A Question of Trust (Updated)

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by Auldheid for the Scottish Football Monitor

On these pages at least there is a mounting lack of trust that the Scottish Football Association can or will govern our game in a fair and honest manner that recognises the principle of sporting integrity as paramount.

This mistrust is equalled only by the frustration at being unable to do anything to change the attitude and action of those at the SFA (and Leagues) responsible for that governance, a frustration compounded by the reluctance of the mainstream media to focus on the very issues of trust and integrity that concern us.

Back in early 2010 Celtic supporters represented by the Celtic Trust, various Association groups and individuals felt the same frustration and found a way to make their voices heard at the SFA – by using their club as a channel of communication to articulate their concerns.

A resolution was agreed and passed to Celtic to convey to the SFA and it was heeded by the club. There is no reason in why a similar conduit cannot be used by supporters groups of all clubs.

The enormity of the task, to get the majority of trusts and associations of all clubs to support this approach and give it sufficient weight, should not be underestimated, but in the interests of amplifying our voice, it is worth the effort.

Based on that 2010 experience, and on the discussion that has taken place on TSFM we have arrived at a (now amended) resolution below under the auspices of TSFM and which has been sent to all representative club supporters groups.

We believe one of the reasons the SFA and SPL were able to mislead (or simply fail to provide leadership) was because of the lack of clarity surrounding who should take provide that leadership and what principles should have been paramount.

The SFA were as tied to the commercial impact of Rangers demise as the SPL and indeed had to be reminded by the supporters of the importance of that sporting integrity. In the aftermath of the Rangers implosion, both the SFA and Leagues on the face of it appear still too commercially oriented to act in a way that balances commercialism and sporting principles.

We have attempted to address this in the resolution below. It also contains additional points raised already on TSFM and elsewhere. It is designed to assist in the widening of accountability in the sport.

We are not wed to the draft or the language. It is there to be revised but we hope it contains enough food for thought to be acceptable to the supporters groups and the clubs.

As recently as today, the SFA has published a Fans Charter. We welcome this development, and although it does not address our specific concerns with respect to governance it is a step in the right direction (http://www.fanscharter.com/).

Some of the principles published are;

  • Challenge is to make a National Fans Charter known, accepted and influential
  • Getting fan involvement in drafting charter important to acceptance,  influence and growing awareness.

We think our resolution is an even bigger step in the direction of those principles.

DRAFT Proposal for Representative Supporter Groups e.g. Trusts or Associations to send to their club to convey to the SFA/SPL/SFL Boards.

We [Insert Association/Trust name here] and in association with fans’ groups of other clubs, ask [Insert Club name here] to convey the following to the Scottish Football Association, SPL and SFL on our behalf.

1         We believe that the commercial viability of Scottish football at the professional level depends absolutely on the belief by supporters that sporting integrity is at the heart of all competition, and that those governing them and the rules by which they exercise governance, must hold sporting integrity as paramount above ALL other concerns. This belief can be summed up in the one word “trust” Without trust in those responsible for governing Scottish Football, commercial viability will suffer, to eventual ruin of our game.

2         There is a perception (accompanied by some dismay and anger) among football supporters throughout Scotland that those who were charged with upholding the rules of the SFA and SPL/SFL, only did so partially – and even then only because of the threat of supporter action if they did not.
3         There appears to be no distinction or order of hierarchy between those governing the game (the SFA) for whom we believe preservation of sporting integrity should be the prime purpose, and the leagues (SPL/SFL) for whom commercial aspects are (understandably) uppermost. As a result sporting integrity lost its primacy and it was left to supporters to insist on it.

4         Consequently many Scottish football supporters have lost confidence that the Scottish Football Association will fulfil their purpose of safeguarding the sport. Indeed their silence following the revelation of a 5 way agreement last summer on the future of the liquidated Glasgow Rangers has exacerbated this loss of confidence in the SFA’s ability to administer professional football in Scotland in a manner that reflects their duty of care to all aspects of the game and everyone who takes part in it.

5         Decisions and deals have been taken by the SFA, SPL, and SFL without any public scrutiny. The operations and decisions of those bodies lack transparency and they are not accountable in any recognisable form to the football supporters throughout the land, without whom there is no professional association.


6         In our view this loss of trust can only begin to be restored by the SFA publically committing  itself to:

(i)                  The production of an unequivocal “mission” statement of purpose/intent which will state (in whatever form they may exist) that maintaining sporting integrity is and will always be their prime goal. The statement will also describe how they intend to ensure this principle is followed in their interactions with Leagues and Clubs, particularly when commercial decisions that might undermine sporting integrity are implemented by the Leagues. (e.g. In the case of TV contracts, sponsorship or any significant league reconstruction).

(ii)                Further: in recognition of the inability of some individuals to provide leadership during the past year simply because of conflicts of interest, take steps to remove any such conflict, and in doing so enable the organisation and its office bearers to function unhindered.

(iii)               In the interests of transparency, publish the “five point agreement” that allowed The Rangers entry into SFL and SFA, provide a supporting rationale for entering into the agreement, and confirm that the terms have been or are being complied with.

Along with other trust restoring measures (see attached Annex) these steps should mark the end of the continuing lack of trust in the authorities.

7.         We appreciate that it may be the start of next season before there is any visible evidence of our concerns being addressed although the statement of purpose/intent by the SFA (i) and action at (ii) can be readily put in place – would be a welcome early development.

8.         All club’s supporters groups will be watching closely for signs of progress before advising our members and our other supporters if we feel the necessary trust restoring steps are being taken and advise that they can purchase their season books for 2013/14 knowing that sporting integrity is once more absolutely paramount in Scottish football to the betterment of our game.

Signed __________________________ on behalf of

[Insert supporter trust/association name here]

Date ______________

Annex to resolution.

The following is a list of other measures that the SFA should take in order to satisfy supporters that they should be entrusted with the job of governing Scottish football.

  1. To increase transparency and accountability in a meaningful way – possibly via creation of an active supporter’s liaison group drawn from representative supporter groups of each club. Its remit, using an agreed consultative mechanism to generate dialogue, to hear supporters’ concerns and consider them before key decisions are made. In an industry that is totally interdependent it is folly to exclude a major stakeholder from key decision making.
  2. A tightening of and an annual and independent audit of the process for granting UEFA Club (FFP) and National Club licensing reporting to the representative supporter liaison group as well as other SFA members to ensure all clubs are living within their means.
  3. Introduction of a rule requiring all Scottish football club directors to declare any financial interest/shareholding in any club other than their own and to rule that disposition of those shares/interest should be a part of a fit and proper assessment of a person’s qualification to hold office at an association club.
  4. A feasibility review of Scottish refereeing to assess the potential for creating a professional service that the SFA provide to the leagues by recruiting and training referees, but where the leagues monitor and reward consistently good performances to an agreed standard. Given the sums dependent on referee decisions, the current system must change for everyone’s sake including the referees.
  5. A full explanation about the circumstances (including dates) surrounding the award of a UEFA Club licence to Rangers in spring/summer of 2011 when there was unpaid social tax that prime facie did not meet the conditions for deeming the granting of a licence acceptable under the UEFA FFP rules on unpaid tax (the wee tax bill).

The [Insert Club Name here] Trust/Supporters Association asks [Insert Club Name here] to convey our concerns above with their provenance to the appropriate authorities as they see fit viz:

    • Football Authority in Scotland (The SFA)
    • Europe (UEFA)
    • Scottish Government (on the issue of accountability to supporters and       proper checks and balance governance.)
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About Trisidium

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

1,893 thoughts on “A Question of Trust (Updated)”


  1. ‘Their beefburgers were found to have traces of pork in them. It was a joke’
    _____________________________________

    The latest is the beefburgers have been found to have traces of beef in them !!


  3. Don’t know if this is already on the site so apologies if it is. Good read / info from Corsica1968 re the TRFC share issue.

    http://alzipratu.wordpress.com/2013/02/05/39/

    _____________________________________

    Thanks Corsica1968. Financially, I can add nothing to your informed analysis and certainly nothing to the expert opinions you’ve solicited.

    It seems to me you’re pointing up only one of two outcomes and that the third scenario i.e. Sevco working it’s way through the leagues over several years, is not possible given the financial analysis presented.

    1. Outcome 1 is that the income stream will be reinstated by parachuting sevco into a reorganised top flight. There was plenty of appetite to supply parachutes last summer so I’m sure this will appear in due course. Funny that Regan and Doncaster have broken cover in the same week. The sporting merit argument for fast track promotion seems to be waning though!

    2. The whole financial mess will unravel in a “history repeating itself” scenario that is morbidly fascinating. Liquidation came about through mismanagement of complex financial instruments and eventual non payment of tax. The sale of the club to a patsy who presided over it’s demise was just the endgame not the new dawn. Well here we have a new owner, complex financial manouevering (the share offer) and where will it take us?

    If the whole edifice falls away then we will have a sorry scenario. A media who wouldn’t investigate left staring at the ruins they were complicit in bringing about. The silent majority supporters who couldn’t take control of a decent resurrectrion left with no club to follow and finally those supporters who invested being duped for at least the third time – debentures, season tickets, share purchases.

    That adds up to a lot of people with either blood on their hands or who let evil succeed by doing nothing.

    Look out for parachite attempts.


  4. if they were just honest and accepted it is a new club, we would have none of this pantomime.


  5. andy says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 15:45
    4 0 Rate This
    Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 15:30

    OK, they could sell their shares – but i didn’t see any rush to do that despite the 28% increase in share price. So they haven’t done that to get capital back.

    _____________
    something i have been thinking about

    if someone was to try and sell a load of shares who would buy them ?

    ——

    The only way that I can see anyone buying the shares is to sell them to the fans under some spurious idea that they are doing it for the good of the club and to see that the fans own the majority of the shares – even though it’s just a holding company.

    That would be when they are no longer locked in


  6. If Sportsound are reading this, please explain to Gordon Smith that Newco were not voted out of the SPL. Oldco held the share and Newco didn’t. The vote was to determine whether the share should be transfered from Oldco to Newco to allow Newco to be admitted. The clubs voted not to transfer the share therefore Newco could not be admitted.


  8. Regan ‘its no up tae me’

    Doncaster ‘its no up tae me’

    lol


  9. yourhavingalaugh says:

    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 12:56

    Madbhoy
    Have you just explained your nom de plume.

    I may be many things but the one thing you can be assured of is that I am definately, 100% mad a hatter! Oh, and thanks for making the wife smile, nothing pleases her more than someone having a go at me.


  10. Cybertims ‏@Cybertims
    Charles Green. selling off assets after a winding up order served on sevco/TRFC?. strong rumours flying around. anyone in the know?


  11. Sorry pressed return too soon meant to say:

    I think they have taken Phil’s tweet too literally.


  12. I’m confused regarding the story that almost £13M of the recent share issue was ‘debt for equity’.
    Would this be similar the ‘Heads of term’ document published sometime ago where Ibrox, Murray Park (still to be renamed), and the Albion Car Park were to be sold off?
    Why would anyone give this type of money to a football club, particularly a football club in Scotland where the only way you make money is by being in the CL and lets face it ‘The Rangers’ are not going to get anywhere near this anytime soon.
    There must be more to this story.
    How has the money evaporated in such a short space of time considering they had no banking facilities?

    I mean how can a new club with 500 million fans go belly up within a year.


  13. Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 18:38
    ==============================================
    Don’t see why anyone could find his offensive.
    Wishing Gazza all the best.


  14. justshatered says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:25

    I’m confused regarding the story that almost £13M of the recent share issue was ‘debt for equity’.

    ………………………….

    Why would anyone give this type of money to a football club

    =========================

    Some people are taking that as a message that it is possibly a business which was owed a lot of money and had no way of recovering it. So they took the equity instead.

    I’m not one of those people, but it seems some are reading the situation that way.


  15. canuckbhoy says: Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 16:11
    ————————————–
    The CVA certainly was planned to be funded by Loans, a total of £8.3M from Sevco 5088, repayable by the end of 2020. From the CVA proposal.

    4.20.1 In addition to the £200,000 referred to in Paragraph 4.19, Sevco agrees to advance to the Company the sum of £8,300,000;
    4.20.2 £8,300,000 will be available for draw down by the Company no later than 31 July 2012, but only once certain conditions (the ―”conditions”) are satisfied;
    4.20.3 The Company will repay the Loan together with interest on it on or before 31 December 2020; and
    4.20.4 The loan will, subject to the laws of Scotland, be secured by standard securities and a floating charge over the assets and undertaking of the Company.

    The initial £200,000 (exclusivity fee) may well have been provided by Imran Ahmed. He was subsequently repaid, £178,000 in cash and the remainder in shares (2.2M at 1p per share)

    It is certainly possible that Ticketus planned to fund the CVA as a loan via Sevco 5088, but there is only circumstantial evidence in the way of previous company and director relationships.

    The actual purchase of the assets appeared to be a straight cash payment of £5.5M plus pre acquisition costs of £1.75M. The main backers at that time were Blue Pitch, Margarita and Zeus (going by the initial share holdings). Was Ticketus behind those investors? Again it’s possible but with the same caveats on circumstantial evidence.

    Further fundraising raised £5.575M before the IPO. Mike Ashley joined the party at that point. It is not clear from the Prospectus who else contributed to that sum.

    I am inclined to believe the Ticketus theory as espoused by Corsica1968, Goosey and others, but would like to see something more substantial to back it up. What might help would be some official document from BDO declaring the names and amounts for the creditors of RFC 2012 in Liquidation, to establish the size of Ticketus’ claim. Should it be much less than the original £26.7M claim, then I think that would be evidence of them having sold at least part of their claim in return for a share in RIFC.

    A creditor’s claim and the RIFC funding could of course be maintained separately by Ticketus (and their investors), which would leave us no further forward.


  16. dentarthurdent42 says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:36

    Thanks for the reply. I’m not really up on all this finance game as my own bank manager would testify but I assume the £13M also has interest on the money and that this will be at a relatively high rate given the club has no banking facilities.
    If all this is true then surely the wirting is on the wall as there is no way they will ever be able to get the property back and will be paying through the nose year after year for playing at the park they owned little more than a year ago.
    Or are they hoping that the original sale from D&P is struck down and the properties go back on the market for sale to the highest bidder. If that happens what happens to the money owed?
    Maybe I have this completely wrong but ‘The Rangers’ are either stuffed or they will take another group of city investors for a ride.
    Whatever one it is I guess only time will tell.


  17. justshatered says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:25
    …………………………………

    Thats the figure I have been waiting for..

    If that is the amount being called in…then they won’t reach the end of Feb never mind 2013…

    However there is a possibility this is also part of the plan to once again push assets further and further away from BDO legally…


  18. I don’t understand why Charles Green would take any responsibility for the Ticketus debt, either as Rangers Ltd or Rangers International PLC.

    The debt itself, if one accepts it as a debt, was owed by the old company, which is being liquidated. The new company and PLC have no interest in it as far as I am aware.

    The only possible reason I can think of, and it is way out there, is that Ticketus have some claim under English Law rather than Scots. In which case their ownership over seats they had bought may survive the liquidation.

    The Court of Session made it clear that was not the case and the contract could be broken, creating a simple debt, for the old company. However if it were dealt with under a different jurisdiction, who knows. If they still “owned” the seats they paid for they may have accepted equity instead.

    Like I said, way out there and just lateral thinking.


  20. justshatered says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:49

    The impression I get, and bear in mind this is me speaking for others not necessarily something I believe myself, is that it was a debt for equity swap. So rather than being owed money the business concerned now owns a proportion of the holding company, which in turn owns all of Rangers FC.


  21. dentarthurdent42 says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:51
    ………………………………….

    You need to bear in mind….Charlie…Craig…Dave King….Dave Murray all have historical links as previously covered by our old friend Corsica…the reasons to you and I don’t stack up…but to spivs favours can be called in…


  22. justpedylan says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 18:18

    Look out for parachite attempts.
    ——————————————-
    I think you’ve got a typo there – you must mean “parashite”, Shirley?


  23. i do not remember if the Bomber ever got an answer to his question:

    Who owns the Deids

    The way things are going he could be their next manager


  24. wonder if chuck had to duck under the table when the rapid vienna guys came in ?
    bit like the sound of music.


  25. Looks like the Ticketus being behind ‘Sevco’ has been put to bed. Oli from Octopus confirms to Tommy that going after Craig Whyte is their only course of action.

    “Why would we buy football club … the money would never be there! Massive operational costs”

    Up the creek without a paddle Chuck!


  26. “parashite” – Sean Connery’s description of a certain CEO?


  27. justshatered says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 20:49

    Maybe I have this completely wrong but ‘The Rangers’ are either stuffed or they will take another group of city investors for a ride.
    ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
    JS
    Nope
    You have it completely right .They are stuffed . And it gets worse
    There is no money to be made by running TRFC
    A warchest of at least £10m is needed to get a decent team under way
    Only Spivs are likely to be interested in taking the assets off Green
    TRFC need a sugar daddy
    And if there wasn`t one when the price was £5,5m its unlikely there will be one anytime soon


  29. First time post so go easy!

    I thought wee Craigy had a floating charge against the assets, so when Ticketus threatened to sue Craigy, due to his personal gurantees to them, perhaps he transferred the floating charge to them? This would have given ticketus some leverage to negotiate with Duff and Phelps on the purchase of assets at a knock down price, Charlie then fronts the purchase up to avoid the backlash Ticketus would have faced.

    On the other point about who would possibly buy the shares that Corsica1968 referred to. Lots of companies participate in share buy back schemes. Ticketus maybe found a route to access the revenues of those future ticket sales via a share buy back


  30. lets say you own a club and you are heading for administration. If you rename the holding company, create a new holding company , name the new company with the same name as the old company.

    Then shift the club to the new holding company and leave the old company to be liquidated. Carry on this wheeze every time money is tight.

    now back to the real world, of course the club and company are the same legal entity otherwise no club could ever go bankrupt.


  31. Anyone got any idea why Neil Doncaster, being interviewed on Sportsound yesterday, would not be drawn on the issue of last year’s RFC prize money? He said that he wanted to wait until the commission’s findings were published and would not utter a single syllable on this matter until then. And he didn’t.

    Mr Spiers emerged with some credit last night for at least asking some tricky questions. He also faced down reality with his, “Technically, they are a new club,” comment. Kenny Macintyre was a dynamic presenter, he also read out emails and tweets from fans that were not exactly flattering to some of the guests. The evening’s big loser was Gordon Smith. Could not believe he’d ever been in a position of authority at the SFA.

    So that’s Regan and Doncaster … Ogilvie next?


  32. mickob7 says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 23:31

    On the other point about who would possibly buy the shares that Corsica1968 referred to. Lots of companies participate in share buy back schemes. Ticketus maybe found a route to access the revenues of those future ticket sales via a share buy back
    ========
    As I understand it, a public company which decides to buy back its own shares cannot do so selectively- all the holders of that class of share have to get the same opportunity to sell back their shares. So it really wouldn’t work as a mechanism for Ticketus to get their money back.

    I have only seen share buy-backs offered by companies that are cash rich, in other words they have lots of cash in the bank and have nothing they can use it on. RIFC , on the other hand, is struggling to see its way through to the next renewal of season tickets. They simply don’t have the money to buy back shares.

    By the way, I think it quite possible that you’re correct about Ticketus still being in the picture. If they have accepted shares in exchange for the money they were owed, they will have done so because it was either that, or sue Whyte, and if they were going to sue Whyte, then I think they would have done so by now.


  33. scott roberts (@schoosh71) says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 23:31

    Nice one


  34. forweonlyknow says:
    Tuesday, February 5, 2013 at 22:38
    18 1 Rate This
    Looks like the Ticketus being behind ‘Sevco’ has been put to bed. Oli from Octopus confirms to Tommy that going after Craig Whyte is their only course of action.

    “Why would we buy football club … the money would never be there! Massive operational costs”
    ======
    Can you post a link to that, please?


  35. From what I can see we (and i include myself) are all getting a bit carried away with all the possible financial woes going on at Sevco.

    Phil Mac has stirred things up a bit but as yet we are not in a RTC situation where certain facts are known and can be backed up.

    Until Phil Mac can tell us more or the story breaks there are still too many unknowns to make any decent call on whether or not Sevco are in danger.

    To date the only things we know is that from previous audited accounts, without Euro football Rangers ran at a loss. While cuts have been made on the players wages the overall running costs of the club are still high as there has been no redundancies nor scaling back of operations. Ibrox is nearly full every game so the costs for catering, security, policing etc are still as high as they were in the past.
    We know that income is down and that there are no commerical deals in the offing, even the stadium naming rights has gone quiet.
    We know that investors will at some point be looking for a return.
    We know that Mr Green wants to give Mccoist £10m, give Ibrox a make over, buy land, move the shop and ticket office, build hotels & cancer centres and start world wide acadamies.

    With what we know the figures don’t stack up if everything on the wish list is to come true.

    For Sevco fans, surely the most optimistic outcome is that something is going to have to give to allow the team to keep playing this season and next. If they can weather that storm then they could be on their way to recovery.

    On the otherhand if the unknowns and the rumours become knowns and the truth then there could be trouble ahead.

    Time will tell.


  36. . . . . it was a debt for equity swap. So rather than being owed money the business concerned now owns a proportion of the holding company, which in turn owns all of Rangers FC.
    ———————————————————————————————————–

    If it was a debt for equity swap the shareholding created would need to be declared to AIM if it ws above either 3 or 5% can’t remember which. In view of the Ticketus ‘debt’ level the figure would be above the limit and require to be declared.

    I think it would be too far a stretch of the imagination to believe that the declaration was being deliberately witheld.


  37. Of course any sharehodling could be held in the name of nominees or a trust but the declaration percentage above 5% would remain. Only one declaration has been submitted to AIM and that is by HARGREAVE HALE LIMITED on behalf of unnamed DISCRETIONARY CLIENTS and the date the transaction was agreed and the percentage threshold crossed was on 18 December 2012 just before the actual flotation date.

    The shares involved total 5,022,000 and represent 7.7148% of Rangers International voting rights and 4,700,000 of these shares are held for unit trusts operated by Marlborough Fund Managers Ltd, for whom Hargreave Hale Ltd manages the investments on a discretionary basis. The remaining balance is held on behalf of other discretionary clients.

    I note the Rangers Internationaal share price at 82p is continuing to slide this morning and the downward trend has been underway since the start of the year often with very thin volumes traded.


  38. ecobhoy says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 09:32

    But aren’t a lot of the shares held by offshore entities of which we know nothing, or by UK institutions which may well be acting as nominees? Apparently Green has told the SFA who is behind these shareholdings, but so far as I’m aware, there is nothing in the public domain regarding several large blocks of shares.


  40. Whoevers got the sub 70p shares wants to get a move on. Latest trades 10p down on the high.

    09:27:20 06-Feb-2013 Price80.04 Vol 2,857 £2,286.74 Ordinary trade


  41. I must have missed this 😆

    Alison Robbie ‏@AlisonRobbie

    So happy @RadioClydeNews and @ClydeSSB nominated for Best sports story at the @irnawards (Rangers In Crisis: The Demise Of An Institution)


  42. I must have missed this 😆

    Alison Robbie ‏@AlisonRobbie

    So happy @RadioClydeNews and @ClydeSSB nominated for Best sports story at the @irnawards (Rangers In Crisis: The Demise Of An Institution)
    ——————————————————————————————————————–

    Probably the same people who nominated (and awarded !) the Journalist of the Year award to Keith (off the radar) Jackson !

    You just gotta laff ! 🙂


  43. neepheid says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 09:53

    Apparently Green has told the SFA who is behind these shareholdings, but so far as I’m aware, there is nothing in the public domain regarding several large blocks of shares.

    ——————————————————————————————————————-

    I remember trying to decipher what the SFA were told quite some time ago and I was fairly satisfied that the SFA didn’t actually have a clue who the ‘actual’ owners were and only had knowledge of the nominees.

    Since the SFA were told there has also been some large shareholdings created and I have doubts whether they know anything about the owners of these either.


  44. ecobhoy says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 11:37
    ================================================
    Around 4 weeks ago,2 lots of 400k shares were sold on the same day.There have been a few in the 10-50k range but these two are the only biggish deals to show as yet.


  45. jackglasgow says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 11:33
    22 0 Rate This
    I must have missed this

    Alison Robbie ‏@AlisonRobbie

    So happy @RadioClydeNews and @ClydeSSB nominated for Best sports story at the @irnawards (Rangers In Crisis: The Demise Of An Institution)
    ——————————————————————————————————————–

    Probably the same people who nominated (and awarded !) the Journalist of the Year award to Keith (off the radar) Jackson !

    You just gotta laff

    ———————————————————————————————————–

    laff laff laff, then turn them aff


  46. On a quiet day.

    Same Old Lies – A Lesson from History

    In Egypt, one of the greatest surviving monuments and one of the most popular tourist attractions aside from the pyramids of Giza, is the great temple complex at Abu Simbel. The twin temples of Abu Simbel were originally carved out of the Nubian mountainside around 1250 BC by ancient craftsmen under Ramesses II, also known as Ramesses the Great (by his own admission) as a lasting monument to himself and his queen Nefertari and to commemorate his alleged victory against the Hittites at the Battle of Kadesh (located in modern day Syria).

    Ramesses is often celebrated as the greatest and most powerful pharaoh of the Egyptian Empire. Like most heads of state, Ramesses was afflicted with a very high opinion of himself and ordered the construction of many large monuments in his own honour all over ancient Egypt. He also erected more colossal statues of himself than any other pharaoh before or since and even usurped many existing statues by having his own face recarved and inscribing his own cartouche on them. Ramesses was a master of propaganda (or what we currently know as PR) and his victories over foreign armies are depicted on numerous temple walls throughout the land.

    The reason he built on such a monumental scale was to ensure that his legacy would survive the ravages of time. The walls at Abu Simbel are carved in a unique style called ‘sunken relief’. Ramesses insisted that his carvings be deeply engraved in the stone, which made them not only less susceptible to later alteration, but also made them more prominent in the Egyptian sun. Depicted in this indelible sunken relief across the walls and pylons of Abu Simbel are spectacular scenes of Ramesses the Great, victorious in battle against the Hittites at Kadesh. There, immortalized in stone, is his great victory for all to see.

    Except

    Ramesses the Great didn’t defeat anyone at Kadesh. Later historians tell us that Ramesses was actually fed false information by Hittite spies, led his men into a trap and barely avoided losing his entire army. Realising his 10,000 strong force (including some 300 chariots) would be overwhelmed by the Hittite army, Ramesses was forced to sign a peace treaty with the Hattusili III, King of the Hittites. This was the first international non-aggression treaty in recorded history and effectively ended Egypt’s expansion into the north.

    However, Ramesses had too huge an ego and could not accept the reality of his defeat at the hands of what he believed was an ‘inferior’ race of people. The pharaoh also did not wish to appear less than godlike to his followers (who were taught that he was a God) and feared he would lose control of the population. So on his return, Ramesses set about promoting the idea that the battle in Kadesh had actually been a great victory for Egypt, certain that most Egyptians lacked the means to actually travel the 1,000 miles to Kadesh to find out for themselves what the truth was.

    In modern times, the ongoing Rangers saga is a clear demonstration that this kind of ‘writ large’ propaganda is still as effective today as it was in ancient times. The supposed guardians of our game and our clubs have used their clever PR people and the lazy journalists of the mainstream media to promulgate several myths designed to keep the fans shelling out their hard earned cash to support a ‘failed system’. The most obvious examples of these deliberate fallacies are:

    Club and company were separate entities;

    Only Rangers ‘holding company’ was liquidated;

    Club history and honours can be bought and sold;

    The Rangers were voted out of the SPL;

    The Rangers are ‘banned’ from Europe;

    ‘Rangers’ have paid all of their debts;

    The SFA are powerless over the SPL and the SFL;

    Rangers have been punished enough;

    Rangers won the big tax case;…. and the classic

    Scottish football needs a ‘strong’ Rangers.

    These outright lies, repeated often enough in the mainstream media, have become accepted as self-evident truth by the deluded hoards but only serve to undermine the supporter’s individual and collective power over our game. The truth is our leaders have failed us, all of us. The system is broken, corrupted by corporate influence, SKY money and personal greed. The rules governing the financial aspects of the game are ineffective and have been shown to be so by their inability to mitigate the situation which has been evolving at Ibrox and Hampden over the last two decades. Current ‘reconstruction’ talk is no more than window dressing this ‘failed system’ in an attempt to convince us that ‘everything is under control’ and we should all go back to sleep.

    There is a moral to this story and it is this. The powers that be won’t allow the truth to get in their way and will feed their own people any old crap in order to control them. That is a fact carved in stone for all to see, 3200 years ago. It is no less true today than it was in the time of the pharaohs.

    I’ve created a blog at http://www.theinternetbampot.wordpress.com for anyone who wishes to peruse or comment on any of my previous musings.


  47. OMG, i am just listening to podcast of Radio scotland program last night. I can’t believe Doncaster is responsible for running the game here…what a fop, and as for Smith – FFS.

    If anything having heard from Reagan, Doncaster, Smith recently, it’s time to get shot of them all. Anyone currently employed by the SFA, SPL, SFL or hold any post in any committee should be fired, their names put on a list of people “not fit and proper” to hold ANY office in the game in scotland and we should simply PAY another FA to run the game for us in the meantime while we train and employ new people

    Anything short of that is not acceptable.


  48. f you’re looking for something to do tomorrow:

    alex thomson ‏@alextomo

    #c4news online – we’re doing a Rangers online discussion tomorrow at 12.15 Glasgow time. Fans, legal expert, top journalist — and me.


  49. Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 14:07
    10 0 i
    Rate This

    OMG, i am just listening to podcast of Radio scotland program last night. I can’t believe Doncaster is responsible for running the game here…what a fop, and as for Smith – FFS.

    Anyone currently employed by the SFA, SPL, SFL or hold any post in any committee should be fired, their names put on a list of people “not fit and proper” to hold ANY office in the game in scotland

    ——————

    I can’t agree entirely. There are no doubt many people in all three organisations who are doing their job competently. Secretaries, receptionists, cleaners, the IT guys, document controllers, catering staff and so on. It’s the ones at the top who must go. If, as seems possible from recent discussion on here, Sevco 5088 are about to implode again, the last thing we need are Regan, Doncaster et al bending the rules inside out in order to accommodate whatever sort of phoenix arises from the next lot of ashes.

    Their track record is deplorable. They must go. Their postions were untenable all the way through last summer, yet they have hung on to the positions they so poorly fill. They are dwarfs in giant’s robes. If this site has a purpose it must be to highlight the negative impact their incompetence is having on the Scottish game and ensure they go and go quickly.


  50. thebasharmilesteg says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 14:35
    ————————————————————–

    nope, any competent individual who chooses to carry on working under that leadership is severely lacking in judgement, ability or ambition – simply enough, if they are not part of the solution, they are part of the problem – get them ALL out for putting up with the mediocrity of their leaders without rising up in bloody revolution to overthrow them!!


  52. http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/revealed-rangers-windingup-petition/4020

    Revealed: Rangers winding-up petition

    After some days of often feverish online speculation, I am now able to clarify the situation regarding the winding-up order which may soon be served against the Rangers Newco over a contract for services prior to the recent share offer.

    Orlit Enterprises, based in Singapore, is seeking to petition the Scottish Court for a winding-up order against Rangers. Sources close to this legal action have spoken exclusively to Channel 4 News today.

    This claim arises from the club’s alleged failure to pay two of the four invoices issued by Orlit. The outstanding sum is £400,000.

    The source has clarified to Channel 4 News that Orlit Enterprises was contracted to source and introduce the investors who provided seed capital in order to acquire the club from the administrator and to secure the June 2012 payroll.

    Orlit did not participate in either the pre-IPO equity fundraising or the IPO itself.

    My sources indicated to me that there has been no satisfactory answer from the club as to its non-payment despite several requests. In the circumstances, the application for a winding-up order of the Rangers Football Club Limited – being the trading company obliged to pay the debt . Sources close to Orlit say they now have no other option than to embark upon winding up proceedings.

    We are seeking comment on this from Rangers. Of course they may well have very sound reasons and defence for not paying.

    This all sounds dramatic stuff and it may possibly play that way. But one should remember that winding-up petitions are often used as a method of extracting payment from companies.


  54. Humble Pie says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 13:44
    …
    Same Old Lies – A Lesson from History
    …
    The powers that be won’t allow the truth to get in their way and will feed their own people any old crap in order to control them. That is a fact carved in stone for all to see, 3200 years ago. It is no less true today than it was in the time of the pharaohs…
    =================================================
    …so…HP…are you suggesting that there could be a monument erected, perhaps in a revamped George Square, with suitable carvings which depict;

    – the all conquering – yet compassionate and caring – unbroken history of ‘Rangers’
    – the ‘Rangers’ as being a tribe that has always been a reliable beacon of truth and honesty
    – the SFA as being the supreme guardian and protector of all clubs across the land
    – the SFA President throwing hugely expensive ‘nights out’
    – etc…

    It could add a humourous tourist attraction to the Square. 🙄
    ==================================================
    Good post HP.


  56. So a winding up order petition is the ‘big stick’ of last resort to extract payments due.

    Interestingly, in the TRFC case it looks like it is for payments for ‘broker’ type commissions or introductory fees ?

    i.e. there would be doubt about whether TRFC would be requiring these services again – i.e. there is no ongoing trading partnership like a computer hardware/software supplier for example.

    From a PR perspective, the damage is done now that the winding up order is public knowledge.

    Assuming all true, then I would bet Charlie doesn’t have the cash: why wait for the fallout from a winding up petition – and especially when you are trying to project an image of a ‘cash rich/debt free’ club to the hordes ?


  57. Neepheid

    I doubt it but he blatantly never paid Rapid when he said he would. Up to him if he likes paying his bills in court rather than through the post. Expensive way to live and its definitely spooking the market.


  58. So, wind up TRFC Ltd

    Could it be all debts are with TRFC Ltd – including players, but assets and cash with RIFC PLC

    let TRFC ltd die, keep cash in RIFC Ltd and maybe sell ibrox/murray park for more cash, divide the pot up amongst shareholders and close RIFC PLC – or even use cash to buy another distressed company and strip it away all over again?

    what could hte bears do? they are minority shareholders in a holding company


  59. neepheid says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 15:43

    £400k…ooooft !! ..smoke mirrors n bullsh*t certainly don’t come cheap.?


  60. From KDS………

    There appears to be a link between the directors of Orlit and Tricor. (And Allenby capital)
    Why does that ring a bell? :ponder:
    Edit:Chan Fook Meng (Nova Resources) is a director of both companies.

    Allenby Capital – our friend Mr Stockbridge.


  61. regards this winding up order……..

    lets all think back to the GEF’s reign. £35K bill wasn’t paid, went to court…..it was the 1st public sign bills weren’t being paid

    is this the same thing? what else isn’t being paid? VAT, NI, PAYE? Suppliers? Face Painters?

    this one might get settled – misunderstanding, nothing to see here, but how many more will get flushed out in fear of Admin Mk 2


  62. At some point in the future there will be a book published outlining, in chronological order the scandal that dominated Scottish football 2003-2013. This definitive book will demonstrate the role Doncaster, Regan, Ogilvie, Smith, Longmuir, et al. played in the scandal.
    Each one of the above abrogated their responsibility and jettisoned the rules to accommodate one club/institution.
    The baffling aspect of the saga was that none of them ignored the rules for monetary gain, so one must ask why then did they throw out the rule book. The answer has to be from fear/cowardice.
    Can you imagine allowing your name and your family’s name be tarnished by acting out of fear/cowardice. These gentlemen are well aware how history will judge them when the time comes to chronicle the most infamous scandal to have hit the game in Scotland and still they continue to act like a bunch of cowards..
    Just shows the power of panic and fear!


  63. ianagain says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 15:51
    3 0 Rate This
    Neepheid

    I doubt it but he blatantly never paid Rapid when he said he would. Up to him if he likes paying his bills in court rather than through the post. Expensive way to live and its definitely spooking the market.
    ========
    Weren’t Hearts due a lot of money from TRFC a few weeks ago? I recall Green offering about 50p in the pound for early payment when Hearts were struggling to pay the wages (he’s a real charmer, right enough). Does anyone know if Hearts eventually got paid in full?


  64. A winding up order? Already?
    That must be a world record, surely!!!!


  65. The settlement offered (and not yet paid) to Rapid was also about 50% of the original fee.


  66. Phil is tweeting….

    @Pmacgiollabhain
    To clarify: The WUO order is being taken against Charles Green’s company and NOT against Rangers as ouija boards do not have that fac


  67. ianagain says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 16:23

    The settlement offered (and not yet paid) to Rapid was also about 50% of the original fee.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    … and that is the sort of ‘arrangement’ that should be causing concern with the SFA. Charles Green’s team were admitted to Scottish football on the condition that they paid their football debts (amongst other secret conditions); not on the condition that they negotiate a reduced settlement.


  69. Why would RFC need to employ headhunters to find potential investors, when they had 3 billionaires,Dallas Cowboys, Adidas etc all waiting in the wings.
    A sceptic might think that some of Mr Green’s public announcements in October/November 2012 were not wholly accurate.


  70. From KDS’s top sleuth, cartuja

    5 minute Google daisy-chain…
    Charles Green and Chan Fook Cheng directors of Nova Resources Ltd > Chan Fook Cheng director of Mandarin Mining Ltd > Mandarin Mining Ltd registered address – 14 New Street, London, EC2M 4HE > 14 New Street, London, EC2M 4HE – registered office of Pritchard Springfield Solicitors > Pritchard Springfield – solicitors to Nova Resources Ltd > Pritchard Stockbrokers linked to Craig Whyte


  71. Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 15:56

    So, wind up TRFC Ltd

    Could it be all debts are with TRFC Ltd – including players, but assets and cash with RIFC PLC

    let TRFC ltd die, keep cash in RIFC Ltd and maybe sell ibrox/murray park for more cash, divide the pot up amongst shareholders and close RIFC PLC – or even use cash to buy another distressed company and strip it away all over again?

    what could hte bears do? they are minority shareholders in a holding company
    ===========
    Have posted wrt this a couple of times.Kill the club and be left with all the property and any cash left over.In fact,by dropping the loss making football club,the fans shares may be worth more.


  72. Well done to Phil Mac for being first out the blocks again.

    May I remind people what Charles Green told Rangers supporters in November 2012.
    Please pay particualr attention to point 10 saying they had no debts and were cash rich

    http://www.gersnetonline.co.uk/vb/showthread.php?49483-Charles-Green-meeting-yesterday

    10 – He once again stated that we have no debts and are cash rich AT THE MOMENT and expecting to make a 6 million profit from the retail arm now JJB are out the way.

    This is coming from a Rangers source.

    So lets take Mr Green at his literal word. They were CASH RICH in November so why not pay the Orlit invoice then. However now having secured £22m from the IPO they are struggling to pay their bill?

    When will the Sevcovians next be given the opportunity to question Mr Green in some Glasgow boozer with regard to these recent revelations.

    As a spiv I have no doubt he is a late player. However if I were in control of a ‘club’ that had a tainted past I would be wanting to pay my bills on time, keep out of the courts and stay on the right side of Hector.

    It looks like while he is out of the country, Mr Green may have scored a hat-track of own goals.

    £400k might not be a lot in the scheme of things but if I was a Sevco fans I would be starting to ask a few more questions. Just in case, you understand!!


  73. TallBoy Poppy (@TallBoyPoppy) says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 16:33
    1 0 Rate This
    From KDS’s top sleuth, cartuja

    5 minute Google daisy-chain…
    Charles Green and Chan Fook Cheng directors of Nova Resources Ltd > Chan Fook Cheng director of Mandarin Mining Ltd > Mandarin Mining Ltd registered address – 14 New Street, London, EC2M 4HE > 14 New Street, London, EC2M 4HE – registered office of Pritchard Springfield Solicitors > Pritchard Springfield – solicitors to Nova Resources Ltd > Pritchard Stockbrokers linked to Craig Whyte

    ———————————————————————————————————–

    Can the above be put into music i.e. the knee bone connected to the thigh bone etc…………

    It just seems like a big body of spivs all connected to a dead body in Govan. All fighting for the bones of the carcass.


  74. wottpi says:
    Wednesday, February 6, 2013 at 16:49
    ====================================================
    Depends how you look at it.Conspiracy theorist may say that This was planned to happen when Green was out of the country.
    There are too many coincidences wrt the connections between Green,Allenby,Nova et al.
    Senior,I think,posted yesterday that his information was that Green would withdraw from TRFC in an orderly fashion but circumstances may have changed.
    Although RIFC may be solvent,with cash raised and Ibrox,Murray Park etc in their portfolio,TRFC may be skint.


  75. If the whole financial house of cards is about to collapse, then how prophetic Mr Green’s claims that there would be no monetary incentive for HMRC to pursue, via the UTT, claims against EBTs/etc

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