A recent autumn storm caused the destruction of the metal goal fame in our garden. The small goal with the weather-beaten net had fallen into disuse. But I liked it seeing it there on the grass. I suppose I half-expected, half-hoped, it would be used again. Once, it was a father and son thing and had been constructed carefully from a nice set of plans. At the time, it impressed both son and daughter no end. But that was then, this was now.
One of our trees, blown over by the recent high winds, caused the goal frame’s final demise. As I unscrewed the twisted metal I thought of the hours of innocent fun it had given us. It had been the scene of many goals and not a few great saves. My son, who is soon off to uni, smiled thoughtfully as I mentioned that this was the end of the ‘goalposts of childhood’. Perhaps he knew what I meant.
My own childhood goalposts had been ‘doon the back’. Drawn with chalk on the red brick of the ‘sausage wall’ at one end, and on part of the ‘wash hoose’ at the other. Many a league, Cup and international match was played out between those goals on the Dennistoun dirt. We once put on a parallel version of a historic England v Scotland match while the real match was being played at Wembley. Jim Mone sitting on one of the dykes had a transister radio to his ear. As we played our match he chalked up live score updates on the wall — our Twitter and FaceBook anno 1967. What a day.
We did use a pile of jackets up on the old Dennistoun cricket pitch, but only rarely. Mostly, we played on the red gravel surface at the Finlay Drive entrance. That pitch was fitted with real goalposts — like the ones they had at Hampden. Or so we imagined.
These sentimental memories of receding years accompanied my removal of the ruined metal goal frame. But, as you can imagine, it seemed an almost symbolic act. For fans of Scottish football the ‘goalposts’ that once defined the game of our football childhoods — have not only been moved, they’ve been been twisted and mis-shapen out of all recognition.
The past decades have seen a fundamental change in the way our game is run and governed, at home and abroad. Money is now king and sporting consideration is a luxury we sometimes have to put to one side — or at least, so we’re told.
At the risk of stating the obvious, sport, if it is to mean anything at all, has to be based on clearly defined rules and principles. These rules must be applied equally to all the participants, they are certainly not optional extras. However, to misquote and paraphrase George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some teams are more equal than others’ — at least, when it comes to Scottish football.
The efforts by the SFA to re-interpret rules to fit the unfortunate circumstances surrounding the demise of Rangers FC in 2012 have left most of us scratching our heads. Much of the Scottish media has backed up the SFA’s efforts, something which has added to the general confusion and chaos. In fact, it’s become clear that the death of Rangers, as we knew them, has been such a traumatic event that it must be denied. The authorities and media seem to have been so besotted with one club that its loss is out of the question. And so, it’s been gifted a bizarre kind of immunity from liquidation and death that implies its on-going existence, long after it drew it’s final breath.
This situation has opened the door to a legion of businessmen on the make. They have been allowed to perpetuate the myth, with SFA blessing, that they ‘saved’ Rangers. And their unwavering message is, that they can only succeed if fans keep giving them their hard-earned cash. To those outside the blue bubble it looks like a huge con trick. If the only source of real money in football is the fans, then the Ibrox faithful have been royally fleeced.
How different it could have been if the former club had been allowed a dignified end. A year out of the game would probably have allowed fans to restart a newco of their own. They could have applied for entry into the professional leagues along with the other clubs waiting in line. Chances are they would have been given special dispensation, and walked straight into the bottom tier. Of course, they would have claimed to be the continuation of the spirit of the previous entity — but would anyone have argued against that? How different it could have been if the rules governing the game had been respected. The SFA may even have kept their dignity intact and the press not felt obliged to print half-truths, falsehoods and lies.
You’ve got to wonder why Dunfermline and Hearts fought so desperately to avoid liquidation. After all, the Scottish football authorities now seem intent on convincing us that liquidation has little or no effect on a football club. Even past sins, such as wrongly-registered players are as naught — if, at the time, they were thought to have been registered correctly. By this logic, we have to ask: if a ‘company’ running a ‘club’ bribes a referee, will retrospective action will be taken against the ‘club’. The players and the club, after all, will have done nothing wrong. And since the referee was not known to have been bribed, and not struck off, he was qualified to referee the match in question, at the time. Using the SFA thought process, the result would probably be allowed to stand. Personally, I’m not sure I follow SFA logic. They’ve ‘moved the goalposts’, and (you saw it coming) bent them into an unrecognisable shape.
Which brings me back to our garden. The old metal goal frame is waiting to be driven down to the local re-cycling centre. The twisted metal and worn-out net are useless. Ruined by forces beyond our control. There is no interest in a replacement at present. Perhaps, if we have grandchildren, they will show an interest in football. If they do, I’ll build a new set of goalposts. They’ll be straight and true, the way the goalposts of childhood should be. The way goalposts should always be.
ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:30 pm
I have no information at all on what action, if any, Celtic has taken on the matter.
=============================
Thanks, and apologies for the confusion on my part.
Why aren’t the players in the 1st division hammering down the PFA’s door and demanding wage parity with their Premiership colleagues? Based on McCulloch’s comments, it would appear that Murray Park is a waste of money, since no other club in their division feels the need for such luxurious facilities, or superbuses, or overnights at four/five star hotels. In fact it could be inferred that McCulloch is making a veiled attack on Ally’s management style.
Does Jig fancy his chances as player/coach?
Has the 35 year old decided that his days of schlepping round the lower divisions is beneath his dignity?
Dave King confirms that the Ibrox clubs raison d’etre is to compete with Celtic and that it is “totally unacceptable” to lose to anyone else.
‘Rangers ambition should not be to be slightly better than the teams in the first division.
‘We really have to have a team, next year in particular, which is strong enough to prevail.
‘We have to get through at the first time of asking next year.
‘We have to be in a position to go up to the Premiership and we have to be in the position to launch a challenge to Celtic.
‘There is no guarantee we are going to beat Celtic in the first season – infact it’s unlikely.
‘It would be a miracle if Rangers were to go on and win the league the first season back.
‘But, similarly, we cannot risk going to Celtic Park and being battered 6-0.
‘We can’t start losing 3-1 to Hibs and Aberdeen and accepting it.
‘Saying, “we are in a period of adjustment, it’s not too bad a season,” is not an option. It’s totally unacceptable.’
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2545041/Rangers-director-Dave-King-Listen-simply-risk-6-0-battering-Celtic-Park.html
‘But, similarly, we cannot risk going to Celtic Park and being battered 6-0.
‘We can’t start losing 3-1 to Hibs and Aberdeen and accepting it.
Tell you what Davy boy – based on recent performances those would most likely be the half time scores !
Lord Wobbly says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:04 am
%%%%%%%
Have you had any communication at all from the Rangers board since your offer to invest after the AGM?
‘None at all’
Says it all…
http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/overdue-apologies-huddleboard-blogging/7095#more-7095
Thompson apologises for the Millwall analogy.
And Huddleboard?
neepheid says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:29 am
http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/overdue-apologies-huddleboard-blogging/7095#more-7095
Thompson apologises for the Millwall analogy.
=================================================
Well now we know – he’s not a God but just like the rest of us who can get things wrong.
The important thing is that he has admitted his error because he has realised he should have been much more careful in how he linked Millwall to Celtic or indeed any club given the revulsion and fear most decent supporters still feel about Millwall.
It can take decades for a support to build the type of reputation Celtic has but it can be lost overnight through the actions of a few mindless thugs whose latching-on to any club often has little, if anything, to do with football.
Gang I do not think the posts on here are ‘protesting too much’ to allegations of underhand land/bank deals.. I would love for ECO to put all the great stuff he has written into single post so he can merely cut and paste whenever the bears are being whipped into a frenzy over these daft claims…It wont stop the bears making fools of themselves over the next couple of years as various investigations take place.
— Great bit of business by Celtic to get the best loan/overdraft rates and best land deals..
— Can you imagine the gers fans reaction if it turned out Celtic had scoped out the possibility of exploiting mineral rights on the land and would be making >£20m profit a year for the next 20 years, all thanks to the Gers fans who brought up the land subject in the first place… 😆
GeronimosCadillac says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:55 am
I too agree that you should continue to debunk the PR propaganda and myths but probably not on here. You should post on Rangers Forums. They are the ones in need of an education on this matter on here we have already decided it’s all nonesense.
=================================
I would advise Ecobhoy NOT to post his factual analysis on any Rangers forum. I posted a trivial factual point on the Bears Den a couple of years ago, and the response went well beyond the simply unpleasant. Nobody challenged the factual basis of my post, they simply set out to give me a metaphorical kicking. I got the strong impression that a physical kicking would have been on the cards too, without the anonymity of the internet. That was my first and last post on a Rangers forum.
Thanks to Ecobhoy, any Rangers fan genuinely interested in the facts surrounding the land deals is welcome to come here and educate themselves. They all know where we are. If they disagree with any aspect of Ecobhoy’s analysis, then I am sure he would be willing to engage with them. Maybe even Mr McMurdo in person could let us all have the benefit of his own piercing intellect and in-depth analysis by arguing his case on a factual basis? Well, probably not.
I’m sure that Irvine/McMurdo would be very happy for Ecobhoy to just say nothing. Facts are their enemy, silence is their friend. Keep the facts flowing, Ecobhoy, and do it on here, where anyone can check it out, and contradict if they can. That’s my advice, for what it is worth.
ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:49 pm
So I’ll continue if that’s all right with you.
——
Fill yer boots, young Eco.
I would only suggest that your contributions may be more effective and readable were you to make them a little more concise.
Aside from regulars here, they are much more likely to be read by potentially interested third parties if they’re short and to the point. Journalists, for example, short on time and attention span, will skim for information. Long posts on internet forums are generally skipped, with shorter replies being relied on to pick up any relevant points.
Just saying, like.
Dave King :’No one wants to see Rangers finishing sixth or something like that’.
I’ll take a bet on that and could probably fund investment in T’Rangers for a million years from the winnings.
As discussed the other day it really is time those with the Old School Rangersness just faded away. They live in a fantasy world.
I have no problem with King sayig he wants to compete with Celtic, it is just the fact he believes there are rich like minded people out there who share his views. Can he not see that those of his ilk have all done runners or never showed up in the first place. The business is a basket case and will continue to be one in the eyes of the markets and potential ‘non Rangers men’ until it sorts itself out.
While I still think the newco will hit the skids due to the asset strippers maybe there is actually an outside chance of the football club emerging in a state fit for the 21st Century, where their fans will actually enjoy future successes because it will have been deserved and won through patience, fiscal prudence, hard work and toil as opposed to feeling it was an automatic right..
neepheid says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:23 am
I would advise Ecobhoy NOT to post his factual analysis on any Rangers forum.
——
I imagine it would last 3 or 4 minutes on any such forum, before being deleted and the poster being banned forever. 🙂
The exception may be Rangers Rumours, which does appear to be open to such things.
Bryce Curdy says:
January 24, 2014 at 4:01 am
ecobhoy – don’t always see eye to eye but you utterly deserve your plaudits and more for the magnificent quality of your recent research about Celtic’s land deals.
=============================================================
@ Bryce – don’t worry you are not alone 😆
That’s why I laugh when I see TSFM dissed by some who dismiss it as a self-satisfied back-slapping club. I have a strong personality with strong views about certain issues and they tend to colour the content of many of my posts.
I don’t like being told I’m wrong – who does? Maybe AT could tell us 😳
But I do listen and engage with those doing the telling and I examine and test their arguments to the limit – not as a defence for my own position but to see if there are any flaws in my reasoning or research. I think anyone who has watched me on here for any length of time will be aware I am not a shrinking violet but capable of changing my position if the counter-evidence and argument merits it.
I hope I long retain a mind open to counter-argument with the strength to cope with the hurtful inner knowledge that you got it wrong. None of us likes admitting that especially on important core issues and beliefs. Those with the inability to do so end-up like a large proportion of the Rangers support who seem 100% resistant to counter-arguments and incapable of questioning what their leaders and experts dictate.
In many ways the coal mines and land deals have gone beyond the simple proof that the Bear Land ‘Experts’ are basically morons or very dishonest people prepared to deceive and mislead their fellow-fans.
But what I still can’t get my head round is why not one of those fans has questioned the findings of the ludicrously termed ‘forensic investigations’. Any Bear making the simplest of enquiries can establish that Celtic’s Lennoxtown training centre is built on Green Belt and not housing land and that Westthorn is not a pristine greenfield housing site but one with a long industrial legacy including at least 4 deep-mining coal shafts and underground workings. These factors are what determines the sale price of the sites and not some secret conspiracy. If there is any conspiracy at work then it is within the Rangers camp.
Of course I am sure that a lot of Bears fully recognise the nonsense but remain silent and that’s another mystery to me.
When I used to manage people I always made sure I had a few bolshies from the awkward squad as team members because experience taught me that when I was in full sail and about to sail off the edge of the known world one of them would say: ‘Hey Boss I think you’ve got it wrong. Let’s think about this a bit longer.’
I have watched many managers in my life and their people and most ‘leaders’ are so weak and useless they can’t brook dissent or questioning of their or the company ‘line’. These managers seldom last as they exclude or marginalise team members who question ludicrous decisions. Indeed many of their useless staff know what’s going to happen and keep quiet in the hope they might be able to advance up the dung-hill obviously not through ability and leadership. Most just want to see their idiot Boss get what’s coming to them.
Needless to say I was always a pain in the ass to my superiors – in rank if not ability 😈 But now and again I would find a kindred spirit and good things could be done which made all the hassle worthwhile. I find TSFM a bit like that with an eclectic mix of posters with all sorts of skills and strengths which can complement what different posters are working on and extend beyond the parameters of individual football club support..
That has been in evidence with a number of posters providing info which has helped me enormously in digging into the land stories .
Lord Wobbly says:
January 24, 2014 at 8:04 am
Dave King confirms that the Ibrox clubs raison d’etre is to compete with Celtic and that it is “totally unacceptable” to lose to anyone else.,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ‘But, similarly, we cannot risk going to Celtic Park and being battered 6-0.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Watch this space
ecobhoy on January 24, 2014 at 8:51 am
5 1 Rate This
———
I spent most of the 1970s in England and, although mostly a disinterested observer of football, I do remember the headlines Millwall were making.
I did wonder if the AT piece, drawing the literal comparison that it did between Celtic and Millwall anno 1974, was justified.
Of course, turning on AT for what was a misjudged analogy could have been seen as belittling the undeniably bad behaviour associated with elements of the CFC support.
All in all, though, I think the response to AT’s original piece was justified. And respect to the journalist for qualifying his remarks and for his apology.
I have posted on a few occasions that TSFM does not make enough effort to get the high quality of information posted on here by knowledgable participants to a wider audience.
There is much lamentation about how frankly ludicrous puff pieces or erroneous information is reproduced by the MSM from PR companies press releases.
Let’s fight back.
Eco’s excellent work on rebutting the accusations of dodgy land deals is a clear example and should be crafted into a 1 page release and emailed to every news desk, sports hack and freelancer that contact details can be found.
There have been some unflattering articles on TRFC recently so I won’t believe that there is no hope of it being reproduced.
Time to go mainstream, bampoterati.
TSFM?
Angus1983 says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:29 am
neepheid says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:23 am
I would advise Ecobhoy NOT to post his factual analysis on any Rangers forum.
——
I imagine it would last 3 or 4 minutes on any such forum, before being deleted and the poster being banned forever 🙂 The exception may be Rangers Rumours, which does appear to be open to such things.
————————————————-
Actually I noticed my Lennoxtown article on a Rangers site yesterday and it’s been there since 8 January posted by a Celtic supporter in response to the FootballTaxHavens fantasy which had been posted previously. Interestingly my piece was dismissed because it came from the TSFM ‘Celtic’ site but not one of the points I made – which systematically demolished the Bear Land ‘Experts’ obsession – was attacked or even mentioned.
The collective Bear ‘brain’ seems to be in permanent hibernation when confonted with a contrary viewpoint no matter how well-founded it is. It really is their Achilles’ Heel and it keeps them from moving-on in a positive way. They are imprisoned in the past and condemned to keep doing it The Rangers Way which means repeating the same old mistakes.
If only they had the ability and self-confidence to break free and join modern society.
I feel sorry for the guy burning 20 pounds every 15 seconds at Ibrox. 38,000 a day
The latest footballtaxhavens blog implying Celtic got a questionable land deal at Lennoxtown should have a Mental Health Warning and nearly fused my circuit board. It appears to have been written by someone who has lost touch with reality and taken up residence in a parallel universe where conspiracies abound.
There are a lot of factual errors and what can only be described as gibberish but the most inexplicable leap into the dark is the contention that the joint planning permission granted to builders McTaggart & Mickel & the NHS for a housing development also applies to the Celtic training complex.
In pursuing this novel theory the writer claims: ‘Precedence has been established that Lennox Castle Hospital land should have been valued at Residential. It wasn’t agricultural. It wasn’t green belt. So it’s residential land and the land should have been priced at that level and Celtic paid that price if they wanted the land.’
He apparently doesn’t realise that the joint planning permission for housing is restricted to a portion of the lower section of the former hospital site. It doesn’t extend to the upper section of that site where the Celtic training centre sits and for which planning permission has been granted in the name of Celtic Football Club.
But like all the Bear Land ‘Experts’ he forgets to check the history and I would suggest he reads the Greater Glasgow NHS Board minute of 22nd October 2002 which states: ‘The lower part of the Lennox Castle Hospital site will be promoted for residential development which will be in line with East Dunbartonshire Council’s Draft Local Plan’.
Wrt to the area where the Celtic training complex is now located the Board minute states: ‘Forecast receipts from the disposal of the upper site are minimal on the basis of the Greenbelt Compatible Leisure planning use designation for this part of the site.’
It’s worth remembering that when the low level of sale receipts from the upper site was mentioned it was three years before Celtic became interested in the location. They were still pursuing the option of expanding their training facilities in Glasgow’s East End with the possibility of purchasing the former Belvidere Hospital grounds to add to the Westthorn site.
The minute also explains how a portion of the former hospital site could re rezoned for housing development which otherwise would not have been allowed. Quite simply McTaggary & Mickel owned a nearby site on which it had planning permission for housing and it gave up its rights there to be allowed to build at Lennox Castle. The other site which the builders relinquished was important to the Council afaik to fill-in a Greenbelt gap.
It’s a fact that the Celtic training complex site is subject to Greenbelt restrictions and it cannot be used for housing and that’s why the valuation was so low. It really is that simple and no amount of turning and twisting the facts will change that. A large proportion of the lower site, outwith the housing areas, remains subject to Greenbelt restrictions as well and is important ecologically because of its heavy tree cover and numerous paths provide leisure facilities for walking and cycling.
And if that isn’t enough East Dunbartonshire Council’s map shows the greenbelt areas at the former hospital site and identifies the Celtic training complex as being part of it. Why don’t these Bear ‘forensic investigators’ never check anything instead of either making it up or allowing wishfull thinking to delude them?
http://www.maps.eastdunbarton.gov.uk/LocalViewext/Sites/planning_web_map/#
This latest footballtaxhavens post is so off-the-wall I reckon the pressure of making it up is really getting to them and they are desperate at the thought of their fantasies being unravelled.
EDIT -ADD
This post refers to the footballtaxhavens post ‘Lennox Castle Hospital grounds had another development given outline Residential Planning granted in 2003’.
However I have just noticed another outpouring this morning which I will now have a look at. As I say the desperation seems to be reaching a crescendo 🙂
With Angus’s advice re brevity for Eco why not go for The Sun approach?
“CELTS SNATCH MURRAY PARK IN LENNOXTOWN HOUSING BONANZA”
Or the Daily Record Angle
“CELTS ROB GERS ON THE FLOOR IN LUCKY PUNCH”
A convicted tax fraudster speaks. Dave King, South Africa’s biggest ever tax fraudster is interviewed in today’s Evening Times.
http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/rangers/dave-king-rangers-must-invest-to-compete-with-celtic-149303n.23248347
Regards keeping on top of the state aid nonsense, it looks like the mods are removing posts for no apparent reasons, and I thought the motto “asking the questions the media won’t ask” was meant to be a statement of intent, seems I was wrong.
I can’t help but wonder whether the poor sod whose job it is to burn the cash each day ever feels the temptation to instead put some of it in his pocket.
” a glib and shameless liar” interviewed in today’s Daily Mail.
A tax court judgment has slammed the conduct of businessman and alleged* tax dodger Dave King, describing the newly appointed executive chairman of listed investment holding company MicroMega Holdings as “a glib and shameless liar”. (*now proved)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2545045/Ex-Rangers-director-Dave-King-says-new-share-issue-inevitable-club-prepare-cuts.html
KLF in charge of the undersoil heating at Ibrox?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lW3AQXaoPs
Over 1.1 million shares in RIFC traded at 27p this morning. I wonder who is getting out and who is buying in?
Well footballtaxhavens have finally unmasked the conspiracy we have all been involved in 😳
They trumpet: ‘Outline and Detailed Planning approved for Lennoxtown before sale’
I’ll keep this short and ignore the usual errors of fact and fantasy in the rubbish spouted. But the important thing and absolutely accurate statement they have made is that Celtic didn’t finally sign-off the land deal for Lennoxtown until June 2006 after it had received detailed planning permission for its training complex.
The blog quite rightly states: ‘Normally having land which already has planning permission means the land is more valuable’. But it hints at possible public corruption with the comment: ‘The NHS wants to get the best price from housebuyers but not from Celtic PLC.’
However let’s deal with the facts which the Bear Land ‘Experts’ either ignore or don’t actually understand: Celtic agreed conditional missives to buy the 50 acres in East Dunbartonshire in July 2005 and received outline planning permission for the Lennoxtown training complex development in December 2005 followed by detailed permission in April 2006.
It’s common practice to place conditions on land purchases such as the deal being subject to the grant of planning permission. This would be of particular importance in a greenbelt area for a number of reasons – not least the possible public ire at any pressure on Greenbelt which can delay or halt the actual sale. That’s why the missives were conditional.
I would add that some of the ‘facts’ claimed in today’s blog contradict ‘facts’ in yesterday’s blog – still we can all change our mind when we get it wrong.
However the case for Celtic being involved in ‘dodgy’ land deals is collapsing at some speed – it’s those bloody mine shafts to blame 😆 And the bottom line remains that the Celtic training complex sits on greenbelt land and not land zoned for housebuilding. That is an inescapable fact and will remain so and that’s why the site valuation is what it is ❗
neepheid says:
January 24, 2014 at 11:20 am
Over 1.1 million shares in RIFC traded at 27p this morning. I wonder who is getting out and who is buying in?
—————————————————————————
I’m sure there was around half a million in two transactions the other day as well.
eocbhoy, I’m admiring your work but personally I think that this Lennoxtown discussion has gone on too long (for this site). Anyway, just in case you don’t already have it, you’ll find a report at the link below on the planning application to add two grass pitches at Lennoxtown. Page 3 details chapter and verse of the site history.
The original application for the complex isn’t available online.
http://opis-web.eastdunbarton.gov.uk/online-applications/files/1D7E60E043C717BC59AF1174A7D46CE6/pdf/TP_ED_09_0202-3.2_PLANNING_REPORT-32839.pdf
blu says:
January 24, 2014 at 11:48 am
eocbhoy, I’m admiring your work but personally I think that this Lennoxtown discussion has gone on too long (for this site).
=================================
As always I am in the hands of TSFM. However if I’m personally not interested in any thread under discussion I don’t read it and everyone has that right.
Thanks for the info you provided, which I am aware of, but I didn’t mention it because I felt it was irrelevant to the core Lennoxtown discussion.
The King’s English
Mr King’s use of the English language strongly suggests he anticipates a specific sequence of events:
1. Promotion to the Championship
2. Admin of RFCL (the club)
3. Buy RFCL out of Admin for buttons (presumably without Ibrox, MP etc)
4. Sell shares in RFCL – an IPO
5. Sell season tickets for RFCL
6. Spend, spend, spend in the Championship with McCoist as manager to gain promotion
7. Spend, spend, spend in the Premiership to beat Celtic – as is the natural order of things.
What could possibly go wrong?
BTW, any scenario without Admin of RFCL would require Mr King to buy a significant shareholding in RIFC plc for him to direct a share issue – which he has never alluded to despite the obvious appeal to the masses he would have as his subjects. There is also the matter of his recent criminal convictions which may impact his desire for a position on the (any) board – chairman no less.
I wonder if Mr King has spoken with Mr Wallace about the exact timing of events – because he has stated, categorically no less, that there will be no Admin.
Dave King just doesn’t get it — none of the Real Rangers Men do. Except Hugh Adam. He got it. Intrinsically, they are a much smaller club then Celtic and it eats at them like a cancer. It’s the historical reason for the sectarianism, the financial doping, the discount option scheme, the EBTs, the withholding of tax and NICs, the lot.
If the playing field is level, they are second best.
ecobhoy says:
January 24, 2014 at 11:55 am
blu says:
January 24, 2014 at 11:48 am
eocbhoy, I’m admiring your work but personally I think that this Lennoxtown discussion has gone on too long (for this site).
=================================
As always I am in the hands of TSFM. However if I’m personally not interested in any thread under discussion I don’t read it and everyone has that right.
Thanks for the info you provided, which I am aware of, but I didn’t mention it because I felt it was irrelevant to the core Lennoxtown discussion.
____________________________________________________
Blu is right – your work on finding and publishing the facts to knock down the PR is great and well worth reading on here.
With my neutrals goggles on I would say that to keep posting on it and wasting space on the internet dismantling the dross put out by the swivel eyed loons at the footballtaxhavens.com site is a waste of your talents. It all begins to look a bit too defensive and, dare I say, “obsessive”.
I think sites like that should just be ignored because, as you and others have ably demonstrated, they have no credibility. The Celtic FC legal team shouldn’t ignore it though, They should intervene if they detect any blatant inaccuracies, libels etc.
And before you tell me to stop telling you what to do and that people don’t need to read everything that is posted on here let me just say I like your work but there are bigger fish to fry and your investigative/analytical skills are required there.
If Lee McCulloch genuinely believes that the standard for the SFL1 i not far off the Premiership – then I wonder if all the players will gladly give up their annual pay rises as they move up the leagues for the benefit of the club – after all, its the same level of football they are playing.
Or will the players be happy to follow their managers example and line their pockets until the club goes under?
I guess the bears should be asking that one.
Sugar Daddy says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:46 am
Eco’s excellent work on rebutting the accusations of dodgy land deals is a clear example and should be crafted into a 1 page release and emailed to every news desk, sports hack and freelancer that contact details can be found.
——
This is a splendid idea. I know just how difficult it can be to condense a well-researched and intricate piece, but if a lengthy scientific paper can be whittled down to the salient points contained in a 300-word Abstract, then I’m sure it’s possible!
Bear in mind that a Press Release of more than a few paragraphs – and certainly no longer than one side of paper – will be ignored. Contact details for further information can be included at the bottom should anyone show interest. Due to the personal information this may divulge, it may be an idea to open a hotmail email account for this purpose (and explain the reasons why this is what has been done)!
The fact it says in black and white in a EDC Planning Board report that the area used for the Celtic FC training facility at Lennoxtown has been identified for a green belt compatible leisure development isn’t pertinent?
The Producers
The Producers was on Film4 last night – still brilliant after all these years – surely the best ever comedy about business strategy – until of course The Rangers is released.
Can anyone tell me how you do that bold font stuff in a post ?
Angus1983 says:
January 24, 2014 at 9:26 am
ecobhoy says:
January 23, 2014 at 11:49 pm
So I’ll continue if that’s all right with you.
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Fill yer boots, young Eco. I would only suggest that your contributions may be more effective and readable were you to make them a little more concise.
Aside from regulars here, they are much more likely to be read by potentially interested third parties if they’re short and to the point. Journalists, for example, short on time and attention span, will skim for information. Long posts on internet forums are generally skipped, with shorter replies being relied on to pick up any relevant points. Just saying, like.
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We are all entitled to our opinions just as we are all entitled to our writing style. I don’t agree with your observations and don’t write for dummies and have no intention of dumbing-down my contributions here as I have too much respect for posters and lurkers on TSFM.
I am also not responsible for the abysmal quality of today’s journos and you must bear in mind that the issues I mainly post on will never see the light of day in SMSM. I have no desire to be a jouno whose career comprises of cutting and pasting wire and PR copy into disintegrating newspapers,
And if you want to read bullet point tabloid style reportage please ignore my posts because they will not be to your taste. I will not take any offence.
L’esprit D’escalier
I’ve been contemplating my assertion about the inevitability of Admin for RFCL – and think there may be an alternative . What if Mr Wallace simply sold RFCL to Mr King, for one of Her Majesty’s fine pound coins. This would be on the understanding that RFCL debts to RIFC are swapped for RFCL properties and a long terms, low-start rental agreement – subject to RFCL continuing to pay said rent i.e. stay in business. All can claim success and Rangersness and an uninterrupted journey back to . . . .
This would avoid the cost and uncertainties of Admin and another old club/new club contortion. The primary reason for Admin is to shed expensive staff and contracts – but if you plan to spend, spend, spend – what’s the point ?
Can we expect an announcement soon ?
Mr King: ‘We have to get through the Championship at the first time of asking next year. We have to be in a position to go up to the Premiership and we have to be in the position to launch a challenge to Celtic.”
——
The subtext, as I read it, is not that he feels this is an unassailable right of the Mighty Gers – but that if these things are not achieved then the Bears will desert in droves, taking their cash with them.
History shows that when the current version Rangers is not winning, then the Bears swiftly remember how to do walking away. This cannot be allowed to happen, and therein lies the crux of the problem. Cutbacks mean weakening, weakening means the possibility of a couple of defeats in a lower league. The Bears just won’t stand for it. Therefore TRFC continue on their current financially suicidal path – they have no option but to hope that someone will once again inject cash. Repeat ad infinitum.
How long of the transfer window still to go? How many TRFC players shown the door?
Perhaps STV would care to resurrect the “Rangers – Live Player Cuts!” real-time updating text thing on their website that they had when RFC Admin happened. It turned out to be kind of pointless then, too.
m.c.f.c. says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:39 pm
0 0 Rate This
L’esprit D’escalier
I’ve been contemplating my assertion about the inevitability of Admin for RFCL – and think there may be an alternative . What if Mr Wallace simply sold RFCL to Mr King, for one of Her Majesty’s fine pound coins. This would be on the understanding that RFCL debts to RIFC are swapped for RFCL properties and a long terms, low-start rental agreement – subject to RFCL continuing to pay said rent i.e. stay in business. All can claim success and Rangersness and an uninterrupted journey back to . . . .
This would avoid the cost and uncertainties of Admin and another old club/new club contortion. The primary reason for Admin is to shed expensive staff and contracts – but if you plan to spend, spend, spend – what’s the point ?
Can we expect an announcement soon ?
===============================
sounds a good plan……unless you are D King.
He wants the lot, lock stock and barrel and he wants it for £1. How and when he gets it, and even if he’ll be allowed to run it (given his role in CW’s rangers) remains to be seen
Basically, we have 2 groups looking to make a killing financially, the spivs want the properties and a lease, King wants the lot for free
I don’t see them agreeing it amicably, so admin will follow
Galling fiver says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:30 pm
Can anyone tell me how you do that bold font stuff in a post ?
2,204,678………………The number of Rangers shares sold today………..FYI
Galling fiver says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:30 pm
http://www.w3schools.com/html/html_formatting.asp
Click on the “try it” link and have a play around. These are some basic HTML tags that allow you to format your text. Trying to type them here to explain won’t work as they’ll be read as an attempt to format!
Another 2 share sales in the past half hour.
1 lot of 300k and 1 lot of 700k, both at 27p
Total sold so far today 2,204,678.
@MCFC I mentioned the rangers film on a recent post, was it you who was asking for names for Mr Whyte’s new film..
Regards your last post also and in the spirit of the great Mel Brooks may I suggest a film name for the rangers saga: ‘The Reproducers’…. 😀
Eco – I’m not talking about “writing for dummies”, or tabloid-style reportage, or bullet-points. The point is to get information across to a wider audience in a more accessible manner.
It’s entirely possible to condense a piece into its salient points without dumbing-down.
I sometimes post in response to other peoples comments, without quoting etc, as I’m new to this lark. Posting links and stuff as well, I’ll have a wee look.
Ta much.
Eco, Angus – give it a rest guys, or take it elsewhere….pretty please
😉
JimBhoy says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:55 pm
‘The Reproducers’…. 😀
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JimBhoy – may be confused with “The Fockers” franchise which is already taken 🙂
blu says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:20 pm
The fact it says in black and white in a EDC Planning Board report that the area used for the Celtic FC training facility at Lennoxtown has been identified for a green belt compatible leisure development isn’t pertinent?
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What I was referring to was the later proposal for the additional facilities as not being pertinent to the core discussion which is that without a shadow of doubt Celtic’s training complex sits on land zoned as greenbelt.
From the beginning of January I have pointed out that Celtic’s training ground is designated in planning terms as a suitable use for greenbelt designated land and probably done so at least a dozen times before your post this morning stating the same fact.
I am therefore at a loss to understand the point you are making.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:47 pm
Basically, we have 2 groups looking to make a killing financially, the spivs want the properties and a lease, King wants the lot for free
I don’t see them agreeing it amicably, so admin will follow
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I think you are probably right – poetic justice if the last option for survival fails because of arrogance and intransigence.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Another 2 share sales in the past half hour.
1 lot of 300k and 1 lot of 700k, both at 27p
Total sold so far today 2,204,678.
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Well we should probably get an AIM notification on that next week.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:47 pm
m.c.f.c. says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:39 pm
0 0 Rate This
L’esprit D’escalier
I’ve been contemplating my assertion about the inevitability of Admin for RFCL – and think there may be an alternative . What if Mr Wallace simply sold RFCL to Mr King, for one of Her Majesty’s fine pound coins. This would be on the understanding that RFCL debts to RIFC are swapped for RFCL properties and a long terms, low-start rental agreement – subject to RFCL continuing to pay said rent i.e. stay in business. All can claim success and Rangersness and an uninterrupted journey back to . . . .
This would avoid the cost and uncertainties of Admin and another old club/new club contortion. The primary reason for Admin is to shed expensive staff and contracts – but if you plan to spend, spend, spend – what’s the point ?
Can we expect an announcement soon ?
===============================
sounds a good plan……unless you are D King.
He wants the lot, lock stock and barrel and he wants it for £1. How and when he gets it, and even if he’ll be allowed to run it (given his role in CW’s rangers) remains to be seen
Basically, we have 2 groups looking to make a killing financially, the spivs want the properties and a lease, King wants the lot for free
I don’t see them agreeing it amicably, so admin will follow
===========================
I agree, but conditionally as always (ask Mrs Smugas). Admin is not required to transfer the properties, reduce/cancel the debt nor my learned friends on here tell me, is it effective to break expensive player contracts. Assuming an agreement can be reached – get yer TRFCL sans assets here furra £ – then admin is not required as you say.
Interestingly though it remains a stick to beat whichever head needs beating. It carries a 25 point penalty (that would appear to be ineffective) but it also carries a risk, but no more than a risk at present (nod to brother Doncaster on that front) that it would stall promotion. It would therefore have no impact on the club per se other than as a weapon in the hands of the vultures in which it finds itself. Thanks for your properties, here’s my rent agreement, been a pleasure doing you, again, and again…
Apparently TE’s departure might well be linked to the voluntary redundo scheme at The Scotsman.
If you go before the end of this month you get three weeks dosh for each year of service. Don’t take it and you will probably go in March with one week’s dosh for each year. I don’t know if this is in addition to government minimum payments or not.
Whatever, sounds really desperate times for the paper.
Over 2.2m shares sold today but no sign of panic setting in.
This suggests to me,maybe wrongly,that there was a willing buyer.i’d suggest Laxey or Damille.
My fag packet says that if the club was cut adrift,then an asset sale of between 25-30m would give a return of between 38-46p per share.
Not bad if you’ve already got a buyer lined up?.
You need to type:
<b>This is bold text</b>
<i>This is italic text</i>
They will appear as:
This is bold text
This is italic text
The Rangers support, this forum, newspapers and pretty much everyone else appear to think that the last hope for Rangers is Dave King. He is the only person left who can actually do anything to try and save them.
A convicted fraudster and proven liar who lives and does his business abroad (presumably for tax reason).
That kind of says it all about where they are just now.
Yet there appears to be no diminution of the arrogance or the “we are the people” attitude. They are still entitled to beat everyone and to rise to the top of Scottish football, trampling everything in their path.
I doubt many people outside of the Rangers’ support themselves have much sympathy left for them.
Yellowood says:
January 24, 2014 at 1:03 pm
Eco, Angus – give it a rest guys, or take it elsewhere….pretty please
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I think you might have failed to recognise the importance of the issue and actually I would hope that most posters on here would agree that it is really up to individual posters as to how they structure and write their posts. If this is unacceptable to others then they obviously have the right to ignore any post.
I happen to believe that the right to express an opinion is in many ways an empty right unless there is also the right to express that opinion in the manner believed to be most suitable by the writer.
It also worries me that some lurkers, with good opinions to impart, might be dissuaded from posting in case their writing skill isn’t up to some arbitrary required standard – whatever that means.
pretty pretty please – just one more time explain that quoting people in boxes thing as well.
Promise I’ll do my homework sir please sir.
torrejohnbhoy(@johnbhoy1958) says:
January 24, 2014 at 12:55 pm
Another 2 share sales in the past half hour.
1 lot of 300k and 1 lot of 700k, both at 27p
Total sold so far today 2,204,678.
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Can anyone suggest a reason, cynical or otherwise, why there should be lots of share activity on Fridays?
Wasn’t Friday the 10th a particularly busy day too?
Only Guessing, But
The steady share price during the trade of 2.2 millions shares (over 3.3% of RIFC) suggests a per-arranged buy/sell. My guess would be that the institutions have bitten the bullet and taken their loss, and that Laxey and other property asset strippers are taking a bigger position before a deal that will boost the share price of RIFC by selling off the cash-inferno that is RFCL.
Just on the Dave King thing. I think we’re actually being unfair to him. Yes he is a proven liar, yes he is a convicted tax evader, but fundamentally he is a decent businessman (he just has a problem with sharing and disclosing the profits). To be honest I think that it is his acumen that is the single biggest factor holding him back. He can recognise a money pit better than any of us!
i just ‘liked’ ecobhoy’s post (1.17pm) and just wanted to say that i don’t ‘like’ the demise of the scotsman… the advertising base has faded away (cars, jobs, property and more), the readership has collapsed (gone to the internet, or just gone) and people have been looking at the circulation figures for years now and shaking their heads… it would be nice if it struggled on to 2017 (200th birthday) but it doesn’t look good…
I am in agreement re posting style.
I have the right to read thoroughly what I want, scan read what I want and totally ignore what I want.
The author of a post equally has the right to compose it however they want . If the moderators decide for whatever reason that a post is inappropriate then they can simply delete it.
Freedom of expression, within the boundaries of legality and decency, is not much to ask.
Smugas on January 24, 2014 at 1:28 pm
0 0 Rate This
pretty pretty please – just one more time explain that quoting people in boxes thing as well.
Promise I’ll do my homework sir please sir.
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😆 😆 😆
Campbellsmoney says:
January 24, 2014 at 10:50 am
I can’t help but wonder whether the poor sod whose job it is to burn the cash each day ever feels the temptation to instead put some of it in his pocket.
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Hot Money (2001) – A team of cleaners plot to steal thousands of pounds from the Bank of England by taking it from the incinerators and hiding it in their underwear.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0305648/
Or a group are getting a high enough percentage together to push resolution 10 (from memory) through.
I don’t think they were ridiculously far away and something like 3.5% has changed hands today with several other deals since the AGM.
10. To renew the Directors’ authority for the disapplication of pre-emption rights
For
35,526,886 67.9%
Against
16,792,955 32.1%
The Directors note that Resolution 10 was supported by 67.9% of the votes cast but as it is a special resolution it required a majority of 75% of the votes cast.
In line with the Chief Executive’s statement of earlier today the board may seek the relevant authority again once it has completed a robust business planning process as appropriate.
Galling fiver says:
January 24, 2014 at 1:36 pm
Instead of ‘b’ or ‘i’ in the angle brackets, use ‘blockquote’ instead.
One thing Dave King has got right is this from today’s interview:
“They had one share issue last year where they managed to line up some institutions to invest. That’s not going to happen again because these institutions were very badly burned.
I don’t think you will find any institutional support for Rangers going forward.”
It’s hard to understand how the institutions were conned into the IPO when any of us here could have told them they were putting money into an unsustainable business.
Some Fancy Talking
How would the bears react if the sale/lease back of Ibrox, MP etc is done by selling off RFCL for a pound rather than going through Admin. Will they buy into the “only way to save Rangers” conclusion of Wallace’s 120 day business review or will they think they’ve been taken for mugs – on a world record scale. The spivs won’t care, but the new owners of RFCL may have some fancy talking to do to sell shares and STs if the bears feel aggrieved.
On Pre-emption rights, and more importantly their disapplication.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pre-emption_right
Company Shares
In practice, the most common form of pre-emption right is the right of existing shareholders to acquire new shares issued by a company in a rights issue, a usually but not always public offering. In this context, the pre-emptive right is also called subscription right or subscription privilege. This is the right, but not the obligation, of existing shareholders to buy the new shares before they are offered to the public. In this way, existing shareholders can maintain their proportional ownership of the company, preventing stock dilution. In many jurisdictions, subscription rights are automatically provided for by statute, for example the UK, but in other jurisdictions it only arises if provided for under the constitutional documents of the relevant company, for example the US.
Other situations in which pre-emption rights are seen to arise are in property developments; parties close to the investors are often given a right of pre-emption in relation to new flats or condominiums within a development.
Overall, pre-emption right is similar to the concept of a call option.
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If a PLC just wanted to bring in money then there would be no reason to get rid of that. Indeed it would be protecting the rights of it’s own shareholders to either buy shares or not.