is a summary.
In April 2017 the Swiss FL (SFL) granted a licence to Sion FC but indicated that a Disciplinary case was pending.
In July 2017 the CFCB, as part of their licence auditing programme, carried out a compliance audit on 3 clubs to determine if licences had been properly awarded. Sion was one of those clubs.
The subsequent audit by Deloitte LLP discovered Sion had an overdue payable on a player, amounting to €950,000, owed to another football club (FC Sochaux ) at 31st March 2017 as a result of a transfer undertaken by Sion before 31st December 2016, although the €950,000 was paid in early June 2017.
Deloitte produced a draft report of their findings that was passed to SFL and Sion for comment on factual accuracy and comment on the findings. Sion responded quickly enabling Deloitte to present a final report to the CFCB Investigation Unit. In response to the Deloitte final report Sion stated:
“il apparaît aujourd’hui qu’il existait bel et bien un engagement impayé découlant d’une activité de transfert. Ce point est admis” translated as
“it now appears that there was indeed an outstanding commitment arising from transfer activity. This is admitted”
What emerged as the investigation proceeded was that the Swiss FL Licensing Committee, after granting the license in April and as a result of a Sochaux complaint of non-payment to FIFA, had reason to refer Sion’s application to their Disciplinary Commission in May 2017 with regard to the submission of potentially misleading information by FC Sion to the SFL on 7th April 2017 as part of its licensing documentation.
Sion had declared
“Written confirmation: no overdue payables arising from transfer activities”, signed by the Club’s president, stating that as at 31 March 2017 there were no overdue payables towards other football clubs. In particular, the Club indicated that the case between FC Sion and FC Sochaux regarding the transfer of the player Ishmael Yartey was still under dispute.
The SFL Disciplinary Commission came to the conclusion that FC Sion had no intention to mislead the SFL, but indeed submitted some incorrect licensing documentation; the SFL Disciplinary Commission further confirmed that the total amount of €950,000 had been paid by the Club to FC Sochaux on 7 June 2017. Because of the inaccurate information submitted, the SFL Disciplinary Commission decided to impose a fine of CHF 8,000 on the Club.
Whilst this satisfied the SFL Disciplinary process the CFCB deemed it not enough to justify the granting of the licence as UEFA intended their FFP rules to be applied.
Sion provided the CFCB with a number of reasons on the basis of which no sanction should be imposed. In particular, the Club admitted that there was an overdue payable as at 31 March 2017, but stated that the mistake in the document dated 7 April 2017 was the result of a misinterpretation by the club’s responsible person for dealing with the licence (the “Club’s licence manager”), who is not a lawyer. The Club affirmed that it never had the intention to conceal the information and had provisioned the amount due for payment and that, in any case, it has already been sanctioned by the SFL for providing the wrong information.
The CFCB Investigation Unit accepted that the Sion application, although inaccurate, was a one off misrepresentation and not a forgery, (as in intended to deceive ) but that nevertheless an overdue payable did exist at 31st March and a licence should not have been granted.
Based on their findings, the CFCB Chief Investigator decided to refer the case to the CFCB Adjudicatory Chamber and suggested a disciplinary measure to be imposed on FC Sion by the CFCB Adjudicatory Chamber, such measure consisting of a fine of €235,000, corresponding to the UEFA Revenues the Club gained by participating in the 2017/2018 UEFA Europa League.
The CFCB Investigatory Chamber submitted that it was appropriate to impose a fine corresponding to all the UEFA revenues the Club gained by participating in the competition considering the fact that FC Sion should not have been admitted to the competition for failing to meet one of its admission criteria.
The Adjudicatory Chambers took all the circumstances (see paras 91 to 120 at http://tiny.cc/i8sxsy ) into consideration and reached the following key decisions.
- FC Sion failed to satisfy the requirements of Article 49(1) of the CL&FFP Regulations and it obtained the licence issued by the SFL not in accordance with the CL&FFP Regulations.
- FC Sion breached Articles 13(1) and 43(1)(i) of the CL&FFP Regulations. (Documents complete and correct)
- To exclude FC Sion from participating in the next UEFA club competition for which it would otherwise qualify in the next two (2) seasons (i.e. the 2018/19 and 2019/20).
- To impose a fine of two hundred and thirty five thousand Euros (€235,000) on FC Sion.
- FC Sion is to pay three thousand Euros (€3,000) towards the costs of these proceedings.
Comment in respect of the award of a UEFA Licence in 2011 to Rangers FC.
It is now public knowledge that an actual liability of tax due before 31stDecember 2010 towards HMRC, was admitted by Rangers FC before 31st March 2011.
This liability was described as “potential” in Rangers Interim accounts audited by Grant Thornton.
“Note 1: The exceptional item reflects a provision for a potential tax liability in relation to a Discounted Option Scheme associated with player contributions between 1999 and 2003. A provision for interest of £0.9m has also been included within the interest charge.”
The English Oxford Dictionary definition of potential is:
Having or showing the capacity to develop into something in the future.
Which was not true as the liability had already been “developed” so could not be potential.
This was repeated by Chairman Alistair Johnson in his covering Interim Accounts statement
“The exceptional item reflects a provision for a potential tax liability in relation to a Discounted Option Scheme associated with player contributions between 1999 and 2003. “ where he also added
“Discussions are continuing with HMRC to establish a resolution to the assessments raised.”
This could be taken as disputing the liability but In fact the resolution to the assessments raised would have been payment of the actual liability, something that never happened.
In the Sion case it was accepted the misleading statement was a one off misrepresentation, but at the monitoring stages at June 2011 in Ranger’s case the status of the liability continued to be misrepresented and in September the continuing discussions reason was repeated, along with a claim of an instalment paid whose veracity is highly questionable.
The Swiss FL Licensing Committee did at least refer the case to their Disciplinary Committee when they realised a misleading statement might have been made. The SFA however in August 2011, when Sherriff Officers called at Ibrox for payment of the overdue tax , did no such thing and pulled up the drawbridge for six years, one that the Compliance Officer is now finally charged with lowering.
The case of FC Irtysh of Kazakhstan is set out in full at http://tiny.cc/y9sxsy and is a bit more straightforward but is nevertheless useful to compare with events in 2011 in Scotland.
Unlike Rangers FC , FC Irtysh properly disclosed that they had an overdue payable to the Kazakhstan tax authorities at the monitoring point at 30th June 2017. This caused the CFCB Investigatory Unit to seek further information with regard to the position at 31st March
It transpired that Irtysh had declared an overdue payable at 31st March but cited their financial position (awaiting sponsor money) as a reason for non payment to the Kazakhstan FA who accepted it and granted the licence. The outstanding tax was paid in September 2107.
The outcome of the CFCB Investigation was a case put to the CFCB Adjudicatory Chamber who agreed with the CFCB Investigation Unit that a licence should not have been granted and recommended that Irtysh be fined the equivalent of the UEFA prize money, (that had been withheld in any case whilst CFCB investigated.)
The CFCB Adjudicatory Chamber however decided that a fine was not sufficient in sporting deterrent terms and ruled that:
- FC Irtysh failed to satisfy the requirements of Article 50bis(1) of the CL&FFP Regulations and it obtained the licence issued by the FFK not in accordance with the CL&FFP Regulations.
- To withhold four hundred and forty thousand Euros (€440,000) corresponding to the UEFA revenues FC Irtysh gained by participating in the 2017/2018 UEFA Europa League.
- To exclude FC Irtysh from participating in the next UEFA club competition for which it would otherwise qualify in the next three (3) seasons (i.e. the 2018/19, 2019/20 and 2020/21 seasons). This sanction is deferred for a probationary period of (3) three years. This exclusion must be enforced in case the Club participates again in a UEFA club competition having not fulfilled the licence criteria required to obtain the UEFA licence in accordance with the CL&FFP Regulations.
- FC Irtysh is to pay three thousand Euros (€3,000) towards the costs of these proceedings. “
The deferral was because unlike Rangers FC, FC Irtysh had properly disclosed to the licensor the correct & accurate financial information required, so the exclusion was deferred for a probationary period of (3) years.
Comment in respect of the award of a UEFA Licence in 2011 to Rangers FC.
From the foregoing it could be deduced that had Rangers FC qualified for the Champions League (or European League) and not gone bust as a result and so not entered liquidation BUT it became public knowledge by 2012 that a licence had been wrongly and possibly fraudulently granted then
- Rangers would have been fined the equivalent of their earnings from their participation in the UEFA competitions in 2011
- At least a two year ban from UEFA Competitions would have been imposed, but more likely three in view of repeated incorrect statements.
- The consequences of both would have been as damaging for Rangers survival as the real life consequences of losing to Malmo and Maribor in the qualifying rounds of the Champions and European Leagues.
Karma eh!
Interestingly in the UEFA COMPLIANCE AND INVESTIGATION ACTIVITY REPORT 2015 – 2017 , the CFCB investigatory chamber recommended that both the Kazakhstan FA and Swiss FA as licensors
“pay particular attention to the adequate disclosure of the outstanding amounts payable towards other football clubs, in respect of employees and towards social/tax authorities, which must be disclosed separately;
Would the same recommendation apply to the Scottish FA with regard to their performance in 2011 and will the SFA responses thereafter to shareholders in a member club be examined for compliance with best governance practice by the SFA Compliance Officer investigating the processing of the UEFA Licence in 2011?
This would be a welcome step in fully restoring trust in the SFA.
JINGOJIMSIE MAY 4 19.04
I have just watched it and the words “follow follow” are clearly heard when he emerges from the tunnel. Never heard the BB.
ALLYJAMBO MAY 4 20.05
Not that it matters but our “latest messiah” as you call him isn’t a RC.
Half Time:
Partick Thistle 1 – Ross County 1
Dundee Utd. 0 – Dunfermline 1 (Agg. 0-1)
STEVIE BC MAY 4 20.23
I take it that you feel the achievements of Brendan Rodgers are also “heavily discounted” in England?. I happen to agree that to get the attention from the rest of the country European success is vital, as the game in Scotland is by & large totally ignored, unless it is a crucial Old Firm encounter, and even then only if there is limited competition for airtime or column inches.
I am told that Dave King will hold a press conference on Monday.
SJ
Do you think DK will announce he is leaving at said press conference
Darkbeforedawn
May 4, 2018 at 19:16
Well to me Gerrard is the sixteenth Rangers manager as reported widely today.
“
Can you elaborate and explain how the club that has had sixteen managers could not compete in Europe for years despite finishing second always annoyed me that one, and can you explain why NTL was allowed to tell them to piss off when they demanded money and did not enter into debate ot take them on when NTL told them you are a new club and have not competed in the SPL yet as it was then
Darkbeforedawn
May 4, 2018 at 19:40
JC, if this is the case why not have a closed door policy for this site where to be allowed to comment you must have to agree with the club being a new club, instead of an open for all fans of Scottish football forum that you try and sell it as? I have no issue with your view or your attempts to get it across to a wider audience.”
Nice attempt at coming across as a moderator when one considers not a jot about what you have and do not have issues with, if it concerns the attempt to force your issues re same club which are untruths it is only fair that your argument or deflection be put in it’s place, you know your old club was liquidated and you know you do not come out of liquidation if you have had a CVA knocked back as this is the rule of the creditors and their word is final, it is called justice for been ripped off when there is no recourse to the law anymore for retrieving their money in full or in part. It’s a nice try by you but others have failed this is not a site for one particular type of persons it is open to all, but, there is no room for fitting in agendas which are factually untruths.
You are coming on here and putting forward your vision and it is blown out the water as you know it is not sustainable, in fact it is a lie and you are aware of it.
Back up your arguments and let the debate commence, this blog has already seen the effects off people not wanting to rake over old coals, when in fact the fires are still burning and the light from them is definitely showing the issues for what they are. This site if not a closed door it is a site for many issues and debates to take place but please spare people on the site from having to put you in your place every time you wish to keep a myth alive.
Basically all you are doing is trolling mate.
FOF MAY 4 21.11
No i don’t believe he will announce his departure on Monday. If information is correct the press conference will address several subjects.
slimjimMay 4, 2018 at 20:48STEVIE BC MAY 4 20.23 I take it that you feel the achievements of Brendan Rodgers are also “heavily discounted” in England?.
mmmm i think the media up here had him off to Arsenal and all our players likked to EPL clubs obviously there are clubs in Scotland dicounted but the last two seasons there seemed to be a concensus BR and Tierney and Moussa and you get the picture.
B1916, please point to where I have been trying to force my point? If you look back previously on either this blog or maybe the last one I spent days putting over my argument, and I answered all of your questions there should you wish to view them. Therefore I will not repeat something that has been done as infintum before. I mealy asked at this time could we focus on the subject at hand and not deflect by getting caught up in it again. What part of that is trolling?
bigboab1916May 4, 2018 at 21:16
Darkbeforedawn May 4, 2018 at 19:16 Well to me Gerrard is the sixteenth Rangers manager as reported widely today. “ Can you elaborate and explain how the club that has had sixteen managers could not compete in Europe for years despite finishing second always annoyed me that one, and can you explain why NTL was allowed to tell them to piss off when they demanded money and did not enter into debate ot take them on when NTL told them you are a new club and have not competed in the SPL yet as it was then Darkbeforedawn May 4, 2018 at 19:40 JC, if this is the case why not have a closed door policy for this site where to be allowed to comment you must have to agree with the club being a new club, instead of an open for all fans of Scottish football forum that you try and sell it as? I have no issue with your view or your attempts to get it across to a wider audience.”
Nice attempt at coming across as a moderator when one considers not a jot about what you have do not have issues with, if it concerns the attempt to force your issues which are untruths it is only fair that you be put in your place, you know your old club was liquidated and you know you do not come out of liquidation if you have had a CVA knocked back as this is the rule of the creditors and their word is final, it is called justice for been ripped off when there is no recourse to the law anymore for retrieving their money in full or in part. It’s a nice try by you but others have failed this is not a site for one particular type of persons it is open to all, but, there is no room for fitting in agendas which are factually untruths. You are coming on here and putting forward your vision and it is blown out the water as you know it is not sustainable, in fact it is a lie and you are aware of it. Back up your arguments and let the debate commence, this blog has already seen the effects off people not wanting to rake over old coals, when in fact the fires are still burning and the light from them is definitely showing the issues for what they are. This site if not a closed door it is a site for many issues and debates to take place but please spare people on the site from having to put you in your place every time you wish to keep a myth alive. Basically all you are doing is trolling mate.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If that’s the case you’ve done a great job by not observing the iron rule of the Interspaz, which is to ignore Trolls.
I’m not just having a go at you because there are others (perhaps co-trolls) who bite every time. It’s a waste of time engaging. Ignore them.
Slim…
Video BB
https://twitter.com/_w_scott1/status/992399469919592451?s=20
Probably the parts were 4th manager or 16th manager is put across i would defo say that is a nice and sneaky way to say its the same club when its not.
What was liquidated and what date and what was its date of birth.
Was it incorporated when liquidated or seperate.
BillydugMay 4, 2018 at 21:28Slim… Video BB https://twitter.com/_w_scott1/status/992399469919592451?s=20
It was on PMcG twitter earlier there was no point in putting it up i believe the denier knew of it and was trolling it happens.
BIGBOAB 1916 MAY 4 21.23
So the media are to be believed then?.
Celtic have profited from player sales in the past due to having some decent European results or/and performances. Hasn’t been too good in the past two seasons though so serious interest will have been reduced imo.
Can’t be denied now.
BILLYDUGMAY 4, 2018 at 21:28
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Slim…Video BBhttps://twitter.com/_w_scott1/status/992399469919592451?s=20
So much dignity on show there disgusting song sung by disgusting people.
FT:
Dundee Utd 2 – Dunfermline 1
So (I think I’m right) the Semi is Dundee Utd v Livi.
That puts me in a quandary, I like them both.
(Scott McDonald scored – I love him and hate him all at the same time)
BILLYDUG MAY 4 21.28
Don’t know anything PMG said so not likely to have seen what is on his site.
I was replying to AJ & JJ who mentioned the BB being sung as SG emerged from the tunnel and replied in kind
https://twitter.com/STVSport/status/992425288830201856
Before anyone asks, the song in question belongs with several others, (sectarian & non sectarian) which have no place in society never mind a football stadium
slimjimMay 4, 2018 at 21:33
BIGBOAB 1916 MAY 4 21.23 So the media are to be believed then?.
I am struggling to find the part below in my post were i said the media are to be believed, in fact Tierney basically told the media to f$ck and leave him be he was happy, but they printed anyway, but i defo did not say i believed the media and Rogic is linked to Soutampton with mark hughes, but i still have not said the media are to believe or if i believe them.
Original quote
“mmmm i think the media up here had him off to Arsenal and all our players likked to EPL clubs obviously there are clubs in Scotland dicounted but the last two seasons there seemed to be a concensus BR and Tierney and Moussa and you get the picture.”
https://www.joe.co.uk/football/sectarian-chants-ibrox-steven-gerrard-176854
Dear Oh Dear, they just can’t leave that chant alone, even in moments of happiness.
Deranged.
Is that the song that springs to mind? Do they actually have a song book about Rangers or Sevco? You know, a FOOTBALL based song? About one of their histories?
One or two posts today about 4th manager or 16th manager.
3 of these recent managers have not completed their contract of employment.Only time will tell if it will be 4.
BIGBOAB MAY 4 22.53
My mistake. Multitasking at present and thought for a moment you actually believed the bids for KT, MD and JS were genuine.
Given the proceedings that are pending on Mr King, then it would surely be a good idea for him to keep a low profile.
All credit to him, he just laughs in the face of normal thinking.
If there’s one thing that has been evident during this whole farcical Scottish Football episode, then it is that crime pays, and that honesty, fair play and paying tax is for losers.
Congratulations once more to Celtic on being the Scottish Champions. Barring a Scottish Leicester, then I think you can rest assured that you will always be the preferred honest Scotsman’s alternative team.
And, I agree with the SFM’s legend, that is John Clark, that Mr King intends primarily to get his lost £20 million back. Today, on the face of it, appears to have been a big step forward for him. Give it up TRFC supporters, his wine cellar is getting low.
slimjim
May 4, 2018 at 22:07
BIGBOAB MAY 4 21.32. You know that i was aware of what PMG posts. Really?. Not going to comment on him personally but there is zero chance of me having any knowledge of what his latest is unless informed by a 3rd party.
Just to fill you in it was his twitter account and not really his post but the attached tweet of the event from someone else concerning the BB song meaning it is attached to quite a lot of accounts. I suppose this meant there was more chance of more folk seeing it, but some choosing to ignore it, i understand from experience it is merely customary over by to get a sense of WATP and when this happens they seem to be unable to contain the themes and it spills out whilst the media do their best to smother it.
I understand their excitement and really would not be too fazed by it and yes i understand it is not every day one gets to meet an under 18 coach with a red carpet rolled out for him. Special day indeed and exciting times ahead. New coffee machine ordered.
slimjimMay 4, 2018 at 21:21
‘…. If information is correct the press conference will address several subjects.’
________________
And, indeed, there are several subjects for him to address!
And not even the Fat Controller would dare tell him to discontinue if any awkward question were to be asked by the gentlemen of the Press, the way Pedro was silenced and hustled out.
Awkward questions from the SMSM when invited to a presser by King? Doh! What am I saying?
They will not be able to eat for days, due to the sh.te they’ll swallow and regurgitate for their readers.
I imagine that an opportunity will be created for a favoured ‘plant’ of a hack to give King the chance to dismiss the TOP and the Court of Session as no more than a minor irritation, not worth mentioning.
I’ll go further and suggest that the hacks will vie with each other to be the favoured one who gets the tastiest wee bit of succulent lamb!
What was it Hamlet said in relation to his mother’s marriage to the man who, to become King, murdered his own brother and took that murdered brother’s widow, his newly widowed sister-in-law ,as his wife?
“That it should come to this!” is what he said.
When Turnbull Hutton cried out, on the steps of Hampden , ” Corruption!” he was in effect saying “That it should come to this!” in relation to the 5-Way agreement that destroyed the Integrity, the very meaning, of Scottish Football as a Sport founded on concepts of honest sporting endeavour and fair play and truth and nobility etc etc.
His clearly heartfelt cry of ‘Corruption’ needs to be heard again.
Why?
Because we have a sport that has been rigged. Not only by a cheating club, but by its very Governing body.
A new club is allowed to claim to be entitled to the sporting honours of a club that died six years ago. Even Lance did not claim honours that he didn’t personally ‘win’!
Oh, for a Turnbull Hutton today, to cry “Corruption”.
Or for Celtic shareholders to formally ask the Police to investigate the circumstances in which the SFA told UEFA in relation to the now deceased ‘Rangers’ that it was okay to slide a few million quid to a struggling club which was not, perhaps, entitled to those few million.(.. and where the hell is the Compliance Officer in his investigations?)
Young Hamlet cried in despairing incredulity “That it should come to this!”
I echo his cry.
This is very important what Brendan Rodgers said:
“They’re looking to win the league. But for us at Celtic, we continue with our own strategy and our own work. And Rangers aren’t our only rivals.”
That works two ways. Celtic are not TRFC’s only rivals.
slimjimMay 4, 2018 at 22:15BIGBOAB MAY 4 22.53 My mistake. Multitasking at present and thought for a moment you actually believed the bids for KT, MD and JS were genuine.
Whilst i have not made it clear as to what i believe from the media nowadays one thing i am clear on i will never trust a media that can make a journalist backtrack on an 11 million exposure of a lie and attempt to turn it into a truth.
journalism is precious for our survival without it we live in a world of myths that give us supermen, continuations, ressurections and other magical fantasies that serve no purpose except to the creator of the fantasies.
Bigboab1916- please, PLEASE don’t tell me the Avengers aren’t real (well what’s left of them)?!!
jimboMay 4, 2018 at 23:15
‘..That works two ways. Celtic are not TRFC’s only rivals.’
_________________________
Of course they are not.
There are striving, competitive clubs trying their utmost to gain sporting honours on the field of play.
(There is also a club, in rivalry, mendacious enough to claim honours which it could not possibly have earned!)
RyanGoslingMay 4, 2018 at 23:34Bigboab1916- please, PLEASE don’t tell me the Avengers aren’t real (well what’s left of them)?!!
they can be what you want them to be RyanGosling and i hope you are happy and content.
i am however only interested and concerned in what the law states
“The Rangers football club does not exist, it is an idea in people’s minds, a myth of continuity. No-one knows what the Rangers football club is, but it has no legal personality.” Mr Dewar adds that …
it is an idea in people’s minds, what a powerful statement certainly worked today.
The Peter Principle.
‘Anything that works will be used in progressively more challenging applications until it fails. This is the “generalized Peter principle”. Peter noted that there is a strong temptation for people to use what has worked before, even when this might not be appropriate for the current situation’.
The thing is, in so far as the rangers are concerned, it’s hasn’t worked, not in the modern day and it’s unlikey to work anytime soon.
In mitigation, it worked for Rangers under the stewardship of David Holmes following the appointment of Souness in ‘86. Back then, Holmes had been a successful businessman, paying all his company taxes in the country his business was based. Then he sold up to Murray; and then they got greedy.
Back to Laurence J Peter, and I make no apologies for the ‘cut n paste’:
’Rather than seeking to promote a talented “super-competent” junior employee, Peter suggested that an incompetent manager may set them up to fail or dismiss them because they are likely to “violate the first commandment of hierarchical life with incompetent leadership: the hierarchy must be preserved”’
I can only guess that Paul Murray was as much aware of this as most on this site.
Whether SG proves to be a successful appointment or not, it is fair to say his presence will raise the profile of the Scottish game, but no more than Desmond’s appointment of Brendan. And let’s not forget, Desmond and Peter sometimes got it wrong too. As have the SFA in it’s past and present fate.
The only thing Brendan has to concern himself with today is Motherwell.
King has far more sleepless nights ahead.
I am totally confused.
“DAVE King, the Rangers chairman and major shareholder, has insisted the Ibrox club have no need to bring in outside investment in order to fund Steven Gerrard’s summer signing spree. ”
“We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,” he said. “We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter. The rights issue is one of the things we are pursuing, but it is not critical. The funding will be made available whether it is through a rights issue or otherwise.”
(The Herald today)
Where in the name of the wee man is the money coming from?
“THE SOURCE OF IT DOESN’T MATTER”
“We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,”
Pray tell me, WHEN did they BEGIN to narrow the funding gap?
Jimbo
“The source of it doesn’t matter”.
That actually says more about Gerrard than King.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/db/Peters_principle.svg/2422px-Peters_principle.svg.png
“We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,” ,,,
So funding it is then. Not investment. The SFM ask for funding on an annual basis and generally receive this from avid readers. There is no payback or return on this money. Only the knowledge that their funding will go to the upkeep of the site. The funding donation is spent. Gone. No return. On the other hand I dabble in the stock market and invest in shares that I look to make a financial gain on. I am looking for a return on my investment. See the difference. So maybe we can cut out this looking to further invest or bring in new investment when what is really being said is we need more money now and there is no return offered on this. Donations. Its called Donations. People need to fund TRFC. People invest in Celtic. There is the difference.
Despite my Friday evening or early Saturday morning contributions, mostly driven by my employment; it’s the only night I’m allowed up late….
Regadless, here I am.
Ive no idea why this came to mind.
All this talk about Steve.
Whatever became of Steve Archibald?
Just a thought that crossed my mind.
Im not suggesting he’s managerial material; Airdrie etc.
But we never hear of him.
It’d be good to get a modern day take from him.
The Steven Gerrard appointment has played out in slow motion but now he has committed to coming.
I honestly don’t get it.
How a dysfunctional business with unavoidable, heavy and sustained losses, a Close to Wonga charge over their saleable assets, no bank account, a potential Cold Shoulder and a rag tag group of professionals get effectively praised by all and sundry for taking another huge gamble.
It is nothing to do with Steven Gerrard the man but it does say a lot about Scotland and the repressed Rangersness for which he he has become both a catalyst and saviour.
And we all know (but seem to be in the minority) anything instigated by and driven by Mr King the RRM extraordinaire is never what it seems.
I agree Steven is good box office news and will ensure his own club (and others too including his biggest rivals) maximise their season book sales over the next few weeks.
It’s history in the making though and while history is always relatively obvious and occasionally simple looking back, trying to predict the future at the time is always much more complex.
And complex times remain in this saga with so many unanswered questions and possibilities and a truly remarkable cast of characters old and new.
I don’t know what else will happen and can’t even try to predict the outcome but am certain that Steven Gerrard is not an end-play.
Just another scene in the pantomime.
A pantomime that goes back to David Murray failing to acquire Ayr United and then buying a different club from Mr Marlborough.
JIMBOMAY 5, 2018 at 00:42
12
1 Rate This
I am totally confused.
“DAVE King, the Rangers chairman and major shareholder, has insisted the Ibrox club have no need to bring in outside investment in order to fund Steven Gerrard’s summer signing spree. ”“We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,” he said. “We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter. The rights issue is one of the things we are pursuing, but it is not critical. The funding will be made available whether it is through a rights issue or otherwise.”
(The Herald today)
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I am astounded of the forehead !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I always knew it would be the supporters that would bankroll the new club but is this guy really serious in what he is saying .
SJ you say he is not stepping down ,as a Celtic fc supporter ,I hope your right .
As a fan of Scottish football ,you and your fellow fans need to get rid of him ASAP
“We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter.
Seriously ,what does he actually mean here .
I would assume that if he has any ambitions of his club playing in Europe (their survival may well depend on it ) then I,m afraid THE SOURCE OF IT REALLY DOES MATTER .
Such is my distrust of the SMSM I would like to see him actually say the above bit as they have the first part in quotes but not the above .
If indeed he did say the last part then this guy has to be brought to task for such a comment
Finloch, a lovely read there both in content and in style.
FOF, Apparently Dave King is going to reveal all on Monday – The TOP, Share issue, investment etc. I can hardly wait!
https://twitter.com/celticrumours/status/992670316232048640?s=20
‘Just imagine if King didn’t have £11m and decided to stand down. And just imagine if he wanted the others to write off their loans and some refused to do so. Just imagine’.
Just a wee thought on yesterday’s statement from Ibrox.
I have to admit, when I read that there was to be a 3 o’clock statement, and with it clear Gerrard was going to be, at least, a part of the ‘good news’, I feared that King was leaving our reality TV style football saga to make way for some genuine investor/funder with mega bucks to squander. I couldn’t imagine that even the most stupid of high profile ex-footballers would accept that poisoned chalice without there being a new, genuinely rich, source of funds already in place, and that the real big news would be an announcement of said funding.
While it’s possible there still might be an announcement (Monday?) of some genuine mega funding, without it, Gerrard can only be an expensive gamble, with a side effect of raising the club’s profile (one wonders why the worlds most successful club (ha) might need it’s profile raised) and maybe encouraging (hoodwinking) some fresh sponsors and increasing ST and kit sales, though, as I’ve seen suggested, Gerrard might well have an Ashley/SD style arrangement whereby he benefits more than TRFC do from this whole arrangement.
Seems to me, though, that Gerrard has been persuaded to Ibrox by a sidekick steeped in Rangersness, rather like Mark Warburton was, and we know how that panned out, for all concerned.
To sum up; I really can’t believe that, having signed up Gerrard, there is no new big investor(s) about to be announced, for the rights issue King is flying cannot possibly fund the kind of players it will take to make Gerrard a success. When I say I can’t believe it, I am, of course, discounting RIFC/TRFC and King’s history of spending, and committing themselves to spend, money they don’t have.
“We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,” he said. “We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter.
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Red buckets before each home game.
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http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/sport/13308283.Rangers_fans_to_learn_of_Ibrox_investment_plans_in_near_future/
The RST minutes read: “There will be an opportunity for fans and fan groups to invest in the club in the future and to play an active role in restoring our club to its pre-eminent position in Scottish football.”
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from back in the day.
I did my best to avoid the media coverage of Steven Gerrard yesterday but unless you lock yourself in a room with nothing else there it is hard to escape. The general fervour seems to be a desperation for a return to a straight head to head with Celtic, but the simple fact is there is no indication yet as to how this would be financed. I do not believe for one minute that if there were people out there serious about ‘investing’ (that word again!) in Rangers then the feelgood moment of yesterday would have been delayed until both blockbuster announcements could be made together. Right now it appears King has convinced Gerrard there is money there, and Gerrard and his advisers have no idea of the realities of life at Ibrox these days.
Would it be too much for the media to tell us why two Directors walked this week? Clearly they will know because they made it clear on Twitter how much they liked Paul Murray. Have they walked because King has now moved the club into a new level of financial abyss it simply can’t sustain? Maybe not, but if there was a positive reason for them leaving then we would surely know by now. However, King has his season tickets sold now so even if he fails to keep his promises to Gerrard that main objective is achieved.
I think we should all celebrate one thing though. Every Scottish club bar Rangers lives within its means. If King is taking Rangers* down the path to destruction once again why should we care if the media don’t want to know. If on the other hand an honest £50m is injected into Rangers sometime soon I will be happy to admit I am wrong.
FINLOCHMAY 5, 2018 at 07:54
I agree Steven is good box office news and will ensure his own club (and others too including his biggest rivals) maximise their season book sales over the next few weeks
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Celtic’s season ticket sales were already maximised. That is a fact, not an opinion.
What has a bottomless pit and a squirrel got in common with Sevco? Show must go on, no seriosly make it happen, woke up this morning and thought, wow what happened yesterday, did the London bridge just get punted again?
Cluster OneMay 5, 2018 at 10:04We’ve got to keep funding the club and continue to narrow the funding gap that we currently have between ourselves and Celtic,” he said. “We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter.
UPTHEHOOPSMAY 5, 2018 at 10:46
FINLOCHMAY 5, 2018 at 07:54
I agree Steven is good box office news and will ensure his own club (and others too including his biggest rivals) maximise their season book sales over the next few weeks
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Celtic’s season ticket sales were already maximised. That is a fact, not an opinion.
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I’d be interested to hear from supporters of other clubs if they think Steven Gerrard getting the Rangers job will sell any of their season tickets, intuitively I doubt it.
I wouldn’t imagine many Hibs fans will decide to buy a ticket because of it. Maybe the team having a good season, playing attractive football and qualifying for Europe would do it. In fact I would suggest that is much more likely.
However it wouldn’t surprise me if any season ticket sales increases are attributed to Rangers getting a new manager.
UPTHEHOOPS MAY 5 10.46
As were Rangers with 43253 sold last season. The appointment of SG ensures this will be matched next season.
DCK: ‘The source of it doesn’t matter.’
…but it does, or else we’re back to (S)DM & his schemes.
Frankly, the Group Chairman of an apparently-distressed company making that statement should set alarm bells ringing among regulatory bodies.
In fact, that a Group Chairman is making any statements that are not germane to his personal situation of apparently being in breach of TOP & court orders seems off to me. (Don’t start me on the acting as a shadow director of TRFC again aspect either!)
As an aside, yesterday’s coup de theatre is all good for DCK. When he finally gets around to an offer document, he can point out that RIFC shares are now even more underpriced at 20p. New marquee management team, business going forward, include Monday’s new investors (!), etc. etc. & he’ll have to buy fewer shares & spend less of his Laird money.
SLIMJIM
MAY 5, 2018 at 11:11
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I agree, it’s why he was brought in.
Any manager willing to take the job would have reduced season ticket sales, not increased them.
This is about short term cash flow, not long term success.
HOMUNCULUS MAY 5 11.22
Season ticket sales would have fallen had a SC or DMI been unveiled but not by a massive amount. The fans have remained loyal with record sales being met with PC in charge for instance.
SLIMJIM
MAY 5, 2018 at 11:32
I don’t know what “a SC or DMI” means.
HOMUNCULUS MAY 5 11.37
Steve Clarke & Derek McInnes but i’m sure you knew that.
SLIMJIMMAY 5, 2018 at 11:11
As were Rangers with 43253 sold last season. The appointment of SG ensures this will be matched next season.
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I don’t recall saying Rangers season ticket sales were not high. I do believe they might have dropped next season though. Before the hype of the Gerrard appointment I detected a realism from Rangers fans that has not existed for years. A high profile appointment was a must. Celtic needed a high profile appointment when Rodgers was appointed, the difference being Celtic can afford it. Rangers couldn’t even afford what they had last season, or the one before that.
With SG now in the hot seat i was reminded today just how some perceive just how relevant the ibrox club is.
If you spot it you may just laugh.
Jingso.JimsieMay 5, 2018 at 11:17
DCK: ‘The source of it doesn’t matter.’
…but it does, or else we’re back to (S)DM & his schemes.
Frankly, the Group Chairman of an apparently-distressed company making that statement should set alarm bells ringing among regulatory bodies.
In fact, that a Group Chairman is making any statements that are not germane to his personal situation of apparently being in breach of TOP & court orders seems off to me. (Don’t start me on the acting as a shadow director of TRFC again aspect either!)
As an aside, yesterday’s coup de theatre is all good for DCK. When he finally gets around to an offer document, he can point out that RIFC shares are now even more underpriced at 20p. New marquee management team, business going forward, include Monday’s new investors (!), etc. etc. & he’ll have to buy fewer shares & spend less of his Laird money.
____________________
That’s a very good point, Jingso. And what right minded person couldn’t imagine King coming up with a plan to use ST money (OPM) to create an aura of value in RIFC/TRFC to reduce the number of shareholders likely to accept his ‘offer’ (if it ever comes)? I’m more than certain King would be happy to spend a few million pounds of ST money on Gerrard, if he thinks it could save him a few hundred thousand of his personal wealth.
SLIMJIM
MAY 5, 2018 at 11:42
Steve Clarke & Derek McInnes but i’m sure you knew that.
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Then you are sure of something which is wrong.
Well first it was the blue pound that fed all the wee clubs on the journey and then it was goiing for 55 and now SG.
To be frank does alarm bells not ring when you consider for six years you have been filling your ground whilst never having a manager in place who could actually manage.
slimjimMay 5, 2018 at 11:11UPTHEHOOPS MAY 5 10.46 As were Rangers with 43253 sold last season. The appointment of SG ensures this will be matched next season.
For your point above the allocation seems to have been met continually with basically six years of rookies so what is your point, the fact that another rookie has been dolled up for the day has once again showed the most gullible will buy into anything, you only have to pull the right strings.
Cluster OneMay 5, 2018 at 11:45With SG now in the hot seat i was reminded today just how some perceive just how relevant the ibrox club is. Cheeky spot but so true.
CLUSTER ONE
MAY 5, 2018 at 11:45
Interesting players to have at the top of the page.
I have been silently lurking for a while and thought I would join back in when something significant happened – Thanks to everyone for keeping me updated. I thought surely this time the wheels would come off for good. And then Stevie G enters stage left. Not in a squirrel outfit but in a Rangers’ scarf, being serenaded in true Ibrox fashion. I never thought I would see the day but it should not really have been such a surprise. They always seem to pull something out of the hat to reassure the masses that everything is just fine, so that they can continue to harvest the pockets and piggy banks of the poor Ibrox (blindly) faithful.
This one makes no sense from a football point of view no matter how they try to spin it.
It would appear Gerrard will be starting, “In the summer” …
I imagine prudent advisor’s will have built a “walk-away” clause into his contract should his war-chest not materialise….. Just saying.!
I also struggle to understand the Stevie G appointment from an economic point of view. ‘Speculate to accumulate’ has not really worked well for clubs playing out of Ibrox over the years. Except of course, if the aim is to accumulate debt!
HOMUNCULUS MAY 5 11.59
Then i apologise.
BIGBOAB 1916 MAY 5 12.09
I take it the “gullibles” are the supporters who follow their team around the country in record numbers, with every away allocation being sold out since we played Queens Park at Hampden in 2012.
For me the gullibles are the people who are fed disinformation from various bloggers (donate to keep the good news coming btw) and are then “bemused” “confused” etc when it fails, yet again, to play out as promised.
SLIMJIM
MAY 5, 2018 at 12:40
Then i apologise.
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Thank you.
Corrupt Official
“I imagine prudent advisor’s will have built a “walk-away” clause into his contract should his war-chest not materialise….. Just saying.! “
– that would make a lot of sense and be fairly prudent on Gerrard’s part. I wonder if they have a cheeky wee non-disclosure clause in there though? I worry that SG could become another in a long line of fall guys, unable to speak out or defend himself.
slimjimMay 5, 2018 at 12:40I take it the “gullibles” are the supporters who follow their team around the country in record numbers, with every away allocation being sold out since we played Queens Park at Hampden in 2012.
Yep you are spot on mate, why were you attending a Queens Park game in 2012:
1. Was it for a Scottish Cup game
2. Was it for a league game
3. Why was 40 odd thousand following a team in the lower divisions, whilst not quering why if they believed it to be the same club, how it should be in a lower tier after finishing second in the SPL and losing a European place in the process and been non seeded in all cup tournaments.
Yes the gullibles are the ones who fell for this and watched as their club died and willingly in desperation bought into a survival myth, a whole rewriting of every press release was denied by the very writers in a mass reversal of the facts to satisfy a club of no relevance who cheated and robbed the country of its revenue paid by every tax paying working class citizens. And knowingly accepted the pilfering of money from small to medium size businesses with no recourse or remorse shown.
The only club in Scotland on the blogs who have produced an exit out of admin has been Hearts, so answer the question can you escape from liquidation without having to first exit administartion.
“Disinformation ” SJ ? Of course nobody gets it right 100% of the time but it is gullible in the extreme to accept all the “information ” emanating from Ibrox without question and then dutifully regurgitated in the SMSM. If the glory days are just round the corner why is no one asking why 2 directors suddenly resigned.
BigBoab – Hearts are not the only Scottish club to have exited administration. Morton, Motherwell, Dundee and Livingston (both more than once) have exited administration and continued trading. Rangers also exited administration but into liquidation!
RYANGOSLING
MAY 5, 2018 at 13:03
BigBoab – Hearts are not the only Scottish club to have exited administration. Morton, Motherwell, Dundee and Livingston (both more than once) have exited administration and continued trading. Rangers also exited administration but into liquidation!
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As did Gretna.
In other similarities, they also have a “successor club”.
“The Gretna Supporters Society, (a Supporters’ trust) formed a new club, Gretna 2008* on 2 July 2008 and applied to join both the East of Scotland Football League and the South of Scotland Football League. They were accepted into the East of Scotland League, though they initially played their matches at the Everholm Stadium in Annan. The club returned to Raydale Park in May 2009 which it now leases from the Raydale Partnership, a community group of which Gretna Supporters Society is a member.”
*https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/SC346482
You will note this “new club” is also a limited company. It’s spookily similar, as if the model was copied, only this time with lies.
ARMCHAIRSUPPORTERMAY 5, 2018 at 12:44
DCK always injects a wee bit of truth hidden amongst the bumff. A wee erchie covering snippet.
– – – – – – – – – – – – – –
“We’ve got to make sure that in order to meet the manager’s ambitions we continue to invest in the club.“The source of it doesn’t matter”
– – – – – – – – – – – –
I doubt King will be bothered about much after ST’s are sold. For his part it will be job done.
Now I wonder when Potless will be asked why he has saddled his pony?
I would wager there are several conditions still to be met before Gerrard is fully fledged. I won’t be surprised if this is the maternal of all squirrels.
BIGBOAB MAY 5 12.56
I said in one of my first posts on here i have no intention of clogging up the site with any OC/NC debate and suggest anyone who wants to goes to the appropriate part of the site.
However i will point out to you the following all have said “same club”
UEFA,SFA ,SPFL,SFL.
HMRC,BDO.
LNS, LORD HODGE (Supreme Court), LORD BANNANTYNE (Coral Racing v Albert Iain Kinloch).
Apart from the “internet bampots” and “legal beagles” ? give me a authority that agrees with you with the appropriate links if you can.
On relection don’t bother as we will have another few days of this nonsense.
Off out to the football now.
No, no, no, no, no not standing for that.
I am on this site with some regularity.
I rate it, and those who post on it. But I keep myself to myself, I lurk but don’t get involved in the discussions.
This site doesn’t need me on it; indeed, I gain a lot of insight from the posters here. What I’m not going to sit by and accept are attacks on myself and some other people for allegedly posting disinformation and waiting for the money to roll in.
Not having that at all.
Back when Craig Whyte took over at Ibrox, it was this site and some of the blogs who were the SOLE VOICES telling Ibrox fans that their club was in the hands of a scumbug. When administration came and every national newspaper was saying Rangers would get a CVA it was this website and some of the blogs who were the SOLE VOICES telling the Ibrox support to get ready for hard times. When Green bought the basket of assets and Sevco fans were congratulating each other about having a guy in there who “gets it” because he slandered the rest of Scottish football it was this site and the blogs who were the SOLE VOICES telling Ibrox fans not to trust a word he said.
Warburton? The man with the Magic Hat? Destined to end in tears. We said that. Caixinha, the Mexican Bond … (Jesus can you believe a national newspaper wrote that?) A farcical appointment, one that was made without his ever having a proper face to face interview. Believe that, don’t believe it, you didn’t read it in the national press though … but true nonetheless.
And Dave King. Jesus, I could write 10,000 on the warnings we gave over that guy and not one of them was heeded, and not one national newspaper said it would end in shame and disgrace. Don’t let yesterday fool you, or whatever comes to pass on Monday … shame and disgrace is how he’s gonna go.
And you know what? We were right on the money more times than not.
Here’s the part that still gets me every time, and it’s why I’m not standing for that idiotic remark.
None of this was guesswork. None of it was speculative.
Whyte’s entire “backstory” was laid out on this site even before the BBC got to it. People got busy digging and they found everything in short order. HMRC policy is to refuse a CVA in every instance when there’s deliberate non-payment. Every instance. And yet I lost count of the number of articles and editorials which pronounced that the club was “hopeful” of a positive result … even Neil Doncaster came out with a statement to that end. Contemptible.
Charles Green openly advertised his “Big Yorkshire Hands” and even the most brief glance at his history painted a very clear picture of what he was about.
Warburton had one year’s managerial experience at Brentford and swaggered up here on the belief that some lower league English players would dominate the SPL. Ego gone mad. Caixinha was just mad. Somebody, somewhere, will explain it one day. There was nothing in his background at all which made that deal look even remotely sensible.
And Dave King? The glib and shameless liar? The man a judge said was not to believed on any subject, ANY SUBJECT, unless there was documentary evidence?
The word “mug” is too soft for anyone who trusts a word he says.
As to our assertions of Sevco’s financial vulnerability … I don’t know about other people but I base my own writing on that on the club’s own published accounts which, combined with even the most basic understanding of economics and maths, paint a picture of a company in dire financial straits. One who’s lights were only kept on by directors cash and Wonga loans.
So perhaps it’s not COMPLETELY out of the question to wonder where the cash for the latest moonbeam is coming from? Maybe it’s not MENTAL to enquire as to who the Hell would ever want to “invest” in a West of Scotland football club when that money won’t go to infrastructure or expanding the business but to paying the salaries and transfer fees of football players so that the most delusional fans on the planet can maintain their belief that they follow a huge club.
Rangers was not a huge club. it was an artificial construct; that’s what so many people still fail to understand. What would it have been shorn of the bank’s money? Note, that’s THE BANK’S money not Murray’s money. In the end, of course, with the nationalisations, it turned out to be OUR BLOODY MONEY. But that’s for another day.
Sevco is not chasing Celtic, no matter what it thinks. It’s trying to be Rangers and the ultimate tragedy of that was that the Rangers they think they can become never existed in the first place.
And you want to talk about disinformation?
No, not having it.
No Steven Gerrard signing for sevco wont sell any tickets at Easter Road.I think there are too many pr gurus here just now.