Good Afternoon.
As virtually anyone on the internet who follows Scottish Football has come to realise, there is a reasoned and determined attempt at ignoring the content of the Charlotte Fakeovers files on the part of the mainstream print media— and indeed by the broadcast journo’s to an extent.
There is widespread speculation that the accessing of the information provided by Charlotte the Harlot was not all above board and the reluctance of the journalists to mention or comment on the documents, so far published on the internet, is often explained away by the lawyers allegedly advising that the content is tainted and so on.
That indeed might or might not be the case, and only the editors, lawyers, journalists and so on will truly know what their stance is on the revelations. Some will want the whole thing suppressed and others will be desperate to get into print, but thus far are frustrated in any attempt to do so.
However, as the documents do appear on the net only to be quickly followed by file disappearances and so on, there is an ever burning question which must be asked and thrown open to debate and argument.
The issue is not just how independent are the Sports Press in Scotland, but whether or not the relationship between certain sections of the press and Rangers or The Rangers is in fact lawful and deserving of football sanctions.
There is no doubt that many big businesses, local authorities and Governments use the services of PR firms and the likes to get information out to the public and to put their slant on any given situation. That is fair enough.
However, in recent days we have seen the release of documentation which, if accurate and true, shows that a leading Scottish PR company were specifically employed to place stories with the press which were designed to damage the reputation of, to embarrass or cause problems for certain other teams and personnel involved in Scottish Football.
Again I stress that all of this is subject to the caveat that what Charlotte is publishing may or may not be real and accurate. However, if what has been produced is in fact the genuine correspondence between the club and its professional advisers then that correspondence needs to be looked at.
The SFA and indeed the SPFL are the bodies that lay down rules which govern the conduct of clubs and their officers and employees.
So looking at these regulations let me just repeat some of them here:
Fisrt the rules of what was the SPL and which I presume are the rules of the SPFL:
A3.1 In all matters and transactions relating to the League and Company each Club shall behave towards each other Club and the Company with the utmost good faith.
A3.2 No Club, either by itself or its Club Officials, shall by any means whatsoever unfairly criticise, disparage, belittle or discredit any other Club, the Company or the League or in either case any such other Cub or the Company’s directors, officers, employees or agents (which shall, for the avoidance of doubt, exclude supporters).
The SFA handbook at article 5 places obligations on members to observe the principles of loyalty, integrity and sportsmanship in accordance with the rules of fair play, and to refrain from engaging in any activity which would constitute a breach of sections 1, 2 and 6 the Bribery Act 2010.
The details of the Bribery act can be found here:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/23/section/2
Basically, I think these rules mean that you cannot criticise belittle or try to damage the reputation of a club outwith the rules of the games and must at all times behave with integrity, in a sporting manner and with THE UTMOST GOOD FAITH!
The details,as released by Charlotte, show that there is at best a conflict of interests at times with various parties being both employed by the club and paid by radio stations or newspapers to comment on matters relating to all aspects of Scottish Football. As a member of the PR staff at Ibrox presumably such employees are paid to tow a certain party line when commenting in the media and so throw a spin on any given set of facts and circumstances that suits whoever is in control of Ibrox.
Further, it has been suggested that certain individuals acting in this way can also represent the views of for example Walter Smith — and so act as their mouthpiece if necessary.
Such practices may be unpleasant and undesirable but not necessarily against the laws of the game. It would just mean that the newspapers and broadcasters concerned cannot be regarded as independent or objective in their comments or views — they are merely towing an employers line. In short they are HMV— His Masters Voice!
Equally, we have seen supposedly independent journalists and editors referred to in such a way that it is clear they are being asked to spin news a certain way for whatever reason — including the suggestion that if they do not comply then some kind of action will be taken which the parties concerned would rather avoid — such as private matters becoming public.
However, of far greater interest is the suggestion that where necessary the newspapers or whoever will be used to spread negative stories about another club, its employees, directors or whoever.
Such a position may well amount to a breach of articles 3.1 and 3,2 of the SPL ( now SPFL rules) and against the principals set out in the SFA handbook.
Both the SFA and the SPL ( SPFL) has a press office and legal officers.
Both grant rights to broadcasters and journalists, and allow members of the press access to their officers and officials.
Both bodies are free to set out what is acceptable conduct on the part of clubs in this area…… and what is not!
Without even alluding to the detail of the Charlotte revelations, or needing to enquire into the details of the Charlotte documents, I would have thought that the governing bodies would be capable of issuing a formal reminder, to all clubs currently playing at any level in Scottish football, of the content of these rules and that any breach of the rules will not be tolerated.
Of course the matter becomes more convoluted if any officers of the SFA or SPL were involved in the employment of any PR companies or agencies on behalf of a member club and engaged in briefing any such agency about what to say when it comes to the affairs of other clubs. Surely you cannot have an executive officer of a governing body who is in any way linked to the employment of an agency which breaks rules on behalf of a member club?
However, few of these people ever appear on the airwaves to answer questions on a personal basis, and very few expose themselves to questions from the public.
However, many of the commentators and journalists named in the Charlotte documents are regulars on the airwaves and could, in theory, be asked whether or not they are no more than “Their master’s voice” as would appear to be the case if the Charlotte documents are in fact genuine.
If the Scottish Footballing Public are to be entrusted with the truth — and why shouldn’t they in this era of open and transparent football governance– then I think they are entitled to enquire direct whether or not the journalists, players, ex players,managers directors, broadcasters and governing body officials believe in articles 3.1 and 3.2 of the SPFL rules and article 5 of the SFA handbook?
Oh– and maybe the same people could provide some practical examples of what they would consider to be breaches of these rules and what the appropriate sanctions might be?
Specifically– do the actions mentioned in the Charlotte documents ( if true ) fall within the football rules or not?
Or do the SFA and SPFL just ignore placed press releases and comments?
It would be interesting to know.
Caveat Emptor says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:45 am
‘….pre season trips, PR (Ha!), stadium maintenance,..’
—-
I love that ‘Ha!’.
It magnificently expresses the whole weight of contempt felt for Jack and his kind in one single syllable more powerfully than a whole essay might do.
On the Repair works Charlotte’s on the case:
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 2m
Ibrox Stadium Roofs and the Arsenal Shares. As mentioned before, capital expenditure works if neglected, (cont) http://tl.gd/n_1rlmcgq
Charlotte Fakeovers @CharlotteFakes 2m
Ibrox Stadium Roofs and the Arsenal Shares. As mentioned before, capital expenditure works if neglected, (cont) http://tl.gd/n_1rlmcgq
Beyond the Waves @BTWCelticShow 14m
Buckle your seat belts!
@paullarkin74 is about to unleash mayhem
https://player.vimeo.com/video/71491255
@Steerpike
You probably did not think that Rangers (1872-2012) were in trouble when I was writing in 2009 that it was only a matter of time.
In the end the Rangers support did not rally to prevent liquidation.
They have bankrolled Sevco, but not to the extent you believe.
All the contending business plans last year were built upon the Regan/Doncaster promises of SPL football.
NoToNewCo and Turnbull Hutton did for that.
Sevco started at the bottom and even that was special treatment (go tell the Spartans).
Sevco have two choices now:
(1) Austerity (which will look and feel like Adminstration).
(2) Insolvency.
The people currently in charge won’t do enough of (1) to avoid (2) next year because they have a short term project (share dumping).
My predictions on Rangers in 2009-2011 were evidence based and were vindicated in 2012.
My analysis of the new club that plays at Ibrox is similarly grounded.
Your reply to me proves that the trauma that you and your ilk suffered last summer is just too much to take in.
Shame…
Sir Barold Hatchback @BartinMain 15m
I see the #Sevco #Rangers match isn’t listed on #NUFC pre- season schedule. Hmmm. Wonder why? pic.twitter.com/eyQkUMbhYT
Matty Roth
UEFA will not cave in to any demands. Kassies co efficient perspective reflects Article 12 of UEFA FFP where a clubs membership is interrupted by a change of structure, in Rangers case liquidation.
Its purpose is to stop clubs simply shedding debt and carrying on as same member of their national association. It requires 3 years membership after the interruption before whatever emerges from the restructuring ( liquidation in Rangers case) can be considered for UEFA competition.
In effect UEFA are saying liquidation after administration is an indicator of sporting advantage gained and it would be against sporting integrity to allow any club to benefit from co efficient points gained as a result of operating outwith UEFA financial fair play principles.
To allow the previous co efficient points to apply would be to undermine Article 12 and UEFA cannot do that or allow that to happen or be allowed by governments who pick up the tax tab to let that happen.
Kassies perspective is simply application of Article 12 principles and not unexpected by me for above reasons.
Sooner or later Mr Taxpayer is going to realise they are being shafted by football.
In Scotland the SFA in acting to protect Rangers and as they see it Scottish football, have shafted tax payers out of circa £18m (the unpaid wee tax bill and the VAT NI not paid by CW) .
The SFA have a duty to taxpayers to enforce their rules that require tax to be paid, not dance around them to help clubs as CF has shown they did with Rangers in 2011.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/157401752/Rangers-Business-Plan-June-15-2010
Charlottes latest shows the costs of running “A” rangers at Ibrox and Murray park.
It nicely breaks out the cost of the football staff from everything else
so, without a player kicking a ball, the average cost of running “Rangers” at ibrox/MP is £14M a year.
Add on a playing staff of £6M a year and we have a cost of £20M a year.
what one off costs have they had this year? (buying edmiston house/car park, paying football debts of old co, pay offs to sandaza/boca/goian, legal bills – £8M?)
So, £28M to run the ship last year
Income? 10M? 12M?
Thats your IPO money almost wiped out in one year. Next year – operating costs £20M, income – £12-14M – another 7-8M loss – and thats it – over the edge now.
So when is the next share issue? Jan/Feb 2014? Or is it straight to liquidation?
Steerpike says:
July 31, 2013 at 10:30 pm
“I predicted Rangers could not survive if they had to start in the 4th tier”
……………………………………….
News flash….
They didn’t survive….the club who started in the 4th tier started with no debt! or so we are led to believe!
The new club in the 4th tier should be able to survive regardless of how many fans turn up….East Stirling do it every season…
The loyalty of fans isn’t the issue…it’s living within your financial means…and everything we have seen so far suggests SEVCO are unable to do this…mainly because of their misplaced ideology that they have to be seen to be competing at the same level as Celtic in every aspect of football…
No my friend you will need to come up with a stronger case than…”cos I believe so”
On the repair bill:
Did the IPO not say something like £5m would be spent on stadium work?
Did the section on the state of Ibrox not look like a Home Report with key info missing? Caveat emptor is it?
That Charlie Green, what a salesman.
So where did the £5m go?
Was it ever raised in the £22m reported from the share issue?
If not what was raised?
If £22m was raised where has that £5m gone? Clearly not on stadium maintenance.
Will any accounts or financial info submitted to SFA under club licensing include any repair liability to be paid? I mean that could make a hole in any P/L account surely?
Are SFA asking SPFL if they have contingency plans, an elastoplast even, to keep the game alive never mind Hearts and Rangers if their money troubles overwhelm them?
Two wheels on my wagon
And I’m still rolling along
Reality is after me
But I’m singing
a happy song.
Whoops, the footballing costs appear to be a bit more than i thought
More like £10M for players and management.
so, will they make it to December?
Interstingly this blog was tweeted by JACK IRVINE!
http://billmcmurdo.wordpress.com/2013/08/01/greens-return-imminent/
Full text here
Charles Green is locked in talks with the Rangers board concerning his return to the club.
Green is concerned about spiralling costs at the club, including board costs of £1.2 million, back room staff of £3 million and player salaries of £7 million. Other investors share his concerns and are backing his return to the Ibrox boardroom.
My understanding is that Malcolm Murray, Scott Murdoch and Douglas Park are working furiously in the background to try and prevent Green’s return by attempting to acquire 29.9% of the club for 35p per share. Given that Green’s consortium still own 51% and are determined not to sell for less than £1.00, it doesn’t look likely that Murray et al will succeed.
One institution – Hargreave Hale it is believed – may sell for not less than 50p but it is highly improbable that the Murray/Murdoch/Park team will stretch to that.
It is generally regarded that the new Blue Knights for want of a better name are just bluffers hoping to get the club on the cheap.
I am told that one or two board members are trying to block Green’s return to the club but I expect that it will happen regardless.
More to follow when available…
Can they play league games at Murray Park?
Interesting reading in CF’s latest.
The draft business plan from 2010 is great stuff. Was this the latest source of accounts?
Some other gems ..
from their SWOT analysis, here are some of the “threats”…
-“Rangers Supporters Trust/Follow Follow and their agendas” (yep, some “threats” there all right)
-“Scottish Media – negative publicity for brand” (where did this come from?? wasn’t MH involved then too?)
And in their plans they add..
“Glamour Friendly when out of Europe” (some accurate foretelling of the future there.)
And of course not forgetting the estimates for roof repairs (3 year old costings, and three years worth of deterioration later)- around £150,000, not to mention the implications and time it would take now during the season rather than pre season if its at all urgent, and it seemed to be at the time according to their H&S survey.
Remind me…what were the SFPL going to publish from club’s returns/information for their licences?
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:05 pm
‘…http://www.scribd.com/doc/157401752/Rangers-Business-Plan-June-15-2010‘
‘Threats’
‘ A diminishing/ageing overseas fan base-50 000 ( 1 000 in contact with club)”
—–
Surely some typos there? Didn’t Charles G tell us there was a fan base of 500 000 000? 🙂
Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 11:50 am
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=========================
Auldheid I very much hope you are proved correct and very publicly and unambiguously so.
Until that happens for all to see I fear that the capitulation that has occurred in other organisations both governing bodes, media organisations and so on does not happen at Uefa.
Rules have been fudged or ignore.
Loopholes and exceptions have been made.
Where rules have been seen through they have been quietly applied and carefully no attention has been drawn to the reasons or implications for fear of the inevitable backlash (ie The Rangers being unseeded in the Cups last year).
With due respect to the smokers 😉 I link to a more detailed business case that shows a player wage bill of around £8m and other wages of £4.5m. I await the wage figure the SFA are going to publish with interest
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B62m3ggkEX2RVUUwRlRqWnBLN0U/edit?usp=drive_web
It shows stadium repair work of £5m split over two years but my suspicion is the money went elsewhere.
The bottom line at the end of last season was £12m odd left in the kitty,if all income and expenditure was as shown or near enough in total.
Reports had it £8m was left.
That being so and if same totals of income and expenditure apply in coming season the predicted shortfall of £1.137m will leap by £4m and just keep on rising even with higher income.
So there is one helluva lot of trimming to be done to repair stadium and cut wages to ensure another administration event is not looming.
From a quick scan CF’s latest appears to back up the theory that regardless of how much you cut the players wages and possibly other wages the cost of operating a large stadium at near full capacity every second week of the season (regardless of what division you are in) along with a large world class traning facility for a year is a very costly business.
Haven’t had time to look in detail but one thing did catch my eye in the SWOT analysis
THREATS
-Rangers Supporters Trust/Follow Follow and their agendas 🙂
wottpi says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:44 pm
Haven’t had time to look in detail but one thing did catch my eye in the SWOT analysis
THREATS
-Rangers Supporters Trust/Follow Follow and their agendas 🙂
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Now who’s the paranoid ones?
From Twitter
Stewart @sconnelly1888
A company called Norland has pulled its plumbers of Ibrox Job due to lack of Payment
Hearts are about to sit in front of the SFA to hear what their penalty is for “going into administration”.
Seems the penalties open to the SFA are:
/1/ do nothing
/2/ fine
/3/ suspension from the SFA
/4/ registration ban
or combinations of the above.
Can anyone remember, when the “old” Rangers faced the SFA for the same “crime” what was their punishment?
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:15 pm
————————-
aren’t a team in admin already under a registration ban?
didn’t RFC get a 10 point deduction (which would apply to hearts at teh start of next season – will be 15 or 17 though due to rule change)
there was a £50k fine – which probably wasn’t paid as RFC was liquidated. Not sure if SFA would have demanded Sevco pay it as one of the football debts
the ever clear, open, honest and transparent SFA will tell us though
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:14 pm
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From Twitter
Stewart @sconnelly1888
A company called Norland has pulled its plumbers of Ibrox Job due to lack of Payment
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
one wheel on my wagon…..
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:15 pm
Hearts are about to sit in front of the SFA to hear what their penalty is for “going into administration”.
Seems the penalties open to the SFA are:
/1/ do nothing
/2/ fine
/3/ suspension from the SFA
/4/ registration ban
or combinations of the above.
Can anyone remember, when the “old” Rangers faced the SFA for the same “crime” what was their punishment?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Yes – they were given the right to use Campbell Ogilivie’s comfy chair in all future meetings at Hampden.
http://m.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/mobile/news/detail.html?announcementId=11664304
Regulatory Story
Company Official List
TIDM
Headline Suspension Worthington Group Plc
Released 07:30 01-Aug-2013
Number 6380K07
RNS Number : 6380K
Official List
01 August 2013
NOTICE OF TEMPORARY SUSPENSION OF LISTING FROM THE OFFICIAL LIST
1/08/2013 7:30am
TEMPORARY SUSPENSION
WORTHINGTON GROUP PLC
The Financial Conduct Authority (“the FCA”) temporarily suspends the securities set out below from the Official List effective from 1/08/2013 7:30am at the request of the company pending notification of its Annual financial report for the financial period ended 31 March 2013 :
Ordinary Shares of 10p each
fully paid
Standard Shares
(GB00B01YQ796)
This notice has been issued by Listing Applications – 0207 066 8352.
This information is provided by RNS
The company news service from the London Stock Exchange
Matty Roth says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:33 pm
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Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 11:50 am
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Auldheid I very much hope you are proved correct and very publicly and unambiguously so.
Until that happens for all to see I fear that the capitulation that has occurred in other organisations both governing bodes, media organisations and so on does not happen at Uefa.
Rules have been fudged or ignore.
Loopholes and exceptions have been made.
Where rules have been seen through they have been quietly applied and carefully no attention has been drawn to the reasons or implications for fear of the inevitable backlash (ie The Rangers being unseeded in the Cups last year).
==============================
I asked this guy the purpose of article 12 last night.
http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/financial-fair-play-explained.php
and got a very interesting reply 10 mins ago, VERY interesting.
My question was put on a contact form which I never saved but I have asked if I can have his copy. When I have I’ll post both question and answer.
You will see from it why I am confident no cave in VERY confident.
The answer also supports my point about why the SFA do not adhere to the same taxpayer protection principles – because they can, and have and need to be brought to account to the UK tax payers.
Auldheid @ 1.26pm.
One wheel on my wagon?
Maybe TRFC will announce plans for a new, state of the art Hover Wagon! 😕
Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:26 pm
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:14 pm
From Twitter
Stewart @sconnelly1888
A company called Norland has pulled its plumbers of Ibrox Job due to lack of Payment
============================================================================
Impressive website if it is these guys
http://www.norlandmanagedservices.co.uk/index.php/about-us/
Plumbers you say?
Were they in there to stop the leaks from the boardroom and the drip drip of information etc etc?
I’ll get my spanner!!!
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:14 pm
Stewart @sconnelly1888
A company called Norland has pulled its plumbers of Ibrox Job due to lack of Payment
…………………………………….
I have a good friend who is a contract manager for Norlands in the South East…wonder what he might be able to tell me?
With regards to no maintenance work being done at Ibrox except essentials.
Is it possible that this is the case because TRFC don’t actually own the stadium as has been mooted before.
If you rent a house you would not be liable for any maintenance on that house. The landlord would have this responsility. Why would TRFC Pay to repair a stadium they don’t actually own.
I have no information one way or the other but as far as I understand it the ownership issue could take years to sort out.
If true then on the point of Stadium safety certificate…what are the options?
1. Rent a neutral stadium for all home games big enough to accommodate already sold ST…as well as an away support and the vacant segregation
2. Play all matches away
3. Get the repairs done
We can safely assume they would not wish to rent an SPL stadium!
Murrayfield? Does SDM still have influence there
Lets say they are unable to acquire a stadium or a stadium big enough to house their ST sales? do they refund or give them a free crossbar challenge at Murray park every other week? Who gets a seat at the neutral venue…
There is a part of me that thinks we have seen everything there is to see in this Vaudeville comedy….and suddenly as if by wishful thinking the makings of another west end farce appears?
They could play at Parkhead.
For an appropriate sum, paid up front,of course.
54 seats ,less, and counting.copyright Slimshady
Blackjacque 2.05
Its quite the opposite case with commercial leases – they are almost without exception FRI leases, that is Full Repairing and Insuring leases – whereby the liability for such is soley with the tenant.
Oh and typically they also have Upward Only rent reviews. 😉
Id rather own such an asset than rent it.
Citybhoy thanks. This site really does provide an excellent education.
They really are in shit then!
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:19 pm
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:15 pm
————————-
aren’t a team in admin already under a registration ban?
o Hearts were given registration bans for paying wages late on several occasions, NOT because they went into Administration
didn’t RFC get a 10 point deduction (which would apply to hearts at teh start of next season – will be 15 or 17 though due to rule change)
o Agreed, this penalty was dished out by SPL I believe
there was a £50k fine – which probably wasn’t paid as RFC was liquidated. Not sure if SFA would have demanded Sevco pay it as one of the football debts
o so Hearts can expect a fine, possibly pointless if they cannot pay. Unless the SFA would then become just another creditor…
the ever clear, open, honest and transparent SFA will tell us though
o no argument there!
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 2:39 pm
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Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:19 pm
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:15 pm
————————-
aren’t a team in admin already under a registration ban?
o Hearts were given registration bans for paying wages late on several occasions, NOT because they went into Administration
=======================
any club in admin is already, automatically banned from registering new players – consequence, not a punishment. standard practice.
of course, trialists – that’s a different matter
From the author, Paul Larkin, https://player.vimeo.com/video/71491255
Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:35 pm
20 0 Rate This
With due respect to the smokers ……
********************************************
My ‘back of a fag packet’ calculations have stood me in good stead for many years! Both professionally and when one of the boys gets that elusive bookies line up. Do iPads have a bookie line ready reckoner? Thought not!
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/report-lays-bare-full-horror-2111404
So £25.4m of £28.5m debts are to Romanov related companies. Wow. Just wow. I keep telling the guys down here in Ingurland-land that these “sugar daddies” aren’t pujtting a fraction of what they claim to be putting in – I believe all Abramovic’s “investment” has been in the form of loans, which he’s not called in (yet…) but of course I could be wrong…
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 2:47 pm
any club in admin is already, automatically banned from registering new players – consequence, not a punishment. standard practice.
o Good point. So I guess for Hearts it made no difference as they already HAD that consequence / punishment.
of course, trialists – that’s a different matter
o I cannot believe how blatantly TRFC are getting round their “consequence” and how many blind eyes are being turned in this case. Yet another reason why my interest in Scottish Football continues to diminish. 👿
As for Steerpike, a more Micawberesque bunch of fans than Old or NewGers does not exist!
Micawber is known for asserting his faith that “something will turn up”. His name has become synonymous with someone who lives in hopeful expectation. Merriam-Webster Dictionary defines a Micawber as “one who is poor but lives in optimistic expectation of better fortune”.
If only the NewGers board and fans could grasp the Micawber principle: “Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness (and survival in perpetuity). Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds nought and six, result misery (and liquidation).”
What any discharged bankrupt has to do is start over, from scratch. They don’t keep their multi-million pound listed home, they don’t keep their overnight stays in hotels and they don’t keep their £1/2m buses! Cut your cloth to your circumstances – £1/2m for a third tier CEO for goodness sakes!
cowanpete says:
August 1, 2013 at 3:25 pm
of course, trialists – that’s a different matter
o I cannot believe how blatantly TRFC are getting round their “consequence” and how many blind eyes are being turned in this case. Yet another reason why my interest in Scottish Football continues to diminish. 👿
==============================
in Rangers/Sevco’s case, the transfer ban WAS a punishment – it was either that or suspension/expulsion from the league for behaviour that was described as “second only to match fixing”
their ban was not for going into administration/liquidation – but for stealing PAYE/NI/VAT which they had collected and then used as working capital.
Very different circumstances.
Caveat Emptor says:
August 1, 2013 at 3:20 pm
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Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 12:35 pm
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With due respect to the smokers ……
********************************************
My ‘back of a fag packet’ calculations have stood me in good stead for many years! Both professionally and when one of the boys gets that elusive bookies line up. Do iPads have a bookie line ready reckoner? Thought not!
And the other good thing about fag packets, in this “health police rules OK world” is they also contain cigarettes.
Disciplinary Tribunal outcome: Heart of Midlothian FC
Thursday, 01 August 2013
Alleged Party in Breach: Heart of Midlothian FC
Date: 19th June 2013
Disciplinary Rule(s) allegedly breached:
Disciplinary Rule 14(g): Suffering an insolvency event by entering into administration on 19th June 2013.
Outcome: Complaint of breach of Disciplinary Rule 14(g) admitted.
Sanction: Prohibition up until 1st February 2014, of registration of new players aged 21 and over.
This prohibition will not apply to players currently registered with the Scottish FA as being with the club.
(of course, they can sign and play all the trialists they like)
Good afternoon Phil and to the many posters who replied to my posts, I will try and respond to as many as I can.
” You probably did not think that Rangers (1872-2012) were in trouble when I was writing in 2009 that it was only a matter of time.”
I would prefer you asked me what I think, guessing can become an embarrassing bad habit.
I suspected Rangers were in trouble soon after Lehman Bros went bankrupt and the full extent of the economic crisis became obvious, this was in Sept 2008. Anyone who could count knew the Rangers business model was being bankrolled by its owner, nothing new or unusual about this in football, we all have our follies.
” My predictions on Rangers in 2009-2011 were evidence based and were vindicated in 2012.”
Correct me if I am wrong but was your prediction not based on a coin toss tax case, a coin that is still spinning, looking back in hindsight is not evidence of foresight to any rational mind, not even you could have guessed the actions of a complete cretin called Craig Whyte.
As for the fans failing to rally to prevent liquidation, Rangers is not Dunfermline, the cost was to put it mildly prohibitive to the average supporter, I was not on my soap box condemning Celtic fans for failing to step up to the plate in their club’s hour of need back in 1994, I am a realist.
” All the contending business plans last year were built upon the Regan/Doncaster promises of SPL football ”
This is irrelevant, what is relevant is the business plan that is built on Rangers starting in the 4th tier with reduced revenue streams and 20 million in a share flotation.
” My analysis of the new club that plays at Ibrox is similarly grounded.”
Your analysis of the new club is just another coin toss guess my friend, pure fiction, and the evidence to support my claim is there are no accounts to analyse, I did warn you of the dangers of guessing becoming an addiction.
And finally this: ” Your reply to me proves that the trauma that you and your ilk suffered last summer is just too much to take in. ”
Try to be more engaging and please stop guessing my thoughts. I support my football team, it is not the centre of my universe nor my raison d’etre, my status does not depend on the success or failure of Rangers, unlike some.
Take it easy my friend.
Steerpike says:
August 1, 2013 at 4:58 pm
Hello Steerpike
I’d appreciate your thoughts on my post earlier, about how the short-term investers knew about the risks. I disagree, primarily because the IPO documentation was a work of fiction. If you sell shares on the basis that you will do a list of things that will add value, then don’t do them, does that make you a liar? If you sell shares on the basis that you will do a list of things that will add value, and had no intention of doing them, is that fraud?
Are you suggesting the short-term investors knew what the risks were, on the basis they knew they were being lied to but didn’t care? I find that hard to believe.
@Steerpike
I think I was rather closer in my assessment of Craig Whyte in June 2011 than were you and the rest of The People were.
At that time the klan were gushing about ‘war chests’ and ‘front loading’.
Who was correct?
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/rangers-strike-it-lucky-with-their-new-owner/
In that old house, that’s where I lived.
With it’s broken windows and missing panes,
Its rotten gutters that shook with the wind,
That rusty roof leaked when it rained.
With its cob web ceiling and some posts leaning
Yes that was where I lived.
J.R Roberts
I was asked my position on Rangers status, it is impossible for me to think of them as a new club with a new history( good and bad), my brain does not deal in technicalities where football emotions are involved. However I do not expect non-Rangers fans to share my feelings and I respect their right to feel otherwise, I also appreciate the efforts of both the SPL and SFA to facilitate my club’s return and I also accept it was done for commercial reasons, not very sporting some may say, but once you mix money and sport then fairness inevitability suffers.
I am a little taken aback by the number of responses toward me, and I must apologize in advance for failing to answer all comments.
Auldheid says:
August 1, 2013 at 1:36 pm
23 0 Rate This
I asked this guy the purpose of article 12 last night.
http://www.financialfairplay.co.uk/financial-fair-play-explained.php
and got a very interesting reply 10 mins ago, VERY interesting.
My question was put on a contact form which I never saved but I have asked if I can have his copy. When I have I’ll post both question and answer.
You will see from it why I am confident no cave in VERY confident.
The answer also supports my point about why the SFA do not adhere to the same taxpayer protection principles – because they can, and have and need to be brought to account to the UK tax payers.
========================================================
You’ve got me on tenderhooks AH, looking forward to full transcript.
And thanks once again for taking the time to contact and question these bodies where appropriate. We all benefit from your efforts.
Steerpike says:
August 1, 2013 at 4:58 pm
Hi,
I appreciate that you feel compelled to defend your team, but a couple of things stood out for me in your post:
– It wasn’t the credit crunch that hit Rangers – they were always unsustainable. What it did do, though, was hasten their demise by bringing about a change at the bank that was funding them(Note: The bank was funding them – Murray put very little of his own cash into the club). When lloyds saw what BoS had been doing, it was no surprise that they wanted their cash back ASAP!
– I’ll agree with you that Rangers weren’t Dunfermline, but then, Rangers had a far, far larger fanbase than Dunfermline, along with the comparative financial clout that it would carry.
– The Rangers ‘plan’ to get back to the top tier – I can see what you’re saying makes sense, if your figures are correct. However, would it not make more sense to put this money aside for a rainy day, and instead sign a squad of players who were the team of the year from the league immediately above? (Pretty much what Gretna did). That way, when you get to the top tier, you have the much mooted ‘warchest’ to actually splash out on the sort of players who would do some damage at that level? To have a manager on 3/4 of a million a season for being able to beat teams of brickies and students doesn’t seem to be the cleverest thing to do. Lee McCulloch must be pinching himself that he’s getting 16,000 a week to try and outmuscle the guy that delivered his mail that morning…
Steerpike says: and says and says and says ….
………………………………………………………….
Guys
I wish it was as easy to get a salmon to rise to my fly when I’m fishing as you to our new friend.
Don’t feed him/her.
Not The Huddle Malcontent says:
August 1, 2013 at 4:20 pm
10 0 Rate This
……
(of course, they can sign and play all the trialists they like)
—————————————————————————————————-
Can they do this in SPFL Premiership? My understanding was the rules were different for the lower leagues and therefore The Rangers could play trialists that a top team would not be permitted to. I don’t ever recall an SPL team playing a trialist in an SPL game.
Steerpike,
Rangers were in trouble the day and minute David Murray embarked on his reckless spending spree. With or without the threat of the big tax case they were in a financial mess. If they hadn’t entered into their little (sic) tax avoidance scheme they would have gone bust years earlier. Either that or they would have fallen so far behind Celtic the fans would have left in their droves (remember the early 80’s for evidence of this) and they would be an irrelevance today. If anything, the big tax case has given Rangers fans a focus on which to vent their spleen. It’s a lot easier to blame HMRC than to look inwards at the real culprits, but that has become the way of things over Ibrox way. It’s never their fault, always someone else.
Please stop taking the bait.
@Phil
Please do not invent my position on Craig Whyte or anything else, I am not one of the people only a realistic Rangers fan, he played no part in either of our earlier concerns, you were predicting armageddon long before he surfaced and his actions are not evidence of your predictive abilities.
Steerpike says:
August 1, 2013 at 5:28 pm
I would agree with most of what you say. I’m sure most TRFC fans don’t care if ‘technically, they are a new club’ (as Graham Spiers would put it). That aspect has been debated on here since the blog first began. No one’s in any doubt that a club is more than what’s on a spreadsheet. If it was just about ‘In my heart, they are the same team’ then it wouldn’t be a problem.
However, the perception that they are the same team in EVERY WAY has been allowed to fester, and if they were the same team, they’ve been treated abysmally. They’ve apparently had all the clubs in the SPL band together and kick them out of the league, they’ve been forced to re-apply for league membership, had their prize money stolen etc. which is a pretty shameful way to be treated ….. IF THEY WERE THE SAME TEAM IN EVERY WAY.
And that is the nub of the problem. Had the SFA come out and said ‘Yes, technically they are a new team, but we understand why the Rangers fans would wish regard them as a continuation, as a club is more than bricks and mortar’, then it would have been made clear to those confused fans exactly how this has all come to pass. Instead, they sat on their hands, hoping for it all to blow over. Now instead of an acceptance, and desire to work their way up and pay their dues, we now have a situation where TRFC fans are raging about ‘being kicked when we’re down’, and believing that certain clubs are responsible for the lowly position they find themselves in. The best bit is the accusations of corruption against the SFA – I mean, they’re right, the SFA are absolutely corrupt, but it’s all been for their benefit, yet they can’t see that.
@Steerpike
If you are ‘a realistic Rangers fan’ then you will know that Rangers are dead.
Steerpike says:
http://i43.tinypic.com/6537sn.gif%5B
39. Madbhoy24941 says:
August 1, 2013 at 5:40 pm
You might not agree with what he’s saying, but the guy has a right to come on here and give his opinion. He’s not being abusive, and it may do us some good to actually have the odd window open to hear the street outside. We’ve often lamented the fact that we get very, very few fans of TRFC on here to engage with. Well, here’s one now. Engage with him. If he’s only here to stuff up the discussion, then it will come to light pretty quickly, and he can be ignored, but let’s not chase him away at the first sign that he doesn’t reflect the general opinion on this blog, eh?
If I wanted to listen to people that I only agreed with, then I wouldn’t bother coming on here – I’d just talk to a mirror instead.
” Are you suggesting the short-term investors knew what the risks were, on the basis they knew they were being lied to but didn’t care? I find that hard to believe. ”
@beatipacificiscotia
A day is a long time in business, conditions can change overnight and any investor knows this, they were not lied to just because the original estimates fell short of projections, business is not an exact science. If the CEO wants to spend funds to suit the new conditions then its usually on a needs must basis, the alternative is far worse for the investor.
Anyone who buys shares in a Scottish football club is needing their head looked, both Celtic and an efficient Rangers only break even in their domestic market, and it is shrinking. Our next door neighbour gets 1 billion per year for media rights, we get 16 million, do the math, personally I was shell shocked at the amount raised by the flotation.
” If you are ‘a realistic Rangers fan’ then you will know that Rangers are dead. ”
@Phil,
Even a realist can have faith, I do not know if Rangers are dead or not, I believe they are not dead.
Go on St. Johnstone….
SACK CLYDE THURSDAY @tommyinglasgow 1m
Stewart Regan was my guest on 1st show of the nite here
https://www.spreaker.com/user/glasgow-radio-online/celtic_fan_phone_in_call_0141_416_1888_1 …
Next show starts 7pm
According to STV’s Ratman Bawbag “Rangers were fined £50,000 for going into administration but Hearts, like Dunfermline before them, escaped a financial penalty”. I don’t think that’s wholly accurate, but it ticks the “victim” box.
On a more positive front, St Johnstone are currently 1-0 up in Minsk.
RANGERS Football Club notes today’s verdict by the Disciplinary Tribunal who ruled that Hearts cannot register any players over the age of 21 between now and February 1, 2014.
We also recall that Dunfermline were given a similar sanction in May.
But in particular, Rangers are aware of the glaring differences in the sanctions imposed on three clubs who entered administration.
Our club, Rangers, was hit with a £50,000 fine and given a 12 month registration embargo.
While no-one at this Club wishes to see others fall on hard times, questions must be asked about these anomalies and we fully understand the rising anger among our fans.
They are entitled to think there is one rule for our club and another for everyone else.
We will be seeking clarification for our fans.
http://rangers.co.uk/news/headlines/item/4650-craig-mather-statement
Auldheid @ 1.26pm.
One wheel on my wagon
——————————————————
Auldheid, you owe me for 1 laptop screen, which is now covered in Tunnocks and coffee.
News flash for Craig Mather….
Your club has never been punished…you club is a year old!
Lets not forget…
Charlie openly stated the SFA were corrupt…no punishment
The Northumbria Police made an official report to the SFA regards sectarian singing in Berwick….no punishment
So a year old and avoided punishments…however Craig is spot on with the following….
“They are entitled to think there is one rule for our club and another for everyone else”
@shooperb
, ” we now have a situation where TRFC fans are raging about ‘being kicked when we’re down’, and believing that certain clubs are responsible for the lowly position they find themselves in. ”
I tend to avoid neanderthals and Rangers has more than its fair share, Scottish football fans in the SPL refused to be dictated to by their clubs, democracy at work, I have no complaints. Our club has a tainted history, sometimes you get what you deserve, I am not foolish enough to believe it will teach the nutters any lesson, human nature being what it is.
” The best bit is the accusations of corruption against the SFA – I mean, they’re right, the SFA are absolutely corrupt, but it’s all been for their benefit, yet they can’t see that.”
Phil got some things right, there is no doubt there is an old firm bias in both Scottish football and the Media, hats off to him for exposing the extent of the bias.
‘Questions must be asked’
‘We fully understand the rising anger among our fans’
Dear oh dear.Permanently angry.
in my view ,yet more rabble rousing rhetoric.
This Armaggedon is murder….St. Johnstone 1 up away from home against Minsk…
IIRC The £50,000 fine that was handed to the OLD Rangers was not for going into admin. it was for bringing the game into disrepute. I may be wrong as my memory aint what it used to be.
paulsatim says:
August 1, 2013 at 6:28 pm
‘.They are entitled to think there is one rule for our club and another for everyone else.’
———
Thanks for that, paulsatim.
The sentence I quote says it all.
The inevitable result of supping with the devil!
By their readiness to rule-break to accommodate RFC/sevco/RIFC, the Footballing Authorities lost all moral authority and are being bitten in the ars. by an ungrateful bunch of deceitful men who know that those same authorities are also deceitful, and, in addition, compliant and fearful and utterly discredited!
They created a veritable Hydra.
Where is the Hercules who can slay it?
He/she may be around somewhere, but cannot emerge until the present SFA Board has gone.
@tomtom
” Rangers were in trouble the day and minute David Murray embarked on his reckless spending spree.”
It only became reckless when he could no longer afford to bankroll his gambling losses, Rangers having a sugar daddy owner is hardly a unique phenomena in football, his decision to embark on a very dubious tax avoidance scheme was a sign he could no longer justify the losses, plus businessman hate paying tax.
Oldco Rangers only ‘punishment’ for going into admin was a 10 point penalty. AFAIR.
Magnificent result for St Johnstone 1-0 away.
Pride in all things that are good in Scottish football.