SFM – The Next Steps

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SFM – The Next Steps

As we all know, this site emerged from the ashes of RTC. The wish of the original administrator of the site, one which I wholeheartedly share, was to keep together the wonderful community RTC had built, in terms of both personnel and spirit. There are still many individuals around who were also part of RTC, and regrettably many who are no longer with us. The RTC spirit however, that of a cross-party football site where issues can be discussed in a respectful and insightful manner remains. The “wisdom of the crowd” phenomenon is also with us to perhaps an even greater extent than before, and consequently SFM’s credentials as a formidable alternative to the print media have grown.

In recent times, many contributors have expressed frustration that we are pretty much a talking shop and little else; characterised as “a lot of gum bashing and no teeth”. I think that is fair comment up to a point, but then again our aim – up to now – has been to simply present an alternative view – a view that has increasingly become the fan view as opposed to the industry view (the industry being made up of club officials, players, and press).

In fact the way I see it personally, SFM has evolved to a point where it has become the watchdog (monitor if you will) of an industry which is subject to very little oversight. The Rangers situation will eventually be done with (no laughing at the back please), and like everything else will be consigned to history (albeit more than one). The same self-interest and lack of regard for sporting integrity though will still remain, and the need for oversight will remain also.

Having arrived at those conclusions,  we have two alternatives; the first is to remain as we are (which is not a bad place to be), and the second is that SFM has to expand its role.

In recent weeks, the mods have met to discuss this, and we think that we ought to give the latter option a try. As to how we want to achieve that, and we have come up with a skeleton plan as follows;

1. We need to move into the area of gathering news content as well as commenting on what appears elsewhere;

2. We should act as a cross-club portal to get good fan site content from all clubs to a wider audience;

3. We need to highlight the positives in the game as well as the negatives;

4. We should become an actively campaigning body, aligning with fan groups to lobby for the changes we think important.

 In order to achieve these objectives, more time will need to be spent on communication like podcasts, adding news content, expanding membership and building links with other fan groups. Time will also need to be spent  setting up features, attending press conferences etc. Later in the year, one of the mods will have much more time on his hands to help achieve this.

Podcasts, premium content, labour, organisation and all of the above costs money, and ultimately a subscription based model backed by sponsorship seems to be our best way of achieving that. In order to give us a head start, we will in the next few months be putting together a business-plan and a pitch for Crowd Funding investment.

This is not to say that our existing model has been a failure. We have successfully managed to keep ourselves afloat through the ad-hoc generosity of people in our community, although the inability to keep the podcasts going has been a bit frustrating. Finding income streams which are more solid will allow us to respond to events more quickly (for example mounting an ad campaign to respond to some event or other, or buying new equipment), and hopefully achieve all of our objectives – and build a bigger audience base for our message.

Of course a move of this nature will require that, in the interests of transparency, anonymity of SFM will have to be set aside. That will not affect any of our contributors, and our practice of using (sometimes) imaginative names on the blog will remain. However, for crowd funding to be successful, we will require to have a board in place, and there is no hiding place from Companies House. The make up of the board is also crucial, and in addition to consideration of blog members for that role, we will be looking to have respected people from without.

I imagine there may be a consequent subtle effect on moderation policy to take into account.

The reason I have made this post is to keep the community up to speed with events. Although we have decided to move forward to see if we can get support for our business plan, that plan is by no means finished. As I said earlier, the “wisdom of crowds” has made our community unique and given it its credibility. There’s a lot more wisdom out there we hope to tap into before we go ahead with our initiative.

We already had someone in mind for chairman of the new board, but events have conspired tragically to rob us of that – and had the effect of postponing this announcement. However we would like to hear suggestions for suitable outside candidates for board and committee places.

We also want to hear from you if you have a suggestion to be added to our wish list of SFM function above – or even if you think it is a mistake to embark on this course.

This is a very big move for SFM, so we don’t want to rush into anything. We need to listen to what you folks have to say, because if the merging SFM is not considered a better SFM by our community there is very little point in looking to fund it.

About the author

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Trisidium administrator

Trisidium is a Dunblane businessman with a keen interest in Scottish Football. He is a Celtic fan, although the demands of modern-day parenting have seen him less at games and more as a taxi service for his kids.

3,023 Comments so far

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alexander276Posted on12:34 pm - May 17, 2015


Say Scottish football got an extra couple of million from BBC, I think issue is how would it be used? I think the worst thing would be to spread it round clubs to finance an arms race on player salaries. I think one of best things about Scottish football in recent years is the earlier introduction of young players … I fear we would choke this off by buying in players from overseas who ‘sound’ like quality because they have ‘exotic’ names but are really no better than what is produced in house.

We really need some way to reward fans who turn up at televised games. I can watch my team on TV or fork out for petrol, food and tickets for some away matches… Who is surprised at the rise of the armchair fan?

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on12:40 pm - May 17, 2015


tcup 2012 says:
Member: (184 comments)

May 17, 2015 at 12:31 pm
Cheers for that mate. My daughter watches Netflix a lot and it is time she gave me some tuition. 😀

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tcup 2012

tcup 2012Posted on12:55 pm - May 17, 2015


Don’t know if I’m reading your post correctly Corrupt

But to be clear
You can get a Netflix add-on on KODI

Not kodi on Netflix

Just type TVMC into your search bar for a basic package to have a look at

I have linked a few guide’s to a better viewing experience on previous posts

Good luck and enjoy

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timomousePosted on12:55 pm - May 17, 2015


http://www.thefootballlife.co.uk/post/119129584061/intraterrestrial-lifeform-the-spfl-and-the-bbc

On the BBC and the potential (or lack of) for movement elsewhere

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TheClumpanyPosted on1:21 pm - May 17, 2015


Good Afternoon

It’s not often I agree with Gordon Waddell but I thought his pop at Ralph Topping and the SPFL following the comments about the BBC deal were rather good

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/gordon-waddell-spfl-chairman-ralph-5711105

Indeed, many of his points – including his final paragraph –
“And the only way to fix that, Ralphy boy, is to improve the thing you’re chairman of not just hold out a begging bowl”.

….are very similar to those I made on Friday afternoon.

https://theclumpany.wordpress.com/2015/05/15/dream-topping/

I am not sure how I feel about agreeing with the Record! Still, I am sure it won’t last!

Enjoy the rest of the day.

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Corrupt official

Corrupt officialPosted on1:24 pm - May 17, 2015


tcup 2012 says:
Member: (185 comments)

May 17, 2015 at 12:55 pm

Don’t know if I’m reading your post correctly Corrupt
—————————————————
Naw you have it bang on. I have no idea how she watches Netflix, but she knows her way around a keyboard. With the links posted previously, she will be able to hook me up and show me what buttons to press 😆 She is neck deep in exams at the mo, so probably in the close season.
Thanks again bud.

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AuldheidPosted on1:28 pm - May 17, 2015


The problem with the IPTV or to air tv is that the disparity between what a person views to pay to watch a game by attending or sitting comfortably at home to watch, is far too wide.

Those, like myself, who watch mainly from home or abroad pay nothing like the cost to view per game as match goers do.

I subscribe to the Celtic OST which is my way of making a more equal contribution to supporting Celtic.

For £250 per season I get to watch all Celtic games if I’m overseas, which equates to around £6 a game. The individual cost to Celtic TV subscribers not using the OST is less, at around £4.50.

For the difference I can attend 5 home games if in UK and best of all, Celtic allocate my unused seat to local projects to allow those who cannot afford to attend to go in my place.

Contrast that with an ST holder who is at the vagaries of TV scheduling and pays around £25 a game for 20 games.

The thing is if these match day folk did not pay those sums to turn up, folk like me would have no team to follow.

Football is not only interdependent as an industry, it is interdependent in supporter terms within each club. This is an issue that needs highlighting to reach a more equal financial solution, for without one the game will continue to suffer.

My solution would be a levelling of price to watch, along with the option of how to watch.

In simplest terms I’d pay say £400 for an ST and that let’s me attend or sit at home to watch as suits my convenience.

The days of too many attending are gone, but even on the odd occasion when there might be a full house, supporters simply log in and “book” their seat so many days before a game.

The reason why clubs want ST money up front is to minimise loss through dropping attendances should the team not be performing well, but I think the bond between club and dedicated followers is now stronger than it was and that for most supporting is less dependent on winning as long as the football is of a decent standard.

Football for too long has been confined by old thinking and attitudes. It’s high time it started to think outside the box.

I think the Celtic Overseas Season Ticket could be the shape of things to come, (I would say that given I suggested it), but first of all every club supporter needs to accept that the cost of watching to support their club should be more evenly spread amongst match day and non match day watchers.

That as far as I can see is a debate that has not even begun.

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upthehoopsPosted on1:48 pm - May 17, 2015


Auldheid says:
Blog Writer: (425 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 1:28 pm
====================================

I have had a season ticket at Celtic Park since the stadium was redeveloped. It was a necessity at the start as it was the only way to guarantee entrance in the days of sell out crowds. I have a recurring direct debit for it and I am fortunate in that I can afford it. Having said that I have at times had to miss games due to work obligations and fixture rescheduling. I do like to support the club though so I don’t mind if I have to pay for an empty seat every now and then. There are a large number of people who term themselves football ‘supporters’ who either watch games on illegal internet streams, or in the pub. What they don’t do is put a single penny into the game. Would they be tempted to go to games if it was the only way to see it? I think it’s time we gave it a try.

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tcup 2012

tcup 2012Posted on1:51 pm - May 17, 2015


No problem Corrupt

If I can be of any help just let me know
😀 😀

Here’s a link to help

http://www.tvaddons.ag/install-kodi/

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on1:53 pm - May 17, 2015


TheClumpany says:
Member: (20 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 1:21 pm

I’m not sure, even though there was no club mentioned in Waddell’s piece, that there wasn’t, at the back of his mind, the words, ‘if only you’d ensured Rangers (TRFC – it’s Waddell’s thoughts after all) were in the top tier, we wouldn’t have this problem!’ Bet he was dying to include something like that!

I have no dispute with what Waddell says about Topping and the SPFL, but I do wonder if he’d have been quite so forthright, though, in his condemnation of the man if ‘Ralphy boy’ was known to favour Waddell’s own club in deliberations at Hampden!

I may have missed it, but did he, Waddell, ever produce such a damning piece on Ogilvie, either over his part in Rangers’ EBTs and DOS scheme, and general lack of leadership that has undoubtedly helped to frighten away sponsors and given encouragement to TV companies to undervalue our game?

I do like his comments on the sudden appearance of Topping’s mug within our media, though. Is something big about to happen that these people from the SPFL have, at last, come up from their bunker?

There, Clumps, hope that makes you feel better about your temporary lapse with regards to Waddell and the DR 🙂

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AuldheidPosted on2:14 pm - May 17, 2015


Upthehoops

I like your thinking 🙂

Once those who cannot afford to pay to watch are catered for according to the ethos Celtic were founded on, the rest have to pay their way.

Having said that, Celtic (and other clubs) must create ways that supporters can contribute according to their circumstances.

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AuldheidPosted on2:26 pm - May 17, 2015


From memory Topping was not happy with the LNS Decision.

I think he thought the punishment did not fit the crime, but had to accept on legal advice he/the SPL could not argue the crime was greater than an extended clerical error.

However he and all SPFL Board members have since the Decision been sent evidence of illegal ebts that render the LNS Decision void and not one of them has said they would look into whether or not LNS and the SPL were duped.

It is now beginning to look like the same evidence was not supplied to the SFA in June 2011 as it would have raised questions on the licence granted in March 2011.

Now to fail to provide what is required once might be an oversight but to do so with the same information twice within 9 months? Why it could almost be deliberate.

Another wee letter to Harper MacLeod might turn the screw,for the worms are still wriggling in the can.

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TheClumpanyPosted on2:59 pm - May 17, 2015


Good Afternoon

I was catching up on a few things earlier today and I stumbled across the musings of Derek Johnstone in The Evening Times. Vacuous soothing sound bites and a classic example of how the MSM fail to properly serve anyone genuinely interested in the Sevco saga. Be it Sevco fans, or the rest of us concerned about the state of our games.

Here are a few thoughts on it

https://theclumpany.wordpress.com/2015/05/17/oil-of-dj/

Enjoy the rest of the day!

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tcup 2012

tcup 2012Posted on3:24 pm - May 17, 2015


upthehoops says:
Member: (693 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 1:48 pm
//////////////////.//

I personally had to give my season ticket up due to missing most of the games through rescheduleing
And more so financial restraint 🙁

Even before that I scrapped my sky subscription

I still try and do goto as many games as I can even though I have the means to watch the very same game in my home

So there being no football on the TV would not entice me to go just to see a game

I have at the moment the means to watch any game which is live on TV in the UK and many more which are not

The main problem I have at the moment is
Why are the playoff’s exclusively live on BT sports?

Why did the BBC/STV not push the boat out to secure the rights
As this is classed as a separate competition and did not come into the current TV deal

Most of the population will not get to experience the excitement off the competition

BBC Alaba managed to secure the championship play off (on live tonight at 5:30)

So why not the prem playoff?

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TheClumpanyPosted on4:33 pm - May 17, 2015


So 2-2 on aggregate at half-time in the second leg of the Premiership playoff quarter-final.
This is sport. This is exciting.
And Messers Regan and Doncaster would have deprived us of it in 2012 by gerrymandering Sevco into a higher league….

Shame. On. Them.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on4:54 pm - May 17, 2015


Here we go 61mins out comes the songbook. Cannae help it. Thhey will never learn.

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upthehoopsPosted on5:09 pm - May 17, 2015


Auldheid says:
Blog Writer: (427 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 2:14 pm
Upthehoops

I like your thinking 🙂

Once those who cannot afford to pay to watch are catered for according to the ethos Celtic were founded on, the rest have to pay their way.

Having said that, Celtic (and other clubs) must create ways that supporters can contribute according to their circumstances.
=======================

Indeed Auldheid, though I personally know plenty who could afford to go but don’t. That’s their right of course, but it doesn’t have irk me when they start ranting about the club not spending enough money.

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Danish PastryPosted on5:10 pm - May 17, 2015


@Auldheid an interesting post. Never knew about an overseas ST. Tbh, I’m against ‘nicking’ TV streams and internet piracy, not least because I live on producing a subscription-based internet service myself. If people pirated my content I’d probably stop producing it. Personally, I try to pay for the content I use.

The thing is if these match day folk did not pay those sums to turn up, folk like me would have no team

On the above, I believe you would certainly have a team, but not one where one player’s wages would, say, pay the entire team budget of another SPFL team. That said, I wish there was an SPFL app or subscription service. I’d rather put the money I use on online content via VPN & IPTV to watch Scottish football directly on Scottish football, rather than indirectly support so many European leagues that I do not watch, not least the EPL — which is increasingly super rich Russian Oligarchs v Middle East Sheiks. Yawn.

As I write this I have a packed Ibrox in the background, via bein sports, showing that £5 match ticket attracts more bums on seats than usual, and modestly funded Doonhammers more than a match for their big-time-Charlie opponents.

Eddie Goldtop’s idea of importing players from specific countries to help export any Scottish online content is an idea but runs the risk of creating a contrived league. In the end, Scottish football is what it is. It’s unique.

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tcup 2012

tcup 2012Posted on5:15 pm - May 17, 2015


TheClumpany says:
Member: (22 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 4:33 pm
So 2-2 on aggregate at half-time in the second leg of the Premiership playoff quarter-final.
This is sport. This is exciting.
And Messers Regan and Doncaster would have deprived us of it in 2012 by gerrymandering Sevco into a higher league….

Shame. On. Them.
//////////////////

And BBC/STV have deprived most of the population of the joy your are experienceing

Shame on them

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nawlitePosted on6:08 pm - May 17, 2015


So it’s only in Scotland that clubs can’t be held responsible for the actions of their fans then?!?

Credit to the South American authorities for quick and decisive action against a ‘big team’.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/32771137

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on7:00 pm - May 17, 2015


Stramash at Alloa v Forfar and Alloa go 2 up. Very entertaining.

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coineanachantaighePosted on7:02 pm - May 17, 2015


alexander276 says:
Member: (16 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 12:34 pm
====================================

I agree. And I said a while back that if we get any extra money into Scottish football one thing they might do is use it to reduce prices for games. And other things like improve facilities and match-day experience. In other words use it to encourage more folk through the turnstiles.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on7:06 pm - May 17, 2015


Holmes red card Forfar Mental tackle.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on7:16 pm - May 17, 2015


Goal Alloa from a corner 4-3 to tem on aggregate now.
SFM live ish reporting

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parttimearabPosted on7:17 pm - May 17, 2015


Auldheid says:
Blog Writer: (427 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 1:28 pm
My solution would be a levelling of price to watch, along with the option of how to watch.

Football for too long has been confined by old thinking and attitudes. It’s high time it started to think outside the box.
========
Excellent post Auldheid.

You’ve mentioned this before but I’ve not thought deeply or fully engaged with your thinking on this in the past.

As a supporter who (as you might guess) attends games infrequently broadening the ways in which you can support your club and access the ‘product’ in the flesh, online or through tv via a single payment seems to me to be a novel and imaginative idea.

Just to add to it the thought occurred that if the SPFL had their own channel the possibility to attend any Scottish game in the flesh could be built in.

The possibilities are endless but I fear limited by a lack of imagination on the part of those in charge of the game.

This might be the type of initiative that could be championed by a revamped SFM in the long term.

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on7:27 pm - May 17, 2015


Scottish Championship 2014-15

Alloa Athletic champions !

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TrisidiumPosted on7:51 pm - May 17, 2015


Running another demo – this time David Low on the Podcast.
sfm.scot/sfmradio

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ianagain

ianagainPosted on8:19 pm - May 17, 2015


Trisidium says:
Moderator: (196 comments)

May 17, 2015 at 7:51 pm

Running another demo – this time David Low on the Podcast.
sfm.scot/sfmradio

==================
Tried it thought it was working fine made a comment and chucked me out.

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TrisidiumPosted on8:38 pm - May 17, 2015


Turnbull on now 🙂

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TrisidiumPosted on8:39 pm - May 17, 2015


Don’t make a comment whilst listening. It resets the feed 🙂
One of the things we need to get fixed.

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jimlarkinPosted on8:50 pm - May 17, 2015


@Theclumpany

further to your SFM post and the WordPress article about the pash that DJ and the rest of the SMSM spout when it comes to all things Sevco

http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/opinion/are-new-ibrox-board-biding-their-time-with-cash-as-sure-as-bears-do-their-business-in-.126298520?

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Barcabhoy

BarcabhoyPosted on9:12 pm - May 17, 2015


Radical change represents much bigger risks. I think the clubs recognise change is required , however I doubt it will be particularly radical.

Risk takers are rewarded spectacularly when it works out . When it doesn’t work out the fallout can often be extreme. There are numerous recent examples of this in the SPFL

I suspect any changes will be minor and the pace of change will be glacial. I hope , but not with any confidence , that this will not prevent SKY and BT being thrown under the bus , at least until they are prepared to pay appropriately

Thanks to all who provided info on KODI

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TheClumpanyPosted on10:18 pm - May 17, 2015


Good Evening

I fear I have come down with the Bampot equivalent of verbal diarrhoea today…

Yet another post…

I’ve been quite taken by irritation with minor media things that seem to raise wider issues.

Step forward Chris Jack of the Evening Times, who still hasn’t acknowledged Celtic’s league win. Indeed his last comment on Celtic was the Scottish Cup semi final defeat being “another Treble chance blown” and “a sore one for Deila”.

His tweeting today was quite interesting… Unlike my blog on the subject… But if you want to take a look, here is a link….

https://theclumpany.wordpress.com/2015/05/17/not-jacking-it-in/

Enjoy the rest of the weekend

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Bill1903

Bill1903Posted on10:49 pm - May 17, 2015


Much to the wife’s disgust I watched 3 televised games today
Swansea v Man City then the big one Man U v Arsenal. They game I enjoyed most was the Alloa v Forfar game.
Cracking stuff although I couldn’t understand the commentary 😕

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jimlarkinPosted on11:21 pm - May 17, 2015


Bill1903Bill1903 says:
Member: (65 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 10:49 pm
Much to the wife’s disgust I watched 3 televised games today
Swansea v Man City then the big one Man U v Arsenal. They game I enjoyed most was the Alloa v Forfar game.
Cracking stuff although I couldn’t understand the commentary ?

…………………..

That’s what you get for allowing your wife to do the commentary 😆 😆 😆

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Tincks

TincksPosted on11:48 pm - May 17, 2015


Re the next steps.

Have to say that I fully support the general thrust of what is proposed. Two suggestions have been made from the floor that I also believe are excellent. Fistly the radio show, which is being taken forward.

Secondly, the notion of a Wiki type database of articles on key issues. I think this would be of tremedous value in the long term. So much has happend since RTC hit the internet that is is almost impossible for any individual to retain all the detail of the skullduggery that has gone on. I’m talking about the big issues:
* BoS and their relationship to MIH and Rangers
* The Big Tax Case
* The Little Tax Case
* EBT’s
* Mr Ogilvies good (but conflicted) night out
* The eufa licence
* The sale of the century for £1 – the MBB – off the radar etc
* Non payment of PAYE, VAT and NI
* 272 creditors stiffed
* Charlotte
* 5 way agreement
* The attempted stitch up and Tunball Hutton’s stand
* How Mr :mrgreen: came to get his big hands on the corpse
* The IPO
* The power and the glory of the compliance officer
* + some other things that might have to wait for justice to run its course before they can be discussed

I’m sure I’ve forgotten plenty.

Happy to move from an occassional dip into the pocket to a subscription and if the Wiki type project can be got off the ground I’d be willing to spare some time if a team could be pulled together.

Edit: How could I leave Lord Nimmo Smith off the list. Duh.

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upthehoopsPosted on6:54 am - May 18, 2015


TheClumpany says:
Member: (23 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 10:18 pm
==============================

Chris Jack, from what I’ve ever read of him, is incredibly biased in his writings. Having said that, at least he does not indulge in the nonsense of some of his peers by living in constant denial of who he supports. On a more serious note I wonder why his Editor thinks it’s okay to have someone as blatantly biased working at his newspaper.

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dom16

dom16Posted on7:17 am - May 18, 2015


Matt Lindsay must still be under the influence following yesterday’s match at Ibrox. He uses the full range of excuses as to why the requisitioners haven’t delivered yet “the complex situation john Gilligan, King and Murray inherited has been largely responsible for the delay”.

Just proves clumpanys point about how badly served the The Rangers fans have been by the MSM.

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dom16

dom16Posted on7:37 am - May 18, 2015


Apologies. Scotrail wifi is poor so couldn’t add the link

http://www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/sport/opinion/are-new-ibrox-board-biding-their-time-with-cash-as-sure-as-bears-do-their-business-in-.126298520

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Danish PastryPosted on8:49 am - May 18, 2015


@dom16 This bit really makes you wonder about the value of Graham Wallace’s 120 days reviewing it all when the new lot need to start ‘forensically’ examining it all over again…

The complex situation John Gilligan, King and Paul Murray inherited has been largely responsible for the delay. The new directors and their professional advisors have been forensically examining the club’s accounts and contracts in the weeks since taking charge.

A sceptical mind might see it as a delaying tactic to hide the actual level of skintness until after the play-off tournament is decided.

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jockybhoyPosted on8:55 am - May 18, 2015


@Matty Roth:
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, my weekend overtook my ability to review and respond to posts and I apologise if you feel my response misrepresented what you were trying to say.

I do feel some are asking the BBC to overpay – they have paid for a highlights packlage and there seems to have been no higher bid, but people are saying “the “English” get X so we Scots, as a percentrage of the population, should get Y”. I don’t even think there is a fair value on “viewership” – how would you define that? That’s where I drew an analogy to the Barnett formula – a formula that in the end comes up with a figure that Scotland should get from the Central fund based on payments, in (taxes/license fee), population/viewership etc. My point was that isn’t based on market forces/rates. It’s artificial and would in this case effectively be an undeserved public sector-subsidy to football. ModgePKR effectively tried the math with his parity in the per-viewer per-year stakes formula.

It wasn’t making a political point I was making, but an economic one. And again, the EPL has others trying to buy the different packages and the price is therefore driven higher. That is my core argument. Again, an economic one.

Sorry if you missed my point re the Top Gear analogy which was an extension of the MOTD/Linkeker one in that I don’t watch it but I understand why the BBC pays for it. Both of these programs do gain revenue from the BBC by effectively reselling it abroad. My unwritten question was could the SPL highlights have its fees offset by this? I doubt it.

“The point I’ve been trying to make is to question whether some sports coverage is value for money” – I would argue that the BBC doesn’t get value for money on ANY sport where other channels have a commercial interest. Other companies bid the prices up and I don’t feel the public service broadcaster should be in that game, BUT the Government has deemed certain sporting events as “NationalTreasures” and they must be shown free to air. Now those it seems are mostly English events – so I can see a politicial issue there – but I do feel for those without sports subscription TV channels that the BBC should have some coverage of the National game. Highlights seems the best option, and the most cost effective for a public service broadcaster, but again I repeat my point, I am happy for the BBC to pay the minimum acceptable fee as it needs to preserve budget for many other things and the SFA/SPFL Scottish football should not be asking it to subsidise their own lack of progress is securing commercial deals. Incidentally to have ANY coverage on the BBC should be a selling point in terms of Named Sponsors for the league/cups… if we didn’t have BBC coverage the sponsorship packages would be even less attractive!).

I hope that has made my thinking and subsequent views on this subject clear, (I am sure you won’t agree with them!) and I apologise again if you feel my response misrepresented your views earlier, that was not my intention.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on10:21 am - May 18, 2015


TheClumpany says:
Member: (23 comments)
May 17, 2015 at 10:18 pm

Nothing I like more than a nice snappy slogan on a banner at a football match 🙄 You know the kind, witty and straight to the point. Often the message is made, perfectly, without the need for words; there was this banner with four horses I seem to remember…in fact it has become part of the folklore of Scottish football 😉

No need for anyone to ask, ‘what’s that all about?’

Then there’s this one…

‘No true Ranger has ever failed in the tradition set him’

Not snappy, no humour and definitely not true! In fact, the only way that statement could be true is if lying, cheating, rule breaking, tax dodging and many more heinous acts are part of the ‘true Rangers’ tradition’. Well maybe the banner did have a point to make in pointing the board in the traditional direction!

Oh, and can anyone explain to me how anyone can be ‘set’ a tradition? Run out of space or letters did we? That banner is so stupid that only a fool would bring it to the public’s attention in his work, other than with the intention of mocking it. I doubt Chris Jack’s intention was to mock anything that smacks of Rangersness, only leaving it the work of a ‘fool’!

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Famous song

Famous songPosted on10:33 am - May 18, 2015


Heart rate back to normal and brow wiped after that Alloa Forfar thriller. Thanks for the kind comments, especially ianagain, I thought the entertainment provided by both teams was right up there. Must have come as a surprise to the bod from The Herald, he of the two bob leagues packed with part timers, if indeed he troubled to watch it.
My focus now turns to cricket, and I was encouraged to learn that the T20 fixture on June 5th between Yorks and Lancs is now a sell out. Lancashire being out of Division One of the County Championship this year, there will be no money-spinning four dayer between these ancient enemies. No articles have appeared decrying this offence to natural order, phone ins aren’t being held to glorify past matches and drool at the prospect of further ones, and Look North don’t have a reporter outside Headingley asking passers by if they “miss” the Old Trafford giants. Any journalist suggesting that the league be reconstituted with Lancashire in the top division would be advised to take more lemonade with it, with a P45 awaiting a second offence. Kent and Essex aren’t subjected to constant reminders of how lucky they are, getting lucrative “red rose pounds” from visitors to Canterbury and Chelmsford.
Oh, and despite it being known as The War of The Roses, after a pretty messy historical conflict, the songs traditionally sung could be described as tasteful if occasionally tuneless. Good clean fun, in fact.

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Danish PastryPosted on10:49 am - May 18, 2015


jockybhoy says:
Member: (76 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 8:55 am
————

If an era of devolved broadcasting is approaching it will interesting to see how the financial priorties line up.

Following your point about the BBC offering value to sponsors and advertisers there could there be a certain logic in dropping Sky & BT? Since although it would be an inferior £ package from the BBC it would give maximum free-to-air exposure allowing current sponsors a better deal, and fans annaw, since there would be none of the quirky BT & Sky induced KO times.

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causaludendiPosted on10:59 am - May 18, 2015


Allyjambo says:
Member: (928 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 10:21 am
___________________________________

AJ, the world is full of allegory, allusion & symbolism that makes no sense to the uninitiated.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on11:12 am - May 18, 2015


Famous song says:
Member: (40 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 10:33 am

Wasn’t able to watch the game, was at work 😥 but gather is was a cracker. I have to admit that I have been very impressed by the standard of the lower leagues having now been able to see some of their games on TV. So there has been something worthwhile about the shoehorning of TRFC into the lower leagues, after all. I just hope the lower leagues will be able to survive once TRFC find their ‘rightful place’, wherever that might be!!!

Congratulations to all the clubs, and their supporters, that finished below 3rd place in the Championship. You all do Scottish football proud.

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Danish PastryPosted on11:55 am - May 18, 2015


Allyjambo says:
Member: (929 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 11:12 am

…I just hope the lower leagues will be able to survive once TRFC find their ‘rightful place’ …
———–

Don’t you start AJ :mrgreen:

Totally agree that the huge benefit of the TRFC shoehorn has been to highlight the ‘forgotten’ leagues. Coverage on a more permanent basis will hopefully emerge, and not least something in future from the non-televised play-off deciders involving Div 1 & 2, which turned out to be great theatre.

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yourhavingalaugh

yourhavingalaughPosted on12:13 pm - May 18, 2015


And there you have it,play off’s that are totally ignored as irrevalant to the armchair fan ,decided by faceless programmers that turn out as edge of the chair tv,just what is the background of these people,unfortunately I also did not get to see any of the games due to no signal in this remote part of the country,interesting comment though about the songbook coming out round about the 60th minute, is this what is being rubber stamped for every game now on live tv in the play off’s and to follow into next season if promotion is gained,what a sad country Scotland will become when this is beamed world wide,you will reap what you sow,SFA & SPL.

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jockybhoyPosted on12:21 pm - May 18, 2015


@Danish Pastry: As an ex-pat in London I would be disappointed if my Bhoys and indeed other Scottish teams weren’t shown live, but I am coming up this weekend for the last game of the season and I was, along with my buddy, a season-ticket holder at Celtic Park until til a couple of years back. (Reasons for dropping it weren’t Rangers related) and our plans have been scuppered a number of times by lat changes to kick-offs or indeed impractical kick off times when factoring in planes, trains and automobiles…

I think I alluded to the kick-offs in my post – personally I wouldn’t be that averse to local (ie Scottish) TV blackouts ensuring people went to games. I see what you are getting at, but I don’t think that’s practical.

Any sponsor would want maximum exposure from their brand and, given the audiences on subscriptions services have already put their money where their mouth is (in terms of paying for sports related goods & services) they are certainly within any sponsor’s target group and am sure they’d want them included. And the fact that BBC are paying for highlights packages would mean, regardless of kick-off time, they would screen their programs post-matches, whether that was 5pm or 10pm.

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Broadswordcallingdannybhoy

BroadswordcallingdannybhoyPosted on12:34 pm - May 18, 2015


Allyjambo says:
May 18, 2015 at 11:12 am
===========================

Congratulations to all the clubs, and their supporters, that lived within their means in the Championship. You all do Scottish football proud.

— fixed that for you AllyJambo 🙂

Haven’t posted for a while and wish SFM luck in their new direction. I think one way SFM could be become a crucial part of Scottish Football, would be to form an immortal football club which borrows money it can’t pay back.

Just a thought.

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Danish PastryPosted on12:37 pm - May 18, 2015


yourhavingalaugh says:
Member: (234 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 12:13 pm
————-

I was listening to Open All Mics to keep up. Hadn’t realised that the delay in the Montrose v Brora match was because of the crowd that turned up — just over 2,000. Not sure what they charged but that’s a fair chunk of the local population that went to the match! Impressive.

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mcfcPosted on2:44 pm - May 18, 2015


A Perfect Storm of Opportunity?

No-one really believed the 2012 Armageddon scenario. But a perfect storm for the SFA / SPFL is a genuine possibility over the next few weeks.

• TRFC not promoted – King steps away.
• NUFC relegated – Ashley steps away.
• RIFC collapses, TRFC miss a season, Spartans promoted and others shuffle up.
• BBC blank SPFL re-negotiation.
• Sky & BT Sport unenthusiastic.
• Sponsors and advertisers trigger escape clauses

My question to you is: Would this be bad for the long term future of Scottish Football?

• Would the clubs wake up to the 21st century business environment and choose administrators to match?
• Would the sixth floor lose its blazers and brogues critical mass?
• Would the MSM / Rangers obsession surpass the Daily Express / Princess Diana obsession?
• Would a Truth and Reconciliation process position football as a positive force in Scottish society?

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John ClarkPosted on2:54 pm - May 18, 2015


There have been some pretty interesting posts on revenue-raising, and equitable sharing of revenue, and the use of Internet resources by our football clubs and authorities to get right into marketing their ‘product’.
I confess to an almost complete inability in these
fields. ( tcup and DP certainly use English
words,but they might as well have written in
Sanskrit as far I’m concerned!)
But, in so far as I understand what they say, I agree with the idea that our clubs, and their elected leaders, should be alive to all the possibilities that the Internet makes available.
But,of course, the underlying rottenness of our present football authorities has to be acknowledged and dealt with first.
The 5-way agreement that gave birth to the cuckoo has to be rescinded.The lies that were told have to be acknowledged as the lies that they were. It has to be publicly stated that TRFC are neither legally nor in sporting terms the old RFC.
When that happens, some degree of trust in the minds of sponsors, broadcasters, and paying fans like you and me, that our sport is not rigged and crooked might be restored.
All the cheating money in the world is not worth the selling of an ideal.
Those who think it is are the enemies of sport and will bring about not only their own personal destruction as men of integrity and honour, but also the very sport they are elected to protect and foster.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on2:59 pm - May 18, 2015


mcfc says:
Member: (1218 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 2:44 pm

Quick attempt to answer your questions 🙂

‘• Would the clubs wake up to the 21st century business environment and choose administrators to match?’
No.

‘• Would the sixth floor lose its blazers and brogues critical mass?’
No. Just like the bankers they’d expect bonuses!

‘• Would the MSM / Rangers obsession surpass the Daily Express / Princess Diana obsession?’
You haven’t noticed? The MSM obsession with Rangers surpassed that with Princess Diana, at least in Scotland, long before she was born.

‘• Would a Truth and Reconciliation process position football as a positive force in Scottish society?’
It might, but we’d never see it (the Truth and Reconciliation process).

It would be nice, though, if the collapse of RIFC/TRFC, or any other event, could bring about positive answers to your questions.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on3:33 pm - May 18, 2015


John Clark says:
Member: (846 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 2:54 pm

Though I agree with you on this sentence:

‘All the cheating money in the world is not worth the selling of an ideal.’

sadly, John, I cannot agree completely with you on this sentence:

‘Those who think it is are the enemies of sport and will bring about not only their own personal destruction as men of integrity and honour, but also the very sport they are elected to protect and foster.’

…for, although they may well bring about the destruction of that which they were elected to protect and foster, such people have no integrity and honour to destroy in the first place. It is also very seldom that people like Doncaster and Regan, and the others involved, suffer professionally for the destruction they cause, and certainly not to a level that is in any way even remotely commensurate. We need only look at the bankers who brought about the catastrophe of the banks because, they too, only gave consideration to themselves and their careers, rather than to that which they were entrusted with preserving.

Such is the modern business world.

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mcfcPosted on3:38 pm - May 18, 2015


Allyjambo says:
Member: (930 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 2:59 pm
===================================================
So what would happen?

Where would the sixth floor spend their energies with no TRFC to shepherd back to where they belong?

How would the clubs respond to the dire financial prospect of losing TV, sponsors, advertisers and the largesse of TRFC?

How would the MSM / Rangers obsession evolve – no players, no managers, no matches, no directors to focus on – only future investors?

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on3:46 pm - May 18, 2015


mcfc says:
Member: (1219 comments)

May 18, 2015 at 3:38 pm

Allyjambo says:
Member: (930 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 2:59 pm
===================================================
So what would happen?
_____________________________

First, we’d all smile, and tuck into the jelly and ice cream 🙂 😀 😆

But, there would be another successor to the Ibrox franchise, there can be no doubt of that, then another, and another ,if necessary. Necessary, that is, to those who want a ‘Rangers’. Each incarnation, or is that reincarnation?, would receive similar support, though each time, as the distance between the new and the very old got longer, that support would become less enthusiastic, and harder to sustain.

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bfbpuzzledPosted on4:51 pm - May 18, 2015


:slamb: meter cranked up to 11 claim that Dick Advocaat about to jet in to TRFC remind me who were the three worst strikers in history? We’re they not Torre Andre and Flo?

This is the opposite of the homeopathic placebo rather than dilute what caused the illness that would appear to suggest it be distilled to major concentration and apply it again.

I could not read further such was the ludicrousness of the suggestion I guess that it therefore bound to happen.

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jimlarkinPosted on5:15 pm - May 18, 2015


Is it now

:slamb: – v – Ponies

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-32783127

Neigh-Chance ???

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TheClumpanyPosted on8:47 pm - May 18, 2015


jimlarkin says:
Member: (277 comments)
May 18, 2015 at 5:15 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-32783127
Neigh-Chance ???
________________________________
Good Evening.

I quite enjoyed the ICT pony ‘story’ and it promoted a few (not entirely serious!) thoughts about the continuing magic of the game.

Do read if you dare!

https://theclumpany.wordpress.com/2015/05/18/horseplay/

Enjoy the rest of the evening.

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castawayPosted on12:51 am - May 19, 2015


No comments for hours. Have we been got at?

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paddy malarkey

paddy malarkeyPosted on1:23 am - May 19, 2015


Watched the fitba’ in the pub – EPL followed by(well overlapping slightly)MSL . Presentation excellent – vibrant and enticing . MSL is of appalling standard judging by the fare on show(and Kaka is still a diver)but I dare say that a lot more money is spent per game than per week in the Scottish lower leagues .Refereeing in both games was bizarre and shows that we’re not alone when it comes to lack of competence in officials . Just my observation ,but if our game could be fixed,(not just the marketing) it is surely better than what was on offer tonight .(Why so many saltires in Orlando and how bad are LA now ?)

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bad capt madmanPosted on1:27 am - May 19, 2015


Not many comments tonight so I’ll jump in. Good article in Scotzine questioning the Qatar friendly. It demeans us and it also weakens our rankings – just how much more shit can we take from the SFA? Very little comment from the MSM addressing the issues raised in the Scotzine article either.
Gordon Strachan’s good work is being hampered by this ridiculous fixture I fear.
Is it too late to just cancel the damn thing or have we already paid the deposit?
We have certainly lost quite a bit of credibility…and here was me thinking our Scottish values were on a roll worldwide.

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castawayPosted on1:47 am - May 19, 2015


Bad Capt.
Gordon Strachan knows his football. I wonder why he gets involved in the daft “Scottish football needs a mythical Big Bird ” stuff.

Maybe support for his employers is part of his contract. Could be.

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upthehoopsPosted on7:16 am - May 19, 2015


If there is one thing I’ve been able to deduce from glancing around yesterday and today’s media coverage is that Hibs don’t matter. They are almost an annoying irrelevance but they might, just might end up dream wreckers.

I will get to Motherwell, but as far as I’m concerned a resurgent Hibs would be a welcome addition to the top league. They have always paid their way, and have never ditched paying taxes in order to fund success. Their support comes with no arrogant sense of entitlement or with any bizarre desire to wreak vengeance on others due to to their own club’s failings. Why should Hibs not matter?

Then we have Motherwell who await Hibs or Rangers. They will not matter either should Rangers prevail. I would argue that to the media they don’t matter already while Rangers are still active in the play off. Yet they are a club who learned the lessons of the past and now live firmly within their means. They may not carry the support levels of Rangers or Hibs but why shouldn’t they matter as long as they win within the rules of the game?

Then of course we have Rangers, who are the only show in town in this play off scenario. Not good enough to finish above Hibs despite having millions more to to spend, and living on crisis loans every month. Their support comes with an arrogant sense of entitlement and a bizarre desire to wreak vengeance on others due to to their own club’s failings.

Judging by the media’s behaviour, next season could be a tortuous one for those of us who believe honesty and fair play are important commodities in our game. The fact they are so desperate to see a club succeed where honesty and fair play have been miles down the pecking order is incredible, but sadly it is still Scotland, even in 2015.

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Danish PastryPosted on7:34 am - May 19, 2015


castaway on May 19, 2015 at 12:51 am

No comments for hours. Have we been got at?
———–

Nah, just not a lot of news at season’s end, imo. The TRFC admin watch continues, but they’ll no doubt muddle on through any play-offs they are involved in. (Mind you, those directors and the chap from Level 5 looked affy glum in the Willie Vass photo from the weekend.) And no one posting here took the new land deal / state aid rantings seriously, which has saved us wading through a lot of utterly tedious bumf.

The dubious Qatar friendly would seem more a dancing cheek-to-cheek exercise with Arab money. Or mibee some folks among the high heid yins are looking for a gig in the Mid-East? Perhaps El Presidente will be head-hunted to spearhead some local Qatari WC organisation? (No need for an EBT since it’s probably all tax-free anyhoo).

Funnily enough, they’ve recently (past several months) beaten Australia, Algeria, Estonia and Slovenia. The more countries that will play against them and endorse the country as a WC venue, the more it becomes legit and set in stone. You’d like to think, though, that the SFA would actually raise concerns about the state of affairs with oor upcoming guests.

PS Dearie me, three paragraphs has me bordering on the verbose. Apologies, me a great believer in brevity, annaw 🙂 Just as well I didn’t add any observations about the Danish Cup Final :+o

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helpmaboab

helpmaboabPosted on7:50 am - May 19, 2015


Why are we playing a game against a country like Qatar?As far as I’m concerned it merely gives legitimacy to the dodgy World Cup dealings of FIFA,not to mention the Qatari’s disgraceful human rights record on migrant workers.

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jimlarkinPosted on8:05 am - May 19, 2015


UEFA set for a major climb down regarding FFP

(to bring UEFA in Line with the SFA FFP ‘rules’) ?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/32784375

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HighlanderPosted on8:06 am - May 19, 2015


Stewart Regan said the following in 2012. Unbelievably, he is still Chief Executive of the SFA. Discuss.

“Without Rangers, there is social unrest and a big problem for Scottish society,” claimed Regan. “They have a huge fan base and to contemplate the situation where those fans don’t have a team to support, where those fans are effectively left without a game to follow, I just think that could lead to all sorts of issues, all sorts of problems for the game.

“Tribalism in football is really important. It is part of the game. People follow their clubs with pride, it is passed down from generation to generation. There are thousands of Rangers fans whose fathers and parents and grandfathers have been Rangers fans. You can’t contemplate a situation without that and if Rangers weren’t to exist that could have real dire consequences.

“There is a lot of emotion around this subject because Rangers are a huge institution in Scottish football history and they are where they are. Their fans have been hurt, they don’t know what’s happening. There hasn’t been a great deal of leadership at the club and there hasn’t been a huge amount of communication from the football authorities.

“The SPL have now decided that Rangers won’t be coming back into the SPL. From our perspective it’s important we set out the landscape because there is only one solution for the game now.

“The only solution for the game now is that Rangers come into the Scottish Football League and they come into it in the First Division. If Rangers were to go anywhere other than the First Division, then there would something in the region of £15.7 million worth of losses to the game.

“For the bigger clubs at the top of the league, that’s half their annual distributions. For clubs at the bottom it is basically wiping out their entire distributions, for some of the smaller clubs it’s a huge proportion of their annual turnover.

“The same will be true for most clubs. Perhaps clubs could survive for a short period of time but it’s not sustainable. Even if Rangers end up in the First Division, there is still going to be a £5 million loss of income to the SPL clubs. The game is not sustainable so there would be a slow lingering death for the game in Scotland. It would then trickle down to the SFL. From our perspective as the governing body and we cannot allow that to happen.

“If we allowed that to happen, it would simply be a dereliction of duty. Therefore, this whole decision-making process has been one of the most challenging and complex decisions that I have ever been involved in in 27 years of business as sport.

“Some clubs in the SFL are afraid of the implications of the decisions. There is the moral argument, the fear of a fans’ backlash and there are financial implications to consider. But when we look at the alternative, it is not possible to think about it without thinking of the game withering on the vine. We cannot contemplate that and the message has to be that Division One for Rangers is the only show in town as far as the future of Scottish football is concerned.”

Regan admits the influence of television contracts, which are largely predicated on the presence of Celtic and Rangers in the Scottish game, are the biggest single factor in his determination to ensure the Ibrox club drop no lower than the First Division. “We have had dialogue with the broadcasters,” he added, “and we understand what the various stakeholders from Sky television, ESPN, Sport Five and a number of the SPL’s other commercial partners are likely to do in the event Rangers are not in either of the top two tiers. It’s not pretty. That’s why we cannot sit back and let that happen without trying to get all parties to accept this is the only solution which can keep the game afloat.

“Without Old Firm games, the value drops, the overseas deals are almost exclusively about the Old Firm derby and that would go immediately. Then you look at the rest of the game and what it is worth. It is fair to say the broadcasters would live with a year without Rangers in the SPL, because it could be a fantastic story for them, which is why I think First Division rights will be an interest as people will want to see how this club is going to bounce back.”

Regan conceded, however, that there can be no guarantee a financially weakened Rangers will climb back to the top flight at the first attempt. “If Rangers don’t get promoted, then the game has got another year to suffer with the financial consequences that brings,” he said. “I can’t predict what will happen, because Rangers at the moment are a weakened team because of everything that has gone on.

“They are a newco at the moment, they have got very few players on their books. They are going to be entering the SFL in whatever division with a weakened team and I don’t think it’s by any means certain they are going to come back in the way they or their fans might like them to recover.

“It’s going to be a slow recovery to get back to the football fitness they have shown in the past. So we can’t look into the future and say ‘what if they don’t operate in a certain way?’. We can only look at building the foundations, to change the game for the better and provide an infrastructure that can bring financial certainty to the other 41 clubs.”

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Danish PastryPosted on8:55 am - May 19, 2015


Ooft, that Regan piece really doesn’t improve with age 😮 First bit could be from The Daily Mash!

Saw on twitter that @Auldheid (finally) got a response from KJ. Unfortunately, KJ says (in true Arsene Wenger style) that he never saw the documents sent to the DR. Still, a breakthrough of sorts…

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bfbpuzzledPosted on9:04 am - May 19, 2015


Highlander; I would not be able to stay in a job if I had got things so completely wrong both in terms of providing such a wildly inaccurate prognosis and in terms of having been part of allowing the situation to happen in the first place. Furthermore, if I were part of an organisation where there was perceived need to rely on a member with the financial probity of a banana republic kleptocrat as the highest aspiration, I would go immediately for the sake of my own self respect.
That he cannot see that such a Upas Tree is the problem rather than the solution then he really should have been tellt. WATP indeed -we are the problem.

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on9:26 am - May 19, 2015


Highlander says:
Member: (25 comments)
May 19, 2015 at 8:06 am

All I can ask is: how can any CEO, of any organisation, be so wrong, yet remain in place, with a ludicrous salary increase?

OK more 🙄

Is any member of the MSM going to ask him about that statement, and how he thinks that a year on year loss making football club could possibly have helped redress the financial loss that RFC were, supposedly, to the game?

Or simply, would someone please just ask him: do you stand by that statement?

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parttimearabPosted on9:43 am - May 19, 2015


Danish Pastry says:
Blog Writer: (1163 comments)
May 19, 2015 at 7:34 am
castaway on May 19, 2015 at 12:51 am

No comments for hours. Have we been got at?
———–

Nah, just not a lot of news at season’s end, imo
================================================
Could be a little something to busy things up shortly…

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/mobile/rangers/sfa-set-to-reveal-outcome-of-king-fit-and-proper-investigation-207253n.126432279?

….although this particular announcement seems to be permanently immanent so you never can tell…

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Allyjambo

AllyjamboPosted on10:12 am - May 19, 2015


parttimearab says:
Member: (332 comments)
May 19, 2015 at 9:43 am

‘It is understood…’

A headline that will have copies flying off the shelves (relatively speaking) turns out to be no more than speculation.

Glad to know that some things never change!!!

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Bawsman

BawsmanPosted on10:47 am - May 19, 2015


Who is paying the wages of the Newcastle FC ringer currently keeping the Ibrox side in the promotion race?

Indeed, who is paying the wages of the other 4 ringers who are not playing?

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