A Blog by James Forrest for TSFM
I am a socialist, and as a socialist I believe in the fundamental goodness of people. Some people find that hard to believe when they read the stuff I write.
I published my first novel recently, on politics and the corrupting nature of it, and it is a deeply cynical book, a book where no-one has clean hands come the end. What has surprised some of those who’ve read it is that I didn’t focus on the lies and smears of the right, but the hypocrisy and deceit of those who claim to be of the left.
Corruption, you see, doesn’t respect political boundaries or points of view. It’s like rainwater. It finds every crack, and gets in there.
My political beliefs revolve around two apparently paradoxical elements; the belief in the inherent decency of people and the need for a strong, and powerful, state. I believe the second underpins the first, and this brings me into conflict with a lot of people, some on the left and some on the right. Too many people see the state as inherently evil, as something that interferes too much in the lives of ordinary people. As something suffocating.
Yet the state exists to protect us. It exists to provide a safety net. It exists to regulate and to oversee. If the state is made up of bad people, if the gears of society are captured by those with malicious or selfish intent, the results are obvious; war, corruption, chaos.
The vast majority of our problems in the modern age can be neatly summed up in two lines from Yeats’ poem “The Second Coming”, which I used to open my novel. “The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.”
We live in a time when those who are protecting their own interests have assumed such power that they’ve cowed the rest of us. They have become a law unto themselves. They have changed the nature of the game, because they have sapped our will to the extent some barely put up a fight anymore. The weak get weaker, and the strong use their strength to crush the rest even more. It is a vicious struggle, a downward spiral.
Society is held together not only by the endeavour and common interests of its citizens but by a collection of laws. We elect the people who make those laws. They do so in our name, and we can remove that right every four years. That is a powerful thing, and we do not appreciate it enough. The present corruption exists because we allow it to exist.
The people around me continue to puzzle over my uncommon interest in the affairs of a football club on the west of Glasgow. My own club plays in the east end. I tell those who ask that my primary interest in the goings-on at the club calling itself Rangers is no longer about football; how could it be, after all? With promotion this year they are still a full two divisions below us, emasculated, skint, weak and unstable. If we were fortunate enough to draw them in cup competition the match would be over, as a tie, by the halfway point … in the first half.
In footballing terms they are an utter irrelevance.
Rangers is more than a football club to me. They are a symbol. Their unfolding calamity is an on-going outrage. What is happening there, what is being allowed to happen, is an offense to decency. It is a stain on the face of our country.
In short, it is a scandal. It is a scandal without parallel in sport.
Yet it’s not just a sports story either. If it was, I might not be so focussed on it. What is happening at Rangers is a colossal failure of governance. It is a damning indictment against the very people who are supposed to oversee our game. It is a disgraceful abrogation of responsibility from those at the top, those who claim to be “running things.”
If this is not a failure of governance it is a result of corruption at the heart of our national sport. It says they are bought and paid for, and I will say no such thing here.
So let’s give them the benefit of the doubt. We’ll say instead that what they are is weak, indecisive, inept and disconnected from reality.
It reminds me of our political class, which has become insular and ignorant about what the public wants, and what it needs. It’s not a wonder parties like UKIP can achieve national vote shares of 25% at local elections. Nigel Farage strikes me as a dog-whistle politician, the kind who knows how to appeal to a select group of voters. He is little different to Charles Green, the man who beguiled Rangers fans into handing over large amounts of money, because he was “standing up for the club.” It is easy to do what he did, easy to do what Farage is doing.
Real leadership requires toughness. Say what you like about the Tories, but they have that in spades. Yeats was right about the worst being full of passionate intensity. Green was. Farage is. Cameron and Osborne personify it in their political outlook.
It is easy to be cowed by blunt force politics, and by “tough talking Yorkshire men” and venomous speeches about “strivers and skivers.” The politics of divide and conquer is the oldest form of politics there is, and it’s no surprise to see it practiced by some of the vested interests in the game here in Scotland. Yet, lest we forget … something significant happened last year. The maligned and the ignored, the weak and the voiceless found something they never realised they had. They discovered that, in a very real sense, the power was in their hands.
Last year, the fans rose up when the governing bodies and the media went all-out to save Rangers from the self-inflicted wounds caused by a decade of cheating, malpractice and ineptitude. I have no problem calling that what it was.
What happened at Rangers seemed incredible, but it was all too predictable, and some of us had been talking about it for years before it hit. The Association seemed caught in the headlights but it would amaze me if they really were as insular and ignorant as they appeared. They must have known how bad the outlook was for Rangers. They just chose to ignore it.
They were aided and abetted by a thoroughly disreputable media, a collection of cowards and compromisers, charlatans and frauds, masquerading as journalists, but who long ago laid aside any claim to be bold investigators and settled for commenting on events as they unfolded. More often than not, with their ill-informed opinions, sometimes due to weaknesses in intellect and others wilfully ignorant, they failed even in that.
Entire newspapers became PR machines for crooks and swindlers. They aided in the scam because they didn’t do their jobs, some because they were lazy, some because they were incompetent and others because they wanted a seat at the table and were willing to sacrifice whatever integrity they once had in exchange for one.
That all of this was embraced by the Rangers fans is amazing to me. They trusted when they should have been asking questions. They closed their eyes, covered their ears and sang their battle tunes at the top of their voices so they wouldn’t have to hear anything they didn’t like. As incredible as I found it then, and still find it now – and now, even more so, when they have already seen the results of it once – I find it pathetic too, and I do feel pity for some of them.
A lot of these people are genuine football fans, and nothing more. They have no interest in the phony narrow nationalism, or the over-blown religion, or the notion of supremacy which manifested itself in a ludicrous statement from McCoist when interviewed recently on Sky.
Some of the Rangers fans look at their team of duds, kids and journeymen, they look at a boardroom of cowards and crooks, they look at a failing manager in his first (and last) job in the game and at a dark future and are not in the least bit impressed by, or interested in, the chest-out arrogance espoused in those ridiculous words “we are the people.” They know full well that their present crisis was made by men like McCoist, and they understand that pretentious posturing is not an act born of strength, but a scrambling around in the gutter, and a symptom of weakness.
They understand their position, and they hate it. And because they care about Rangers, because they value the club, because they cherish those things that made it a great Scottish institution, they want that back. They understand that before the Union Jack waving, Sash singing, poppy wearing, Nazi saluting, Orange element became the public face of their support Rangers meant something else, and that, above all things, is what pains them the most.
People do not hate Rangers. When the country appeared to turn its back last year, they were turning the back on favouritism and the bending of rules. Yet it would be a lie to say that there is not an element of dislike in the gleeful mockery of many rival fans.
But they don’t hate Rangers either. They hate the version of it around which a certain section of the support continues to dance. They hate the version which hates, and so too do many, many, many Rangers supporters, and they definitely deserve better.
David Murray chose not to openly challenge that version. Indeed, he encouraged certain strands of it to flourish and grow, with his “Britishness Days” and his effort to turn the club into the “team that supports the troops.” Other clubs have done as much, if not more, for the British Army than the one that plays out of Ibrox. Other clubs have given more money. Other clubs have lent their support to those on the front lines. They just chose to do it with respect, and with class, and with dignity. They chose to do it in private, understanding that there eventually comes a tipping point between looking after the ends of the soldiers and using them to promote your own.
The army has not battened on to Rangers. Rangers has battened on to them, and although it is unclear when an altruistic motive became darker, what started out as a gesture of solidarity is now used to entrench division and promote a notion of superiority.
Craig Whyte took over from Murray and immediately understood the lure of the “dog whistle.” He knew too that the media would accept whatever he told them, without question, and as he spoke up for “Rangers traditions” he made sure the lunatic fringe was well onside. He met face to face with the hard-core extremists in the support first and made them his praetorian guard. They spoke up for him until the day the club entered administration.
So, whereas Murray pandered to them and Whyte used them to further his own ends, it was only a matter of time before someone suggested to Charles Green that he could use the same tactics to win over the support. He went even further and blatantly promoted and encouraged this mind-set, and stoked the hate and nonsense to frightening new heights. The same people who cheered Whyte to the rafters jumped on board the Big Blue Bus and the results are clear.
Through all of it, the ordinary Rangers fan has seen his club buffered against the rocks, battered, broken, smashed to smithereens and sunk. Now there’s a big hole in the side of the lifeboat, and they are terrified that further tragedies await.
They are right to be concerned. Much of the media is still not telling them what they need to know. The people in charge of their club – the owners who have lied, the former hack who covered up the truth about Whyte and now acts as a mouthpiece for Green, the “club legends” who are content to sup with the devil and take his greasy coin when they should be standing toe-to-toe with the fans – are trying to silence those members of the press who do have facts to present.
How many times now have media outlets been banned from Ibrox for daring to report the truth? The manager who demanded the names of a committee last year defends those inside the walls who are desperate to keep secret the things that are going on. He is either an unprincipled coward, or he is, himself, bought and paid for. The fans suffer for it.
The “inconvenient truth” is still being kept from them, and this denies them any chance to play an active role in their club. Indeed, it is all too possible that they’ve passed a point of no return, and that their club is heading for a new liquidation event and it can no longer be stopped.
In either case, their power has been eroded to the point at which they must feel they have nothing left to do but stand back and watch what happens next.
They are wrong. I am a socialist. I believe in the inherent good of people. I think the ordinary decent Rangers fans are the only people left who can save their club … and the means by which they will do it is as simple as it could be.
They must stand up for “big government.” They must embrace the need for a “strong state.” They must lobby the SFA, and they must trust the SFA and they must get the SFA to follow its own rules and thereby save them from any further harm.
There is a tendency amongst some Celtic fans to see our governing bodies as pro-Rangers. If it is true then those running our game are ruining Scottish football without benefiting the thing they love more. The incalculable harm that has been done to Rangers in the last 20 some months is a direct result of the subservient media and the willingness of the football authorities to be “deaf, dumb and blind.” Those who believe this has actually helped the Ibrox club have not been paying attention in class. It has irrevocably scarred them, and it may yet have played a hand in destroying them once and for all, as a force if not as a club entirely.
For years, the SFA sat and did nothing as a club in their association operated a sectarian signing policy. They did nothing whilst the fans sang sectarian songs. In their failure to act they strengthened those elements of the Rangers support, instead of isolating, alienating and eventually helping to eliminate those who saw that club as a totem pole of division and hate. Their failure over EBT’s, and their lack of scrutiny, led to one of the greatest scandals in the history of sport, and I say that with no equivocation at all. The testimony of their registrations officer in the Lord Nimmo Smith investigation was a disgrace and in years to come it will rank as one of the most disreputable and damaging moments in the association’s history.
The most egregious failures of all were the failures in the so-called “fit and proper person” tests, which allowed first Whyte and then Charles Green to assume controlling positions at Ibrox. They will pass the buck and say the responsibility lies with the club itself, in much the same way as they are content to let the club investigate itself at the present time, but any neutral who looks at this stance knows it is unprincipled and spineless. It’s like letting the defence set the terms at a trial. It is foxes investigating the chicken coop.
It is a blueprint for corruption, and a recipe for disaster.
It is now too late for the SFA to declare Green “unfit”, as it was too late when they finally slapped that title on Craig Whyte. He and his allies own Rangers, and they control its destiny. They can push the club to the wall if they choose, in the final extremity, if that gets them what they want. The time for changing that is past. The damage has already been done. The barbarians are not at the gates. They are inside the walls, and sacking the city.
The SFA will be forced to punish Rangers for the sins of the owners, for the second time in as many years, and whilst it is right that the club face up to that, all the better to send a message to other clubs and other owners, the SFA cannot be allowed to slither off the hook here as though this was none of their doing. Green will skip off into the sunset. Craig Whyte has yet to pay his fine. These people never cared about Scottish football and they don’t care now.
The SFA are supposed to. Our governing body is supposed to govern, for the good of the whole game, and not as a support system for a single club. What they have allowed to happen on their watch is absolutely shameful and if the people responsible were men at all, with any sense of accountability, they would resign en masse.
They can pretend ignorance, but only the truly ignorant would accept that. Craig Whyte was not inside Ibrox a week before RTC and other sites were dismantling his entire business history, with some of the people here doing the work the SFA would not. Whyte himself claims to have made the governing bodies aware of the scale of what was facing the club, and they did nothing at all. Heads should have rolled a year ago.
In October of last year, on this very site, I posted an article in which I wrote:
“Which isn’t to say the due diligence matter isn’t worrying, because, of course, it is. Again, no-one is going to convince me that the SFA has conducted proper due diligence on Charles Green and his backers. No-one will convince me they are satisfied that this club is in safe hands, and that the game in this country will not be rocked by a further implosion at Ibrox. They failed to properly investigate Craig Whyte, because of lax regulations requiring disclosure from the club itself, regulations which are just a joke, but they can be forgiven for that as the press was talking sheer nonsense about him having billions at his disposal, and a lot of people (but not everyone!) were either convinced or wanted to be convinced by him.
To have witnessed what Whyte did, to have witnessed the Duff & Phelps “process” of finding a buyer, and having Green essentially emerge from nowhere, with a hundred unanswered questions as to his background and financing, for the SFA to have given this guy the go ahead, only for it to blow up in their faces later, would annihilate the credibility of the governing body and necessitate resignations at every level. There would be no hiding place.”
There are times when it is fun to be right, but this is not one of them. It is dispiriting and disquieting to have been so on the nose. It scares the Hell out of me, as someone who loves football in this country, to have seen this matter clearly when the people running our game apparently either did not or chose to ignore very real, very obvious, concerns. The Internet Bampots had no special insight or access to information that was denied those at the SFA. We just weren’t prepared to ignore it and pretend that it wasn’t there. There was too much at stake.
I have become convinced that things will never change until the Rangers supporters join us in demanding the full and unabridged truth here. They need to come out from under the bed, and confront their fears. They need to be willing to take the consequences, so that their club can emerge clean from this, and start again, with all this behind them.
And it can all happen with one simple thing. The application of the rules.
The existence of laws comes down to a simple principle; they protect society from those elements within it who are interested only in their own selfish ends. We may cry out at those rules and regulations we see as “restrictive”, but the law was not made to restrict our freedoms but to protect them. Had the SFA years ago acted against Rangers sectarian signing policy, and the songs from the stands, the club would not have mutated to the point where there was no help on hand when they needed it the most. Let’s not kid ourselves about this; Whyte and Green were only able to grab control because the club itself has a dreadful image which put off respectable and responsible buyers. The SFA could have helped change that perception years ago and did nothing.
The SFA could have conducted its own investigation into who Craig Whyte was. They could have asked David Murray for full disclosure when he was running up £80 million of debt, a sum of money that is beyond belief for a single club in a small provincial backwater league. Had they had the guts to do that the club would never have spent itself into oblivion and forced the hand of Lloyds, which led indirectly to their ignominious end.
The SFA could have fully investigated Charles Green and the means by which he took control, instead of rushing through a license. His emergence at the last minute was transparently suspicious and designed to force them into a quick decision, but they did not have to bow to that pressure by making one, without being in possession of the facts, as it is now 100% clear they were not.
Had they asked for every document, had they insisted on legal affidavits and personal securities from investors (and this would have been perfectly legitimate and is common place in other licensing areas) none of this would have come to pass. After Craig Whyte they had a moral responsibility to the rest of the game to get this one right and their failure is without parallel in the history of Scottish football.
As the club hurtles towards a new abyss, names are cropping up which should send a shudder down the spines of every honest, genuine supporter of not only Rangers but every team in the land. The SFA claims that a strong Rangers is essential for the sake of Scottish football, but they have been extraordinarily lax in protecting that club, and therefore the game, from destructive elements. Craig Whyte and Charles Green had dubious personal histories, and the acquisition of the club itself was mired in controversy and scandal. Yet it was allowed.
Neither Green nor Whyte were known to have operated outside the law, yet neither was worthy of trust or stood up to scrutiny. Neither man should ever have been granted the status as fit and proper persons to assume a role in our national sport, and if it is true of them what can we say about the three men who are, presently, being touted as the Great White Hopes for a bright, new Rangers future; Dave King and the Easdale brothers?
King recently cut a deal with the South African government over an on-going dispute over taxes. In other words, he pled guilty and accepted the central plank of their argument; that for years he was engaged in wilfully with-holding vast revenues from their Treasury. The media does not like to put it like that, and the SFA seems willing to ignore it utterly, and this would be scandalous enough. But it does not stop there. HRMC rules – as well as the SFA’s own governance documents – actually bar him from serving on the board of the new club.
Last but not least, aside from being an admitted tax cheat, King is also awaiting trial in South Africa, having been indicted for corruption, forgery and fraud – 300 charges in total. Yet as recently as last week, we were told that the Association was willing to look at him and consider representations from his lawyers. This is almost beyond belief.
If Dave King’s position is untenable, and he is yet to be convicted of a crime, what can we say about the position of the Easdale’s? One of the two brothers, Sandy, has already served jail time. He is a convicted criminal, a fraudster nonetheless, who’s “victim” was the same Treasury who are appealing one case involving the old club and liquidated it entirely over another. This is precisely the kind of “businessman” the fit and proper person test was supposed to weed out, and if the SFA holds its nose here the reek will stink out the halls at Hampden for decades. If King or the Easdale’s are judged fit and proper, then who exactly is the test for? What exactly do you have to do to fail it? How do we explain the existence of laws, when these are not applied?
Pascal says “Law without force is impotent.” The SFA’s weakness has allowed one version of Rangers to destroy itself, and has allowed an existential risk to another. If the next power at Rangers resides in South Africa or Greenock I can say with some certainty that the Association is engaged in an even more dangerous roll of the dice, because the surfacing of fresh scandal will be an ever present risk, and will be of the sort no-one will survive.
The damage to Scottish football will take years to heal. The Scottish game has been through enough trauma. It does not need more. It barely survived the last calamity to hit Rangers. The rest of us should not be forced to pay the price of the next one.
The greater damage will be done to Rangers itself. If the Green crisis ends in another collapse – as it well might; another administration event is a certainty, and another liquidation is a much more likely prospect than it was before 14 February 2012 – the club will once again have to start from the bottom, and this time the reputational damage will be impossible to repair. The club faces internal strife, sporting sanctions, and criminal investigations. The last takeover might be declared a fraud. the Whyte takeover will almost certainly be. The share issue might be invalid, as well as criminal, and the people involved may well end up in jail. Lawsuits could follow from investors, there could be as yet unknown consequences from the Upper Tier Tax Tribunal (thank you Brogan Rogan for pointing out what those might be) and a host of other issues.
Rangers fans must be the loudest voices here. How do you want the world to view your club in years to come? Do you want one to be proud of, or one forever associated with the shame and disgrace of these days gone by? The one which bailed out on its tax obligations. The one with supporters who disgrace your very name. The one which allowed Whyte and Green to take you to the cleaners and send you to the wall. The one which handed over control to one convicted criminal and another awaiting trial. Do you want to be reborn clean, or mired in the muck?
David Murray destroyed your financial stability. He made it so no bank would issue you a line of credit and no investor of note wanted to buy. Craig Whyte liquidated you. Charles Green has cast the future of the Newco into doubt and acted in a manner which has annihilated your credibility with the financial markets for decades to come.
Between these three men, they have taken everything from you, and the press and the people who run the game here, as well as some of your own blindly ignorant fans, have allowed them to do all this and more. Now they conspire to hand the keys to Ibrox to other men of questionable character, who will wreck further havoc on the reputation of the club.
The Scottish Football Association has damaged the game it was supposed to protect, but above all else their greatest failure of governance was a failure to protect one of its biggest clubs from its own excesses and those of its owners.
Rangers fans, the SFA have betrayed your trust, more than the trust of any other club. What you must insist on now is full disclosure and transparency from the powers that be in Hampden. The SFA has to end the charade of allowing your club to handle this in-house. They must hand everything over to an outside agency – whether a legal one, or a footballing body like UEFA – and they must demand co-operation and answers, and threaten to withhold the license if they don’t get them.
You must not be afraid of that. You must embrace it. The men with their hands on the gears at Ibrox are motivated by money, and nothing more. If the license is withdrawn their “investments” are worthless. They cannot risk that.
You must demand that the rules on fit and proper persons are applied, and where necessary even made stronger, to prevent your club falling into unclean hands. You must demand that they protect your reputation from further damage, by getting this all out there and acting accordingly, even if that means your club does not play football for at least a year.
You must be willing to suck it all up, knowing that what will emerge is a Rangers which has been cleansed and moves forward with honour, and dignity, led by custodians who treasure it rather than those who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
The Rangers Standard has recently emerged as a genuine voice for those in your support who are sick and tired of what Rangers has become, and want it restored to something that is worthy of the love and respect in which you hold it. On that website, there are discussions about the kind of club you seek to be and about whether the institution of Rangers is about more than just football.
If that’s how you feel about it then you know it is about more than how many titles the club can claim, about more than just results on the park, about more than just the game. Rangers, like Celtic, is an idea. It has to be something you are proud of.
I am a socialist, but one with a fevered imagination and a tendency to write very dark things. This piece won’t have been good reading for some of you (perhaps all of you haha!) but I think there’s more hope in here than in other things I’ve written.
In spite of everything that’s come to pass, I still believe. I believe in Scottish football. I believe in our system of football governance, even if those who are working in it are failing on some level.
In society, as much as we strain against them, laws exist for our protection. To fail to enforce them is to leave us at the mercy of those elements who would do us harm. The rules of football ensure the protection of all clubs, not just a few.
The failure to enforce the rules has never had graver consequences than here in Scotland. The irony is that bending and breaking them has hurt the one club those violations were designed to help. It cannot be allowed to happen again.
The rules must be applied without fear or favour.
The best must find their conviction, and their passionate intensity once more.
James is a co-editor of the On Fields of Green Blog http://www.onfieldsofgreen.com/
Returning to the topic of jerseys worn in the Scottish Cup Final, and by way of explanation, the home and away sides in the final is presently decided by the pattern of the semi final draw.
Going back to the 2004 Final, Celtic were the away team because they were drawn in the second semi final, so that year they wore their away outfit, while in 2007, having been drawn in the first semi final, they wore the home strip, and Dunfermline changed.
A good example would also be the 2008 and 2009 finals: in 2008 old Rangers took part in the second semi final, so had to allow Queen of the South the choice of blue jersey for the final, whereas in 2009, having played in the first semi final, they were then the home side for the final against Falkirk, so Falkirk wore their white change strip.
From recollection, I think this method of deciding choice of jersey used where a colour clash arises stems from the 2003 competition, where Dundee and Rangers disputed who should wear blue. I recall there was a bit of bad blood between the sides at the time, as Zurab Khizanishvili was rumoured to be on his way to Ibrox for free, and the jersey issue was a spillover.
On another point of information, and to ensure that I receive the prerequisite number of TDs, on all these occasions, no matter which of the ex OF sides took part in the finals, and no matter who had played first in the semis and so was regarded as a ‘home’ side, both Celtic and old Rangers got the use of their ‘traditional’ dressing rooms. 🙂
CF last tweets concerning Mr Green and potential threats to Mr Whyte heading for a possible showdown at High Noon. No one to trust in the Govan Coral, all squinting eyes at each other in the barroom boardroom(no offence to MM).
Sports writer of the year KJ stated on BBCSportsound last night that the past 48 hours behind the scenes at the Govan coral was horrendous and there is a possibility fairly soon that something major was about to happen, and not in a good way for the gunslingers. Is there a price on CW Dead or Alive? So something apparently is Bounty happen soon.
Where is the state Marshall CO and his deputy SR are they out of Dodge at the moment.?
We need law and order restored. Round them up and move them out.
Do not forsake me Craigy Whyte…………………………………….you know the tune. Add your own words.
Jack
Should have said that I actually DO believe Dingwall’s version of events. My point was to challenge your assumption that because he had spoken it proved anything.
valentinesclown says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:51
“So something apparently is Bounty happen soon.”
Are we to see a taste of Paradise ?
borussiabeefburg says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:51
Returning to the topic of jerseys worn in the Scottish Cup Final, and by way of explanation, the home and away sides in the final is presently decided by the pattern of the semi final draw.
On another point of information, and to ensure that I receive the prerequisite number of TDs, on all these occasions, no matter which of the ex OF sides took part in the finals, and no matter who had played first in the semis and so was regarded as a ‘home’ side, both Celtic and old Rangers got the use of their ‘traditional’ dressing rooms. 🙂
___________________________________________________________________
My information concurs with yours on the jersey situation, but unless there has been a change since 2006, the “home” team gets the first call on the home dressing room.
I sympathise with the poster who was irked that there are traditional Celtic and Rangers ends at Hampden something that predates any Murray influence. Don’t know when it goes back to but both ends were referred to thusly as early as the fifties and probably before.
The annoying thing for fans of other teams is that the end they would be standing or sitting in depended on which of the Glasgow big two they were playing in the final.
briggsbhoy says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:49
On another point of information, and to ensure that I receive the prerequisite number of TDs, on all these occasions, no matter which of the ex OF sides took part in the finals, and no matter who had played first in the semis and so was regarded as a ‘home’ side, both Celtic and old Rangers got the use of their ‘traditional’ dressing rooms.
—————————–
Not as relevant as the fans having to sit in the pissing rain…….. Now I wonder which set of fans never had to do that?
borussiabeefburg
Khizanishvilil, was taken on a free against the common (but not literal) understanding of the rules regarding compensation of youth development. Dundee’s refusal to sell another player at a price suitable to the ibrox team caused Masterton to call in Dundee’s loans with the bank. Loans initially set up to enable Dundee to build a 10000 seat stadium; cash from Masterton, steel from Murray, rest to Barr. That was admin 1, oh and according to Calderwood, they then placed rangers men to run the club as they saw fit; we have lurched from crisis to crisis ever since.
Back to Charlotte, and the doctored emails;
a) Charlotte changed the email, or
b) The sender sent more than one, or has changed the email, or
more likely,
c) They have both changed the email to suit personal agendas,
either way, those on the light blue side of this argument can now claim that it’s all made up, nothing to see here, we caught her red handed.
Rabo Karabekian says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:23
The real story is not Charlotte, whose web is becoming increasingly tangled and frayed. The real story at Rangers is one of survival in the midst of financial meltdown and continued overspending.
=====
Exactly right.
As Charlotte performs the dance of the seven veils before her mesmerised audience, over at Ibrox the money is running out fast. Expenditure still running at over £2m per month, IPO money all but gone, ST money desperately needed, but unlikely to match last year’s achievement.
The real players are wanting their money out NOW, before the train hits the buffers at top speed. While Charlotte drip feeds us a load of stuff which has no bearing on the apparently top secret financial crisis at Ibrox right now.
Has there been anything in the press or broadcast media about the financial situation at Ibrox? All I’ve seen is the £20m in the bank garbage. Our journalists seem not to understand that you can’t spend it and still have it, but then that’s probably too complicated a concept for their delicate little minds to grasp.
Come on, Charlotte, arouse my interest by tweeting the current cash position of RIFC. Then I’ll know what kind of girl you really are.
Rabo
Mark Dingwall produces the original on the link I gave (FF thread), post at 09:03.
If you follow the thread on this link he present´s his case well and if you consider Charlotte´s version (e-mail leaked last night) then what is obviously missing is an itroduction, ie. Dear X or similar.
He takes the time and show´s the courtesy to sign off with his name so is it not reasonable to assume he´s make the appropriate introduction ?
MD´s version makes more sense and there has been no comeback from Charlotte. She did however make mention about a seperate issue concerning the same MD (after the Rangers supporters spokesman showing the original).
She aluded to the same back on the 18th.
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 18 may
Prominent Rangers Supporters Spokesperson sends me this, thinking I’m Craig!!! “Been an admirer of your recent work. Would be good to talk”
I took this at the time to be somewhat opportunistic finger-pointing that grabbed attention on the supporters messageboards but had little to do with the meat of the issue.
It suggested the possibility that whoever had the material may have an interest in football rivalry aswell.
I read with interest your post of 01:14 re. the possibilities of hacking being involved.
Rabo Karabekian says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:03
The annoying thing for fans of other teams is that the end they would be standing or sitting in depended on which of the Glasgow big two they were playing in the final.
===================
I don’t see their problem if they were up against Celtic in the 60’s and it was raining. Celtic fans had to get soaked no matter who they were playing!
Rabo,
Does it matter what Charlotte’s motives are ? They probably are the actions of a Non Rangers fan. So what ? If there is a credible response from any of those Charlotte is exposing , then those individuals can provide it through the MSM.
The information is surely the most important thing here. It seems to me that almost everyone now accepts that Charlotte has access to genuine information.
The audio clip that the media released, presumably via Whyte, of Green saying ” You are Sevco, thats what we are saying” was the beginning of the end for Green. The reason was that the information it provided was what mattered. The fact that it was a very short clip of an audio Charlotte later released in full didn’t matter. Green was on his way, as soon as that initial clip was released.
What we don’t know , is whether the Sun had the full 4 minute audio, and chose or agreed only to run the short version. Their credibility wasn’t damaged in regard to this .
I understand the reaction of Rangers supporters in looking to minimise the effect of what Charlotte is releasing, using whatever methods they can. These supporters bought into Whyte, and then bought into Green, and have been humiliated for their lack of judgement. Denial is a normal human emotion , when faced with something unpalatable .
What makes the reality of Rangers problems more difficult to handle for a lot of their supporters, is that it has by and large been fans of other clubs who have brought the truth out into the open. That’s a double whammy, and means an even more determined rebuttal, even when they know that what they are trying to damage is the truth .
neepheid says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:22
I don’t see their problem if they were up against Celtic in the 60′s and it was raining. Celtic fans had to get soaked no matter who they were playing!
==========================================================================
My recollection of Hampden in days gone by was regardless of where you were in the ground and whether or not it was raining it was odds on the bottom of your trousers got soaked with spilled or ‘recycled’ Tennents Lager or McEwans Export.
Mind you the old cans with the seams up the side were handy for me as a kid as you could stand on a couple to get a better view of tha game.
greenockjack says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:16
Mark Dingwall produces the original on the link I gave (FF thread), post at 09:03.
If you follow the thread on this link he present´s his case well and if you consider Charlotte´s version (e-mail leaked last night) then what is obviously missing is an itroduction, ie. Dear X or similar.
He takes the time and show´s the courtesy to sign off with his name so is it not reasonable to assume he´s make the appropriate introduction ?
MD´s version makes more sense and there has been no comeback from Charlotte. She did however make mention about a seperate issue concerning the same MD (after the Rangers supporters spokesman showing the original).
_________________________________________________________________
I saw the “original”. Just as easily doctored as the Charlotte version. I do agree that Dingwall’s version makes more sense though. Why on earth would you mail someone with whom you were already acquainted with “I admire your work, We should talk!”
We know that there was a well established mutual admiration between MD and CW – before there wasn’t all of a sudden 🙂
barcabhoy says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:26
I agree with you that Charlotte’s motives are secondary to anything substantive she may have to offer. I also agree that Rangers fans will understandably want to shoot it down for obvious reasons.
My view for now is that Charlotte has offered nothing substantive other than that which is already in the public domain. I also think that the rush to believe is just as compelling for some as the rush to deny is for others.
I am trying to keep in check my rush to believe 🙂
I do think though that Charlotte may have made a mistake with the Dingwall mail.
briggsbhoy says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:49
Apart from wondering who these guys were I was thinking mainly why would you have possession of someone’s passport photograph and why or who would have needed to have a possessed a copy for their records ?
Solicitors are required to obtain personal identification documents to verify client’s identities.
This requirement relates to any person/corporate body that own 25% or more of the shares in a company. Generally they want certified copies of passports or photocard driving licences, together with a certified copy of a recent (i.e. no more than 3 months’ old) utility bill or bank statement which confirms names and home addresses. Just handed mine over recently during company lease renewal.
Rabo,
What would be interesting, and this may have happened as I don’t go on Follow Follow, is for Dingwall to respond . To state that he knew that the email he received was from Whyte’s email address but that he also know it wasn’t from Whyte. In which case, who did he think it was from ?
I see the Sevco Currents have announced signing of Nicky Law with MORE to come.
No one asking Ally how he plans to register all these players next year
No one asking how they plan to pay them all whilst losing £1M+ a month
head in sand as usual from MSM.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 12:05
I see the Sevco Currents have announced signing of Nicky Law with MORE to come.
No one asking Ally how he plans to register all these players next year
No one asking how they plan to pay them all whilst losing £1M+ a month
head in sand as usual from MSM.
========================
With the LNS verdict, and the hole blown in the system, do registrations even matter anymore?
How much are Nicky Law and Cammy Bell worth in the transfer market. They both appear to be committing to long term contracts.
If they were sold on under contract how much would they be worth ? In the current climate maybe £300,000 each .
Will they be getting a signing on fee? Will it be anywhere near their sell on value ? Their combined wage is unlikely to come anywhere close to the combined wage paid to Alexander and Sandaza.
If there is £8 million left in the kitty, and if the support buy season books at last years levels, then could Rangers make it to the end of the forthcoming season. Why would the fans buy season books, after watching last years fare ? So what has to be sold, is that it’s not going to be last year’s fare.
This totally disregards the fact that the Spivs are still in control and they need the fans money for their own exit route .
Rangers fans have been both applauded for their loyalty and laughed at for their refusal to take action against the spivs. The future of the Spivs is in their hands. Starve them out and face some more short term pain, but enable credible owners to come in. Alternatively be taken for a collective mug yet again, and hope Ahmad isn’t as big a low life as all the evidence indicates.
What a dilemma, imagine having to trust Imran Ahmad !!! It doesn’t bear thinking about
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 09:26
Charrlotte Says:
Perhaps these 2 could help you? http://i.imgur.com/Xyi1UGX.jpg
#AskAidan #AskWulstan
———————————–
Could be wrong here, but I’m sure that these two are Wulstan Earley on the right and his brother Justin Earley on the left.
100% on Wulstan (click this link)
http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/9257/wilstanearley.jpg
Justin, not quite sure (90%)…..but it sure ain’t Aiden!
mmm….Charlotte can’t tell the difference?
Long term lurker here, and from RTC. I’m off for a week so I may have time to share my opinions.
Initially, I have a question related to today’s news, hopefully pertinent to the conversation.
With SFL 1st Division clubs preparing to break the rules by quitting the SFL for a new SPL2, is this seen realistically as the chance for certain other club/s leapfrogging to a higher division than expected next year?
Also, on a side note, it seems Charlotte is recently claiming whistleblower status. I thought about this when Tom English was claiming to wait for legal clearance before publishing, despite it being potentially of public interest.
But whistleblower status was set up to specifically to protect employees from their employers when leaking damaging information to the public domain as part of the Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998.
Is Charlotte using the term Whistleblower incorrectly or is s/he actually an employee of a related party?
Robert Coyle says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 09:31
Robert I think the Fitzpatrick guy is an accountant who handles company secretarial
positions for various businesses. Holmes is not Craigy’s mate. Good on you for trying to make the connection though
briggsbhoy says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 10:49
Quantcast
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 09:26
Apart from wondering who these guys were I was thinking mainly why would you have possession of someone’s passport photograph and why or who would have needed to have a possessed a copy for their records ?
—————————————————————————————————————————–
When doing corporate deals it is standard practice to require photographic ID for money laundering and proof of identity reasons.
Charrlotte Says:
Perhaps these 2 could help you? http://i.imgur.com/Xyi1UGX.jpg
#AskAidan #AskWulstan
Justin Earley.
(Both Earley photos taken at the same location/venue and tagged)
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9642/justinearley.jpg
Forres Dee (@ForresDee) says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 12:18
With the LNS verdict, and the hole blown in the system, do registrations even matter anymore?
=======================================================
I think it’s quite simple as you suggest – If you register once then you’re registered for life.
Saves a helluva lot of money on admin costs. And of course if the registration isn’t actually tied to a club then you can never exceed the allowable number of players set by the rules.
It truly is a win win situation 🙂
Robo Karabekian…
welcome…
do you know anything about the fit and proper persons test?
Is there some confusion
Charlotte says to update TSFM
Picture is os Aiden Early
other should be Wulstan
Now other photo’s seem to be ….. Anthony and Peter from the Worthington Board ?
and indicating that Aiden and Wulstan also are
My map does show the Early links
Not read through posts todaay so not entirely sure what CtH was referring to …
apol’s …. you guys ahead of me ….
CrazyHorse says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:53
100bjd says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 12:56
What I was really alluding to was would the possession of these photographs who’s needs required them bring us any closer to who CF is or worked for?
Night Terror says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 13:45
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I agree with most of what you say but I’m not sure it’s a topic for debate on here.
Don’t take this the wrong way but your writing style is quite “abrasive” could you adjust the setting on your keyboard to “robust”.
The self-inflicted trauma continues
“Frankie @GersnetOnline 23s
Scotsman suggesting emergency board meeting (not an EGM!) is taking place today. Malc Murray’s position under threat. Fun & games continue!”
Tweet to Charlotte
Ok. My mistake – Quote “100% on Wulstan . Justin, not quite sure (90%)” Post on TSFM. (Very few photos of Aiden – plenty of Justin)
sorry meant to include link
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/sfl-division-three/rangers-board-to-decide-malcolm-murray-s-fate-1-2943671
barcabhoy says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 12:02
8 0 Rate This
Rabo,
What would be interesting, and this may have happened as I don’t go on Follow Follow, is for Dingwall to respond . To state that he knew that the email he received was from Whyte’s email address but that he also know it wasn’t from Whyte. In which case, who did he think it was from ?
____________
Dingwall has said on FF that someone tried to join using whytes email address
thats why he sent the email
@100bjd
Re your post this morning which I have just seen – I think you’re probably referring to the development at the Royal Haslar Hospital which followed Panceltica and left Major Parker Bowles, of Camilla fame, a bit flummoxed. There is a mention of it in:
http://scotslawthoughts.wordpress.com/2012/09/13/could-charlie-greens-rangers-float-turn-into-a-lead-lifebelt-by-ecojon/
However your memory is quite correct, as usual, on Fraser at Panceltica: ‘Panceltica announced that Fraser would step back from his role as chief executive for several months as he had been diagnosed with a serious medical condition. His duties will be performed by interim consultant Paul Manning’.
Always worth remembering Green and his role as was it deputy or vice chair of Panceltica which crashed and burned a lot of AIM investors. And of course Green ended up at Haslar with Fraser after Panceltica.
I believe your understanding is correct that after Fraser got out of Panceltica on health grounds and didn’t return with share-lock lifted for medical reasons. Fraser also left Haslar – but have never been able to establish if there was a package or not and from memory, although I don’t have access to my notes at the moment, I think his ill-health may have returned at least temporarily.
Grandmaster_Suck
“A thin-skinned, chronically-offended, individual”
Join Date: 06-03-2005
Location: The Disco Inferno
Posts: 22,377
Charlotte Fakes falls into ambush and doctors an email
I notice that someone using Craig Whyte’s old email address had attempted to register for an account on FF on 24th April.
After noting the IP address I sent them a wee note designed to draw them out.
By that point I knew that someone had been emailing others using that account claiming to have hacked Whyte’s email.
Rabo Karabekian says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:35
‘…. “I admire your work, We should talk!”..’
——-
Isn’t that phrase part of the ‘coded’ language used by freemasons?
If there is something like £8m left in the bank (at either RIFC or TRFC) and that is being used on running costs, I take it the plans, as outlined in the IPO have been abandoned. The vast majority of the money having been spent on running costs (or just about to be spent on them). If the company is spending £20m a year or more I just don’t see where the income to cover that is going to come from. Particularly with ticket prices being frozen.So cash in the bank will continue to be spent.
42,000 @ £350 = £14.7m. Minus VAT = £12.25m income from tickets. Add in merchandising, sponsorships media etc and I think the business still struggles to break even
So as I said, what is going to happen to the other plans. Where is the money coming from. I really believe the reality is that not only did they not let the market know that there was a threat to the asset ownership, but they also misled it in what the plans for the future were. Of course it was actually a failure if I remember correctly. The target was something like £27m and they were well short of that if memory serves.
http://scotslawthoughts.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/rifc-prospectus.pdf
The Company plans to use the money raised from the Placing to improve the
infrastructure of the Club. In particular, the Directors have identified:
•
upgrades to Ibrox stadium (approximately £5.5 million);
•
acquisition of land assets adjacent to the stadium (£4.5 million);
•
other identified projects which could result in additional revenue
generating activities (approximately £3.0 million); and
•
general working capital purposes.
In addition, should the Company receive funds from the Offer, the Directors have
identified other potential investments that would go beyond the Group’s strategy
in the next 12 months, but which could further enhance revenue opportunities.
In particular, the Directors have identified:
•
further upgrades to Ibrox Stadium (approximately £3.5 million); and
•
other identified projects which could result in additional review
generating activities (approximately £2.0 million).
Additionally, cash could also be used to provide the Directors with additional
flexibility to opportunistically consider appropriate investment opportunities
as and when they arise
Chipmonk
And Charles was going to take up the slack personaly,5/6million,I take that is not going to happen in the near future,oh well the fighting fund will need topped up somewhat,get yoouur spearment chewing gum and youuur macaroon bars here and can you put your change in this collection can,thank you.
Scapaflow
Malcolm Murray agrees to step outside and “settle this once and for all”
Changes his mind on seeing rowing boat tied up in Edmiston Drive.
The Reservoir.
This is the time of year when the Reservoir, which is the Fans’ cash, is full.
The Club Chairmen are all waiting for the sluice gates to be opened
so that the money
will be released
to fill their club coffers.
Right now, there is absolutely NOTHING more important to the Chairmen.
Right now, they don’t give a toss about TRFC / SFA / MSM.
Corruption in Scottish Football ? Away an’ don’t bother me !
They are ONLY interested in Season Book money.
The sluice gates are of course the fans’ wallets.
The Chairmen are waiting for them to be opened
and for the money to flow out in payment for Season Books.
And with the money in, the Chairmen can relax.
Campbell Ogilvie ? Out ? Naw, we’ll leave that for now, no rush.
Ahm goin’ on holiday shortly.
See ya !
The Earleys, Peter Townsend and Anthony Cooke are all linked through Worthington Group PLC and were probably responsible for £3m of Jerome Group Pension Fund cash being sent to Whyte in RFC PLC’s hour of need.
You do know that the domain name libertycapital.biz points to the Worthington Group website.
So it’s probable that Charlotte gained access to the domain some time last month, then registered the email address – and simply checked for previously received emails to that account, plus all attachments.
Genius!
With the password changed, Whyte has no way of regaining access to delete stuff.
I would imagine the delays between Charlotte’s postings merely reflects the time needed to download all of this stuff, get it squirrelled away and then try to make sense of it.
This could get VERY interesting . . .
Chipmonk
You are being over generous with your figures ,their site is advertising adult tickets from £258,kids £65 and cons from £160,oh and there are none for sale[at this moment in time] seemingly
Auldheid says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 14:41
Perhaps as well there is no Blackfriars Bridge on the clyde….
Ps. No, not me, the Chairmen, on holiday. Got it ?
No tickets for sale! Are they expecting an invite that would allow a price uplift?
Afternoon all,
If there’s one ‘character’ that I find more fascinating than even Mr Charles in this whole omnishables it’s Chris Graham. Here is a man who expressed genuine outrage of the scrutiny, such as it was, that was applied to CW when he first became Chairman. Then he welcomed the Yorkshireman with open arms, refusing to even contemplate that his motives, background and associations were questionable. Since CF emerged his strategy has been ‘lets see how it all pans out’ and now, of course, the recent discourse between Dingwall and CF, allows him to step back and confirm that there’s absolutely nothing to worry about. Again.
Proper, ordinary, decent Rangers fans are not best represented by a man who appears to lack any qualifications to be their spokesperson and who fails to apply any objectivity or logic to the situation; which might be that people with highly questionable business histories and motivations don’t in fact want to pour tons of cash into his Club, rather they’re there to solely make a fast buck or worse.
yourhavingalaugh says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 14:45
I was being deliberately generous, at least that was my intention.
I also wouldn’t be surprised if the costs are higher than the £20m.
The bottom line is there is going to be a struggle to make ends meet, without additional revenue streams. And it’s all gone very quiet on things like stadium naming rights. So for the business to stay afloat they will need to keep digging into any cash reserves they hold.
So there really is an issue with regards things like the “stadium upgrades”. For which I read “essential maintenance work”.
Bearing in mind that, if I understand it correctly, the club will be bringing in the ticket money etc. It will then effectively be borrowing money from the PLC to make up the difference.
Has anyone ever factored in interest or charges that the PLC might be charging.
bogsdollox says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 14:06
4 3 i Rate This
Night Terror says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 13:45
I agree with most of what you say but I’m not sure it’s a topic for debate on here.
Don’t take this the wrong way but your writing style is quite “abrasive” could you adjust the setting on your keyboard to “robust”.
=====================================================
Ditto for me bogs – agree with most. Disagree with NT in part – clearly some Celtic supporters using the site simply see this place as an extension of their club forums and somehow believe that it is their right to judge who is and isn’t acceptable. However, my experience is that most are concerned about Scottish football as a whole. The issues of consistent application of the rules, poisonous business practice in Scotland, compliant/inadequate MSM and football authorities matter to us all.
I think that NTs pushing for exactitude on the FPP test is entirely valid and that that sceptical approach should be applied as a matter of course. TSFM did this with CtH of course and, in my opinion, was right. I don’t know about others but it’s not clear to me yet whether CtH is a wonderful work of fiction, CW acolyte or a whistle-blower so scepticism rather than wishful-thinking endorsement should be applied. I don’t know what Greenockjack’s agenda is but it seems fair enough to question what value, if any, that CtH is adding.
To NT – your hissy fit’s a bit of a lengthy rant but understandable. Barca clearly has significant credit on the site due to quality of postings generally and longevity but I think he over-stepped the mark, which was out of character. TSFM was wrong to pull you up but it won’t stop me reading and posting and I hope it doesn’t stop you, and as far as I can see you’re not banned.
I’ve not checked but I’d assume Mr Graham view Malcolm Murray as someone who should be removed from the Rangers Board, in light of his ‘refueling’ problem?
One other thing, thoroughly enjoy Night Terror and Greenock Jack’s contributions. A little too much playing the man and not the ball recently.
The best thing about this blog are the different styles and personalities, across what is a broad church.
Chris (Fury) Graham is very similar to Mark (Grandmaster Suck) Dingwall.
They both enjoy the limelight and the sound of their own proclamations. They both see themselves as special fans, and leaders of the support. They both flip flop depending on what is going on. I think it is clear they will court whoever the current owner, board are. I suspect their motives are very similar.
If / when there is a fans’ representative on the board they want to be that man.
Neither does the Rangers’ support any favours. Their own agenda’s come before that.
nickmcguinness says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 14:45
The Earleys, Peter Townsend and Anthony Cooke are all linked through Worthington Group PLC and were probably responsible for £3m of Jerome Group Pension Fund cash being sent to Whyte in RFC PLC’s hour of need.
You do know that the domain name libertycapital.biz points to the Worthington Group website.
So it’s probable that Charlotte gained access to the domain some time last month, then registered the email address – and simply checked for previously received emails to that account, plus all attachments.
Genius!
With the password changed, Whyte has no way of regaining access to delete stuff.
I would imagine the delays between Charlotte’s postings merely reflects the time needed to download all of this stuff, get it squirrelled away and then try to make sense of it.
_________________________________________________________________________
I imagine if it happened that way that Charlotte would have downloaded it all before showing her petticoats.
I misread that the domain was lapsed and registered in April. It was merely updated at that time. The domain has not been transferred since 2006.
Therefore, since the DNS points to the Worthington Group, CW is still in control of it or has handed the keys over to Worthington.
scapaflow14 says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 14:15
1 0 i
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sorry meant to include link
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/football/sfl-division-three/rangers-board-to-decide-malcolm-murray-s-fate-1-2943671
===========================================================================
Just 5 weeks since they officially told the AIM that Charlie went at end of play on a Friday Night.
Can we expect another annoucement by the end of today? Could be handy given the bank holiday weekend.
neepheid says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:22
22
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Rabo Karabekian says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 11:03
The annoying thing for fans of other teams is that the end they would be standing or sitting in depended on which of the Glasgow big two they were playing in the final.
===================
I don’t see their problem if they were up against Celtic in the 60′s and it was raining. Celtic fans had to get soaked no matter who they were playing!
________________________________________________________
Neepheid the one good think for the Tic fans was the stoor could rise and blow away. The other side had to suffer it bouncing back of the roof!
wottpi says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 15:26
===========================
Malcolm Murray’s future is already decided.
All that is left is how it is played out and what collateral damage is caused.
The two key points are Walter Smith and the sale of season tickets.
This is the same Walter Smith who failed in his own bid to buy the assets and wished the New Club well btw.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18503656
“We wish the new Rangers Football Club every good fortune.”
Nor company, not business not any other obfuscation ” …new Rangers Football Club …”
I suppose that makes him a traitor with the fans.
Are there season tickets on sale for for any team playing out of Ibrox.
Are Rangers not just in the renewal process just now, with the public sale to come after that.
chipm0nk says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 15:31
Agreed that how Sir Walter of Cardigan plays it will be the big story.
However some investors must surely be worried that within months of the IPO the CEO and Chairman have gone along with NEO’s and the football clubs commercial director.
As you rightly say some of Charles Green’s moonbeams list will have to be cut. I doubt we will see the stadium improvements or the development of world wide academies, hotels cancer centres etc.
Given the announcement of new signings and promises of more to come then they are heading down the same road as before.
Unless someone calls a halt and gets on with serious cost cutting there be trouble ahead.
If only those in power had the imagination
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/05/23/uk-soccer-champions-finances-idUKBRE94M0M920130523
wottpi says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 15:46
Walter “New Club” Smith will be crucial in selling season tickets. If he walks away I think the overall sales may take quite a hit.
Logically, with prices frozen, they really need to sell at least 38,000 just to perform as well (badly) financially as they did last year. If he walks along with Murray, leaving Green/Ahmad’s men in total control then I think the fans will certainly be revolting.
This is crucial for the short term future of the new club.
please bear with me in regard to the change strip scenario at hampden on sunday…
i have attended, as i said earlier in the week on this blog, many great finals between celtic and hibs over the years…
scottish cup, league cup and dryborough cup in the 70’s…
i also saw the late, great joe mcbride score 2 as hibs beat celtic 2-0 at easter road many years ago…
the colours didn’t clash then and they do now?
this is another example of fans being taken for a ride and is just an attempt to prise more money from the pockets of, in many cases, hard pressed parents…
this is the major showpiece game of the season…
hampden will be awash with green and white everywhere, except on the pitch…
it’s a joke and a disgrace…
those who agreed to it should hang their heads in shame…
remember part of the the reason this blog exists is because of the relentless pursuit of mammon by some in the scottish game…
this latest, small but insidious example makes me sick!
shame on the perpetrators…
Rabo Karabekian at 15.24:
All depends on whether the “update” involved taking control of the website domain in place of someone who had not used it for many years.
“www.libertycapital.biz” was previously pointing to the Celtic FC website. Someone is playing games and having fun.
My money is now on Charlotte being a hacker. Probably someone US-based with Celtic connections.
Someone known by RangersTaxCase, which is still the only account Followed by Charlotte on Twitter.
Might be wrong but I must admit I find all this amateur detective stuff to be good fun.
Oh, and it was Minty on the marble staircase with a Masonic apron.
So Mark Dingwalls is known as Grandmaster Suck on FF. surely that is a name that no one would self apply!
abigboydiditandranaway says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 16:02
Yeah but they played in black and whyte back in the day.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSaY75jHC-4
chipm0nk says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 15:18
Chris (Fury) Graham is very similar to Mark (Grandmaster Suck) Dingwall.
They both enjoy the limelight and the sound of their own proclamations. They both see themselves as special fans, and leaders of the support. They both flip flop depending on what is going on. I think it is clear they will court whoever the current owner, board are. I suspect their motives are very similar.
If / when there is a fans’ representative on the board they want to be that man.
Neither does the Rangers’ support any favours. Their own agenda’s come before that.
__________
All very true, chipm0nk ,and you sort of underline a problem which the Ibrox support has: I could name several “fans’ leaders” from that club, and list several factions within the support. Heck, even their message boards seem to enthusiastically hate each other.
At clubs in crisis, the fans often attempt to unite and ignore their differences to lever their teams out of the mire: Ibrox fans seem to have a loathing as part of their DNA, even for their own kind.
abigboydiditandranaway says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 16:02
Couldn’t agree more! Also, let’s get rid of all these ridiculous branding and ‘We-Are-Family” badges that festoon our teams strips these days.
Hibs and Celtic strips are iconic and the tamperers should keep well away. As for numbers on the Celtic strips (or the utterly dreadful white-panelled number in European games), I thought Celtic solved that one in the early 60’s by putting numbers on the shorts. While I’m at it in this little rant, can we get back to numbering strips 1-11 + sub numbers. The meta-language of football just ain’t the same when the wee winger at number 46 passes to the big midfielder at number 77!
Wish this site could do a wee campaign on this issue. Oh, sorry, I forgot! Our views don’t matter!
lol chipmOnk…
i was intending to put something in about black and white but, as usual, got carried away in ranting mode…
i should take more time to draft…
but then i would have missed the bus!!!
a few beers before heading off to barcelona tomorrow…
but kidding aside i am seething about this…
first choice kits with embroidered scottish cup final 2013, hibernian v celtic should be the order of the day…
bayviewgold
I kid myself on at times that I know what you are all talking about – but really… you’re having a laugh now!
cmontheshire
Aslong as your view is the same as their policy everything is fine.
If it isn´t, tough ! They think you´ll turn-up and spend money regardless because of emotional attachment.
Alongside this there is the ever more sophisticated and comprehensive use of spin.
Never in UK history, has opinion been forced and shaped as much as in the 21st Century.
Just to say that the video above brings back memories of an excellent Hibs team, full of quality.
Never won a League or a Scottish Cup though.
Good Luck to them on Sunday, 111 years is a long time.
mullach says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 09:05
Newtz, could you make sure Regenisis and Banstead are included in your composition.
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Sorry guys way behind posts at mo …..
Updated map showing Wulstan links / associations etc ……
http://flic.kr/p/epZ7on
Can you summarise tha Barnstead link ….
Now this was good to go back and look at ……. it now links Sherri Ellison with Wulstan thro Haxtok Trading ……..
@Charlotte whats missing ?
borussiabeefburg says:
Friday, May 24, 2013 at 16:15
Indeed.
That often means that they are unwilling to tell the fans anything they don’t want to hear, so as not to lose acolytes from their own faction.
It is also why they will never really unite and take “to the car park” in the way they mock Celtic fans for doing.
Mark Dingwall and Chris Graham should really be part of the solution, instead they are part of the problem.
Chris Graham On Craig Whyte:
Quote:
Whyte’s performance with the press has, on the whole, been refreshing if a touch naive
Quote:
It is almost unprecedented that a chairman of Rangers should have to answer such detailed questions and I am impressed that Whyte has now stepped up several times to do so.
Quote:
The more mud they sling the more it sticks and if there are real issues with Whyte they are being obscured by what now appears to be a vendetta.
Quote:
Ally McCoist called for unity on Friday. Those who are mistrustful of Whyte should remember that there are people working in Ibrox who know a lot more about Whyte, his motives and his methods than the press do. Does anyone doubt that McCoist or Gordon Smith have the best interests of the club at heart? Do they really think if Whyte was trying to pull off some sort of swindle then they would stand by and watch it happen?
Quote:
(On Ticketus deal) The type of facilities that Whyte is using are more and more common in business these days with invoice discounting and factoring being used as a replacement for bank lending which is now so difficult to secure.
Quote:
The fans need to back the new owner and understand that what he is doing may not be popular but it is necessary.
Quote:
It’s clear that Mark Daly, the Celtic supporting (do we see a theme here?) journalist, was more interested in smears than facts.
And on administration
Quote:
It’s worth noting that this is a step that Craig Whyte had to take against the backdrop of HMRC possibly winning the tax case. If he hadn’t, and they had won, then there is the very real prospect that they would have sought to liquidate the club. That would be the real worst case scenario.
Quote:
Can the Scottish Government afford to have Rangers enter administration with the possible economic implications that would cause?